Ulster Archaeological Society

Antiquarian Notes and QueriesSource: Ulster Journal of Archaeology, First Series, Vol. 6 (1858), pp. 184-190Published by: Ulster Archaeological SocietyStable URL: http://www.jstor.org/stable/20608872 .

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184

ANTIQUARIAN NOTES AND QUERIES.

The remarks of your correspondent, Mr. A.

H3NE [vol. vi., p. 54], respecting the preserva

tion in Ireland of old ferms and pronunciations of English words, is deserving of much attention. In Scotland, in several of the provincial parts of

England, and in America, many of the local

peculiarities are nothing but the primitive Eng lish idioms, which. have in the modem language

been superseded by recent innovations. By attending to these peculiarities, we may often

determine from what precise parts of England particular portions of Ireland were colonized.

Thus, there is a striking resemblance between

the dialect of Devonshire and the English spoken in the county of Cork: e.g., such words as "'boat" are pronounced in two syllables-" bo-at." There is one word used in Cork, the origin of

which I have sought in vain in dictionaries. A "shed" (called in Ulster a "shade") is there named a "linny." Now, in Devonshire they cal it a linhaye." This word may perhaps be

connected with the French "I haye, " a hedge or

fence. In Exeter, two streets near the cathedral

are called "Northern Haye" and "Southern Haye." May not " linhaye" be from " ligne de

la haye," a pent-house erected along a hedge9-P

I may observe that the resemblance between the

Cork A:nglo-Irish and the natives of Devon and

Somerset extends beyond their manner of speak

ing, and is very obvious in their appearance and manners. HERMcES.

Among the instances of early English pronun ciation remaining as provincialisms in Ireland,

may be noticed the word "patron," pronounced

"pattern," and used to signify the festival of a

patron saint. The modern English word "pat

tern" is merely a corruption of the French " patron," the word for a model. The model used by a founder, in casting a statue, was pro

bably called the "patron," as being the likeness either of the patron saint or of the employer

[patronus] meant to be represented. REmis. The characters engraved on the stone found in

the subterranean chamber at Connor (co. An

trim), and figured in your last number [p. 100],

are clearly not an Ogham inscription. They are

more probably Runic. We know from Olaus Wormius that Runic letters were inscribed by

the old Scandinavians in every variety of situa

tion, apparently as charms for protecting their persons or property. They had them on the hilts of their swords, the sterns of their ships, their seats, drinking cups, and other domestic utensils. The letter N especially figres as a charm of this kind on many occasions; and this letter is the one most distinctly shown in the Connor inscrip

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185

tion. If we couLld be certain that the marks on

the stone are really the remains of letters, I should have little hesitation in considering theon as

tLnllic, and therefore the cave as Scandinavian. SITRIC.

I do not know anything that would be more generally interesting than copies of old topo

guaphical maps of the Irish provinces and coun ties. Such are often necessary for understand ing accoutnts of nilitary movemiients, battles, &e., in former times. For instance, was " Mouilntjoy Fort," w-hich figuires so prominently

in the war of 1641, placed wrlhere Oharlenmont niow is, or where, else? T. II. P.

AsANCrr IRISHi COOKERY. [Notes and Queries, vol. 6, p. 101 .]-Mention i s madle by your cor

respondent ANGLecrs, of the biaunt stones found in quantities in parts of the County Cork.

Keating refers to this mode of cooling in his history of keiciaM. le says the ancient Irish were in thie, habit of digginig two large pits, the

one of which was for washing, the other for

c:-,ooking. Stones heated red hot were thronr in, and uipon these was laid thlc mieat, boLmnd up

in green sedges or buhl-shes. Onl this again

was placed annotier layer of hot stones, tlhen

more meat, and so on till the reqluiired quantity was disposed of. The nane given to such olld

spots in the Sou.th of Ireland by the people is Pakldaek 2w Pein$s.. EIImONNAc.

Bir-Ltw.-v--We are consttly using terms in our ordinary speech, into the origin of which we never thikl of inquiring. The oxpression Bye Law is one of these. Spelman says (after re

ferring to the government of German towns, as described by CUsar and Tacitus) :-- These laws

the Goths, the Swedes, the ,Danes, and Saxons, called Bi-layginoes; fromn By, which in all these

langlages signifies ' a towrn,' and L2gl, or

3lghne, which signifies 'laws,' as Gravius,

Suecus, and our Saxon authors testit2." W0 still see this old w,orord, By, preser-ved in the n(almes of innumerable towns and vllagges in

Eng-land, such as Derby, Whitby, Selby, &e. II. I.

