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NEW SOUTH WALES POLICE SERVICE

CERTIFICATION OF E.R.I.S.P. TRANSCRIPT

ERISP INTERVIEW NO tWI7<,IOQ-NAME OF INTERVIEWEE roo I NAME OF INTERVIEWING OFFICER ~Iv, iXlNAC,W1 INTERVIEW LOCATION :JltT J(oc;M/I11 . DATE OF INTERVIEW '\ t" t:&b .;;?o 1I NUMBER OF PAGES \D ..

I have reviewed this E.R.I.S.P. transcription and compared the transcript with the

Pollee Master Audio Cassette Tape. I am of the opinion that the transcript is an

accurate record of the electronically recorded interview.

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SENIOR CONSTABLE DONAGHY

Q1 O.K. its 10.00am on Wednesday the 9th of February 2011, my name's

Kelly Donaghy and I'm here today at Kogarah JIRTS speaking to a

little girl, take out my paperwork and have a look. Your full name is

[ DO I is that right?

A (NO AUDIBLE REPLY).

Q2 Is that your name EJ? A (NO AUDIBLE REPLY).

Q3 You're nodding yes?

A (NO AUDIBLE REPLY).

Q4 O.K ...... tlJlw what I need to talk to you about tod.~X.EJ is that

A

Q5

A

Q6

A

Q7

A

Q8

. A Q9

A

somebody told me that your birthday is on the

2006, Is that right?

(NO AUDIBLE REPLY).

REDACTED

You're nodding your head, so how many are you EJ (NO AUDIBLE REPLY).

You're holding up four fingers, you're 4. I think the cet might have

your tongue today, you're not really talkative, is it OK we use our

voice rather than nod our head today?

(NO AUDIBLE REPLY).

Can we talk and use our voice?

(NO AUDIBLE REPL YJ. You're nodding your head, OK All right no~"DO ~hat I want to talk

to you about today is that you said something aboli! my pen before,

cen you tell me what colour this fluff around my pen Is?

Blue .

I! somebody said that that was red, would that be the truth or would

that be a lie?

A lie.

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Q10 O.K. so what's the truth, what colour is it?

A Blue.

011 O.K. can we talk about only the truth today when we talk?

A (NO AUDIBLE REPLY).

Q12 You're nodding your head. ,Can you tell me what sometimes happens

if people don't tell the truthE)

A (NO AUDIBLE REPLY).

013 What sometimes happens if people don't tell the truth?

A (NO AUDIBLE REPLY).

014 do you know?

A (NO AUDIBLE REPLY), -:-'-. -".-. Q15 No? O.K. ATrnght now you've chosen a toy there to play wi!lHoaay

while we're talking, it's a little bit noisy It's got a bell in it.

A I know,

016 It's very cute, OK Can you tell me something fun you like to do

roo ~

A (NO AUDIBLE REPLY).

Q17 Because I haven't met you before so I want to hear about something

that you like to do for fun.

A (NO AUDIBLE REPLy).

018 You're shrugging your shoulders, you don't know?

A (NO AUDIBLE REPLY).

019 Well what do you like In music, what sort of music do you like?

A (NO AUDIBLE REPLY).

020 Do you like HI-5?

A Justin Bieber.

021 Justin Bieber rtght, well can you tell me all about Justin Bieber?

A (NO AUDIBLE REPLy).

022 Yeah?

A I'm going to see Justin Bieber concert tomorrow.

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023 You're going to see the Justin Bieber tomorrow, who are you going

there with?

A Mummy and'

024 Wow. I'm just going to move th is around your fool is that OK cause

this is a little speaker and I don't know If it can hear your little voice,

because I've got a loud voice and I don't know if it can hear you.

A Oh,

025 Yeah so I just thought I'd move it closer to you. So tell me what

songs do you like of Justin Bieber?

Hey Baby, Baby, Baby Oh. A

026 Baby, Baby, Oh .. ..That's a very good song I like that one too, WeJL. •.

that's exciting, Now E]when you came here today who brought

you to the office today?

A Mummy.

027 Mummy. OK and did mummy tell you why you were coming here

A

028

A

029

today?

(NO AUDIBLE REPLy),

You're nodding your head?

MmmMmm.

