11 19 12 0204 063341 Transcript by RJC B. Johnson OCRd After No Number Crop

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Q

OF

IN THE JUSTICE COURT OF THE

IN ND FOR THE COUNTY

THE HONORABLE PETER SFERRAZZA,

-

STATE OF NEVADA,

P l a i n t i f f ,

Case No. RCR2011-063341

Depar tment No. 2

COUGHLIN,

Defendan t .

JAVS ELECTRONICALLY RECORDED TRANSCRIPT OF PROCEEDINGS

Tr i a l t o t h e Cour t

Monday, November 19, 2012

t h e P l a i n t i f f : Z CH YOUNG, Esq.Deputy D i s t r i c t At t o r ney

t h e Defendan t : ZACHARY BARKER COUGHLIN, Esq.

In p r ope r pe r son



*** I N D E X ***

D i r e c t C r o s s RD RC RRD

A u s t i n 31

Co l t o n 131

Cory

N a t h a n i e l

161

198

191 193

Zacha ry 249

M RKED DMITTED

t h e Plaintiff

t h e D e f e n d a n t :

- digital media

1 s t 911 c a l l

2nd v i d e o o f e v e n t

2nd call

99 104

- digital media

911 call on 8 / 2 0 / 1 1

99 104

digital media

digital media

p h o t o g r a p h s

pho t og r a phs

p h o t o g r a p h s

pho t og r a phs

99

99

133

133

133

133



RENO NEVADA MONDAY NOVEMBER 19, 2012 9:12 A.M.

000-

THE COURT: W e re r eady to go. And what w e r e

t o dofirst

i s d i s p o s e o f any r emain ing o b j e c t i o n s

t h e subpoenas I have p r e v i o u s l y r u l e d on t h e mot ion fo r

i s t r i a l which was de n ie d . The subpoenas I r u l e d , wi t h

e x c e p t i o n o f t h e Alaxa ( phone t i c ) subpoenas , all o t h e r

were e i t h e r i mpr ope r l y s e r v e d o r i mpr ope r l y

undu ly burdensome, were f o r w i t n e s s e s o r m a t t e r s

to t h e trial on t h e m e r i t s in t h i s c a s e o r d id

s p e c i f y what documents , if any , were b e i n g subpoenaed

t h e c a s e o f t h e subpoena duces t ecum.

So t h e fo l lowing subpoenas a r e t h e on l y ones

a r e go ing to be honored t oda y .

The one f o r Ni co l e Watson i s Ni co l e Watson

Okay. Was she s e r v e d wi th d i d you pay he r o r

The w i t n e s s f ee?

MR. COUGHLIN: Your Honor , you t o l d me t h a t

be waived o r d e f e r r e d .

THE COURT: I d i d n t say t h a t . I s a i d if you

p r o o f to me t h a t I o r d e r e d t h a t it be waived o r

I would c o n s i d e r t h a t . I r ev i ew ed e v e r y t h i n g

f u r n i s h e d me. I d i d not see such a document .

MR . COUGHLIN: I b e l i e v e ( i n d i s c e r n i b l e )



on t h e r e c o r d t h a t we had d i s c u s s e d my

THE COURT: Wel l , I d o n t want to h e a r what you

MR COUGHLIN: No I , ( I n d i s c e r n i b l e )

THE COURT: Do you have it cued up?

MR COUGHLIN: No I d o n t .

THE COURT: Not go ing to do a n y t h i n g on t h a t .

Lucy Bying ton .

Gave you to l a s t Thursday to g e t me t h a t .

Lucy Bying ton .

MR COUGHLIN: I ll j u s t e n t e r f o r t h e r e c o r d ,

Honor I have a b a r d i s c i p l i n a r y , f u l l - d a y h e a r i n g .

THE COURT: I u n d e r s t o o d t h a t b u t I gave you

t im e to g e t t h a t .

Lucy Bying ton .

MR COUGHLIN: I would l i k e to p r e s e r v e f o r t h e

-

THE COURT: Okay.

MR COUGHLIN: He l i e d to t h e Cour t a s s e r t i n g

he was g i ven , I b e l i e v e , a u t h o r i ty t o s e r v e me by

f o r a h e a r i n g

THE COURT: He was no t -

MR COUGHLIN: T h a t s what he r e p r e s e n t e d to me.

THE COURT: That was an a d d i t i o n a l s e r v i c e t o



s u r e t h a t you got it.

MR COUGHLIN: T h a t s no t h i s r e p r e s e n t a t i o n .

THE COURT: Col ton Temple ton . Mr. Temple ton i s

so w e l l honor t h a t subpoena .

Rober t Dawson. Okay. Any p r o o f t h a t he was

a wi tness fee o r t h a t I waived it?

MR COUGHLIN: I b e l i e v e he hung up on me and

d i d waive it. It s on t h e r e c o r d , Your Honor .

THE COURT: A l l r i g h t , we l l

MR COUGHLIN: I go t t h e D ( I n d i s c e r n i b l e )

under p e n a l t y o f p e r j u r y t h a t you

THE COURT: Wel l you w i l l have an o p p o r t u n i t y

t oda y .

MR COUGHLIN: Wel l you -

THE COURT: S i r , sit down.

MR COUGHLIN: I j u s t need a c o r r e c t i o n f o r

sake , Your Honor t h a t you -- I b e l i e v e you

t h e r i g h t to make me pay it l a t e r , if it w a s n t

waived .

THE COURT: Aus t in Lich ty . Okay. Mr. L ic h ty i s

so w e l l pr oceed w i t h him.

Any o t h e r subpoenas I v e a l r e a d y r u l e d on?

Mr. Dogan i s he re bu t I b e l i e v e I r u l e d on your

as we l l if it was ~ m o n t h o s e t h a t I p r e v i o u s l y

on.

I



MR DOGAN: Your Honor am I f r e e to l e a ve ?

MR COUGHLIN: Your Honor I do not b e l i e v e

p r e s e n t e d a subpoena on h i s b e h a l f . C e r t a i n l y t h e

a t t o r n e y d o e s n t r e p r e s e n t t h e p u b l i c defender .

THE COURT: Al l r i g h t . Mr. Dogantell

me why

want t h e subpoena quashed .

MR DOGAN: Your Honor I f i l e d a mot ion to

t h e subpoena t h a t was s e r v e d on me by Mr. Coughl in .

was no r e s pons e . It s an admi s s i on t h a t my mot ion

worthy . Also I have no knowledge o f t h e f a c t -

MR COUGHLIN: Your Honor c o u l d we have t h i s

sworn?

( I n d i s c e r n i b l e c r o s s t a l k . )

THE COURT: Wait a second , sir. You sit down.

an a t t o r n e y , y o u r e no t . Come on.

Mr. Dogan.

MR DOGAN: Your Honor I m no t a p e r c i p i e n t

I have no p e r s o n a l knowledge o f t h e

THE COURT: I m j u s t t r y i n g to f i n d your mot ion .

say you d i d file a mot ion wi t h t h e c o u r t ?

MR DOGAN: T h a t s c o r r e c t .

THE COURT: Do you know what d a t e it was?

MR DOGAN: About two weeks ago , I b e l i e v e .

MR YOUNG: Your Honor I have a copy o f Mr.

mot ion if you would l i k e t o see it.



THE COURT: I would b u t I ' m s u r e it s in h e r e .

MR YOUNG: It was file s t amped November 7 th and

was s e r v e d a copy o f t h i s . T h a t ' s how I have a copy .

THE CLERK: What ' s t h e title o f it?

MR YOUNG: Motion to quash subpoena duces t ecum

s t amped November 7, 2012, 10 : 24 .

THE COURT: I do have it. It was one o f t h e

ones . It is i n th e o r d e r . And what it r e sp o n d s i s

t h e m a t e r i a l r e q u e s t e d by t h e subpoena duces tecum

p r e v i o u s l y f u r n i s h e d to Mr. Cough l in and f u r t h e r t h a t

Dogan does no t have t h a t and I g r a n t e d t h a t motion .

MR COUGHLIN: Your Honor , I was neve r s e r v e d

THE COURT: Never s e r v e d what?

MR COUGHLIN: I neve r r e c e i v e d t h a t .

THE COURT: Wel l , sir, a c c o r d i n g to t h i s it was

to you o r faxed .

MR COUGHLIN: It was faxed?

THE COURT: And t h e subpoena you s e r v e d him

ab o u t -- sir. On t o p o f t h a t t h e subpoena you

him w a s n ' t a v a l i d subpoena .

MR COUGHLIN: I would n o t e f o r t h e r e c o r d t h a t

a t t o r n e y , Bi ra y Dogan, is smi r k i ng a t me menac ing ly .

THE COURT: I would say it s n o t menac ing ly

MR COUGHLIN: He changed h i s e x p r e s s i o n



you

UNKNOWN MAN Your Honor -

THE COURT: I t h i n k he had s mi l e d and t h e r e i s

r u l e a g a i n s t s m i l i n g .

Anyhow sir, t h a t subpoena i s quashed f o r t h e

s t a t e d in t h e mot ion b u t f o r t h e f u r t h e r r ea son

t h e document t h a t you s e r v e d him wi th was no t a v a l i d

MR YOUNG: For t h e r e c o r d , I m showing

Coughl in a copy o f t h e mot ion .

MR COUGHLIN: Your Honor j u s t f o r t h e r e c o r d I

t h e o p p o r t u n i t y to be he a rd d i c t a t e s t h a t

THE COURT: You had n o t i c e and o p p o r t u n i t y to be

sir, and I r u l e d and w e r e done.

MR COUGHLIN: I was no t s e r v e d it, Your Honor .

f a c t , I d o n t b e l i e v e it s a c c u r a t e . T h a t s not

and -

THE COURT: S i r , I f u r n i s h e d you e v e r y t h i n g in

file and you had t h e o p p o r t u n i t y to r ev iew it __

MR COUGHLIN: When d i d you f u r n i s h me wi t h t h e

THE COURT: At t h e l a s t h e a r i n g we had in t h i s

MR COUGHLIN: No you d i d n t . You p r i n t e d o f f



docke t s h e e t ( I n d i s c e r n i b l e ) -

THE COURT: Yes which showed

MR COUGHLIN: -- be in t h e file.

THE COURT: No b u t -

( I n d i s c e r n i b l e c r o s s - t a l k . )

THE COURT: it l i s t e d e v e r y t h i n g in t h e file.


THE COURT: S i r , I m not g o in g t o a rg u e wi t h

Do you have some th ing to add? Go ahead and add it.

MR COUGHLIN: Yeah b u t

THE COURT: Add it r i g h t now sir because -


MR COUGHLIN: You f u r n i s h e d me ( i n d i s c e r n i b l e )

t h e l a s t h e a r i n g on October -

THE COURT: No I f u r n i s h e d you a list o f

t h a t was in t h e file.

MR COUGHLIN: Okay. That was O cto b e r 2 7 th -

This i s November 7.

THE COURT: I unde r s t a nd , bu t you were given

t ime to respond t o t h e subpoenas . The i s s u e b e f o r e

was t h a t I quashed e v e r y t h i n g p en d in g a r ev i ew and you

given o p p o r t u n i t y to show me p r o o f t h a t t h o s e were

subpoenas . You had t h a t subpoena . If you d i d n t

t h e subpoena , it neve r e x i s t e d , sir.

Did you not



MR COUGHLIN: You r u l e d on ( I n d i s c e r n i b l e )

THE COURT: Did you not p u r p o r t e d l y s e r v e Mr.

wi t h a subpoena?

MR COUGHLIN: I d i d n t p e r s o n a l l y .

THE COURT:No b u t d i d you d r a f t it up?

MR COUGHLIN: He f i l e d a mot ion to quash .

THE COURT: I m n o t t a l k i n g ab o u t t h e mot ion to

I was r u l i n g on all t h e subpoenas t h a t you had

to s e r v e o r s e r v e d and I t o l d you t h a t .

MR COUGHLIN: I w a s n t n o t i c e d t h a t t h e h e a r i n g

be abou t t h a t and I d o n t -

THE COURT: Yes you were n o t i c e d t h a t by

you were to f u r n i s h me wi t h all your p o i n t s and

all o f your ev i dence t h a t t h o s e were v a l i d

e v e r y subpoena i n c l u d i n g t h a t one , even if he

made a mot ion .

MR COUGHLIN: Even if I h a d n t made a mot ion?

THE COURT: Even if he had no t made a mot ion to

it. There were l o t s o f p e o p l e who d i d n t make

to quash t h e i r subpoenas .

MR COUGHLIN: And you quashed them b ecau se -

THE COURT: Because t h e y were e i t h e r I t o l d

d i r e c t l y t h a t you would have to p r e s e n t p r o o f t h a t

were subpoenas v a l i d l y i s s u e d by t h e Cour t and

s e r v e d .



As to t h e subpoenas t h a t you f u r n i s h e d me wi t h

documenta t ion you f u r n i s h e d me I found t h a t t h o s e

to my o r d e r were t he on l y ones t h a t were e i t h e r

s e r v e d o r p r o p e r l y execu t ed .

Now t h e prob lem i s , in a d d i t i o n to t h a t , I

r u l i n g on whether o r no t t h e w i t n e s s f e e s were

p r o f f e r e d and you were g ive n t h e o p p o r t u n i t y to

t h a t to me and you still h a v e n t done t h a t .

Anyhow Mr. Dogan s subpoena i s quashed -

MR COUGHLIN: I f I c ou ld do an o f f e r o f p r o o f

r e c o r d . H e s r e f u s e d to tell me much in t h e way

h i s communica t ions wi t h Dorothy Nash Holmes

MR YOUNG: I o b j e c t , Your Honor .

THE COURT: T h a t s i r r e l e v a n t to t h i s c a s e and

a l r e a d y r u l e d -- I v e r u l e d on it.


THE COURT: And it s i r r e l e v a n t . S i t down o r

l l be e s c o r t e d ou t o f t he room Mr. Coughl in .

Mr. Dogan you a r e f r e e t o go.

A l l r i g h t . Are we r eady to go Mr. Cough l in -

Mr. Cough l in -- Mr. Young?

MR YOUNG: Your Honor t h e on l y p r e l i m i n a r y

t h a t I have wi th r e s p e c t to t h e subpoena f o r Aus t in

he i s p r e s e n t . It was a d e f e n s e g e n e r a t e d

I t ook a look a t t h e n o t i c e o f w i t n e s s e s t h a t



f i l e d by t h e d e f e n s e . Mr. L i c h t y i s n o t ment ioned on

n o t i c e o f w i t n e s s e s . I c e r t a i n l y d i d no t list him on

n o t i c e o f w i t n e s s e s .

So p e r s t a t u t e I would ask t h a t he no t be

to t e s t i f y . As an o f f i c e r o f t h e C our t , I ll tell

t h a t I d i d speak wi t h Mr. L i c h t y f o r t h e first t ime

morning . The sum o f h i s t e s t imony isn t c ompl i c a t e d .

I d o n t want to m i s l e a d t h e Cour t s a y i n g h i s t e s t i m o n y

so c ompl i c a t e d t h a t I need a d d i t i o n a l t i m e . I m j u s t

t h e Cour t know he was ne ve r n o t i c e d .

THE COURT: A l l r i g h t . I m go i ng t o , s i n c e h e s

and he was subpoenaed , I ll a l low him to t e s t i f y .

MR YOUNG: Thank you.

THE COURT: Do you have no o t h e r -

MR YOUNG: Your Honor if you r e c a l l , I pu t on

S t a t e s w i t n e s s e s and I had no t r e s t e d . At t h i s t ime

f o r m a l l y r e s t t h e S t a t e s c a s e i n c h i e f .

THE COURT: Al l r i g h t .

Mr. Cough l in , you can c a l l your first w i t n e s s .

MR COUGHLIN: Yes sir, Your Honor .

your r u l i n g . I m no t c h a l l e n g i n g it bu t I j u s t

on t h e c e r t i f i c a t e o f s e r v i c e -

MR YOUNG: Your Honor -

THE COURT: S i r , if you speak abou t someth ing

a l r e a d y r u l e d on y o u l l be in contempt o f C our t .



r i g h t . I m n o t g o in g to a rg u e wi th you . You may c a l l

first w i t ne s s .

MR COUGHLIN: I b e l i e v e Zach Young was

-

MR YOUNG: And my o f f i c e -

( I n d i s c e r n i b l e c r os s t a l k . )

THE COURT: Mr. Young s subpoena i s quashed as

The on l y peop l e left and I d i d ema i l you t he o r de r .

you do not have it I w i l l - it was a l s o mai l ed to

But I w i l l p r o v i d e you a copy o f t h e o r d e r r i g h t

sir.

MR COUGHLIN: What d a t e is t h e s e r v i c e o f t h a t

THE COURT: It was t h e day -- I t o l d you I

it -- you d i d n t b r i n g it in u n t i l l a t e Thursday

I go t it done F r i d a y morning . It was an o r d e r deny ing

f o r m i s tr i a l , p r e p a r e d on November 16 a t 11:41 a .m.

November 16 t h a t 11 : 42 .

MR COUGHLIN: Your Honor I w a s n t a b l e to -- I

you t h o s e subpoenas t h a t were l a w f u l l y i s s u e d .

t a b l e to s e r v e them.

THE COURT: S i r , I m no t a r g u i n g w i t h you abou t

subpoenas . The o r d e r i s done . You had your

MR COUGHLIN: I would l i k e to p r e s e r v e t h a t fo r

I



r e c o r d t h a t -

THE COURT: You ve a l r e a d y p r e s e r v e d t h a t .

MR COUGHLIN: I d o n t b e l i e v e I have, Your

THE COURT:Yes, you have. You p r e s e r v e d it by

your mot ion . I f you d i s a g r e e wi th t h e r u l i n g o f

Cour t , you w i l l have t h e p r o p e r o p p o r t u n i t y fo l lowing

in t h i s c a s e to a ppe a l o r seek p o s t - c o n v i c t i o n

w h a tev e r you do. But so f a r as t h e r u l i n g o f t h e

it i s done . Under our r u l e s a mot ion once made

be made aga in , sir.

MR COUGHLIN: S i r , t h e b a s i s f o r what I m

now ( i n d i s c e r n i b l e ) u n t i l t h i s c o u r t c l o s e d on

and I -

THE COURT: No, sit down. Y o u r e go ing to be in

o f c o u r t . You have a copy o f t h e o r d e r o f t h e

Mr. Cough l in -

MR COUGHLIN: You a r e ask ing me, s i r ?

THE COURT: Do you have a copy o f t h e o r d e r o f

Cour t?

MR COUGHLIN: I d o n t b e l i e v e so , sir.

THE COURT: Al l r i g h t . I m go i ng to ask t h a t

u l l have bo th o r d e r s -- I have i d e n t i f i e d t h e peop l e in

cour t room t h a t responded to t h e subpoena and you can

them as w i t n e s s e s . You can testify y o u r s e l f bu t it s



f o r you t o go fo rward , sir.

MR COUGHLIN: Okay. I have a few p r e l i m i n a r y

Your Honor , t h a t I would l i k e to a d d r e s s l i k e

Young d i d .

THE COURT:What ' s t h e p r e l im i n a r y m a t t e r ?

MR COUGHLIN: I b e l i e v e t h e r e is a b a s i s f o r

Your Honor .

THE COURT: Denied . Go ahead .

MR COUGHLIN: Can I e n t e r i n t o t h e r e c o r d t h e

f o r t h a t ?

THE COURT: You a l r e a d y had t h e o p p o r t u n i t y to

me a l o n g t im e ago, sir.

MR COUGHLIN: If t h e r e i s

THE COURT: You c a n ' t do it d u r i n g t h e trial.

MR COUGHLIN: T h e r e ' s newly d i s c o v e r e d

THE COURT: Newly d i s c o v e r e d e v i d e n c e f o r

MR COUGHLIN: I d o n ' t know t h a t -- n o t h i n g wi t h

to you, Your Honor , b u t w i t h r e s p e c t to t h e c o u r t

r a l .

THE COURT: I ll g i v e two m in u te s to s t a t e what

is.

MR COUGHLIN: Yes, sir. C e r t a i n l y . I j u s t ,

say -

I



THE COURT : I d o n t b e l i e v e it s t i m e l y , bu t go

MR. COUGHLIN: S i r , some e v i d e n c e

become r e l e v a n t t o me r e c e n t l y . There i s

i s s u e r i g h t now r e l a t e d to t h e e v i c t i o n i n t h e r e a l

-

MR. YOUNG: Your Honor I o b j e c t t o t h a t .

know how an e v i c t i o n c a s e has any r e l e v a n c e to t h i s .

THE COURT: Well , I ll let him f i n i s h in two

Go ahead, sir.

MR. COUGHLIN: It goes t o REV 2011-001708 which

a summary e v i c t i o n now on a p p e a l b e f o r e t h e Nevada

Cour t t h a t u l t i m a t e l y l e d t o a c r i m i n a l t r e s p a s s

c u s t o d i a l j aywalk a r r e s t , t h e m a t t e r t h a t I

Mr. Young and Mr. Dogan abou t on Fe b r u a r y 2 7 t h

a v i o l a t i o n o f NRS 178 .405 in t h e S t a t e

.

The newly d i s c o v e r e d e v id e n c e r e l a t e s to t he

t h a t I have l e a r n e d t h a t t h e ( i n d i s c e r n i b l e ) was

o u t s i d e o f t h e 24-hour window r e q u i r e d by

much l e s s t h e f a c t t h e o r d e r itself d i d no t

( I n d i s c e r n i b l e ) .

THE COURT: Has to do w i th t h a t case , n o t t h i s

. Anyth ing e l s e , s i r ?

MR. COUGHLIN: Well , t h e r e a s o n I b r i n g t h i s up



Honor i s t h a t I b e l i e v e now o f t h e Reno J u s t i c e

r e f u s e d to prov ide me i n f o r m a t i o n r e l e v a n t to

it t r a n s m i t t e d ( I n d i s c e r n i b l e ) o r d e r to t h e Washoe

S h e r i f f ' s O f f i c e

THE COURT: I f i n d t h a t i r r e l e v a n t t o t h i s case .

e l s e , s i r ?

MR. COUGHLIN: I d o n ' t b e l i e v e t h e Reno J u s t i c e

responded to my subpoena ( I n d i s c e r n i b l e ) s t a t e bar

THE COURT: I 'm s o r r y ?

MR. COUGHLIN: I subpoenaed some i n d i v i d u a l s

t h e Reno J u s t i c e Cour t . And I , as f a r as I know I

r e c e i v e d any r e sponse f rom t h e i n d i v i d u a l s d i d n ' t

up a t my b a r h e a r i n g .

THE COURT: You can t a k e t h a t up wi t h t h e b a r ,

MR. COUGHLIN: It i n d i c a t e s some s o r t o f

THE COURT: I d o n ' t know what c o n f l i c t it

If someone d i d n ' t show up in some s e p a r a t e

u n r e l a t e d t o t h i s one t he n you have r e c o u r s e in t h a t

MR. COUGHLIN: Wel l j u s t to s e t f o r t h more

my b a s i s f o r a s s e r t i n g t h e r e maybe a c o n f l i c t in

I 'm a s k ing t h e Cour t ( I n d i s c e r n i b l e ) i s t h a t to t h e



t h a t t h e coun ty would f a c e s u b s t a n t i a l liability

it to a f f e c t a improper l oc kou t based on

i n v a l i d o r v o i d e v i c t i o n o r d e r in t h a t it

a s n t s e r v e d w i t h i n t h e amount o f t i me r e q u i r e d by

and that s -

THE COURT: They would p r o s e c u t e you f o r

a c e l l phone because o f t h a t ?

MR COUGHLIN: Well , I have been a r r e s t e d 10

t h i s yea r . T h a t s c e r t a i n l y ou t o f t h e o r d i n a r y .

THE COURT: Yes I a g r e e . It s ou t o f o r d i n a r y .

you a r e a l s o ou t o f t h e o r d i n a r y , sir.

I f i n d no r e l e v a n c e , no l o g i c a l c o n n e c t i o n

t h e c a s e s y o u v e t a l k e d abou t and t h i s c a s e .

one Reno muni c o u r t had a b s o l u t e l y n o t h i n g to do t h i s

what happened t h e r e . What happened wi t h t h e

b a r and u n l e s s t h i s c a s e became p a r t o f it -

R COUGHLIN: It d id .

THE COURT: Al l r i g h t . That c a s e I r e f u s e d to

I was r e q u e s t e d to t e s t i f y . I s a i d t h a t it

be i n a p p r o p r i a t e f o r me to testify in a c a s e b e f o r e

s t a t e b a r when I m d e c i d i n g your g u i l t o r innocence in

c a s e . So your mot ion to quash o r to r e c u s e me i s

Are you r eady to c a l l your w i t n e s s , s i r ?

MR COUGHLIN: Yes sir. And Your Honor if I

I



j u s t n o t e t h e r e was -- Your Honor I c e r t a i n l y d o n t

to go fo rward a f t e r you r u l e d on someth ing . I guess

m unsu r e ( I n d i s c e r n i b l e ) a t t h i s p o i n t bu t as to t h e

to t h e m i s tr i a l , t h e numerous v i o l a t i o n s o f t h e

e v a l u a t i o n ( i n d i s c e r n i b l e ) by t h e p r o s e c u t i o n

y e a r and t h e c o u r t i n ge ne r a l , i s t h a t someth ing open

argument o r -

THE COURT: No it s no t open f o r argument .

r u l e d on it.

MR COUGHLIN: Okay. I am s u r e t h a t I d o n t

t h e Reno P o l i c e Depar tment o f f i c e r s a r e he re

They were a p p r o p r i a t e l y s e r v e d , p r o p e r l y i s s u e d

I b e l i e v e that s a b a s i s f o r a c o n t i n u a n c e .

THE COURT: Wel l t he y were subpoenas duces

and I rev iewed them and found t h a t t h e y were

and d i d not s p e c i f y t h e documents r e q u e s t e d .

t h e one t h a t d i d s p e c i f y documents r e q u e s t e d , t hose

were f u r n i s h e d to you.

MR COUGHLIN: But t h e r e was ones t h a t w e r e n t

duces t ecum sir. F l a t ou t show up to t e s t i f y

subpoenas .

THE COURT: C a l l t h e w i t n e s s and w e l l d e a l wi t h

a t t h e

MR COUGHLIN: C a l l O f f i c e r Dur a l de .

THE COURT: I m s o r r y ?



MR COUGHLIN: I ll c a l l O f f i c e r Dur a l de .

THE COURT: Okay. Where i s t h e subpoena?

MR COUGHLIN: I b e l i e v e I had to g ive it to

Your Honor . I c o u l d n t g e t back in t i me to s e r v e t h e

o f them on F r i d a y becauseI

c a l l e d t h e c o u r t and

f o r them b u t t h e o r d e r w a s n t r e a dy .

THE COURT: O f f i c e r

MR COUGHLIN: That was a f t e r d e l i v e r i n g them to

on Wednesday I b e l i e v e .

THE COURT: S i r , I ll a l low you to come up he re

look a t t h e s e .

MR YOUNG: If I c ou ld approach as w e l l , Your

THE COURT: Yes Mr. Young. Go t h rough them one

a t ime and show them to Mr. Young as you go t h r ough

because -

MR COUGHLIN: Based on t h a t , no I d o n t see

Watson h e r e .

THE COURT: I t h i n k I a l r e a d y c a l l e d h e r .

MR COUGHLIN: But d i d you quash h e r subpoena ,

MR YOUNG: Your Honor we s h o u l d n t have any

a t t he bench . Th is i s j u s t f o r him to rev iew

subpoenas .

THE COURT: J u s t f o r you to i d e n t i f y t he



t h a t you c l a im were p r o p e r l y i s s u e d and s e rve d .

b e l i e v e t h i s might be Savannah Montgomery Tanner

(phone t i c ) , Ron Rossa ( p h o n e t i c ) , James Z i l a ns ka

Reese ( p h o n e t i c ) .

MR. COUGHLIN: Your Honor do I need -

MR. YOUNG: Again , I would ask t h a t we d o n t

any c o n v e r s a t i o n s a t t h e s i d e b a r . Needs t o be

THE COURT: You sir j u s t show me t h e subpoena

you c l a im was s e r v e d on -

MR. COUGHLIN: ( I n d i s c e r n i b l e .

THE COURT: These a r e t h e ones you have been

and a r e a t t a c h e d t o t h e document t h a t was -

MR. COUGHLIN: Righ t . Alaxa , Rossa .

THE COURT: What?

MR. COUGHLIN: You say I d i d n t f u r n i sh ,

THE COURT: These a r e t h e ones t h a t were

were p r o p e r l y s e rve d bu t I was r e s e r v i n g r u l i n g

whether o r no t you had p r o f f e r e d t h e w i t n e s s f ee as

by -- t h e s e a r e all a t t a c h e d t o t h e o r d e r , sir.

MR. COUGHLIN: Yes sir. I t h i n k I was

t h a t o r d e r -

THE COURT: Wel l you were s e n t it l a s t F r i d a y

your p r e f e r r e d method o f s e r v i c e .



MR COUGHLIN: I m not s e e i n g any o f t h e

h e r e .

THE COURT: These a r e subpoenas duces tecum in

no documents were s p e c i f i e d .

MR COUGHLIN: Got it.

THE WITNESS: What?

That one d o e s n t say duces t ecum.

THE COURT: These , sir, t h e s e w e r e n t s e rve d .

MR COUGHLIN: I b e l i e v e t h e y were .

THE COURT: The subpoena duces t ecum o f your

s p e c i f y -

MR COUGHLIN: Oh t h e r e was t h e m a t t e r o f t h i s

in what was mai l ed was s e t f o r t h in all t h e RPD

numbers m a t t e r s t h a t were r e q u e s t e d .

THE COURT : What abou t them?

MR COUGHLIN: Wel l , let s j u s t a t t a c h it to

and it was what s p e c i f i c d o cu m en ta t i o n I m

THE COURT: I m s o r r y , sir. It s no t a t t a c h e d

t h i s and not f i l e d by t h e c o u r t as r e q u i r e d by t h e

and I v e a l r e a d y r u l e d on it.

MR COUGHLIN: Okay. A l l t h e s e were -- wel l ,

one w a s n t b ecau se I c o u l d n t g e t back to t h e c o u r t

d e l i v e r i n g it on Wednesday. That was one day a f t e r

s t a t e b a r h e a r i n g where t h e y were s e e k i n g t o d i s b a r me.



THE COURT: You d i d n t d e l i v e r t h e s e t o t h e

on Wednesday. They were d e l i v e r e d on Thursday a t

5 :00 o c l o c k . I w a i t e d f o r them to come i n .

MR COUGHLIN: W a s n t t h e 1 4 th Wednesday and t h e

--

I knowit

was t h e day a f t e r t h e 1 4 t h , I know t h a t .

THE COURT: The 1 5 th was a Thursday .

MR COUGHLIN: Okay. Yes sir. I m s o r r y I was

in t h a t r e g a r d . These -- t h e r e s a -- t h e RPD

t h a t a r e no t t h e subpoena duces t ecum r i g h t he re .

Montgomery d i s p a t c h e r ; Ron Rossa , and Alaxa and

Reese , it s my u n d e r s t a n d i n g t h o s e were a p p r o p r i a t e l y

under NRS 174.345 and no t s e e n any o f t h o s e

THE COURT: Pardon me?

MR COUGHLIN: I v e no t s e e n t h o s e w i t n e s s e s

t o d a y and I move f o r a c o n t i n u a n c e .

THE COURT: Where i s t h e one f o r

Dura lde . The same prob lem. O f f i c e r Dura lde i s

in he r e by t h e way.

MR COUGHLIN: y u n d e r s t a n d i n g i s -

THE COURT: Your u n d e r s t a n d i n g i s what?

MR COUGHLIN: That I p u t t h a t in t h e e n v e lo p e .

d o n t want t o speak -- I d o n t b e l i e v e he was s e r v e d t h e

THE COURT: Well -



MR COUGHLIN: His was on one o f t h e -

THE COURT: The bo t tom l i n e , you have t h e r i g h t

an o r d e r to show cause if you show p roo f t h a t you

t h e wi tne s s f e e .

MR COUGHLIN:Your Honor you t o l d

me Id i dn ' t

to p r o f f e r -

THE COURT: I d i dn ' t tell you t h a t . You t o l d me

t o l d you t h a t .

MR COUGHLIN: I a s s e r t e d t h a t unde r oa t h .

THE COURT: Okay.

MR COUGHLIN: Not ( i n d i s c e r n i b l e ) Mr. Young.

THE COURT: I 'm so r r y?

MR COUGHLIN: It s no t been r e bu t t e d by

Young t h a t a s s e r t i o n .

THE COURT: It s been r e bu t t e d by me. I s a i d

had to f u r n i s h me p roo f by Thursday . You have no t ,

t r a n s c r i p t .

MR COUGHLIN: The t yped -ou t t r a n s c r i p t ?

THE COURT: No. Al l had do r e f e ro toou was

l i n e o f t h e aud io . I t o l d you all t h a t . I 'm no t

to was te any more t ime . Ca l l your wi t n e s s e s .

MR COUGHLIN: Your Honor a r e you a sk ing me if

have it keyed up? If I have it keyed up now can I show

t o you?

THE COURT: If you have it keyed up yes .



MR COUGHLIN: Or I can show it to you l a t e r .

THE COURT: You can show it to me l a t e r bu t

now you need to proc e e d wi th your trial sir.

MR COUGHLIN: Yes sir.

THE COURT: ehave been h e r e f o r a lmos t

ah a l f

and so f a r as I 'm concerned y o u ' v e accompl i shed

MR COUGHLIN: Okay. Your Honor t he l a s t p o i n t

i s s u e would be t h a t I was f i n a l l y g i ven t he m a t e r i a l s

Mr. L e s l i e r e f u s e d to g ive me even though I

them f rom Econ on O cto b e r 3rd and he was still

on t h e 22nd.

Those m a t e r i a l s i n c l u d e t h e d i s p a t c h r e c o r d s

t h e Reno P o l i c e Depar tment and Econ and I b e l i e v e

de mons t r a t e s p r o s e c u t o r i a l misconduc t in t h a t Mr. Young

t h i s Cour t in f i l i n g and t h r o u g h argument and

e l i c i t i n g t e s t imony t h a t I b e l i e v e t h e r e was a b a s i s

a m i s t r i a l t h a t t h e i n f o r m a t i o n f rom d i s p a t c h was t h a t

was a p o s s i b l e f i g h t . I have t h o s e r e c o r d i n g s .

i s no i n d i c a t i o n o f a p o s s i b l e f i g h t b e i n g

to t he Reno P o l i c e Depar tmen t e i t h e r in t h e

l ogs o r in the r e c o r d i n g s .

MR YOUNG: I o b j e c t as un t ime ly and t h e r e ' s no

f o r t h a t o t h e r t han h i s s t a t e m e n t s .

THE COURT: Well I d o n ' t know even know what



a s k i n g f o r . So it 's de n ie d .

MR. COUGHLIN: I have t h e aud i o r e c o r d i n g

t h e d i s p a t c h and t h e Reno PD. The whole p o i n t o f

s u p p r e s s i o n h e a r i n g which you r e s e r v e d t h e r i g h t to

a r u l i n g on i s t h a t p a r t o f t h e

t h e main b a s i s f o r t h e pat -down, t h e proba b le cause

do t h e s e a r c h i n c i d e n t t o a r r e s t and all t h a t i s

- and Mr. Young has r e p e a t e d t h i s r e pe a t e d ly ,

f i g h t , d i s p a t c h t o l d them p o s s i b l e f i g h t ,

f i g h t ; d i s t u r b a n c e , p o s s i b l e f i g h t . And it was

d r i l l e d i n t o t h e r e c o r d over and over .

THE COURT: T h a t ' s not what I r e c a l l , sir. But

be a b l e to a rg u e it. T h a t ' s a f a c t t h a t I'll need

r u l e on in de te rmin ing your g u i l t o r i nnocence . So

move on.

MR. COUGHLIN: Yes sir. C a l l my first w i t n e s s ,

c a l l Aus t in Lich ty .


MR. COUGHLIN: Well , I ' m so r r y , Your Honor

if I can , I 'll c a l l Ni co l e Watson.

THE COURT: I s Ni co l e Watson he re ?

( I n d i s c e r n i b l e . )

MR. COUGHLIN: I move f o r a c o n t i n u a n c e , sir.

THE COURT: Denied .

MR. YOUNG: Your Honor a t l e a s t based on t h e



to con t i nue , I c a n t imag ine what she would have to

t h i s Cour t that s o f s u b s t a n c e as n e c e s s a r y unde r

so u n l e s s I he a r o t h e r w i s e , I would a l s o

a c o n t i n u a n c e .

THE COURT:Wel l , t h e c on t inua nc e i s de n ie d .

d i d no t p r e s e n t t h e p r o o f t h a t I r e q u e s t e d on

sir.

MR COUGHLIN: With r e s p e c t to t h e wi tness f e e s ?

THE COURT: Yes.

MR COUGHLIN: Oh I o f f e r e d to pay them.

THE COURT: You o f f e r e d t o pay them? Did you

t h e w i t n e s s f e e s ?

MR COUGHLIN: I c o u l d n t v e r i f y if it was he r

r not on t h e phone and

THE COURT: No when you d e l i v e r e d t h e

sir, d id t h e p e r s o n who d e l i v e r e d t h e subpoena

a check f rom you wi t h t h e -

MR COUGHLIN: It was ma i l e d .

THE COURT: Wel l , d i d you e n c l o s e t h e check wi t h

m a i l i n g ?

MR COUGHLIN: I d o n t b e l i e v e s o .

THE COURT: A l l r i g h t . Then sit down. C a l l

nex t w i t n e s s .

MR COUGHLIN: Yes sir. If I c ou ld j u s t

sir. Seems as t hough you p u l l e d a s i d e



o f subpoenas t h a t you were r e s e r v i n g

on t h o s e u n t i l I show you t h e payment p r o o f ?

THE COURT: Yes. Those a r e t h e ones t h a t I -

a r e t h e ones based on t h e r e c o r d s t h a t I found to be

t h a t t hey were p r o p e r l y subpoenaed wi tha

i s s u e d by t h i s Cour t and t h a t t h e y were p r o p e r l y

by mai l . However I r e s e r v e d r u l i n g on whether o r

t h e s e r v i c e was comple ted because o f t h e r e qu i r e me n t

t hey be p r o f f e r e d t h e w i t n e s s f e e . A l l r i g h t . Go

Go ahead .

MR COUGHLIN: That d i f f e r s marked ly .

THE COURT: No it d o e s n ' t d i f f e r f rom what

you t h e l a s t c o u r t d a t e , sir. I t o l d you to submi t

to me by Thursday .

MR YOUNG: Your Honor y o u ' v e asked

Cough l in no l e s s t h a n f i v e t i m e s . It c a l l s

Can we move on? It s q u a r t e r to 10 and

i s t a k i n g a whi l e .

THE COURT: Al l r i g h t . Go ahead .

MR COUGHLIN: Yes sir. I ll c a l l Aus t in

p l e a s e .

THE COURT: A l l r i g h t . Mr. L i c h t y , w i l l you

up.

MR YOUNG: Your Honor if I r e c a l l c o r r e c t l y

r u l e o f e x c l u s i o n had been invoked a t t h e l a s t

I



THE COURT: A l l r i g h t .

MR YOUNG: So b e f o r e we t a k e t e s t imony .

THE COURT: I would ask t h a t all o f you who a r e

to t e s t i f y , if you would wa i t o u t s i d e , no t to

case among y o u r s e l v e s o r wi th anyone e l s e

c a l l e d to t e s t i f y . A l l r i g h t . And if you were

you do need to wa i t h e r e .

MR COUGHLIN: Your Honor I would j u s t ask t h a t

( I nd i s c e r n ib l e ) b u t to t h e e x t e n t a w i t n e s s

member i n t h e cour t room

MR YOUNG: I oppose t h a t , Your Honor .

THE COURT: A l l r i g h t . It s been opposed . He

t h e r i g h t to invoke t h e r i g h t o f e x c l u s i o n as we l l ,

r u l e o f e x c l u s i o n .

So come up here , sir.

MR COUGHLIN: I ll i nvoke t h e r u l e o f e x c l u s i o n

wel l .

MR YOUNG: It a l r e a d y has been invoked .

THE COURT: It s a l r e a d y been invoked . You s a i d

d i d n t want t o i nvoke it.

MR COUGHLIN: No I d i d n t . I s a i d I wanted

who w a s n t go ing to testify t o l e a v e t h e

MR YOUNG: T h a t s been done .




MR COUGHLIN: And t h e f a mi ly members.

MR YOUNG: I oppose t h a t . There i s no b a s i s in

f o r t h a t .

THE COURT:P l e a s e r a i s e your r i g h t hand.

The w i t n e s s was sworn . )

THE COURT: Al l r i g h t . S i r . U n les s someone i s

you canno t f o r c e them to r ema in in t h e

MR COUGHLIN: But to l e a v e t h e cour t room.

THE COURT: You can f o r c e them t o l e a v e t h e

t h e r u l e o f e x c l u s i o n .

MR COUGHLIN: T h a t s what I a t t e m p t e d to do,

THE COURT: Well , everyone who is a wi tness in

c a s e has been r e q u e s t e d to l e a v e and t h e y all have.

MR COUGHLIN: I was j u s t say ing to t h e e x t e n t

t h e i r f a mi ly members it v i t i a t e s t h e impor t o f t h e

o f e x c l u s i o n . So t hey a r e a b l e to r e p o r t on it

e a s i l y .


MR YOUNG: Your Honor , a g a i n , I oppose .

you r u l e d on it

THE COURT: Well , it d o e s n t r e a l l y m a t t e r .

have t h e f r e e w i l l t o s t a y o r l e a v e if t h e y wish . I f



have chosen to l eave , you canno t f o r c e them t o s t a y .

ahead , sir

AUSTIN LICHTY,

c a l l e d asa

w i t n e s s , having beenfirst

du ly sworn, was

examined and testified as fo l l ows :

DIRECT EXAMINATION

MR COUGHLIN:

Good morning , Mr. Lich ty . Thank you f o r

THE COURT: Oh, w a i t . S i r , would you s p e l l your

and l a s t names f o r t h e reco rd .

THE WITNESS: Aus t in , A-U-S-T-I -N. Lich ty ,

THE COURT: Thank you.

MR COUGHLIN: Has he been sworn and I m issed

THE COURT: Yes, he was sworn .

MR COUGHLIN: Thank you.

THE COURT: You were sworn; r i g h t , s i r ?

(No a u d i b l e r e s p o n s e . )

THE COURT: Go ahead .

MR COUGHLIN: Yes, sir

Your Honor , I b e l i e v e you s t a t e d it was all



if I remain s e a t e d a t t i m e s .

THE COURT: T h a t s f i n e .

MR COUGHLIN: Okay.

MR COUGHLIN:

Q Mr. Lich ty , can you i n d i c a t e what your d a t e o f

i s , p l e a s e ?

MR YOUNG: O b j e c t i o n , Your Honor r e l e v a n c e .

MR COUGHLIN: Your Honor I b e l i e v e it goes to

r e l e v a n c e in t h a t Mr. L i c h t y i s h e a r d on t h e 9-1 -1

e x p l a i n i n g t h a t because he was 17 y e a r s o l d he cou l d

what he wanted -

THE COURT: Ask him how o l d he was.