InISa NAr lxs or, 'owxLANnDS. -Evcry toNwuland

in Ireland has its clesigmation. Many, if we refer

to old deeds and charters, have several naes, besides that which they now bear. In eommon (if I am not ]nistaken) with miany other owners of land, I must plead guilty to great ignorancee of the meaning of these ancient names. An in

quiry into this matter might probably be not considered foreign to the objects of the Ulster Jo2rirnal of -Arceology; amd it stares cane that it

could not fail to be generally interesting, while

in many eases it migh,Jt hoe of much utility. Gostrd Ca4kA e, Markethill. Gosro-nD. WJrhen passing through the South of Ireland a

fw years ago, I met a negro gentleman (Mr. Bar

fda) who :had travrelled vrery exten ively;1r) intat, there was seareely any conuntiy that he did not ap

pear to have visited. Hie seemed an adirtable

linguist, and, in conversation, he mentioned to me

thalt, having tn ayelled across Cenitral Africa, and

become acq(uainted ith the dialects there, he was

able, when shown some Irish manscripts in the library of Trinity College, Dublin, from his

knowledge of these dialects, to translate several

portions of thelm. I ami awrare many words in the Irish language

are derived from tlhe Latin; buit if not mistaken

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186

are given for the consecration of the number five, as being made up of two and three-as it were,

wedded together. Connected with this idea, he has some remarks on the form of the Trefoil and the fig-lea and ivy-leaf, which do not well bear quotation.

Now, it strikes me that, if we suppose the Druidical superstition to be more or less identical with these Oriental fancies, some liglt may be thrown on their practice. One of the Egyptian r tes consisted in pounding in a mortar a certain

plant called Omomi, and casting it, mixed with the blood of a wolf, into a place inaccessible to

sun-slhine, invoking HTades and darkness. Could this plant ha-ve been the mistletoe, or a-ny plaiit

having, like it, its leaves in pairs? The Egi p tians h-eld some plants sacred to the good god

aind somae to the evil one. Tho number two, we

have seen, was devoted to the latter; and what time was more fit for invoking darkness than thte

winter solstice? In your editorial notes to the

paper on the Shamrock, you remark the etymo logical resemblance of the original name of this plant to that of the Sun; and we have observed

that the number two was sacred to Diana, or the

mnoon. All this seems to point to some early

religious dogma, now lost in the obscurity of the

past. Among the arithmetical whims of the Pytha

goreans was a dislike to the number seventeen, while holding sixteen and eighteen in estimation. I beg to suggest to Mr9 Saiuel Lover, that this would furnish as valid a reason as the one as

signed in his humorous song for the 17th of March beinig the birth-day of St. Patrick, the

destroyer of Irish Druidism. The festival of

most, if not all of these, are either connected with "the Church," or refer to circumstances and events with whichi our country could only have becomne acquaiiated through the Romans. But how are we to accouint for an affinity between

this language and the dialects of Central Africa? Belfast. Taoxx sHENRY PURDON.

SACRED NuFBnru.s-Tn the paper on the Sham rock [Journal, vol. 5, p. 12], and the notes

appended, there are references to tlhe Egyptian superstitions respecting the sanctity of the num

ber three. Whoever takes the trouble to wade

through Plutarch's freatise on Tsis and Osiris, and the doctrines of the Pythagorean philosophy, will fiad some wonderful proI)erties and virtues ascribed to almost every number. Certain aritih

metrical or geometrical peculiarities are usually assigned as reasons for such especial reverence.

Without detailing all the dogmas, it may suffice to notice that the beneficent divinity Oromasdes is designated oy the unit, the malignant deity Arcimanius by two, and Mithras, the mediator, by thtree. This ascribing of evil to the number twvo

seems to have given rise to the idea of ill-luck in that throw with the dice. Hence, too, the Prince of Darkness is among ourselves popularly called "the 7)euce."--Again, the numberonewas assigned to Apollo, two to Diana, and three to Minerva.

Plutarch adds:-" The number two [implies] strife and audacity, but the number three, jus tice." He also notices thirty-si as a most holy number. Orosmasdes is likewise said to have created six gods, and Arcimanius six antaagonist divinities.