Why, why did you come here today to talk to me?

A That clock fell.

030 It didn't fall Its just there to tell me the time In case I forget. So can

you tell me why you're today talking to meE)

A Cause mummy said to me we've got to go to a new work.

031 O,K. All right well I'm here today to talk to you about your kindy, Is

that O.K. if we talk about klndy?

A (NO AUDIBLE REPLY),

032 You're nodding your head. Can you tell me all about your klndy that

you. use to go to?

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A (NO AUDIBLE REPLY).

033 Tell me who works there?

A III 034 _ Yep who else?

A

035

A

036 Sorry?

A

037

Yeah.

else?

. .........,..-~ ... A

038 - - - and who else.-is there~' ~""

A

039

A

040

A

041

A

042

A

043

A

044

.. _ Who else?

And who else? - . .. Is there anyone else?

REDACTED

REDACTED yep?

A That's away here.

045 And are those names that you told me girls or boys?

A Girls and boys.

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046 Girls and boys O.K, Now somebody told me that somebody works

A

there called rOM ~

I knoWCoM I L-J

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047 You knowf DM l how do you knowf DM p A Cause he, he lives

048 Sorry?

A They are cousins who live with_.

049 They're your cousins that live with I'm just talking about Pre-

school OK or at kindy if you call It that. OK do you knov.fDM , hat

use to wort< at kindy?

A (NO AUDIBLE REPLY).

050 You're nodding your head , tell me all aboutE}

A Would ...... she put those on the beach ball a big one. And that's

what I forgot what he did. ..~ -, . ....,....,.. ...

Yep.

A He put us on the swing.

052 O.K. sqeDM ~ould put you on the beach ball and he'd put you on the

swing?

A I want to see mummy.

053 . You want to go see mummy? ThaI's O.K. mummy's just talking to

one of my friends at the moment so she's just a bit busy and we're

just going to have a talk and you can see her Is that all right?

A (NO AUDIBLE REPLY). (BACKGROUND NOISE - CASH

REGISTER BEING PtA YEO IN FRONT OF MICROPHONE).

054 Yeah?

A I don't want to talk anymore.

055 You don't want to talk anymore? Can you tell me why?

A I just want to go see momma.

056 O.K. Well we'll go and see mum In a minute. Now can you tell me

why you d'on't go to pre-school, kindy anymore?

A Cause I don't want to go there cause Its, ·cause we have a sleep and -

057 You don't want to go there because you have a sleep?

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A Yeah and I don't want ...... but we but I ... ... I rest.

058 O.K. So why didn't you like sleep?

A Cause I only like resting.

059 Cause you only like rest you don't like sleep?

A (NO AUDIBLE REPLY).

060 O.K. Tell me what happened at kindy when you use to have a sleep?

A Cause I don't like sleeping on those beds.

061 You don't like sleeping on the beds. Tell me more about that?

A Cause, cause I only like doing il to the ..... (INAUDIBLE

CONVERSATION - EATING).

062 O.K. Now I'm going to show you a picture is that O.K.?

(NO AUDIBLE REPLY).

063 What can you tell me about this picture?

A A rudie nudie.

064 It's a rudie nudie, O.K. Cause she's got no clothes on, is that why

you're saying she's a rudle nudie?

A (NO AUDIBLE REPLY).

065 Fair enough. O.K. now I'm going to point to a part of the body and I

A

066

want you to tell me what its called and then I'm going to write down

the name, does that sound O.K. (BACKGROUND NOISE - KICKING

THE TABLE WITH SHOES).

(NO AUDIBLE REPLY).

You just might not want to kick cause that might just be a bit noisy if

that's O.K., thanks so much for that. O.K. what part of the body Is this

called?

A Finger.

067 Finger. All light O.K. whose allowed to touch your finger?

A Mummy.

068 Mummy, anyone else?

A Daddy.

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Q69 Daddy yep, O.K. What about this part of your body?

A Toe.

Q70 O.K. whose allowed to touch your toes?

A Mummy and daddy.

Q71 O.K. anyone else?

A

Q72 Sorry?

A

Q73 Who's that?

My brother. A

Q74 Your brother, fair enough. OK what part of the body Is this called? .~.-. '

A Leg.