I ll s u s t a i n t h e o b j e c t i o n to t h e d a t e o f b i r t h

t h a t i s a p r i v i l e g e d d a t e and can be u sed in a

r e c o r d , s o c i a l s e c u r i ty number d a t e o f b i r t h . But

can c e r t a i n l y ask him how o l d he was when t h e c a l l was

MR COUGHLIN: Yes sir, Your Honor t hank you.

THE COURT: The age , not t h e d a t e o f b i r t h .

MR COUGHLIN:

Q Mr. Lich ty , on Augus t 20 th , 2011 how o l d were

A I was 18 .

Q You were 18. Did you say someth ing o the rwi se on

d a t e ?



A I d o n t remember .

MR YOUNG: Your Honor o b j e c t i o n t o t h a t .

THE COURT: W h at s t h e o b j e c t i o n ?

MR YOUNG: Did you say someth ing o the rwi s e ?

u n d e r s t a n d what t h a t q u e s t i o n means t oo br oad .

MR COUGHLIN: Your Honor o f f e r o f p r o o f would

t h a t I v ide oed -

THE COURT: Wel l , t h e n ask him s p e c i f i c a l l y what

i s , no t o t h e r w i s e . Did you say -

MR COUGHLIN: Okay. Did you

THE COURT: Verba t im what he s a i d .

MR COUGHLIN:

Q Did you say you were younger t h a n 18 on t h a t

A My life f e l t t h r e a t e n e d , so , yes , I d i d .

Q Can you e x p l a i n why you felt your life f e l t

Can you tell us t h a t ?

A That you were s t e a l i n g f rom us and t a l k i n g ve r y

to us s a y ing all t h i s s t u f f . T h i s was awhi l e ago.

remember e x a c t l y what you were s a y i n g bu t you were

rude to us you were s t e a l i n g s t u f f f rom my

Q And your life f e l t t h r e a t e n e d ?

A Because y o u r e an a d u l t and I was still j u s t a

I may have been 18 . I m still a k i d though .



Q So do you f e e l -- when you were 18, d i d you f e e l

-- d i d you f e e l your life was t h r e a t e n e d i n t h e

o f any a d u l t o r

A To be hone s t I still f e e l t h r e a t e n e d sitting

w i t h you.

Q Why i s t h a t ?

A Because you a r e j u s t a wei r d guy t h a t keeps

me. You h a r a s s me. You want to t a l k abou t

how you t o l d me you were ( i n d i s c e r n i b l e ) coach?

THE COURT: I m s o r r y . I d i d n t h e a r what you

THE WITNESS: Okay. Well , t h i s happened -

THE COURT: No no. I d o n t h e a r what you s a i d .

d o n t want you to -

THE WITNESS: He -

MR COUGHLIN: O b j e c t i o n , Your Honor

Maybe it i s r e s p o n s i v e a c t u a l l y . I k i nd

opened t h e door to it.

THE COURT: What I ask ed you to do sir i s

what you had a l r e a d y s a i d . You s a i d some th ing

t h a t you felt t h r e a t e n e d by him and he was c a l l i n g

c o n s t a n t l y and t h e n you s a i d someth ing e l s e .

THE WITNESS: I felt h a r a s s e d .

THE COURT: Har as sed . Okay. W h a t s your



MR COUGHLIN: I m s o r r y , Your Honor . I s it all

to r e c o r d t h e proc e e d ings ?

THE COURT: No it s n o t . We have a r e c o r d i n g .

MR COUGHLIN : But I ll be a b l e t o g e t a

t h e proc e e d ings ?

THE COURT: I ll p r o v i d e you w i t h an aud io

not a t r a n s c r i p t .

MR COUGHLIN: Thank you sir. Due to my


MR COUGHLIN : My i nd ige nc y r ema i ns . I s t h e r e a

ar rangemen t that s in p l a c e ?

THE COURT: I w i l l waive t h e c o s t o f an aud io

bu t e v e r y t h i n g has to be done s p e c i f i c a l l y . I m

w aiv in g e v e r y c o s t in t h i s c a s e .

MR COUGHLIN: I a p p r e c i a t e t h a t .

MR COUGHLIN:

Q So you felt your life was t h r e a t e n e d . Were you

wi t h o t h e r s ?

A Yes l o t s o f o t h e r s .

So even how many o t h e r s were you t h e r e with?

you g ive us an e s t i m a t e ?

A No i d e a .

Q So

A I was one o f t h e first ones because -- okay .



me

Q I ' m s o r r y ? I c o u l d n ' t u n d e r s t a n d

THE COURT: He s a i d he was one o f t h e first

J u s t go ahead and ask your q u e s t i o n .

MR COUGHLIN: A f t e r he s a i d I was one t h efirst

t h e n he s a i d s o m e t h i n g e l s e .

THE COURT: He s a i d go a h e a d and ask your

MR COUGHLIN: Okay.

MR COUGHLIN:

Q So were you one o f t h e first to approach -- and

know t h i s migh t sound w ei rd , Mr. L i c h t y , b u t I ll

j u s t r e f e r -- when you t h i n k I migh t s a y m y s e l f

j u s t g o i n g to say t h e s u s p e c t t h r o u g h o u t this.

But when you were -- were you one o f t h e first

a p p r o a c h t h e s u s p e c t ?

A ( I n a u d i b l e . )

Q Did you do t h a t in a group , app roach t h e

A I d o n ' t remember .

Q Did you do it a l o n e ?

A I p o s s i b l y was t h e first one -

THE COURT: Mr. L i c h t y , I ' m g o in g to ask you to

a little c l o s e r to t h e mic b e c a u s e we have t r o u b l e

t h e s e up.



THE WITNESS: Okay.


THE WITNESS: I was d e f i n i t e l y one o f t h e first

I fo l lowed you on your b i k e and your c ha in broke and

when we eve ryone s t a r t e d c a t c h i n g up. But I was

o f t h e first.

Y MR COUGHLIN:

Q Are you s u r e you w e r e n t a lone and t h e f i r s t ?


Q Do you remember why you approached t h e s u s p e c t ?

A Because I was t o l d t h a t you s t o l e a phone and it

someone -- one o f your w i t n e s s e s o r one o f t h e peop l e

wanted to b r i n g in c a l l e d me -

Q ( I n d i s c e r n i b l e . )

A And s a i d t h e y t hough t it was my phone .

Q Can you say t h e i r name?

A Ni co l e Watson.

Q She was c a l l i n g you?

A Think ing it was my phone and he t o l d me t h a t a

was s t o l e n .

Q Okay. And t h e n how d i d t h a t r e s u l t in you

t h e s u s p e c t ?

A She t o l d me t h a t -- she p o i n t e d because we were

j u s t a t t h e i c e r i n k and we were all t o g e t h e r . There

a few o f us out in t h e midd le s k a t e b o a r d i n g and t h e r e



pe op le ou t on t h e s i d e , on t he little s e a t i n g a r e a .

c a l l e d me and she p o i n t e d when I l ooked over a t her

I answered my phone and you were r i d i n g away on

b ike .

She c a l l e d you. Did she say someth ing? Did you

t he phone?

A She s a i d t h a t someone p i c k e d up a phone nex t to

and t h e n she p o i n t e d a t you.

Q She s a i d someone p icked up a phone ne x t to them.

would t h a t have been?

MR YOUNG: Your Honor I o b j e c t to t h a t . I d id

o b j e c t initially on hear say bu t aga in t oo much i n t o

Ms. Watson s a i d , that s hea r say . What I d i d a l low

t h e initial que s t i on , why d i d Mr. L i c h t y approach t he

THE COURT: Al l r i g h t . O b j e c t i o n o v e r r u l e d . Do

have a r e s pons e ?

MR COUGHLIN: Yes Your Honor . I r e c a l l my

c o n s i s t e d p r e t t y much e n t i r e l y o f

MR YOUNG: T h a t s not t h e trial.

MR COUGHLIN: But t hen you sought to copy and

e v e r y t h i n g from t he motion to s u p p r e s s h e a r i n g

THE COURT: Okay. S i r , you have to r espond to

o b j e c t i o n , not some o t h e r o b j e c t i o n o r some o the r



t h a t t ook p l a c e .

MR COUGHLIN: It s no t -

THE COURT: This ob j e c t i on , wha t ' s your r e sponse

t h e hea r s ay ob j ec t i on?

MR COUGHLIN: It snot go ing to prove t h e t r u t h

t he m a t te r a s s e r t e d bu t to t h e e x t e n t t h a t it s a

s en s e imp r es si on i n d i c a t i n g h ighe r degree o f

THE COURT: Where i s it go ing t o , s i r ?

MR COUGHLIN: What ' s t h a t ?

THE COURT: What i s it go ing t o .

MR COUGHLIN: In te rm s o f re le v an c y ob j ec t i on?

THE COURT: No in t e rms o f h ea r s ay ob j e c t i on .

s a i d it was no t hear say .

MR COUGHLIN: The e f f e c t on t h e l i s t e n e r .

THE COURT: The e f f e c t on t h e l i s t e n e r .

MR COUGHLIN: What s he ' s t e l l i n g him.

THE COURT: You can ask him what he d id as a

of what she t o l d him.

MR COUGHLIN: I would l i k e to know what she

him.

THE COURT: Objec t i on su s t a i n ed . Go ahead .

MR COUGHLIN: So I c an ' t ask him what she t o l d

THE COURT: Objec t i on i s su s t a i n ed . It s



MR COUGHLIN: A l l r i g h t .

MR COUGHLIN:

Q So how d i d you wind up a p p r o a c h i n g t h e s u s p e c t ?

A I s k a t e d a f t e r you on my s k a t e b o a r d .

Q But why why d i d you do t h a t ?

A Because I was t o l d you s t o l e my f r ie n d s phone .

Q By who?

A Ni co l e Watson.

Q Did she i n d i c a t e s p e c i f i c a l l y how and where t h e

was s t o l e n ?

MR YOUNG: Your Honor t h i s a g a i n , I would

same r u l i n g you j u s t made.

THE COURT: S u s t a i n e d . You s a i d d o e s n t m a t t e r

it t r u e o r no t what she s a i d t o him.

MR COUGHLIN: Well , it m a t t e r s where she

-

THE COURT: Wel l , e i t h e r it m a t t e r s o r it

t . Now you a r e s a y ing it does m a t t e r .

MR COUGHLIN: No I t h i n k it does m a t t e r , Your

because -

THE COURT: Okay. Then it s h e a r s a y and t h e

i s s t a i n e d . Go ahead .

MR COUGHLIN:

Q Where was t h e phone s t o l e n f rom?



MR YOUNG: Your Honor , o b j e c t i o n .

THE COURT: T h a t s h e a r s a y .

MR COUGHLIN: If he knows he can answer .

THE WITNESS: From t he i c e r i n k . It was s i t t i n g

t h e s i t t i n g a r e a .

MR COUGHLIN:

Q S i t t i n g on t h e s i t t i n g a r e a ?

A Yeah. Like t h e b o r d e r on t h e i c e r i n k where

a lways sit.

Q Would t h a t be c a l l e d a l e dge by some?

A Yeah, I g u ess you c o u l d c a l l it t h e l e dge .

Q Okay. And i s it your u n d e r s t a n d i n g t h a t t he

j u s t walked up nex t to a group o f peop l e -

MR YOUNG: Your Honor , I o b j e c t t o your

If he knows f i r s t h a n d he can answer bu t

what your u n d e r s t a n d i n g -

THE COURT: If you saw someone t a k e t h e phone

can answer . If you he a rd it f rom someone e l s e you

MR COUGHLIN: And I ll j u s t p r e s e r v e f o r t h e

Your Honor , we have a m u l t i t u d e o f what someone

t o l d Z a r a t e and Goble i n t h e first coup l e o f days o f

You ve given some o f t h e r u l i n g s so f a r -

THE COURT: Okay. S i r , I v e r u l e d aga in . So go



MR COUGHLIN: So you s u s t a i n y e t a n o t h e r

by Mr. Young, t h e district a t t o r n e y

THE COURT: The same o b j e c t i o n . It i s

MR COUGHLIN: That you o v e r r u l e d when I made

THE COURT: -- if it s o f f e r e d f o r t h e t r u t h o f

a t i s s u e . This w i t n e s s , u n l e s s he has p e r s o n a l

o f who t ook t h e c e l l phone , you ask ed why he

to go a f t e r you, it s because someone t o l d him t h a t .

as to whether he a c t u a l l y saw you t a k e t h e c e l l phone ,

can on l y answer t h a t if he saw you t a k e t h e c e l l phone .

MR COUGHLIN:

Q Did you see t h e s u s p e c t t a k e t h e c e l l phone?

THE COURT: S i r , you have to answer t h a t ou t

THE WITNESS: No.

MR COUGHLIN:

Okay. Did you approach t h e s u s p e c t a l one?

A I d o n t remember . This was a y e a r ago .

Q Have you seen any v ide os on YouTube abou t t h i s ?

A No.

Q You ve seen no v ide os on YouTube about t h i s ?

A No.

Q I f we s e a r c h e d your home compute r , would we f i n d



remnant -

MR YOUNG: Objec t i on , a rgumen ta t i ve .

( I n d i s c e r n i b l e c r o s s - t a l k . )

THE COURT: When you s a i d t h i s , sir, what do you

t h i s ?

MR COUGHLIN: Anyth ing c onne c te d to t h i s

THE COURT: Connec ted , that s ve ry b roa d .

MR COUGHLIN: Any r e a s o n a b l e d e f i n i t i o n o f

any subsequen t i n t e r v i e w s t h a t t o o k p l a c e

a week l a t e r where Mr. L i c h t y say ing , Hey

THE COURT: I ' m go i ng t o s u s t a i n t h e o b j e c t i o n .

MR YOUNG: Also ask ed and answered .

THE COURT: Only t h i n g , if t h e r e i s someth ing on

v i deo o f t h e i n c i d e n t .

MR YOUNG: Your Honor I would ask t h a t

Cough l in s t o p l ook ing a t Mr. L i c h t y ' s mother . This i s

da nge rous ly c l o s e to me a s k i n g f o r s a n c t i o n s

Mr. Cough l in . He ' s now p e r your o r d e r a l i c e n s e d

The l a s t t h i n g he s h o u l d be do i ng i s l ook ing

a t Ms. L i c h t y d u r i n g t h i s c o n v e r s a t i o n . I would ask

he start watch ing h i m s e l f .

MR COUGHLIN: I f I am a l i c e n s e d a t t o r n e y I can

subpoenas .

THE COURT: He ' s not l i c e n s e d , sir.



MR YOUNG: You r e r i g h t . H e s t e m p o r a r i l y

However h e s a l l owed a c t in h i s own d e f e n s e .

does no t need to be l ook ing back in t h e g a l l e r y a t t he

mother .

THE COURT: A l l r i g h t . S i r , you do no t need to

a t t h e w i t n e s s mother .

MR COUGHLIN: I ll p r e s e r v e t h e r e c o r d . I have

i d e a who t h a t woman i s .

MR YOUNG: Well h e s l ook ing back a t h e r .

THE COURT: Now he knows.

S i r , you a r e i n s t r u c t e d no t to l ook a t t he

i m s mother o r t h e a l l e g e d v i c t i m .

MR COUGHLIN: Okay. If I can

a t me and s m i l i n g wi th Mr. Les l i e , I

a p p r e c i a t e t h a t

THE COURT: To my knowledge it h a s n t happened .

ahead , sir. Why d o n t you pay a t t e n t i o n to your case?


MR COUGHLIN:

Q Did you say someth ing to t h e s u s p e c t about h i s

ho le b e i n g widened whi l e he was in j a i l ?


Q If I showed you a videoed would t h a t he lp

your r e c o l l e c t i o n ? You need to answer wi t h an

r e sponse , sir, because t h i s i s be ing r eco rded and



w i l l p r o b a b l y be t ype d up i n t o a t r a n s c r i p t and if

i s a c o n v i c t i o n t h a t would p r o b a b l y be on t h e Nevada

C o u r t s we bs i t e ?

MR YOUNG: ( Inaud ib l e )

THE COURT: Huh?

MR YOUNG: Ask a q u e s t i o n , no t a s t a t e m e n t .

THE COURT: True . S i r , you a r e t h r e a t e n i n g t h e

by your s t a t e m e n t so

MR COUGHLIN: It s no t my i n t e n t i o n .

THE COURT: Well , you a r e . You can ask a

and y o u l l have to a c c e p t t h e answer .

MR COUGHLIN: Okay.

MR COUGHLIN:

Q If I showed you a v i d e o t a p e o f you s a y ing , Did

b u t t ho le g e t widened whi l e you were in jail, would

he lp r e f r e s h your r e c o l l e c t i o n ?

A Sure

Q Okay. Did you make any c a l l s t h a t n i g h t wi th

phone in c onne c t ion wi t h t h e a r r e s t o r t h e moments

t h e r e t o .

A I t h i n k I let Cory use my phone to c a l l 9-1 -1

I d o n t remember c omple t e ly .

Q W h at s your phone number?

MR YOUNG: Objec t i on , Your Honor r e l e v a n c e .

MR COUGHLIN: It goes to e s t a b l i s h , one ,



and, two, c ha in ( i n d i s c e r n i b l e ) -- I have t h e

r e c o r ds . I can impeach h i s t e s t i m o n y o r h i s

and t h e e x t e n t to which t h e y a r e

THE COURT: Well , first o f all, it s go t to be

W h at s t he r e l e v a n c e ?

MR COUGHLIN: We ve had a g r e a t d e a l o f

wi th r e s p e c t to who c a l l e d who and when. Most

it d u r i n g Mr. Young s c a s e in c h i e f where we w e r e n t

who by name c a l l e d who and c o u l d n t remember t h i s o r

and who c ou ld a c t u a l l y say t h e y had p e r c i p i e n t

o f see ing t h i s o r t h a t happen . That was

vague all t h roughou t Mr. Young s c a s e in which

p r i m a r i l y on h e a r s a y which he was a l lowe d to admit

ev idence .

THE COURT: S i r . The h e a r s a y was f o r probab l e

and t he p o l i c e o f f i c e r . This i s no t . This i s f o r

o r i nnoc e nc e . And, sir, you have t h e phone number

s a i d .

MR COUGHLIN: I d o n t know who t h e y a r e -

TH COURT: He s a i d t h a t a phone c a l l was

made from h i s phone to t h e d i s p a t c h by Cory.

m a t t e r what phone was used . It s what t he

was made to d i s p a t c h . And you have t h a t

MR COUGHLIN: I found it does m a t t e r q u i t e a



d e a l whose phone was u sed and where it p l a c e s him

what it would e na b le them to s e e o r do and how it

t o p r e v i o u s t e s t i m o n y .

And f u r t h e r , Z a r a t e and Goble t e s t i m o n y was not

t o proba b le cause a tall.

In f a c t , Mr L e s l i e

to c a l l him a t t he mot ion to s u p p r e s s h e a r i n g

THE COURT: Okay I ll s u s t a i n t h e o b j e c t i o n .

ahead .

MR COUGHLIN: So you made -

THE COURT: I s u s t a i n e d t h e o b j e c t i o n . Go

I m s o r r y .

MR COUGHLIN:

Q Mr L ic h ty , seems as t hough your l a s t answer was

you let Cory use your phone t o c a l l 9 - l - 1 ?

A I m not s u r e bu t I t h i n k s o .

Q Did you use your phone o r a l low anybody e l s e to

it a t any t im e t h a t n i g h t f o r any o t h e r purpose?

A I d o n t remember

Q Okay So you w o u l d n t have been a p a r t o f

to v e r i f y whether o r no t t h e s u s p e c t had t h e

v i a a t t e m p t i n g to c a l l it?

A No

Q 0 0 you have any r e c o l l e c t i o n o f t h a t ?

A I d o n t know



Q P l e a s e d o n t look to Mr. Young f o r coach i ng .

A I d o n t know what r e c o l l e c t i o n means . So if you

to e l a b o r a t e on it t h a t would be n ic e .

Q You s a i d you d o n t know what r e c o l l e c t i o n means?

A Uh-huh.

THE COURT: R e c o l l e c t i o n means do you remember .

THE WITNESS: Oh. I d o n t remember . It was a

t ime ago . I d o n t remember what c a l l s we made. It

ove r a ye a r ago .

MR COUGHLIN:

Q Okay. And on t h a t n i g h t , j u s t to go back a

b i t , d id you say someth ing to t h e e f f e c t o f I m 17.

a miner . You c a n t t ouch me. I can g e t away wi t h

t h i n g s to you?

A Maybe t h e first h a l f , not t h e end .

Q Could you g ive me i dea what s p e c i f i c a l l y you

say ing in t h a t r e ga rd?


Q But you remember w e l l enough to tell me not t h e

p a r t bu t what I -

A Yeah because I would no t s ay t h a t I can t ouch

I w o u l d n t .

Did you t ouch me t h a t n i g h t ?

A No.

Q Did you make a l ung ing a t t e m p t to r e a c h i n t o my



A No.

Q Did you make a n y t h i n g t h a t migh t r e a s o n a b l y be

A Maybe p o i n t e d a t your poc ke t because we saw t h e

l i g h t up when someone c a l l e d it.

Q Okay. I m n o t s a y i n g t h i s to badge r t he

Your Honor bu t h e s a young man and I would j u s t

to remind him you a r e under oa th , sir -

THE COURT: S i r , you d o n t need to remind him

The Cour t has a l r e a d y swore him under o a t h under

p e n a l t y o f p e r j u r y .

MR COUGHLIN: I j u s t d o n t know t h a t he

what t h a t means a t all t he co n seq u en ces t h a t

a t t a c h t h e r e t o .

THE COURT: You can ask him. You c a n t tell

You c a n t t h r e a t e n him.

MR COUGHLIN: I m no t t r y i n g to t h r e a t e n him

Honor .

THE COURT: Well , t h e n you can ask him if he

what p e r j u r y i s .

MR COUGHLIN: I m a little b i t o f f e n d e d t h a t

t h i n k I m t r y i n g to t h r e a t e n him.

THE COURT: Well , I m a little bit of fe nde d t h a t

a r e t e l l i n g me what I m do ing h e r e . I m t e l l i n g you



I b e l i e v e t h a t you a r e a t t e m p t i n g to i n t i m i d a t e t h e

MR COUGHLIN: You t h i n k it s p o s s i b l e t h a t I m

to tell a young man Hey t h e r e s r e a l life

You d o n t have as much s k i n in t h e game

o f t h e s e peop l e t h a t may be coach i ng you up j u s t

it s t r a i g h t .

THE COURT: S i r , so f a r as I m concerned , I

it as i n t i m i d a t i o n . So you can ask him as I

if he unde r s t a nds what p e r j u r y i s , if that s what

want to know.

MR COUGHLIN: Al l r i g h t .

MR COUGHLIN:

Q Do you unde r s t a nd what p e r j u r y i s ?

A Do you want t o e x p l a i n it?

THE COURT: I ll e x p l a i n it, sir It s l y i n g

oa th .

THE WITNESS: T h a t s what I b e l i e v e .

THE COURT: And if you lie under oa th , you can

p r o s e c u t e d f o r a f e l o n y which has a consequence o f one

i n p r i s o n .

THE WITNESS: Yes.

THE COURT: A l l r i g h t . Go ahead .

MR COUGHLIN:

Q Have you been t o l d might go by Mr. Young wi th



all ( I n d i s c e r n i b l e ) p r o s e c u t i n g f o r p e r j u r y -- t h e

of be ing p r o s e c u t e d f o r p e r j u r y ?

MR YOUNG: What was t h a t last q u e s t i o n ?

MR COUGHLIN:

Q Has Mr. Young o r anyone f rom t h e district

o r n e y s o f f i c e made any s t a t e m e n t s t o you wi t h r e s p e c t

t h e l i k e l i h o o d t h a t you would a c t u a l l y be p r o s e c u t e d

p e r j u r y if you happened to be caugh t p e r j u r i n g your

A I m no t l y ing . So f i n e .

Q T h a t s not what I asked you. I ask ed you sir,

Mr. Young made any s t a t e m e n t in any way r e l a t e d to t h e

chances -

A I j u s t t a l k e d t oday f o r t h e first t i me and we

t a l k e d abou t t h i s case . We d i d n t t a l k abou t

e l s e .

Q Righ t . Okay. Now I ll ask you f o r a t h i r d

p l e a s e t h i s t ime a c t u a l l y -


MR COUGHLIN:

Q -- answer my q u e s t i o n ?

MR YOUNG: H e s s t a r t i n g to badge r t h e w i t n e s s

wi t h t h e q u e s t i o n .

THE COURT: A l l r i g h t . R e s t a t e t h e ques t ion ,



MR COUGHLIN:

Q Did Mr. Young a t any t i m e in your r e l a t i o n s w i t h

o r anyone wi t h t h e district a t to r n e y s o f f i c e make any

to you t h a t i n d i c a t e d t h e l i k e l i h o o d o f your

p r o s e c u t e d f o r p e r j u r y ( i n d i s c e r n i b l e ) o r d i d t h e y

any s p e c i f i c i n d i c a t i o n o f t h e l i k e l i h o o d would be?

THE COURT: Now t h e q u e s t i o n is g o in g on

Did Mr. Young say a n y t h i n g abou t you b e i n g

f o r p e r j u r y ?

THE WITNESS: No.

THE COURT: The answ er is no. Go ahead .

MR COUGHLIN:

Q So t h a t p r o b a b l y w o u l d n t ( i n d i s c e r n i b l e ) any

o f it

THE COURT: Any s t a t e m e n t s abou t b e i n g

f o r p e r j u r y i n c l u d e s t h e c h a n c e o r no t

MR COUGHLIN: P o i n t t a k e n , Your Honor .

MR COUGHLIN:

Q Okay. So, you say t h a t a t no t i m e t h a t n i g h t

you e i t h e r a t t e m p t to r e a c h i n t o t h e s u s p e c t s p o ck e t

make a l u n g i n g t y p e o f movement wi t h y o u r r i g h t hand

t h e s u s p e c t , say , left f r o n t s h o r t p o c k e t ?

A No. Maybe p o i n t e d a t it b u t no r e a c h i n g .

Q You p o i n t -

A Because we saw t h e phone l i g h t up. T h a t s why,



someone c a l l e d it.

Q Did you s p e c i f i c a l l y s e e it l i g h t up?

A Yes I d i d .

Q When was t h a t ?

A Tha t n i g h t .

Q Okay. Tha t h e l p s b u t maybe if you c o u l d be a

bit more s p e c i f i c abou t

A This was a y e a r -

Q what happened t h a t n i g h t ?

A more t h a n a y e a r ago . I d o n t remember

what t im e t h a t happened . S o r r y .

Q Okay. I m n o t so much l o o k i n g f o r a s p e c i f i c

number b u t maybe if we p u t some s o r t o f r e f e r e n c e

i n t h e n i g h t . Did you, say , s e e it l i g h t up p r i o r

Ms. Watson c a l l i n g you and a n n o u n c i n g t h a t it was

A It was when we were all c i r c l e d a round you

f o r t h e p o l i c e to come

Q Okay. So would it have b e e n a t a p o i n t where

were one o f t h e initial in a group ap p ro ach in g t h e

A No.

Q Did t h i s group you e s t i m a t e d 20 all

c o n v e r g e upon t h e s u s p e c t ?

A No s lo w ly p eo p le s t a r t e d coming .



Q Can you d e s c r i b e t h a t s p e c i f i c a l l y , s t a r t i n g

who do you first r e c a l l appr oach i ng t h e s u s p e c t ,

o r no t t he y were a l one and s p e c i f i c a l l y i n d i c a t i n g

do you fit i n t o t h a t .

A I d o n t remember.

Q Can you e x p l a i n t h e me how you a r e a b l e to

as to c e r t a i n t h i n g s bu t t h e n no t remember o t h e r

A Somet imes you know s t u f f , somet imes it j u s t

I d o n t know.

Q R i gh t . But y o u r e t e s t i f y i n g i s to t h i n g s t h a t

you c a n t remember them t hen you w o u l d n t have been

to know t h e t h i n g s a i d immed ia te ly -

MR YOUNG: T h a t s a rgume n ta t ive .

THE COURT: A l l r i g h t . S u s t a i n e d .

MR COUGHLIN:

Q So would you say you were one o f t h e initial

o f t h r e e who approached t h e s u s p e c t ?

MR YOUNG: Your Honor asked and answered .

THE COURT: Well , I d o n t t h i n k he asked him if

was t h e initial group o f t h r e e . So I ll a l low

THE WITNESS: I d o n t know. I was one o f t h e



Y MR. COUGHLIN:

Q Would you say one o f t h e first f i v e ?

A Yeah.

Q But no t one o f t he first seven?

A I h o n e s t l y d o n t know.

Q Do you remember when you first s t a r t e d t a l k i n g

Mr. Goble abou t h i s phone p e rh ap s b e i n g m iss in g ?


Q When would you say you first became aware as to

phone might be m iss in g ?

A As soon as I go t t h e phone c a l l and t h e y s a i d

a phone was s t o l e n and it w a s n t mine and t h e on ly

pe r son I know t h a t has an iPhone was Cory.

Q Okay. What d i d you do immed ia te ly t h e r e a f t e r ?

A Went a f t e r you.

Q You d i d n t look a round f o r Cory and ask him if

had h i s phone?


Q Well , okay. T h a t s where I ge t co n fu sed i s you

p r i o r had a d e f i n i t i v e answer and t h e n ex t

you c o u l d n t remember.

MR. YOUNG: Your Honor o b j e c t i o n , that s no t a

MR. COUGHLIN: It was a s k i n g f o r c l a r i f i c a t i o n .

THE COURT: It s i s a s t a t e m e n t . Ask a



sir.

MR COUGHLIN: Okay.

MR COUGHLIN:

Q And -- I m so r r y , Your Honor I d o n t mean to go

o r ( I n d i s c e r n i b l e ) on your r u l i n g . Can I ask , what

I guess Ms. Watson you s a i d tell you t h a t made you go

t he s u s p e c t ?

MR YOUNG: Objec t i on , Your Honor . You covered

and w e v e gone ove r t h i s and you p r e v i o u s l y s t a t e d if

kep t going a f t e r p r e v i o u s r u l i n g s you would c o n s i d e r

him in con tempt . He c o n t i n u e s to do t h a t .

THE COURT: A l l r i g h t . S i r , t he r u l i n g was and

c l a r i f y it one l a s t t ime t h a t what she had s a i d i s

to him e xc e p t h i s r e a c t i o n to what he s a i d i s no t

So if based on what she s a i d , he de t e r mi ned to

a f t e r you that s t h e on l y pu r pose o f it, it s a d m i t t e d

t h a t pur pose a lone and no t t h e s p e c i f i c c o n t e n t o f

she s a i d t o him. Al l r i g h t .

MR COUGHLIN: Okay. With r e s p e c t to whether it

t o h i s s t a t e o f mind h i s f e a r f u l n e s s , d i d t h i s __

THE COURT: S t a t e o f mind i s i r r e l e v a n t , sir.

c a r e if he was a f r a i d o f you o r n o t . What

does it make?

MR COUGHLIN: Well , one , goes t o impeach h i s

t e s t imony t h a t he was in f e a r o f h i s life and



-

THE COURT: What if it d id? It i s no t r e l e v a n t

whether o r no t you s t o l e t h e c e l l phone .

MR COUGHLIN: I t h i n k it goes to a m a t e r i a l

in ev i dence because one o f t h e e l e me n t s o f t h a t p e t t y

cha r ge -- and Your Honor I m s o r r y , I d o n t know

I a p o l o g i z e if you r u l e d on t h i s b u t d i d you i s s u e a

wi th r e s p e c t to my mot ion t h a t t h e p o s s e s s i o n o r

s t o l e n p r o p e r t y cha r ge i s u n s u p p o r t a b l e as a

was p l e a d in t h a t it d i d n o t ment ion -

THE COURT: Yes I d e n i e d t h e mot ion .

MR COUGHLIN: Under S t aub , t h e mandatory

in Nevada .

THE COURT: I de n ie d t h e mot ion . It s an i s s u e

f a c t and you had t h e o p p o r t u n i t y to a r gue t h a t a t t h e

o f t h e e v ide nc e , sir.

MR COUGHLIN: We c a n t t a k e j u d i c i a l n o t i c e

t h e compl a i n t does no t ment ion f rom ano the r?

THE COURT: S i r , I v e r u l e d .



MR COUGHLIN:

Q So how many t ime s would you say -- you t e s t i f i e d

you saw t h e phone l i g h t up?

A Yes.



Q How many t i mes would you say d i d t h a t happen

Yes it happened once and you f l i p p e d t h e phone

so we c o u l d n t see it anymore .

Q So you would say you were on l y a b l e to see t h a t

From what I remember .

Q Okay. I s it t h e c a s e t h a t t h e phone j u s t lit up

i n d i c a t e an incoming c a l l ?

It happened when we c a l l e d .

Q A l l r i g h t . So t h e r e was a c onne c t ion made?

Yes.

Q That some how v e r i f i e d to you what you were

n g t o f i n d out?

Yes.

Q But t h e phon had one o f t h e apps where it j u s t

up r a t h e r t ha n -

You can a l s o see t h e d e s i g n .

Q The i m p r i n t k i nd t h a t it

Yeah and it was p a i n t e d a p i c t u r e , Cory took a

o f and you see t h e c o l o r s i n it.

Q Okay.

It was obv ious t h a t it was h i s phone .

Q Okay. And Cory it had it s e t to t h a t incoming

n o t i f i c a t i o n where t h e s c r e e n on l y l i g h t s up and



i s no v i b r a t i n g ?

A Yes.

Q So it d i d n t v i b r a t e ?

A I d o n t remember compl e t e l y b u t I d o n t know.

Q I s t h a t how Cory l i k e s to s e t h i s phone up?

MR YOUNG: Obje c t ion .

THE WITNESS: I d o n t know.

THE COURT: He a l r e a d y answered . Go ahead , sir.

MR YOUNG: I was go ing to o b j e c t to p e r s o n a l

bu t he s a i d he d o e s n t know so that s good

MR COUGHLIN: Okay.

MR COUGHLIN:

Q But you d i d n t h e a r any v i b r a t i n g o r any r i n g

You j u s t saw it l i g h t up?

A We were all -- it was t h e h e a t o f t h e moment.

k ind o f l i k e it j u s t goes away l i k e you b l a c k ou t

s t u f f happens . I on ly remember p a r t s o f t h a t n i g h t .

d o n t remember e v e r y t h i n g , eve r y little d e t a i l .

Okay. I m a s k i n g you do you remember h e a r i n g

i n d i c a t i o n -


Q But you a r e say i ng you remember s e e i n g

A I remember s e e i n g it l i g h t up f o r s u r e .



Q Which pocke t would t h a t have been i n?

A I d o n ' t remember

Q What s i d e o f t h e s u s p e c t were you on?

A I d o n ' t remember

Q Who was t h e r e wi th you w i t h gauged e a r s ?

THE COURT: Who was t h e r e what?

MR. COUGHLIN: A gen t leman -- I ask ed him who

t h e r e wi t h you wi th gauged e a r s which i s k i n d o f l i k e

co r k , g e t a huge ho l e c u t i n t o t h e i r e a r l o b e pu t a co rk

it somewhat s i m i l a r to maybe an A f r i c a n

pe r s on .


THE WITNESS: I d o n ' t know

MR. COUGHLIN:

Q Do you r e c a l l an i n d i v i d u a l l i k e t h a t ?

A I t h i n k h i s name i s Peanu t bu t I d o n ' t know h i s

name

Q You t h i n k i s name i s P ean u t?

A I t h i n k . But I d o n ' t know h i s r e a l name

Q What e l s e do you know ab o u t P ean u t?

A A b s o l u t e l y n o t h i n g .

Q How d i d you know h i s name i s Peanu t?

A Because I t h i n k Cory and I went and t a lk e d t o

abou t t h e s i t u a t i o n l ik e when t h e p o l i c e a r r i v e d

he came o v e r and asked what happened t o us and he



h i s name He s a i d h i s name was P eanu t .

Q Was he p a r t o f an initial group wi t h you and

appr oach i ng t h e s u s p e c t , t h e group o f t h r e e ?

A Group o f t h r e e ? I d o n t remember .

Q Do you r e c a l l whe the r he showed up

A I t h i n k he showed up

Q a f t e r t h e s u s p e c t was in t h e squad c a r in

o r was he p a r t o f t h e

A He showed up when t h e p o l i c e were t h e r e I t h i n k

I d o n t remember . It was a y e a r it was l i k e a ye a r

a h a l f ago w e r e t a l k i n g abou t .

Q Have you h e a r d any v i deos on You Tube o f t h i s

A I have no t .

Q None o f your f r i e n d s have ment ioned o r Googled

names or a ny th ing , t u r n e d up a v i deo on YouTube?

A No a u d i b l e r e s p o n s e . )

Q Okay. Did you c a t c h up wi t h anybody e l s e t h a t

A To Cory to c a l l t h e cops .

Q J u s t t o Cory?

A From what I remember . I t h i n k I d i d . I t h i n k

used my phone to c a l l t h e p o l i c e bu t I d o n t

Q Okay. Did you pas s your phone to Peanu t a t a l l ?



A No because I d o n t know t h a t k i d and I w o u l d n t

t h a t . It s l i k e me g i v i n g my phone to you. I d o n t

you. I d o n t t r u s t t h a t .

Q Okay. Where wi t h you - so it was your

t h e s u s p e c t j u s t grabbed t h e phone o f f t h e

MR YOUNG: Your Honor o b j e c t i o n . H e s a l r e a d y

he d i d not see t h e s u s p e c t gr ab t h e phone . For

to ask , w h a t s your under s t and ing , t h a t goes to

one , hear say , o r two had no p e r s o n a l knowledge.

MR COUGHLIN: I m more ask ing to u n d e r s t a n d

h i s s t a t e o f mind was wi th r e s p e c t to whether

THE COURT: His s t a t e o f mind i s i r r e l e v a n t so

go ing t o s u s t a i n t h e o b j e c t i o n .


MR COUGHLIN:

Q Who e l s e was t h e r e p r i o r to t h e p o l i c e a r r i v i n g ,

t h e group wi th you?

A A l l t h e pe op le -- I d o n t know t h e pe op le you

Rober t was t h e r e . C ol t on was t h e r e . Cory

t h e r e . Nate was t h e r e . T h e r e s a l o t o f peop l e t h a t

d i d n t know t h a t were t h e r e .

Q Was Ni co l e Watson t h e r e ?

A Yes.



Q When is t h e last t i m e you spoke w i t h N i c o l e

A Maybe once a f t e r t h a t n i g h t .

Q J u s t once a f t e r t h a t n i g h t ?

A I t h i n k so .

Q But you two a r e w e l l a c q u a i n t e d enough t h a t

t h a t she c a l l e d you i m m e d i a t e l y -

A Yeah.

Q a b o u t t h e phone?

A e used to be f r i e n d s . But I d o n t know what

to it. I d o n t know where she w ent , if she moved

r what happened .

Q I s she a s t u d e n t a t McQueen High Schoo l .

A I d o n t know if she still is. She was.

Q Were you?

A I was.

Q Are you a f reshman i n c o l le g e t h i s y e a r ?

A Yes I am.

Q Did you make any s t a t e m e n t s abou t Cory b e in g 24

o l d o r so b u t still have ( I n d i s c e r n i b l e ) someone

was 17?

MR YOUNG: Your Honor o b j e c t i o n . Relevance

q u e s t i o n .

THE COURT: W h a t s t h e r e l e v a n c e , s i r ?

MR COUGHLIN: I t h i n k it would go t o , one , t h e



o f Mr. G o b l e s t e s t imony p r e v i o u s l y . We have got

L i c h t y s r e l a t i o n s h i p wi th Mr. Goble and h i s

o f t h e v e r a c i t y o f Mr. G o b l e s a p p a r e n t c l a i m

he was all t imes no t ne g l ige n t on t h i s n i g h t in

MR YOUNG: Your Honor I h e a r d no b a s i s in t h a t

to show why t h i s i s r e l e v a n t .

THE COURT: Objec t i on s u s t a i n e d .

MR COUGHLIN: S i r , may I have one more s e n te nc e

why I b e l i e f .

THE COURT: What?

MR COUGHLIN: May I a d d r e s s t h a t wi th a little

more o f an o f f e r o f p r o o f ?

THE COURT: A little b i t .

MR COUGHLIN: It s my u n d e r s t a n d i n g t h a t one

o f ( i n d i s c e r n i b l e ) in t h i s c a s e might be t h a t t h i s

l o s t o r m i s l a i d o r abandoned p r o p e r t y and t h e e x t e n t

which and t h e r e f o r e l a r c e n o u s i n t e n t d id not e x i s t

t h e t ime o f any a l l e g e d t a k i n g s u f f i c i e n t to under

a u t h o r i t y in Nevada l aw auger f o r an a c q u i t t a l

t h e e x t e n t to which Goble e i t h e r a l l e g e d l y left a

on t h e ground in t h e midd le o f t h e ska t e p l a z a

l e a v i n g it -

THE COURT: Well sir t h a t depends on when t h e

i s and I know that s your argument t h a t t h e



t a k i n g o c c u r r e d when you first r e c e i v e d t h e phone .

t h e r e i s a n o t h e r argument t h a t t h e a l l e g e d t a k i n g

when you r e f u s e d to s u r r e n d e r t h e phone . W e l l

t h a t in argument .

But r i g h t now sir, you can ask s p e c i f i c a l l y if

Goble i s n e g l i g e n t c a r i n g f o r h i s p r o p e r t y I gues s ,

no t whether he was mature o r n o t . I d o n t know what

t h a t ha s .

MR. COUGHLIN: Yes sir, Your Honor j u s t to

Made no r e p r e s e n t a t i o n s wi th r e g a r d r e c e i v i n g o r

r e c e i v i n g t h e phone o r any p o s s e s s i o n o f t h e phone

g i ven t h a t t h e s u p p r e s s i o n mot ion i s still up

de ba te

MR. YOUNG: T h a t s i n a c c u r a t e . It s no t .

MR. COUGHLIN: That i s a c c u r a t e .

THE COURT: Well , it i s not up t o de ba te , sir.

r u l e d on t h e motion .

MR. COUGHLIN: And I c i t e it in my b r i e f s to

you let t h a t up f o r f u r t h e r r ev i ew and I t h i n k

p a r t i c u l a r l y a p p r o p r i a t e -

THE COURT: S i r , I r u l e d on t h i s r i g h t now. So

ahead . W e re not go ing to argue someth ing e l s e .

MR. COUGHLIN: I f I c o u l d p r e s e r v e t h e r e c o r d

e x t e n t t o which -

THE COURT: Your q u e s t i o n , you had a ques t ion .



MR COUGHLIN: Righ t .

THE COURT: The q u e s t i o n was whe the r o r not -

MR COUGHLIN: This i s a b i g de a l .

THE COURT: Wel l , maybe in your mind.

MR COUGHLIN: Well , it i s b ecau se Mr. L e s l i e

90 p e r c e n t o f t h e t ime . He ' s p r e j u d i c e

THE COURT: You, sir a r e r unn i ng t h e case r i g h t

MR COUGHLIN: R i gh t . In t h e n i n t h i n n i n g I ge t

t a k e o v e r a f t e r Mr. L e s l i e ( i n d i s c e r n i b l e ) t h e first.