At the same time, in Plutarch's treatise "Conl cwining the El in Delphi," sundry sage reasons

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187

Osiris was held at tihe time of tle new moon,

next the vernal equiinox. The full moon, in a

lwuar mouth, falls about the svrenteent1c day,

accordling to Plutarch's reckoning. Can the 17th of larch haro lad any reference to the Pasehal

full noon?-.A great nuruy other str ange thleories, arithmetica, geometrical, and miiusical, are given l)y Plutarclh, in his treatise "I On the Generation of tlhe Soul." TiIsnIruISTUs.

Tint Sco,rc ix InMANfl.-A few days past,

when looking over a very miseellaneouLs collection

of papers, relating, to coranrerec, colonies, &e., formerly belonging to Abrahtam Mill, a fellow

and treasruer of tlle Royal Society, and one of

tile first comiimissioiners of the ioarcd of Trade

when it was instituited in 1696, I found tire fol

lowing memoranda, which may not be altogether

devoid of interest to the readers of this Journal;

as they happily illustrate an observation of Dr.

flume, in one of his valuable and itricestiuna

papers ol Ulster ethiolog,y, to the effect-I quote from meomory-that Delfast, though originally an

English town, in course of timtLe became practi

caIy a Scottish one; and they also show, what

many writers, by the way, are apt to forget,

that, previous to the Scottish union, thle English at-nd Irish People Tegarded Scotland as a foreign

state; which, indeed, coiiumerciolly, and, I may

almost acId, politically Speaking, it really was.

I send the paper juzst as I folund it, without

either dato or signiatuLire; bult it is bound utip with

papers of 1697, and its o05 n internal evidence

declares it to be of that period. W. PiNxE rON.

" Quiery. If trlle.

1. That the Sects have gott into their hands

two-tlhirds of tlhe trade of Ireland.

2. Tha;t the money they gott by the English

AlAriyes landing ina the North, first putt them in

Stock. That they presently traded to furnish the Ariiyes, & thenceforth went boldUy into

France, & had, for many years, connivance for

all they imiiported, as it brought help & increase

to the Publickl Revenue. 3. That tle seat of the Warr beins, in the 3

other Provinces, all the plunder of black cattle was sent & driven into the North for Security, where they hacd plenty before: soe as the Mar

kett went fiom thience to all other Parts, when

the Warr was over.

4. That the greatest Destruction flng on the sheep, & England refusia0 to lett any goe

over,a (as in 1654 had been allow'd, & for 3

years after that Warr), these Merchants gott from Scotland to the valne of 300 thousand pounds in

Scotelh sheap, which served for eating, till the relllaynas of the better stock could miltiply.

5. That tle last yeares want of Comne in Scot

land broughit over not lesse than 20 thoustnd

poore, & niot lesse than 30 thousancl before, since

ye Revolution. 6. That altho' Belfast is now counted the

second place of Trade in Ireland, yett the Scotch

AMerehants are spread into all other the Trading

Townes of that kindldom, & are made Magistrates in their Tnnes. They ate generally frugal, industrious, vary nationall, & very helpful to eaclx other against any Third.

7. That this Temper is the same in their

Gentry, who have gotten great anthoity in the Armye, & in the Pariamuent of that King;dom.

Wlhether this growing wealth & power, if found tree, will center at last in England or in

Scotlanid, is worth Consideration." & For Lear of eucouraging Irish woollen manufactures

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188

ANSWER1 S TrO QUERI E S.

ITsuv r, iu,n Vntoov "Arpn." [vol. iii., p. 32,3.3,1

'the glory proposed by M7r. Evuss oIul(1 hmave been long sinice answered, but that I

doubted f' ifthe qperist, or alny othier wvell inforimed person, could reailly bave been ignornait

that the insertion of the luel ronou "liio," in sua1l

plassages ais lie -refers to ift u1(1 E]nglish wvfiters,

as exptie/iv, and bad lit) sed il1arate nicaning -

lmcrely giving intenmsity i o the assertionslls by

shoming that theici spoealers leromllll feiclilg'S

wereL interesited i the matter. Instainces of this are tabndant. A likle idionm is fanmilir in Greek

T. 1f I P.

"SrxviSV^Nlr]ivl" [Queries, vol. v., ). 352].

T'he inquirer is in error respecoting thoe form;i of thlis word. it is "sCerendibic0" witlhout an r. I

once knew a fiAhermalL at Neweastle, in the Co.

