Peter Bogdanovich July 28

8/13/2019 Peter Bogdanovich July 28

1/25

PETER BOGDANOVICH July 28, 1977 Interview

How did you become a director?

I started acting in New York in stock theater and television between the ages offifteen and nineteen I worked for the New York !hakes"eare #estival and Joe $a"" in

19%7 as a s"ear carrier in Othello I was also studying acting with !tella &dler at theti'e &t a certain "oint, so'e ti'e before I was eighteen, I decided that I(d )ust assoon not be an actor, that I(d rather direct It was a big 'istake, because actors don(thave to work as hard and get "aid 'ore 'oney*he first thing I did as a director was an +ff-roadway "roduction of The Big Knifeby .lifford +dets, when I was about nineteen or twenty +dets was the first "erson togive 'e a chance to direct "rofessionally I did another "lay +ff-roadway about fouryears later, /auf'an and 0art(s Once in a Lifetime uring that ti'e I was alsowriting about 'ovies, because I didn(t have any 'oney and wanted to see the' forfree *here was a ti'e when I was on every screening list in New York, and I also gotall these books fro' "ublishers that I couldn(t "ossibly read I only had a s'all roo'

and it was filled with books I was writing for a strange little 'againe calledIvythata""eared about si3 ti'es a year, and then eventually hit the big ti'e and wrote so'e"ieces forEsquire&t so'e "oint the director #rank *ashlin ca'e to New York I(d 'et hi' in0ollywood when I was doing anEsquire"iece about Jerry 4ewis 0e said, 56hat areyou doing in New York on(t you want to direct 'ovies I said, 5Yes 0e said,56ell, they 'ake the' in .alifornia !o a few 'onths later 'y for'er wife, $olly$latt, and I were in a car driving west !oon afterwards I was at a 'ovie screening andoger .or'an was sitting there 0e said, 5You write forEsquire, don(t you I(veread your stuff 6ould you ever consider writing screen"lays I said, 5!ure 0esaid, 56hy don(t you write a screen"lay for 'e I want so'ething that(s a kind of aco'bination of Bridge on the River KwaiandLawrence of Arabia -ut chea" !o$olly and I wrote a scri"t called The riminals, which was never "roduced ightaround that sa'e ti'e oger was doing a 'otorcycle "icture called The !ild Angelsand he asked if I would like to work on this "icture I said, 5oing what 0e said, 5Idon(t know Just co'e on down and be with 'e 6e(re having "roble's with thefil' It(s a short shooting schedule, only three weeks, and the scri"t needs a "olishI(ll "ay you :12% a week now, and when we(re in "roduction :1%;I read the scri"t It was really bad, sort of like a isney "icture *here were things in itlike< 5*he 'otorcycles roar by .ut to frog(s $+= of 'otorcycles going by *herewas another scene with a horse and it said, 5.ut to horse 0orse looks .ut to horse(s

"oint of view of fight oger said, 56e(re going to start shooting in about a week6e need the scri"t rewritten I re'e'ber he had a yellow legal "ad where he hadwritten about forty "ages of notes on the scri"t 0e called the writer and said, 5Now,.huck, on the first "age there(s a "roble' about > &nd he was interru"ted, listenedfor about ten 'inutes and said, 5I(ll get back to you, .huck oger then turns to 'eand says, 50e doesn(t like 'y first note 6hy don(t you rewrite it !o in about fiveor si3 days I rewrote the whole scri"t, for which I didn(t receive any credit, not that Iasked for it I hel"ed cast it because ?eorge .hakiris, who was going to be in it, @uitwhen he got the scri"t 0e said it was Ai''oral( oger had to figure out who wasgoing to "lay the "art and decided that 'aybe $eter #onda could do it I re'e'beredhi' looking very "re""y inLilithand wondered if he could "lay this biker guy, but he

ca'e into the office wearing aviator sunglasses and I thought he really lookedfabulous 6e gave hi' the "art and I 'ade sure he wore the glasses in al'ost every


2/25

shot

6e shot for about three weeks I did al'ost everything you could do on a "icture Igot the laundry, 'ade sure the lunch was there, hel"ed find locations 6e had real0ells &ngels on the "icture oger said, 5-e sure you know before you get the setu"

where your ne3t shot is, because the 'inute you have to think the crew will fall a"arton(t thinkB)ust goC 6hen you finish a shot, )ust turn to the' and say, A+kay, we(reover here( Dven if you don(t know where the hell you(re going, )ust "retend It kee"severybody on their toes, and kee"s 'orale u" Eeanwhile, the 0ells &ngels didn(tfeel like hurrying u" so 'uch oger would say, 54et(s start the bikes now &ll thebikes down the roadC and they(d )ust sort of leisurely kick over their engines, andafter a cou"le tries so'eone would turn around and say, 5It doesn(t start, 'an !othen it would be a halfhour while we waited for the' to get the bikes going, and weke"t falling further and further behind schedule*he last cou"le days we were doing a fight scene between the townies and the &ngels6e didn(t have any e3tras, so I "layed one of the townies oger said, 5un in there

Now, they had seen 'e standing ne3t to oger, who' they hated -oth of us woresunglasses and they thought< sunglasses, sonofabitch director and all that !o I run inthere and they )ust about killed 'e *hey were kicking 'e, and I never "rayed so'uch for a director to call 5.ut &fter about three days of shooting the guy who wasthe ringleader ca'e over to 'e and said, 50ey, 'an, I(' sorry about hassling youbefore I said, 5*hat(s all right 0e said, 56e thought you were a shit, you know,but you(re all right *hat was 'y first review *hey(ve gotten "rogressively worse& few days before we were su""osed to finish, oger said, 56e(re going to have tothrow out the rest of the scri"t and )ust "iece it together I said, 5oger, we(ve onlygot about half the "icture 0e said, 5No, we(ve got three@uarters of it I said, 56hatabout the other @uarter 56e(ll )ust have to get a second unit to go out and shoot this

)unk I can(t do it I(' not going to s"end any 'ore 'oney I said, 5I(d love to do thesecond unit 0e said, 5Ey secretary or you, it doesn(t 'ake any difference 0ewra""ed the shoot and we went back to 4os &ngeles 0e called 'e and said, 5+kay, Iwant you to do the second unitI went out and shot for a week with a full crew, then for another week with a s'allercrew, and then finally the last week with )ust 'e and a ca'era'an, one actor and abike &ctually for a while we were first unit, because we had $eter #onda and Nancy!inatra I did a whole se@uence with -ruce ern where he gets killed u" in the'ountains *he only thing oger said was, 5You know how 0itchcock works I said,56hat do you 'ean 0e said, 50e "lans everything I said, 5Yeah 0e said, 5You

know how 0oward 0awks works I said, 5Yeah 0e said, 50e never "lansanything I said, 5ight 0e said, 5+n this one be 0itchcock I said, 5+kay I hada cou"le fights with the cine'atogra"her who knew that I hadn(t done anything andwanted to take advantage of it I learned a lesson because I said, 5I want to shoot overthere 0e said, 5You can(t shoot over there, the sun(s not there I said, 56ell, will itever be there 0e looked u" and said, 5No I believed hi' *wenty 'inutes later Ilook over and say, 50ey, there(s sun over there -ut it was too late because we(dalready got the shot so'ewhere else, and I figured this guy didn(t know what the hellhe was doing, either !o that(s how I learned to direct "ictures 6hen I finishedshooting the stuff, oger said, 5*he cutter(s got too 'uch to do You(ll have to cutyour own 'aterial together I didn(t have any idea how to cut, so we got a 'achine

and a guy who knew so'ething about it, and I started to cut I worked twentytwoweeks on the "icture, fro' "re"roduction, shooting, second unit, everything, and it