THE COURT: Well , so f a r -

MR COUGHLIN: And p r e j u d i c i a l

THE COURT: t h i s w i t n e s s has no t he l ped your

L e t ' s p u t it t h a t way. So go ahead .

MR COUGHLIN: Yes, sir.

THE COURT: If you want to elicit someth ing

Mr. Goble ' s n e g l i g e n c e i n t a k i n g c a r e o f h i s c e l l

go ahead and do t h a t .

MR COUGHLIN: Thank you, Your Honor . Yes.

MR COUGHLIN:

Q P l e a s e , Mr. L ic h ty , would you respond to t h a t

t h a t -

THE COURT: No. You ask your q u e s t i o n . I 'm no t

your q u e s t i o n s .

MR COUGHLIN: Yes, sir Your Honor .



Y MR. COUGHLIN:

Q Was t h e r e some i n d i c a t i o n t h a t n i g h t t h a t

Goble was n e g l i g e n t in some r e g a r d w i t h h i s

MR. YOUNG: I o b j e c t to t h a t as f a r as t h e use

It s a l e g a l t e r m t h a t c a l l s f o r a l e g a l

He can ask f a c t s o f what happened . But any

as to whether h e s quo te -unquo te n e g l i g e n t , I m

co n ced in g he was b u t any argument , that s a r g u m e n t s

Mr. Cough l in may ask q u e s t i o n s as to t h e b a s i s -

THE COURT: S u s t a i n e d . The word n e g l i g e n c e , you

ask him q u e s t i o n s r e l a t i v e to t h e f a c t s f rom which t h e

can conc lude t h a t he was n e g l i g e n t .

MR. COUGHLIN:

Q Okay. Would you say Cory was c a r e f u l wi t h h i s

phone t h a t n i g h t ?


Q What do you remember ab o u t where t h e phone was

a n y t h i n g Cory s a i d abou t it?

A That he d i d n t want to b r e a k it i n h i s pocke t

we were s k a t e b o a r d i n g and we fall all t h e t ime so

p u t it down nex t to t h e g i r l s , I gue s s , I d o n t know.

Q Next to what g i r l s ?

A Ni co l e Watson.

Q And Lucy Bying ton?



A Yeah.

Q Okay. So it was s e a t e d r i g h t n e x t to them?

It was some th ing Cory d i d . I d o n t know But

what I t hough t .

t o l d where t h e phone was p la c e d?Q But you were

MR YOUNG: Objec t i on , Your Honor h e a r s a y .

COURT: Yes o b j e c t i o n s u s t a i n e d .THE

MR COUGHLIN: Negl i gence , a n a l y s i s o r m i s l a i d

abandoned p r o p e r t y ?

THE COURT: It s still h e a r s a y . You can

it f rom somebody e l s e if you wish .

MR COUGHLIN: Well , I d o n t know t h a t Ms.

o r Ms. Bying ton w i l l a ppe a r , o r Mr. Dawson. So to

e x t e n t he might be one o f t h e on ly o p p o r t u n i t i e s t o

t h e t e s t i m o n y in t h a t r e g a r d .

MR YOUNG: He can c e r t a i n l y ask which I would

o b j e c t to if he saw where t h e phone was. But he

ask where he he a rd t h e phone .

THE COURT: Where was it?

MR YOUNG: I j u s t want to be c l e a r abou t my

Mr. Cough l in ask ed what was your under s t and ing

t h e phone was . Mr Coughl in i s f r e e t o ask t h e

if he saw where Mr. G o b l e s phone was and if he

f i r s t h a n d , I m no t go ing to o b j e c t to t h a t . But as

as h i s under s t and ing o f what o c c u r r e d , t h a t



THE COURT: A l l r i g h t . Then t h e o b j e c t i o n is

s u s t a i n e d . You can a s k t h e q u e s t i o n as Mr. Young

Y MR COUGHLIN:

Q Did you s e e where t h e phone was?

A I d i d n o t .

Q Did you see t h e s u s p e c t come i n t o t h e p o s s e s s i o n

r r e c e i v e t h e phone?

A No.

Q Did you e v e r a c t u a l l y s e e t h e phone in t h e

p o s s e s s i o n ?

A Yes when it lit up i n your p o c k e t .

Q Were you a b l e to v e r i f y f o r s u r e t h a t it was

phone?

A Yes.

Q How so?

A The p i c t u r e on it and t h e way you f l i p p e d it

soon a s it s t a r t e d l i g h t i n g up

Q And t h a t to you was c o n c l u s i v e p r o o f ?

A Yes .

Q Okay. And you co u ld s e e t h r o u g h , what was it

i n t h e p o c k e t a t t h e t ime?

A ( I n d i s c e r n i b l e ) what you were w e a r i n g .

Q You d o n t know what I was w e a r i n g ?

A I d o n t .



Q But you a r e a b l e to testify t h a t you can see

it?

A Yes Because I do remember s e e i n g t h e phone

Q Okay Was anyone p h y s i c a l l y o r v i o l e n t t oward

s u s p e c t ?

A I d o n t know

Q You have no r e c o l l e c t i o n o f t h a t ; i s t h a t

A That is c o r r e c t .

Q Were you y o u r s e l f a t a l l ?

A No

Q Did you c a l l t h e s u s p e c t a f aggo t and say g ive

t h e phone , f a ggo t , o r some th ing l i k e t h a t ?

A I might have c a l l e d names

Q Such as f aggo t ?

Do you know whe the r you were c a p t u r e d s a y ing

on a 9-1 -1 r e c o r d i n g .

A I d o n t know

Q Did Mr Goble a t any t i me on t h a t n i g h t say , I m

to r e a c h i n t o h i s pocke t r i g h t now?

MR YOUNG: O b j e c t i o n , h e a r s a y .

MR COUGHLIN: ( I n d i s c e r n i b l e . )

THE COURT: I w i l l o v e r r u l e t h a t o b j e c t i o n .

he can t e s t i f y what he he a rd Mr Goble say and it s

r e a l l y he a r s a y b ecau se it s no t o f f e r e d f o r t h e t r u t h



You canw h e t h e r o r n o t he r eached i n t o h i s p o c k e t .

t h a t q u e s t i o n , if you know.

THE WITNESS: I d o n t know. I j u s t w o r r i e d

I d o n t know whatwhat was g o i n g on w i t h t h e phone .

a r e s a y i n g .

MR COUGHLIN:

Q Did t h e s u s p e c t say a n y t h i n g l i k e , Hey lets all

p e a c e f u l and w a i t f o r t h e p o l i c e to a r r i v e and r e s o l v e

p e a c e f u l l y ?

MR YOUNG: O b j e c t i o n . Tha t is h e a r s a y .

MR COUGHLIN: Goes to h i s -- t h e e f f e c t on t h e

MR YOUNG: I d o n t know how t h a t goes to t h e

on Mr. L i c h t y .

THE COURT: I ll s u s t a i n t h a t o b j e c t i o n .

MR COUGHLIN:

Q Was t h e s u s p e c t t a l k i n g p e a c e f u l l y w i t h you?

A No.

Q How would c h a r a c t e r i z e h i s b e h a v i o r ?

A Being rude and maybe d e f i a n t .

Q In what way was he d e f i a n t ?

A He knew t h a t he had t h e phone and we d i d a s k

a t first if we c o u l d j u s t have it back and we

u l d n t g e t t h e p o l i c e i n v o l v e d and he j u s t was

on s a y i n g he d i d n t have it u n t i l t h e cops



Q Did t h e s u s p e c t say a n y t h i n g l i k e , If it 's your

why would you l e a v e t h e phone your mom and dad go t

300 bucks on -

MR YOUNG: O b j e c t i o n , Your Honor h e a r s a y .

THE WITNESS: I have no i de a .

MR YOUNG: C l e a r - c u t h e a r s a y .

THE COURT: S u s t a i n e d .

MR COUGHLIN: Why it 's go ing to

THE COURT: You can t e s t i f y , sir.

MR COUGHLIN: I know I can . That goes to

o r not ( i n d i s c e r n i b l e ) a rgumen t .

THE COURT: His d e f i a n c e argument? T h a t ' s h i s

o f your behav io r .

MR COUGHLIN: And f u r t h e r it wouldn ' t be -

THE COURT: You a r e t h e one who ask ed him.

MR COUGHLIN: Yes.

THE COURT: I d o n ' t know whether it 's r e l e v a n t

bu t it w a s n ' t o b j e c t e d t o .

MR COUGHLIN: He made t h e s t a t e m e n t t h a t t h e

s a i d j u s t I d o n ' t have your phone and if t he

made a s t a t e m e n t in t h a t v e i n it would t e n d to

some th ing a l ong t h e l i n e s o f w e l l , who knows

phone it is. Might have -

THE COURT: That i s r e a d i n g your mind sir,



you c a n t do. T h a t s p u re s p e c u l a t i o n and i s

Anyhow t h i s w i t n e s s u n d e r s t a n d i n g o f

m o t i v a t i o n to me i s i r r e l e v a n t .

MR COUGHLIN: I m t r y in g t o a s c e r t a i n h i s

o f whether o r no t t h e s u s p e c t t r u l y s a i d yes

r no b a s i s to hav ing t h e phone o r b e i n g aware

THE COURT: He a l r e a d y s a i d t h a t you den i ed t h a t

had t h e phone .

MR COUGHLIN: And I m a s k ing was someth ing s a i d

might t e n d t o i n d i c a t e someth ing l e s s t ha n d e n i a l .

THE COURT: Ask a q u e s t i o n , sir.

MR COUGHLIN:

Q Did Mr. Goble say , You j u s t a d m i t t e d you s t o l e

phone?

MR YOUNG: Your Honor o b j e c t i o n , he a r s a y .

THE COURT: I ll a l low t h e q u e s t i o n .

MR COUGHLIN:

Q You d o n t r e c a l l h e a r i n g a ny th ing l i k e t h a t ?

A No.

MR COUGHLIN: I m s o r r y , Your Honor I m t r y i n g

to go back .

MR COUGHLIN:

Q Did t h e s u s p e c t say a ny th ing a b o u t , D o n t s e t

phone on t h e ground and go s k a t e b o a r d away a m i le

and t he n g e t mad -




MR. COUGHLIN:

Q - - t h a t t he world p i c k s it up?

MR. YOUNG: Objec t i on . Mr. Cough l in , h e ' s

what t h e s u s p e c t s a i d andthat s

h e a r s a y . You 've

on t h i s .

THE COURT: Al l r i g h t . S u s t a i n e d .

MR. COUGHLIN: Yes, s i r Your Honor , I 'm so r r y ,

d i d n ' t mean -- Mr. Young, I d i d n ' t mean t o -

THE COURT: Well , you can ask t h e q u e s t i o n bu t

I s u s t a i n t h e o b j e c t i o n t h e n you have to move on. Go

MR COUGHLIN: I f I 'm ask ing it not to prove o f

o f t he m a t t e r a s s e r t e d bu t t o

THE COURT: Prove what?

MR COUGHLIN: The e f f e c t on t h e l i s t e n e r .

THE COURT: The e f f e c t on t h i s w i t n e s s s

I ' v e a l r e a d y s a i d t h a t . In f a c t , I t h i n k t h e

e f f e c t on anyone that s r e l e v a n t i s you. But -

MR. COUGHLIN:

Q Was t h e s u s p e c t t h e r e a g g r e s s i v e towards you?

A No, I d o n ' t t h i n k so .

Q ( I nd i s c e r n ib l e ) p h y s i c a l l y a g g r e s s i v e towards

A No.



Q Was he v e r b a l l y a g g r e s s i v e t oward you?

A I d o n t remember what you s a i d .

Q But t h e r e w a s n t any s o r t o f body l anguage o r

t h a t was a g g r e s s i v e o r t h r e a t e n i n g ?

A I d o n t know I d o n t remember

Q Okay But a second ago d i d you j u s t testify no

asked if t h e s u s p e c t was a g g r e s s i v e ?

A R e s t a t e t h a t p l e a s e .

Q I m a s k i n g you j u s t a minu te ago when you were

was t h e s u s p e c t a g g r e s s i v e t h a t n i g h t and you s a i d

A Yeah

Q Okay

A You j u s t were d e f i a n t

Q In what way is d e f i a n t ?

A Like you w o u l d n t g iv e t h e phone back . You were

you were l y i n g abou t t h e whole t h i n g . You j u s t

e r e n t b e i n g r e a s o n a b l e when it c o u l d have j u s t been

s o l v e d .

Q Was t h e r e any i n d i c a t i o n why t h e s u s p e c t migh t

t a k e n t h a t p o s i t i o n ?

A I d o n t know

Q Did t h e s u s p e c t i n d i c a t e -

MR YOUNG: Hearsay , if h e s g o i n g t o go ask

he s a i d .



THE COURT: Al l r i gh t . Go ahead wi th your

.

Y MR. COUGHLIN:

Q Did t h e s u spec t make any i n d i c a t i o n t h a t he

it o f f pu t t i n g t h a t you ' r e group o f you s a i d

some 20, I assume t h ey a r e all you ths ,

him in a ho s t i l e and agg r e s s i v e manner sudden ly

-

MR. YOUNG: Obj ec t i on .

THE COURT: Hearsay , s u s t a i n ed .

Y MR. COUGHLIN:

Q Did you o r someone you were wi th make a 9-1 -1

t h a t n igh t a l l e g i ng t h a t someone j u s t socked a minor?

A Not t h a t I 'm aware o f .

Q You make any s t a t emen t abou t you be i ng a minor

someone j u s t socked you o r punched you o r t ouched you

a way

A ( I n d i s c e r n i b l e . )

Q I 'm s o r r y , c ou l dn ' t hea r you.

A No.

Q Okay. So you a re s ure abou t t h a t ?

A P r e t t y su r e .

Q Okay. And so j u s t to f o l l ow up, t h a t would

t h a t ne i t h e r you nor anyone you were aware o f used

i n an impe rm i s s i b l e way by l y i n g abou t someone j u s t



socked a minor to g e t -

MR. YOUNG: Asked and answered .

MR. COUGHLIN:

Q - to g e t a more urgen t r e s pons e f rom t h e

A I d o n t know. I d o n t know who c a l l e d 9-1 -1 .

Cory d i d wi t h my phone bu t I d o n t know.

Q Re ga rd l e s s o f when you know who c a l l e d 9-1 -1 , do

know whether somebody c a l l e d

THE COURT: He j u s t answered t h a t , sir.

MR. YOUNG: Asked and answered .

THE COURT: O b j e c t i o n s u s t a i n e d . Move on.

MR. COUGHLIN: Okay.

MR. COUGHLIN:

Q Did you see -- once t h e o f f i c e r a r r i v e d , where

you p o s i t i o n e d ?


Q Do you remember t h e o f f i c e r a r r i v i n g ?

A Yes.

Q Can you d e s c r i b e what you saw o r hea r d?

A I remember them f i n d i n g t h e phone and t he n Cory

h i s l oc k t h i n g and we f i g u r e d ou t it was h i s phone .

that s what I remember f rom t h a t .

Q You remember them f i n d i n g t h e phone?

A In your poc ke t . And t hen Cory -- t h e o f f i c e r



t h e phone to Cory. Cory un locked it because he had a

code on it. And t hen Cory proved t h a t it was h i s

by un lock ing t h e pas s code .

Q Okay. Did you eve r see t h e o f f i c e r a t t empt to

t h e phone o r would t h a t have been po i n t l e s s s i n ce you

see it l i g h t up anyway?

A I don ' t remember.

Q So you were t h e r e when t h e o f f i c e r a r r i v ed?

A (No aud ib l e r e sponse . )

Q I s t h a t co r r e c t ?

A Yes.

Q How many o f f i c e r s were t h e r e?


Were t h e r e f i v e o f f i c e r s t h e r e when you -

A I don ' t know.

Q Okay. Do you r e c a l l whe the r t h e o f f i c e r

s t a r t e d go ing t h rough t h e s u s p e c t ' s pocke t


Q Do you r e c a l l whether th e s u sp e ct had a dog o r a

wi th him?

A He had a b ike .

Q Do you r e c a l l whether he had a dog?


Q You keep l ook ing a t Mr. Young. Would you p l ea s e



answer my q u e s t i o n -


THE COURT: He s a l l o w ed t o look a t anyone he

Mr. Young i s no t s i g n a l i n g him o r a ny th ing . I v e

obs e rv ing Mr. Young.

MR COUGHLIN: I u n d e r s t a n d . I observed him

t oo e s p e c i a l l y on aud io r e c o r d i n g s , and I v e

a t key p o i n t s t h e r e seems t o be c e r t a i n s i g n i f i e r s

voc a l i n f l e c t i o n and o t h e r w i s e t h a t would t e n d to

t r o u b l e zone t r o u b l e zone.

THE COURT: He s no t do ing any th ing . Righ t now

s m i l i n g a t your s t a t e m e n t .

MR COUGHLIN: Okay. Got a good sense o f humor.

MR COUGHLIN:

Q Was t h e s u s p e c t , was he - was he w a i t i n g to t h e

o r

MR YOUNG: O b j e c t i o n , Your Honor .

THE COURT: Was he what?

MR YOUNG: I b e l i e v e t h e q u e s t i o n was was t h e

f o r t h e p o l i c e and I o b j e c t to t h a t based

p e r s o n a l knowledge.

THE COURT: Yeah -- I ll s u s t a i n t h e ob je c t i on .

wi tness has no way o f knowing whether you were

f o r t h e p o l i c e o r no t .

MR COUGHLIN: Wel l he can testify as to what



p e r c e i v e d o f whe the r t h e s u s p e c t was l e a v i n g , go ing

THE COURT: He can testify as to whe the r o r no t

were t h e r e when t h e p o l i c e a r r i v e d which h e s a l r e a d y

h e s a l r e a d y done .

MR COUGHLIN: But that s a d i f f e r e n t q u e s t i o n .

m -- I m n o t a s k i n g whe the r o r no t I was t h e r e . I m

w h e t h e r o r n o t

THE COURT: You can ask if you tried to l e a v e .

MR COUGHLIN:

Q Did t h e s u s p e c t t r y to l e a v e ?

A When you first s t o l e t h e phone , yes . But t h e n

b i k e b r o k e and t h e n we c i r c l e d you and we w o u l d n t

you u n t i l t h e cops came.

Q What d i d t h a t e n t a i l . Did you p u l l t h e s u s p e c t

A No. We j u s t s t a y e d a round you so you w o u l d n t

anywhere .

Q Did t h e s u s p e c t t r y t o go anywhere?

A No. Because t h e r e was a l o t o f u s making s u r e

you w e r e n t go ing to g e t away.

Q How would t h e s u s p e c t know you were making s u r e ?

A Because we were in a c i r c l e a round you.

Q Were some o f you sitting down some o f you

up?




Q Okay. Did t h e s u s p e c t say a ny th ing l i k e , Let me

I want to l e ave?


Q Did t h e s u s p e c t say a n y t h i n g l i k e t h e r e was a 13

o l d who j u s t k i l l e d somebody Stephen G i l l , two

ago -

MR YOUNG: T h a t s h e a r s a y .

MR COUGHLIN:

Q So everybody needs to r e l a x ?

THE COURT: S u s t a i n e d . And t h i s i s t h e l a s t

I t h i n k you I t h i n k I made it p r e t t y c l e a r , you

ask him abou t s t a t e m e n t s you made. A l l r i g h t ?

MR COUGHLIN: Okay.

THE COURT: So you a r e j u s t w a s t i n g t ime by

to do t h a t .

MR COUGHLIN:

Q Did you o r anyone e l s e t h a t n i g h t say , I j u s t

somebody so t h a t d o e s n t app l y to me?

A W hat s your q u e s t i o n ?

Q Did you o r anyone t h e r e t h a t n i g h t say , I j u s t

somebody two months ago?

A I d o n t know.

Q You d o n t know. Okay.

MR COUGHLIN: Your Honor I would l i k e to

t h e w i t n e s s r e c o l l e c t i o n a n d / o r impeach h i s



by o f f e r i n g i n t o ev i dence some v ide os o r

a t t h e p r e s e n t , p l a y i n g t h e v ide o f o r him

MR YOUNG: Your Honor as t o r e f r e s h i n g

memory Mr. Cough l in can a t t e m p t to r e f r e s h t h e

memory by showing him someth ing o r o t h e r wise bu t

no t p r o p e r to admi t it. I d o n t know what

h e s t r y i n g to r e f r e s h t h e w i t n e s s memory

THE COURT: I ll tell what I ll l e a v e t h e


THE COURT: You can a t t emp t to r e f r e s h h i s

and -

MR COUGHLIN : Okay.

THE COURT: Mr. Young can o b j e c t when I come

if he d i d someth ing

MR COUGHLIN: I would ask t h a t t h e trier o f

remain in t h e cour t room.

THE COURT: Well , you a r e wrong sir.

MR COUGHLIN: I m not a s s e r t i n g a n y t h i n g

THE COURT: Because it made -- you have no t

to Mr. Young what you a r e o f f e r i n g in e v ide nc e .

MR COUGHLIN: Yes I have .

THE COURT: You have one, y o u v e t o l d him

what y o u r e o f f e r i n g in ev i dence?





t h a t and t hen I ll come back u n l e s s it s done q u i c k e r .

MR COUGHLIN: T h i s isn t f o r r e f r e s h i n g , it s

a u t h e n t i c a t i o n a t t h i s p o i n t .

THE COURT: Well , sir, y o u l l need to r e f r e s h

memory o u t s i d e o f my p r e s e n c e .

MR COUGHLIN: But I j u s t s a i d I m do i ng t h i s

r e f r e s h i n g . I m do ing t h i s t o a u t h e n t ic a t e t h e v ide o .

MR YOUNG: Your Honor I r e c e ive d numerous

from Mr. Cough l in . I d o n t know which v ide o h e s

a bou t . I can g i v e you t h e d a t e s .

THE COURT: I v e r u l e d on t h i s . Y o u l l have 10

a t most to g e t t h i s done .

MR COUGHLIN: To do what? I m no t a t t e m p t i n g

h i s r e c o l l e c t i o n . I m a t t e m p t i n g to have him

h i s v i deo and testify as to whether it s, you

-

THE COURT: He c a n t testify to t he e n t i r e

sir.

MR COUGHLIN: Well , it s no t ve ry l ong a t all,

a mi nu t e .

THE COURT: Y o u l l be a b l e to do t h a t wi t h

r i g h t now and t h e n I ll come back . If Mr. Young

no o b j e c t i o n , you can a t t e m p t t o a u t h e n t i c a te it, if

what you want to do. But even if it s

it i s no t a d m i s s i b l e u n l e s s it i s f o r



pur poses so I d o n t know who y o u r e go ing to

MR. COUGHLIN: It i s f o r impeachment purpos e s .

THE COURT: Impeaching who?

MR. COUGHLIN: Mr. L i c h t y and Mr. Goble and

Dura lde and Mr . Z a r a t e .

THE COURT: A l l r i g h t . Well , t h e n y o u l l need

do what I s a i d .

MR. COUGHLIN: J u s t to c l a r i f y , that s to

r e c o l l e c t i o n o r a u t h e n t i c a t e it o u t s i d e your

Your Honor?

THE COURT: Yes all o f it.

MR. COUGHLIN: Al l r i g h t .

THE COURT: If y o u r e done soone r I ll come back

MR. COUGHLIN: I f I i n t e n d to show more t ha n one

s hou ld we t r y to do as much as we can?

THE COURT: With t h i s w i t n e s s , yes .

This w o n t be on t h e r e c o r d . What w i l l be on

r e c o r d i s what a c t u a l l y happens when we resume. A l l

A r e c e s s was t a k e n . )

THE COURT : P l e a s e be s e a t e d .

MR. COUGHLIN: Your Honor I would l i k e t o e n t e r

t h e r e c o r d , I f e e l ve r y t h r e a t e n e d by J im L e s l i e h e r e .



would a c t u a l l y l i k e to move f o r a p r o t e c t i o n o r d e r .

t h r e a t e n i n g me.

THE COURT: Denied . Denied . You a r e not go ing

was te t h e C o u r t s t ime anymore .

MR COUGHLIN: He s ve r y t h r e a t e n i n g .

THE COURT: H e s not t h r e a t e n i n g you and I

him t o be h e r e .

MR COUGHLIN: Yes sir. Your Honor I would

t o have Mr. L ic h ty a u t h e n t i c a t e a coup l e o f v i deos

some 9-1-1 c a l l s t h a t he was a p e r c i p i e n t wi tness t o ,

was t h e r e t o p e r c e i v e -

THE COURT: He made t h e 9-1-1 c a l l ?

MR COUGHLIN: Well I t h i n k t h e t e s t imony was

were made from h i s phone t h a t he p a s s e d t o h i s f r i e n d


MR COUGHLIN: W hat s t h a t , s i r ?

THE COURT: Did he make t h e 9-1-1 c a l l ?

MR COUGHLIN: I d o n t know I mean I t h i n k it

wi th h i s phone . Who d i a l e d it I d o n t know.

vo ic e i s on it. I d o n t b e l i e v e d o n t know.

l i k e to ge t h i s t e s t imony on it.

THE COURT: Wel l you a l r e a d y have h i s

MR COUGHLIN: With r e spe c t to t h i s -



MR YOUNG: Your Honor b e i n g t h a t it s a bench

so it s a little p e c u l i a r b u t I ll be o b j e c t i n g t o

bu t one o f t h e a u d i o / v i d e o s t h a t I j u s t he a rd . One o f

I have no o b j e c t i o n t o and that s f o r s t r a t e g i c

on ly .

The o t h e r one I o b j e c t to and so wi thou t you

t h e v ideos , y o u l l no t be a b l e t o know whether

shou l d be o b j e c t e d t o .

THE COURT: Al l r i g h t . Br ing them up he re and

e l l look a t l e a s t t h e be g inn ing o f each one and see how

i s germane to t h i s w i t n e s s .

MR YOUNG: The o t h e r t h i n g , because

Cough l in i s a t t e m p t i n g to admi t t h i s a s e v ide nc e ,

to be marked and a d m i t t e d wi t h t h e Cour t .

THE COURT: Wel l we have DVDs; r i g h t ?

MR COUGHLIN: I b e l i e v e you do sir, yes .

THE COURT: Or t h e CDs. I m no t s u r e what t h e y

MR YOUNG: The o t h e r t h i n g i s , I can a ddre s s my

a t t h e a p p r o p r i a t e t im e bu t o b v i o u s l y

j u s t f o r t h e showing o f t h e o f f e r o f p r o o f

t o t h e way it i s .

THE COURT: Al l r i g h t . L e t s -- a r e t h e y cued

and r eady to go? Do you have




MR YOUNG: Your Honor aga in , f o r you to make a

needs to be someth ing marked and a d m i t t e d

t h e Cour t . Mr. Coughl in i s p l a y i n g it o f f t he

u n l e s s he wants to admi t h i s e n t i r e compute r as

whichI

c a n t imagine he does , he needs to

someth ing to

THE COURT: Are t h e y a ud ios ?

MR COUGHLIN: S i r , t h e y a r e t h e 9-1-1 c a l l s

THE COURT: Are t hey a ud ios ?

MR COUGHLIN: Those a r e aud ios .


MR COUGHLIN: And t he n t h e r e s v i d e o s .

THE COURT: The v ide os w i l l have to be a dmi t t e d .

a ud ios you can p l a y and p i c k e d up on t h e microphone .

MR COUGHLIN: Okay. And so -- okay. The

a r e in t h e C o u r t s f i l e s and Mr. Young i s go ing to

t h e s e . They were a t t a c h e d

THE COURT: I have no v ideo , sir.

MR COUGHLIN: On that s t h e DVDs?

THE COURT: I have empty -- someth ing you f i l e d

t h e l a s t -- s t u f f you f i l e d t h e o t h e r day and it was an

l ooked l i k e a cove r f o r a v ideo . I d o n t want to

t i me on t h i s . Go ahead . We w i l l t a k e it in

if we de c ide to use it o r if -- wel l , y o u l l have



l e a v e it in e v ide nc e . Have it marked -- w h a tev e r you

go i ng to do have it marked r i g h t now.

MR COUGHLIN: Okay.

THE CLERK: ( I na ud ib l e . )

THE COURT:Oh

Ihave no i de a .

I lllook a t

p r i o r trial d a t e t h a t I would have marked it on. It

t e s t i m o n y by Dura lde .

Okay. e d i d have an E x h i b i t D -- E x h i b i t A and

which were p i c t u r e s o f t h e c e l l phone which were

MR COUGHLIN: The p r e v i o u s trial t h e r e would

been n o t h i n g to he lp me admi t in e v ide nc e by

L e s l i e .

THE COURT: Do you have any th ing o t h e r t han A

B t h a t were a dmi t t e d?

THE CLERK: This w i l l be D e f e n d a n t s E x h i b i t

MR COUGHLIN: Mr. L e s l i e r e f u s e d it to u t i l i z e

-

THE COURT: I d o n t want to h e a r abou t

L e s l i e . This i s your c a s e now so you p r e s e n t it as

you can , sir.


THE COURT: Do you have them r eady to be marked?

MR COUGHLIN: Your Honor j u s t to c l a r i f y , t h e



on l y r e c e i v e d one D o r DVD f rom me?

THE COURT: I d i d n ' t r e c e ive any .

MR YOUNG: There has been no CDs o r DVDs

ev i dence in t h i s trial o r marked f o r

even .

THE COURT: None were r e c e i v e d e i t h e r .

MR COUGHLIN: None were r e c e i v e d ?

THE COURT: No.

MR COUGHLIN: Or a t t a c h e d to -

THE COURT: It was a t h i n g j u s t l i k e t h a t t h a t

have and I b e l i e v e I can f i n d it b u t I j u s t d o n ' t want

was te t ime l ook ing f o r it because r i g h t now w e ' r e

to move on wi t h t h e trial.

MR COUGHLIN: But you wouldn ' t have rev iewed

( i n d i s c e r n i b l e )

THE COURT: I would not have r ev iewed someth ing

you d i d n ' t f u r n i sh t o me, no, sir.

MR COUGHLIN: But maybe it seems as t hough a

ago you i n d i c a t e d

THE COURT: I would no t have r ev i ew ed it in any

hav i ng u sed t h e e nve lope . A l l r i g h t . There

no th ing in it.

MR COUGHLIN: Was t h a t t h e C o u r t ' s u s u a l

to book it i n t o ev i dence o r someth ing l i k e t h a t



THE COURT: It i s t h e C o u r t s u s u a l p r a c t i c e no t

r ev i ew someth ing that s not been s u b m i t t e d to t h e o t h e r

in a t i m e l y manner w i t h i n 10 days . But fu r the rmore

to r ev i ew someth ing t h a t i s not in e v i d e n c e , and it s

in e v ide nc e .

MR COUGHLIN: So even if it s a t t a c h e d as an

to a motion , t h e Cour t would no t r ev iew it?

THE COURT: I would not r ev i ew it wi thou t g i v i n g

o t h e r s i d e a chance to r e spond . But r i g h t now sir,

go ing to g i v e you abou t two minu te s . If you d o n t

t h o s e marked and r eady to go w e l l move on to t h e

t h i n g .

MR COUGHLIN: A l l r i g h t , sir. A c t u a l l y a t t h i s

can I first p l a y them to impeach h i s t e s t i m o n y

t han

THE COURT: No. F i r s t you need to have them

as an e x h i b i t . And t he n you need to ask him if he

t h i s and t h a t on such and such a d a t e .

MR COUGHLIN: Al l r i g h t .

THE COURT: If he says , Yes I d i d , it s o v e r

You d o n t even g e t to admi t t h e impeach ing

If he says , No I d i d n t , t hen if it i s , and

c o r r e c t l y s t a t e e x a c t l y what it i s in t h e t a p e and he

it, t h e n you can p l a y it. Al l r i g h t .

MR COUGHLIN: Okay. And you s a i d I c ou ld p l a y



au d io i n t o t h e r e c o r d a t t h i s p o i n t in a s k i n g him -

THE COURT: No. I s a i d first o f all, you have

have them marked as an e x h i b i t . Have you done t h a t ?

MR COUGHLIN: Wel l , I b e l i e v e you s a i d if it s

it d o e s n t need to be an e x h i b i t ( i n d i s c e r n i b l e )

THE COURT: No I d e c i d e d t o t h e c o n t r a r y .

w e r e n o t -- you have it mark it.

MR COUGHLIN: I m s o r r y . Your Honor j u s t t h e

t h a t I had a h e a r i n g in my life a few days ago f o r my

l i c e n s e is somewhat ( I n d i s c e r n i b l e ) .

THE COURT: S i r , y o u v e known ab o u t t h i s

MR YOUNG: Your Honor if he d o e s n t have

-

THE COURT: I s e t t h i s trial a l o n g t im e ago.

w a i t e d to t h e last minu te to move f o r a c o n t i n u a n c e .

you


THE COURT: A f t e r you had subpoenaed 30 o r 40

t he n you dec i ded t o move f o r a c o n t i n u a n c e .

MR COUGHLIN: Wel l , when all my subpoenas were

e x - p a r t e by an em a i l n o t i c e t o me -- b u t you t o l d

when you s e t t h i s trial t h e r e w i l l t h e r e would be no

THE COURT: I d i d based on t h e f a c t t h a t you



ample o p p o r t u n i t y r e p e a t e d l y and you were he re

we p icked t he da t e .

MR COUGHLIN: Yes sir. J u s t t o c l a r i f y , if I

t h i s marked and moved in e v ide nc e can I t hen t ake it

to p l a y it o r w i l l I need

THE COURT: S i r , you c a n t have it marked and

i n t o ev idence . I f you want to impeach a wi tnes s ,

you have to c o n f r o n t him w i t h t h e p r i o r i n c o n s i s t e n t

MR COUGHLIN: I would l i k e to do t h a t now by

t h e aud i o i n t o t h e reco rd .

THE COURT: No. You c o n f r o n t him by ask ing him

q u e s t i o n , e x a c t l y the que s t i on .

MR COUGHLIN: And t h a t c o n s i s t s o f p l a y i n g t he

THE COURT: No. Speak ing works ou t o f your

Isn t it a f a c t t h a t on t h i s da t e , you s a i d t h i s .

MR COUGHLIN: Okay. Thank you.

THE COURT: P r e c i s e l y as it i s on t he a ud io .

MR COUGHLIN: Okay.

MR COUGHLIN:

Q Mr. Lich ty , isn t it a f a c t t h a t on August 20

you s a i d , I m a minor . I m 17 you c a n t touch me?

MR YOUNG: Asked and answered , Your Honor .

a l r e a d y t e s t i f i e d to t h i s .



THE COURT: He d i d . So it s no t even a p r i o r

s t a t e me n t . He a l r e a d y testified he s a i d

MR COUGHLIN: No he -- okay .

THE COURT: W h at s t h e ne x t one?

MR COUGHLIN:

Q Did you e v e r demand t h a t t h e s us pe c t g ive you

dog o r h i s b ike ?


Q Y o u r e l ook ing a t Mr. Young a ga i n . But p l e a s e

answer t h e q u e s t i o n .

I d o n t remember . I d o n t remember you even

a dog. I remember t h e b i k e . I d o n t remember t h e

THE COURT: S i r , t h e q u e s t i o n I t o l d you you

ask i s , On t h i s da t e d i d you say t h i s , p r e c i s e l y

he s a i d t h a t you a r e g o in g to impeach him wi th . Not

you say a n y t h i n g abou t a dog. The q u e s t i o n i s , Isn t

a f a c t t h a t on t h i s da t e a t t h i s t i me you s a i d t h i s ?

MR COUGHLIN: Okay.

MR COUGHLIN:

Q Isn t it a f a c t t h a t August 20 2011

11 :26 p.m. you s a i d , Give us t h e phone

I d o n t remember . It s p o s s i b l e .



Q Okay.

MR COUGHLIN: I would l i k e t o p l a y -

THE COURT: Wait , wai t , w ai t . Did you in f a c t ,

t h e r e c e s s p l a y t h a t f o r him?

MR COUGHLIN: Yes. I b e l i e v e we d i d .

THE COURT: Did he , Mr. Young?

Can you r ep ea t t h a t a g a in ?

MR COUGHLIN:

Q I s it t r u e t h a t on August 2 0 th , 2011

a round 11 :25 , you s a i d t o t h e s u s p e c t , Give

t h e phone f a g g o t ?

A It s p o s s i b l e .

Q Well I would l i k e t o p l a y

THE COURT: When you s a i d , i s it p o s s i b l e

MR COUGHLIN: I would l i k e t o p l a y t h e

THE COURT: He s a i d it was p o s s i b l e .

MR COUGHLIN: But he d i d n t say yes .

THE COURT: A l l r i g h t . Then I ll a l l o w you to

t h a t p o r t i o n o f t h e aud io e x a c t l y and ask him if t h a t

h i s memory because it was u n c l e a r to me as t o

o r no t h i s memory was r e f r e s h e d o u t s i d e o f

So go ahead .

MR COUGHLIN : And he would be ab l e to

t h e aud io?



THE COURT: You can ask him if that s h i s vo i ce?

r i s t h a t you t a l k i n g ?

MR COUGHLIN:

Q I s t h a t you in t h e v id eo ?

THE COURT: I d o n t know what you have -

MR YOUNG: Your Honor i s t h e r e an e x h i b i t to

marked?

THE COURT: I asked him to have it marked. But

have it marked a f t e r w a r d s . W e l l mark t h i s as

1 .

MR YOUNG: H e s p l a y i n g it o f f h i s ha r d dr ive?

MR COUGHLIN: No. This i s o f f

MR YOUNG: Wel l have it marked.

THE COURT: Wel l , t h e n w e l l d e l a y it f u r t h e r .

would l i k e -

MR YOUNG: J u s t no te my o b j e c t i o n .

MR COUGHLIN: I f we cou l d have it marked and -

THE COURT: A l l r i g h t . P u l l it o u t and have it

Do you have them all marked s i r ? Anyth ing t h a t

go ing to a t t e mpt to do r i g h t now have it all

MR COUGHLIN: Okay.

THE COURT: Because w e r e go ing to s t o p a t 10

noon o r -

How l a t e can you be he re -



THE CLERK: ( I n au d i b l e . )

THE COURT: Wel l no t 1 2 :1 5 .

W e ll do it t o 12 and by t h a t t ime y o u l l be

w i th t h i s wi tnes s , sir.

MR YOUNG: Your Honor I c a n t imag ine t h i s

even t a k e s to noon.

THE COURT: Well I d o n t know. The way h e s

so f a r it i s . T h a t s why I m t r y i n g to e x p e d i t e

Br ing him up sir. Hurry up.

MR COUGHLIN: Yes.

THE COURT: These w i l l become p a r t o f t h e c o u r t

bu t y o u l l be ab le to g e t c o p i e s made l a t e r if you

them.

We c a n t pu t it on t h e f r o n t o f t h e d i s c ?

THE CLERK: I m no t s u r e . I can . I can t r y .

know how t h a t w i l l a f f e c t in h i s compute r .

THE COURT: Well normal ly it -- Huh?

MR YOUNG: I t h i n k it goes in t h e enve lope .


MR YOUNG: D o e s n t it go in t h e enve lope?

THE COURT: Wel l if we p u t it in t h e enve lope ,

f i n e bu t we need t o g e t , match t h e r i g h t d i s c wi th

r i g h t enve lope . You can w r i t e on t h e enve lope if you

one.

THE CLERK: H e s a s k i n g t h e q u e s t i o n to change



on t h e d i sc , t h e w r i t i n g on t h e d i s c .

THE COURT: I d o n t know how h e s go ing t o

it.

THE CLERK: ( Inaud ib le .


THE COURT: Who wro te it o r i g i n a l l y ?

MR COUGHLIN: Me.

THE COURT: Al l r i g h t . Then go ahead and change

MR. YOUNG: Your Honor whi l e h e s do ing t h a t ,

I check a message?

THE COURT: Yes.

Can you j u s t on t h e enve lope w r i t e some th ing

so we p u t t he r i g h t d i s c in t h e r i g h t enve l ope .

a t s all I m concerned a bou t .

S i r , it d o e s n t m a t t e r which o r d e r t h e y a r e i n .

can j u s t tell us which one you a r e r e f e r r i n g t o .

Why d o n t you start. You can g e t t h e r e s t f rom

MR. YOUNG: If I can j u s t s e e what Mr.


Al l r i g h t . E x h i b i t s , D e f e n d a n t s e x h i b i t s 1

3 have been marked. None have been admi t t ed .

MR . COUGHLIN: Sorry , I m t r y i n g to if I can



q u i c k l y -- t h i s i s t h e l a s t one . Mark t h i s as

4.

THE COURT: J u s t l e a v e t h a t up t h e r e wi t h h e r

g e t back to what you a r e doing .

MR COUGHLIN: A l l r i g h t . So may I p l a y t h i s

MR YOUNG: Your Honor , t h e r e s been no

THE COURT: I m go ing t o ask him to p l a y t h e

t h a t d e a l s d i r e c t l y wi t h t h i s w i t n e s s .

(Exh ib i t s 1-4 were marked f o r

i d e n t i f i c a t i o n . )

THE COURT: I m go ing t o ask him to p l a y t h e

t h a t d e a l s d i r e c t l y wi t h t h i s w i t n e s s . Then you ask

if that s h i s v o i c e .


MR YOUNG: And I ll be a l l owed t o o b j e c t .

THE COURT: Yes.

MR COUGHLIN: ( I n d i s c e r n i b l e )

THE COURT: Yes. I d o n t even c a r e if I he a r

I can d i s r e g a r d it.

MR COUGHLIN: I u n d e r s t a n d .

THE COURT: W e r e t a k i n g more t i me s e t t i n g it

Video p l a y i n g . )



THE COURT: But I do have a q u e s t i o n .

Mr. Young you d i d not o b j e c t to t h e q u e s t i o n

MR YOUNG: W h a t s t h e q u e s t i o n ?

THE COURT: About t h e wi tness c a l l i n g him a

THE CLERK: Does t h i s g e t marked a l s o ?

MR COUGHLIN: Yes.

THE COURT: That was t h e impor t o f it.

MR YOUNG: Fine . I b e l i e v e h e s a l r e a d y

to t h a t so I o b j e c t to t h a t .

MR COUGHLIN: Your Honor you s a i d t h e wi tne s s

a f i g h t ?

THE COURT: A f aggo t . I mean that s t he s h o r t

It was more t ha n t h a t

MR YOUNG: The t e s t imony a s I r e c a l l

Lich ty , he used some words and d i d n t know o r remember

it was and demanded t h e phone back .

THE COURT: Yes.

MR YOUNG: So if that s what w e r e go ing to be

t h e r e i s no th ing to r e f r e s h h i s

t h e r e s no r ea son to p l a y t h e v ide o .

MR COUGHLIN: Wel l Your Honor he cou l d

it.

THE COURT: No it was whether o r not he was



to impeach him. But he neve r de n ie d it.

MR YOUNG: Exac t l y , t h e r e i s n o t h i n g to impeach

THE COURT: Al l r i g h t . Then I ll s u s t a i n t h e

on t h a t one . Move on to t h e ne x t one .

