Indoalbanisches Etymologisches W örter buch May be Illyrian may be Martian What a shame! Unbelievable! Similar crap you can hardly find even by the most stupid folk- etymologist! Below is the excerpt from the so-called "Proto-Indo-European Etymological Dictionary", the book Abdullah has recently advertised. [...meigh-, also meik- [...Gk.αμορβος “dark” derived from Alb. mje(r)gule ̈ “ fog, darkness “ [common G k. β < gw, p < kw phonetic mutation]; Alb. proves that fr om Root mer-2 ; * extended mer-ek-: “to shimmer, shine” derived the truncated Root meigh-, also meik- : “to glimmer, twinkle; mist”...] The above note is from the "revised" version of Pokorny's PIE dictionary*: ________________________________________________ My comment: Abdulah (as well as his mentors G.Staros tin and A, Lubotsky) does no t know tha t his αμορβος is αμαυρόβιος in reality, which means "living i n darkness" (in f act αμαυρός + βίος; αμαυρώνω /tarnish, blacken/; βίος life); cf. Serbian mrak, mrakèina, mraèno, mrko (dark, darkness, dusk): Such foolis hness could hardly be expect from an average highs chool student! May Be Illyrian may be Martian http://vukotic.atspace.com/alb.htm
[...Gk.αμορβος “dark” derived from Alb. mje(r)gule “ fog, darkness “ [common Gk. β < gw, p < kw phonetic mutation]; Alb. proves that from Root mer-2 ; *extended mer-ek-: “toshimmer, shine” derived the truncated Root meigh-, also meik- : “to glimmer, twinkle;mist”...]
The above note is from the "revised" version of Pokorny's PIE dictionary*:
________________________________________________
My comment:
Abdulah (as well as his mentors G.Starostin and A, Lubotsky) does not know that his αμορβοςis αμαυρόβιος in reality, which means "living in darkness" (in fact αμαυρός + βίος; αμαυρώνω /tarnish, blacken/; βίος life); cf. Serbian mrak, mrakèina, mraèno, mrko (dark, darkness, dusk):
Such foolishness could hardly be expect from an average highschool student!
May Be Illyrian may be Martian http://vukotic.atspace.com/alb.htm
On Jun 30, Abdullah Konushevci wrote a message in which
he tried to conceal his own ignorance and the ignorance of
his mentors - George Starostin and Alexander Lubotsky:
"Stupidity, your name is Dušan. Mixing Gr adjective amorbos 'dark', where /b/ is from *gW and -os is simple masculine ending of adjectives, pretendingto connect it with amauros and further with bios, speaks for itself who the hell you are and what is your level of education on linguistics. But, I used to be attacked constantly f rom such outraged or manikos,if you like it in Greek, person. Simply, don't wait to answer on your provocations. I am feed-up from such kind of craziness.
So, Hasta la Vista, baby!"
The next they (July 1, 2007) I replied to Abdullah:
"If Abdullah were not so uneducated he would understandthat even MORON and MAROON belonged to the MURKY(Serb. MRKI dark or gloomy) sides of this world.
"Have you had any decent Greek dictionary in you hands?Obviously not! If you had one you would not talk nonsense!If you read a proper Greek you would know it was not mewho connected Greek αμαυρός and βίος into the compoundαμαυρόβιος (living in darkness); αμαυρός + βίος =αμαυρόβιος: and αμορβος is just one of the contracted formsof teh compound αμαυρόβιος (cf. αμορβαιος); there is noman in the whole world (of an avarage intelligence) whowouldnot notice that.
"Why did you put your prosthetic <R> between brackets -mje(r)gule? Why did you not follow Demiraj who, withoutblinking, inserted <R> into the Albanian word 'mjegull' (fog,mist, haze). If there was a dialectal form of Albanian mjegullwith the sound 'R' without brackets, why did you not mentionit? Where is so-called Proto-Albanian form mergulƒ? Whathappened, you do not recognize Demiraj as an authority inAlbanian "science"?
"I know, your task is to promote Shqip-Illyrian language andso-called Illyrian origin of the Albanian people. Nevertheless,you should be aware it has always been impossible to make
something from nothing! Albanian mjegull is a clearborrowing from Greek ομίχλη (fog, mist): Greek OMIKHLE- Serbian MAGLA => Albanian MJEGULL.
"Do you really believe you can insert a sound wherever youfind it suitable? Are you so stupid to think that you can useyour "magic rubber eraser" as you like? Haven't you noticed,this is a serious science!; and not your wanton hamlet's fair!
"Finally, this ie book is not only Abdulah's shame; it is shamefor George Starostin and Alexander Lubotsky who revisedand recognized the internet edition of the "updated" and"modernized" version of Julius Pokorny’s IndogermanischesEtymologisches Wörterbuch. Both of them are bearing bigresponsibility for allowing Abdullah to diseminate hisfoolishness and blemish the name and work of the greatscientist Julius Pokorny. I advise them (George and
Alexander) to re-revise this book agian and save their ownhonor and honor of those (probably Soros) who financedthem. Also, I think, George Starostin should think what hisfather would say about such a negligence and irresponsiblebehavior his son has manifested."
f. “ear point, awn” from N.Ger. aggel (with spirant. g) from IE *aku -lā; O.E. āwel m. “fork”,O.N. soð-āll “meat for (Gmc. *ahwala-, IE *áku -olo-); if here gallo-Lat. opulus “common
maple “ (Marstrander, Corr. Gmc.-celt. 18), would be placed IE *ok u- olo- ; about O.N. uggr etc. see e/o-stem, about O.E. éar see s-formant; Welsh ebill “drill”, mbr. ebil “peg, nail “
(*aku - ī lio -);
May Be Illyrian may be Martian http://vukotic.atspace.com/alb.htm
Note: The mutation kw > p, b in Celtic tongues, Lat. and Gk. Balt *ašus in Ltv. ass “ sharp, pointed “, Lith. ašutaĩ m. pl. “coarse horse hair “ = Slav.*ošuta m. “ Thistle “ in Church
Slavic оsъt ъ , Russ. osot . On account of here Toch. A āc āwe “rough” (Van Windekens Lexique
15)? see under *ōku -s “ fast (sharp in the movement) “. 4. With m-formant:
The excerpt from the Indo-European Dictionary; Language Association – http://dnghu.org/
Acumincum was the Celtic stronghold and it is believed that the Celts were those who namedthat station. Acumincum could not be translated as "salt-stone" ("salt-stone" is the Serbian name
- Slan-Kamen) if someone believed it was the Latin name, but eventually "sharp- stone" ('acus'pin, needle) or “sour/acid stone” (aceo acere be sour). It is interesting to mention that CelticAcamincum sounds almost the same as Serbian word Kamenac (a small stone). If it was acoincidence we must admit that such a coincidence is very unusual.