DT)ow. give hiis son a severe beathiig, aind ani 01(I

newi leseviboig- thle act, staid, "' Hoe tui tho wee

Jfrlla be dti scruff o' the nlach, and blochied l1Pm

mlost Isereaddd." The word is apIparenly it

soen-donbie) ," thiat i, ;; sevcin-fold," andi the

adverb is fomined reguai-airro:ll lthe td,jectivo,

Ma'nly Engll-lish wNords, lihk, "doub(:le,1 " takie at

saconlda ry leivanling in treluiid, whlich is l)l rly

prlvineill; tlhus, wye saly an 0o(l mill is bnf,t

twvo double ;" n bt a cart x'ol()0 is '' three,

double," ain(d a) ru11stic whipa'slx is "hair double.''

_pli wdll-klnelow expression of Dr. 1iarett soulllds rational l enoLglh to a m1iddle or lower chi nIII- 11A1I

i IlreOland, though it tickles Engl is ealrs AIl U Gaul is tjncatorcd into titer hars." Ku

chadeozz1ar, whlo was a, Iklbylollilts, king, galve

orders to h1ealt thole lburi',g fiery funnace " one se'6've times. vore thanll it IV, Was wont to be heated: "

had lie been a1 countiy Dawn imi11nl he l woul ldImve

sinply said, ''Hleat it ml.ost seerendd/ibl.'

A. 1r 0GnD Nrec. [Queories, vol. v., p. 352; aIvlNto].

Vti., 1)0 .]-Namesof this kind are1 usually

jenl'uar or pu-woineinl a.t; first, but, fur tho1e sake of

(c{01Tiveialcee, thicy become exlpress.se ill a. uch1111

wiler (circulit. St. Nicholas was tlu' lpatral ot

salilors, anld, a1til vithlin lleh last. twvo cenlturies,

offerinlgs to lnim wero 11not 111n1Isnal., I)LaToure( go'in']g

t?) sea, 1 in the mariffine towns of EnglnuId A

puat of the Rfnhi o(ustom was the tisending ouit of

laips oin a Sunday, 'after, they had lrti(n r(tid fiuth

pratyers of thel church." .In'1 Hit circe,umshtw1uee'.(s,

it w\ras taisy to coinfound "01(1l NYick" with " Ithe,

pr'ioc of the; iowri ofat theai' " especa lly as

every unusual hat inl motorology or navlgtttioI

was then asoribod to suponnitural causeS. I have7O

S0n1iewhierc beardl or raead thlat the name11lo " Old

hairry,, origaul"teil in te eoarly part of.. the 103th

century; the opponents of H Vnry J 11 LI., (jti tying him with ', siipp')sdtil o111d. rTh1 name1

'Dlavy Jtins,'s' 1usedI by sailors, is at stittirical

allusion)l to the, 'W(e18lsh; maulltl al lsion to hiS

"locker t 'is ('xp1OliCd by tho seconlId linoe in al ir11Ser rh- ].11y1nie descriptive of " Taffy."

I [rnie" andt "Cloote" airt) nam-ftes derived fron tlPo sHupposed personatl pearance of Satan; the Englisih popular ida It duving the middle aiges

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189

being apparently taken in part firom the notion of a Saracen or loor, and, in ?fact, from that of

the Greek Pran." In a Scottisl poei, the Ei

One is called "Old Ringan," a name evidently

corrupted from Saint " Ninian;" but why, I do

not know. Perlaps the functions of this saint

were similar to those of St. Nicholas. A. H. O0ur hNen-This namne for the Deiil is not

confinecl to English. The word, -with slight variations, is found in all the Northern Ian

guages; DanishA Hoke, Swedish Ne7e, :Flemish .ZVcker, l?innishlA71 Nai, German Nieks. In the

Icelandic Eddi, he is called lWkuatr, and seems to have been the wtater-doity or Neptune of the Scandinavian mythology. THence the derivation hinted at by youllr correspondent QuisQuis [vol.

6, p. 107,] is merely fanmcifd. The name is older than he supposes. SENnX.

COxvmis. [Queries, vol. v., p. 166.3-Please in form Rt. L. that I can show hii, in the county

of Derry, clozens of what are called Dsnes' Forts,

containing artificial eaves. T. '.

O'NuILv's Sr)TUCInAN. [Q@erjeS, vol. 6, 1. 108.]

'-There is a towvuland, a little niorth of New

Mills (County Tyronie), the old name of whlich was SSuclan. Its position seems to answer to

that marked in Speed's map. hxsnaREs. To STrIKE A BARGAIN. [QnerieS, vol. 5,

258.3-Tlhe custom of ratifying a bargain or

agreement by a blow of the hand seems to have

been quite usual among various ancient nations. The itomans had a great many ways of ex

pressing the making of a baroain, end all of

thlem alluLde to the blow or touch of the hand.