3/25

was a twentytwoweek course in "icture 'aking I haven(t learned as 'uch sinceThe !ild Angelsbeca'e a very big success It cost about :F;;,;;; and grossed about:% 'illion It was oger(s 'ost successful 'ovie at that ti'e, and he asked 'e if Iwanted to direct 'y own "icture, and that(s how Targetsca'e about oger said, 5I(ll"ay :G,;;; for you and your wife, but before that I want you to fi3 u" another "icture

for 'e, sa'e "rice It(s a little ussian "icture I(ve got called "torm louds of #enusIt(s got the greatest s"ecial effects, rocket shi"s taking off and landing on =enus ands"ace stations It(s great stuff, but there(s one "roble' with it *here(s no girls in itIt(s )ust a bunch of guys wandering around I said, 56hat do you want 'e to do0e said, 5I can sell it if you can "ut so'e girls in it You can go shoot with Ea'ie=an oren but I can(t afford sound 0e told 'e to go down to Ealibu to 'atch thee3isting footage 6ell, you all know what Ealibu looks like It does not look like the-lack !ea, which was where the ussians shot their =enus6e went to Ealibu *here were a lot of rocks in one "articular "lace, so we shot allthis stuff on the rocks 6e had seven girls I don(t know why, but I thought if they(reon =enus they have to be blond !o'e of the' weren(t blond but we gave the' wigs

$olly designed gills of so'e kind because I thought they ought to be 'er'aids *henI wondered how they were going to walk on the rocks *he costu'es were tights withrubber things sticking off the' and when they got wet they started to droo" Younever saw such a grou" of saggyassed sirens walking across the rocks It was anunbelievable "icture 6e shot five days on the rocks *here was no dialogue, becausewe had no sound 6e said, 50ow are they going to co''unicate I thought,5*ele"athyC !o Ea'ie =an oren would look 'eaningfully at one of the other girlsand they would go get so'e fish or whatever 6hen all this was cut together it wastotally i'"ossible to understand, so oger said to 'e, 5You(ll have to "ut in so'enarration *his went on for 'onths Dventually we finished the fil', which wascalled #oyage to the $lanet of $rehistoric !omen It(s a ridiculous 'ovie I directedten 'inutes of it, that(s all

&nyway, back to Targets oger said, 5-oris /arloff owes 'e two days( work I'ade a "icture with -oris and Jack Nicholson called The Terror I want you to takeabout twenty 'inutes of /arloff footage fro' The Terrorand shoot twenty 'ore'inutes with /arloff You(ll be able to shoot twenty 'inutes in two days I(ve shotwhole "ictures in two days *hen get a bunch of other actors and shoot another forty'inutes in ten days and we(ve got an eighty'inute /arloff "icture &re youinterested -eing twentysi3 and interested in al'ost anything which would give 'e

a chance to direct, I said yes I looked at the footage fro' The Terrorand wonderedwhat I was going to do with this footage of /arloff skulking around this 'ansion Ididn(t want to 'ake that kind of 'ovie -oris didn(t even scare 'e very 'uch, so Ifigured, 5I(ll 'ake hi' an actor in this fil' I was going to begin the "icture in a"ro)ection roo' with scenes fro' The Terror *he lights co'e u" and there(s -orissitting there with oger .or'an, and -oris turns to oger and says, 5It really was adreadful 'ovie, wasn(t it oger turns and 'u'bles so'ething I figured it wasn(t abad idea, because if he(s a disgruntled actor then I have an alibi for all this lousyfootage *hat was how the fil' started *hen $olly said, 56hy don(t we write a storyabout the guy who shot those "eo"le in &ustin, *e3as I don(t know if any of youre'e'ber, but in 19GG there was a guy na'ed .harles 6hit'an in *e3as who killed

his wife and his 'other and then went u" that tower in &ustin with a rifle andrando'ly killed a bunch of "eo"le for a""arently no reason


4/25

!o we crosscut that with a story about an aging 'ovie star who "layed in a lot ofhorror "ictures who feels he(s all washed u" and has decided he(s going to @uit thebusiness because the horror of the 'odern age is 'uch worse than any =ictorianhorror *he tension between those two stories was what we ended u" working on It(sa bit manqu%, as the #rench would say, but it kind of worked 6e had to kill /arloff

off about halfway through the "icture because I only had hi' for two days I showedthe outline to !a' #uller and he said, 56hy did you kill /arloff off in the 'iddle ofthe "icture, kid I said, 5I(ve only got hi' for two days 5on(t think about thatCIgnore thatC 0e(s the star of the "icture You can(t kill hi' off in the 'iddle I said,5-ut oger won(t give 'e the ti'e 5Ignore thatC he said 56rite the scri"t like yougot hi' for the whole "icture Never worry about anything "ractical when you(rewriting a "icture 6hen you(re directing it, that(s another "roble', but right nowyou(re writing it In three hours !a' "roceeded to rewrite it, @uite brilliantly &fter Ilooked at the changes I said, 5-ut !a''y, this is a co'"lete rewrite I(ve got to giveyou credit 0e said, 5Naw If you give 'e credit they(ll )ust think I wrote the wholething

I rewrote the scri"t again and gave it to oger, who said, 50ow are you going to shootall this stuff with /arloff in two days I said, 5I can(t 0e said, 5$eter, I(' notgoing to "ay for any 'ore ti'e !o I called u" /arloff(s agent and we tried severalthings 4uckily /arloff loved the scri"t I said, 5I need five days It was a big dealand cost oger a little e3tra 'oney, but we finally got /arloff for five days and shotall the stuff you see in the fil' *hen we shot with other "eo"le for about twenty daysIt was really about fifteen days of "rinci"al "hotogra"hy and ten days of second unit,which was only five "eo"le< 'e and 4Hsl /ovHcs and a cou"le other "eo"le 6estole all the shots on the freeway 6e didn(t even ask "er'ission, because we knewthey would turn us down 6hen the sni"er is shooting the cars on the freeway, we hadtwo ca'eras and a walkietalkie syste' I had so'e of 'y neighbors in cars *heysaid, 5&ll right, we(re co'ing on the -urbank onra'" I said, 5+kay, okay, I seeyou +kay, get ready, here we go &nd as they ca'e by the ca'era I would say,5-angC over the walkietalkie and they would react to the shot 4Hsl asked, 56hatha""ens if we see a co" I said, 5#il' hi' *he shots of the "olice you see in the"icture are real "olice *hey didn(t know they were in the shot&ll together the fil' cost :1F;,;;;, including :22,;;; for -oris 6e finished it andevery studio turned it down *hey didn(t think it was very good or 'aybe theythought it was too violent ?od knows what they thought, they )ust weren(t interestedin it, e3ce"t for $ara'ount, which sort of liked it but not enough to "ut u" any 'oneyoger wanted the :1F;,;;; that he had "ut out 6e did a screening at &rthur /night(s

!. cine'a class and invited the trade "ress I said, 5If you like it, "lease review it6ell, they ha""ened to like it, so they wrote reviews in the trades, and the ne3t day$ara'ount called and said, 56e(re still interested 0ave you sold it yet I said, 5Ye",we(ve got a deal, but it hasn(t really been closed yet $ara'ount says, 56hat(s thedeal for and I say, 5:1F;,;;; *hey said, 56ell, we(ll 'ake it :1%;,;;;, and theybought it *hen there was a big internal struggle at the studio -ob Dvans and .harlie-luhdorn were the ones who really liked it, but al'ost nobody else at the studio did,so it wasn(t well distributed and nobody really saw the fil' *he ti'ing wasn(t great,either You 'ight think "eo"le would be interested in seeing a "icture about rando'violence after two assassinationsBEartin 4uther /ing and -obby /ennedyBbutthey weren(t 6e finished shooting )ust before /ing was assassinated, and the guy

who shot hi' used a F;;G rifle, )ust like the one we used in the "icture, and drove awhite Eustang, which the boy does in the fil'


5/25

Do you think youll work with Corman again?