Namely, if Acumincum was a compound word and first word was acu- (doesn't matter if it wasakus or aceo) what the second part of that word meant? I think, there is no Latin word‘minci/um’ that will have the meaning “stone”. Of course, there are Latin words caementum (aquarry-stone, used for walls; cf. English cement) and cæmenta (stone chips used for makingmortar), both words obviously related to the Serbian word 'kamen' (Serb.adj. 'kamenit' stony).Now comes the most interesting part of this story: if the Scordisci (Celtic tribe) were the one toname Acumincum why the Celtic/Gaelic languages do not have a word (as far as I know) forstone similar to Latin cementum and Serbian kamen/ kamenac? Finally, if the Celts had wordsimilar to kamen or cement, is it possible to find out the history of that word and see whatlanguage
The man who wrote the above notation mentioned the Albanian word 'akull' (ice; akull doesn't
mean "sharp ice" as the author tried to mislead his readers), a clear Lat in borrowing (fromgelidus via Common Romanian; cf. Romanian gheaþã), related to Germanic kald- and Slavicholod-. In fact, the man who wrote this part of the "improved" Pokorny's book, thought that hemust somehow connect Albanian akull with the Latin acus (pin, needle); or acula (little needle),aculeolus (little needle, pin) and Slavic igla (Serbian igla /needle/, Czech jehla /needle/, Russianигла; cf. Serbian klin /nail, wedge, bolt, pin/); if it was not possible otherwise why would he notuse the well- known fact that ice might be very sharp when broken! ;-)
However, this writer used the "holy" Pokorny's book to propagate his own ideas about Illyirianlanguage and Illyrian origin of Albanian people.
There are a lot of Serbian place names Kamenica. A dozen of villages and two larger cities inSerbia - Sremska Kamenica and Kosovska Kamenica. The whole Balkan area is full of Kamenica geographical names. Author of the above note seems to have really believed thatKamenica was an Illyrian toponym. Of course, he has the right to believe whatever he want but
he has no right to pollute a great work, as Pokorny's Indogermanisches Wörterbuch is, with hisfolk-etymology's interpretation and overheated nationalistic dreams. As we have already seen,Latin, Celtic and Serbian (Greek also: κουνώ, άκμων) vocabularies possess the word related toAcumincum-Kamenac-Kamenica, with the proper meaning - stone, rock. Only language wheresuch a word does not exist is Albanian.
If the people who have revised this book were thinking about the credibility of science and theirown credibility they would advise the author of these passages to draw back all his unprovenand uncertain theries and hypotheses and would demand him to abide strictly by thewell-known scientific methods and standards.
"Wrong! Albanian afroj, afer (squeeze, near) and O.C.S. blizь (Serbian blizu /near, nigh, closeto/) have nothing to do with each other, because they are coming from different basis (afrojfrom BR-GON and blizu from BEL-GON).
I wonder what "similar" Abdullah could have found between this two words. Albanian afrojmay be compared with the Serbian words priæi (from prigoniti; come closer) and prionuti(prijanja stick together, cleave; cf. German Freund, English friend, Serbian prijatelj, prijan, prika /friend/): once again Serbian prijanja (stick together, cleave) <=> Albanian afroj/afronj (near,
bring close, squeeze)... Of course there are other cognates like Serbian prezanje/na-prezanje /pregnuæe
(pressing), English press (from Latin presso, pressare); Greek βαρησις (pressure, oppression);Serbian prignati/prigoniti (drive closer) and the great number of words in other IE languages,
May Be Illyrian may be Martian http://vukotic.atspace.com/alb.htm
"Cleansing the history through burning earth, a well-know strategy of Serbian Army, was judged as a crime against humanity. The same could be seen in your messages, cleansing thehistory through equation of Illyrians with Martians. You have no clue about l/r shift in manyPIE roots, so what the hell do you ask from anyone to reply on your disgusting posts. I will begmoderators of sci.lang to save some level of decency, for VD and Alexander Lubotsky are twouncomparable measures."
Konushevci
My answer was precise:
"I cannot see what the Serbian army has to do with your linguistic ignorance; stop complainingto everyone and try to be a grown up man.What l/r shift?; are we talking about Japanese kind of rhotacism? Are you suggesting that Slavic bliz- turned to be Albanian afroj or it happened theother way round. Both of the above assumptions, in connection with l/r shift, are wrong; maybeyou have another (hidden) option on your mind.
Blizu and afroj were born from different basis; are you really unable to understand it?"
Maybe Alb. (*aest ā-, *vesna, *vièsientá) vjeshta “autumn, harvest time (long summer)”: Go.asans “harvest time, summer” [common Alb. prothetic v- before bare initial vowels] henceVesta “goddess of hearth and its sacred fire” was an Illyrian goddess, also Alb. vatra(*vastra) “hearth” with -tre suffix.
The excerpt from the Indo-European Dictionary; Language Association – http://dnghu.org/
"If I were following the Abdullah's way of thinking I could say that Vesta was a Serbiangoddess, a reduced form of the Serbian ne-vesta (bride, not married, unleashed); from theSerbian verb vezati (tie, bond). If not from Serbian it could be from the English word fasten oreven West. Abdulalh is somewhere inbetween because he believes that Roman goddess Vesta(Greek Hestia) was in fact West-Illyrian or, closer, West- Albanian female deity. Of course,quite logical, if Vesta was the goddess of hearth (fireplace), it must be connected to some of thewords from the Shqip-Illyro-Albanian vocabulary... and of coruse, the word 'vatër' imposeditself in a most natural way. In fact, we are going to take the Albanian vatër (fireplace) inpluralform - 'vatra' -and "spice" it with the <s> infix. What we have achieved? VASTRA! OK.With the help of the special AlbanianwRRRenching tool, the unnecessary R intRRRuder will beremoved and - VASTA is born! Finally, some fine ablaut-adjustment is needed before we couldsee, in a ll her brilliancy, the Shqip-Illyro-Albanian female
English meaning: to drive, to overwhelm, harm Deutsche Übersetzung: “worauf eindringen,treiben, überwältigen, kränken” Material: present *(a)i-neu-mi : O.Ind. inóti, ínvati, Imper.inuhí, participle -inita- (úpenita- “ pushed, cut into “), “ penetrate into something, master “, Av. inaoiti, Inf. aē naŋhe “violate, hurt “, ainita (from *an-inita by haplology) “ not violated,not painedly “ (from ai énas- n. “Crime, sin, misfortune “ = Av. aē nah- “ act of violence,crime “, in addition m. “ evildoer”?),Av. intay-” rape, injury; torture “, O.Ind. iná-‘strong; m.master “,maybe also ī ti-h f. “plague,need”; Gk. αινος “tremendous”; maybe Alb. inati“anger; ire; rage; dander; dudgeon; rampage;down;disappointment; malice; blood; rancour;rancor; pique; spunk; miff; temper; must”.maybe here-in- in Goth. faír-ina “guilt, reproach”,O.H.G. firinōn ‘sin”, O.Ice. firn n. pl. “the extraordinary” (cf Weisweiler IF. 41, 29 f.), if original meaning (as in the Heliand) “ act of violence “.