MR COUGHLIN: And fo r a u t h e n t i c a t i o n pur poses ,

THE COURT: No I 'm s u s t a i n i n g t h e o b j e c t i o n as

h i s answer on t h a t t h a t it would no t impeach him

he does not deny t h a t he made t h e s t a t e m e n t . He

s a i d he does not remember whether o r no t he made

s t a t e m e n t . And fu r the rmore I d o n ' t t h i n k it s

whether he c a l l e d you t h a t o r n o t .

MR YOUNG: He a l r e a d y t e s t i f i e d , he s a i d to

t h e phone back . If all Mr. Cough l in wants in i s t h e

o f t h e word f a g g o t , t h e r e ' s ( i n d i s c e r n i b l e . )

MR COUGHLIN: Wel l sir, I t h i n k it would go to

e f f e c t on t h e accu sed and whether , t h e r e ' s -- t e s t i f y

to a group o f 20 -


THE COURT: Okay. O b j e c t i o n s u s t a i n e d . Move on

t h e nex t one . Move on to your ne x t q u e s t i o n .

MR COUGHLIN: Okay. Did you say someth ing to

-

THE COURT: Not someth ing , d i d you say .



Y MR. COUGHLIN:

Q Did you say some th ing t o t h e e f f e c t of , Did your

ho le g e t widened w h i l e you were in j a i l ?

A It s p o s s i b l e , yeah .

THE COURT: When was t h i s now?

MR. COUGHLIN: This would have been abou t

a f t e r t h e s u s p e c t was r e l e a s e d f rom a week in jail.

MR. YOUNG: Your Honor I o b j e c t to t h a t . One

r e l e v a n c e , two on -- wel l , it s i r r e l e v a n t , a c c o r d i n g

Mr. C o u g h l in s o f f e r o f proo f , it s a week a f t e r t h e

There i s no r e l e v a n c e t h e r e .

THE COURT: Okay. That one i s s u s t a i n e d . Go on

t h e nex t one .

MR. COUGHLIN:

Q Did you e v e r t h r e a t e n t h e s u s p e c t to br eak h i s

when he was i n t e r v i e w i n g you?

MR. YOUNG: I would o b j e c t as t o e v e r . It s

He can ask so f a r i s t h e n i g h t o f August 20th ,

beyond t h a t it s i r r e l e v a n t .

THE COURT: Okay.

MR. COUGHLIN: I t h i n k it goes t o t h i s w i t n e s s

It f u r t h e r goes to

THE COURT: The w i t n e s s has t h e a b s o l u t e r i g h t

to t a l k to you.

MR. COUGHLIN: But d o e s n t have t h e a b s o l u t e



to th row c i g a r e t t e s on me punch me c a l l me a

-

THE COURT: Then you s h o u l d file a c r i mi na l

a g a i n s t him sir.

So f a r as t h i s c a s e goes , on t h e n i g h t o f t h e

t h e f t , that s what w e r e t a l k i n g a bou t .


And t h e n I would l i k e t o p l a y t h e w i t n e s s t h i s

c a l l and ask him q u e s t i o n s r e l a t e d t h e r e t o .

THE COURT: Any o b j e c t i o n to t h a t one?

MR YOUNG: I d o n t know which c a l l h e s t a l k i n g

-- if it s Mr -- i s it your c a l l ?

MR COUGHLIN: It s t h e one t h a t a t 1 1 : 2 6 and 20

it s G o b l e s c a l l . b e l i e v e t h i s i s t h e one

e i t h e r d i s p a t c h e r Weise o r d i s p a t c h e r Montgomery.

MR YOUNG: I would have t o h e a r which one it i s

I can lodge an o b j e c t i o n a t t h e r e l e v a n t t i me .

THE COURT: A l l r i g h t . Go ah ead .

MR COUGHLIN: I can p l a y it?

THE COURT: Yes.

MR COUGHLIN: Okay.

THE COURT: For a u t h e n t i c a t i o n p u r p o s e s . It s

f o r impeachment .

MR COUGHLIN: I t h i n k it migh t u l t i m a t e l y wind

t h e r e if I can r e s e r v e t h a t .



R YOUNG: Hasn ' t been a u t h e n t i c a t e d ye t . It

be p la ye d and t h e wi tne s s can say .

Tape p l a y e d . )

MR COUGHLIN: Sor ry it s f rom t h e be g inn ing .

MR YOUNG: I s Mr. Coughl in moving, a s k ing to

t h a t c a l l i n t o ev i dence?

R COUGHLIN: Yes.

MR YOUNG: I have no o b j e c t i o n to t h a t c a l l .

THE COURT: It s a d m i t t e d .

( E x h i b i t s 1 and 2 were a dmi t t e d in

ev idence . )

MR COUGHLIN: I j u s t want t h e t r u t h to come

THE COURT: Huh?

MR COUGHLIN: I j u s t want t h e t r u t h to come

MR YOUNG: e t oo .

MR COUGHLIN: I d o n ' t have o b j e c t i o n to

l i k e Mr. Young.

MR YOUNG: I have an o b j e c t i o n to i r r e l e v a n c e

i n a d m i s s i b l e ev i dence .

THE COURT: Well , anyhow, it s a d m i t t e d so let s

argue abou t someth ing that s a l r e a d y a d m i t t e d .

Anyth ing e l s e ?

MR COUGHLIN: I f I cou l d impeach Mr. L ic h ty and



him if t h i s was h i s vo i ce s a y ing , Give us t h e phone

MR YOUNG: Your Honor y o u v e a l r e a d y r u l e d

MR COUGHLIN: I f I cou l d p l a y t h a t aga i n f o r

THE COURT: I a l r e a d y r u l e d on t h a t .

MR COUGHLIN: I f I -

THE COURT: I s it your vo i ce?

THE WITNESS: Yes.

THE COURT: A l l r i g h t , done .

MR COUGHLIN:

Q S i r , j u s t to c l a r i f y . T h a t s you s a y ing , Give

s t h e phone f aggo t ?

THE COURT: He a l r e a d y s a i d ye s .

MR COUGHLIN:

Q Okay a r e you s a y ing it to t h e s u s p e c t ?

THE COURT: He s a i d ye s . Y o u r e done. You

g e t to ask it f i v e t imes .

MR COUGHLIN: I m s o r r y . Yes sir.

MR COUGHLIN:

Q Did you say t h a t to t h e s u s p e c t o r who were you

it t o?

A P ro b ab ly to you.

Q Okay.



A It would make s e n s e .

Q Why were you us ing t h e t e rm f aggo t ?

MR YOUNG: Obje c t ion -

THE COURT: I r r e l e v a n t , s u s t a i n e d .

MR COUGHLIN: Your Honor if I may make an

o f p r o o f .

R YOUNG: Your Honor you s u s t a i n e d t h e

THE COURT: W h a t s t h e o f f e r o f p r o o f -

MR YOUNG: This i s t a k i n g e n t i r e l y t o o l ong .

you make a r u l i n g , Your Honor wi t h all due r e spe c t ,

Coughl in needs to move on. W e re h e r e a t 11:30 now

w e r e still on Mr. C o u g h l i n s first w i t n e s s . This i s

way t o o l ong .

MR COUGHLIN: I j u s t want to r e sp o n d to t h e

It s my u n d e r s t a n d i n g , if I d o n t p r e s e r v e it

r eco rd , I might -

THE COURT: J u s t s t a t e it. Go ahead . What i s

r ea son?

MR COUGHLIN: Wel l , I t h i n k it goes -- t h e

i s a f r a i d o f t h e s e youth .

MR YOUNG: That would be e f f e c t on he re which

L ic h ty i s no t q u a l i f i e d to testify t o .

THE COURT: Y o u r e a f r a i d because he c a l l e d you

f aggo t ?



MR COUGHLIN: Wel l , t h e r e i s a l s o and I d o n t

if you cou l d h e a r it

THE COURT: A l l r i g h t , sir. The o b j e c t i o n i s

Go on.

MR COUGHLIN:Okay. If

Icou l d j u s t q u i c k l y

-

MR YOUNG: You j u s t s u s t a i n e d

THE COURT: I a l r e a d y r u l e d on it. Next t ime

have you e s c o r t e d ou t .

Al l r i g h t . Go on, move on.

MR COUGHLIN: If I cou l d p l a y him t h e p a r t ,

where I b e l i e v e it s h i s vo ic e s a y ing , g i v e me your

I m go ing to t a k e your dog.

THE COURT: We ve a l r e a d y he a rd it.

MR COUGHLIN: Can I ask him if that s h i s vo i ce

t h a t ?

THE COURT: Yes.

THE WITNESS: I d o n t remember t h e r e be i ng a dog

it p o s s i b l y cou l d have been me.

MR COUGHLIN:

Okay. So if I p l a y your vo ic e

THE COURT: You a r e no t go ing to p l a y it aga i n

I t h i n k it s i r r e l e v a n t whether you had a dog o r

MR COUGHLIN: Not abou t whe ther I had a dog -



he was t r y in g t o t a k e t h e dog o r s t e a l t h e b i k e .

MR YOUNG: I r r e l e v a n t .

THE COURT: If t h e y were h o l d i n g it you can

them bu t t he y d i d n t . You were h o l d i n g t h e phone

to what you s a i d r i g h t t h e r e .

MR COUGHLIN: I d i d n t say a n y t h i n g abou t

t he phone

THE COURT: Yes you d id . You s a i d you r each

my poc ke t . That w a s n t you s i r ?

MR COUGHLIN: You s a i d you he a rd my vo ic e say ,

f you r e a c h i n t o my pocke t I w i l l sue you?

THE COURT: Yes.

MR COUGHLIN: And you i n t e r p r e t t h a t to say

i s a d m i t t i n g to ho ld ing a phone

THE COURT: No I d i d n t say t h a t you a dmi t t e d

h o l d i n g t h e phone . Go ahead .

MR COUGHLIN: Yes sir. I t h i n k you r u l e d t h a t

c a n t so I d o n t want to go a g a i n s t it o r b r i n g up o r

f u r t h e r i n t o them t r y i n g to s t e a l t h e b i k e where you

t h a t was i r r e l e v a n t I b e l i e v e .

THE COURT: I s a i d it s i r r e l e v a n t t o whe the r o r

you t ook t he phone . T h a t s t h e on l y i s s u e b e f o r e me

Y o u r e ch a rg ed wi th s t e a l i n g o r t a k i n g a phone by

o r p o s s e s s i o n o f s t o l e n p r o p e r t y , two coun t s .

MR COUGHLIN: With t h e i n t e n t to p e rm an en t ly



wi t h t he i n t e n t .

THE COURT: With e v e r y t h i n g t h a t goes wi th it.

MR COUGHLIN: Righ t and I t h i n k it goes to

THE COURT:Goes t o what?

MR COUGHLIN: The i n t e n t to pe r manen t l y

THE COURT: I n t e n t t o pe r manen t l y d e p r i v e if

took your b i c y c l e ?

MR COUGHLIN: No. If someone d id , f o r t h e sake

f argument , have t h e phone and t h e y felt t h a t keep ing t h e

in t h e i r pocke t might be t h e on l y ( i n d i s c e r n i b l e )

would p r e v e n t t h i s a g g r e s s i v e group o f y o u th s f rom

THE COURT: I m no t go ing to g e t i n t o t h e

o f t h e case , now sir.

MR YOUNG: Your Honor Mr. L i c h t y who s t h e

on t h e s t a n d has no way o f knowing what

Cough l in j u s t s ugge s t e d .

THE COURT: The o b j e c t i o n was s u s t a i n e d . W e r e

If you have any o t h e r q u e s t i o n s f o r t h i s w i t n e s s ,

-

MR COUGHLIN: Okay.

THE COURT: Do you have any o t h e r q u e s t i o n s ?

MR COUGHLIN: Yes.



Y MR. COUGHLIN:

Q Mr. L ic h ty , if, say , you -- if someone was, say ,

to s t e a l your dog o r your b i k e

MR. YOUNG: Obje c t ion , Your Honor , I see where

i s headed .


THE COURT: F i n i s h t h e q u e s t i o n .

MR. YOUNG: I ' m j u s t t r y i n g to speed t h i n g s up.

THE COURT: A l l r i g h t . Well let him f i n i s h t h e

Go ahead .

MR. COUGHLIN: Yes, sir.

MR. COUGHLIN:

Q I f someone was t r y i n g to s t e a l your dog o r your

would t h a t c o l o r your view as to whether o r no t a

t h a t t he y a s s e r t e d was t h e i r s was in f a c t t h e i r s -

MR. YOUNG: O b j e c t i o n .

THE COURT: Sus t a ined . Go on.

MR. COUGHLIN: Okay.

Can I p l a y t h e nex t 9-1 -1 c a l l , s i r ?

THE COURT: I d o n ' t know what it s abou t .

MR. YOUNG: This i s t h e one t h a t Mr. Coughl in

have o b j e c t e d to a s he a r s a y .

MR. COUGHLIN: This i s no t t h a t one. I b e l i e v e

Mr. Goble ' s second 9-1 -1 c a l l . I b e l i e v e t h i s



THE COURT: Go ahead and start it -


THE CLERK: What e x h i b i t i s it?

MR COUGHLIN: These f i l e s a r eall

found on

No 1 .

THE CLERK: ( I n d i s c e r n i b l e )

THE COURT: You can s t e p down f o r a whi l e , if

want b ecau se h e s t a k i n g so l ong .

MR COUGHLIN: I o b j e c t to t h a t , Your Honor .

THE COURT: I d o n t c a r e what you o b j e c t t o .

unpr epa r ed and no t r eady to go and I m go ing to

you abou t 30 seco n d s . If you a r e no t r eady to go

e l l move on.

MR COUGHLIN:

Q Mr. L ic h ty , d i d you wi tness anybody t h a t n i g h t

h e a r abou t h o l d i n g p i c k i n g t h e iPhone up and ho ld ing

a l o f t and o f f e r i n g it up?

MR YOUNG: O b j e c t i o n , h e a r s a y . I d o n t know

many t i mes I have t o o b j e c t . He cannot ask what

L i c h t y hea r d somebody e l s e say . How many t i mes do

to o b j e c t ?

THE COURT: Unless he he a rd t h e pe r son ho l d it

MR YOUNG: Your Honor that s h e a r s a y .

I



THE COURT: No.

MR COUGHLIN: Your Honor if I cou l d j u s t .


THE COURT: It s no t h e a r s a y if he asks , Does

own t h i s phone .

MR YOUNG: T h a t s t h e ve ry c l e a r d e f i n i t io n o f

THE COURT: No I d o n t t h i n k s o . It s not

t h e t r u t h o f whether o r not someone owns t h e

I s t h a t your q u e s t i o n , s i r ?

MR COUGHLIN: I t h i n k so , ye s , Your Honor .

THE WITNESS: What was t h e q u e s t i o n ?

THE COURT: Did you h e a r anyone t h a t n i g h t ho l d

t h e phone and say , Does anyone h e r e own t h i s phone?

THE WITNESS: No.

MR COUGHLIN:

Q Did you he a r anyone say t h a t t h e y would th row

phone in t h e r i v e r if someone d i d n t c l a im it?


THE COURT: You can answer .

THE WITNESS: I d o n t know.

MR COUGHLIN:

Q You d o n t know if you heard?

A I d o n t r e c a l l it But it cou l d be p o s s i b l e , I



know.

Q Okay. And that s as to whether you hea r d

be ing s a i d . Did you h e a r a n y t h i n g abou t t h a t l a t e r

n i g h t ?

THE COURT: That o b j e c t i o n i s s u s t a i n e d .


MR COUGHLIN:

Q Was t h e r e a ny th ing you w i t n e s s e d t o i n d i c a t e

t h e s u s p e c t r e c e i v e d t h e phone from somebody e l s e ?


MR COUGHLIN: I f he p e r c e i v e d

THE COURT: Okay. Did you see someone e l s e g i ve

phone to t h i s -

MR YOUNG: Asked and answered . He a l r e a d y s a i d

d i d n ' t see Mr. Coughl in end up wi t h t h e phone .

THE COURT: A l l r i g h t . O b j e c t i o n i s sus t a ine d .

Go ahead .


I would l i k e to p l a y Mr. L i c h t y t h a t second

c a l l .

THE COURT: Go ahead . S t a r t it, sir.

MR COUGHLIN: Sor ry . I ' m s o r r y . Here we go.

i s a c t u a l l y t h e v ide o .

Can I p l a y t h e v id eo ?

MR YOUNG: Obje c t ion , h e a r s a y . This i s Mr -



I b e l i e v e to be Mr. Cough l in s pe a k ing .

MR. COUGHLIN: It s a l o t o f pe op le speak i ng and

. L i c h t y i s v i s i b l e and a u d i b l e on t h e v ideo .

MR. YOUNG: And I d o n t know what t h e r e l evance

f w h a t s abou t t o be p la ye d .

THE COURT: Well , l e t me h e a r it and t he n I ll

MR. COUGHLIN: May I show t h e v ide o as wel l ,

THE COURT: You can b r i n g it up h e r e .


THE COURT: But y o u l l have to show it so t h a t

w i t n e s s can see it as w e l l .

MR. COUGHLIN: Yes.

THE COURT: Unless you pu t it ove r h e r e .

Tape p layed . )

MR. YOUNG: Your Honor , I o b j e c t .

THE COURT: I d o n t t h i n k it s c o n s i s t e n t wi t h

THE WITNESS: ( Inaud ib le .

THE COURT: Okay. Go ahead . I ll admi t it.

MR. COUGHLIN: Okay. Then t h e r e i s ano the r

h e r e . I b e l i e v e t h i s i s a c t u a l l y -

MR YOUNG: That l a s t v ide o , any q u e s t i o n s as

as a u t h e n t i c a t i o n o r a ny th ing , what you seen on t h e



--- -

v i d e o .

THE COURT: Wel l , I m g o in g to admi t it.

it s s e l f - a u t h e n t i c a t i n g . I can see t h e p a r t y in

I j u s t want to move t h i s on.

MR. COUGHLIN: Yes if I may do t h e same wi t h a

o f o t h e r v i d e o s qu ick ly he r e?

THE COURT: No you c a n t do t h e same wi t h a

o f o t h e r s . Y o u l l have to have a q u e s t i o n abou t

I d o n t know what t h e r e l e v a n c e -- even t h a t one i s

MR. YOUNG: It i s i r r e l e v a n t .

THE COURT: I m go ing to s u s t a i n t h e o b j e c t i o n

t h e o t h e r one . Go ahead . I m o v e r r u l i n g myse l f .

MR. COUGHLIN: This i s t h e v i deo o f t h e a r r e s t .

THE COURT: Video by who?

MR. COUGHLIN: Wel l , it was a v i deo t a ke n by a

in my pocke t immed ia te ly t h e moments b e f o r e t h e

a r r i v e d and t h e n t h r ough t h e p o i n t where he I

-

THE COURT: Have you shown it t o him.

( I n d i s c e r n i b l e c r o s s t a l k whi l e t a p e i s

MR. YOUNG: ( I nd i s c e r n ib l e ) Mr. L i c h t y c a n t

to t h i s .

THE COURT: Yeah. Okay. You can t e s t i f y it -



down.

MR COUGHLIN: T h a t s my fifth amendment

THE COURT: No t h e n you d o n t have to pu t it in

MR COUGHLIN: I know b u t you p r e v i o u s l y s a i d

anybody was t h e r e cou l d a u t h e n t i c a t e it

THE COURT: No I s a i d if t h e y have p e r s o n a l

MR COUGHLIN: H e s in t h e v i deo

THE COURT: A l l r i g h t . Then show him t h e v ide o .

MR COUGHLIN: May I approach?

THE COURT: Yes

THE CLERK: The first v i deo you t o o k

THE COURT: The one he j u s t d i d .

THE CLERK: Not o f f e r i n g ?

THE COURT: I m deny ing t h e ad m is s io n o f t h a t .

There a r e some v i deos on t h i s and I d o n t know

you would i d e n t i f y them.

MR COUGHLIN: Your Honor t h a t l a s t v id eo

h i s t e s t i m o n y . H e s shown in t h e v id eo r e a c h i n g

my pocke t and l ung i ng and h e s a l s o h e a r d and seen

h e s a minor .

MR YOUNG: ( I n d i s c e r n i b l e ) , I d i d n t see t h a t .



THE COURT: N e i t h e r d i d I .

MR. COUGHLIN: Well , might n e c e s s i t a t e hav ing a

view o f it b u t it s t h e r e . I mean

THE COURT: ( I n d i s c e r n i b l e ) .

MR. COUGHLIN: I had a c t u a l l y prov ide d Mr.

still f rames

THE COURT: Well , sir, j u s t to e x p e d i t e t h i s ,

admi t it bu t go ahead . T h e r e s two t h a t a r e

There i s t h e 9-1 -1 c a l l and t h e v id eo o f t h e

itself. Go ahead .


(Tape p l a y i n g . )

( I n d i s c e r n i b l e c r o s s t a l k whi l e t a p e i s

)

MR. YOUNG: Your Honor, can you pause i t ?

MR. COUGHLIN: Shou ld I pause it?

THE COURT: Yes, pause it.

MR. YOUNG: Your Honor, my o b j e c t i o n a t t h i s

i s we had a v e ry s p e c i f i c mot ion to s u p p r e s s h e a r i n g

which you made r u l i n g s , one o f which t h e phone

come in bu t some r u l i n g s t h a t you say a s f a r as

s e a r c h and some s t a t e m e n t s made were i n a d m i s s i b l e .

Mr. Coughl in now wants to p l a y i s t h a t ve r y e p i s ode .

long as Mr. Cough l in knows what h e s do ing , I j u s t want

b r i n g up t h e C o u r t s a t t e n t i o n t h a t t h i s i s , su r r ounds



ve r y mot ion to s uppre s s t h a t you in p a r t g r a n t e d .


MR. YOUNG: So l ong as he knows what h e s doing .

THE COURT: ( I n d i s c e r n i b l e .

MR COUGHLIN: Your Honor , t h e r e i s no buzz i ng ,

o v i b r a t i n g on t h i s .

THE COURT: Okay. Go ahead .

MR. COUGHLIN: You t ook out t h e f e e l i n g o f

and when you t a k e out t h e h e a r i n g , t h e

MR YOUNG: Your Honor , now h e s t e s t i f y i n g and

it s a rgume n ta t ive .


THE COURT: You need to p l a y it. Go ahead .


MR YOUNG: I s he moving to admit t h i s as we l l ?


THE COURT: Go ahead and p l a y it.

Tape p la y ing . )

THE COURT: How is t h e r e s t o f t h i s r e l e v a n t

( I n d i s c e r n i b l e . )

THE COURT: W hat s t he r e s t o f t h i s ?

MR COUGHLIN: He t r i e d t o he lp me wi t h my dog

sir, if I may -



MR YOUNG: Befo re we go on i s Mr. Coughl in

to admi t t h a t ?

THE COURT: He s a i d he was.

MR COUGHLIN: Yes.

MR YOUNG:So long as t h e r e c o r d i s c l e a r

Cough l in ( i n d i s c e r n i b l e ) I have no o b j e c t i o n to t h a t .

THE COURT: It s a d m i t t e d . Now h e r e s t h e

i s all E x h i b i t 1 b u t on l y p a r t s o f

1 a r e a dmi t t e d .

THE CLERK: ( Ina ud ib l e ) t r y i n g to be s p e c i f i c as

which one . I got t h e first 9-1 -1 c a l l and t h e first

o f t h e i n c i d e n t . So now t h i s i s -

THE COURT: So E x h i b i t 1 , first 9-1 -1 c a l l and

t h e v i deo o f t h e a r r e s t

MR COUGHLIN: And sir, if I may Your Honor

m s o r r y , I m a little u n c l e a r , bu t t h e first v id eo p r i o r

t h e p o l i c e a r r i v i n g , t h a t does show Mr. L i c h t y -


THE COURT: What?

MR YOUNG: What h e s s a y ing now i s argument .

e still have t h e wi tne s s on t h e s t a n d .

THE COURT: Yes.

MR COUGHLIN: Mr. Z a ra t e testified as to -

MR YOUNG: Argumen ta t ive .

MR COUGHLIN: j ok ing r e a c h i n g



THE COURT: Okay. S i r , t h a t o b j e c t i o n was

on t h a t v ide o . I v e gone back and f o r t h on it

I m s u s t a i n i n g t h e o b j e c t i o n on t h a t v ide o . I d o n t

if he r eached in your pocke t or no t , f r a n k l y . I

know t h a t it s r e l e v a n t in any way.

MR COUGHLIN: ( I nd i s c e r n ib l e ) f e e l f e a r f u l

r -

THE COURT: Wel l if you had someone e l s e s c e l l

I guess you shou l d f e e l f e a r f u l . Al l r i g h t .

MR YOUNG: Your Honor we have wi tne s s on t h e

Could we g e t back to q u e s t i o n and answer p le a se .

THE COURT: S i t down.

MR YOUNG: I no t e it i s f i v e m in u te s to 12 and

e a r l i e r s a i d you would g ive Mr. Cough l in u n t i l noon

t h i s w i t n e s s .

MR COUGHLIN: If you knew it was t h a t pe r son

if t he y were t r y i n g to r each i n t o your pocke t might

to make you t h i n k -


THE COURT: I d o n t c a r e what you t h o u g h t .

you t h i s a whole bunch o f t im e s . W e l l he a r from you

r your argument as to your de fe ns e . A l l r i g h t .




THE COURT: I d o n t c a r e what he t hough t , pu t it

way.

MR. COUGHLIN: Okay. But I b e l i e v e .


MR. COUGHLIN: It goes to h i s c r e d i b i l i t y which

me i s n i l which c o n s i d e r i n g a l o t o f t h i n g s he s a i d -

THE COURT: C r e d i b i l i t y -

MR. COUGHLIN: ( I n d i s c e r n i b l e .

THE COURT: You c a l l e d him as a w i t n e s s . So you

impeaching your own w i t n e s s .

MR. COUGHLIN: I m impeaching t h e whole group

t h e l i e s t h e y t o l d t h a t wrecked my life.

THE COURT: You a r e impeaching t h i s w i t n e s s i s

y o u r e do ing , t h e w i t n e s s you c a l l e d .

MR. COUGHLIN: Righ t . And t h e y a r e c l o s e f r i e n d

a group .

THE COURT: Yeah okay . Go ahead , sir.

MR. COUGHLIN: Yes sir.

MR. COUGHLIN:

Q This v i deo , sir c o n t a i n s Mr. L i c h t y making

h i s accoun t o f t h e e v e n t s t h a t n i g h t s p e c i f i c a l l y

MR. YOUNG: I s t h i s a q u e s t i o n ?

MR. COUGHLIN: No.

MR. YOUNG: Then I ask t h a t he ask a q u e s t i o n .



THE COURT: Wai t , wai t . H e s i d e n t i f y i n g t h e

and it may save some t ime . Was t h i s t a p e d

MR COUGHLIN: Yes.

THE COURT: Okay. It s de n ie d .

MR COUGHLIN: Can I -

THE COURT: No.

R COUGHLIN: i n d i c a t e why I t h i n k it s

THE COURT: No. I m deny ing it. Al l r i g h t .

MR COUGHLIN: It was i r r e l e v a n t to t h e

MR YOUNG: I m o b j e c t i n g to r e l e v a n c e b ecau se

was a f t e r t h e f a c t .

R COUGHLIN: But it goes to show t h a t he l i e s

abou t j u s t abou t e v e r y t h i n g .

THE COURT: What does he a l l e g e d l y lie about ,

MR COUGHLIN: Whether he saw whe the r he saw

phone b e i n g grabbed , who Ni co l e Watson and Lucy

names a r e . J u s t abou t e v e r y s t a t e m e n t he makes

c o n t r a d i c t e d by s t a t e m e n t s -

THE COURT: Okay. I m go ing t o deny it a ga in .

MR COUGHLIN: C e r t a i n l y .

THE COURT: You had t h e o p p o r t u n i t y to f u r n i s h



to t h e p r o s e c u t i o n as wel l .

MR COUGHLIN: I d i d -

THE COURT: E a r l i e r t o d ay you you.

MR COUGHLIN: H e s had them f o r a ye a r , sir.


MR COUGHLIN: H e s had them f o r a y e a r .

THE COURT: So. I asked you e a r l i e r t o d ay to go

t h e s e w i th him to c o n f r o n t t h i s w i t n e s s .

MR COUGHLIN: Wel l , t h e r e s more t h a n t h e

o f t im e you gave us wor th o f v i d e o .

THE COURT: Go on to t h e nex t t h i n g because

e l l be f i n i s h e d i n j u s t a coup le o f minu tes here .

MR COUGHLIN: Should I p l a y it o r ask him a

THE COURT: I want you to ask a q u e s t i o n .

MR COUGHLIN: Okay.

MR COUGHLIN:

Q Upon v iewing t h a t v i deo , d i d you he a r y o u r s e l f

any -

I t h i n k you might have r u l e d t h i s a d m i s s i b l e so

d o n t know if I can ask t h e q u e s t i o n no t t h e a r r e s t

bu t t h e first one where he s a i d I m under age and

MR YOUNG: Asked and answered .

THE COURT: I v e a l r e a d y r u l e d on t h a t t h r e e



MR COUGHLIN: Okay. You r u l e d on t he video no t

a d m i s s i b l e -

THE COURT: I r u l e d t h a t he a d m i t t e d t h a t he was

7 when he was a c t u a l l y 18.

MR COUGHLIN: What I 'm g e t t i n g a t , sir, i s t h e

to which t hey a r e gaming t he 9-1-1 sys tem and t h e y

what t h e y need to say to g e t t he r e sponse t h e y want

t hey got which was an a r r e s t t h a t wrecked my life by

-

THE COURT: They got an a r r e s t because you

to r e t u r n a c e l l phone t h a t a l l e g e d l y was in your

T h a t ' s why you got a r r e s t e d , sir. It was c l e a r

t h a t t ape , ve r y c l e a r .

MR COUGHLIN: It was c l e a r whose phone it was?

THE COURT: No it was c l e a r on t h e t a p e t h a t

o f f i c e r gave you t h e o p p o r t u n i t y to s u r r e n d e r t h e c e l l

MR COUGHLIN: When he s a i d pr obab l y ?

THE COURT: Okay. I 'm no t go ing to argue wi th

Go ahead .

MR COUGHLIN: Okay. But -

THE COURT: I ' v e a l r e a d y r u l e d on t h a t s p e c i f i c

Do you have a n o t h e r ques t i on?

MR COUGHLIN: Okay. I j u s t -- to me it s not



-

THE COURT: I d o n t c a r e to you. You go ahead

ask a q u e s t i o n .


THE COURT: You a r e not g o in g t o a rg u e wi t h me

MR COUGHLIN: I m so r r y , sir. I d o n t mean to

wi t h you.

THE COURT: You a r e .

MR COUGHLIN: Wel l , I m s o r r y , I d o n t

t h a t it comes a c r o s s t h a t way and I ll t a k e

o f t h a t and no t do t h a t anymore .

THE COURT: Go ahead , sir.

A l l r i g h t . W e r e done wi t h t h i s w i t n e s s u n l e s s

S t a t e wants to c r os s - exami ne .

MR YOUNG: Your Honor I have no q u e s t i o n s .

THE COURT: A l l r i g h t . Y o u r e f r e e t o go sir.

MR YOUN : For t h e r e c o r d it s 12 :02 p.m.

THE COURT: I u n d e r s t a n d . I was g i v i n g him t h e

to ask t h e q u e s t i o n and he d i d n t . So now

e l l move on and w e l l c o n t i n u e t h i s to t h e t h i s

I would l i k e you to i d e n t i f y which w i t n e s s it

he re t h a t you i n t e n d t o c a l l because I m no t go ing to

p e o p l e come back .

Chuck. W e r e go ing to i d e n t i f y who s here .



w i l l you ask t h e w i t n e s s to come.

THE COURT: Oh no h e s gone . H e s done.

MR YOUNG: That was my q u e s t i o n , Mr. L ic h ty , i s

e f r e e to go?

THE COURT: Yes.


THE COURT: Mr. L ic h ty i s f r e e to go. So go.

As to t h e o t h e r w i t n e s s e s , I j u s t need you to

y o u r s e l v e s by name. Stand up and say your name.

THE WITNESS: Col ton Temple ton .

THE COURT: Okay. Are you go ing to c a l l

Temple ton?

MR COUGHLIN: Yes.

THE COURT: Okay. S i t down. Y o u l l need to

back a t 1 :30 . E i t h e r one o f you.

MR ZARATE: I m N a t h a n i e l Z a r a t e .

THE COURT: Okay. Did you

MR COUGHLIN: Yes sir


MR GOBLE: Cory Goble .

MR COUGHLIN: Yes I do.

THE COURT: A l l r i g h t . They w i l l be he r e a t

I m go ing to g ive you have a h a l f - h o u r w i th each o f

When a h a l f - h o u r i s up t h e S t a t e w i l l be a b l e to

no more t h a n a hour and w e l l be done . That



t a k e us a t most t h r e e hours .

MR YOUNG: Your Honor f o r t h e r eco rd ,

Goble and Mr. Z a ra t e p r e v i o u s l y testified in t h e

case in c h i e f . So I u n d e r s t a n d Mr. Coughl in

him back . But f o r t h e C o u r t s i n fo rma t ion ,

have a l r e a d y t e s t i f i e d -

THE COURT: I unde r s t a nd . Y o u l l be a b l e to

t o a ny th ing t h a t was a l r e a d y testified to

MR YOUNG: Make s u r e we d o n t dr ag t h i s ou t .

THE COURT: Yes sir, you a r e r a i s i n g your hand.

UNKNOWN MAN I j u s t neve r a c t u a l l y r e c e i v e d a

to be he r e t oday . I j u s t t h o u g h t it would be a

i d e a . E v e r y t h i n g on t h e c o u r t was happen ing today

I r e c e i v e d a phone c a l l from Mr. Cough l in t r y i n g to

me -

MR COUGHLIN: Your Honor if h e s go ing to

cou l d we have him sworn?

THE COURT: No h e s no t t e s t i f y i n g , sir.

MR COUGHLIN: I u n d e r s t a n d .

UNKNOWN MAN He c a l l e d on t h e phone t r y i n g to

me a subpoena o v e r t h e phone .

THE COURT: When you come back you can move to

it if t h e r e was no subpoena and I ll r u l e on t h a t a t

t ime .



THE WITNESS: Do I need to be h e r e f o r t h e r e s t

f t h e a f t e r n o o n .

THE COURT: Yes you need to be h e r e . I m

you to be he r e , no t by subpoena , I m j u s t

you to be h e re a t 1 :30 . You can t a l k to

Young if t h e r e i s some b a s i s t o quash t h e subpoena

was a l l e g e d l y se rv e d on you. Let me even see if

i s a subpoena . Do you have one f o r Mr. Goble?

MR COUGHLIN: It was in t h e p a c k e t t h a t I

-- t h a t I gave to t h e Cour t , Your Honor on

And I b e l i e v e t he c e r t i f i e d s l i p pur suan t to

THE COURT: I have Ni c o l e Watson Lucy Byington ,

Temple ton A u s t in L i c h ty who has a l r e a d y t e s t i f i e d .

Dawson. T h a t s it. And Nate Z a r a t e .

MR YOUNG: H e s h e re ( I n d i s c e r n i b l e .

THE COURT: I m s o r r y .

MR . YOUNG: H e s a l r e a d y h e r e . He s a i d he ll

So a r e we good f o r l unch?

THE COURT: Yeah go ahead .

MR. COUGHLIN: He s a i d .

UNKNOWN MAN: May be excused as wel l , Your

u n t i l 1 :30?

THE COURT: A b s o l u t e l y . Everyone i s excused .

You need to l e ave all o f t h e e x h i b i t s wi th t he



sir

Noon r e c e s s was t aken .



RENO NEVADA NOVEMBER 19, 2012, 1 :45 P.M.

- - 0 0 0 -

THE COURT: Okay. Mr. Coughl in , would you c a l l

nex t w i t n e s s , s i r ?

MR COUGHLIN: Yes, sir Your Honor . J u s t no te

Mr. Goble .

UNKNOWN MAN: He j u s t went to t h e r e s t r o o m r e a l

MR COUGHLIN: Okay. If I may i nvoke t h e r u l e

f e x c l u s i o n .

THE COURT: You w i l l . T e l l us t h e wi tnes s .

MR COUGHLIN: Mr. Temple ton , sir.

THE COURT: A l l r i g h t . Mr. Temple ton , if you

come ou t and t h e o t h e r two w a i t o u t s i d e . As I

t h i s morning, y o u ' l l be l i m i t e d t o one h a l f - h o u r

w i t n e s s .

D i d you s a y Mr. Temp1e ton?

MR COUGHLIN: Yes.

THE COURT: A l l r i g h t . I t h i n k t h e y

you.

Come up h e re and be sworn r i g h t up he re . Rai se

r i g h t hand.

(The w i tn e ss was sworn . )

THE COURT: P l e a s e be s e a t e d and t h e n w i l l you



your first and l a s t name and t h en proceed ,

Cough l in .

MR . COUGHLIN: Yes, sir

THE WITNESS: C-O-L-T-O-N, T-E-M-P-L-E-T-O-N.

MR. YOUNG: Before we start t h i s , i s be i ng

THE COURT: I 'm s o r ry?

MR . YOUNG: I j u s t want to make su r e t h a t t h e

i s r e co rd i ng t h i s .

THE COURT: Yes.

MR. YOUNG: Per r equ i r emen t .

THE COURT: Go ahead , sir

MR. COUGHLIN: Thank you, Your Honor .

COLTON TEMPLETON,

c a l l e d as a wi tne s s , hav ing been first du ly sworn, was

examined and testified as fo l lows :

DIRECT EXAMINATION

MR. COUGHLIN:

Q Good a f t e r noon , Mr. Temple ton . Thanks f o r be i ng

t oday .

S i r , have you seen any v i deo s o f any i n t e r v i ews

maybe t h e a r r e s t i n g ques t i one r ?

A Any v ideos?



Q Yeah, l i k e on YouTube o r a n y t h i n g l i k e t h a t ?

A No.

Q Okay. Do you have some -- what was your

o f what happened on t h a t day?

I d i d not see anybody t a k e t h e phone . But once

phone had been t a ke n , I remember go ing ove r t h e r e and

had it in your p o s s e s s i o n , it was in your left poc ke t .

we were c a l l i n g it and we cou l d see t he phone l i g h t i n g

t h r ough your pa n t pocke t and we j u s t ask ed you to g ive

t back and you s a i d no. So t he n we c a l l e d t he cops

t h a t ( I n d i s c e r n i b l e ) .

Q Okay. Can we br eak t h a t down a b i t ? T h a t ' s a

ove rv iew and I a p p r e c i a t e t h a t . But cou l d we maybe

wi t h -

And, Your Honor, I t h i n k it might be h e l p f u l to

and h o p e f u l l y to t h e Cour t and if Mr. Young d o e s n ' t

any o b j e c t i o n t o it I would l i k e maybe, we have some

c o l o r -

THE COURT: Have them marked. I d o n ' t know why

d i d n ' t do it e a r l i e r .

TH CLERK: He t r i e d bu t I had s t u f f I was

TH COURT: Okay.

MR YOUNG: He j u s t showed me t h a t on t h e br eak

I have no o b j e c t i o n s to it.




(Exh ib i t s S, 6, 7, and 8 were marked

f o r i d e n t i f i c a t i o n p u r p o s e s . )

MR YOUNG: I have no o b j e c t i o n to t h e s e .


MR COUGHLIN: I f I may approach , Your Honor .

(Discuss ion was h e l d a t t h e bench . )

THE COURT: A l l r i g h t . And t h e y a r e a dmi t t e d as

based on t h e s t i p u l a t i o n o f t h e district a t t o r ne y .

MR COUGHLIN: Your Honor , if I may approach

qu ick ly .

THE COURT: Yes, go ahead .

MR COUGHLIN: And let you see j u s t g e n e r a l l y

I 'm r e f e r r i n g t o . This i s t h a t

THE COURT: I know where it is. Go ahead .

THE WITNESS: Okay.

MR COUGHLIN:

Q Mr. Temple ton , cou l d you t h e r ea son I go t

p i c t u r e s ou t , I was hop ing to maybe if you cou l d

t h i s and p o i n t to some s t u f f -

THE COURT: I n d i c a t e which e x h i b i t it i s .

MR COUGHLIN: T h a t ' s E x h i b i t 6, Your Honor .

t h i s is a wide view sho t t h a t c a p t u r e s some of t he

o f f i c e , t h e s k a t e p l a z a and t h e C en t e r S t r e e t br idge .




MR COUGHLIN: T h i s , in f a c t , might be t h e b e s t

to work w i t h in t h a t it has all t h o s e k in d o f

If you co u ld h o l d t h a t . If you co u ld t r y t o

it so most ly , Your Honor t h e Cour t can s e e it bu t

i n a w h i l e h e l p me and Mr. Young o u t .

Can you d em o n s t r a t e where you were t o start

anybody knew a n y t h i n g abou t a phone o r a n y t h i n g

t h a t ?

THE WITNESS: I was s k a t i n g w i t h my f r i e n d s .

Y MR COUGHLIN:

Q You were s t a n d i n g r i g h t abou t smack-dab i n t h e

p l a z a ?

A I was s k a t i n g eve rywhere a round t h e r e .

Q So you were s k a t i n g , you w e r e n ' t k in d o f engaged

A I was s k a t i n g eve rywhere a r o u n d t h e r e .

Q You were s k a t i n g . You w e r e n ' t k in d o f engaged

A I w a s n ' t l i k e sitting o r a n y t h i n g .

Q You w e r e n ' t s i t t i n g ?

A Huh-uh.

Q You were maybe s t a n d i n g t a l k i n g w i th somebody?

A I d o n ' t remember t h a t .

Q When was t h e first p o i n t t h a t you remember a t

someth ing happened t h a t , okay , a c t i o n



I

A Some k i d came ove r and ask ed us if one o f us had

c e l l phone , t h a t somebody j u s t walked o f f wi t h it and

know if it was o u r s and I s a i d no and somebody e l s e

and t r a c k e d them down and it ended up b e i n g Cory

phone and he -

Q Okay. Hang on. I 'm s o r r y . I know I asked an

q u e s t i o n bu t if I may I would k i nd o f p r e s s

and g e t a little more t a r g e t .

So if we s t o p a t some k i d

THE COURT: You can pu t t h e pho to down. You

need to ho l d it up.

MR COUGHLIN: Yeah.

MR COUGHLIN:

Q So t h e first t h i n g , if y o u ' r e a d i r e c t o r w r i t i n g

s t o r y , t h e first t h i n g t h a t k i nd o f happened t h a t was

t h a t was no tewor thy was a k i d came up and made

communica t ion to you; i s t h a t c o r r e c t , s i r ?

A Yes.

Q Okay. Can you d e s c r i b e t h a t k i d?

A I canno t .

Q I s he 10 y e a r s o l d o r 2 2 - i s h ?

A Guess ing t e e n a g e r , 17, 18 maybe.

Q Did he have l i k e gauged e a r s ?

A I t h i n k so .

Q Was he wear ing l i k e maybe a k i nd o f an



I

br and t ype T - s h i r t , some th ing l i k e t h a t ?

A I d o n t remember t h a t .