It was a 'arvelous way to start, because you learn a certain disci"line that you neverlose ?uerrilla fil''aking is so'ething you should all learn You steal, cheat, lie anddo anything you can to get the scene I think that(s why 'any of the older directorswere so good, because they had a disci"line that was i'"osed fro' outside *hat(s the

terrible thing about having too 'uch freedo', "articularly at the start of a career Ithink there(s nothing better than being told, 54ook, you(ve got to do it in three daysYou(ve only got this 'uch 'oney, so do it this way or you(re not going to get itdone In the old days, so'ebody like John #ord had only so 'uch fil' and that(s allIt wasn(t that he wanted to be econo'ical *he guys in the front office said, 5*hat(s it*hat(s all you(ve got &t .olu'bia for years they wouldn(t let you "rint 'ore thanone take &nd the whole idea of 54et(s go is i'"ortant ?et the crew going 56e gotthis shot over here, now we(re over here /ee" it 'oving, because there(s a terriblekind of lethargy and boredo' that sets in on a crew Eaking "ictures is boring foreverybody e3ce"t the director, and so'eti'es even for hi' -ut the 'ore you geteverybody going, the less boring it is I was ha""y working for oger I loved it 0e

gave 'e the ground rules and then left 'e alone 0e also loved the "icture when itwas finished 0e didn(t give 'e 'uch 'oney, but so whatWhere didThe Last Picture Show come from?6hat I think Targetslacked was a sense of the "erfor'ances I began as an actor atage fifteen, and when I(' on the set I still a""roach everything fro' the actor(s "ointof view /arloff was good in Targetsand the boy in it was also good, but everybodyelse could have been better 6hat I really wanted to do on The Last $icture "howwasconcentrate on the actors, to really get good "erfor'ances out of the' +ne otherreason why I wanted to 'ake the "icture was because after reading the novel by 4arryEcEurtry I didn(t know how to fil' it !olving the "roble' of how to turn this storyinto a fil' was very intriguing to 'e I liked the fact that it was about a world I knewnothing about It was @uite a challenge to 'ake a fil' about what was, basically, aforeign country to 'e$eo"le ke"t giving 'e 4arry(s book to read and I never read it !al Eineo, a sweet,dear friend, gave it to 'e, as did two or three other "eo"le I finally read it about twoyears later and liked it very 'uch I wanted to do it but I couldn(t get the rights *he"roducer -ert !chneider, who had liked Targets, said to 'e once, 5If you ever want todo a "icture, let 'e know & lot of "eo"le say that, so I didn(t believe it, but I calledhi' u" and said, 50ey, were you on the level about wanting to do a "icture 0e said,5Yeah I said, 56ell, I read a book I liked called The Last $icture "howby 4arryEcEurtry ?o get it and read it I wanted to see if he was really on the level &bout a

week later he called and said, 56ell, I read the book 4et(s 'ake it I said, 5#ine,e3ce"t this other guy owns the rights and I think he(s got so'e "retty bad ideas howto 'ake this thing -ert said, 50ow do you want to 'ake it I said, 5I )ust want to'ake the book 0e said, 5*hat(s what we all like, isn(t it !o he got the rights andwe 'ade it It was really "retty si'"le4arry wrote a draft, which I rewrote *he trouble with 4arry was that he really didn(tlike his book as 'uch as I did 0e ke"t changing the scri"t I would say, 54arry, thiswasn(t in the book 0e said, 5No, it(s better I said, 5No, it(s worse, and I wouldchange it back to the book It(s funny correcting the writer hi'self 0e had written thebook in five weeks out of a kind of anger, and I don(t think he felt the sa'e thing Idid co'ing fresh to it *he scri"t really was "retty 'uch the book with "arts cut out

6e really could have 'ade the "icture another hour longerHow did you come to cast Ben Johnson in the film?


6/25

I couldn(t think who could "lay the "art of !a' the 4ion I went to Nashville andinterviewed old countryandwestern singers, thinking 'aybe I(d find so'e great oldfaces there *hen one day I thought, 5-en JohnsonC -ut he didn(t want to do it 0esaid, 5$eter, there are too 'any words I can(t say all those words !o I called John#ord and said, 5I(ve got this wonderful "art for -en and he doesn(t want to do it 0e

says there(s too 'any words 5+h, .hrist, he says 5-en(s always been like that6hen we were shooting &ellow Ribbon-en would co'e on the set and go over to thescri"t girl and ask, AI got any words today( If she said yes, he(d go and sulk If shesaid no, he was ha""y &ll he had to do was ride #ord says, 56here is he I(ll callhi' !o about an hour later #ord calls 'e back and says, 50e(ll do it *hen -encalls and he says, 5.hrist, you got the old 'an on 'e I said, 56ell, I )ust want youto do this "icture !o he ca'e in about three or four days later and sat down in theoffice 0e had the scri"t in his hand and said, 5$ete, I )ust don(t think I can do this foryou, boy I said, 5-en, you(ve got to do it 0e says, 56hy do you kee" sayingthat I said, 5-ecause there(s nobody else that could do it 0e said, 5+h, shit, youcan get ten other guys I said, 5No You "lay this "art and you(ll win the +scar

#inally he sla''ed the scri"t shut and said, 5&ll right, I(ll do the godda'ned thing Isaid, 54ook, we(re going to start rehearsing *hursday 0e said, 56hat have I gottado I said, 5You don(t have to do anything but read through the scenes I(d like thecast to 'eet you 'ore than anything else !o on *hursday I introduce hi' toeverybody and say, 54et(s )ust read your scene !o we start to read and he(s got thescri"t closed 0e doesn(t o"en it because he already knows every line he(s got in thething, letter "erfect 6e finish and I say, 5You know, you(re a sonofabitch 0e says,56hy I say, 56hat the hell do you 'ean, telling 'e you don(t know how to readwords You didn(t have to learn the lines by now 0e said, 56ell, $ete, I(' not toogood at reading, so I )ust figured I(d better know (e' &nyway, he did win the +scar*he to""er is that three years later I(' talking to hi' about a "icture we wanted to dowith uke 6ayne and Ji''y !tewart, and he says, 5I like it, but there(s not too 'anywords in there for 'eCan I ask you a blunt question? ou!e worked with a lot of !ery good actors" Was

Cybill #he$herd hired on the basis of her looks?