References: WP. I 1, Feist 139/140.
Page(s): 10
Indo-European Language Association – http ://dnghu.org/ Page 35
"Albanian word <inat> (anger, grudge, resentment) is the loan word from Serbian <inat>(defiance, grudge, anger); the basis of this word is the reduplicated primal basis (Gon); mostsimply, it can be connected to the Serbian word 'gonjenje' (driving, chasing) or English 'hunting'.Other cognate of the word 'inat' are the Serbian words 'junak' (hero) and 'junoša' (young man)and English 'young' (cf.English anger, Greek ankhein squeeze; Latin ango press thight, causepain, strangle; Serbian 'uzano/usko' narrow from Serb. 'nagnati' press together or 'ugoniti' drivein, as if driving the sheep into the sheepfold); Serb. ganuti "feel the pain")."
English meaning: bright, shining Deutsche Übersetzung: “klar, hell, leuchtend” Material: AwN.. eiskra “ rage before hot excitement “, Mod.Ice. iskra also from burning pain. Lith.áiškus, where beside zero grade O.Lith. iškùs “clear, bright “. Russ. dial. jáska, demin. jásoèka “ bright star “, beside it O.Bulg. jasno adv. “clear, bright,distinct”, Russ. jásnyj“light, clear, bright” from *aiskno-; Pol. jaskry, jaskrawy “blinding,dazzling, brilliant “ from*aiskro-; O.Bulg. iskra “ spark “ etc. from *iskr ā. Maybe zero grade in Alb. (*aiskno-)shkëndijë ‘spark” [common Alb. n > nd phonetic mutation]. Also Alb. zero grade (*jaskry),shkrinj “melt, burn”, participle *scrum > shkrumb “ashes” [common Alb. m > mb shift]loaned in Rom. scrum “ashes”. Russ. dial. jáska, demin. jásoèka “ bright star “, besidesO.Bulg. jasno adv. “ clear, distinct “, Russ. jásnyj “ bright, clear “ from *aiskno; Pol. jaskry, jaskrawy “ brilliant, sparkling “ from *aiskro; O.Bulg. iskra ‘spark” etc. from *iskr ā.
Here the FlN Ger. Aisch (Bavaria), Eysch(en) (Luxembourg), nEng. Axe from Celt. or Ven.-Illyr. *Aisk ā. Maybe Alb. (*aisk ā) eshkë “mushroom (when dried used to kindle the fire)”related to Lat.esca -ae f. “food, victuals, esp. as bait”,
References: WP. I 2, Trautmann 4, Pokorny UrIllyr. 70, 113, M. Förster
Themse 839.
See also: perhaps originated from *aidh-sk- , or from *ai-sk- in āi-
4.
Page(s): 16-17
Indo-European Language Association – http ://dnghu.org/ Page 39
"Slavic "iskra" (sparkle) and "jasno" (clear, bright) are not the offsprings of the same"progenitor"; it means that the root *aisk- could be the source only of the word 'iskra' (sparkle).What's happened in reality? Slavic 'jasno' (bright, clear) is the word which comes from theancient Bel-Gon basis. 'Jasno' is a reduced form of the verb 'bljesnuti' (flash; Ger. Blitz) and'obasjati' (lighten); we can throw the parallel here between Serbian bljesnuti (flash) => objasniti(clarify) => jasno (clear, bright) and German blitzen (twinkling) => leuchten (shine, flash) =>licht (light);
On the other side, Slavic 'iskra' was born from the basis Sur-Hor (Serb. sagoreti, izgoreti /burn,cremate, burn down/. The Albanian 'shkrinj' (melt, burn) comes from the same Sur-Hor basis(and thanks God, Abdullah finally put something right), and it is equal to Serbian 'izgaranje'(burning). Abdullah is also right here (although he is uncertain as usual; his maybe-yes-maybe-no sanctuary!) when saying that skrumb (char, cinder; not ashes as Abdullahclaimed; ash/ashes = hi/hira in Albanian) and Romanian scrum (ashes) belong to the wordsofthe same origin as Slavic 'iskra' (sparkle) and 'sagoreti/ izgoreti' (burn)."
_________________________________________________
aiu-, aiu- EVER; always; EWIG - UVEK
Page(s): 17-18
Indo-European Language Association – http ://dnghu.org/ Page 44
"Let us compare Serbian adverb 'uvek' (a lways) and German 'ewig' (eternal). I hope we couldagree that notion eternal is closely related with "always". In addition, we will see that Serbianword'vek' has the meanings 'century' (a period of 100 years) and "age" (lifetime). The otherSerbian word, derived from the Be l-Gon basis, is the adjective 'veèno', which has the samemeaning as the above-mentioned German 'ewig' (eternal). Now it became clear that Serbian'uvek' is the cognate to German 'ewig'. ;-)Abdullah is ALWAYS trying to find an Albanian wordthat could be suitable for a certain Pokorny's root. And it would be OK if it were not socompulsively done. In this case Pokorny found the Albanian word 'eshe, (tanks to Norbert Jokl;Zeitraum, span of time), but I cannot see how that word could be classified among the other IE
words with the meaning 'always'. Maybe Abdullah could help me to understand this item better.
As I told many times before, Albanian language was compiled from the surrounding languages,mostly from Greek, Italian and Serbian without any rule or system. It is the reason why theAlbanian language is so difficult to decipher. For example. Albanian 'vjeshtë' means autumn and'vejushë' is widow. It is hard to say how this words suffered such a deep and unusual soundchanges. Explanation probably lies in the fact that Albanian adopted foreign words according tothe way they heard and understood it."
poukso-) “Flaumfedern, Daunen, feines wolliges Haar an animals” (outof it Lith. pũkas“Flaumfeder”), Russ. pušistyj “fleecy, dense, buschig”, pušnój továr “Pelzwerk”, Cz.-nsorb.o-puš (*puchъ), opyš “tail”, Russ. opúška, opušina “edge (of Waldes), hem, Verbrämung”.
Pokorny Page: 849
And what to say about Abdullah's scientific approach? Commenting above Pokorny's rootpūk-1, peuk- Abdullah (or his mentors Starostin and Lubotsky) claimed that "Alb. suggests that Root pūk-1, peuk- : (thick-haired, *fox) is a reduced root of older Lat. volpes “fox”, Gk.alôpêx a fox. Root ulp-,lup-, lup- : [a kind of carnivore (fox, wolf)...]*.
