WPC Facilities ProjectComments as of 9/15/19

Category Comment FrequencyCost Using a consultant to guide us through the financial process is a

good idea

Cost We are graced by Heather’s gift

Cost All planning ideas ought to have a cost estimate with them.  Cost is not something that can be left to the end. It should be the first item to steer and constrain the design.[I] don’t want to be locked into a plan without knowing a firm cost.I do not see the restrooms improvements and possibly the breezeway enclosure in the budget at this time.   All the preliminary work that I list above will take a good chunk of your budget. More than you think! And this doesn’t even consider the basic needed maintenance on the Blue House.Nevertheless, I have included my thoughts/ideas on a future breezeway remodel with following sketch. (A)

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Cost I believe we are over-extending our good fortune. Much of the plan calls for what I consider a non-requirements IE. Restrooms and Lounge

Cost Everything we’ve needed has always cost more than what we had.  With every building we’ve been able to find the funding. It’s always worked out.  We’ve looked to the future and we’ve planned for the future – we need it [the changes and repairs outlined by Facilities Task Force 2.0].

Cost I think it is unrealistic to assume we won’t incur some debt. We go forward in faith and that has never failed us yet. I am in favor of one capital campaign and do the breezeway project and expansion of HH at the same time. It is time to have a space that is large enough to comfortably seat us for HH events.

Cost Debt is not a bad thing. Future members will be able to feel they are contributing to the church improvement

Cost I do not agree we should use the services of a Financial Consultant. In the past we pooled sought resources of our members.

Cost Plan calls for too many changes, is too expensive, and too fast in the time frame

Current Design

There was a great deal of difficulty getting a casket into the Sanctuary for a funeral recently.  Please consider this when planning a new entrance/exit.If we return to the way the pews were originally aligned in the Sanctuary, we could add more pews and therefore more seating.

Facilities Conceptual

Layout

Make windows on the street side of the welcome center resemble those of HH

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WPC Facilities ProjectComments as of 9/15/19

Facilities Conceptual

Layout

Recommended Option is too much, too massive a change as it ruins the symmetry of the sanctuary by moving the breezeway enclosure south

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Facilities Conceptual

Layout

WINDOWSDislike moving the stain glass windows.

Please do not take out sanctuary stained glass window I’m a fan of the stain glass window [that is proposed to be

moved]. There are only two stain glass windows on the east side so

moving one would change the lighting and the feel of the Sanctuary.

Note from the COP Team:  There are four windows, two in the Sanctuary, one in the Narthex, and one in the Library.

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Facilities Conceptual

Layout

Prefer to only enclose the original breezeway, enclose the kitchen Door/hallway, plus expand the restrooms

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Facilities Conceptual

Layout

DOORSNorth side having two sets of double doors seems to impede traffic flow; seems excessive and expensive.

Facilities Conceptual

Layout

Here is the history why the entry door is the way it currently is. Since the sanctuary did not have a fire sprinkler system, Heritage Hall was allowed to be built with a 20-foot separation (creating the breezeway) and the wall facing the sanctuary is constructed as a 2-hour fire rated wall with fire rated metal doors.  The sanctuary could not have a door facing Heritage Hall so the door is around the corner facing south. (Don’t ask me why they let the stain glass window remain in the library!)

Facilities Conceptual

Layout

The International Building Code requires all doors to have a level landing on both sides of them.  The sloped nave inside the church creates a problem meeting this requirement. The idea of inserting any size door becomes a complicated problem quickly in meeting this code requirement.  You have to build a level landing that then makes a compound slope into a sloping floor. This in itself becomes a hazard for walkers and wheelchairs. The cost and end effect is not worth the effort.  It would look like a band aid and would not flow naturally. Additionally, seating is lost.

Facilities Conceptual

Layout

NORTH SIDE RAMP Entrance and egress ought to be redesigned to flow as a primary route of travel with a large wrap-around landing at the floor level.The casket story was a great reminder of why meeting the building code minimums don’t always work.

I do not believe the new North stair and sidewalk proposal would need to eliminate the existing ADA stalls-just move the stalls out North into the parking circulation.  This may provide traffic calming and need further study.