THE COURT: Mr. Coughl in , t h e y a r e a dmi t t e d so

t h e pho t os up here .

MR COUGHLIN: Oh yes ,sir.

THE COURT: As long as t h e y a r e a dmi t t e d .

MR COUGHLIN: And I ll j u s t qu ick ly no t e f o r

r eco rd , Your Honor if I can , E x h i b i t 5 i s from t h e

o f t h e CalNeva p a r k i n g garage , k i nd o f a b i r d s e y e

E x h i b i t 7 i s l ook i ng n o r t h e r l y on C en t e r S t r e e t

And E x h i b i t 8 i s more o f t h e first f l o o r o f t h e

ga r age l ook i ng t owards t h e o l d R i v e r s i d e , a good

o f t h e s k a t e p l a z a bu t no t t oo much o f C en t e r S t r e e t

MR COUGHLIN:

Okay So you s a i d t h e k id , you would e s t i m a t e

o l d?

A 17 18 somewhere in t h e r e .

Q Okay. And d id you say he d i d have t h e k ind of ,

t h a t looked l i k e t h e c o r k - t y p e fit i n t o t h e

THE COURT: He s a i d t he y were gauged . You

asked him.

MR COUGHLIN: Okay. So it was okay .



Y MR. COUGHLIN:

Q You s a i d he came up to you and asked you if

A There was a group o f us and t h e n he came up and

e asked if it was any o f o u r s and we d i d n t t h i n k it was.

t hen I t h i n k it was N ico le Watson s a i d t h a t C o r y s

had go t s t o l e n . So we came ove r .

Okay. So t h i s gent leman wi t h t h e gauged e a r s ,

e w a s n t a man who found t h e phone a s k i n g p eo p le? He was

man who p u r p o r t e d to have seen t h e phone be s t o l e n o r -

A I b e l i e v e so , yes .

Q Can you tell us , k ind o f g i v e us your b e s t

o f s p e c i f i c a l l y what he s a i d ?

MR. YOUNG: Your Honor o b j e c t i o n , one , he -

THE COURT: S u s t a i n e d . , go on.

MR . COUGHLIN: Okay. Yes sir, Your Honor.

MR. COUGHLIN: And j u s t q u i c k l y , it s o f f e r e d to

why Mr. Temple ton d i d what he d i d nex t ?

THE COURT: He a l r e a d y testified what he d id .

e s a i d someone came o v e r and s a i d t h e phone was s t o l e n

it w a s n t o b j e c t e d to b e f o r e b u t it i s o b j e c t e d to

MR. COUGHLIN : Okay yes , sir.

THE COURT: So he went o v e r t h e r e .

MR. COUGHLIN: Yes.



THE COURT: We know why you went o v e r t h e r e .

MR COUGHLIN: Okay. And Your Honor may I

i n t o some t e s t i m o n y as t o -

THE COURT: You can . You go t -

MR COUGHLIN: Okay.

THE COURT: abou t 16 m in u te s left.

Y MR COUGHLIN:

Q Was t h e phone , was t h e r e any i n d i c a t i o n by

t h a t t h e phone somebody r an up and grabbed it o f f

l edge o r d i d someth ing d i f f e r e n t happen o r -

MR YOUNG: Again I m go ing to o b j e c t if h e s

f o r s p e c i f i c s . Now Mr. Cough l in i s a s k ing fo r

t r u t h o f t h e m a t t e r a s s e r t e d . I d i d no t o b j e c t

b ecau se it was s imp ly , What d i d you know and why

you do t h a t . It was ve r y b r i e f and we go t t h a t p o i n t .

f o r Mr. Coughl in to g i ve me s p e c i f i c s , what was

t o l d , a ga in , it s hear say .

THE COURT: A l l r i g h t . Unless t h i s wi tne s s saw

phone b e i n g t a k e n I m go ing t o s u s t a i n t h e o b j e c t i o n .

MR COUGHLIN: Okay. And I t h i n k t h e q u e s t i o n

j u s t a s k ing fo r h i s p e r c i p i e n t w h a tev e r he saw o r

MR YOUNG: He testified t h a t he h a d n t seen t h e

b e i n g t aken .

MR COUGHLIN: Okay. So I asked abou t what



might have t o l d him

THE COURT: T h a t s hear say .

MR COUGHLIN: And that s h e a r s a y . Okay. P o i n t

t aken .

MR COUGHLIN:

Q So t h e man wi th t h e gauged e a r s came up to you

-- I remember Mr. Young s t a t i n g t h i s , wi t hou t

i n t o t oo many s p e c i f i c s and that s pr obab l y a wise

t a c t i c t h a t he did , so I ll -- t h e f a c t t h a t he

go i n t o t oo many s p e c i f i c s and d i d n t g e n e r a t e any

o b j e c t i o n , I ll ask you what d i d you do in

to whatever it i s he t o l d you?

A I s k a t e d over t h e r e to where you were a t on t h i s

Q Okay. So where -

THE COURT: Wait a minute . You say on t h i s

which b r i d g e i s t h a t ?

THE WITNESS: The C en t e r S t r e e t .

THE COURT: Okay.

THE WITNESS: It was l i k e r i g h t in t h e middle o f

b r i d g e .

THE COURT: I m showing you w h a t s marked as

7 I s t h a t a b e t t e r pho tog raph?

THE WITNESS: Yes.

THE COURT: And which p a r t o f t h e b r i d g e was he



s ide?

THE WITNESS: We were on t h i s s i d e pr obab l y

in t h e midd le .

THE COURT: When you say t h i s s i d e , that s t h e

s i d e ?

THE WITNESS: Yes.

THE COURT: The west s i d e o f C en t e r S t r e e t ?

THE WITNESS: Yes.

THE COURT: A l l r i g h t . Go ahead , Mr. Cough l in .

Y MR COUGHLIN:

Q Where was -- and t h i s might be c o n f u s i n g b u t I m

go ing to though r e f e r to m y se l f as t h e s u s p e c t .

A Okay.

Q On t h a t e x h i b i t , can you h o l d it up and show me

t h e Cour t where Mr. Cough l in was when you first

THE COURT: The s u s p e c t o r Mr. Coughl in?

MR COUGHLIN: Well , Mr. Cough l in o r t h e

I ll use . I m j u s t t r y i n g to avo i d s a y i n g me

Honor .


THE WITNESS: S or r y . So what d i d you want?

MR COUGHLIN:

Q Once t h i s gauged e a r man t o l d you wha teve r he

you and it r e s u l t e d in you f o c u s i n g your a t t e n t i o n on

s u s p e c t , where was it s u s p e c t a t t h a t p o i n t ?



A I b e l i e v e -

Q ( I n d i s c e r n i b l e . )

A He was a l r e a d y on t h e b r i d g e .

Q Okay So he was a l r e a d y on t he br idge?

A Yes

Q About where on t he b r i dge?

A C en t e r o f it on t he west s i d e .

Q Okay So not q u i t e where t h e b r i d g e s t a r t s

A A little b i t , in t h i s a r e a .

Q Where u l t i m a t e l y d i d t h e -- what happened nex t ?

saw t h e s u s p e c t c e n t e r l y on t h e b r i d g e , west s ide , and

happened?

A There was a l r e a d y a few pe op le around you and

it was my f r ie n d s phone so I s k a t e d over t h e r e to

what was go ing on and we asked you m u l t i p l e t imes to

t h e phone back and you i n s i s t e d you d i d no t have it.

Q Okay Let me j u s t s t o p you t h e r e . You say you

a l e r t e d by t h e man with t h e gauged e a r s who I

-- t h i s might not be a p p r o p r i a t e to say bu t

r Goble t e s t i f i e d t o t h a t be ing t h e k i d he d i d not

know Do you remember t h a t ?

THE COURT It s no t Mr Goble Ask him if he

He a l r e a d y s a i d he d i d n t know t h e k id .

MR COUGHLIN Okay

I



Y MR. COUGHLIN:

Q Mr. Goble testified I m s o r r y . So you a r e

gauged- ea r guy came up to you and you d o n t r e c a l l

was wi t h you i n t h e group?


Q Might have been Ni co l e Watson and Lucy Byington?

A I h o n e s t l y d o n t remember .

Q Okay. He came up to you s a i d someth ing . You

your a t t e n t i o n on t h e s u s p e c t who was f rom your

p o i n t a t t h e c e n t e r o f t h e s k a t e p a r k he was

on t h e C en t e r S t r e e t b r i d g e on t h e w e s t e r l y

And t h e n nex t you c o r r e c t me if I m wrong you

to i n d i c a t e it went from t h e r e . Was t h e s u s p e c t

a t t h a t p o i n t o r was t h e r e a l r e a d y peop l e a c c o s t i n g

A There were a l r e a d y peop l e ove r t h e r e .

Q Who okay. Were t h e y i n t e r a c t i n g wi t h t he

o r were t h e y j u s t -

A Yes.

Q Who were t h o s e peop l e t hen?

A I d o n t remember e x a c t l y who went o v e r t h e r e .

Q Were t h e y peop l e you knew?

A Yes.

Q You j u s t c a n t remember who e x a c t l y .



A Yeah. I d o n t remember which one it was.

Q Do you know whe the r o r no t it was Mr. Goble?

A I b e l i e v e it was.

Q Okay. But it s no t as though when t h e man wi t h

gauged e a r s came up to you and whoever you were wi th ,

Goble was r i g h t n ex t to you and you w i t n e s s e d

Goble he t o l d some th ing abou t a phone and immed ia t e ly

o f f o v e r t h e r e o r someth ing l i k e t h a t ?

A I d o n t remember b e i n g wi t h Mr. Goble when t h e

wi t h t h e gauged e a r s came up to us .

Q And he I guess I c a n t ge t i n t o s p e c i f ic s ?

he t o l d you

Your Honor if I cou l d j u s t ask f o r some

I m j u s t wonder ing -

THE COURT: What d i f f e r e n c e does it make if t h e

man t o l d him?

MR COUGHLIN: I m wonder ing why if he felt l i k e

t o l d t h e r i g h t pe r son in Goble and he seen Goble run

-- which I d o n t know if that s t h e c a s e -- why would

keep going and t e l l i n g o t h e r p e o p l e -- maybe that s a

t h i n g to do bu t -

THE WITNESS: Maybe he d i d n t know whose phone

was so he was go ing




Y MR. COUGHLIN:

Q Okay So you d o n t know whether t h e p eo p le

s u s p e c t were do ing so b ecau se t h e y were t o l d

y t h e same man you were t h a t t h e r e was some i s s u e ?

A Yes

Q They co u ld have -


MR. COUGHLIN: W hat s t h a t ?

THE WITNESS: R e s t a t e t h a t p l e a s e .

Y MR. COUGHLIN:

Q The p eo p le who went and a c c o s t e d th e s u s p e c t ,

you first t r a i n e d your eyes on him on t h e C en te r

b r i d g e ?

A Yes

Q Do you know why t h e y had t r a i n e d t h e i r a t t e n t i o n

him and went over and a c c o s t e d him?

A Because t he y were t o l d t h a t you had h i s c e l l

Q By who?

A The k i d w i th t h e gauged e a r s .

Q So you do know t h a t ?

A Yes

Q You p e r s o n a l l y wi tne s s e d him t e l l i n g somebody

you c a n t remember who t h e n s u b s e q u e n t l y went and

t h e s us pe c t ?



THE COURT: He neve r testified anyone a c c o s t e d

s u s p e c t .

Y MR COUGHLIN:

Q Well how would you pu t it? They were over

wi th t h e suspec t ?

A Yeah. I n t e r a c t i n g .

Q Okay. Can you d e s c r i b e t h a t i n t e r a c t i o n a t t h a t

i n t r o d u c t o r y p o i n t , was it d i d it look l i k e

dra ma t i c was about t o happen? Did it look

How many peop l e were t h e r e ? Was anybody wi th

s u s p e c t ? Things l i k e t h a t ?

A I d o n t know how many pe op le were over t h e r e bu t

d i d n t l i k e -

Q Was it 25 o r c l o s e r to two?

Clos e r to two

Q Was it t h r e e ?

Maybe. I doubt it.

Q Was it t h e man wi th t h e gauged e a r s , L ic h ty

A That cou l d p o s s i b l y be it bu t I h o n e s t l y do not

Q So t hey might have been t h r e e initial

who i n t e r a c t e d wi t h t he s u s p e c t as a

as a th reesome, group o f t h r e e ?

A Yes.



Q Might have been b u t you a r e n o t s u r e ?

A Yes.

Q Okay. How c o u l d t h e man w i t h t h e gauged e a r s be

t h e r e w h i l e h e s a lw ays t lling you s o m e t h i n g t h a t

you t o t r a i n your a t t e n t i o n on t h e s u s p e c t on t h e

A I d o n t know if he was o v e r t h e r e .

Q Okay.

A I d o n t remember s e e i n g him o v e r t h e r e a t t h e

b e g i n n i n g b e c a u s e I was t o o f a r away. I c o u l d n t see

Q Was Nathan Z a r a t e n e a r you?

A I d o n t remember if he was n e a r me a t t h e t i me .

know he was i n t h e pr emi se s .

Q You d o n t know if he was i n t h e group

you t hough?

A Yeah, I d o n t remember t h a t .

Q Okay. Do you know where Mr. Goble was a t t h a t

A No.

Q Do you have any r e c o l l e c t i o n o f some s o r t o f

who migh t have r e f e r r e d to a s t h e man w i t h t h e

p i c k i n g up a h a t and s a y i n g , Who s h a t is t h i s ?


THE WITNESS: No. ( I n d i s c e r n i b l e )





Q Okay. Did you u l t i m a t e l y maybe start f i l m i n g me

your iPhone?

I d i d . But t h a t phone i s broken and I d o n t

it anymore .

Q Okay. And you d i d n t t a k e it ou t anywhere?

A Yeah.

Q Okay So f rom t h e r e , you a r e still in t h e

o f t h e s k a t e pa rk , s k a t e p l a z a ?

A Yeah.

Q There i s a group i n t e r a c t i n g w i t h t h e s u s p e c t on

b r i d g e and t h e n s lo w ly -- so f a r y o u v e proved p r e t t y

and I would j u s t ask you to t r y to go s lo w er w i th

s p e c i f i c s and d e t a i l in c o n t e x t where t h i n g s a r e .

you s lowly walk me t h r ough t h e s c e n e s o f t h a t

let s say , movie what a c t u a l l y happened , pu t

t h a t way.

THE COURT: Mr. Cough l in , I m go ing to tell you

if he walks you t oo s lowly , y o u r e go ing to run ou t

So you may want to g e t to t h e p o i n t o f your

MR COUGHLIN: And I t h i n k t h i s is it, Your

b ecau se t h i s r i g h t where I t h i n k t h e a c t i o n s

Sounds l i k e he d o e s n t have any p e r c i p i e n t

p r i o r to t h a t p o i n t and e v e r y t h i n g I m t r y i n g

elicit from him has been r u l e d on as hear say . So



m -

THE COURT: Wel l let s g e t it to t h e n .

MR. COUGHLIN: Okay.

Y MR. COUGHLIN:

Q So nex t .

A So we were t o l d t h a t somebody had t a ke n a phone

we t hough t it was our f r i e n d C o r y s and we s k a t e d over

t h e west s i d e o f t h e C en t e r S t r e e t b r i d g e .

Q We meaning who?

A Okay. I t a k e t h a t back . I s k a t e d o v e r t h e r e

now t h a t I t h i n k about it, I d o n t remember

wi t h anybody e l s e .

Q Okay. But

A Over to you.

Q But t h e man w i th t h e gauged e a r s who t o l d you -

THE COURT: H e s a l r e a d y -- t h i s has been asked

answered -

MR. COUGHLIN: Okay. Yes sir, Your Honor .

THE COURT: m u l t i p l e t i m e s .

MR . COUGHLIN: Yes Your Honor .

MR. COUGHLIN:

Q Why d i d you t h i n k it was C o r y s ?

A Because we had a l r e a d y g o t t e n ove r t h e r e and

were c a l l i n g t h e phone and it was l i g h t i n g up in your

and he had



Q Hold on you s a i d we had a l r e a d y g o t t e n o v e r

bu t a t t h i s p o i n t you had no t i n d i c a t e d you had

f rom t h e c e n t e r o f t h e s k a t e p l a z a ?

THE COURT: He j u s t testified he s k a t e d o v e r

MR COUGHLIN: Okay. From my r e c o l l e c t i o n he

still i n th e c e n t e r o f t h e s k a t e p l a z a , he r e i t e r a t e d

t o l d him someth ing c a us ing to t r a i n h i s a t t e n t i o n

n t h e s u s p e c t . And a t t h a t p o i n t he s a i d we t hough t it

C o r y s -

THE COURT: He s a i d he s k a t e d ove r t h e r e . You

who s k a t e d w i th you and he s a i d it was a c t u a l l y j u s t

MR COUGHLIN:

Q But back up go back to t h e c e n t e r o f t h e s k a t e

why a t what p o i n t d i d you form t h e b e l i e f t h a t it

C o r y s ?

A Cory had pu t h i s c e l l phone down and it was

f rom t h e s po t t h a t it was and so he went over t h e r e

t he n we found ou t abou t it o r I found ou t about it and

went o v e r t h e r e t oo .

Q Okay. E a r l i e r you testified you d i d n t know

o r no t Cory was o v e r t h e r e b u t now it seems as

you a r e s a y i n g now you do know and Cory was over

i n t e r a c t i n g w i th t h e s u s p e c t ? m I a c c u r a t e l y -



Sounds r i g h t .

Q Okay. So y o u r e remember ing t h a t now?

little bit yes .

Q Okay. I m s o r r y if t h i s is o b v io u s , Your Honor ,

how d i d you know it was C o r y s o r become aware t h a t

felt it was h i s o r Cory was i n v o l v e d in some way?

They had t o l d us t h a t t h e phone was s t o l e n -

Q Who s t h ey ?

The k i d w i t h t h e gauged e a r s .

Q Okay.

And Cory had r e a l i z e d t h a t h i s phone was where

was a t t h e t ime t h a t it was t a k e n . So he assumed

it was h i s .

Q So earlier when you s a i d you d i d n t r e c a l l who

w i t h you i n t h a t group t h a t you were s t a n d i n g a round

r s k a t i n g wi t h , now it seems a p p a r e n t t h a t Cory Goble

l d n t n e c e s s a r i l y have to be t h e r e ?

Sure . I h o n e s t l y do n o t remember him s t a n d i n g

t o me.

Q Okay. Wel l , maybe it d o e s n t mean he had t o be

But somehow you became aware t h a t Cory felt if

was aware t h a t h i s phone was no l o n g e r where he had

it?

Uh-huh.

Q And t h a t would have been i n th e c e n t e r o f t h e



p l a z a ?

That he s e t h i s phone?

Q Yes.

I t h i n k he s e t it a l ong t h e edge on t h e

s e a t s o r whatever t h e y a r e .

Q Like on t op o f t h e l edge o r -

I t h i n k . I h o n e s t l y d o n t know where h i s phone

It was o v e r t h e r e somewhere . I j u s t d o n t know

if it was on t h e g r a s s , if it was on t h e l edge o r

Q Okay. And t he n to b r i n g it to where we were

a r e still i n t h e middle o f t h e s k a t e p l a z a and now

aware t h a t someth ing i s amis wi t h C o r y s phone .

p e r c e i v e Cory to be over on t h e b r i d g e w i t h some o t h e r

o r a l one w i th t h i s s u s p e c t ?

I t h i n k t h e r e was one o r two o t h e r peop l e bu t

be wrong.

Q Was one o f t h o s e peop l e t h e young man w i th t h e

e a r s ?

I do no t remember .

Q Okay. Could be bu t cou l d a l s o no t be?

Yes it s p o s s i b l e .

Q But if it was him he would have had to tell you

he t o l d you and t h e n go r i g h t ove r t h e r e t o -

Yeah.

I



Q Okay Was Aus t i n L i c h t y somewhere in t h i s ?

A He was somewhere I d o n t know where

Q You d o n t know if he was one o f t h e ones

Okay

So t h e n what? Did you n o t i c e some th ing

happen ing o v e r on t h e b r i d g e o r t h e s i t u a t i o n seeming

g e t more u r g e n t in some way?

A A little bit. I n o t i c e d t h a t eve rybody I had

w i t h was gone o v e r t h e r e and t h e n I went o v e r t h e r e .

Q Okay But a s f a r as you a r e p e r c i p as f a r as

e y e w i t n e s s i n g t h i n g s , t h e s u s p e c t f rom your v an tag e

s t a r t e d a t t h e same p o i n t on t h e b r i d g e where he was

a r r e s t e d l a t e r , g i v e o r t a k e , I d o n t know a

o f f e e t o r someth ing?

A Yes

Q So he d i d n t t r y t o l e a v e nobody was s t o p p i n g

f rom l e a v i n g ? What was he do ing?

A He was s t a n d i n g t h e r e w i t h h i s b i k e and h i s dog

would n o t g i v e u s t h e phone back .

Q Was he h o l d i n g h i s dog?

A I h o n e s t l y d o n t remember

Q Okay So back up to you a r e still a t t h e

o f t h e s k a t e p l a z a and you n o t i c e more p eo p le

I d i d n t h e a r you say t h e r e was more urgency



cau sed you t o go o v e r t h e r e , b u t more l i k e more

were o v e r t h e r e ?

A Yeah.

Q T h e r e f o r e you maybe was c u r i o u s as t o why a

was g a t h e r i n g and went o v e r t h e r e ?

A Yes.

Q Once you approached , were t h e r e any p o l i c e

t h e r e a t t h a t p o i n t ?

A No.

Q Then what d i d you n o t i c e upon ap p ro ach in g o r

o r n o t i c e o r s e e ?

A I j u s t h e a r d eve rybody a s k i n g you to g i v e u s t h e

back and them r e p e a t e d l y c a l l i n g it and s a y i n g -

Q Who c a l l e d ?

A I d o n t remember whose phone c a l l e d it. I t h i n k

migh t have been A u s t in s b u t I m n o t s u r e .

Q Was it A u s t i n c a l l i n g it w i t h h i s phone o r w i th

else s u s i n g h i s phone?


Q But you somehow remember somebody was c a l l i n g it

you j u s t d o n t -

A Yeah I d o n t know who was c a l l i n g it.

Q T h a t s a r e o c c u r r i n g t h i n g i n this c a s e .


MR COUGHLIN: I m s o r r y , Your Honor .





THE COURT: He d i d n t say he d i d n t remember

He s a i d he d i d n t remember s p e c i f i c a l l y what

was asked and answered .


YMR COUGHLIN:

Q Can you g i ve me a little more d e t a i l abou t what

do remember w i th r e s p e c t to t h a t asked and answered?

A I d o n t know.

Q You c a n t ?

A We were a s k i n g you to g ive us t h e phone back ,

l i g h t i n g up and that s abou t it.

Q How many t i mes -- d i d you keep c a l l i n g over and

s a y ing , Look. We see it l i g h t i n g up. It c o i n c i d e s

u s c a l l i n g . Give it up.

Was it l i k e t h a t o r was it you on l y c a l l e d one

A I m p r e t t y s u r e we c a l l e d m u l t i p l e t imes .

Q You c a l l e d m u l t i p l e t i mes and -

A I t h i n k so .

Q Did it j u s t keep l i g h t i n g up e v e r y t h i n g ?

A Yes.

Q So it j u s t l ik e ( I n d i s c e r n i b l e ) ?

A Yes.

Q Okay. So you c a l l and t he n you s t o p and you

some more and you c a l l and you say , Look it s



up. It s l i g h t i n g up. And t h e n a little whi le

by and you c a l l and g e t somebody e l s e o r same pe r son

aga in , it l i g h t s up aga in . You say , Come on, look

look t h e r e i s a c o r r e l a t i o n , was it l i k e

A I w a s n ' t s a y ing it was obv ious o r a ny th ing bu t

t was l i g h t i n g up and I d o n ' t remember s p e c i f i c a l l y

to you t h a t it i s l i g h t i n g up. I remember

p e o p l e s a y ing t h a t .

Q Okay. And t h a t was on more t han one i n s t a n c e

you a r e aware t h a t somebody was c a l l i n g and e i t h e r

p e r c e i v e d it l i g h t up o r somebody announced see ing it

up o r some th ing l i k e t h a t ?

A Yes.

Q More t ha n one i n s t a n c e ?

A Yes.

Q Okay. Then what happened?

A You kept denying it s a y i n g it s no t ou r s and we

t h e cops and t h e cop asked you, Look, do you have

phone? If you do, j u s t g i ve it back and w e ' l l drop

t h i s . And you sa id , No, I d o n ' t have it. And he

it out o f your pocke t and asked Cory f o r t h e pass

and Cory gave him t h e p a s s code , ask ed him f o r h i s

i n f o r m a t i o n . He t o l d t h e pe op le t h a t were in h i s



Q Okay. When he p u l l e d it ou t o f my pocke t , was I

n handcuf f s a t t h a t p o i n t ?


Q Did you he a r t h e p o l i c e o f f i c e r s a y i n g any t h i ng

o each o t h e r ?

A No.

Q Did you he a r anybody say , Well if it s no t in

r i g h t pocke t , maybe he swi t ched it o v e r t o h i s left

o r a n y t h i n g l i k e t h a t ?

No.

Q Did you see t h e p o l i c e o f f i c e r p a t t e d t h e

down s h o r t l y a f t e r a r r i v e d on t h e scene?

A P a t t i n g you down?

Q Yeah l i k e check ing fo r weapons?

A I d o n t remember t h a t b u t I remember them

t h e phone .

Q Do you r e c a l l h e a r i n g t h e s u s p e c t sc ream o r

You a r e t o u c h i n g my p e n i s o r some th ing l i k e t h a t ?

A No.

Q Okay. You d o n t r e c a l l h e a r i n g any y e l l i n g o r

l i k e t h a t ?

A No.

Q Okay. You testified t h a t t h e o f f i c e r sa id , Do

have t h e phone someth ing l i k e t h a t

THE COURT Okay. Time i s up. I ll g i v e you



more q u e s t i o n . Y ou ve gone t h r e e mi nu t e s , two minu te

so .

MR COUGHLIN: Thank you, Your Honor .

Y MR COUGHLIN:

Q Wel l , d i d you so how would you d e s c r i b e t h e

t s i n t e r a c t io n w i th t h e o f f i c e r o r o f f i c e r s , h i s

h i s l e v e l o f c o o p e r a t i o n ?

Seemed f i n e . You j u s t t o l d them you d i d n t have

Q Okay. Was t h e r e do you t h i n k t h e o f f i c e r -

o you r e c a l l s e e i n g t h e o f f i c e r initially p a t t h e s u s p e c t

check f o r weapons and do some th ing e l s e f o r a w h i l e

t h e n come back and p l a c e h i s hand t h e s u s p e c t s l e g o r

l i k e t h a t ?

A I d o n t remember him p a t t i n g you down no.

Q You d o n t even remember t h e initial pa t -down o r

l i k e t h a t ?

A No.

Q Do you r e c a l l t h e one o f f i c e r y e l l in g a t you

o f f , let us do our job . Someth ing l i k e t h a t ?

A I remember t h a t , yes .

Q Okay. Do you r e c a l l s e e i n g t h e o f f i c e r , once he

a r r e s t e d t h e s u s p e c t , t a k e n t h e phone ou t o f h i s

i n t e r a c t i n g w i th Cory some way t a k i n g t h e s u s p e c t

t o h i s c a r and t h e n s l am t h e s u s p e c t s head on t h e



o f t he t r u n k o f t he p o l i c e v e h i c l e ?

A I d i d no t see t h a t .

Q Okay. Do you r e c a l l s e e i n g anybody l i k e Aus t i n

o r anybody e l s e kind o f make a j o k i n g r e a c h i n g i n t o

s u s p e c t s pocke t

THE COURT: Okay. T h a t s more t h a n one

T h a t s more t h a n four q u e s t i o n s .

So do you have any c r os s .

MR YOUNG: I have no c r o s s .

THE COURT: Y o u r e f r e e t o go, sir Give me t h e

Who do you want nex t ?

MR COUGHLIN: Thank you, Mr. Templeton.

Your Honor , if I may c a l l Cory Goble , p l e a s e ,

THE COURT: Al l r i g h t . Since Mr. Goble

b e f o r e , as I i n d i c a t e d e a r l i e r , if you a r e

him to r e s t a t e a ny th ing he s a i d on d i r e c t , t h e

a t t o r n e y w i l l have t h e r i g h t t o o b j e c t and so

s ugge s t t h a t you ask him someth ing new t h a t you

ask him b e f o r e o r w a s n t asked o f him b e f o r e .

MR COUGHLIN: Yes.

THE COURT: P l e a s e r a i s e your r i g h t hand, sir

The wi tne s s was sworn . )

I



CORY GOBLE,

c a l l e d as a w i t n e s s , hav ing been first du ly sworn , was

examined and testified as fo l lows :

DIRECT EXAMINATION

Y MR. COUGHLIN:

Q Hi, Mr. Goble . Thank you f o r showing up t oday .

a p p r e c i a t e it.

Can you d e s c r i b e to me -

Your Honor, if I may g ive Mr. Goble t h a t p i c t u r e

s wel l ?

THE COURT: The p i c t u r e s a r e all h e r e .


THE COURT: But d o n ' t mix in your own

MR. COUGHLIN: I w o n ' t .

THE COURT: wi t h t h e e x h i b i t s .


MR. COUGHLIN:

Q S t a t e d f o r t h e r e c o rd , I 'm showing Mr. Goble

6 and I ' m a s k i n g him to t a k e j u s t ho l d t h a t ,

Goble , and if you can i n d i c a t e , sir -- and if you

ho l d it up so t h e h o n o rab l e Judge S f e r r a z z a w i l l be

to see it. Kind o f ang l e it a little b i t so we can

it once in a whi l e . Before any i n d i c a t i o n o f any





MR COUGHLIN: ( I nd i s c e r n ib l e ) to r e v e a l t h a t

It s k i nd o f hamper ing me a bit.

MR YOUNG: If h e s t r y i n g to f i g u r e out -- same

s a s k ing da t e o f b i r t h o r what v e h i c l e he d r i v e s , t h e r e

s no r e l e v a n c e t h e r e .

MR COUGHLIN: It has r e l e v a n c e and t h e r e s

-

THE COURT: Subsequent has no r e l e v a n c e

MR COUGHLIN: -- media t h a t I cou l d i n t r o d u c e

would b e a r on t h e i s s u e .

THE COURT: Subsequent media?

MR COUGHLIN: Wel l media t h a t I cou l d

i n t r o d u c e i n t o e v ide nc e .

THE COURT: Unless it has some th ing to do wi th

a l l e g e d l y

MR COUGHLIN: It does .

THE COURT: -- t a k i n g t h e c e l l phone -- s t a t e

it is.

MR COUGHLIN: Yes sir, Your Honor . While t h e

i s not t h a t s p e c i f i c i n t h e f a c t f o r t h e

e l em en t s o f t h e cr ime and I know we in a

memorandum we go t i n t o t h e d i f f e r e n c e s between

County Code and t h e NRS bu t I a n t i c i p a t e Mr. Young

pur sue ( I nd i s c e r n ib l e ) as l a r c e n y approach he r e

he goes f u r t h e r , ( I nd i s c e r n ib l e ) t h a t remains to be



t h e r e h a s n t been t h a t much t e s t imony in t h a t r e g a r d

I r e c a l l s p e c i f i c a l l y i n d i c a t i n g how t h e s u s p e c t was

to have come i n t o p o s s e s s i o n . Where Mr. Goble

if t h i s i s ( I n d i s c e r n i b l e ) abandon d e a l would b e a r on

m a t e r i a l f a c t s i n i s s u e . Mr. G o b l e s t e s t i m o n y he r e

r e s p e c t to where he was may i n d i c a t e v e r a c i t y i s s u e s

r e s p e c t to if h e s -

THE COURT: Al l r i g h t . It s o v e r r u l e d . The

i s s u s t a i n e d . Go ahead . Ask your nex t

MR COUGHLIN: I am. I m t r y i n g to remember t h e

MR YOUNG: Did he e ve r have a Jeep .

MR COUGHLIN: Okay.

MR COUGHLIN :

Q Your t e s t i m o n y i s you d o n t even r e c a l l if you

t h e r e t h a t n igh t o r how you go t t h e r e . Okay.

A I d id have no i d e a

Q Y o u r e p r e t t y much l o c a t e d in t h e c e n t e r o f t h e

p l a z a wi t h your s ka t e boa rd , s k a t e b o a r d i n g , t a l k i n g

peop l e Okay. Had you s e t your phone down somewhere

A Yes.

Q Where was t h a t ?

A I n s i d e a b l u e L b a s e b a l l h a t on t h e l ed g e r i g h t



t h i s s t r e e t l i g h t .

Q Okay. Can you show t h a t to us and d e s c r i b e it

n v e r b a l t e rms t oo b ecau se we c a n ' t see it back here .

A I j u s t d e s c r i b e d it i n v e r b a l t e rm s and I ll

it a ga in .

Q I 'm s o r r y .

A It was r i g h t b eh in d t h i s s t r e e t l i g h t on t h i s

There i s a l edge t h a t c i r c l e s t h e p l a z a , it s a

Q Yes sir.

A And my phone was s i t t i n g i n s i d e my ha t , a

h a t t h a t be longed to me and my h a t was i n s i d e

c e l l phone was i n s i d e o f t h e h a t sitting on t h e l e dge .

Q On t h i s t h e l e dge , not on t h e ground?

A On t h e l e dge .

Q Because you were s k a t e b o a r d i n g , phone cou l d f a l l

A D i d n ' t want it to br eak , e x a c t l y , ye s .

Q Okay. And t he n what happened f rom t h e r e ?

A From where? From what , you neve r gave me a

o f r e f e r e n c e . From where?

Okay. From what I u n d e r s t a n d your phone i s on

l edge on t h e n o r t h e r l y s i d e o f t h e e x t e r i o r o f t h e

p l a z a , you were in t h e c e n t e r s k a t e b o a r d i n g o r

wi th , say , f r i e n d s o r somebody. What r e l e v a n t



happened nex t t h a t maybe changed what you were

A I was go ing to check on my phone .

Q You went t o go check on it?

A Uh-huh.

Q And d i d you n o t i c e it w a s n ' t t h e r e o r someth ing

t h a t ?

A Yes, I d id .

Q You asked if somebody had seen my phone o r

l i k e t h a t ?

A I j u s t s a i d ou t l oud , I j u s t s a i d , where t h e -

my l anguage -- I guess it s no t needed bu t yeah ,

where i s my phone ou t loud , where t h e F i s my phone .

I s a i d ou t loud and, yeah . What e l s e ?

Q Okay. P r ev i ous to t h a t , had you h e a r d any man

up a h a t and say , Who's h a t i s t h i s ? Whose ha t

t h i s ? l o u d enough t o -

MR YOUNG: Obje c t ion , Your Honor . Hearsay .

MR COUGHLIN: Not go ing to

THE COURT: Well , I w i l l a l l ow t h a t q u e s t i o n .

MR COUGHLIN: Thank you, Your Honor .

THE COURT: Because it s no t o f f e r e d f o r t h e

o f what he s a i d bu t -

THE WITNESS: You ' re a s k i n g if I saw an

ho l d up my h a t and say , Whose h a t i s t h i s ?

I



MR COUGHLIN:

Q Yes sir.

No sir, I d i d not see t h a t happen . And I

if I saw it happen I would have n o t i c e d . It s a

b l u e b a s e b a l l cap and I would have seen someone

it a round s a y ing , Whose i s t h i s . When I was on l y

t t h e most 20 f e e t away I would have seen t h a t , yes .

Q I f t h a t had occu r r ed?

A I would t h i n k I would have seen t h a t , ye s .

Q So you would have t o assume t h a t d i d n t occur?

A I would -

MR YOUNG: Obje c t ion , Your Honor c a l l s f o r .


THE COURT: Yes it w o n t -- t h e o b j e c t i o n i s

He c a n t assume a ny th ing .


THE COURT: He j u s t d i d n t see it happen that s

MR COUGHLIN: Okay. Or he a r it.

THE COURT: Or h e a r it.

MR COUGHLIN:

Q Do you have head phones on o r a n y t h i n g l i k e

A No sir.

Q Okay. At t h a t t im e had you gone ove r t o



S t r e e t to do a n y t h i n g to a n y b o d y s c a r , hang ing

in any way?

A No sir.

Q Okay. If t h e r e was a 9 -1 -1 c a l l t h a t you made

s a i d my J e e p was r i g h t t h e r e , what would t h a t have

r e f e r r i n g t o ?

A If it was p a rk ed , we p a r k e d literally j u s t in

a r e a where -- w i th t h i s J e e p -- it s no t my Jeep

-- I d o n t know if that s a Jeep , bu t r i g h t h e r e where

c a r is p a rk ed by t h e mobi l e home i s where we p a r k our

Q So you can p a r k o v e r t h e c u r b ?

A There is a little open ing h e r e . They n ev e r

l i k e no one e v e r c a r e s in t h e first p l a c e .

Q Okay: Okay.

A ( I n d i s c e r n i b l e )

Q So you would have been p a r k e d down on V i r g i n i a

b u t you would have been -- t h a t k i n d o f mobi l e

t h i n g by t h e -- where t h e i c e r i n k i s in t h e

THE COURT: H e s p o i n t i n g to it in t h e p i c t u r e .


THE COURT: Mark t h e s p o t -

MR COUGHLIN: Yes.

THE COURT: Have him mark t h e s p o t if you want a



MR COUGHLIN: Okay.

THE COURT: Have him mark t h e p o l e your phone

by and pu t phone and t he n mark t h e s p o t where t h e Jeep

by and pu t Jeep if t h e Jeep was t h e r e .

MR YOUNG: Your Honor h i s t e s t i m o n y i s t h a t he

r e c a l l .

THE COURT: I know bu t he s a i d if h i s Jeep was

it would have been pa r ked and he p o i n t e d to a spo t .

MR COUGHLIN: Okay.

MR COUGHLIN:

Q So where we left o f f , you went ove r to check

where your phone was p l a c e d in t h e h a t on t h e

on t h e k i nd o f t h e n o r t h e r l y s i d e o f t h e s k a t e

You had asked where it was you were pr obab l y

abou t it as most anybody would be , I would

At t h a t p o i n t , what happened ne x t t h a t moved

a long?

A When I r e a l i z e d t h a t my ha t , t h a t my phone

in any ha t?

Q Yes.

A I s a i d where i s my phone . An i n d i v i d u a l t h a t

t o be r i g h t nex t to where my h a t was s i t t i n g

That was your phone? As a q u e s t i o n . And I s a i d

And he s a i d t h a t man r e f e r r i n g t o you you would



e t h a t man -- has it r i d i n g away on t h e b i k e and he was

sou t h ( I n d i s c e r n i b l e ) .

Q Towards t h e C en t e r S t r e e t b r i d g e -

A Towards t h e Cente r S t r e e t b r i d g e , ye s .

Q - where t h e S ien a i s -

Okay.

THE COURT: When you say s o u t h , do you mean

THE WITNESS: I b e l i e v e it was s ou th because

C en t e r S t r e e t ( I n d i s c e r n i b l e ) I b e l i e v e .

MR COUGHLIN: The CalNeva i s n o r t h , Your Honor .

THE COURT: Oh he was s a y ing s ou th on C en te r

THE WITNESS: He was h ead in g s ou th on Cente r

J u s t c u t t i n g a c r o s s

THE COURT: A l l r i g h t I u n d e r s t a n d .

MR COUGHLIN:

Q Was it s u s p e c t d a r t i n g o f f o r o t h e r w i s e seeming

maybe to f l e e o r g e t away?

I would pu t it as s u b t l y l e a v i n g t h e scene . You

b i k e o f f supe r qu i ck . He k i nd o f was t r y i n g t o

it look l i k e no th ing was happen ing as he s lo w ly rode

Q Okay. Did he t a k e a l a p around t h e pa r k t h a t

n o t i c e d .



A When you say he , a r e you r e f e r r i n g t o you?

Q Yes yes .

A No he d i d n ' t t a k e a l a p .

Okay. That you wi t nes sed?

A Not t h a t I wi tne s s e d , no.

Q Okay. J u s t back up q u i c k l y , when you went back

check your phone your h a t was t h e r e ?

A Yes it was.

Q Nobody had g iven you your h a t o r a ny th ing

Z a r a t e h a d n ' t r e t r i e v e d t h e h a t f rom a man who had

it up announced ( I n d i s c e r n i b l e ) ?

A Not to my knowledge no .

Q Okay. Did anybody t h a t n i g h t ment ion t o you

t h e t h e phone was h e l d up and o f f e r e d t o t h e

assembled in t h e s k a t e p a rk ?

MR YOUNG: Obje c t ion , h e a r s a y . There i s no

t h e r e t h a t r e l a t e s to an a f f e c t on it he r e which

Coughl in keeps f a l l i n g back t o .

THE COURT: Okay. S u s t a i n e d , o b j e c t i o n

MR COUGHLIN: Well -

THE COURT: You d i d n ' t obse r ve anyone do i t ?

MR COUGHLIN: J u s t might go to t h e e f f e c t o f

o r no t Mr. Goble f e l t l i k e somebody came up and

and grabbed h i s phone o r whether he r e a l i z e d he



have been -

THE COURT: I d o n t t h i n k it r e a l l y m a t t e r s ,

Y o u r e ch a rg ed w i th in t h i s case e i t h e r w i l l f u l l y o r

s t e a l , t a k e away c a r r y away t h e p e r s o n a l

o f a n o t h e r .


MR COUGHLIN:

Q So t h i s man who a l e r t e d you t a l k i n g in

as to what he t o l d you d i d you know t h i s

Oh t h a t was your phone o r whatever he s a i d ?

A No i d e a who he was.

Q Have you e v e r hea r d t h e name Peanu t a s s i g n e d to

A Did you say p e n i s ?

Q No peanut?

A No. No I have no t .

Q Okay. Okay. He had gauged e a r s though?

A I h o n e s t l y c a n t even remember . He had l i k e

brown h a i r and he was whi t e and l i k e my age i s

I know.

Q Okay.

THE COURT: Wai t wai t a second , who had blond .

THE WITNESS: I know f o r a f a c t t h a t he d i d n t

o r he d i d n t s i g n a wi tne s s t h i n g . I h o n e s t l y

know.



THE COURT: No no I mean h e s t h e p e r so n who

you who had t h e phone?

THE WITNESS: He d i d n t oh yeah , yeah , yes .

THE COURT: Okay. Go ahead .

YMR COUGHLIN:

Q But you had n ev e r r e c e i v e d a phone c a l l f rom him

t o t h a t n i g h t o r c a l l e d him o r knowing f rom a

A No.

Q Did any o f your f r i e n d s d id ?

A No.

Q Tha t you know of? Okay.

A No.

Q So once he a l e r t e d you t o t h e f a c t t h a t t h e

who you had i n d i c a t e d was a t t h a t p o i n t pr obab l y

where if y o u r Jeep was t h e r e you i n d i c a t e d it would

been pa rked?

A Repea t t h a t .