No, she wasn(t hired on the basis of her looks I was in New York casting and sheca'e in and took off her shoes and sat on the floor ne3t to a kind of a "ot with acou"le flowers sticking out of it I said, 56hat do you do !he said, 5I go tocollege 56here do you go to college 5I go to 0unter 56ell, what are youtaking 5Dnglish literature !he(s behaving like she doesn(t give a da'n aboutbeing there, and I asked her which authors she likes, and she says, 5ostoevsky

56hat have you read of his 4ong "ause 5I can(t think of anything right now -utas she said it she "layed with a flower *here wasn(t any kind of feeling that she hadbeen caught short It was as if I was the du''y for asking such a stu"id @uestion Itwas the 'ost wonderful reading I(ve ever heard It turned out she was )ust nervousand that(s the way she acts in those situations !he gets rather @uiet and shy but itco'es out as very cool -ut when she touched that flower I e3"ected it to wilt, and Ithought to 'yself, 5*hat(s the characterC I hadn(t understood the character until that'o'ent Jacy should be a girl who(s kind of destructive to 'en, but not on "ur"ose!he )ust flits fro' flower to flower and they wilt in her wake, but it(s not like she goesout and says, 5I(' going to kill that guy *hat(s the character we evolved, but shegave it to 'e )ust by touching the flower in the audition

I think one of the finest moments inThe Last Picture Show is the last shot withCloris %eachman &ust before you dissol!e to the $an"


7/25

You 'ean when she(s trying to talk to hi' and she can(t @uite get anything outDssentially, she had so'e answers to this situation !he see'ed to gli'"se the sunthrough a cloud and was trying to find the words to say it *his character is not anelo@uent wo'an, so she lost the words -ut she knew that it would all be okay I wastelling her all this as we were doing it !he was great, though the "roducers wanted

'e to cut the whole last se@uence with .loris and *i' *hey thought the "ictureshould end on the road I said, 5I only 'ade the "icture so I could have that sceneIt(s the best scene in the "icture I had to cut so'e other things as a sacrifice Youhave to give the' so'ething so you can kee" the stuff you like *hat(s true in life tooou s$oke earlier of studying with #tella 'dler" Can you say what she taught you?

I was involved in 'any theater "roductions as an actor and stagehand and dresser,"erha"s forty of the', before I ever directed Dverything I know aboutco''unicating with actors I learned fro' !tella, things I could fall back on when 'yinstinctual a""roach failed 'e Instinct will take you only so far -ecause she taughtacting in such a co'"lete way, she was also talking about directing I found the firstsi3 'onths of her class fascinating but )ust didn(t understand what she was talking

about You needed to be eighteen to get into the class but I lied because I was onlysi3teen &fter a few 'onths, it all clicked into "lace and the basic idea of what theaterand acting areBthis heightened reality rather than 'undane naturalis'Breally beganto 'ake sense to 'eirecting actually started for 'e because I was sitting around with five actors fro'!tella(s class and I said, 56hy don(t I direct you guys in a scene sually sceneclass would be a twocharacter scene or a 'onologue, so having five actors in a sceneall interacting was unusual 6e "ut it on for the class and when it was over !tellastood u" and said, 5-ravo darlingsC -ut you(ve been directed 6ho directed you*hey all "ointed at 'e at the back of the roo' !he turned to 'e and said, 5-rilliant,$eterC !o I figured I wasn(t bad at this

Did you ha!e any contact with #anford (eisner or %ee #trasberg?

I was in !trasberg(s class once, but that(s about it I(' not a big fan of his I(' very'uch fro' the &dler school, and !tella didn(t think !trasberg was a good teacher!trasberg was a "erversion of the !tanislavsky 'ethod, and !tella would be the one toknow because she(s the only "erson in the nited !tates who actually studied with the'an hi'self !he heard it fro' the horse(s 'outh !tanislavsky said that acting is fifty"ercent e3ternal and fifty "ercent internal !trasberg co'"letely eli'inated thee3ternal and was interested e3clusively in the internal, which is not a good thing foracting

Did your time as an actor hel$ you as a screenwriter?

&cting is very 'uch a "art of writing 6ith so'e scenes I(ll act out the "arts 'yselfand transcribe what I sayWas the idea for the sla$stickWhats U! Doc"your own?6arner -ros ca'e to 'e and said, 56ould you 'ake a "icture with !treisand *heyhad a scri"t they wanted 'e to do calledA 'lim(se of Tiger, but it wasn(t the kind offil' I wanted to 'ake$icture "howhadn(t even o"ened at that "oint and only two"eo"le had seen it +ne was !teve EcKueen, who wanted 'e to 'ake The 'etaway0e ca'e into 'y office after seeing the fil' and said, 5I(' )ust an actor, 'an, butyou(re a fil''aker You only 'ade one 'istake in that "icture I said, 56hat wasthat 0e said, 5You never should have cut away fro' the diving board If youre'e'ber, there(s a scene in$icture "howwhen .ybill stri"s at the swi''ing "ool

*he other was -arbra !treisand and she wanted to work with 'e, so John .alley, thehead of 6arner -ros, said, 5!o you don(t like this scri"t 6hat would you like to


8/25

'ake I said, 5& screwball co'edy, like Bringing )( Baby, with -arbra & s@uare"rofessor and a daffy da'e who breaks hi' down live ha""ily ever after 0e said,5o it 6ho do you want to write it I said, 56ell, I worked with -enton andNew'an atEsquire .alley said, 5?reat, they )ust did a "icture for us I called the'and they e3"lained they were starting another fil' in three weeks I said, 5If -en

0echt and 0oward 0awks can do "carfacein eleven days, we can do this in threeweeks 6e worked for three weeks and ended u" with a draft that needed a lot ofwork I rewrote it a little and had a reading with yan and -arbra I read all the other"arts and talked 'y way through all the action se@uences, and at the end of it theyboth co''itted to it John .alley suggested we bring in -uck 0enry to rewrite it,who said, 5You(re going to hate 'e but I don(t think it(s co'"licated enough Youneed another suitcase !o we added the whole *o" !ecret suitcase which wasins"ired by the $entagon $a"ers story *hat(s actually why we cast Eichael Eur"hy,because he looked a bit like aniel Dllsberg -uck rewrote the scri"t, which is 'oreor less what we shot 6e 'ade u" so'e of the )okes as we were "lanning andshooting it #or the "arty scene in the 'illionaire(s house, all -uck wrote in the scri"t

was< 5*here is now a fight which will be brilliantly staged by the director *hat wasit *hanks a lot, -uck*he fil' ended u" being the secondbiggest hit of the year, after The 'odfather,which actually I turned down because I didn(t want to 'ake a Eafia fil' *here wasan early, glity screening of !hat*s )(+ ,oc-and the audience see'ed to be resistingit *hey weren(t loose enough for a fil' like that It(s like everyone was sitting thereasking the'selves, 56hat is this *here had been so'e laughs but it wasn(t aswar'ly received as it would later be by the "ublic &bout ten 'inutes in, John.assavetes stands u", in the 'iddle of the "icture, turns to the audience and shouts,very loudly, 5I can(t believe he(s doing thisC *he "lace broke u", and fro' then onthee'y loved it John and I beca'e friends after that It(s 'y favorite review of anyfil' of 'ine

It looks like you had fun makingWhats U! Doc"!hat*s )(+ ,oc-was the 'ost fun of any "icture I(ve ever 'ade It was absoluteheaven fro' beginning to end I didn(t give a da'n if we ever 'ade the "icture, anenviable "osition to be in *his hasn(t been the case on every "icture I(ve 'ade, butyou 'ust never give a da'n if the whole thing falls a"art 5It doesn(t 'atterBwe(lldo so'ething else< that(s the only way to do "ictures, because when you start caringthey kill you 6hen you start saying, 5If I don(t 'ake this "icture I(' going to die,they will 'ake you "ay