My comment:
"In this case not only that Abdullah forgot to denote the Albanian word (or whatever Albanian)that "suggest" something, but he also mixed wolf and fox with dormouse (small furry-tailedsquirrel-like rodent) - Serbian puh. Although Abdullah can speak Serbian fluently (at school he
has been taught in Serbian) he did not connec t the name 'puh' (dormouse) with the Serbian verbpuhati/puhnuti (blow) and adjective na-puhan (inflated, blown up). Logically, dormouse's tailand body looks like "na-puhano" (inflated) because of its "blown-up" fur hairs. The Serbianverb 'puhnuti' (blow, inflate) is cognate of the English blow (both stemmed from Bel-Gon basis)and we can understand it completely if we compare the meanings of English 'blow' and Serbianverbs 'puhnuti' (blow) and 'puknuti' (explode).
"On the other side is volpe (Latin belua, English wolf), derived from the reduplicated Bel basis;and it means that 'puh' (dormouse) cannot be compared with Latin volpe (fox; Greek alopex).
"It could be interesting to mention that Serbian word 'lopov' (thief, burglar; cf. volpe) has beenderived from the same reduplicated Bel basis. Theft and burglary are the main practices of thatanimal (fox), including cunningness (Serbian lukav, lukavost) what is returning us again to theBel-Gon basis; i.e. to Slavic volk, vlk, Greek lycos) Slavic volk (volf) is the word from the samesource (Bel-Gon) as above mentioned puh (dormouse).
"The final conclusion is unquestionable: root pūk-1, peuk- is not and cannot be the reduced
form of ulp-,lup-, but the fact is that both of these roots could be derived from the larger basisBel-Bel-Gon, if we consider Greek alopex (Serbian lopina, lopuža /thief/)...
"Of course, this roots and different IE words for animals like wolf and fox demand muchdeeper analyzis, for to be exposed in all possible details.
ulp-, lup- (*suilkW-)COW EATING WOLF
Listen to this stupidity: "Maybe Alb. lopë “cow, (hugeconsuming animal; cow eaten by wolves)”, llup “devour”,llapë “tongue” : Lith. lapenti “to swallow food”.Page 2737 dnghu.org; Pokorny 1179_________________________________________________My comment:
"Interesting, cow has been named in Albanian 'lopë' and,
according to Abdullah's opinion, it is related to the Latinword lupus (wolf); on the other side, wolf is called ulk/ujk inAlbanian. What a miraculous Sqip-Illyrian naming;something in style of Polat Kaya, the "famous" Turkishetymologist whose crankiness Abdullah mentioned recently,
May Be Illyrian may be Martian http://vukotic.atspace.com/alb.htm
when he attac ked me, safely hidden behind Cybalist"moderated" curtain."I just wander why the Albanians did not name sheep inaccordance with the Latin lupus/volpes; sheep is much morefavorite pray for wolf/fox than cow - particularly a grown upone!"Using such a special word and sound-change"technology" there is nothing in the world that you cannot"prove". Associated with two others great scientists (G.S. andA.L.), Abdulah taught Pokorny that his root *lup- was
derived from *ulkW- (most sanative kw => p Indo-Illyriansound change)."Neither Abdullah nor his two soul-trading mentors were
able to understand that Slavic volk (wolf) and lisica (fox)originated from the Bel-Gon basis while lupus (wolf) andvolpes (fox) sprang from the reduplicated Bel ur-syllable.There is a Serbian word 'lupež ' (thief, crook; a lso lopina,lopuža, lopušina) which is obviously connected to Latinlupus (wolf) and Greek αλωπεκίς / alopekis (fox) and... inSerbian, the history of these words is clear."I was talking many times here about the Bel-Gon basis andwords like English begin and Serbian pogon, waggon, way,voziti, Weg, pulse and Serbian polazak (start, outset); In caseof the noun volk and lisica the word obilaziti (resort, range,roam); hence obilazak (visit) => (b)liska => lisica (fox) =>lija; on the other side, Serbian word 'obilaženje' (in sense of
visit) can also be uvlaèenje (prowling, move about in apredatory manner; from the sam Bel-Gon basis as 'obilaženje'visiting), uvlaka, volk, vuk (wolf)."In order to understand how interesting the development andhistory of a certain words can be, let me mention the Latinword veterinus (from vehiterinus; veho bear, carry, ride,pass), i.e. vehi-terinus is the same as Serbian "vuèna životinja" (burden-bearing or pulling animal). Now we arecoming back to the above mentioned "begining' and thewords pogon, waggon, way, voziti, Weg, pulse... However,Slavic 'volk ' is not a pulling animal although the Slavic "volk"name has been derived from the noun 'vlaèenje ' (vlak, volk,vuk, vuèji)..."And, please, do not mix Latin fera with German Tier or
maybe with Slavic ' zver ', Swedish 'djur ', Sanskrit 'tiryanc'(tiryan), dhúrya (beast of burden)...
It seems Root ades-, ados- : ‘sort of cereal” evolved from an older root * heg h- “ a kind of
grain “. This root was suffixed with common -ska formant in Gmc. branch Gmc. * atisk- a-,while in Anatolian branch the root was suffixed with common PIE -tar formant. The old
laryngeal (Centum h - > a-, e- : Satem h - > s- ) was lost except in Hitt. and Arm. Clearly Gmc.tongues borrowed the cognate from a reduced Lat. (*hattar-) adoris > Gmc. *at-isk-a-.Finally zero grade in Alb. (< ad ō ris) *dris, drizë “thorny plant”, (< dris) drithë “grain”where the Lat. -is ending has been solidified.
The surprise is the phonetic mutation -g h- > -d- found only in Av. - Illyr.- Balt languages.
_______________________________*Above note is from the "updated" and "enhanced" Proto-Indo- European EtymologicalDictionary ;A Revised Edition of Julius Pokorny’s Indogermanisches Etymologisches
Wörterbuch http://dnghu.org/ - "revised" by George Starostin and Alexander Lubotsky.
Latin ador -oris (grain, spelt) and granum -i (grain, seed). First, we must know that these twoLatin words came from the same Hor-Gon basis; or more exactly, from the Hor-Goon and itsinverted Gon-Hor basis (Cf. Serbian <okretati> turn, rotate, revolve and <koturati> turn, rotaterevolve). Latin granum and Serbian zrno (grain) are a clear-cut "produc ts" of the "circle"(Serbian krug, Latin cicino, corona). In Serbian, there are the words <okrug> and <kotar>, bothwith the meaning 'district'; equal to Greek <agros> (χώρα) and Lat in <regio -onis> (region).Now, if we compare Serbian word <jedro> (nucleus, core; from Gon-Hor basis) and Latin
<ador> (grain; Gon-Hor basis aagain) we will be able to comprehend the whole scale of phonetic changes, which have metamorphosed inverted Hor-Gon basis in accordance with thedemands of different (in this case Latin and Serbian) IE languages. Above mentioned Serbian<kotar> 'district' is known in the northern part of Serbia as <atar> 'area' and it sounds almost thesame as Hittite <hattar> 'cereal'. These examples are showing that the notion of 'circle' (Latin
May Be Illyrian may be Martian http://vukotic.atspace.com/alb.htm
cirkino, Greek kirkos/krigos, Serbian krug/kotur) has been very inspiring in sense of namingdifferent things in different IE languages.