Q S or r y . I d i d t h a t . Once you were t o l d abou t

( I n d i s c e r n i b l e ) p o i n t t h e s u s p e c t o u t t o you

can we ge t i n t o whe the r he i n d i c a t e d he

t h e gauged e a r man s a i d , I saw him go g rab it o r

him do someth ing e l s e ?

THE COURT: No you c a n t .

MR COUGHLIN: Okay. I m s o r r y , Your Honor I m

I



t r y i n g to

THE COURT: We ve a l r e a d y c l a r i f i e d t h a t .

Y MR COUGHLIN:

Q Okay. What happened nex t ?

A Do you want me to start where I left o f f ?

Q Yes.

I s a i d t h a t guy has my phone . And I saw you on

b i k e s lowly p e d a l i n g away. And my first i n s t i n c t was

come c o n f r o n t you and ask you if you had my phone .

Q Did you jog over t h e r e .

A I s ka t e boa rde d o v e r t h e r e as f a s t as I cou l d .

Q Did anybody j o i n you?

A Not a t t h e v e ry be g inn ing , no. I came all by

to you.

Q Okay. And t h e n d i d anybody j o i n you soon t h e r e

A Many peop l e j o ined me soon a f t e r .

Q Was it l i k e two -

MR YOUNG: Obje c t ion . Asked and answered .

t h i s t h e first t i me .

THE COURT: A l l r i g h t . T h a t s t r u e . S u s t a i n e d ,

MR COUGHLIN: Okay.

MR COUGHLIN:

Q So you went over and would you say you



t h e suspec t ?

A Yes.

Q Okay.

THE COURT: He s a i d he c o n f r o n t e d you.


MR COUGHLIN:

Q Do you r e c a l l e xa c t l y what you asked tell me

s b e s t you r e c a l l what you asked initially and what t h e

A I was l i k e , Hey d i d you j u s t t a k e my phone?

a t s what I sa id , someth ing ve r y s i m i l a r to t h a t .

Q Okay. And t h e n you r e c e i v e d some r e sponse

A I s p e c i f i c a l l y remember No I do no t have your

I have a phone and you p u l l e d ou t a d i f f e r e n t c e l l

and sa id , I have my phone . And t hen you pu t t h a t

and t r i e d to keep r i d i n g away f rom me. You w o u l d n t

to me. You were compl e t e l y t r y i n g to i gno re and

to g e t away from me.

Okay. What would you say would t h i s might

be a l l owab le , Your Honor .

But from your van t age p o i n t , what would make t h e

t h i n k he had your phone?

MR YOUNG: Obje c t ion , same o b j e c t i o n .

THE COURT: If you keep r e f e r r i n g t o t h e



I d o n t know who you a r e t a l k i n g abou t anymore

MR COUGHLIN: I m t h e s u s p e c t h e r e , yeah . I m

THE COURT: Try ing to what?

MR COUGHLIN: Wel l I m wear ing a coup le o f

h a t s . Do you want me t o say me and sound l e s s

an a t t o r n e y ? I s t h a t i t ?

THE COURT: No. I want to know who you a r e

abou t

MR COUGHLIN: There i s one s u s p e c t h e r e .

THE COURT: Y o u r e t a l k i n g l i k e it s a t h i r d

MR COUGHLIN: Yeah I know because it s

f o r me to be c o n s t a n t l y sound ing l i k e I m t he

when I m t r y i n g to be r e p r e s e n t i n g myse l f .

THE COURT: Wel l b u t . Okay. And he can answer

it was you if he wants to I gue s s .

MR COUGHLIN: It s c onfus ing when h e s not

my t e rmino logy . I u n d e r s t a n d t h a t .

THE COURT: He s h o u l d n t be .

MR COUGHLIN: I unde r s t a nd , Your Honor . My

Your Honor it sounds l i k e you p r e f e r if I s a i d

THE COURT: You can r e f e r t o y o u r s e l f as t h e



and you can r e f e r to him as whoever it was o r -

MR COUGHLIN: I ll go wi t h w h a tev e r t h e Cour t

and I ll s t a t e me from now on.

THE COURT: You can c a l l y o u r s e l f s u s p e c t .

f i n e .

MR COUGHLIN: I t h i n k y o u ' v e g o t it b e t t e r ,

Honor , it s c l e a r e r t h a t way.

Y MR COUGHLIN:

Q So a t t h a t p o i n t , what would you say -- how -

would make me t h i n k , f rom your p o i n t o f view a t t h a t

t h a t I had your phone?

MR YOUNG: Obje c t ion , s p e c u l a t i o n . Asking what

w i t n e s s can t e s t i f y to what Mr. Cough l in i s t h i n k i n g ,

s p e c u l a t i o n or r e a s ona b le pe r s on , that s

THE COURT: Sus t a ined .

MR COUGHLIN: And I 'm j u s t -

THE COURT: Sus t a ined .

MR COUGHLIN: Yes, Your Honor .

MR COUGHLIN:

Q When you s a i d , Do you have my phone o r someth ing

t h a t , d i d you expec t me to know if I had a phone t h a t

t was yours in p a r t i c u l a r

A I s u s p e c t e d you, yes , and t h a t was mine. When

t h e i n d i v i d u a l a s k i n g you if you have my phone , yes , I



expec t t h a t you knew it was mine , yes .

Q How would I know t h a t ?

MR YOUNG: Objec t ion , Your Honor Specu l a t i on .

MR COUGHLIN: I 'm a sk in g if it s mine.

THE WITNESS: Should be enough

MR YOUNG: Specu l a t i on .

THE COURT: Objec t i on i s su s t a i n ed .

MR COUGHLIN:

Q Okay. Was I a s tr a ng e r t o you and you to I a t

po in t ?

A Yes.

Q So we d i dn ' t have any s o r t o f l ong s t and i ng

t h a t would deve lop

A I t h i n k no t , no.

Q a r appo r t . Okay.

So if a s t r a ng e r came up to you and s a i d , You

my phone , would you expec t it was t h e i r phone?

MR YOUNG: Objec t i on . I don ' t unde r s t and t h a t

THE COURT: It s su s t a i n ed It s i r r e l e v an t ,

MR COUGHLIN: Al l r i gh t , Your Honor .

MR COUGHLIN:

At t h a t po in t , it sounded l i k e you were unhappy

t h e answer you were ge t t i n g . Did t h e su spec t t r y to



Yes.

Q Okay. E a r l i e r d i d you say he j u s t kep t going on

way?

Same t h ing , going on your way f l e e . would

it s t he same t h ing . You were t r y i n g to ge t away from

from me a t l e a s t . You were t r y i n g to ge t away from

Q Like a mad dash?

You go t to t he p o i n t t h a t you were t r y i n g to

o f f t h a t you were choking your own dog t h a t was t i e d

o your b ike . I s p e c i f i c a l l y remember t h a t .

Q The dog was on t he ground, was it?

You had your dog e i t h e r t i e d to your b ik e o r you

h o ld in g it and you were t r y i n g t o ge t away so bad

I s p e c i f i c a l l y remember t he dog g e t t i n g l i k e yanked

on t he ( i n d i s c e r n i b l e ) when you were t r y i n g to

away.

Q Like t he cha in was caugh t up in someth ing?

I have no i de a . I j u s t remember you t r y i n g t o

away so bad t h a t t he dog was g e t t i n g somewhat yanked

n your b i ke when you were t r y i n g to ge t away.

Q Okay. But okay b u t you d o n t know if t he cha in

scaugh t in someth ing o r

-

Maybe t he cha in was caugh t . I d o n t know.



Q The dogs cha in . Okay.

By t h a t p o i n t had you made any i n d i c a t i o n , Hey

want you to s t op h e re and a l low me to prove to you t h a t

t was my phone o r someth ing?

A I d o n t t h i n k you gave me t he o p p o r t u n i t y to do

all.

Q Okay. So t hen , what d i d you ( I n d i s c e r n i b l e )

A My f r i e n d s saw t h e s i t u a t i o n coming. There was

o t a c k l i n g whatsoever .

Q Okay.

A They came ove r and my f r i e n d c a l l e d , I s a i d ,

c a l l me phone which I v e a l r e a d y t e s t i f i e d to t h i s

I d o n t know why I m doing t h i s aga i n . I s a i d

my phone. He d i a l e d my phone number and we saw it

up in your pocke t and a t t h a t p o i n t it was c l e a r as

t h a t my phone was i n s i d e o f your pocke t .

Q Now you saw I was you say , t r y i n g to

make a mad dash a t t h a t pOint ye t you were still

to see t he phone l i g h t i n g up in t h e pocke t?

MR YOUNG Your Honor I o b j e c t .

t he t e s t im o n y . T h e r e s neve r t he use o f

dash . Second of f , t h i s has all been cove red t h e first

t h i s wi t nes s t e s t i f i e d .

THE COURT: S us t a i ned .



IR COUGHLIN: Your Honor if I can j u s t say ,

know t h a t we ev e r covered t h e i de a o f how cou ld he

t h e phone l i g h t i n g up if t h e s u s p e c t was somewhat

THE COURT: Okay.

MR COUGHLIN: T h a t s t he t e s t i mony .

THE COURT: You can ask - I ll a l low t h a t

MR COUGHLIN: Okay.

THE COURT: You on ly go t f i v e minu tes .

MR COUGHLIN: Okay.

THE WITNESS: I can answer t h e q u e s t i o n .

b o t h e r me a t all.

We had to literally c i r c l e a round you so you

f o r c e f u l l y b i ke t h rough us . What I r e c a l l , we

around you. Then asked -- Tanner c a l l e d t he phone

we saw it c l e a r as day l i g h t up in your p o ck e t .

MR COUGHLIN:

Q Okay. So t h e s u s p e c t w a s n t in a l e a v ing type

f movement when you saw t he phone l i g h t up?

You were t r y i n g to l e ave t h e scene . I

I

r e c a l l you t r y i n g t o l e ave -

remember t h a t . I ll say on t h e r eco r d ,

Q Was t h e r e some -- okay. Was t h e r e some p o i n t

I s topped t r y i n g t o l e ave , as you say , and engaged



n a c o n v e r s a t i o n wi th you and maybe ment ioned , Hey, let s

e p e a c e f u l . t h i r t e e n y ea r o l d j u s t -- t h e r e was a

There was d e f i n i t e l y no, L e t s been p e a c e f u l .

t was j u s t you denying , denying , deny ing , deny ing you had

phone .

Q Okay.

And t h a t was about it. And we r e s t r a i n e d you

and when I c a l l e d t he phone I saw it l i g h t up in

p o c k e t . C o u l d n t t ake it anymore and d i a l e d 9-1 -1 .

Q Okay. And so was t h e r e some p o i n t a t which you

you j u s t ad m i t t ed you s t o l e my phone?

Yes, yes . You s a i d t h e r e i s someth ing t h a t l e d

e to b e l i e v e t h a t -- you s a i d someth ing l i k e , Well , it s

n o l d 3G. Why do you even c a r e ? You s a i d someth ing l i k e

I s p e c i f i c a l l y remember t h a t . You were l i k e , it s

an o l d 3G. It s l i k e wor th 50 bucks , who c a r e s . You

someth ing l ik e t h a t .

Q And d i d you tell t h e o f f i c e r s t h a t it was wor th

50 t o 80 bucks -

It was l i k e 300 retail va l ue when you first

t h a t phone , yes .

Q Did he ask you how much t h e phone was worth?

I c a n t remember.

Q Okay. Did you see him r e a c h i n t h e s u s p e c t s



and t a k e out t he phone?

A Yes I d i d see t h a t .

Q And d i d you -

A He f o r c e f u l l y had to t a k e it back f o r me if

what y o u r e ask ing , yes . You d i d no t w i l l i n g l y

over t h e phone . Like I sa id , I covered t h i s be f o r e

o t he o f f i c e r , even gave you t he oppor tun i t y , he s a i d if

r e t u r n t he phone w e l l drop t h i s now. We have no

which I d o n t unde r s t and why t he s us pe c t -


Y MR COUGHLIN:

Q Al l r i g h t . Did t h e o f f i c e r -- all r i g h t . Did

eve r r each l i k e you were going to grab f o r t h e

-

A I want to say no. From what I r e c a l l , no

you h o n e s t l y i n t i m i d a t e d t h e h e l l out o f me.

Q Okay.

A You a re ex t remely tall. I d i d no t know you.

i d n t want you to punch me i n t h e f a c e . I d i d no t -

Q Okay


Q Okay. How would you say I i n t e r a c t e d with t he

Was I c o o p e r a t i v e ? Was I -

A Not c oope ra t ive a t all.

Q And how so?



A They asked you v e r y p o l i t e l y to g iv e t h e phone

You d e n i e d it. You s a i d you d i d n t have it and

f o r c e f u l l y had to t a k e it. They had to f o r c e f u l l y

to t a k e t h e phone from you. I would s a y that s no t

wi th t h e p o l i c e .

Q So you s p e c i f i c a l l y r e c a l l me t e l l i n g t h e

No I do no t have t h e phone?

A Something l i k e t h a t , yeah . I d o n t

-- okay . I d o n t have s p e c i f i c a l l y remember

say in g no b u t I do s p e c i f i c a l l y remember ing you no t

r e t u r n i n g it.

Q Do you s p e c i f i c a l l y r e c a l l me t e l l i n g t h e

I d i d no t have i t ?

A No i de a , I d o n t know.

Q Okay. So t h a t -


Q Okay. Did you see A u s t i n L i c h t y making a

grabb ing t ype , j o k i n g movement maybe say

A No i d e a .

Q Did t h e man wi th t h e gauged e a r s , was he t h e r e

y t h a t p o i n t ?

A I have no i d e a .

Q Did you t e s t i f y

A I want t o say yes , I want to say yeah , he was.

came ove r w i th t h e group and he was h e l p i n g us ho ld you



Q Was he someone you would c h a r a c t e r i z e as t h e

a g g r e s s i v e w i t h Mr. Cough l in?

I remember him I want t o say he was t h e one who

you. Someone h e l d on to your hand l eba r s so you

l e a v e .

Q So you say t h ey were h o ld in g t h e hand le b a r s -

I m p r e t t y su r e it was him.

Q So Mr. Coughl in , I c o u l d n t l e a v e . It w a s n t

t h e y were say in g

This i s a y e a r and a h a l f ago a lm o s t . do

someone r e s t r a i n i n g your b i c y c l e . I m n o t su r e if

t was t h e man ( i n d i s c e r n i b l e )

Q For how l ong?

t h a t you were say in g w i t h t h e gauged e a r s o r

you c a l l e d him. I have no i d e a if t h a t i s t o

it was.

Q Okay. Was it l i k e initially r e s t r a i n i n g t he

f o r l i k e a second and t h en I s topped and s a i d , you

okay, I m s t opp i ng -

I t h i n k we were p r e t t y c l e a r t h a t you were go ing

o be h e l d t h e r e u n t i l t he p o l i c e a r r i v e d .

Q Did you see me c a l l 9-1 -1?

No.

Q You d i d n t see me h o l d t h e phone and c a l l 9-1 -1?



A Now t h a t you say t h a t , I t h i n k you might have .

l i k e , I m go ing to c a l l t h e p o l i c e . It was l i k e I

am.

Q Okay. Did you -


Q Okay. Did you a t t h i s p o i n t say , Someone j u s t

a minor to t h e 9-1-1 o p e r a t o r ?

I do remember t h a t t o o . Someone I c a n t

I d o n t know who bu t someone was t r y i n g to g e t

and you d i d l i k e l a y a hand on someone.

Q Okay. So d i d somebody t o u ch me t h a t n i g h t in

c o n t e x t o f c o n f r o n t i n g about t h e phone?

I c a n t remember . I would assume yeah .

THE COURT: You have abou t t h r e e minu te s left.


Y MR COUGHLIN:

Q You c a n t remember s p e c i f i c a l l y b u t somebody

A I have no i d e a .

Q Okay. Was t h e r e some p o i n t where you s a i d -

A My mind -


Q I go t to ask t h e q u e s t i o n . Where you s a i d t h e

o p e r a t o r , someone j u s t socked a minor?



MR YOUNG: Asked and answered .

MR COUGHLIN: I d i d n ' t h e a r any answer .

MR YOUNG: J u s t answ ered abou t 10 seconds ago .

MR COUGHLIN: Okay. He d i d n ' t remember .

THE COURT: He s a i d he may have .

MR COUGHLIN: May have because somebody might

t o u c h e d him bu t t hen he s a i d he d o e s n ' t r e c a l l

t ouch i ng him. So I ' m c l a r i f y i n g b ecau se it s been

c o n t r a d i c t o r y b u t -

THE WITNESS: I h o n e s t l y w ish I co u ld be more

abou t it. My mind, I had so much a n x i e t y and

and f l u r r y t h a t I wish , you know, I mean, I

-

Y MR COUGHLIN:

Q Because it s your phone; r i g h t ?

A Yeah. I was ex t r em e ly u p s e t .

Q P r i v a t e s t u f f , it s no t co o l

A Lot s o f a d r e n a l i n e -

Q-- if it s

your phone , p r e t t y much anybody would

e p i s s e d ; r i g h t ?

A I was ups e t , yes .

Q Yeah. I t h i n k that s normal and r e a s ona b le .

Was t h e r e any p o i n t t h a t n i g h t where you f e l t

t h e group w i th you was k i n d o f o v e r l y a g g r e s s i v e and

t h a t



No.

Q -- t h a t I b e l i e v e d , one , t h a t it was your phone

immed ia t e ly comply w i t h -

What a r e you ask ing?

Q Was t h e r e any p o i n t which it o c c u r r e d to you

I had t he phone whi le w e r e e x p e c t i n g t h i s guy

b e l i e v e it s our phone and two w e r e b e in g p r e t t y

in demanding t h a t he t u r n it o v e r r i g h t away?

I still d o n t unde r s t and t h e q u e s t i o n . S o r ry .

Q Did you e v e r say , I m go ing to r each i n t o h i s

No.

Q go ing to grab t h e phone ou t o f h i s pocke t

now?

No.

Q Okay. Did t h e o f f i c e r t a k e t h e phone ou t o f t h e

p o ck e t and t h e n walk ove r to you?

Yes I b e l i e v e so , yes .

Q And t h en what-

I d o n t know e x a c t l y . I do t h e remember him

t h e phone f rom you and t h en t h e y d i d b r i n g it ove r

me and asked me que s t ions abou t it. They s a i d w h a t s

pas s code . Can you tell us some c o n t a c t s ? And I

them l i k e a coup le o f t h i n g s . I f u l l y d e s c r i b e d t h e

P r e t t y c l e a r as day it was mine .



Q Did you tell them was anybody s t a n d i n g with

when you were i n t e r a c t i n g w i th t h a t ? Was it t h e one

A I b e l i e v e I want to say t h e r e was a t l e a s t

o f f i c e r s on scen e .

Q But t h a t you were i n t e r a c t i n g wi th?

A I have no i d e a which o f f i c e r I was i n t e r a c t i n g

Q Not which one , b u t j u s t whe the r it was one main

who was communica t ing w i th you?

A Yeah yes .

Q Okay. And a t some p o i n t I would imagine he had

o ask you your phone number?

A Yes g u ess .

Q Okay. So he asked you your phone -

A d o n t know. c a n t answer t h a t . d o n t

if he asked me f o r my phone number o r n o t .

Q But you know whethe r he c a l l e d t h e iPhone in

and t r i e d to a s c e r t a i n whe the r in f a c tit

was

phone p r i o r to j u s t s e a r c h i n g i n t h e s u s p e c t s

A What? You a r e conf us i ng . Your q u e s t i o n s a r e

conf us i ng .

Q Did t h e o f f i c e r j u s t show up and say I t h i n k you

t h e phone and j u s t g r a b i n t o t h e p o ck e t o r d i d he do a



I

t h i n g s to t r y to -

A Well , I want to say , I d o n t know if t hey

you o r h an d cu f f ed o r if it was b o t h . But ,

know. They r e s t r a i n e d you, go t my phone . One o f

o f f i c e r s came back ove r and asked me a co u p le o f

to see if it was mine . I answered a coup le o f

and he b e l i e v e d it was mine and gave it back to

Q So he had t h e phone -

THE COURT: Al l r i g h t . Time i s up. I ll g iv e

one more q u e s t i o n .

Y MR COUGHLIN:

Q So he had t h e phone a t t h a t p o i n t when he first

up to you and asked you, i s t h i s your phone?

A Are you ask i ng if he had t h e phone when he asked

if it was mine?

Q When he first s t a r t e d a s k i n g you q u e s t i o n s about

phone , yeah .

A Yes. I gues s , yeah . Where e l s e would it have

Q Okay. How s your -

THE COURT: T h a t s your

THE WITNESS: Make it was still in your pocke t

he asked me. I d o n t know. Maybe it was still in

p o ck e t when he was ask i ng me q u e s t i o n s . I d o n t



Y MR. COUGHLIN:

Okay. Did he maybe say , It s no t in h i s r i g h t

Might be in h i s left p o ck e t ?

A What ' s t h e d i f f e r e n c e o f which p o ck e t it was in

f he was h o l d i n g it a t t h e t ime o r n o t . I j u s t d o n ' t see

r e l e v a n c e o f t h a t a t all.

THE COURT: Okay. You ve gone way over t h e t ime

so w e ' l l -- I ' m go ing to t a k e a f i v e minu te r e c e s s .

need to meet w i th Judge S a lced o . You have one more

and -

MR. YOUNG: Your Honor, I have one o r two

on c r o s s .

THE COURT: You do. Then go ahead and ask .

MR. YOUNG: I ll be b r i e f .

CROSS-EXAMINATION

MR. YOUNG:

Q You t e s t i f i e d , sir

THE COURT: I 'm s o r r y , I d i d n ' t ( i n d i s c e r n i b l e ) .

MR . YOUNG: T h a t ' s okay.

MR. YOUNG:

Q You testified a t one p o i n t t h a t t h e s us pe c t -

pe r son you were t a l k i n g t o , t h a t you i d e n t i f i e d l a s t

as Mr. Coughl in , same p e r so n ?



A Yes sir.

Q Okay You s t a t e d a t one p o i n t t h a t Mr. Cough l in

ou t h i s c e l l phone some th ing a l ong t h e l i n e s o f

t h i s isn t your phone o r some th ing l ik e t h a t

A Yes e x a c t l y .

Q Was t h a t your phone t h a t he p u l l e d ou t ?

A The first one?

Q Yes.

A When I first asked him no.

Q Okay. So he had

It was l i k e r e d , compl e t e l y I c o u l d n t tell

what it was It was l i k e a r e d f l i p phone . W asn t an

Q That was d i f f e r e n t phone t ha n yours t h a t was on

pe r son?

A Yes.

THE COURT: A l l r i g h t . I ll a l l ow you to

to t h o s e two q u e s t i o n s if you have a q u e s t i o n

to t h o s e two q u e s t i o n s .

REDIRECT EXAMINATION

MR COUGHLIN:

Q Did Mr. Young ask -

THE COURT: He asked if you were t h e pe r son who

t h e -- who you i d e n t i f i e d as t h e s u s p e c t .



MR COUGHLIN: Okay.

THE COURT: And t h e o t h e r q u e s t i o n was when he

s t opped you you showed him a phone t h a t w a s n t h i s

And r e i t e r a t e d it w a s n t h i s phone . It was a r ed ,

b e l i e v e d was a r ed f l i p phone .

MR COUGHLIN: Okay. But I can ask a qu ick

r e l a t e d -

THE COURT: R elev an t to t h a t , ye s .

MR COUGHLIN:

Q Did you t hen say , No no I m t a l k i n g abou t and

d e s c r i b e your phone w i th more s p e c i f i c i t y to t h e

A Are you a s k i n g if I r e p l i e d to you a f t e r you

t h a t one ou t?

Q Yes.

A I was l i k e , No that s no t my phone and I v e

t o l d you have my phone to be hone s t , someth ing l i k e

Q Okay.

A At t h a t p o i n t I cou l d tell you were j u s t be i ng

r e d i c u l -- tell y o u r e l y ing .

Q But you d i d n t i n d i c a t e more s p e c i f i c a l l y t h i s

a b l a c k o r a whi te iPhone?

A I have no i dea what I t o l d you r i g h t t h e r e .

MR COUGHLIN: Okay. Thank you Your Honor.



THE COURT: Al l r i g h t . W e l l t a k e a f i v e

r e c e s s . When we come back -- w e l l , you have one

wi tne s s on subpoena. So do you want t h a t wi tne s s

t hen?

MR. COUGHLIN: Yes.

THE COURT: And if you want to t e s t i f y y o u l l be

t o .

A d i s c u s s i o n h e l d a t t h e bench . )


THE COURT: Befo re we pr oceed any f u r t h e r , I d id

Mr. L e s l i e to be he r e as s t andby counse l . And i s

any o b j e c t i o n to him be ing r e l i e v e d a t t h i s p o i n t

I b e l i e v e Mr. Coughl in has p r e t t y much compl ied

t h e Cour t decorum and I d o n t know t h e r e would be any

f o r him to t a k e o r t h e d e f e n s e . We re a lmos t done.

MR. COUGHLIN: Your Honor if I may

THE COURT: You wanted him to l eave b e f o r e .

MR. COUGHLIN: Well I l i k e and r e s p e c t

L e s l i e , Your Honor. But I ll say t h i s , Your Honor

o n ly r ea son I might wish fo r him to be he r e i s if you

if t h e r e i s a g u i l t y v e r d i c t , me be i ng

I might wish to have s t andby counse l to t a k e

p r o p e r t y r a t h e r t ha n have it booked i n t o t h e jail

MR LESLIE: I d o n t t a k e p o s s e s s i o n o f p e r s o n a l





THE COURT: Wel l do you have t h e r e s t o f t he

you can do i t ? Because w e r e p r o b a b l y not go ing to be

MR LESLIE: I m a v a i l a b l e and I had co v e red all

c a s e s .

TH COURT: A l l r i g h t . I ll r e q u e s t t h a t you

j u s t because to be save on t h i s in c a s e someth ing

MR COUGHLIN: Your Honor I d o n t a n t i c i p a t e

out any d i f f e r e n t l y t ha n -

TH COURT: I know bu t if some th ing happens

you f e e l t h a t you need someone to r e p r e s e n t you t h e

minu te , he ll be here .

MR COUGHLIN: I m consc i ous o f Mr. L e s l ie s

I r e a l i z e h e s got impor t a n t work to do.

TH COURT: Al l r i g h t .

MR LESLIE: This i s a l s o impor t a n t and I j u s t

to be ve r y c l e a r and t h e n I ll sit down. The r eason

I m h e s i t a t e to say I want to l e a v e , I d o n t want any

f my d e c i s i o n s o r a c t i o n s to work to any d e t r i m e n t to t h e

I m h e r e and I m in t h e aud i ence and I m

TH COURT: Wel l n e i t h e r do I . I ll have you

t hen .



Okay. Ca l l your wi tness , sir.

MR . COUGHLIN: Yes, sir, Your Honor . I ll c a l l

. Nathan ie l Zara t e .

THE COURT: Okay. Come up and be sworn and t hen

f you ' l l s p e l l your first and l a s t name f o r t h e r e co rd .

be l i e v e you t e s t i f i e d be fo r e . So, Mr. Young wi l l have

r i g h t to ob j ec t if it s someth ing which has a l r eady

t e s t i f i e d to be fo r e . Raise your r i g h t hand.

(The wi tnes s was sworn . )

THE COURT: Would you s t a t e and we s p e l l your

and l a s t names.

THE WITNESS: Nathan ie l Zara t e ,

Las t name Zara t e , Z-A-R-A-T-E.

THE COURT: Al l r i g h t . Go ahead , Mr. Coughl in .

MR COUGHLIN: Yes, sir, Your Honor.

NATHANIEL ZARATE,

c a l l e d as a wi tne s s , hav ing been first du ly sworn , was

examined and t e s t i f i e d as fo l lows :

DIRECT EXAMINATION

MR. COUGHLIN:

Q Good a f t e rnoon , Mr . Zara t e . Thank you fo r be ing

sir. I am go ing to ask you, do you r e c a l l on

n igh t in ques t i on , August 20th , 2011, someone you



r e f e r r e d t o e a r l i e r as t h e man w i th t h e s i x

h o l d i n g t h e iPhone w h i l e o f f e r i n g it up to p eo p le in

p a rk ?

MR YOUNG: Your Honor o b j e c t i o n . Hearsay .

t h e t r u e s t d e f i n i t i o n o f h e a r s a y as I o b j e c t e d to

MR COUGHLIN: Your Honor if I cou l d q u i c k l y

a c o u n t e r to t h a t .

THE COURT: Well , you can j u s t ask him t h e

if r e c a l l s some -- you s a i d t h a t you testified to

You asked him to r e c i t e t e s t i m o n y f rom a p r i o r

You can ask him t h e q u e s t i o n , if he saw

h o ld up t h e phone .

Y MR COUGHLIN:

Q Did you see -- d i d someone h o l d up a phone t h a t

A Yes.

Q He o f f e r e d up to t h e p eo p le i n t h e p a r k ?

MR YOUNG: Your Honor a g a i n , I o b j e c t t o t h a t ,

THE COURT: I m go ing to o v e r r u l e t h a t b e c a u s e

t was asked b e f o r e and answ ered by t h i s w i t n e s s I

I f n o t , it was answ ered by t h e o f f i c e r , one o r

o t h e r



MR. COUGHLIN:

Q You may answer t h a t , sir.

THE COURT: b ecau se I he a rd t h a t t e s t i mony

I have no way o f knowing it e xc e p t f o r t h a t .

MR. COUGHLIN:

Q Mr. Zara t e , w i l l you answer t h a t , p l e a s e .

A Yes. There was a man h o l d i n g up a phone .

Q Did t h e man say some th ing to t h e a f f e c t t h a t

c l a i m t h e phone o r I ll t h row it in t h e r i v e r ?

MR. YOUNG: Your Honor I o b j e c t t o t h a t .

f o r a f a c t t h a t it s no t been i n t r o d u c e d i n t o


MR YOUNG: And a ga in t h e r e s no -- I have not

an e x c e p t i o n to t h e he a r s a y r u l e prov ide d by

Coughl in , I t h i n k it i s c l e a r l y h e a r s a y .

MR. COUGHLIN: And Your Honor may I j u s t o f f e r

he a r s a y o b j e c t i o n ? Except ion .

THE COURT: W h at s t h e he a r s a y e xc e p t ion?

MR COUGHLIN: I would say I b e l i e v e t h a t t he n

menta l o r emot iona l o r p h y s i c a l c o n d i t i o n would

as would p r e s e n t sense impre s s ion .

THE COURT: I m go ing to o v e r r u l e t h e ob je c t i on .

ahead .



Y MR. COUGHLIN:

Q You may answer , sir.

A To which que s t ion?

Q Did somebody h o ld t h e phone up and

in t h e r i v e r if somebody d o e s n t c l a im

A I d o n t remember t h a t man s p e c i f i c a l l y say i ng

m go ing to t h row t h e phone in t h e r i v e r .

Q Anyth ing l i k e t h a t ?

A I d o n t remember him s a y i n g a ny th ing l i k e t h a t .

Q Do you r e c a l l N ico le Watson a d m i t t i n g to h e a r i n g

MR. YOUNG: Your Honor a g a i n

THE COURT: Tha t i s s u s t a i n e d . This w i t n e s s can

what h e a r s a y is.

MR. YOUNG: Mr. Cough l in knows what hea r say is.

THE COURT: What?

MR. YOUNG: Mr. Cough l in knows what h e a r s a y is.

t h e e n t i r e day , h e s a t t e m p t e d to elicit a lmos t

bu t he a r s a y .

THE COURT: T h a t s f i ne . But t h a t p r i o r

one t h a t he answered I t h i n k i s an e xc e p t ion

t h i s one i s no t and it i s doub le h e a r s a y on t op o f

sir.

MR. COUGHLIN: Okay Your Honor . It s no t



p r o o f t h e t r u t h o f t h e m a t te r a s s e r t e d .

THE COURT: Wel l I d o n t c a r e . I v e s u s t a i n e d

MR COUGHLIN: Okay.

MR COUGHLIN:

Q Do you r e c a l l see ing me wi t h some cameras and

equipment about a week a f t e r t h e a r r e s t

MR YOUNG: Obje c t ion , r e l e v a n c e .

THE COURT: W hat s t h e r e l e v a n c e ?

MR COUGHLIN: One I b e l i e v e it goes to t h e

m a t e r i a l and it s been s a i d t h a t someone -- if

Z a r a t e hea r d me ask t h a t q u e s t i o n and he a rd someone

t o h e a r i n g a man say h e s go ing to t h row it in t h e

THE COURT: I s u s t a i n t h e o b j e c t i o n .

MR COUGHLIN: Okay. Can I ask Mr. Z a r a t e to

a r e c o r d i n g t h a t was made wi th him p r e s e n t i n

h i s vo ic e i s on?

THE COURT: You may.

MR YOUNG: Your Honor I would -- if t h i s i s a

t a k e n a week a f t e r t h e i n c i d e n t -

THE COURT: Oh a week a f t e r ?

MR YOUNG: Which he was j u s t r e f e r r i n g t o , I

o b j e c t to t h a t .

THE COURT: Then I s u s t a i n t h e o b j e c t i o n . I f it



contemporaneous w i th t h e i n c i d e n t t h e n I ll a l l o w it.

MR COUGHLIN: Wel l it was a week a f t e r t h e

and -

THE COURT: So t h e o b j e c t i o n i s s u s t a i n e d .

It s no t r e l e v a n t t o t h i s cha r ge t oday sir.

MR COUGHLIN: So if t h e i n d i v i d u a l had

knowledge o f t h e e v e n t s o f t h e n i g h t o f t h e

a week l a t e r our v i d e o t a p e d e s c r i b i n g t h e a r r e s t

no t r e l e v a n t f o r t h e even t i nvo l ved?

THE COURT: The a r r e s t i s no t t h e i s s u e . It s

o r no t you s t o l e t h e c e l l phone .

MR COUGHLIN: Wel l t h e a c t i o n i n c i d e n t t o t h e

o r r e s u l t i n g in t h e a r r e s t if t h e y a r e

-- no t go t e s t i f y i n g bu t commenting a week

on v i d e o t a p e knowing t h e y a r e b e i n g r e c o r d e d as to

a c t i o n s were i n v o l v e d in t h e a r r e s t what

what that s no t r e l e v a n t ?

THE COURT: S i r tell me s p e c i f i c a l l y you can

an o f f e r o f p r o o f a b r i e f one as to what i s

on t h i s v ideo t h a t d e a l s wi t h t h e a r r e s t on t h e

o f t h e i n c i d e n t .

MR COUGHLIN: Yes sir. And I ll j u s t no t e

I r ev iewed t h e t a p e o f t h e October 22nd h e a r i n g

and a t t h e 48 minute mark o f t h e second file on t h a t

n o t e t h a t I ll be a f f o r d e d t h e r i g h t t o waive t h e



f ee s f o r subpoenas and t h e r e i n I would su g g e s t

my p r o p e r l y s e r v i n g Nico le Watson i n c i d e n t NRS

THE COURT: Well I see t h a t i s a p r o p e r s e r v i c e

it s no t one she has t o obey be c a use it s by m a i l . So

f she d o e s n t g e t it, and if she d o e s n t s i g n f o r it,

it s no t ev idence t h a t she was se r ved . It may comply

t h e t e c h n i c a l i t y o f t h e s t a t u t e b u t it d o e s n t g i v e

t h e power to o r d e r , ( I n d i s ce r n i b l e ) o r to i s s u e an

f o r h e r nonappearance .

MR COUGHLIN: I do b e l i e v e it p r o v i d e s a b a s i s

a c o n t in u a n c e .

THE COURT: No sir, n o t u n l e s s you made a

mot ion ba se d on t h a t .

MR COUGHLIN: I m making t h a t now sir.

THE COURT: It s d e n i e d .

MR COUGHLIN: Okay. Well , a s to your p rompt ing

to i s s u e an o f f e r of p r oof , t h i s r e c o r d i n g , and I have

v ideo o f it and an aud io o f it s w e l l -- might remember

Temple ton ( i n d i s c e r n i b l e ) it w i l l show Mr. Za ra t e

n e x t to Ms. Watson when Ms. Watson a dmi t s to

t h e man wi th t h e 6-pack h o l d i n g t h e iPhone and

to th row it in t h e r i v e r if somebody d i d n t

it immedia te ly .

MR YOUNG: How Mr. Coughl in does no t see t h a t



s he a r s a y , Your Honor

THE COURT: A l l r i .ght .

MR COUGHLIN: And I th i .nk i . t s

THE COURT: You a r e sayi .ng t h a t Ms. Watson sai .d

on t h e vi.deo?

MR COUGHLIN: Yes s i . r , wi.th Mr. Z a r a t e t h e r e .

I th i .nk i . t s r e l e v a n t to t h e e x t e n t t h a t

Z a ra t e t he n c l e a r l y appea r s to di .ssuade h e r from

cont rad i .c t i .ng what he a l l e g e d l y t o l d t h e pol i .ce

ni .ght and I bel i . eve t h e r e i.s i .ndi .cat i .ng a moti .ve on

p a r t to co v e r up t h e e x t e n t to whi.ch hi.s mi.ss ta tements

t h e pol i . ce r e s u l t e d i.n my a r r e s t .

THE COURT: A l l r i .gh t . I m goi.ng to sus ta i .n t h e

. Go ahead .

MR COUGHLIN: Your Honor I would no t e f o r t h e

I do be l i .eve I compli .ed wi.th t h e s t a t u t e wi.th

THE COURT: I bel i . eve you compli .ed excep t t h a t

di.d no t provi .de f o r t h e wi. tness f e e . But you

t h a t I wai.ved i . t whi.ch I s t i . l l h a v e n t seen o r

But even i .f I had t h e evi .dence i.s t h a t s h e s no

h e r e . So I d o n t know what

MR COUGHLIN: Well she w a s n t he r e t oday , i.s

THE COURT: No s h e s no l o n g e r i.n th i . s

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MR COUGHLIN: She i s . I conf i rmed t h a t s h e s a

a t McQueen High Schoo l .

THE COURT: Accord ing to t h e t e s t imony e a r l i e r

t h e r e i s t e s t i mony t h a t s h e s no l o n g e r .

MR COUGHLIN: Mr. L ic h ty , I r e c a l l him say i ng

e w a s n t aware o f he h a d n t t a lk e d t o he r in a ye a r .

THE COURT: And he a l s o i n d i c a t e d t h a t he

t h a t she had moved.

MR COUGHLIN: I d o n t r e c a l l th a t . I b e l i e v e

e i n d i c a t e d t o me t h a t no

THE COURT: Okay. Let me look a t t h e -

I d o n t have one f o r he r b u t I assume you have a

f o r he r . Do you have it w i th you?

MR COUGHLIN: I p r o v i d e d it to t h e Cour t , Your

THE COURT: Well t h e one t h a t I have d i d no t

it.

MR COUGHLIN: Would it be all r i g h t , Your

if I r ev iewed

THE COURT: Well , it d o e s n t m a t t e r r i g h t now.

am r u l i n g t h a t what she would have testified to would

been hea r say and a l s o pr obab l y not r e l e v a n t t o

o r no t it was a t h e f t . I know your a rgument

t h i s was found p r o p e r t y bu t what some t h i r d p a r t y



o r d i d n t do i s not going to be a t i s s u e i n t h i s c a s e

we f i n i s h it.

MR COUGHLIN: So if t h e phone was go ing to be

r i v e r bu t f o r someone s i n t e r v e n t i o n , that s not

on t h e f a c t whe the r or no t , compar ing -- someone s

up

TH COURT: If somebody s a i d t h a t , I d o n t know

o . 1 , t h a t t h e y d i d because it he a r s a y as o b j e c t e d to by

Young. So I m s u s t a i n i n g h i s o b j e c t i o n as t o he a r s a y .

even if it w a s n t he a r s a y , t h e bo t tom l i n e i s I d o n t

N o . 1 , if t h e pe r son would have done t h a t or no t .

know how t he y came i n t o p o s s e s s i o n o f t h e c e l l phone

t h i r d l y , you d i d c l a i m t h e phone f rom t h a t pe r son ,

to what I hea r d .

MR COUGHLIN: But if you had hea r d all t h e

f rom me t he n you would t h e n pe r haps r e c o n s i d e r

t h i s e x c i t e d u t t e r a n c e o r ( i n d i s c e r n i b l e ) .

THE COURT: No I r u l e d .

Okay. I ll a l low you to argue it. A l l r i g h t .

can argue any t h i ng you want bu t t h e bo t tom l i n e i s t h e

w i l l be what I dec i de on and t h a t i s not ev idence

t h e he a r s a y t e s t imony o f someone w h o s no t he r e and

if t h e y were he re , it would be still be he a r s a y .

MR COUGHLIN: Yes sir, Your Honor . And if

no t go ing to o f f e r to prove t h e m a t t e r a s s e r t e d bu t

I



t o d em o n s t r a t e a b i a s o r m o t i v e on t h i s w i t n e s s

t o s h u s h anybody who is s u g g e s t i n g someth ing t h a t i s

to what he t o l d t h e p o l i c e i n which a f f e c t e d a

a r r e s t .

THE COURT:Still

s u s t a i n e d . I t h i n kit s

a t

m a r g i n a l l y r e l e v a n t by some t a n g e n t i a l i s s u e to t h i s

which i s w h e t h e r o r n o t -- and I t o l d you t h i s t h r e e

-- w h e t h e r o r no t you d i d w i l l f u l l y and u n l a w f u l l y

t a k e and c a r r y away t h e p e r s o n a l p r o p e r t y o f

T h a t s one co u n t .

The o t h e r coun t ~ whe the r on o r abou t t h e

day o f August , you d i d w i l l f u l l y and u n law fu l p o s s e s s

r w i t h h e l d s t o l e n goods . A l l r i g h t . You can make any

you want .

MR COUGHLIN: Yes sir. If I c o u l d j u s t

-- t h i s isn t t h e r i g h t t im e -- b u t if he co u ld

i n d i c a t e , Your Honor r e s p e c t f u l l y , I b e l i e v e it

to t h e w i l l f u l n e s s a s p e c t o f -- and t h e a s p e c t o f

If someth ing i s go ing to be i n t h e r i v e r , I

one , it a r guab l y no -

THE COURT: You can , y o u r e done . A l l r i g h t .

a l r e a d y r u l e d on it t w i ce now

MR COUGHLIN: Perhaps it s j u s t my

Your Honor

THE COURT: Perhaps it is. But t h e bo t tom l i n e



s I have r u l e d and you can pr oceed .

MR COUGHLIN: Gran ted , b u t isn t t h e r e a

THE COURT: I m no t g e t t i n g t h r ough to you.

MR COUGHLIN: I m s o r r y , Your Honor bu t

THE COURT: I v e den i ed -- I v e s u s t a i n e d t h e

and den i ed your r e q u e s t f o r a con t i nuance to

in t h i s w i t n e s s . A l l r i g h t . Go ahead .

MR COUGHLIN: And I m no t a b l e to p r e s e r v e f o r

r e c o r d why -

THE COURT: You a l r e a d y have p r e s e r v e d f o r t h e

I t h i n k it s q u i t e a p p a r e n t . I unde r s t a nd what

a rgument is.