I re'e'ber -arbra !treisand told 'e before we did the "icture, 5I(ve never beendirected Nobody(s ever directed 'e in a "icture I said, 56ell, you(re about to bedirected, and I directed the hell out of her !he wouldn(t listen to 'e a lot of ti'es!he wouldn(t cut her nails, for instance I said, 5-arbra, this girl is a college kid andshe wouldn(t have these 'oviestar nails !he said, 5I(' not going to cut 'y nails Isaid, 5Jesus, first of all, your hands look better without the long nails !he said, 5No,they don(t I have stubby fingers I said, 5You don(t have stubby fingers !heha""ens to have very nice hands and her fingers don(t look stubby at all -ut she hasthese silly long nails, so I 'ade her carry so'ething all the way through the "icture!he(s got a suitcase or a coat over her ar' or so'ething so I wouldn(t see hergodda'n nails -ut generally we really got along and worked well together *he

director is an actor(s first audience and she wanted to "lease 'e !he knew e3actlywhat I wanted


9/25

6e took over !an #rancisco and wrecked a cou"le of streets and got in a lot oftrouble 6e had a hell of a scene when all the cars go into the water at the end *hefirst guy that went in was the =olkswagen *hey told 'e =olkswagens float, but itain(t so *his thing went down like a stone, and it was very dee" *he guy drove in atabout seventy 'iles an hour without an o3ygen tank 6e were all standing there

dying because the guy didn(t co'e u" for a 'inute, two 'inutes #inally he co'es u"having esca"ed through the windshield which luckily ca'e in on hi', because hecouldn(t get the door o"en 6e had seven or eight ca'eras on those "articular shots,so if one ca'era 'alfunctioned we would still get itJohn #ord gave 'e a very good "iece of advice 0e said, 5Never rehearse action Isaid, 56hy not 0e said, 5!o'ebody could get hurt It(s a cry"tic re'ark, as all of#ord(s re'arks were, but it 'akes sense 6hat you do is discuss everything that can"ossibly ha""en and what you want and what you(ll take if you don(t get that, andthen you do it sually you get elaborate "ieces of action on the first take becausenobody wants to do it again, and they all work like hell to get it right +ne of the lastshots in The Last $icture "howis where all the guys are standing around the truck and

the kid is lying on the ground dead, and it builds until *i' -otto's yells out, 50e wasswee"ing, you sons of bitchesC 0e "icks u" the body and carries it to the 'ar@uee ofthe theater I wanted it to be without a cut I didn(t want the ca'era to leave hi' fro'the 'o'ent he said 50e was swee"ing to the ti'e he carries the body over and walksaway It was about fifty feet fro' there to the theater, so he had to "ick u" the bodyand carry it, and the ca'era was on a truck It was a co'"licated shot for the actorbecause of the e'otion and very co'"licated for the crew because there was a oo'involved which I wanted to hide 6e set it u" before lunch and I talked to *i' allthrough lunch I was trying to find out what he was going to do without telling hi'what to do *his was a line that I wouldn(t let hi' rehearse I knew it was a line I onlywanted to hear once *hat(s a 'ovieacting thing It(s not true on the stage, but thereare certain lines in a 'ovie that should only ha""en once, because the 'inute youhave to do it again it beco'es 'echanical *hat first e'otion is very i'"ortant forcertain 'o'ents *he crew ca'e back fro' lunch and I said, 56e are not getting ashot of a guy carrying a body across the street 6e are shooting a bridge being blownu" *here is only one ca'era and we(ve only got one bridge I don(t want any'istakes fro' you guys No e3cuses !o we did the shot and we got it, thank ?od4uckily *i' was su"erb and the crew was su"erb &s a 'atter of fact, to "rove 'y"oint we actually did the shot twice *he second one was technically betterBbut the"erfor'ance wasn(t there *he first one broke your heart It(s the only ti'e I(ve everbeen 'oved to tears on a set by an actor

What did Barbra #treisand mean when she said that she hadnt e!er been directedbefore?

Eost directors have no idea how to direct actors It(s rare that they do 6illia' 6ylerwould )ust say, 5o it again =ery few of the older guyshad any theatricale3"erience, but they did have a sense of what they wanted

Did you write the scri$to# Paer $oo%?I was sent a scri"t calledAddie $raywhich was based on a book It wasn(t too goodbut there were two scenes in it that were wonderful< the cafL scene and the scene onthe hill with *ri3ie *hose two scenes were the only two scenes that re'ained afterthe rewriting -ut they were so da'ned good that I said to 'yself, 5Jesus, I could doso'ething with this I saw the whole thing as so'e kind of antiM!hirley *e'"le

'ovie I read the book and there were so'e things that weren(t in the scri"t that I "utback in and so'e things that I took out 6e didn(t co'e u" with an ending until we


10/25

shot it I finally ca'e u" with it the night before we shot it 6e had that greatlocation, that wonderful road, and we knew she was going to co'e after hi' but weweren(t sure how, so I ca'e u" with that line about the :2;;, which got 'e out of alot of troubleI ca'e u" with the title$a(er .oon, which nobody at $ara'ount liked I thought

Addie $raysounded like a snake or a liard or so'ething *hey all said, 56hy do youwant to call it$a(er .oon 6hat(s it got to do with the "icture I said, 56hat thehell does it 'atter what it has to do with the "icture It(s a good title I said to thewriter, 56e(ve got a "roble' You know those "a"er 'oons that you sat in atcarnivals and they took your "icture 6e(ve got to "ut a scene in so they(ll thinkthere(s a reason for the title I called u" +rson 6elles who was in o'e and said,50ey, what do you think of this title -ecause this is long distance to o'e and Iwanted to 'ake sure he understood, I said, very loudly, /$a(er .oon01*here was along "ause, and he says, 5*hat title is so good you shouldn(t even 'ake the "ictureJust release the title

How did you work with )atum *+eal inPaer $oo%?

6ith great difficultyDid you ha!e to o!ercome some difficulty with her father?

Jesus no, I had to kee" yan fro' killing her 5?odda''it, *atu', would you learnyour lines ?odda''it, I(' not going to do it again with herC !hit, we(ve done ittwentyeight ti'esC ?et the lines right, *atu'C $eter, I can(t do it again I did$eyton

$lacefive thousand ti'es and I never went through anything like thisC *his is on aroad in the 'iddle of /ansas with nothing anywhere but /ansas and the car and thisrig that we had "ulling the car with the ca'era on it and twelve "eo"le hangingaround It was a scene between yan and *atu' which "layed without a cut, and itwas the end of the first act where they have this big argu'ent about the -ibles It(sreally the scene where they sort of ad'it that they care about each other withoutsaying it or ad'itting they(re going to stay together It(s one of those scenes wherethey don(t say what they 'ean but ho"efully you get the "oint I wanted it to bewithout a cut with the' driving along, so we figured the scene would take about a'ile and a half to "lay, and we only had about a 'ile and a half where the road wasgood because after that you started seeing so'ething that wasn(t of the "eriod *wo'iles down the road there was a "lace where we could turn around and co'e back,but turning around took five or si3 'inutes because the road was so narrow !o sinceit had to be without a cut, if they started down the road and after about three linesso'ebody blew it we(d have to go two 'iles and then turn around and go back 6edid it twentyfive ti'es the first day I re'e'ber "utting 'y ar' around yan and

walking u" the road while I cal'ed hi' down I got hi' to do it another few ti'esand we still didn(t get it *he ne3t day it rained, and the day after it rained and we shotso'e other stuff, and a few days later we ca'e back and did it again 6e got it thesecond day on so'ething like the si3teenth take