Abdullah, as we can see from his above statement, t ried again to introduce his Illyrianconfabulation as an undeniable fact. Unfortunately, Lubotsky and G. Starostin helped him toadvertise his national dream in their newest edition of Pokorny's PIE Dictionary. Namely,
Abdullah is "surprised" by seeing that -g h- > -d- phonetic mutation "could be found only in Av.- Illyr.- Balt languages" (of course, an invented Illyrian is equal here to the compiled Albanian). In reality, Albanian <drithë> (grain) is a disguised loanword from Serbian <jedro> 'nucleus','core' or Greek <σιτηρά> (Lat. ador grain). On the other side, Albanian <drizë> 'thorny plant'has nothing to do with the above "cereal" and "grain" words, because it was borrowed fromGreek - <ternax> 'stalk of the cactus' (cf. Serbian trn, English thorn)
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ad(u)-, ad-ro- (*heg hero)* JEZERO-
JEDRO-JEZGROEnglish meaning: water current Deutsche Übersetzung: “Wasserlauf” Note: From Root ang (h)Wi- : ‘snake, worm” derived Root akW ā- (more properly ekW ā): ē kW-: “water, river”; Root
"What is the meaning of Abdullah's "common Alb.-Illyr.-Balt-g h- > -d-, -z- phonetic mutation"? Did he ever hear aboutthe "common" Slavic kgh/czs palatalization? What a shamefor Lubotsky and G. Starostin; they allowed one uneducatedperson to access Pokorny's PIE dictionary; doesn't matter if itwas electronic edition."Slavic <ozero>, < jezero> lake has its completelytransparent etymology in Slavic languages and I do not
understand that someone dares to say that such a wordbelong to some confabulated (non-existent) Illyrian."I already told that Albanian name for lake (liqen) isborrowed from Romance <lac>, while the words like<vlagët > 'wet' and <baticë> (tide) are loanwords fromSerbian <vlaga> 'wetness' and < potok, potoci> 'brook,stream' (Serbian ' poteæi' run off water). The Albanian words<uje> 'water' and <shi> are specially interesting because inboth words the elision of initial sounds ('v' or 'k') is clearlyvisible: Namely, Albanian 'uje' is Slavic <voda>, probablyacquired via Serbian 'piti/pojiti ' (drink; Albanian pi, pije =>uje; cf. Alb ujk wolf and Slavic volk/vlk/vuk, v-ujko) while<shi> must be a shortened form of Serbian <KISHI > 'it'sraining'; it means that Albanians misheard that Serbian word -SHI instead of KI-SHI. Finally there is Albanian <spërkatje>borrowed from Italian <spruzzo> or Serbian <isprskati>
'splash'. We can see that there is not a single word in sense of water that Albanians inherited from their Caucasianmotherland - just loanwords!"In my previous message I wrote about the Serbian wordsKRUG/KOTUR (circle) and I explained what happened andhow 'kotur' became 'jedro' (nucleus). There is anotherSerbian word coming from the Gon-Hor basis - it is 'jezgro'(same meaning as ' jedro'); it shows that the ancient Gon basiswas "laryngealized" and it first sounded as GoHn (wherefromGerman gehen). Thus we have got GeHn-Hor => Ges-Hor => geshero (like Icelandic geyser ) => jezero (Slavic lake). Iwould not be suprised if I hear that Abdullah is explainingwords like Latin cezar and German Keiser with the help of his invented Illyrian and compiled Albanian. These words arerelated to the word 'hunter '... but about it next time
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May Be Illyrian may be Martian http://vukotic.atspace.com/alb.htm
Maybe nasalized Alb. (*an´ gas) ne¨kon´ j, Gheg angoj´ “groan, sigh, complain of pain, evil”(*enq-); prove the link between Root agos- : [fault, guilt, blame, sin (damage, injury,sacrilege, evil)] and Root enq-, onq- : (to sigh, groan) [see below] Note: It is possible Root agos- (*hege-): “fault, sin, *blood guilt” is a zero grade of Lat. sangue “blood”, Alb. gjak “blood” see Root s(u?)ek?o-s : ‘sap, pitch, *blood”.
"First, Gheg <ankoj/angoj> is a reduced form of the verb <rënkoj> groan; and this word alsolost its initial velar, because <rënkoj> is borrowed from Serbian <groktanje> (grunting),<graknuti> 'caw, croak' or from Italian <grugnito> grunt.
"This words are a good example that can help us to understand the way in wich the Albanianswere adopting the foreign words: often by elision of initial consonant and sometimes byremoving the whole first syllable (for instance, Albanian <vlagë> 'humidity' is a loanword fromSerbian <vlaga> 'humidity' and <vlagët> and <lagët> are words with the meaning 'wet' /Serbian'vlažan'/; Albanian <udhëtoj> 'travel' from Serbian <voditi> 'lead', <udhëheq> 'guide' fromSerbian <vodic> 'guide'; Albanian <ujk> 'wolf' from Serbian hypocoristic form for wolf -<vujko> 'wolf' (cf. Serbian surname Vujk-ovic); Albanian <grusht> 'fist', 'handfull' from Serbian<pre-gršt> 'handfull' /from gruda, grozd lump: from KRUG circle/; most interesting seems to bethe Albanian word <shi> 'rain' from Serbian <ki-shi!> 'it rains'; from 'kisnuti' - triplicated Gonsyllable, like in Serbian 'nagoniti' (drive, to force); hence also Serb. <sneg> 'snow' and <snaga>'power, force'.
There is another Albanian word with the meaning groan, sigh - it is <kërcitje> whichadditionally proves that above-mentioned <ankoj> and <rënkoj> are the shortened forms of theIE words like Serbian <krecati>, <kriknuti> 'cry.
"Albanian <gjakësi> 'murder' is clearly connected to the Albanian word for blood <gjak> and itshows that this word has nothing to do with the IE root s(u)okW-o- (Serbian sok juice, juhasoup or Latin jus): it means that Albanian <gjak> is related to other Albanian words: <gjah>'hunting, prey' and <gjahtar> 'hunter'; the fact is that Albanian <gjak> was derived from thereduplicated Gon basis, as it happened to
"Latin 'jus' or Serbian 'juha' (soup), but the logic here was different because Albanian <gjak>'blood' is transparently connected to the other Albanians words referring to murder <gjakësi>,hunting <gjah> and <gjahtar> 'hunter'.