MR COUGHLIN: I j u s t want to ( I n d i s c e r n i b l e ) ,

a p p e l l a t e c o u r t might -

THE COURT: I d o n t know what t h e a p p e l l a t e

would do if y o u r e c o n v i c t e d .

MR COUGHLIN: Yes ( I n d i s c e r n i b l e )

THE COURT: Huh?

MR COUGHLIN: N e i t h e r do I .

THE COURT: A l l r i g h t . Wel l , ask your q u e s t i o n .

MR COUGHLIN:

Q Was t h e r e any t h i ng you hea r d , saw or w i tne s s e d

t h e e v e n t s in q u e s t i o n t h a t would make you t h i n k my

t h a t n i g h t was somehow d i f f e r e n t t h a n someone



up and gr abb i ng someth ing and runn ing away?

MR YOUNG: Your Honor o b j e c t i o n . I d o n t

t h e q u e s t i o n . It s i r r e l e v a n t , c a l l s fo r

One p o i n t in t h e r e he ask ed a n y t h i n g you

t h a t would c a l l f o r h e a r s a y .

THE COURT: Okay. Obje c t ion s u s t a i n e d .

MR COUGHLIN: Unless it s a s t a t e m e n t a g a i n s t

o r admiss ion

THE COURT: The s t a t e m e n t a g a i n s t i n t e r e s t o f

MR COUGHLIN: Well I -- maybe somebody e l s e

t h e ( I n d i s c e r n i b l e ) . I m a s k ing a p e r c i p i e n t

to tell us what he saw o r hea r d .

MR YOUNG: H e s a l r e a d y testified to t h a t .

and answered .

MR COUGHLIN: I d o n t b e l i e v e -

MR YOUNG: A month o r two months ago when he

he t e s t i f i e d what he saw.

MR COUGHLIN: And t h e Cour t n a r ro w ly

THE COURT: Okay. I w i l l -- you have 15 minu te s

So I ll a l low you to ask a q u e s t i o n t h a t he had

knowledge o f a t t he t ime , even if it was

because you have 15 mi nu t e s . So use your 15

as you t h i n k b e s t excep t to t h e e x t e n t t h a t



Young c e r t a i n l y has t h e r i g h t t o o b j e c t .


Y MR COUGHLIN:

Q Mr. Z a r a t e , was t h e r e a ny th ing abou t my conduc t

n i g h t t h a t , acco r d i ng to your m o ra l s and b e l i e f

would -

THE COURT: T h a t s no t a p r o p e r q u e s t i o n , sir.

wi t hou t an o b j e c t i o n , a c c o rd ing to h i s mora l s and

sys t em. The q u e s t i o n i s whe the r you v i o l a t e d t h e

o f t h e S t a t e o f Nevada and Washoe County.

MR COUGHLIN: Wel l , t h e i n t e n t goes to t h a t and

goes to t h a t .

THE COURT: Then ask him a q u e s t i o n which

I d o n t know how he can r e a d your mind bu t ask

a q u e s t i o n t h a t has to do wi t h p r o v i n g your de fe ns e .

MR COUGHLIN: He can r e a d my mind by my a c t i o n s

n i g h t -

THE COURT: Wel l , t hen ask him abou t your

s p e c i f i c .

MR COUGHLIN: T h a t s what I m t r y i n g to do.

THE COURT: Well y o u r e no t . You a r e a s k i n g

m o r a l i t y and o f e v e r y t h i n g e l s e .

MR COUGHLIN: Yes it b r i n g s t o b e a r h i s

on t h i n g s he testified t o .

THE COURT: It s no t h i s f e e l i n g s . You have to



Did I do t h i s ? Did I do t h a t -

MR COUGHLIN:

Q Did I do someth ing t h a t n i g h t

THE COURT: No. S p e c i f i c a l l y ask him someth ing

you d id o r would have done had you been c u l p a b l e I

I d o n t know what your argument i s bu t -

MR COUGHLIN:

Q From what you know about my a c t i o n s t h a t n i g h t ,

would you d i s t i n g u i s h them from someone who j u s t runs

p gr abs someth ing and s t e a l s and l e a v e s ?

MR YOUNG: Obje c t ion , Your Honor .

THE COURT: You can ask t h e q u e s t i o n , d i d I run

p d id I s t e a l it, d i d I l e a v e , whatever it i s t h a t you

t r y i n g to ask .

MR COUGHLIN: I m a s k in g

THE COURT: Not what some t h i r d pe r son might

done unde r t h e c i r c u m s t a n c e s . Okay. Did I t a k e -

MR COUGHLIN: T h a t s no t my q u e s t i o n . I want

ask more complex q u e s t i o n t h a t d e a l s wi t h a d eep e r

THE COURT: Wel l I m not go ing t o a l l ow you to

as to ph i l o sophy here , sir, o r m o r a l i t y . It s t h e

t h a t w e r e he r e -

MR COUGHLIN: I know it t h e law. Phi losophy

m o r a l i t y a r e t h e b a s i s o f l aw.



THE COURT: It may be b u t h e s n o t a p h i l o s o p h e r

r a l a w y e r . I want you to ask a q u e s t i o n o f f a c t .


Y MR COUGHLIN:

Q Did you a r e you aware o f a n y t h i n g I d i d t h a t

t h a t f a c t u a l l y i n d i c a t e s I r an up and g r a b b e d

and s t o l e it and r an o f f ?

A Yes. You c l a i m e d t h e phone f rom t h e first man

t h e n you tried to go away.

Q Hold on a second . Did you p e r s o n a l l y w i t n e s s me

t h e phone f rom t h e first man?

A Yes I d i d . I w i t n e s s e d you c l a i m t h e phone

him.

Q So if I have a v i d e o o f you s a y i n g you d i d n t

see it b u t you i n f e r r e d it f rom s u b s e q u e n t l y

t h e man o r s e e i n g me walk away f rom t h e man b u t

you d i d n t a c t u a l l y t e c h n i c a l ly , p e r s o n a l l y w i t n e s s

phone chang ing hands , would t h a t make your t e s t i m o n y

u n t r u t h f u l ?

MR YOUNG: Obj ec t i on , Your Honor

THE COURT: Yes it s j u s t - a g a i n , I t o l d you

if you have a p r i o r i n c o n s i s t e n t s t a t e m e n t o r

i n c o n s i s t e n t s t a t e m e n t , t h e n a s k him p r e c i s e l y

it i s t h a t he a l l e g e d l y s a i d b e f o r e .



MR COUGHLIN: Yes sir Your Honor .

Y MR COUGHLIN:

Q Tha t n i g h t , abou t seven days a f t e r I was

( i n d i s c e r n i b l e ) f rom jail d i d you a l l o w me to

you and ask you some q u e s t i o n s ?

A I d i d n t a u t h o r i z e it by any means b u t I was

my f r i e n d s , yes , when you were a s k i n g q u e s t i o n s .

Q Okay. Did you answer a q u e s t i o n o f mine to t h e

o f d i d you -

THE COURT: Not to t h e e f f e c t , e x a c t l y what it

y o u r e go ing t o c o n f r o n t him ask him what it was

he a l l e g e d l y s t a t e d .

Y MR COUGHLIN:

Q That n i g h t d i d I ask you w h e t h e r you p e r s o n a l l y

t h e phone change hands?

A Tha t n i g h t I d o n t r e c a l l a n s w e r i n g any o f your

Q Did you a t t e m p t t o s h u s h N i c o l e w atson o r

f rom answer ing any o f my q u e s t i o n s ?

A For t h e s a f e t y o f my f r i e n d s and m y se l f , yes , I

Q How so f o r t h e s a f e t y o f y o u r s e l f -

THE COURT: Okay. S i r , w e r e done . I s a i d you

ask him s p e c i f i c a l l y what it was t h a t he s a i d t h a t i s

to what h e s s a y i n g t o d a y .



MR COUGHLIN: Okay.

THE COURT: You ve y e t to do t h a t .

MR COUGHLIN: And seemed l i k e he okay .

MR COUGHLIN:

Q That n i g h t about seven days a f t e r t h e a r r e s t ,

you s p e c i f i c a l l y i n d i c a t e t h a t you p e r s o n a l l y

t h e phone chang ing hands?

A I d o n t b e l i e v e I ~ n d i c t e d a ny th ing in t h a t

I do not r e c a l l answer ing any o f your

MR COUGHLIN: Again , I would l i k e to fo r an

o f p roo f , Your Honor, I would l i k e to o f f e r a v ideo

Mr. Z a ra t e admi t s and I cove r ed t h i s in my

and I t yped out t h e words t h a t were used in t h a t

and t h e ques t i on -

THE COURT: Well , you have your b r i e f so -

You can come up and g e t it.

MR COUGHLIN: I d o n t know if -

THE COURT: Huh?

MR COUGHLIN: I m so l i m i t e d in t ime , Your

-

THE COURT: Your mot ion f o r d i s m i s s a l ,

o f l aw.

MR COUGHLIN: Something in t h e r e c o r d .

THE COURT: Wel l , some th ing in t h e r e c o r d .



MR COUGHLIN: I b e l i e v e t h e memorandum o f law

it s in t h e mot ion o f d i s m i s s a l because I f e l t it was

o key bu t , t h e r e i s a pas sage in t h e r e where t h e r e i s a

I b e l i e v e it s e n t i t l e d v i deo 0100 where in

Rober t Dawson whom I might a l s o q u i c k l y j u s t say I

I pr ope r l y subpoenaed him and t h e r e i s a b a s i s fo r

c on t inua nc e ( I n d i s c e r n ib l e ) and I ll move on where in he

Mr. Z a r a t e a long wi th Ms. Watson and Bying ton ,

Dawson C o l to n Temple ton a r e t h e r e where in Mr. Za ra t e

he d i d n t p e r s o n a l l y e ye wi tne s s t he phone

hands wi th t he man wi th t he 6-pack to me bu t

it due to -

THE COURT: Wel l ask him t h a t . Did he s t a t e

he d i d n t p e r s o n a l l y wi tne s s bu t i n f e r r e d it.

Y MR COUGHLIN:

Q Did you?

A Wel l t h i s t o o k p l a c e a ye a r ago so d e t a i l s a r e

little b i t fuzzy . However I do remember Mr Coughl in

t h e man and t he n a few moments l a t e r I

on h i s b i ke l ook ing a t t he c e l l phone and a t

p o i n t we were u n c e r t a i n o f whose phone it was. A f t e r

e s t a r t e d to p i e c e t o g e th e r t h e i n fo rmat i on that s when

went and t r i e d to go c l a i m it f rom him.




MR COUGHLIN:

Q So would it be f a i r to say in t h a t r e sponse you

t h a t you d i d n t p e r s o n a l l y w i t n e s s t h e phone

hands from t h e man

THE COURT: If he p e r s o n a l l y w i t n e s s e d you wi th

phone a f t e r -

MR COUGHLIN: T h a t s no t what I m a s k i n g . I m

whe the r - r e c e i v i n g i s one o f t h e e l e me n t s . There

be i n f e r e n c e o f r e c e i v i n g b u t -

THE COURT: I n f e r e n c e o f r e c e i v i n g ?

MR. COUGHLIN: Yes.

THE COURT: The Cour t makes t h e i n f e r e n c e s bu t

e t e s t i f i e d t h a t he saw you t a l k to t h e man and he saw

d r i v e away wi th t h e phone a f t e r w a r d s , a f t e r t h e man

h e l d up t h e phone.

MR COUGHLIN: Righ t b u t when t h e

THE COURT: And I have a -- huh?

MR COUGHLIN: When t h e D.A. asked him a

it s a l o t s t r onge r , yes , I -- and you q u e r i e d

Your Honor and it was very i n s i g h t f u l f o r you to do

You s a i d wai t a second , you p e r s o n a l l y eyewi t nes sed

and t h i s wi tne s s a t t h a t t im e when he was t h e D.A. s

it s yes -

THE COURT: Once a ga in , h e s s a y ing in e s s e nc e ,

made a c onc lus ion b u t h e s c l a r i f y i n g it now f o r t h e



t h a t he made an i n f e r e n c e .

MR COUGHLIN: T h a t s k i nd o f key b ecau se you as

judge in t h i s c o u r t asked him under p e n a l t y o f

p r e v i o u s l y , wai t , you p e r s o n a l l y eyewi t nes sed

And a t t h a t t im e t h i s wi tne s s who has hada

mot ive

to be found as someone who a f f e c t e d a wrongfu l a r r e s t

r -

THE COURT: What mot ive?

MR COUGHLIN: Because if I say someth ing t h a t

somebody s life and g e t s them a r r e s t e d wr ongf u l l y ,

I -- I w i l l be brought to j u s t i c e because o f it I

have a mot ive to t r y to preven t t h a t f rom coming to

THE COURT: If you were a r r e s t e d wr ongf u l l y

we h a v e n t d e t e rm in ed y e t , so But if you s t o l e t h e

phone it w a s n t wrongfu l , r i g h t .

MR COUGHLIN: We d o n t know now t h a t it was a

and gr ab job and run o f f o r if somebody found it

have th rown it i n t h e r i v e r and somebody sa id , You

what r a t h e r t han have t h a t phone be in t h e r i v e r

downtown Reno

THE COURT: You a r e a rgu ing and t e s t i f y i n g

MR COUGHLIN: I know. I m s o r r y , Your Honor .

THE COURT: If you want to testify you a r e f r e e



t e s t i f y .

MR COUGHLIN: I w i l l . I w i l l a b s o l u t e l y


THE COURT: You have f i v e minu te left w i th t h i s

So do what you want to do.

MR COUGHLIN: Al l r i g h t . Can I impeach h i s

by showing some o f t h e v i deo?

THE COURT: I v e a l r e a d y co n c lu d ed t h a t h i s

t oday i s c o n s i s t e n t wi t h what you s a i d you d id .

MR COUGHLIN: Yes sir, yes , sir.

MR COUGHLIN:

Q Did you see t h e phone l i g h t up -- what happened

where were you ( I n d i s c e r n i b l e ) .

A I -- i s t h e r e any way I can draw a p i c t u r e ?

THE COURT: Wel l he has p i c t u r e s h e r e . There

one - d i d you t a k e my p i c t u r e s , s i r ?

MR COUGHLIN: I d o n t b e l i e v e so , Your Honor

I have - if I d id , I ll l ook .

THE COURT: Are t h e r e e x h i b i t numbers on t h e

THE CLERK: Yes.


THE COURT: I have t h i s one . Let me t a k e t h o s e



Y MR. COUGHLIN:

Q Mr. Z a ra t e d i d you testify t h a t -

THE COURT: Hang on Mr. Cough l in , because t h e

a r e no t here .

MR. COUGHLIN: Well t h e n I ll move on b ecau se

t im e i s l i m i t e d , Your Honor .

Y MR. COUGHLIN:

Q You t e s t i f i e d t h a t -

THE COURT: We have E x h i b i t 6. So he can look

one . T h a t s t h e one t h a t you r e f e r r e d to bu t if

e d o n t have t hem you must .

MR. COUGHLIN: Can I j u s t -- can we j u s t use one

f t h e s e p i c t u r e I have

THE COURT: Wel l we have E x h i b i t 6 t h e one

t a l k i n g abou t .

MR. COUGHLIN: Okay. Gre a t .

MR. COUGHLIN:

Q Can you ho l d t h a t up Mr. Z a r a t e , and i n d i c a t e

you were a t t h e p o i n t in t im e t h a t it was d i s c o v e r e d

t h e phone was m iss in g ?

A Sure . I was r i g h t a round h e r e i n t h i s a r e a

MR. COUGHLIN: Let t h e r e c o r d r e f l e c t that s

o f a nor th w e s t e r l y p a r t o f t h e l edge on t h e



MR YOUNG: Looks l i k e t h e s ou thwe s t e rn p a r t -


THE COURT: Which s ide?

THE WITNESS: I was s i t t i n g t h e r e s t h a t

t h a t runs a c r o s s next t o t h e ground where I was

r i g h t a round h e r e when I first w i t n e s s e d them

THE COURT: So t h e n o r t h o f t h e r i v e r a t t h e

o f t h e c i r c l e on t h e uppe r n o r t h edge o f t h e

THE WITNESS: Yes.


MR COUGHLIN:

Q That would be k i nd o f t h e n o r t h w e s t e r l y p a r t o f

pa rk .

Where was Mr Goble a t t h a t t ime?

A He f rom what I remember he was up on t h e o t h e r

around t h i s a r e a c l o s e r to t h e movie t h e a t e r .

Q So he was on t h e w e s t e r l y s i d e ?

A D i r e c t i o n .

Q Okay. Near V i r g i n i a S t r e e t Okay. So a t t h a t

you cou l d he a r Mr. t h i s man see t h e h a t . Where

he f i n d t h e ha t ?

A The man found it on t h e ground a c r o s s f rom where

was c l o s e r to t h e trailer. Right around t h i s a r e a .



Q Okay. Show t h a t to t h e Judge where you a r e

A It was r i g h t a round he re by t h e trailer

Q Okay. So was j u s t k i nd o f on t h e ground t h e r e

n t h e c o n c r e t e ?

A Yes I b e l i e v e h i s phone and h i s h a t were

Q It w a s n t on t h e l edge?

No. There i s no t a l edge o v e r t h e r e .

Q Okay. So t h e phone was k i nd o f on t h e ground ,

Reno 11 :30 a t n igh t , Sa tu rda y , 15 p e r c e n t f ou r

in a row. Phone was on t h e -- phone was on t h e

downtown Reno?

A Yes t h e r e was

Q Someone p i c k e d it up

THE COURT: You have one minu te left

MR COUGHLIN:

Q Someone p ic ke d it up and o f f e r e d it and Cory

h e a r him o f f e r it up to anybody?

MR YOUNG: O b j e c t i o n . He d o e s n t have p e r s o n a l

o f it

MR COUGHLIN: Wel l , he m ig h t .

MR YOUNG: He d o e s n t .

MR COUGHLIN:

Q Did you see him o f f e r it up and w i t n e s s whe the r



r no t Cory was aware o f i t ?

A I d i d n o t . We r e c o g n i z e d C o r y s h a t and that s

we saw first and that s when we c l a im ed it fo r Cory

we knew it was h i s . However we d i d n t know he

h i s phone w i th him o r no t and t h e nthat s

when t h e man

in w i th t h e same s t o r y .

Q Cory d i d n t ap p ea r by h i s manner be aware enough

r c l o s e enough t o h i s phone

A No he was on t h e o t h e r s i d e o f t h e

Q That would be nea r V i r g i n i a S t r e e t . Was t h a t

t h e Jeep was pa rked?

A I d o n t r e c a l l where he was pa r ked t h a t n i g h t .

Q Okay. And d id you make a c a l l -- how d i d you -

I b e l i e v e you t e s t i f i e d you i n f e r r e d t h e phone was

by. e and t h e n a t t h a t p o i n t , what happened? Did

c a l l somebody o r d i d you run over and do someth ing

me o r what happened?

A We asked you k i n d l y f o r t h e phone back and we

j u s t go our s e p a r a t e ways a f t e r t h a t and t h e n you

Q So you went f rom h e r e and you r a n a f t e r me?

A No you s t a r t e d -- you t r i e d t o ge t away on your

Q Who approached me first?

A I b e l i e v e it was Cory.



Q But not you?

I d i d not approach you first, no.

Q Okay. Did you wi tne s s t h e phone l i g h t i n g up in

pocke t ?

I d id .

Q Where were you when t h a t happened?

On t h e br idge and I would p o i n t t h a t out if you

me to -

Q T h a t s where y o u r e s a y ing I was?

T h a t s when I -- that s where you were when I

t h e phone l i g h t up in t h e poc ke t .

Q Where were you when you saw it?

I was pr obab l y two t h r e e f e e t away from t h e r e .

Q You w e r e n t on t h e o t h e r s i d e o f t h e park?

No. I was r i g h t i n f r o n t o f you.

Q Isn t t h a t what you testified a t t h e p r e v i o u s

t h a t you obse r ved me from t h e o t h e r s i d e o f t h e

and t h e phone l i g h t i n g up in my pocke t all t h e way

on t h e br idge?

I d o n t b e l i e v e t h a t , sir. I b e l i e v e I

t h a t we e n c i r c l e d you so you cou l d no t l e a ve on

b r i d g e and you had -- and that s when I wi tne s s e d my

c a l l i n g C o r y s phone and t he n t h e phone l i g h t i n g up

your poc ke t .

Q ( I n d i s c e r n i b l e ) ?



A I m n o t s u r e , I d o n t remember .

THE COURT: Okay. Times up. I ll a l l ow one

q u e s t i o n if you have it.

MR. COUGHLIN: Yes Your Honor .

YMR. COUGHLIN:

Q What was t h e f u l l e x t e n t o f your c o n v e r s a t i o n s

t h e Reno P o l i c e Depar tment t h a t n i g h t ?

THE COURT: The f u l l e x t e n t ? You can ask , no t a

MR. COUGHLIN: Wel l , Your Honor t h e pre v ious

i n d i c a t e d t h a t it w o u l d n t t a k e t o o l o n g to tell

MR. YOUNG: If it p r e v i o u s t e s t i m o n y , it s been

and answered .

THE COURT: Wel l I ll a l l ow t h e one q u e s t i o n .

THE WITNESS: When t h e p o l i c e a r r i v e d I

m y se l f b ecau se I knew what happened and a f t e r

I b e l i e v e he took Mr. Goble and myse l f a s i d e and I

wi tne s s e d what happened , I ll answer any q u e s t i o n s

have. But a f t e r t h a t I f o r g e t , I don t know who t h e

o f f i c e r was bu t he came up and I j u s t f i l l e d ou t a

and I d i d n t d i s c u s s any f a c t s o f t h e case

him .

MR. COUGHLIN: One f o l l ow- up , Your Honor .

THE COURT: No. I s a i d one q u e s t i o n .




THE COURT: Wai t . The S t a t e have any c r o s s ?

MR YOUNG: No, Your Honor .

THE COURT: Are t h e r e any o t h e r p i c t u r e s down

s i r ?

THE WITNESS: I d o n ' t see them, sir.

THE COURT: You have t h e c o p i e s b ecau se none o f

a r e h e r e .

MR YOUNG: I b e l i e v e t h e r e were fou r p h o to s

THE CLERK: There were .

MR COUGHLIN: I ll look f o r t h o s e

THE COURT : We have t h e one , 6.

MR COUGHLIN: P o s s i b l e ( I n d i s c e r n i b l e )

THE COURT: It s p o s s i b l e because t h e y a r e

no t he r e and we d i d no t t a k e them.

MR COUGHLIN:

Q Mr. Z a r a t e , i s t h e r e any k i nd o f m i l l i n g

-

THE COURT: I have t h e d i s c s , t h e CDs. They

left up h e r e .

THE CLERK: They were CDs. It says r i g h t

-

THE COURT: You need to b r i n g t h e CDs back up.

MR COUGHLIN: Yes, sir. Can I j u s t e n t e r them



i n t o ev id en ce?

THE COURT: They a r e not e n t e r e d i n t o ev i dence .

p a r t o f one o f them i s so f a r .

THE CLERK: We o n ly have p a r t o f No. 1 i n t o

I marked more t ha n t h a t

THE COURT: There were f ou r marked.

THE CLERK: There were fou r marked and t he n we

f ou r pho t os which t h r e e a r e mis s ing now. And t hen we

more CDs marked.

THE COURT: Well , t h i s i s t h e on l y pho to t h a t

a c t u a l l y t a l k e d abou t .

THE CLERK: I marked fou r .

THE COURT: I know.

THE CLERK: And e n t e r e d fou r i n t o ev i dence .

MR COUGHLIN: I had f ou r o f one pho t o . I found

t I m s o r r y .

THE COURT: Those a r e t h e e x h i b i t s , ye s .

MR COUGHLIN: They a r e pa pe r , no t t h a t g l o s s y

( I n d i s c e r n i b l e )

THE COURT: A l l r i g h t . Thank you

A l l r i g h t . Mr. Young.

R YOUNG: I have no q u e s t i o n s o f t h i s wi tness .

THE COURT: A l l r i g h t . Y o u r e f r e e t o go sir

MR COUGHLIN: Thank you Mr. Z a r a t e .

THE COURT: Do you have any o t h e r wi tne s s e s ?



MR COUGHLIN: Yes, sir and I have t he c i t a t i o n

t h e aud io cued up and what you t o l d me you go ahead

t h e w i t n e s s f ees and t h e 48 minu te mark o f file

on t h e October 22nd. I m s o r r y , Your Honor , I m

my t h o u g h t s and you might have a l r e a d y t o l d me

r u l e d on t h i s I would l i k e t o c a l l Ni co l e Watson

Rober t Dawson bu t t h e y f a i l e d t o appea r d e s p i t e -- I m

if y o u v e a l r e a d y r u l e d on t h i s , Your Honor . I m

k i nd o f -- ( I nd i s c e r n ib l e ) I v e no t go t much s l e e p

even t hough b a r h e a r i n g was l a s t week, t h e r e has

a l o t o f pos t h e a r i n g work w i t n e s s .

THE COURT: Well , t h e y a r e not here . But

let me h e a r what you have on t h e t a pe . You can

t h a t .

MR COUGHLIN: Could I p l a y t h e t a p e o f Nicole

THE COURT: No. You have my o r d e r . You s a i d -

MR COUGHLIN: Yes, sir yes , sir.

THE COURT: You s a i d it was cued up and ready to


Tape p la y ing . )

THE COURT: B r in g it up here .

MR COUGHLIN: Yes, sir. If I c ou ld j u s t

Do you want me to b r i n g it up t h e r e , sir so I



h e a r it.

THE COURT: If I cou l d h e a r it I d o n t c a r e

it i s .

Tape p l a y e d . )

THE COURT:Okay. S i r , what

Iwas t a l k i n g abou t

I would waive t h e s e r v i c e c o s t by t h e s h e r i f f which we

do t h r ough t h e in fo rma p a u p e r i s . e have no means o f

a w i tne s s f e e s o r p r o v i d i n g t h e w i t n e s s f ees . e

no fund f o r t h a t bu t we do have t h e a b i l i t y to o r d e r

s h e r i f f to s e r v e a subpoena w i t h o u t payment . Now

even know if you f i l e d a mot ion f o r in fo rma p a u p e r i s

waive t h e s e r v i c e f ee .

MR COUGHLIN: I b e l i e v e I f i l e d a mot ion f o r

p a u p e r i s and

THE COURT: You f i l e d t h e mot ion f o r i n fo rma

bu t whe the r you f i l e d one s i n c e t h a t day

t h e s e r v i c e f e e s . But be t h a t as it may, I d i d

waive t h e wi tne s s f ee . In f a c t , I s p e c i f i c a l l y s a i d

c o n t r a r y . I f you l i s t e n to it.

MR COUGHLIN: May I b e l i e v e I h e a r d you

say , waive t h e wi tne s s f e e . Your Honor ,

THE COURT: By t h a t I meant t h e s e r v i c e f ees .

-- okay . If you l i s t e n to t h a t a g a i n , y o u l l he a r

I s a i d .

I

I



MR COUGHLIN: Okay. Your Honor I ll p r e s e r v e

I b e l i e v e I r e a s ona b ly r e l i e d upon t h e r e a s o n a b l e

t h a t was no t -

THE COURT: Reasonab le i n t e r p r e t a t i o n when I

t h e Cour t has no funds t o pay w i t n e s s e s ?

MR COUGHLIN: Wel l , I t h i n k t h a t goes to where

l a t e r s a i d t h a t I may d e f e r t h a t and make you pay them

THE COURT: Yeah I s a i d I may d e f e r it.

MR COUGHLIN: I b e l i e v e you s a i d

me pay it l a t e r . But you were d e f i n i t e l y

to me sir, a l lowing me to a t t e m p t to g e t

t r u t h ou t t h e r e .

THE COURT: Okay

MR COUGHLIN: Even t hough I m i n d i g e n t .

THE COURT: But t h e problem i s t h i s , sir.

does no t have to respond a b s e n t a w i t n e s s f ee

advanced .

MR COUGHLIN: Wel l sir, I d o n t have to show

p f o r Mr. C i t y A t to r n e y s cau se e m a i l i n g me n o t i c e o f a

b u t -

THE COURT: You d i d n t . You d i d n t have to show

MR COUGHLIN: Wel l , he t o l d me you s a i d I d i d

I d i d .



THE COURT: No I s a i d .


THE COURT: What I s a i d was I wanted to make

you were s e rve d one way o r t h e o t h e r . So I s a i d t h a t

a d d i t i o n t o s e r v i n g you by r e g u l a r s e r v i c e t h a t he

to g e t ho l d o f you by ema i l because I do know

how you communica te wi th t h e C our t .

MR COUGHLIN: And he seems t o have i n t e r p r e t e d

to a u t h o r i z e s e r v i c e -


THE COURT: So you w o u l d n t have been here , so

w o u l d n t have had any say a t all. I would have j u s t

t h e o r d e r wi thou t t h e say .

MR COUGHLIN: Wel l t y p i c a l l y

THE COURT: You w o u l d n t -

MR COUGHLIN: ( I n d i s c e r n i b l e ) you s a i d

I w o u l d n t have been h e r e because you d i d n t have

d i d n t have p e r s o n a l j u r i s d i c t i o n , you c o u l d n t dr ag

i n t o t h e s t a t e -

THE COURT: Okay. S i r . So I d i d n t dr ag you

it s t a t e . I gave you t h e o p p o r t u n i t y to argue

a mot ion which was made -

MR COUGHLIN: I see where you say t h a t , Your

-

THE COURT: p r o p e r l y and in a d d i t i o n I gave



a chance to respond by l a s t Thursday and so f a r as I m

t h e r e sponse was to some e x t e n t okay and to some

it was nonrespons ive . But t o t h e e x t e n t t h a t it

r e spons ive I d id o r d e r t h a t t h o s e subpoenas I would

r u l i n g on and w e r e now a t t h a t p o i n t .

MR COUGHLIN And if I -

THE COURT And I m f ind ing as a m a t t e r o f f a c t

I d i d not a u t h o r i z e you to s e r v e subpoenas wi t hou t

t h e wi tne s s f e e s . I d i d i n d i c a t e t h a t we have

o funds to pay them bu t t h a t I would a l low you to s e rve

wi thou t co s t . The bo t tom l i n e i s I d i d r u l e t h a t

peop l e were s e rve d bu t I am f i n d i n g t h a t t h e y were

p r o f f e r e d t h e w i t n e s s f e e s . By your own t e s t imony you

you d i d no t i n c l u d e a check f o r t h e s e pe op le .

MR COUGHLIN Your Honor may I p l a y t h a t

a ga in

THE COURT No you may no t . I a l r e a d y hea r d

Y o u l l have whatever argument you have i s r e s e r v e d

t he f u t u r e .

MR YOUNG Your Honor one t h i n g f o r t h e

o f t h e r e c o r d t h a t I would l i k e to pu t on t h e

wi th r e spe c t t o t h e mot ion to c o n t i n u e by

Coughl in due to Ms. W atson s nonappearance here , one

f t h e r e qu i r e me n t s to ge t a c on t inua nc e i s to show t h a t

t e s t imony o r t h e p u r p o r t e d t e s t imony would have some



on t h e case .

From e v e r y t h i n g w e v e h e a r d f rom Mr. Coughl in

t h e a t t e m p t s to g e t Ms. W atso n s t e s t i m o n y , o r what

would say i n , I would o b j e c t to it a s he a r s a y anyway

it would no t be coming i n . So in a d d i t i o n t o

you a r e s a y i n g t h e r e i s no b a s i s to c on t inue to

h e r

THE COURT: I a l r e a d y r u l e d on t h a t .


MR YOUNG: I j u s t want t h a t on t h e r eco rd .

THE COURT: - it was h e a r s a y .

MR COUGHLIN: To t h e e x t e n t , Mr. Young s making

if I may i n d i c a t e , Your Honor, t h a t one o f t h e

i s f rom ano the r , some th ing t h a t is abou t to be

i n t h e t r a s h can -

THE COURT: Well , y o u l l be a b l e to a rg u e t h a t .

t a l k i n g abou t t h e o n ly t h i n g I m r u l i n g on r i g h t

I m deny ing your mot ion to c o n t i n u e . B r in g i n t h e s e

t h e two w i t n e s s e s .


THE COURT: Do you have any o t h e r w i t n e s s e s ,

y o u r s e l f if you wish to t e s t i f y ?

MR COUGHLIN: Yes, sir. And I do i n t e n d to

bu t I a l s o would l i k e to p u t on e v i d e n c e p r i o r to



THE COURT: Evidence o f what , s i r ?

MR COUGHLIN: Oh t h e v i d e o s .

THE COURT: Y o u l l need t o t e s t i f y . So I d o n t

what

MR COUGHLIN:Wel l , because somebody needs to

it?

THE COURT: Yeah. Someone needs to a u t h e n t i c a t e

You s a i d you were p r e s e n t when t h e v i d e o s were made

I would tell you t h i s . Again , any v i d e o made a f t e r

f a c t , u n l e s s you can show d i r e c t l y t h e r e l e v a n c e , I m

to admi t it in ev i dence , all r i g h t . Even if you

it. A l l r i g h t .

MR COUGHLIN: Okay.

THE COURT: Are you r ead y to go?

MR COUGHLIN: Yes S i r - okay . Yes. Al l

If I may -

MR YOUNG: Your Honor wi t h r e s p e c t to

Coughl in t e s t i f y i n g , he has i n d i c a t e d t h a t he - I

he i n d i c a t e d he wishes to t e s t i f y . I would ask

t h e Cour t can v ass Mr. Cough l in t h a t he has t h e

s t i tu t i o n a l r i g h t to remain -

THE COURT: Wel l , I t hough t I a l r e a d y had . But

-

MR YOUNG: Wel l , I m n o t s u r e t h a t we have .

I u n d e r s t a n d Mr. Cough l in proba b ly knows h i s r i g h t s



we

THE COURT Okay. S i r .

MR YOUNG For pur poses o f t h i s case , we need

pu t t h i s on t he r e c o r d .

THE COURTS i r ,

Ido have

as tandby counse l

f o r one t h i n g and w e l l if you wish , I ll a l low

to c o n s u l t wi t h him b e f o r e you waive your

n s t i t u t io n a l r i g h t to remain s i l e n t and you unde r s t a nd

have t h e c o n s t i t u t i o n a l r i g h t to remain s i l e n t ; i s

c o r r e c t ?

MR COUGHLIN Yes sir, I do. The on l y e x t e n t

which I m somewhat u n c l e a r on t h a t i s when a de f endan t

proc e e d ing pro se , t h e r e i s a split in t h e c a s e law

r e s p e c t to whether t he y a r e making sworn t e s t imony o r

s imply o f f e r i n g argument o r q u e s t i o n s such as

do a t t i mes -

THE COURT Well if y o u r e o f f e r i n g ev idence ,

a r e t e s t i f y i n g . I f you a r e a r g u i n g t h e f a c t s t h a t

been a d m i t t e d in ev idence , t hen you a r e a c t i n g as an

pr o s e .

MR COUGHLIN Yes sir. And I ll j u s t no te

Judge Nash Holmes swore me a t t h e b e g i n n i n g o f t h a t

a t i s s u e because she i n d i c a t e d , I b e l i e v e , somewhat

way it k i nd o f ha ms t r ings t h e defense , t h a t she

t h a t t h e pro se de fe nda n t s t e n d t o t e s t i f y -



THE COURT: I d o n t a g re e wi th t h a t p o s i t i o n .

p o s i t i o n i s you a r e a c t i n g an a t t o r n e y -

MR COUGHLIN: I m not s u r p r i s e d you say t h a t ,

THE COURT: If you wish , if you wish to argue

f a c t s t h a t have been a d m i t t e d in e v ide nc e you may do

o wi thou t t e s t i f y i n g . I f you wish to s t a t e f a c t s t h a t

not in ev i dence t h e n y o u l l need to t e s t i f y .

MR COUGHLIN: I m not s u r p r i s e d you s a y t h a t ,

and I d o n t b e l i e v e you a r e a l i f e l o n g p r o s e c u t o r

a l o t o f judges and that s someth ing I r e a l l y

abou t you sir.

THE COURT: Okay a p p r e c i a t e it o r n o t . T h a t s

r u l i n g . So t h e bo t tom l i n e t hough you have t h e r i g h t

remain s i l e n t . Do you wish to e x e r c i s e your r i g h t to

s i l e n t ?

MR COUGHLIN: No I d o n t t h i n k so , sir.

it s -

THE COURT: Then do you wish to c o n s u l t wi th

L e s l i e b e f o r e you make t h a t d e t e r m i n a t i o n ?

MR COUGHLIN: Normal ly I would because

L e s l i e i s w e l l s p r i n g o f i n fo rma t ion and p r o f e s s i o n a l

but it seems as t hough you s e t somewhat o f an

p o i n t fo r t h i s and where to t h e e x t e n t w e r e runn ing

a g a i n s t it, I m j u s t k i nd o f -



THE COURT: Wel l , t h e end p o i n t in your case i s

you testify to some th ing t h a t i s no t r e l e v a n t . But

t h a n t h a t , I w i l l a l low you to t e s t i f y .

MR COUGHLIN: If -

THE COURT:Mr. L e s l i e .

MR LESLIE: I if I may p r o v i d e some i n p u t , Your

H e s been a d v i s e d o f h i s r i g h t to testify o r not

as h i s f i f t h amendment. H e s been a d v i s e d o f t h e

consequences and I p r o v i d e d him n o t i f i c a t i o n o f

If he wants to c o n s u l t wi t h me f r a n k l y , t h e r e i s

a l o t o f r o c k e t s c i e n c e to it. I v e c o n s u l t e d wi th

p r e v i o u s l y b e f o r e you pu t me as s t andby counse l so it

u l d n t t a k e more t ha n a minu te o r two.

THE COURT: Also -

MR LESLIE: H e s had months t o mul l t h i s over .

THE COURT: Okay. But , a l s o , sir I m go ing to

you t h e o p p o r t u n i t y a t t h i s t ime , if you wish , to

Mr. L e s l i e a c t as your a t t o r n e y f o r t h e pur poses o f

exami na t i on if you want to testify.

MR COUGHLIN: No d i s r e s p e c t to Mr. L e s l i e , sir

I p r e f e r to pr oceed as I i n t e n d e d t o .

THE COURT: Okay. You u n d e r s t a n d t h a t if you do

t h e s t a n d you can be c r os s - exami ned?

MR COUGHLIN: Yes sir. Yes sir I do.

THE COURT: You u n d e r s t a n d e v e r y t h i n g you say



and w i l l be used a g a i n s t you i n t h e s e p r o c e e d i n g s ?


THE COURT: And can be u sed in your f avo r as

MR COUGHLIN:Yes Your Honor . I j u s t d o n t

to t h e e x t e n t , if t h e shoe was on t h e o t h e r foo t and

Young sough t to i n t r o d u c e a v i deo r i g h t now I m a

u n c l e a r , would he need a w i t n e s s t o a u t h e n t i c a te

Could he ask t h e Cour t to t a k e j u d i c i a l n o t i c e ?

he c e r t i f y it as an o f f i c e r -

THE COURT: No. He would

MR COUGHLIN: o f t h e C our t .

THE COURT: No he would have a w i t n e s s to

it.

MR COUGHLIN: He would?

THE COURT: Yes.

MR COUGHLIN: Even if he h i m s e l f f i l med t h e

THE COURT: If he h i m s e l f f i lme d it he cou l d

be t h e a t t o r n e y in t h e case . You a r e in a d i f f e r e n t

You c a n t be an a t t o r n e y and a w i t n e s s in a

nor ma l l y .

MR COUGHLIN: Unless y o u r e a one-man band .

THE COURT: Wel l , l i k e you a r e .

MR COUGHLIN: Yes.



THE COURT: But t h e normal r u l e i s if you know

go ing to be a wi tne s s in a c a se and you ' r e an

you a r e supposed t o t r y and wi thdraw from t h a t

Tha t ' s t h e normal r u l e .

MR COUGHLIN: Yes.

THE COURT: But t h i s i s a s p e c i a l s i t u a t i o n ,

Are you r eady to proceed?

MR COUGHLIN: I am sir. So if I cou ld j u s t

I hope t h e Cour t s ee s t h a t I 'm t r y i n g to b r i s k up

pace and be cogn i zan t o f t h e f a c t -

THE COURT: Ac tua l l y I don ' t want to start r i g h t

we ' r e t a k i ng a -

MR COUGHLIN: Well , h e r e ' s my po s i t i o n t h a t if

o ' c l o ck comes i s t h a t it? Or -

THE COURT: S i r , I ll de t e rmine a t t h a t t ime if

do ing someth ing t h a t i s r e l ev an t to t h i s case .

MR COUGHLIN: Okay.

THE COURT: And you ' l l be ab l e t o t e s t i f y as

a s you ' r e t e s t i f y i n g t o someth ing r e l ev an t and

admis s ib l e , I ll a l l ow you to testify.

MR COUGHLIN: Thank you. Your Honor .

THE COURT: But to t h e ex t e n t it s ob j e c t e d t o

I r u l e , I s u s t a i n t h e ob j e c t i on , t h en you ' l l no t be

to t e s t i f y .

MR COUGHLIN: Okay. In t h a t ve in , Your Honor



I

would l i k e t o o f f e r i n t o ev i dence m a t e r i a l s I v e newly

p r o v i d e d by t h e Reno C i t y A t t o r n e y , Mr. Skau in

wi th your d i r e c t i o n and he was g r a c i o u s l y ,

him g i v i n g t h a t Econ -

THE COURT: S i r , y o u l l need t o t e s t i f y .

MR COUGHLIN: Okay. So I do need to t e s t i f y

THE COURT: Wel l y o u l l -

MR COUGHLIN: And that s f a i r because you would

Mr. Young have a w i t n e s s to it so -

THE COURT: Wel l , if y o u r e go i ng to o f f e r

in e v ide nc e . I j u s t to l d you t h a t t h r e e t imes .

MR COUGHLIN: I m s o r r y , Your Honor .

MR YOUNG: For t h e r eco rd , it s no t t h a t

Cough l in h i m s e l f needs t o testify

THE COURT: No I u n d e r s t a n d t h a t . He can -

MR COUGHLIN: For him to admi t e v ide nc e , he

a w i t n e s s and if Mr. Cough l in has no t pu t t h i s

ev i dence on wi t h any o t h e r w i t n e s s e s he c a l l e d

it f a l l s to him. But he ha s , l i k e you s a i d , t h e

t o remain s i l e n t and t h a t c ou ld no t be h e l d a g a i n s t

i r r e s p e c t i v e o f what ev i dence he wants to pu t in

THE COURT: And a l s o , sir, t h e o t h e r t h i n g , j u s t

you t e s t i f y d o e s n t make ev i dence a d m i s s i b l e t h a t



not o t h e r w i s e be a d m i s s i b l e . It s go t t o be

t h a t you have p e r s o n a l knowledge of , t h a t you

e i t h e r a w i t n e s s to o r o the rw i e . But some o f t h e s e

I may admi t I mean if it w i l l e x p e d i t e

-- a r e you t a l k i n g about t h e Econ r e c o r d s be ing t h e

t r a n s c r i p t o f t h e phone c a l l -- I mean o f t h e 9-1 -1

MR COUGHLIN: I have t h e l o g , t h e t y p ed -o u t

f o r somet ime . They r e v e a l n o t h i n g about a p o s s i b l e

I do have t h e aud io -- I b e l i e v e

THE COURT: You a l r e a d y p l a y e d t h a t .