*atu' was eight years old and didn(t have any idea what the hell we were doing, andshe sort of cared less !he(d never had any disci"line in her life !he was in a world ofher own, and so'eti'es her world and the one we were trying to create on screendidn(t necessarily 'esh, like the ti'e we were shooting the carnival scene It was anight scene so it took us about three hours to light it *atu' got there about fiveo(clock and did what any kid would do !he started riding the #erris wheel, eating

"o"corn, eating candy corn, eating "eanuts, and by the ti'e we were ready to shootshe was sick !he was on the floor 5I told you not to eat, said yan 5I told you, you


11/25

idiot 5+h, addyC 5?et u"C yan and I sort of alternated on who was going to beyelling at her You had to scare her into doing it right &fter about five weeks shereally got into it and started to en)oy the shooting and was 'uch better6hen yan(s character says, 5I ain(t your "a, I always figured fro' the first fra'ehe really was her father 0e(s )ust not going to co" to it 6hen we were casting the

fil', $ara'ount told 'e John 0uston had wanted to 'ake it with $aul New'an andhis daughter $olly said, 56hat about yan(s daughter -ut $ara'ount said theywouldn(t use yan under any circu'stances because he(d had an affair with &liEac?raw onLove "torywhen she was 'arried to -ob Dvans, who was head of thestudio I said, 5I won(t 'ake it with anyone else !hat*s )(+ ,oc-was still "layingin theaters and was a big hit, so I forced the issue with $ara'ount It wouldn(t havebeen good for their stockholders to turn the fil' down

How did you come to makeDais& $i''er?I read a scri"t of,aisy .illerthat was "retty bad, but when I got to the end and all ofa sudden she died I was very 'oved !o I read the original 0enry Ja'es story andthought, 5I ought to 'ake this In other words, the ending of the story 'ade the

whole thing really 'ean so'ething *hat(s the case with 'ost stories< it(s how itfinishes that 'atters 6hat does it all add u" to eciding to do so'ething reallyco'es down to whether it 'oves 'e e'otionally, or whether it 'akes 'e laugh I'ade,aisy .illerbecause it 'oved 'e 6hat "ersuaded 'e to do it is the co'"lete'isunderstanding of aisy Eiller by the young 'an 0e(s so in love with her butabsolutely doesn(t get her 0e )udges her It(s why he(s na'ed 6interbourne 0e(s ascold as ice, certainly when co'"ared to her vibrancy It see's to 'e that one of the"revalent "roble's in society is that 'en don(t understand wo'en Een trust whatthey shouldn(t and don(t trust what they should 6interbourne is also a co'"lete )erkwho thinks he(s su"erior to this young &'erican girl who is sha'eless and stubborn,but also a @uite innocent flirt *he line on the "oster was 5!he id as !he $leasedaisy flaunts Italian custo' by being seen walking in "ublic with this 'an, but he )ustdoesn(t understand where she(s co'ing fro' Ja'es "uts it very well when he has6interbourne say at the end of the story, 5I have lived too long in foreign "arts6e had #reddie a"hael write another version of the scri"t based on a fewconversations we had about 'aking it darker, 'ore dra'atic -ut that was a 'istake,because #reddie wrote a ostoevsky version and it )ust didn(t work !o I went back tothe book and rewrote every scene, and ended u" kee"ing only a cou"le of his ideas,like setting the tea scene in the baths *he scri"t went to arbitration and he ended u"getting credit on the fil' *hey offered 'e 5&dditional ialogue and I said, 5I(' notgoing to be the !a' *aylor of 'y generation !a' *aylor was the guy who took

credit on a version of The Taming of the "hrew &fter 5-ased on the "lay by 6illia'!hakes"eare it said 5&dditional ialogue by !a' *aylor Ey original "lan was to"lay 6interbourne 'yself and have +rson direct, but he didn(t want to do itWhy do you think the film was so badly recei!ed?

I don(t know I(' very "roud of it, and I think everybody is good in it I think it(sbeautifully shot I think the scri"t is very faithful to the book and I think the book iswonderful $eo"le don(t realie that al'ost all the dialogue in the "icture is by 0enryJa'es I would )ust change certain words that were a little bit too for'al, things like5I shouldn(t think so instead of 5I wouldn(t think so, because aisy wouldn(t say 5Ishouldn(t *here were e3traordinary words that ca'e u" in the dialogue that youthought wouldn(t be used during that "eriod &t one "oint she says, 5id you ever see

anything so cool *hat(s such a fifties or si3ties e3"ression, but she said it It(s in thebook fro' 187%


12/25

$eo"le find it difficult to acce"t a character like aisy Eiller in that 'ilieu I couldtell a western with the sa'e basic "lot< an Dastern girl co'es to the 6est and doesn(tunderstand the codes of the 6est If you "ut her into a western nobody would haveany difficulty believing that character -ut the 'inute you "ut her into a Duro"ean'ilieu, which is sort of so"histicated and highbrow and artistic, "eo"le find it hard to

believe that anybody could be that crude -ut that(s the "oint of the story, and if youread it again you(ll find she(s described as crude, vulgar and annoying !he wassu""osed to be that way, yet you were su""osed to like her anyway If you don(t, I(vefailed in so'e way -ut I do think that in ten years you(ll like it better, when youforget about who .ybill !he"herd is, when you forget about the fact that she(s 'ygirlfriend, when you forget about the fact that she was a cover girlIt(s a'aing, when you see 'ovies again, how they change I(ve seen "ictures that Iadored ten years ago and now think are cra", and "ictures that I hated ten years agoand now think are 'aster"ieces &ctually, what changes is you -ut it is true that"ictures have a way of changing their sha"e and color *hat(s why it(s so difficult tobe a critic It(s al'ost i'"ossible to guess what(s going to last It sounds like I('

being very defensive, but really I(' talking here today about 'y fil's as thoughso'ebody else had 'ade the' 6e(re sitting here looking at,aisy .illerin ter's ofwhat the director intended to convey and what he achieved 6hen five or si3 yearshave "assed I 'ight go back and look at a fil' I 'ade, and it either works for 'e or itdoesn(t, )ust like I 'ight run a "icture by Eioguchi or John #ord or 4ubitsch or -illy#riedkinWithDais& $i''er! which I think is one of the most beautiful films I!e e!er seen,were you influenced by anyone when it came to your camera setu$s and the color

and the com$osition?

Eainly 'y father, who was a "ainter 0e worked at ho'e because he couldn(t afforda studio, so fro' the 'o'ent I was born I was surrounded by co'"osition and colorand i'ages It 'ust have had a "rofound effect on 'e 0e was influenced by the"osti'"ressionists, but because of his !erbian heritage his work had so'e kind of-yantine overlay, which 'eant the colors were brighter,aisy .illeris one of thefew "ictures of 'ine I can look at and not feel like I actually had anything to do withit, which is nice 4ooking at your own work is like looking in the 'irror I was in the$laa 0otel so'e years ago with yan +(Neal 6e were both staggering out in the'orning for so'e sort of interview, and there was a 'irror ne3t to the elevators to letyou know how you look yan was already standing there looking in the 'irror Ica'e running u" and said, 5+h, shit, and he said, 56hat(s the 'atter I said, 5Ialways think it(s going to be better 0e said, 5*hat(s funny I(' always "leased at

how 'uch better it is *hat(s an essential difference between actors and directorsou had the great fortune of knowing -rit. %ang and John -ord" Do you thinkthose relationshi$s hel$ed you with your own filmmaking?