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WPC Facilities ProjectComments as of 9/15/19

Facilities Conceptual

Layout

CHANCEL The Oak Harbor Building Official told me (when he and I

met in the sanctuary) that we must add a lift to make the chancel accessible and safer. I propose a small stair along with the lift in the room West of the chancel.  The door would need to be replaced by a 36” wide door and flip the swing.

I support the use of Risers over the stairs of the chancel where the organ would go on one side and the piano on the other. (This was a TF2 possibility). This was later revised to: We, John and Carolyn Lesh, recommend that any changes to the sanctuary regardless of floor plan, include installation of both piano & organ at ground level with a railing around each instrument for safety and this change was overwhelmingly supported by attendees at presentation. The proposed layout would also allow visual interaction between the musicians and the choir Director. If necessary for space, the piano and organ positions could be reversed. See Attachment E

I do not want any changes to the chancel. Leave it as is for the greatest flexibility.

As a musician, I appreciate that you’ve looked at moving instruments to make them look balanced and so the musicians can see each other. 

About the organ situation:  It’s not ideal. We don’t have an organist currently, this instrument takes a lot of room, and it wasn’t being used.  The organ is on an umbilical so it can be moved forward [closer to the pews].

We need to get rid of the organ and replace it with a smaller and up-to-date instrument.

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Facilities Conceptual

Layout

Do not eliminate a pew. We cannot afford to eliminate a pew 2

Facilities Conceptual

Layout

Modify scheme 2 and 3 Combine the three options.

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Facilities Conceptual

Layout

Add a shower. Please consider adding a shower; boys need it, girls want it.  [The speaker was referring to youth group overnights]. 

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Facilities Conceptual

Layout

The “main entrance” to the welcome center is on the back of the building … parking lot

Facilities Conceptual

Layout

Cover ramp the stairwell with a roofI appreciate the option that includes improvements to the ramp.

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Facilities I don’t believe we need a fireplace or a coffee bar. 4

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WPC Facilities ProjectComments as of 9/15/19

Conceptual Layout

Fireplace and coffee bar in lounge are an un-necessary expenses and it would require ongoing maintenance and encourage people to take coffee into sanctuary.

No Fireplace.Facilities

Conceptual Layout

I agree we don’t need an elevator to the storage area and steps would be good.

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Facilities Conceptual

Layout

Not sure the expense of a tunnel between Fellowship Hall and HH is warranted

A tunnel would make the lower levels of the sanctuary and HH more accessible and usable

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Facilities Conceptual

Layout

There is not enough room to move a pew into the space where the storage cabinet is currently located

Facilities Conceptual

Layout

The east exit from the Sanctuary (through the Lounge/Library) should be minimum door width of 36”. See drawing (B)

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Facilities Conceptual

Layout

Like the North entry , and enlarged restrooms and their accessibility from entry

Facilities Conceptual

Layout

Impressed by Architect’s rendering of South elevation and how it ties to sanctuary building and HH

Facilities Conceptual

Layout

At a church I visited, the welcome center was being used by other groups at the time of my visit.  As those attending the memorial service arrived, they were greeted by those already there. I love that feeling; when you proceed into the Sanctuary, you’ve already begun worshipping.

Facilities Conceptual

Layout

We love the welcome center and entry recommended except:The entry from the welcome center needs a better design because of the sloped floors. Perhaps the current door from the Library/hallway could be widened and continue to serve as entry to Sanctuary.

It sounds like we need a bigger entrance into the welcome center/Sanctuary to not have to deal with the sloping floor.

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Facilities Conceptual

Layout

Could the new welcome center be reduced in size more resembling the layout shown in scheme 2.

Facilities Conceptual

Layout

I am very much opposed to putting a door into the east side of the Sanctuary.