Thus 1

fidens sancireirs dextrd is used by Livy;

and we continually meet with the expressions

"pangero feedus, percutere fcedus," and "lferire fcedus." This last idiom we kmow refers to a cus

torn, when making a treaty, of striking a pig. ["Jupiter populum Rlomanum sic ferito, ut ego hlme porcumi hedie feriam."-L'. lib. I.] We meet also the expressions "icere fcedus" and" icere

pactuLm." The words paetun and pcVatio them selves, signifying "I a bargain or agreement," are derived from _pango,

" to str-ike a blow" We have

ourselves the word com'pact inEnglish, and_paction in Scotch, [" They made a paction 'tween them twa."] And we say, "to drive z bargain."

There is a quaint old phrase used m a letter of

the duke of Ormond's, dated 1593, (quoted in this diurnal, vol. 5, p. 202,) which I do not recollect to have seen before, but which is very

expressive, and seems to refer to some sinmilar custom: -"Promisebeing mLade byTas. M'Sorley, &c. %' -4 bu-t the other did not keep toucht as he had

promised:' The Latin word poilieeo, " to pro mise," has never been satisfactorily explained. May it not be derived frompollex, "the thumb," and have reference 'to some old castomr no w un

known, of indicating, by a peculiar touch of thle

hand, that an agreement was solemnly made.

SEnmrx. C-A-nTiR. [Queries, vol. v., p. '1l66.]-The

inquiry as to the o-rigin of this phrase 'is casily

answered. Clapping with the hands is a usual mode of applauding public speakers; and "c:lap trap'" accordingly me"ans a trap to catch applause. This is men-tioned in one of the published letters of Southey; not explained, but alluded to as

being known. J J W

TOL. VI,

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190

Q U 1x, R I E S,

Arc tlhere, among ourl relics of antiquity, ,any remains of chariots? Arc thlere any distinet proofS of their usc recordXed in ancient Irish pooms or A[SS.? I-How was it possiblc to ceni ploy them in a couinry so overspread wvithl wood, and lttterly with hogs, andcl bally provided with roads? T. I. P.

Is it true that frogs are Inot indigenouts il Ire land? O'Reilly's Irish Dictionary gives the

word "' losgirn" as thleo ntatrme of thle iffog, ail M'Curtin's dietiounry gives another wor('d "I Reae

dan" for tlhe same. Tlese words do iiot seem to be borrowed from any otiher laniguage, and would therefore prove that tlhe anhina wat known to the ancient lrish. Are these naines for the frog still in use annong th;1e Irish-speaking Population?

RUSTICUS.

In the "Epistle Dedicatory" to BJoate's Ire land's Nahtrall H12seory, published in 1652, the following passage oecurs :-" I lookt elso some

what upon the hopofulla ppearance of replinting Ireland shortly, net only by t1C Adventurers, but happily by tlhe callinig in of exiled Bose mians and other Vrotc steants also, lind happily by), the invitation of soeine well-alfected ciut of thoe

Low Countrics."-Ca nany of' your readers in

form me what were the Bohemians here referred

to, aid whether any of thom caeio to Ireland?

I have o1vor riot withl a s8Atis-hotory dorivae

tioe for tiu word tTory," a5 applied to i apolitical

ptarty. Perhaps your eorresppoidents iway be able

to enlighten nco. xsa rsUT .

Wh1at is tho origini of the word " ben-fire ?"

Johnson, in his diotionary, Miakoe it a Compound

of thoi V romiohl ion, good, anld the Eniglish fire; buit besides thle iirprobiability of such a1 ceomuibina

tion, wlhen it woulld be as slhort atnd (as easy to

Say "goo"d-fire as "bll-firO," Ilean soc n;o good

Treason for this derivatioxi. CuiTuLOSIu.s.

Tfho use of 0 ead as a boverage so-eems- to have

been universal iii ancient Ireland. Is it known

at whlatt period it was last used? I am not aware

that even the0 ;mode of makiing it is now known ill any ptart of the counitr. Azror4reus.

I air anixious to know wlhere I can find a

satisfactory accoIunlt of the popular notions re

garding the oiD eesho, and of the origin of that

singular superstition. Most of tlhe notices of the

sulject whlich I h1ave tret with arTe vogu10e aind

superficial. G, APL.

Whiat is the* actual legond of the "3lolody

Hand,'" adopted as the arnis of Ulster? And

whore: is the origial to bo found ? A. II.

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