*here(s a fine line between being influenced by these guys and stealing outright fro'the' &ll directors steal fro' each other I was talking to 0oward 0awks about theshot inRed Riverwhen the cloud co'es in and covers the funeral I said, 5*hat(s ahell of a shot 0e said, 56ell, you know, so'eti'es you get lucky and get one ofthose great #ord shots I said, 5o you 'ean you thought of it as a #ord shot then0e said, 5+h, sure 6e all said, A4et(s get that #ord shot( I asked hi' if #ord hadinfluenced his westerns and he said, 56ell, Jesus .hrist, $eterBI don(t see how youcan 'ake a western and not be influenced by John #ordC

I was fortunate because I got out to 4os &ngeles in 19G1 Eany of the great directorsof the early "eriod were still alive then, and so'e of the' were even still working I


13/25

tracked the' down and asked the' as 'any @uestions as I "ossibly could John #ordonce yelled at 'e and said, 5Jesus, can(t you end a sentence with a "eriod 0ave youever uttered a declarative sentence &l'ost all of the' en)oyed talking about theirwork, even so'eone as recalcitrant as #ord 0e could really talk once you got hi'going It 'ust have been gratifying that such a young guy was asking the' so 'any

@uestions *hey were all aware that even though I was writing forEsquireI wasactually a theater director and an actor *his was the trick to it all, that they knew Iwasn(t a real )ournalist but that I was in the businessIt was like "utting 'yself through a uni@ue fil' school that had as its faculty all thegreat directors &l'ost all of the' began in the silent era I think one of the biggest"roble's facing 'ovies today is that we(ve lost touch with silent cine'a *hey arethe foundation of everything that ca'e afterwards +ne of the 'ain things I learnedfro' the older directors is not to let the dialogue dictate how you 'ake the "icture0itchcock said 'ost "ictures are si'"ly "ictures of "eo"le talking, and that(s beco'e'ore and 'ore the case I like what &llan wan said, that when we switched fro'silent "ictures to sound, the whole artistry was gone 0e said, 5Dvery ti'e I finished a

talking "icture I(d run it silent If I could "retty 'uch follow the "lot, I figured I(ddone a good )ob .ha"lin has a great line about this< 5Just when we were getting itright, it was over It(s true that around the ti'e silent cine'a ended, they werebeco'ing flawless at telling stories visually#or 'e, the 'aterial, the story being told, dictates the style I feel that one of thedangers in "icture 'aking is that style has beco'e 'ore i'"ortant than content +nthe other hand, if the content is very good and the style is no good, it(s still no good Ifthere(s no substance, a fil' will always be shallow -ut substance with no craft ise@ually "roble'aticWas it you who $ioneered the idea of going back and inter!iewing the old

directors?

*he #rench did it first .habrol, *ruffaut, oh'er, ivette and ?odard were allinterviewing the oldti'e &'erican directors for ahiers du in%ma I read the'againe in the late fifties and early si3ties, and it see'ed "erfectly natural to go andinterview those "eo"le I was interested in

Did you e!er think about going to /uro$e and doing for -rench and /nglishdirectors what you were doing for 'merican filmmakers?

Ey focus was on &'erican 'ovies and directors because I was going to 'ake&'erican fil's I went to see -erg'an and &ntonioni, but that wasn(t 'y"redilection I think so'ething that has hurt &'erican cine'a of late is that youngerfil''akers have gone after &ntonioni and #ellini !uch "retensionC 6here(s aoul

6alsh when we need hi'Had you really seen all the films you discussed with the directors you inter!iewed?I think I saw all but one of 0awks( fil's, and I think I saw all of 0itchcock(s fil's,but with so'eone like #ord a lot of his fil's are lost I certainly didn(t see all of &llanwan(s fil's, because he 'ade so 'any -ut re'e'ber that fil' culture in NewYork in the fifties and si3ties was a vibrant one, and there were a lot of o""ortunitiesto see rare fil's back then $eo"le were starting to take fil' very seriously I was'arginally involved with a grou" of fil''akers and avantgarde artists that beca'eknown as the New &'erican .ine'a grou", "eo"le like 4ionel ogosin and JonasEekas &dolfas Eekas asked 'e to be in his fil'2allelu3ah the 2ills, but I turnedhi' down because of the nudity I didn(t want 'y ass all over the screen I was

interested in seeing avantgarde fil's, but knew that wasn(t the kind of work I wantedto 'ake 'yself -y the ti'e I was about twenty I had sketched an idea for a fil' I


14/25

wanted to 'ake called The Land of O((ortunity, about a young cou"le in New Yorkwho get everything for free *hey either steal it or so'ehow "ro'ote it for free I )usthad the idea, and never even wrote the scri"t Years later I ended u" using so'e ofthose ideas in !hat*s )(+ ,oc-

I would go to &'os =ogel(s fil' club .ine'a 1G all the ti'e and re'e'ber vividlyseeing so'e 'e'orable 'ovies there, like 'old ,iggers of 4566and 0awks(Twentieth entury, for the first ti'e I worked for an *albot for a cou"le of years atthe New Yorker *heater on the ""er 6est !ide, which could hold so'ething like athousand "eo"le an was the first "erson to show classic &'erican fil's rather thanforeign fil's, which the *halia and 'ost of the art houses were doing 0e wasfollowing the ahierslead and started an &'erican revival house which was a veryinfluential theater for a nu'ber of years I advised hi' so'ewhat on which "ictures tobook, and curated a nu'ber of shows like *he #orgotten #il's, where we ranfourteen double bills in two weeksBtwentyeight "ictures in fourteen days whichhadn(t been seen on the big screen for thirty years I had hel" fro' &ndrew !arris and

Dugene &rcher, and wrote all the "rogra' notes In the "rogra' note I did when anrevived +rson(s Othello, which had hardly been seen in New York at all, I called thefil' 5the best !hakes"eare fil' ever 'ade *his was hardly the conventionalwisdo' at the ti'e, and I got a call fro' ichard ?riffith, head of the Euseu' ofEodern &rt fil' library, who asked 'e if I wanted to curate the firstever &'ericanretros"ective of +rson(s work at the 'useu' and write the acco'"anying'onogra"h I said, 56hy 'e 6hy don(tyoudo it 0e said, 5I don(t really like+rson 6elles very 'uch, but we have 'any friends and colleagues who do and feelthe 'useu' should do this 6e think you would be the right "erson to organie theretros"ective *hat beca'e The inema of Orson !elles, 'y first bookWhy didnt you inter!iew him at that time?