"Latin sanguis is related to the Serbian word <snaga> 'strength', 'power' and we can see it viaadditional meanings of sanguis (blood- relationship, life-blood, strength, vigor); from
Sur-Gon-Gon basis; sur-tong => strong; sur-nonga => snaga; sur-gnuti => Serb. suknuti (asudden rapid flow, gush /water, smoke/; c f. Serbian kisnuti (get wet by rain) <= > suknuti (gush)
In one of his messages Abdullah wrote: " Dear Trond,As you may have noticed, I was very tired from some other
non-pleasant posts. I will try to make some further explanation about some place, folks, river and personalnames and from time to time to enlarge as much as possiblethe list. "Lets start from f irst entry: abhro- 'strong, mighty': 1a. Albafër 'close, near', cf O.C.S. blizь (r/l shift); b. afronj 'bringclose, squeeze', cf. Ltv. blaîzît ‘squeeze, clash, hit'. I will add here freely Dardanian folk name (FN) Gal-abroi (Strabo,
Geographica, VII, 3,18) as well as Illyrian FN Abroi and Thrac PN Abro-.*ab-/*ap- 'water, river'. 1. Alb amë 'river,source', pl. emna, from *ab-no through -bn-/-mn- mutation;amull 'backwater' derived from *akWa:-/*agWa;- throughthe shift -gW- > -b-, -kW- > -p-, attested in Greek, Illyrianand Celtic languages, as well as in some Albanianderivatives, cf. Lat amnis 'river', Ir ab 'river' and Illyrian place name Am-antia/Ab-antia, RN Am-ar, Am-ana (Krahe, Beekes). It is to be notices m/b alternation like in other words. "Root *ades-/*ados- 'sort of cereal' evolved f rom an older root *heg'h- 'a kind of grain' through phonetic mutation-g'h- > -d- found only in Alb-Illyrian and Baltic languages,cf. Alb dardhë ‘pear, pear tree’ from *Heg’hord- withregular change -g’h- > -d- from full-grade *g’hord- and
Greek akhrados ‘wild pear’ Huld, BAE, page 48). Botanically is proved that Dard-ania was the most suitableregion of growing of wild pear. There are many placenames with appellative dardhë ‘pear’ in Albania and Dardania (now Kosova). So, till now, we have these
May Be Illyrian may be Martian http://vukotic.atspace.com/alb.htm
material: ABROI, GAL-ABROI, probably ABRO, AM-ANTIA/AB-ANTIA, AM-AR, AM-ANA, DARD-ANIA that could be explained with Albanian appellatives afr-onj, amë,dardhë. We have as well –g’h- > -d- and –gW- > -b- and -kW- > -p- mutation and m/b alternation. *** Yes, as far as I know, -gW- > -b- and -kW- > -p- is regular phonetic mutation on Greek, Celtic, Illyrian-Albanian, cf. Rom apa 'water' from*akWa:- or Dardanian Ulkiana(*wl.kWo-ana), besides Ulpiana or Alb umb 'small polwshare' from * from *unkW-ni, zero-grade of *wekW-ni(gW and kW - l abiovelars). Regards,Konushevci
My comment was: "Thanks Abdullah!Now I understand that the Serbian word 'luk' (arcus) isderived from the English loop, or... it was vice versa - loop issome kind of arc?"Thanks for explaining me that Latin volpe (fox) was derivedfrom Slavic volk (wolf)! How else could I know that Serbianverb ''ulivati' (to pour in) came from other Serbian word withthe almost same meaning - 'ulokati se' (booze); of course, we just need a famous Abdullah's Shqip-Illyrian law ulk => ulb;a miracle sound-change we have been waiting formillenniums! "Why do you not say people that Ulkiana is the name youinvented yourself. Would you be so kind to specify thesource where that , so-called Illyrian place, was mentionedunder the name Ulkiana.Maybe you thought Ullikana, aHawaiian tale!"Try to google it: Ulpiana 30,800 Ulkiana; 58 (mainlyAlbanian web pages); Books: Ulpiana 640, Ulkiana none(!) Abdullah: Try Ulciana. It was my tipo. My answer: "Maybe you think Portuguese province Luciana(prefecture Ulciana)! Again only Albanian web pages...[...Po ky fenomen, sipas mendimit tim, do t'i ketë përfshirëedhe emrat Ulcinium - Ulqin; Ulciana - Ulpiana të formuaranga fjala ilire ulk e ruajtur edhe në shqipen po si ulk, ujk..]
Translated from Albanian: "But this phenomenon (wolf),according to some opinions, includes also the names Ulcinum- Ulqin; Ulciana - Ulpiana; from where the Albanian wordslike ulk and ujk were [allegedly] formed... Abdullah and other Albanian scientist are trying to say thatAlbanian word 'ujk' (wolf) is derived from a certa in Illyrianword. Of course, Albanian 'ulk/ujk' is a clear derivative of theSlavic volk (wolf). Nevertheless, the name of this city (Ulcinj,Ulcinum) probably has not been connected with the name of volk (wolf). Ulcinj is well-know after its numerous (coastal)olive trees and it is more plausible that this city aquired itsname in accordance with the Serbian/Slavic word 'ulje' (oil)or Latin oleum, olei; similar to the name Uljanik (island inCroatia, also known after its Olive production). "Finally, as we can see, it does not matter if Ulcinj (Lat.Ulcinum) has got the name from 'volk' (wolf) or 'ulje' (oil),because both words clearly belong to the Slavic vocabulary(or Latin - oleum.olei). "There is another possibility that Ulcinj was named by theSlavic word 'luka' (port ), for instance, Serbian 'uluèiti brod'(bringing a ship into a port; luka comes from uvlaka bay;uvlaèiti => uluèiti), but I do not know that Ulcinj ever wasan important port town.
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May Be Illyrian may be Martian http://vukotic.atspace.com/alb.htm
The phonetic shift gWh > zj took place in Alb. alone as a typical Alb. phonetic mutatIon. Hence Slav languages borrowed Alb. (Illyrian) cognate in O.C.S. žeravъ “ blazing “, požar ъ“blaze”.Maybe other Alb. cognates: zjej “boil, cook”, zi adj., m.”black, burnt”, (duplicated zezë adj., f. “black, burnt”. Also Alb.Tosk zjarr “fire, glow, heat, fervour “ : Rom. jar “fire,glow, heat, fervour “ which proves the migration from Albania to Rumania after the TurkishinvasIon.Lat. formus “warm” (Festus), fornus, furnus (*gWhorno-s), fornā x “oven (latter in a fem. āstembe ing based on), fornix, -icis “ dome“ (*fornicos “die Gestalt an Ofens habend”);
What to say about Abdullah's, G. Starostin's and Lubotsky's insolence? What to say about G.Starostin's and A. Lubotsky's (un)wittingly negligence? Please my dear friends, would you mindto read again this Abdulah's unbelievable statement. He says: "gWh > zj is typical Alb. phoneticmutation... "HENCE SLAVIC LANGUAGES BORROWED ALBANIAN (ILLYRIAN)COGNATE IN O.C.S." ŽERAV blazing, POŽAR blaze."