Q75 Where the pen Is.

A ..... (WHISPERING). Bellybutton.

Q76 Bellybutton. And who's allowed to touch your bellybutton?

A Mummy and daddy and!

Q77 OK and has anybody else touched your bellybutton ' apart from

A

078

mummy and daddy?

And apart from

bellybutton.

A (NO AUDIBLE REPLY).

has anybody else touched your

079 You're shaking your head no? OK what part of this of the body Is

this called?

A Leg.

Q80 Yep. And what part offhe body Is this called?

'A Tummy.

Q81 Now I'm going to draw a circle around a part of the body and I want.

you to tell me what Is Inside the circle and what part of the body Is that

called?

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A

082

Tummy.

O.K. the part of the body that I've circled is the part of the body that

you use to go to the toilet. So can you tell me what that part of the

bodies called?

A Wizzie.

083 Wizzie? O.K. All right now who's allowed to touch you on the wizzie?

A Daddy and mummy and

084 O.K. All right now has anybody else touched you on the wizzie?

A (NO AUDIBLE REPLY).

085 You're nodding your head? Who's touched you on the wlzzie?

A On.!,)y tummy.

086 onwurtummy? Who's touched you on your tumriiyr"

A Daddy. And momma.

087 Yep?

A And '

~ QK~~~~~QK.~~~~d~~

A

089

apart from_your brother, has anybody else touched you on

your tummy?

(NO AUDIBLE REPLY). (BACKGROUND NOISE - FODD PACKET

BEING RATILED NEAR MICROPHONE).

You're shaking your head no? Do you want me to open that for you?

U's opened Itself.

A Where Is that thing put?

090 I don't know, do you want to try and open it so It doesn't spill or are

you rtght?

A Puppy, puppy. Need to put It In my finger.

091 O.K. now the reason why I'm talking to you today~s Its I'm a

pollee lady O.K. but I'm Just not weartng a police uniform because I

talk to kids and we wear normal clothes, did you know that?

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A (NO AUDIBLE REPLY).

092 You're nodding your head. So the reason I'm asking you these

questions todayE:Jis I just need to make sure that you're O.K. and

that no body's touched you on your wizzie or on your tummy when

they shouldn't have. Do you understand?

A (NO AUDIBLE REPLY).

093 Now Is there anything that you think that you should tell me or

anything I need to know?

A Go see momma.

094 You want to see momma? All right well we're going to go and see

momm.~ soon, I just want to make sure we finish taJ.~Jng before

we go aM see mum, is that O.K.?

A (NO AUDIBLE REPLY).

095 All right because somebody told me somethlngfDO ~nd I just want to

check with you If its right. is that O.K.?

A (NO AUDIBLE REPLY).

096 So I need you to listen to the question I'm going to ask.

A My brother has these stickers,

097 Does he? O.K. can you choose two that you want to use and then

come back down and sit down so I can make sur~ that you're listening , to what I'm saying to you, There you go, all ' right now are you

listening to my question?

A (NO AUDIBLE REPLY).

098 O.K, very good. Now I just want to make sure ~when I spoke to

you before that nobody's touched you on the tum\"y and the wlzzie

and somebody told me O.K. that you told your murrl that~touched

your tummy. What can you tell me about that?

A Cause he can touch me.

099 Can you tell me more about that?

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A (NO AUD[BLE REPLY).

0100 No?

A I go see momma.

0101 You want to see momma? We're going to go and see her very soon

O.K.? [just want to make sure that you're O.K. So you're happy at

your new kindy now?

A (NO AUD[BLE REPLY).

0102 You're nodding your head. Well that's good. I'm just going to ask my

friend [f she's got anymore questions before we finish talking today,

I'm just going to write my name on this piece of paper. O.K. Do you

remember te[linllmummy about any of this?

A (NO AUD[BLE REPLY).

0103 No? O.K. All right. Well thank you very much~for coming and

talking to me today, you did a really good Job O.K.? Now while we're

talking to mummy today are you O.K. to play in the playroom for a

while?

A (NO AUD[BLE REPLY).

Q104 OK this Interview Is now suspended and the time is 10,1 Oam. Thank

youEJ

INTERVIEW CONCLUDED

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