MR COUGHLIN: No d i f f e r e n t , where you s a i d you

-- t h e p o s s i b i l i t y o f r e v i s i t i n g your r u l i n g on

t o s upp re s s and t o t h e e x t e n t to which t h i s newly

m a t e r i a l which I b e l i e v e r e a l l y i s a b a s i s fo r

in t h a t it w a s n ' t d i v u l g e d i n c i d e n t t o

G oodn i gh t ' s p r e v i o u s r e q u e s t f o r such p ro d u c t io n ,

where t h e S t a t e focused so h e a v i l y on t h i s

d i s p a t c h t o l d RPD a p o s s i b l e f i g h t , p a r t i c u l a r l y

t h e a r r e s t i n g o f f i c e r ' s wife was working fo r

t h a t n i g h t and t h e r e ' s n o t h i n g in t h i s -

THE COURT: I d o n ' t u n d e r s t a n d . Eve r y t h i ng I ' v e

so f a r , whe the r t h e r e was a n o t h e r d i s p a t c h based on

p o s s i b l e f i g h t , e v e r y t h i n g that s been p r e s e n t e d had t o

o w i t h t h e t h e f t o f a c e l l phone . The 9-1 -1 c a l l t h a t I



was d e f i n i t e l y abou t t h e f t o f a c e l l phone .

MR COUGHLIN: You s a i d it was t h e f t , not

o r a f i g h t and a f i g h t was what Mr. Young - I

( i n d i s c e r n i b l e ) j u s t i f i e d t h e pa t -down and t h e

c u l l e d f rom t h e pa t -down-

MR YOUNG: Not Mr. Young -


MR COUGHLIN: P r obab l e cause f o r it. That was

your p l e a d i n g , you argued it -

THE COURT: Wai t , wai t a second . You have

I d i d in t h a t c a s e , I d i d g r a n t t h e mot ion to

wi t h r e s p e c t to what was testified to by o t h e r

h e a r s a y p o r t i o n o f it. But now that s no l o n g e r

c a s e . You a c t u a l l y , you a c t u a l l y go t a dm i t te d he re

t h e c a l l itself.

MR COUGHLIN: No I m r e f e r r i n g to t h e

o f t h e communica t ion be tween d i s p a t c h and t h e

which i s what Mr. Young focused on and it s what

Dura lde fo cu sed on. I m no t t a l k i n g abou t t h e

c i t i z e n s making t h e 9-1 -1 c a l l s . T h e r e s a l s o

( i n d i s c e r n i b l e ) o f what t h e d i s p a t c h e r s a r e

to t h e o f f i c e r s . And it r e p e a t e d l y , t h e

At to rne y Young and O f f i c e r Dura lde kep t us ing

buzz word Oh d i s p a t c h t o l d us p o s s i b l e f i g h t ,

f i g h t . Wel l o f cour se we had to p a t him down.





MR COUGHLIN: a l O- se c ond p o i n t q u i c k l y .

i s what Mr. L e s l i e and I -- I t h i n k it s an

p o i n t because Mr. L e s l i e and I k in d o f went

and f o r t h over t h i s -

THE COURT:Wel l

Id o n t c a r e what

-


MR COUGHLIN: Whether I made

THE COURT: what Mr. L e s l i e and you went back

f o r t h o v e r . You a r e r e p r e s e n t i n g y o u r s e l f now. So

me do you want to t e s t i f y o r n o t ?

MR COUGHLIN: But now -- now I m in a p o s i t i o n

Mr. L e s l i e was in s a y i n g to t h e c l i e n t , l ook , you

to waive your 5 t h if you want t o admi t t h i s v ideo

e v id e n c e . And t h e c l i e n t i s t h e same way. I s h o u l d

( i n d i s c e r n i b l e ) and have you g e t t h a t v i d e o i n t o

some o t h e r way and t h e n d e c i d e l a t e r if I m

THE COURT: Video o f what , s i r ?

MR YOUNG: I d o n t u n d e r s t a n d t h a t argument ,

Honor .

THE COURT: Yeah. I d o n t even know if you can

a u t h e n t i c a t e t h e v id e o , sir.

MR COUGHLIN: I b e l i e v e it a ( I n d i s c e r n i b l e )

in t h e v ideo c e l l phone a u t h e n t i c a t i n g . And I

t h a t t h e o t h e r w i t n e s s e s t o d a y have a l r e a d y

it. I t h i n k it was one o c c a s i o n t h a t you



s p e c i f i c a l l y found t h a t

THE COURT: Wai t wai t , sir. What i s it -- t h e

no. I t hough t you were t a l k i n g abou t t h e d i s p a t c h .

MR COUGHLIN: I was Your Honor I m s o r r y I

s i d e t r a c k e d .

THE COURT: The d i s p a t c h l og , I ll a l l ow you to

wi thou t t e s t i f y i n g .

MR COUGHLIN: Because it s a p u b l i c r eco rd ,

THE COURT: I ll a l l ow it to be a d m i t t e d if

all you want and t he n you can go fo rw ard

MR COUGHLIN: I can p l a y t h a t aud i o?

THE COURT: Huh? I t hough t you had a d i s c

o f it.

MR COUGHLIN: No. It s t h e a ud io .

THE COURT: I ll a l low t h a t aud i o to be p la ye d

you c a n t a u t h e n t i c a t e it anyhow.

MR COUGHLIN: Okay.

THE COURT: And that s

MR COUGHLIN: I b e l i e v e we have t h e s e r e d

I d o n t know if it s more o f a warn ing t ha n a

b u t -

THE COURT: But , sir, that s it. Now do you

to testify o r not? Noth ing e l s e i s coming i n .

MR COUGHLIN: Why? Can I p u t t h e p o l i c e r e p o r t



n ev i dence?

MR. YOUNG: I o b j e c t to t h a t .

THE COURT: The p o l i c e r e p o r t , t h e y c a n t even

it in ev i dence . You cou l d have c r os s - exami ned on t h e

r e p o r t .

MR. COUGHLIN: I c a n t pu t t h e p o l i c e r e p o r t i n

THE COURT: No.

MR. COUGHLIN: I c a n t ?

THE COURT: NO you c a n t .

MR. COUGHLIN: That compl e t e l y c o n t r a d i c t s

by all o f t h e s e w i t n e s s e s

THE COURT: Wel l sir -

R. COUGHLIN : I ll

THE COURT: t h a t i s some th ing you canno t do.

MR. COUGHLIN: It s a b u s i n e s s r e c o r d j u s t -

MR. YOUNG: Your Honor w e v e wasted a n o t h e r

m in u te s s i n c e we -- still d o n t have a answer whe the r

e wants to t e s t i f y or no t .

MR. COUGHLIN: You c a n t p u t a p o l i c e r e p o r t in

THE COURT: I j u s t t o l d you you c a n t . Stop

me.

MR. COUGHLIN: A l l r i g h t . Can I testify to what

t says?



THE COURT: No.

MR COUGHLIN: I m s o r r y . I m n o t e x p e r i e n c e d .

THE COURT: Wel l , yeah , t h e n you shou l d have had

n a t t o r n e y r e p r e s e n t you sir.

MR COUGHLIN: Wel l , he w o u l d n t have pu t it in

THE COURT: Wel l , he c o u l d n t . He knows t h a t .

f it s a p r i o r i n c o n s i s t e n t s t a t e m e n t it can be used f o r

MR COUGHLIN: Wel l , that s where I m hamst rung

y t h e f a c t t h a t I d i d ge t a r e t u r n ( I n d i s c e r n i b l e ) f o r

Dura lde and I b e l i e v e t h e o t h e r o f f i c e r s , and I do

a v e r b a t i m i n d i c a t i o n by you on t h e r e c o r d a t t h e 48

o f it, second aud io file on O cto b e r 22nd t h a t you

waiv ing w i t n e s s f ees , no t s e r v i c e f e e s by t h e

You made no ment ion o f s e r v i c e f ees t h e r e . You

wi tness f e e s . And I r e a s o n a b l y r e l i e d upon t h a t .

MR YOUNG: Your Honor because Mr. Coughl in i s

h i m s e l f , he has t h e du t y o f can d o r to t h e

This i s a comple te waste o f t ime and I would ask

you ask Mr. Cough l in whether he wants to t e s t i f y o r

have him g i ve you an answer . If he f a i l s t o g ive you

answer , h o l d him in con tempt . I have

THE COURT: I m not go ing t o h o l d him in



MR YOUNG: e w i l l .

THE COURT: I m j u s t go ing t o conc lude t h e

MR YOUNG: However do you want to do it. H e s

e v e r y o n e s t ime .

THE COURT: Do you want testify o r no t ?

MR COUGHLIN: I do Your Honor bu t if

THE COURT: Okay. Then t a k e t h e s t a n d .

MR COUGHLIN: I ll j u s t p r e s e r v e f o r t h e r e c o r d

f a c t t h a t I f e e l l i k e -

THE COURT: Take t h e s t a n d .

MR COUGHLIN: Okay.

THE COURT: Or we conc lude t h e trial.



MR YOUNG: For t h e r e c o r d , h e s ( i n d i s c e r n i b l e )

j u s t made I m no t c o e r c i n g him. It s t o t a l l y h i s

-

MR COUGHLIN: Y o u r e a s k i n g to pu t me in jail

l i k e you d i d a t t h e ( I n d i s c e r n i b l e ) h e a r i n g -

MR YOUNG: Has n o t h i n g to do wi th whether he

t h e r i g h t t o e x e r c i s e h i s r i g h t to testify o r not

THE COURT: I do no t a g re e wi t h Mr Young.

you if you do not t e s t i f y w e l l co n c lu d e t h e trial.

e r e not go ing t o pu t you in jail f o r no t t e s t i f y i n g .



MR COUGHLIN: I know t h a t , Your Honor -

THE COURT: However, if I c o n v i c t you you may go

o jail b u t that s a d i f f e r e n t s t o r y . Al l r i g h t . P l e a s e

your r i g h t hand.

(The wi tne s s was sworn . )

ZACHARY BARKER COUGHLIN,

c a l l e d as a wi tness , hav ing been first du l y sworn, was

examined and t e s t i f i e d as fo l lows :

DIRECT EXAMINATION

THE COURT: Go ahead sit down and proceed , sir.

MR COUGHLIN: Your Honor , to t h e e x t e n t I 'm

t h a t e na b le s me to p l a y v ide os , shou l d I g rab

THE COURT: I d i d n ' t say it e n a b l e s you to p l a y

if you -- first o f all, you need to t e s t i f y as to

you a r e p r o f f e r i n g because I w i l l g i v e you some

s i n c e y o u ' r e t h e a t t o r n e y and t h e w i t n e s s . But

need to t e s t i f y as to some th ing r e l e v a n t t o t h i s

that s a d m i s s i b l e .

MR. COUGHLIN: Okay. So t h e whole k i nd o f

i s you a r e say ing , Well , we go t to g e t him to

THE COURT: It s not an argument , sir.



MR COUGHLIN: By Mr. Young.

THE COURT: I d o n t c a r e abou t argument .

t o l d you -


THE COURT:if

you want t o s t e p down I m no t

to f o r c e you to t e s t i f y . But once you s t a r t , y o u l l

s u b j e c t to c ros s -examina t ion .

MR COUGHLIN: Righ t . But once I start I a l s o

to adduce -- t h e r e i s some good t h a t goes a l ong w i t h

t h a t pe op le might view as bad. I a c t u a l l y welcome

c r o s s - e x a m i n a t i o n because I d o n t

THE COURT: I d o n t want to a rgue anymore . Are

going to start o r no t ?

MR COUGHLIN: Yes I b e l i e v e p a r t ,

Your Honor I t h i n k t h a t means I can b r i n g

my m a t e r i a l s as I m f u n c t i o n i n g in a dua l r o l e .

I m hamstrung .

THE COURT: No I m no t go i ng to r e a d your

MR COUGHLIN: Not r ead them b r i n g them up and

them -

THE COURT: Br ing them up p u t them f a c e down on

o f t h e t a b l e . If t hey a r e a d m i t t e d in ev idence ,

u l l be a b l e to t e s t i f y as to any th ing that s admi t t ed

ev idence .



MR. COUGHLIN: Yes sir.

MR. YOUNG: And I may m issed it. Was

Coughl in j u s t sworn as a w i t n e s s .

THE COURT: Yes he was .

MR. YOUNG: Thank you.

MR. COUGHLIN: I m so r r y , Your Honor would it

p o s s i b l e f o r me to run ou t and g e t a s i p o f wate r?

j u s t be t a l k i n g a l o t and I m no t -

THE COURT: We w i l l g e t you some w a t e r .

MR. COUGHLIN: Thank you sir.

THE COURT: J u s t come up h e r e .

Al l r i g h t . Go ahead , sir.

MR. COUGHLIN: ( I n d i s c e r n i b l e ) my c a s e in c h i e f ,

I m j u s t t r y i n g to conf i r m t h a t . So I m a s k i n g

THE COURT: Well , you d o n t have to ask

You can speak in n a r r a t i v e t e rms b u t it s got

be ge rmane as I s a i d , and r e l e v a n t and , f u r t h e r , it

to be n o n o b j e c t i o n a b l e .

MR. COUGHLIN: Yes sir. Yes sir.

your a l l o w i n g me to testify in t h e n a r r a t i v e .

my b a r h e a r i n g t h e y i n s i s te d t h a t I do it in a k i nd o f

q u e s t i o n and r e sponse fo rmat wi th mys e l f .

y r e c o l l e c t i o n o f t h a t n i g h t a r e t h a t -- I

b e l i e v e t h e r e was a p o s s i b l e f i g h t g o in g on . I



do a ny th ing v i o l e n t towards anyone. In f a c t , if

m a b l e t o , I would l i k e to p lay some v ide os t h a t

t h a t I t r i e d t o make t he b e s t ou t o f somewhat

f a bad s i t u a t i o n and one t h a t I am no t proud o f

I d i d t h a t n igh t o r k i nd o f where I was in my

o r what I d i d to g e t t h e r e by nobody d ied , you know.

Nobody d id -- somebody d i d d i e two months

in a t r agedy wi th Stephen G i l l ove r a purs e and

r e f e r e n c e d t h a t a t t h e t ime . I go t ( I n d i s c e r n i b l e ) t h i s

some proba b ly l e g i t i m a t e f r u s t r a t i o n wi t h me and

o f t h e t h i n g s t h a t have gone on t h i s y e a r i n t h e

which I have not r e p r e s e n t e d t he b a r

e s p e c i a l l y -

THE COURT Wel l sir, I can a s s u r e you I m

t h i s case j u s t on t h e f a c t s o f t h i s c a s e . So not

e l s e .

MR COUGHLIN Yes sir. And I m g e t t i n g to

I m g e t t i n g to whether o r no t I have f e l o n i o u s

which I be l i e ve might be among my s t r o n g e s t

a f e l o n i o u s i n t e n t a t t h e t im e o f t h e r e l e va n t

i n ques t ion .

But I would l i k e to g e t t h i s Econ it s s h o r t ,

Honor proba b ly only t h r e e minu te l ong and it s j u s t

c l i p s o f -- k i nd o f i n t e r e s t i n g -- o f all t h e

t h e d i s p a t c h e r s and t h e Reno P o l i c e



THE COURT: Any o b j e c t i o n to t h e Econ t ape?

MR YOUNG: He c a n t a u t h e n t i c a t e it.

THE COURT: Well I m going to a l low it because

d i d o r d e r t h a t it be produced . The c i t y a t t o r n e y was

i n d i c a t e d t h a t he was go ing to f u r n i s h it.

MR YOUNG: To be c l e a r , t h i s i s t h e Econ

in q u e s t i o n

THE COURT: J u s t t h e n i g h t in que s t i on .

MR YOUNG: Not a subsequen t n i g h t .

THE COURT: T h a t s t h e on ly t h i n g I m a l l owing .

you under s t and t h a t ?

MR COUGHLIN: Yes sir yes , sir. And to t h e

t h e r e s a , Well what does it m a t t e r . Someone

-- Mr. Young might say you a l r e a d y r u l e d on t he

motion , I submi t t h a t you -

MR YOUNG: Your Honor.

MR COUGHLIN: -- d id l e a v e t h e door open .

MR YOUNG: Argumenta t ive . H e s t e s t i f y i n g .

i s f o r t e s t imony .

THE COURT: Yes you a r e t e s t i f y i n g r i g h t now

a rgu ing .

MR COUGHLIN: I m f u n c t i o n i n g in a dua l r o l e

now.

THE COURT: No no one i s o b j e c t i n g t o it.



it would be a dmi t t e d so you d o n t have to a rgue .

MR COUGHLIN: Yes.

THE COURT: Unless it s d e a l i n g wi t h a d i f f e r e n t

o r a d i f f e r e n t i n c i d e n t .

MR COUGHLIN: J u s t t o t h e e x t e n t t h a t I need to

to you and I b e l i e v e ( I n d i s c e r n i b l e ) made it where it

t h a t you i n d i c a t e d t h a t t h e s u p p r e s s i o n mot ion would

t h e door was not c lo sed .

THE COURT: I do not want t o g e t i n t o t h a t .

I to p l a y t h e t a pe .

MR COUGHLIN: But that s where t h i s t a p e i s

sir.

THE COURT: I v e a l r e a d y a l l owed it. You d o n t

to argue abou t r e l e v a n c e . Al l r i g h t ?

MR COUGHLIN: But if I won on t h e supp res s ion

it might a f f e c t how I pr oceed w i t h t h e r e s t o f it.

THE COURT: You can argue a t t h e c o n c l u s i o n o f

case . You d i d n t win -- you won h a l f o f t h e

motion , sir. You can a r gue a t t h e c onc lus ion

t h e c a s e as to whether you a r e g u i l t y o r i nnoc e n t -- o r

g u i l t y , I m so r r y . I m no t go i ng to argue wi th you.

it if you want it. If no t , your t ime i s r unn i ng ou t .

MR COUGHLIN: Yes sir

THE COURT: I m n o t going to w as te t i me -

MR YOUNG: Your Honor has t h i s been marked



THE COURT: L e t s have it marked t h e n .

(Exh ib i t ____ was marked f o r

i d e n t i f i c a t i o n p u r p o s e s . )

THE COURT: S i r , whi le y o u r e t r y i n g t o ge t it

you can t e s t i f y to someth ing e l s e


I he a rd - I saw and he a rd f rom where I came up

a c o r r i d o r a long t h e r i v e r f rom t h a t movie t h e a t e r on

and I b e l i e v e , it s Ce n te r S t r e e t -- no 1 s t and

down t h e r e where t h a t movie t h e a t e r i s on t h e

I was down t h e r e by t h a t , t h a t k ind o f p l a z a by

head over to Wingf i e ld pa rk a t proba b ly

11:10 t h a t n i g h t . That was August 20th .

I j u s t had a fou r and a h a l f y e a r r e l a t i o n s h i p

in June o f t h a t yea r . And t h a t would be u p s e t t i n g to

I -- it ended a coup l e o f days a f t e r she

g r a d u a t e d f rom c o l l e ge and t h e n I subsequen t l y

ou t in Augus t , which you might r e c a l l because you

on t h e , on t h e e v i c t i o n m a t t e r t h a t -- and maybe you

t a k e j u d i c i a l n o t i c e o f t h i s because t h e l a n d l o r d

to it t h a t she had f a i l e d to fo rward -- I g ive

my s h a r e o f t h e r e n t each month and t h i n g s f o r f i v e

and she

THE COURT: I d o n t know that s r e l e v a n t to

bu t Mr. Young i s not o b j e c t i n g .



I

MR COUGHLIN: I f I cou l d j u s t i n d i c a t e I w i l l

e x p l a i n how it s r e l e v a n t to t he e x t e n t t h a t

sudden f i n a n c i a l upheava l r e s u l t e d in me no t be i ng

to a f f o r d by m e d i c a t i o n s . And I m p r o b a b ly kind o f

be ing r e a l i s t i c a t t h i s p o i n t to t h e e x t e n t I t h i n k

have some p r i v a c y in t h a t r e g a r d bu t to whatever

t h e r e c o r d cou l d l a t e r

THE COURT: S i r , we o f f e r e d you m en ta l h e a l t h

in t h i s case which you d e c l i n e d so

MR COUGHLIN: No I went ove r t h e r e .

MR YOUNG: Your Honor t h i s is not t e s t imony .

MR COUGHLIN: I would r a t h e r use t h e t ime

-


MR COUGHLIN: But I t h i n k it goes t o i n t e n t o r

I mean -- so .

THE COURT: Wel l u n f o r t u n a t e l y , sir, I v e had

examined tw ic e wi th r e s p e c t to your competency .

MR COUGHLIN: I d o n t t h i n k I m a r g u in g -

sir.


MR COUGHLIN: I d o n t know if that s compe tency

i n c a p a c i t y o r t h e r e a r e d i f f e r e n t t h i n g s bu t

MR YOUNG: Your Honor I would ask t h a t

Coughl in t e s t i f y to f a c t s . T h a t s what w e r e he re



MR COUGHLIN: Well , go ing o f f your m e d i c a t i o n

a f a c t .

MR YOUNG: I d i d n t o b j e c t t o t h a t .

MR COUGHLIN: Not be ing a b l e t o a f f o r d

i s t h e f a c t t h a t I m t e s t i f y i n g t o .


MR COUGHLIN: They a r e p s y c h o a c t i v e me dic a t ions

I was j u s t b r i e f l y a s k ing to t h e e x t e n t if p o s s i b l e

s i n c e I m not go ing t o testify t o it, bu t if it s

t o somehow make an in camera later o r removed

t h e r e c o r d what m e d i c at io n s I m g o in g to t e s t i f y t o

a p p r e c i a t e it because t h e r e i s somewhat o f a

view in some segments o f s o c i e t y abou t t h e s e

I went o f f b o t h o f my m e d i c a t i o n s a t t h e start

Augus t due to r unn i ng ou t o f money and it k ind o f a -

f a l l o u t o f abou t a f i v e - y e a r r e l a t i o n s h i p and

f i n d i n g ou t t h a t she made o f f wi t h about a two months

now I m t h a t f a r beh i nd .

So somewhere I g u ess maybe I i n a p p r o p r i a t e l y

to make it up was in my m e d i c a t i o n s and maybe go ing

a me dic a t ion h o l i d a y bu t r e a l l y I t h i n k it was more due

not hav ing t h e money

Quick ly I would j u s t say I d i d a t t e m p t to

I



any ne g l ige nc e a t t e n d a n t to go ing o f f t h o s e

by c a l l i n g NN MHS and i n q u i r i n g as to t h e

o f s o r t o f IFP fo r m e d i c a t i o n s .

But one o f t h e medi ca t i ons i s a , it s -- t h i s

e x p l a i n some t h i n g s wi t h r e g a r d to some o f t h e

o f hav ing me b e f o r e you in c ou r t , sir, i s

it s medi ca t i on f o r a t t e n t i o n d e f i c i t d i s o r d e r . J u s t

I ll i n d i c a t e some o f t h e f r u s t r a t io n t h a t I know

has wi t h me i s t h e i n a b i l i t y to do what

supposed to be do ing when you do it and t h i n g s

over and no t c o l o r i n g in t h e l i n e s , you know And

ha l l mar k w i t h p eo p le w i th DD o r ADHD A l o t o f

d o n t r e a l i z e some a d u l t s do have t h a t .

The o t h e r medi ca t i on ( I n d i s c e r n i b l e ) - t h e

f o r DD was Adde ra l l . T h a t s m e d i c a t i o n , if

go o f f it sudden ly , you can e x p e r i e n c e some em o t io n a l

I m no t s u g g e s t i n g t h a t made me s t e a l and I m

s u g g e s t i n g I s t o l e t h a t n i g h t . T h a t s not my

My c o n t e n t i o n i s t h a t I m i n n o c e n t . And I

no t s t e a l .

But e a r l i e r when I was r e f e r e n c i n g some o f t h e

t h a t n i g h t I m no t t h a t p r o u d o f , I was more

on j u s t some o f t h e a t t i t u d i n a l s t u f f , some o f

l a c k o f -- I guess r e g a r d t o f e e l i n g s o f o t h e r s o r t h e

of be i ng a p o l i c e o f f i c e r and t h e dange r t h a t



J u s t see ing o t h e rto e ve ry n igh t doing t h a t j ob .

v i e w p o i n t s . I t h i n k I was more in a ve ry

p l a c e in l a r g e p a r t due to go i ng t h rough

very s i g n i f i c a n t s u f f e r i n g . Those a r e what anybody

f e e l , i n c i d e n t to t he end of p robab ly t h e most

pa r amour - t ype r e l a t i o n s h i p I v e had in my life

them on t op o f t h a t t h e i s s u e s a t t e n d i n g to going o f f

ve ry powerfu l p s y c h o t r o p i c s -- I t h i n k t hey a r e

I d o n t know. But p s y c h o l o g i c a l

which i s fo r majo r d e p r e s s i v e

which I have been d ia gnos e d w i t h and t r e a t e d wi th

a l ong t ime by Dr. ( I n d i s c e r n i b l e ) u n t i l he d i e d a

o f y e a r s ago and t h e n c u r r e n t l y by Dr. Usar

T h a t s -- I v e been t a k i n g t h a t s i n c e I was

p r i m a r i l y f o r majo r d e p r e s s i v e d i s o r d e r i n somewhat o f

o f f l a b e l used f o r kind o f low gra de o b s e s s i v e

t y p e t e nde nc i e s .

And t h e n t h e Addera l l which i s commonly known as

it f o r t he a t t e n t i o n d e f i c i t d i s o r d e r bu t

m e nt o f r e s i s t a n t d e p r e s s i o n and some

an a c c e p t e d seconda r y o f f l a b e l use . Not to ge t

f a r a f i e l d on t h a t s t u f f anymore. But I do t h i n k it

to -- I v e watched Your Honor t h roughou t t h i s trial

I h a v e n t no t i c e d a l o t o f r e g a r d f o r my a c t i o n s t h a t

from you.



MR YOUNG: Obje c t ion , Your Honor r e l e v a n c e .

i s no t t e s t i f y i n g -- h e s no t t e s t i f y i n g to f a c t s .

THE COURT: C o r r e c t . The o b j e c t i o n w i l l be

MR YOUNG: I v e let it go b u t t h i s i s g e t t i n g

f a r .

THE COURT: I can a s s u r e you t h a t I h a v e n t made

d e t e r m i n a t i o n as to your a c t i o n on t h a t n i g h t a t t h i s

So go ahead and t e s t i f y to t h e f a c t s , sir.

MR COUGHLIN: A l l r i g h t . And I ll no t e t h e r e

D i s t r i c t At t o r ney Young s t e e r i n g it back what i s

and that s what peop l e w i t h a t t e n t i o n d e f i c i t

have do ing i s c o l o r i n t h e l i n e s and I a p p r e c i a t e

do ing t h a t b ecau se I ll s t e e r back t h a t , go back to

m a t e r i a l f a c t s in i s s u e . But why I was go ing in t h a t

long s o l i l o q u y i s t h a t ob je c t i ona b l e , b o a r i s h ,

rude be ha v io r i s -- might no t be ad m i rab l e

t h a t d o e s n t make it hav ing a f e l o n i o u s i n t e n t . There

a d i f f e r e n c e . And I d o n t b e l i e v e I had a f e lon ious

n i g h t .

MR YOUNG: Obje c t ion , a rgume n ta t ive .

THE COURT: Wel l I ag r ee that s a rgume n ta t ive .

o u l l be ab l e to argue when y o u r e no t t e s t i f y i n g __

MR COUGHLIN: I t hough t when I was a l awyer I

a lways t o l d I was be i ng a rgume n ta t ive .



THE COURT: Wel l , sir

MR YOUNG: Also a misdemeanor .

THE COURT: You a r e a rgu ing i n s t e a d o f

So tell t h e us what happened t h a t n i g h t .

MR COUGHLIN: Yes sir. The o n l y t h i n g i s to

e x t e n t and I t h i n k t h i s p r o b a b l y ( I n d i s c e r n i b l e ) fo r

b ecau se t h i s isn t what you guys want t o he a r bu t I ll

n o t e f o r t h e r e c o r d to t h e e x t e n t t h a t I began do ing

I waived t h a t which you t o l d me I c o u l d do which i s

t h e s u p p r e s s i o n hear ing , p a r t i c u l a r l y t h e p r o b a b l e

a n a l y s i s a t t e n d a n t to t h e r e -

THE COURT: I d i d n ' t say -

MR COUGHLIN: -- no t b e i n g a p o s s i b l e f i g h t

i s what t h e D.A. Young and O f f i c e r Dura lde b ased

whole case on.

R YOUNG: Your Honor I would o b j e c t . H e ' s

t e s t i f y i n g t o f a c t s . This i s h i s t im e -- I d o n ' t know

he d o e s n ' t unde r s t a nd . He p a s s e d t h e b a r . He

t h a t he had -

MR COUGHLIN: I g e t it now. This i s no t

argument ; r i g h t ?

MR YOUNG: That he -


MR YOUNG: He ' s no t t e s t i f y i n g

THE COURT: Yes he d i d -



MR YOUNG: Very s i m p l e concep t , h e s


THE COURT: I unde r s t and .

MR YOUNG: -- t h e f a c t u a l ( i n d i s c e r n i b l e )

THE COURT: I t h i n k he u n d e r s t a n d s .

MR YOUNG: I d o n t t h i n k he d o e s .

THE COURT: Well , if he co n t i n u es , he w i l l be in

o f c o u r t .

MR COUGHLIN: Wai t .


THE COURT: This i s , sir. It s your o p p o r t u n i t y

testify as t o t h e f a c t s and I have y e t -- and it s

-

MR COUGHLIN: Okay.

THE COURT: o v e r 15 a lm o s t 20 minute s i n c e

s t a r te d t e s t if y i n g and it was a little a f t e r f ou r when

s t a r t e d d e c i d i n g whethe r o r no t you were go ing to

So now w e r e a t 4 :35 and I h a v e n t hea r d you

a s to a n y t h i n g f a c t u a l r e l e v a n t t o t h i s i n c i d e n t

MR COUGHLIN: Going o f f m e d i c a t i o n i s r e l e v a n t

i n t e n t .

THE COURT: Okay. That may be .

MR COUGHLIN: Okay. I see what y o u r e g e t t i n g



You want t h e r e a l l y , r e a l l y r e l e v a n t e l e m e n t s o f t h e

THE COURT: Wel l , y o u v e a r gued them in your

MR COUGHLIN: And t h e on l y r e a s o n I -- I f e e l

I keep waiv ing t h i n g s and I would be waiv ing my

THE COURT: S i r , if you d o n t fo cu s on t h e

I ll f i n d you in con tempt . A l l r i g h t ?


THE COURT: You d o n t need t a l k ab o u t wai ve r .

need t o t a l k abou t t h e f a c t s .

MR COUGHLIN: Okay. I d i d n o t f a c t u a l l y

any f i g h t o r p o s s i b l e f i g h t t h a t n i g h t . I

and felt b e i n g a t t a c k e d by a group o f y o u t h f u l

I w i t n e s s e d myse l f b e i n g r a t h e r d o c i l e in

wi t h t h e o f f i c e r s in my i n t e r a c t i o n s wi t h them

p o l i t e l y as p o s s i b l e a s s e r t i n g a t l e a s t t h e n o t i o n t h a t

migh t have some c o n s t i t u t i o n a l r i g h t s t h a t migh t p r e v e n t

f rom a s k i n g me -- o r demanding an answer f rom me wi t h

t o e v e r y t h i n g t h e y migh t want t o know o r s e a r c h i n g

p a r t o f my p e r s o n t h a t t h e y migh t f e e l would be

c a r r y i n g ou t t h e i r d u t i e s , o r a c h i e v i n g t h e i r

however honor ab l e and however much s o c i e t y

upon t h o s e .



I would l i k e to f a c t u a l l y testify t h a t o f f i c e r

and I do no t b e l i e v e he d i d t h i s on p u rp o se ,

he d i d t o u ch my p e n i s . It was s t a r t l i n g . I had

a l o t o f weight i n 2012 f o l l o w i n g I ll c a l l it

d i v o r c e a l t h o u g h we w e r e n t m a r r i e d . I was i n h a l i n g

Peop le a round t h e cour t house commented on when I

abou t 40 pounds e a r l ie r t h i s ye a r , why I l o s t a

o f weigh t , once I k in d o f g o t o v e r t h e b reak u p .

I n c i d e n t to g a i n i n g all t h a t weigh t and my

i nd i gency o r p o v e r t y , I w a s n t a b l e to go buy a

wardrobe . I c u t n o tch es i n t o my w ai s tb an d on some o f

underwear to accommodate my i n c r e a s e d w a i s t l i n e and I

t h a t r e s u l t e d in what O f f i c e r Dura lde was f o l l owi ng

pr ocedur e and he testified as to o v e r l a p p i n g when

a ( i n d i s c e r n i b l e ) pa t -down , t r a i n i n g .

THE COURT: Well

MR COUGHLIN: I t h i n k it r e s u l t e d in h i s hand

t h i s is c a p t u r e d i n a pop on t h e v i d e o , h i s hand go ing

my w a i s t l i n e and where he t hough t he might have

-

THE COURT: Mr. Young c o r r e c t me if I m wrong

I n o t r u l e t h a t t h e pat -down s e a r c h __

MR YOUNG: You r u l e d t h a t i n a d m i s s i b l e and t h e

d i d no t g e t i n t o t h a t i n its c a s e i n c h i e f .

THE COURT: So it was on t h e s e a r c h i n c i d e n t



t he a r r e s t ; r i g h t ?

MR YOUNG: You e xc lude d a f t e r t h e motion to

any r e f e r e nc e s to t he pa t -down s e a r c h and

when O f f i c e r Dura lde testified to c a l l i n g t h e

hea r ing it v i b r a t e , you e xc lude d all e v ide nc e o f

Dura lde t ouch ing wi th t he palm o r back o f h i s

Mr. C o u g h l i n s s h o r t poc ke t and f e e l i n g t he

TH COURT: Al l r i g h t .

MR COUGHLIN : So t h a t has been e xc lude d . The

d i d not g e t i n t o t h a t . Mr. Cough l in i s now g e t t i n g

t h a t on h i s own.

TH COURT: And so , sir I t h i n k you a r e a rgu ing

dead hors e a t t h i s p o i n t . I a l r e a dy r u l e d i n your f a vo r

t h a t . So t he ques t ion i s , whether t h e r e was p r o b a b l e

to a r r e s t you o r not and t h a t i s so f a r as I m

all t he ev idence pr e se n t e d to da t e t h a t

t h a t bu t if you have someth ing t h a t I m

o f t h a t you wish to t e s t i f y to on t h a t , you may do

MR COUGHLIN: I do, sir. And l a r g e l y as I

it t h roughou t t he first -- Mr. Young s case in

was a l a r g e b a s i s f o r t h a t p r o b a b l e cause to conduc t

s e a r c h -- an a r r e s t and s e a r c h i n c i d e n t t h e r e t o r e s t e d

an a c c u s a t i o n o f noncompl iance f o r demeanor i s s u es o r



THE COURT: S i r -

MR YOUNG: Your Honor

THE COURT: what it was t h e w i t n e s s e s who

p r e s e n t a t t h e t ime and who t o l d t h e o f f i c e r

t h a t you had s t o l e n t h e phone .

MR YOUNG: Your Honor can you once aga i n

Mr. Coughl in to t e s t i f y to t h e f a c t s , p le a se .

THE COURT: Yes. I ll i n s t r u c t you once aga i n

o t e s t i f y as to t h e f a c t s .

MR COUGHLIN: I m t ry i n g t o testify as to t h e

r e l a t i v e to whether o r no t I was c o o p e r a t i v e o r

abou t someone t ouch i ng my p e n i s which -

THE COURT: Okay. S i r , you a r e not charged wi th

You were ch a rg ed wi t h t he t h e f t o f a

phone o r p o s s e s s i o n o f a s t o l e n c e l l phone .

MR COUGHLIN: Based upon t h e f r u i t from a

t h a t was l a r g e l y b u t t r e s s e d upon an a c c u s a t i o n o f

o r demeanor i s s u e s o r non

THE COURT: I t o t a l l y d i s a g r e e and w e r e done

MR COUGHLIN: Okay.

THE COURT: So you need to pr oceed .

MR COUGHLIN: I unde r s t a nd , sir. If I could

in f a i r n e s s to O f f i c e r Dura lde q u i c k l y , I d i d n t



he meant t o do t h a t .

THE COURT: I d o n t c a r e if he meant to do it o r

Go ahead .

MR COUGHLIN: A l l r i g h t . I d i d no t y e l l -- I

o not f e e l I was y e l l i n g about him t o u c h i n g any p a r t o f

body t h a t was no t a pp r op r i a t e . I ment ioned it. It

been in a s l i g h t l y l ouder vo ic e t h a n normal bu t

d id no t y e l l t h a t . I d id not y e l l th a t in some s o r t

f -- and t h i s i s -- I m t e s t i f y i n g as to t h i s to r ebu t

I f e e l was s e t f o r t h in h i s t e s t i m o n y and p o l i c e

where it seems as t hough he a t t e m p t e d t o l i n k t h e

abou t t h e i n a p p r o p r i a t e t o u c h i n g wi th t h e g e t t i n g

t o where he f e l t t h e phone was.

I b e l i e v e I have ev i dence and can t e s t i f y

as t o t h e e x t e n t t h a t you h e a r t h e pop o f t h e

when h i s hand s l i p s i n t o a p r i v a t e a r e a -

MR YOUNG: Your Honor h e s no t -- a ga in h e s

t e s t i f y i n g to f a c t . He j u s t s a i d h i m s e l f , he sa id , I

I cou l d t e s t i f y t o . This i s h i s chance to

So he shou l d t e s t i f y .

THE COURT: A l l r i g h t . Go ahead , sir w h a t s

t e s t imony?

MR COUGHLIN: That when h i s hand s l i p p e d p a s t

wai s t band , t h a t t h a t was a n a t u r a l , l e g i t i m a t e

o f mine . It might have c o n t a i n e d a b i t o f



it, I ll say t h a t , sir. But it w a s n t

manufac tu red i n c i d e n t to h i s

THE COURT: S i r , I m hav ing i s a t ough t ime wi th

r e l e va nc e o f t h i s . I v e a l r e a d y r u l e d i n your f avor

n t h e mot ion to suppr e s s so f a r as it went to t he

sea rch . So t h e i s sue , t h e f a c t s t h a t a r e in

so f a r as I m conce rned i s whe the r o r not you

t h e s t a t u t e , t h e NRS.

MR COUGHLIN: And I go to t h a t because -- and

i s -- one o f my c r i t i c i s m s o f t h e s u p p r e s s i o n motion

t h a t it -


MR COUGHLIN: -- f a i l e d to a r gue .

MR YOUNG: o b j e c t i o n .

( I n d i s c e r n i b l e c ross t a l k . )

MR COUGHLIN: -- i n c i d e n t to a r r e s t .

MR YOUNG: Your Honor o b j e c t i o n .

MR COUGHLIN: You can a rg u e t h a t -

MR YOUNG: Your Honor o b j e c t i o n . H e s no t

THE COURT: Al l r i g h t . W e re done. I m go ing

have you t a k e n i n t o cu s to d y u n t i l tomorrow morning and

we w i l l c on t inue with t h i s trial.

MR COUGHLIN: S i r , can I -

THE COURT: And by t hen y o u l l testify as to



MR COUGHLIN: S i r , c ou ld I have one l a s t chance

do t h a t ? I promise y o u l l have no prob lem -

THE COURT: No, no.

MR COUGHLIN: P l e a s e ,sir.

THE COURT: No.

MR COUGHLIN: I h a v e n t

THE COURT: No. Can you go tomorrow -

MR COUGHLIN: I a p o l o g i z e , Your Honor .

THE COURT: Mr. Young?

MR YOUNG: Tomorrow morning?

THE COURT: Yes.

MR YOUNG: I ll have to move some t h i n g s around

I ll g e t it done.


MR LESLIE: Your Honor , if I may, it depends on

t ime . I v e been subpoenaed to a h e a r i n g I t h i n k a t

a .m. he re bu t I c ou ld a ppe a r e a r l i e r . I would

8 :30 if t he Cour t -

THE CLERK: He has a mot ion h e a r i n g tomorrow

a t 10 wi th Judge C l i f t o n .

MR YOUNG: Me?

THE CLERK: No, Coughl in .

THE COURT: W e l l do 8 :30 tomorrow. And can you

them know to t r a n s p o r t him h e r e a t 8:30 .



THE CLERK: Yes.

MR. YOUNG: I ll be h e r e a t 8 : 30 , Your Honor.

THE COURT: A l l r i g h t . And I d o n ' t know what to

I ' v e g iv en him as much t im e a s we can and t he n w e ' l l

o f rom t h e r e .

MR. LESLIE: I hope you u n d e r s t a n d my

THE COURT: I 'm go ing to a c t u a l l y I may O.R. him

now, bu t let me t h i n k abou t it.

MR. COUGHLIN: Thank you.


THE COURT: Mr. Cough l in , w e ' r e back on t h e

I 'm go ing t o r e l e a s e you bu t you a r e to ap p ea r

tomorrow a t 8:30 and if you want to pr oceed , y o u ' l l

to testify i s to f a c t s in i s s u e .


THE COURT: If you c o n t i n u e to a r gue , t hen I ll

you back in cus t ody . Unders tood?


THE COURT: W e ' ll see you tomorrow morning a t

Al l r i g h t .

MR. COUGHLIN: Yes, sir, w i l l do. Can I t a k e my

THE COURT: Your s t u f f i s r i g h t t h e r e .

THE CLERK: I need e x h i b i t s 1 , 2 and 4.



THE COURT: E x h i b i t s 1 2 -

THE CLERK: J u s t t h e one t h a t was a d m i t t e d t h a t

had ev i dence s ubmi t t e d on. These were all marked bu t

one admi t t ed was one.

MR. COUGHLIN: Probab ly s h o u l d n t have them all

up l i k e t h a t . ( I n d i s c e r n i b l e ) .

THE CLERK: The enve lope i s marked.

MR. COUGHLIN: E x h i b i t 1 was marked on t he D

THE CLERK: Wel l you d i d t h a t , bu t if that s on

t op and what it shou l d say on t h e CD I wro te it on

c o r n e r on t h e enve lope r i g h t t h e r e .

THE COURT: T h a t s E x h i b i t 4. E x h i b i t 1 -

THE CLERK: Should j u s t be a CD.

THE COURT: We have two empty ones .

THE CLERK: Br ing me t h a t enve l ope in your left

MR. COUGHLIN: I t h i n k t h a t one wi t h t h e r e d

i s what -

THE COURT: Some o f t h o s e a r e e x h i b i t s ?

THE CLERK: They a r e all marked bu t t he se were

on l y ones a dmi t t e d .

THE COURT: Okay.

THE CLERK: So I m j u s t t a k i n g c o n t r o l o f t h e

t h a t were admi t t ed .



THE COURT Okay I m t a k i n g t h e s e , t h e file

(Conc lus ion o f JAVS Audio . )



OF NEV'ADA,

) s s .

OF W SHOE

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