"Slavic žerav and žar are clearly and logically connected to the Common- Slavic root *gērъ or
common IE basis Hor-Gon (Serbian goreti burn, Czech vyhoøet burn down, Russianгорящий /garyashciy burning, Slovak horiet). Slavic žar and žerav are the words that werederived from the lengthened basis Bel-Hor-Gon (Serbian pogoreti /burn down/; same as theabove Czech vyhoøet. It means that verb 'pogoreti' (burn down) gave the noun 'požar'(palatalization) and 'žar' was a product of the reduct ion of the noun 'po-žar'. Once again:POGORETI => POŽAR =>ŽAR and its later derivation ŽERAVICA.
"On the other side, we have no word in Albanian with the meaning of burning, that begins withvelar except (as far as I know) hi, hiri (ashes). Ash is the product of burning and if it is derivedfrom the IE root gWher- it means that it comes at the end of a logical process; burning beginswith fire and ends with ashes. Only in the heads of Albanian (Shqip-Illyrian scientists it looksdifferent - it starts in an inverted manner - first ashes and then fire!
Albanian djeg - burn (a borrowing form Slavic/Serbian žega; this word is derived fromreduplicate Gon basis - Serbian džagnuti, džagati, prodžagati (poke the fire); cf. Serbian žacnuti(sting /like a bee/; in sense of burning); there are a great number of similar Gon derivatives inSerbian like æušnuti, kucnuti, kuèiti, èuknuti, tuknuti/ taknuti/tuæi (all with the meaning close toEnglish kick); Irish dóigh burn, Lithuanian dagas fire, heat; Serbian žestok (furious, scorching);žestoka vatra (wild fire), žestina (ardor, fe rvor, zeal), žiža (focus), žižak/žiška (ember) andhundreds of other Serbian words which are clearly and logically interlaced. Of course thisanalysis should also take in consideration words like German Tag, Serbian dan (day) and manyothers from different European languages, but I have no time for this at the moment.Nevertheless, above examples would be enough to understand tha t Albanian is the last languagein Europe that would be able to help us to understand the history of any (single) Indo-Europeanword. Why? Because Albanian is formed of loan words altogether... Greek, Latin (Italian,Romanian) and Serbian
Albanian zjarr - fire (the word is borrowed from Slavic; there is no way that anyone can explainthe history of that word in Albanian; If you do not believe me - please ask Abdulah - he willconfirm my words).
tym - smoke (loan word from Serbian 'dim'; also word derived from reduplicated Gon basis (seeabove-mentioned Irish dóigh and Lithuanian dagas burn, fire); in fact, dim came from the
"Aleta (Ptoleme II, 15) not identified. Same suffix like inroyal Molosian name Alk-eta. Resemblance with Aletium in Apulia is striking. A town Halata is in present Monte-Negro. According to Krahe, the element al- appears also in cityname Al-eva, Al-eta in Sicilia (Ptol. 3,4), Al-etius, Venetian person name; also Aletrium mons in Latium with identical
suffix like Illyrian Andetrium (see below). Variant forms Al-ata, Nal-ata suggest that it may be related to PAlb nal-të‘high (place, mountain)’. So, the root is probably *H2el- ‘togrow’.(Pokorny 2. al- 26.)"
May Be Illyrian may be Martian http://vukotic.atspace.com/alb.htm
My comment:"Abdullah probably never heard for a dog called Molosser (name derived from Molossia, a country once located inWestern Greece). Molosser could be translated from Greekas Black Mountain dog. Albanian Malësor has the samemeaning as Crnogorac or Montenegrin ."I would like to see what alchemy Abdulah has used to
acquire the meaning 'high' from so-called PAlb nal-të; or ithappened so because the Greek word μελας / melas (black)was misunderstood by the Albanians, MELAS-ORO/S
μελας / ορο-ς means BLACK MOUNTAIN in Greek andAlbanian MALESOR's real meaning is not "highlander" but Black Highlander or Montenegrin."Present Republic of Montenegro (Serbian Crna Gora) is aBlack Mountain; the same Black Mountain exist inMacedonia (Skopska Crna Gora) compared with Melas-oro(also Black Mountain) in Greek. As we can see, onlyAlbanians and Albanian language missed BLACK MONTAIN because of their inaptitude to understand foreign languages(in this case Greek) properly."Actually, the Albanians adopted Greek μελας /MELAS,"translating" it to their own 'mountain'. Finally, the logcialquestion imposes itself: if the Albanians borrowed the GreekMELAS (black) in order to name the mountains where theywere allegedly born, how can anyone talk about aboutso-called Illyrian heritage in Albanian?"It means: had the Albanians been the true natives of Balkan
they must have had their own (inherited) name for mountain.Malisors (Greek melas oro/s) are the Black Mountaineers;Crnogorci are the Black Mountaineers or Monte Negrins;Greek Melas Oros (Black Mountain; Kara-dag in Turkish)became Albanian Malisor (mountaineer); it is the way howthe Greek word melas (black) became Albanian "mountain"."There is no borrowing from Albanian into Greek or anyother language in Balkan, simply, because Albanians werecolonized in Balkan during 12th century (in a small andnegligible number). It took them a few centuries to become areal and recognizable nation.
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Abdullah: "*ab-/*ap- 'water, river'. 1. Alb amë 'river, source', pl. emna, from *ab-no through-bn-/-mn- mutation; amull 'backwater' derived from *akWa:-/*agWa;- through the shift -gW-> -b-, -kW- > -p , attested in Greek, Illyrian and Celtic languages, as well as in some Albanianderivatives, cf. Lat amnis 'river', Ir ab 'river' and Illyrian place name Am-antia/Ab-antia, RN Am-ar, Am-ana (Krahe, Beekes). It is to be notices m/b alternation like in other words."
Dušan: "No, it is not truth! Compare Latin flumen, fluminis, and amnis and you will understandwhence comes the Albanian river (emna); Latin fluminis - amnis; Albanian lumë pl. lumenj =>ame, emna. This words, both Latin and Albanian have nothing in commen with aqua or root*akWa, because they were derived from the same source as English lake, Serbian plima (tide)or Greek λίμνη (lake); compare Greek ληνός (trough) and Serbian oluk (trough) just for a littlebrain gymnastics; Serbian plinuti (pour down), plimni (tidal)."