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ImprovementsPriority

There appears to be omissions in the original recommendations to Task Force 2 based on assessments 1-5 (page 1 of handout distributed at Congregational Meeting June 16, 2019). Fundamental repairs to our facilities are not included in the charge to TF 2. These include, water intrusion, sewer issues in the

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WPC Facilities ProjectComments as of 9/15/19

basement of our sanctuary and electrical updates to our buildings.I would like these repairs, along with safety improvements to be the primary   focus of work to be done.  I would like analysis and bids from contractors for this work before delegating funds for any other additions or improvements to our facilities.Thank you for your work.

Infrastructure AUTOMATIC FIRE SPRINKLER SYSTEM  a. This has always been our WPC roadblock for any major

improvements as the City of Oak Harbor’s Building Official and Fire Marshal have sighted codes requiring the fire sprinkler system.

b. We will need to bring the water over from the fire riser room which is under the stairs in Heritage Hall.

c. We can take advantage of the planning from a previous congregation (40 years ago +/-) who prepared for a tunnel tying Heritage Hall to the Sanctuary.  Under the breezeway concrete slab is sand fill for easy excavation for the tunnel. This would finally make our whole facility basement accessible and provide an excellent route for the fire sprinkler water line.

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Infrastructure While we have the excavation equipment and in preparation for a new North stair and breezeway enclosure, we ought to eliminate the water leaking along the North wall of the basement.  This also removes the failing concrete stair to the basement kitchen that catches Garry Oak leaves every year. This stair is not a required exit stair.

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Infrastructure Installing the fire sprinkler system will require added electrical alarms and monitors. The whole sanctuary electrical wiring that is old knob and tube should be replaced.  The old knob and tube system does not have a ground. The wires if knocked can lose the outer insulation coating and become a fire hazard. Insulation can catch on fire. The church has been replacing the fuse boxes, which may be all replaced by now with circuit breakers. As we look to hand off to future generations, we need to preserve the Sanctuary by updating the electrical system and the plumbing, repair the foundation, and add sprinklers.We are focused on making the Sanctuary as safe as possible.

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Infrastructure Insulate the whole sanctuary.  We have been heating the atmosphere forever.   The brown arched frames we see looking up at the ceiling are made with fabric.  You can see right down into the nave while standing in the sanctuary attic. Insulation would pay for itself over time and Puget Power has programs that can help pay for insulating our sanctuary.

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Infrastructure The mechanical system needs to be upgraded.  The furnace will need testing for balancing supply and return air after new insulation and weatherizing the sanctuary.  Replacing the furnace

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WPC Facilities ProjectComments as of 9/15/19

would be appropriate at this time. I do not know the age of our furnace.

Infrastructure Congregation members sitting in the mezzanine have the need for comfort during hot days.  Adding insulation may further the need for adding a large ceiling fan in the balcony.

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Infrastructure When I was on Session, we heard a lot for a while about the sewer line, that it was old, and that it probably needed replacing.  I heard some about the line with the recommendations from Facilities Task Force 2.0 but nothing specific is in the cost projection.  Session:  Please consider having the sewer line or lines evaluated and replaced as necessary should all or some of the recommendations be approved.

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Infrastructure I’m confused about the north wall seeping.  I understood that it was a very intermittent problem so I thought that we had decided to mop as necessary.  I understood that the problem is the plumbing and the cast iron sewer piping.The north wall [of Fellowship Hall] is sand and the contractor would not guarantee the work unless he worked on all of the foundation for $50,000.

I hope that we replace the sewer piping.  Note: It costs about $200 for the plumber to clear this pipe and they typically find that the block is composed of baby wipes.

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InfrastructureI appreciate the time and effort Terry Ledesky has taken to provide input on the TF2.0 recommendation. His expertise and knowledge of our facility make his input particularly valuable. Having said that, I do differ on a few points. I will reference his input in my remarks. 

AUTOMATIC FIRE SPRINKLER SYSTEM Adding a fire sprinkler system to the sanctuary has long been acknowledged as a requirement when we joined the two buildings. I don't agree with the proposal to put a tunnel between the basements of the sanctuary and Heritage Hall. Since the move of the nursery to Heritage Hall, the basement of the sanctuary has been unused, therefore I don't believe the benefit would justify the cost. I don't agree with the proposal to water proof the north wall of the sanctuary foundation. In the time I have been on Buildings and Grounds the problem has been intermittent and recently very sporadic. The overwhelming majority of water in the sanctuary basement is due to the toilets overflowing from clogging due to items being flushed that do not breakdown. If the foundation problem should get worse it could be dealt with in the future but at this time don't believe the problem justifies the expense.