0e was in Duro"e shooting The Trial I sent two co"ies off to so'e address in Duro"eand didn(t hear a thing for seven years, not until 19G8, after I(d directed Targets &fterthe fil' had o"ened I get a "hone call 50ello, this is +rson 6elles I can(t tell youhow long I(ve wanted to 'eet with you I said, 50old on, that(s 'y line 6hy didyou want to 'eet 'e 0e said, 5-ecause you have written the truest words ever"ublished about 'e 0e "aused for a few seconds and added, 5In Dnglish *hen hesaid, 5Eeet 'e at the -everly 0ills 0otel to'orrowour written work seems almost anti0academic"

I(' not consciously antiacade'ic, it(s )ust not in 'y nature +nly occasionally do Ie3"lain what a fil' 5'eans I don(t like to get "hiloso"hical about any fil's, even

'y own I(' 'uch 'ore of an instinctual artist than "eo"le give 'e credit for,because they think I(' "aying ho'age to various things with 'y fil's +ne criticsaid that$a(er .oonis a ho'age to thirties fil''aking 6hat nonsenseC *he fil' isset in the thirties, but I never saw a single fil' like that 'ade in the thirties I was in4ondon a while ago and a ta3i driver said, 5I love$a(er .oon It(s such a celebrationof fa'ily 6ell, that(s not what I intended at all, but I(' not going to tell hi' thatand disa""oint hi' 0is "oint of view is entirely valid *here was a enoir series afew years ago here in town I went over to his house afterwards and said, 5Jean, I sawBoudu "aved from ,rowning 6hat a wonderful fil' that isC 0e was such a hu'bleand generous 'an, and he said, 5+h, thank you very 'uch You(re very kind I said,5o you like the fil' 0e said, 56ell, you know it was 'ade in the early days of

sound, and so'e of the sound is not so good *he 'usic recording is not so good 6ehad no 'oney and had to buy fil' stock as we went along, so so'e of the "icture


15/25

doesn(t 'atch fro' shot to shot !o'eti'es the cutting is a little too fast, andso'eti'es the cutting is a little too slow 0e went on and on 5-ut I think that"erha"s it(s 'y best fil'&s enoir once said in an interview with Jac@ues ivette, 56hen we have achievedtotal realis', we will have achieved total decadence Ey inter"retation of that is that

today, with s"ecial effects, you can do anything on fil' -ut who cares *he 'agic isgone *he audience knows it(s all )ust one big e3"ensive bo3 of tricks It used to bee3citing when ouglas #airbanks )u'"ed u" onto a table *he whole idea ofsus"ension of disbelief has eva"orated -uster /eaton and 0arold 4loyd did all theirown stunts, which is what 'akes the' so brilliant !o'eone once co'"lained to.ha"lin that his ca'era angles weren(t interesting 0e said, 5*hey don(t have to beI(' interesting If you watch &staire and ogers dancing, there(s hardly a cut 4ongtakes $art of the greatness of 'ovies is showing so'ething ha""en in real ti'e*oday s"ecial effects are getting so good that who knows what(s real &nd all thecutting and handheld ca'era that goes on )ust 'akes you aware of the "rocess 6hatdoes it add .ertainly not realis'

What do you make ofEas& Ri(er?It seems to be the antithesis of your own work,which looks quite conser!ati!e in com$arison"

I don(t think 5conservative is the right word I(' 'ore of a classicist -ut don(tforget that The Last $icture "howhad nudity and showed teenage se3 in a way thathad never been shown before It was @uite a radical fil' for its ti'e even though thestory was told in a classical styleEasy Riderreally began with The !ild Angels$eter #onda basically "lays the sa'e character in both fil's -rando in The !ild Onehadn(t done well, and The !ild Angelswas the first really successful biker "icture Itstarted a whole genre and without it there would be noEasy Rider $eter and ennis0o""er ca'e to oger .or'an and asked if he wanted to 'akeEasy Rider, but ogerturned it down because they wanted half a 'illion dollars +f course the two of the'ended u" winning the "rie at .annes and 'aking a fortune

Did you come u$ with the original idea forNic)e'o(eo%?It was a "et "ro)ect of 'ine because I found the whole silent era so fascinating #il'is the only art for' that was born within our lifeti'e It(s a co'"licated, wonderfuland horrible 'ediu', and I wanted to tell a story about how and when it all startedIt(s a 'o'ent full of great innocence, so'ething I think is reflected in the fil' &llthe stories in7ic8elodeonare largely true because they were told to 'e by thedirectors who had been 'aking fil's back then, "eo"le like 4eo Ec.arey, &llanwan and aoul 6alsh #or e3a'"le, yan +(Neal beco'ing a director co'esdirectly out of what ha""ened to &llan wan & director went 'issing, so wan sent

a telegra' to his boss e3"laining what had ha""ened, and received a re"ly telling hi'that he was the new director*o be honest, I don(t 'uch like the fil' It wasn(t the "icture we wanted to 'ake *oo'any co'"ro'ises, like having to 'ake it in color, and the casting I wanted ayounger cast, but the studio wanted big star na'esWhat are your thoughts on music in films?

I think that essentially I(' cheating if the 'usic in a fil' accentuates or e'bellishesthe action It see's to 'e that the visuals should do absolutely everything *oo 'any'ovies today are told through the 'usic 6hat I do like is when the 'usic "laysagainst the visuals, like if you have fast"aced i'ages and so'ething going on'usically which acts as a counter"oint, or so'ebody "laying a funny song in a sad

sceneIt sounds as if the singing inAt Lo%* Last Lo+e was recorded li!e"


16/25

*hat was a folly of 'ine It was an a'bitious but flawed fil' for which I can onlybla'e 'yself Ey favorite 'usicals are the 4ubitsch fil's of the late twenties andearly thirties I fell in love with those "ictures, and along with a book that .ybill gave'e, a collection of .ole $orter lyrics, they(re the ret see how you can 'ake a westernand not be influenced by John #ordCason I 'adeAt Long Last Love +ne of the things

that 'ade The Love $aradeand The "miling Lieutenantso e3citing was that youknew they were singing live *he orchestra was right offca'era *hey couldn(t 'i3sound in those days, so they had to record everything at the sa'e ti'e I re'e'ber0itchcock telling 'e he shot an insert of a radio and there was an orchestra "layingoffca'era because they didn(t have the ability to record it later and 'i3 it in 0e'ight have been e3aggerating, but for 'e it 'ade sense not to "ostsynch, because thei''ediacy of the whole thing would be lost I couldn(t stand the thought of recordingthe singing first and "laying it to the actors as they(re being fil'ed I wanted to 'akea 'usical where they were acting the songs and singing the' live Dverybody thoughtthis was cray, but I was riding high at the ti'eIt beca'e a huge "roble', because we couldn(t afford an orchestra on the set, so #o3

s"ent @uite a lot of 'oney to develo" a tiny s"eaker that fit into the actor(s ear *heyeach had an antenna co'bed into their hair that could "ick u" an electric signal sentfro' an electric "iano, so on the set the actors were hearing the 'usic &ctually, noneof the' were really singers, although that was the fun of it e'e'ber the scene with-urt eynolds and .ybill in the swi''ing "ool when she laughs so hard she can(tsing *hat(s )ust what I wanted *he "oint is that these "eo"le are su"erficial *heycan(t s"eak, which is why they(re always singing It(s not an &staireogers ho'age,it(s about "eo"le who aren(t singers and dancers but would like to be, )ust like 'e*hey can only e3"ress the'selves through songs written by so'eone else I oftensang to girls because I didn(t know how to "ut it into words of 'y own It soundscorny to say 5I love you, so why not sing instead OsingingP 5I(ve got a crush on you,sweetie"ie !o it was a rather "ersonal fil' for 'e, and the .ole $orter song that'ade 'e want to 'ake the 'ovie is the first scene I wrote but is one of the last scenesin the fil' OsingingP

Date post:	04-Jun-2018
Category:	Documents
Upload:	matt-jenkins
View:	217 times
Download:	0 times

Peter Bogdanovich July 28

Documents