Abdullah: Root *ades-/*ados- 'sort of cereal' evolved from an older root *heg'h- 'a kind of grain' through phonetic mutation -g'h- > -d- found only in Alb-Illyrian and Baltic languages,cf. Alb dardhë ‘pear, pear tr ee’ from *Heg’hord- with regular change -g’h- > -d- from full-grade *g’hord- and Greek akhrados ‘wild pear’ Huld, BAE, page 48). Botanically is proved that Dard-ania was the most suitable region of growing of wild pear. There are many place names with appellative dardhë ‘pear’ in Albania and Dardania (now Kosova). So, tillnow, we have these material: ABROI, GAL-ABROI, probably ABRO, AM-ANTIA/AB-ANTIA, AM-AR, AM-ANA, DARD-ANIA that could be explained with Albanian appellatives afr-onj,amë, dardhë. We have as well –g’h- ..."
Dušan: Albanian dardhë is the borrowing from Greek άχερδος and you explained well thephonetic changes g/h => d. Do you not see that Greek akherdos, Serbian kruška and Albanianwere derived from the same Hor-Gon basis or, to be more understandable, from the word whichdenotes CIRCLE (Greek κρίκος, Serbian krug, Albanian rreth). And you are saying:"Botanically is proved that Dardania was the most suitable region of growing of wild pear."
Using such childish logic I would also say that Dardani were Darodani (Slavic name Darodan)and in Sebian 'darodan' or 'nadaren' means 'gifted' ; in Bulgaria Darodan is "the one who wasgiven as a gift" (Дародан - който е даден в дар).
Which one of these two crazy stories (your "pear-Dardanians" and my"gifted-Dardanians") is
May Be Illyrian may be Martian http://vukotic.atspace.com/alb.htm
more plausible? Do you not see a difference between folk-etymology and real science? I amsurprised that people (some of them are serious scientists or should be serious) on Sci.lang seemto believe in your Cinderella's midnight runaway chariot and lost shoo. Ridiculous!
OGANJ-JAGNJE-AGNUS Note: The old laryngeal centum h- > a-, e- : satem h- > s- in PIE; only Alb. and Umbr. and
Slavic preserved the old laryngeal through Alb. h- > k- phonetic mutatIon. Alb.Gheg kinxh,tosk (*egh-) qengj “lamb” : Umbr. habina(f) “ of a lamb “ : Lat. haed ī nus “of a kid” : O.C.S.:(j)agne “lamb” [common Alb. gh- > gl- > gj- : lith. gh- > dz- phoneticmutation]. Gk. (*agnos,abnos) αμνος derived from an earlier *abnos “lamb” [common Gk. κ W > p gW > b phoneticmutation, later b > mb > m common Illyr.-Gk. phonetic mutation] Gk. αμνος m. f., αμνη f.“lamb”; Lat. agnus, - ī , fem.-a “lamb” (agnī le ‘sheep stable”, lacking suffix affinity withO.C.S. jagnilo“ place where the sheep lamb “, a derivative of the verb jagniti “to lamb");O.Ir. ūan Welsh oen, O.Corn. oin, Bret. oan “lamb” (urk. *ognos with -gn- would have derived from *-gWhn-, not-*gWn-, in spite of Pedersen KG. I 109-bn; o- probably influence from*ouis ‘sheep”); O.E. ē anian, Eng. to yean “to lamb”, Dutch oonen ds. (from *aunōn from*auna- = IE *agWhno-); O.C.S. (j)agne “lamb” (with formants-et- broadened around popular names of young animals), (j)agnьcь “lambkins” contain fullgradatIon. Or is placed IE *og(h)no- : to *egW(h)no-? Through the Gmc. and Celt. presumed voiced-aspirated alsowould underlie the basis of Lat. and Slav. forms, so that Gk. αμνος (at first from *αβνος )remains the only dependable indication in voiced-nonaspirated gW. If Umbr. habina(f) “ of alamb “ could be explained from intersection from *hedino- = Lat. haed ī nus “of a kid” and
*abnī no- = Lat. agninus “of a lamb; f. as subst., lamb’s flesh”, however, would point Umbr. bto voiced-nonaspirated. But maybe it has become gWh in Osc.-Umbr. to b. Note: Celtic Illyrian concordances: common Illyr. -gW- > -b-, -d- : Alb. -gW- > -d- phonetic mutatIon.
Is it possible that nobody is seeing that Slavic (j)agne (Czech jehnì, Russian ягненок, Bulgarianагне; Serbian jagnje; Latin agnus) is closely related to the word 'oganj' (fire; Russian огонь,Czech ohen; Serbian oganj; Lat in ignis; Hettite agniš). I am suprised that all "clever" minds onSci. lang are not able (because of stupidity or something else) to understand that Abdullah (withthe help of Lubotsky and G. Starostin) is leading every one here by the nose.
1) Is there anyone who is able to explain what Abdullah thought when he said that "Slavicpreserved the old laryngeal through Alb. h- > k- phonetic mutatIon"? Did he mean that Slavichad to be grateful to the compiled Albanian for its own existence?
2) He is also talking about "common Alb. gh- > gl- > gj" mutation; is there any phoneticmutation that is not possible in Albanian? Which one of the Sci. lang wise guys could be able toexplain (or comprehend) Abdullah's gh => gl "common" mutation?
3) Do you really believe that Greek 'amnos' came from 'agnos' via 'abnos'? Please, would youanswer this question just to see how many fools we have on this forum?
4) No body in the world knows nothing about fucking "Illyrian"; the language that waspresumed from a dozen of words that have reached our time indirectly - through Greek or Latin.Are you people without your own opinion and sound logic?
Go and read ALBANIAN: The Language of God and you will probably be able to understandAbdullah's real intentions and Squip-Illyrian Paleo-Balkan dreams.
[...As Darwin's theory might be referred to as the 'language of nature ', the Illyrian (Albanian)language could be referred to as the 'language of god'...]
5) It seems that converted Slavs (as Konushevci) are showing more national zealotry than nativeShqipetars. Abdullah's Slavic kinsfolk are spread across the cont inent - even in Russia. Look foryourself: [Konusevic] Конусевич, Е. Н. "Иван Серегеевич Тургенев." Литературноеобозрение, 1993, № 11/12, 4?10. T ? memoirs of him
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All above notes are from the "updated" and "enhanced" Proto-Indo- European Etymological
Dictionary; A Revised Edition of Julius Pokorny’s Indogermanisches EtymologischesWörterbuch http://dnghu.org/ - "revised" and crippled by George Starostin and AlexanderLubotsky.
May Be Illyrian may be Martian http://vukotic.atspace.com/alb.htm