 ELECTRICAL UPGRADE Bringing the electrical wiring up to current code is a high priority in my estimation.

 INSULATION I agree that the brown arch frames on the sanctuary ceiling should be sealed and insulated. I question whether insulating the entire sanctuary attic would be worth the cost and definitely disagree with

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WPC Facilities ProjectComments as of 9/15/19

insulating the walls of the sanctuary. I believe the most effective way to increase the efficiency of the sanctuary heating would be to install ceiling fans to circulate the air and prevent the warm air from pooling at the ceiling.

MECHANICAL UPGRADE Replacing the 3 furnaces in the basement of the sanctuary at this time is unnecessary. Larry Porter has the most knowledge of the furnaces & said that the guy that maintains them thinks they should continue to function OK for the foreseeable future. I would favor waiting until they require replacement. With 3 of them, if one of the two heating the sanctuary should give out during the winter, the one heating Fellowship Hall could be cannibalized until a more permanent solution could be effected. ACCESS INTO THE SANCTUARY Terry clearly explains the dangers of installing a door in the east wall of the sanctuary. It would make the sanctuary floor much more dangerous for mobility-impaired and balance-challenged persons. If a person should fall during an emergency evacuation, it could put many people in jeopardy. Once that was pointed out, the TF should have removed the proposal for an entry in the East wall from further consideration. Failure to do so allowed it to continue to be considered by those who didn't see or hear his explanation I believe the best solution would be to increase the width of the existing doors on either side of the chancel.

NORTH SIDE RAMP The proposal has merit, however it ranks below enclosing the breezeway in my estimation & I think the cost of the higher priority items will force this to a future undertaking. CHANCEL LIFT This was news to me, however I trust Terry's information is accurate and that the lift would be required. Obviously this adds an additional cost to the original estimate. BUDGET CONTROL I share Terry's concern for the cost estimate being exceeded, but believe that the restroom improvements and enclosing both sides of the breezeway should be accomplished. They represent the most tangible results of the investment, and the original impetus for the entire project.

Sanctuary Many people wear hearing aids and adding a baffling panel on ceiling above choir and pulpit would greatly alleviate “echo”

Add sound-dampening panels to sanctuary Our current audio/visual equipment was assembled on an as-

needed basis, & consists of mostly hobby grade equipment. Upgrading to modern digital equipment will greatly improve the sound quality, visual presentation, artistic participation, lighting, and communication from pulpit to both congregation and those watching on-line. We will forward specifics to the Worship Team.

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Process This is the process of discerning, there may be a time to ponder other things.  I hope that we are including things that need to be here and are valuable.

[I would like to see] this be a deliberative and slow process. [The Sanctuary] is part of the history of Oak Harbor, so take

it slowly and maintain beauty; this is so worshipful; very difficult process.

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WPC Facilities ProjectComments as of 9/15/19

Process I would strongly recommend that this entire construction plan be considered by the entire congregation.

Process Let’s get this show on the road.Process/priority

Our priorities for the facility should be1. Infrastructure (electrical, foundation, fire system,

insulation)2. Enclose breezeway per proposal (enclosure, improved

sanctuary access, improved bathrooms, attic access)Funding should come from a capital improvement drive and portion of gift based on drive results.

Process/Priorities

1. Enclose breezeway2. Library space for other uses3. Restrooms: retain the present ones4. New stairs to North entrance: I approve

See attached floor plan (D) belowProcess We miss having coffee hour in HH! Now when we have our new

welcome center, it could be in there! 😊

Ledesky Layout A above - Waite Layout B below

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WPC Facilities ProjectComments as of 9/15/19

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WPC Facilities ProjectComments as of 9/15/19

Tozer Layout C above. Layout D – Frazee below

Lesh – Attachment E Chancel

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