9/5/2018 8:41 AM
. RHODE ISLAND SUPREME COURT' UNAUTHORIZED PRACTICE OF LAW COMMITTEE
IN RE: WILLIAM E. PAPLAUSKAS, JR. UPLC 2015-6
Appendix Vol. I
Table of Contents
Transcript, Vol. I (March 1, 2017)
Transcript, Vol. II (May 9, 2017)
Apgendix Vol. I
Table 0f Contents
Exhibit 1 Complaint (dated August 5, 2015).
. Exhibit 2 Notice of Complaint to Respondent (dated February 29, 2016)..
Exhibit 3 Response to Complaint (filed on March 15, 2016).
Exhibit 4 Notary Heid Harmless form.
Exhibit 5 Affidavit 0f Vincent Majewski.
Exhibit 6 Affidavit of Rebecca Majewski.
Exhibit 7 Subpoena from Committee to JPMorgan Chase Bank.
Exhibit 8 Subpbena from Committee to ServiceLink.
Exhibit 9 Records produced by JPMorgan Chase Bank in response to
subpoena.
- “A11 Terms Met.” Exhibit 9, pg.13.
- “Signature Verification Affidavit.” Exhibit 9, pg. 14.
.- “Signature Verification Page.” Exhibit 9, pg. 15.
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. - “Borrower’s Identification Statement.” Exhibit 9, pg. 16.
~ “Errors and Omissions/Compliance Agreement.” Exhibit 9, pg. 25.
- “Mortgage.” Exhibit 9, pg. 47-73.
Exhibit 10 Records produced by ServiceLink in response t0 subpoena.
- “Settlement Statement, HUD-l.” Exhibit 10, pg. 78-81.
- “Truth in Lending Disclosure.” Exhibit 10, pg. 86-87.
- “1m.” Exhibit 1 0, pg. 90~92.
- “Uniform Residential Loan Application.” Exhibit 10, pg. 93-96.
— “Request for Taxpayer Identification Number and Certification.”
Exhibit 1 0, pg. 99.
- “Request for Transcript ofTax Return.” Exhibit 1 0, pg. 104.
. — “Document Correction Ageement.” Exhibit 1 0, pg. 108.
- “Lock—In Ageemen .” Exhibit 10, pg. 109-1 10.
- “Acknowledgement of Receipt of Appraisal/Evaluation.” Exhibit
1 0, pg. 111.
- “Notice ofNonrefundabilitv of Loan Fees.” Exhibit 1 0, pg. 117.
- “Mortgage Commitment Letter.” Exhibit 10, pg. 118-120.
- “Initial Escrow Account Disclosure Statement.” Exhibit 1 0, pg.
125.
~ “Tax Infonnation Sheet.” Exhibit 10, pg. 126.
- “Settlement Agent Fee Sheet.” Exhibit 1 0, pg. 13 1.
Exhibit 11 General Laws 1956 § 19-9-6. (Lending institutions — Title attorneys.)
Exhibit 12 General Laws 1956 § 42-30-8. (Powers of notaries.)
_/
.iExhibit 13
Exhibit 14
Exhibit 15
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Standards of Conduct for Notaries Public in the State of Rhode
Island.
Federal Trade Commission/Department 0f Justice Letter re:
Proposed Bill H. 7462 (dated March 29, 2002).
Federal Trade Commission/Department 0f Justice Letter re:
Comments on the American Bar Association’s Proposed Model
Definition of the Practice of Law (dated December 20, 2002).
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/'
In The Matter Of:
Hearing
William E. Paplauskas, Jr.
March 1, 201 7
ALLIEDwgCOURT REPORTERS, INC.
and
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9/5/201 8 8:43 AM
STATE OF RHODE ISLAND AND PROVIDENCE PLANTATIONSSUPREME COURT
UNAUTHORIZED PRACTICE OF LAW COMMITTEE
PROCEEDINGS AT HEARINGIN RE:
WILLIAM E. PAPLAUSKAS, JR.
PLACE: STATE OF RHODE ISLAND SUPREME COURTBOURCIER CONFERENCE ROOM, 7TH FLOOR250 BENEFIT STREETPROVIDENCE, RI 02903
DATE: March 1, 2017TIME: 1:30 P.M.
fl
PRESENT:DEBRA A. SAUNDERS, ESQ., CHAIRWOMANJANET GILLIGAN, ESQ.CAROLYN BARONE, ESQ.MEGAN MACIASZ DISANTO, ESQ.VINCENT VESPIA, JR.DAVID J. STRACHMAN, ESQ.THOMAS M. BERGERON, ESQ.
FOR THE RESPONDENT .......... GREGORY P. PICCIRILLI, ESQ.
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I N D E X
WITNESS: William E. Paplauskas, Jr.
EXAMINATION:
By Mr. Bergeron ...................................By Ms. Gilligan ...................................By Ms. Barone .....................................By Ms. Maciasz DiSanto.................., .........Re-Examination by Ms. Barone ................. .....By Mr. Vespia ................................ .....By Mr. Strachman ..................................
E X H I B I T S
'NO. DESCRIPTION: UPLC'S
Exhibit 1. Complaint Letter from J. Pagliarini,Jr., Esq‘, dated 8/5/15 (3pp) ................
Exhibit 2. Letter from UPLC to W. Paplauskas,Jr., dated 2/29/16 (2pp) .....................
Exhibit 3. Letter from Attorney Piccirilli toUPLC dated 3/15/16 (5pp) .....................
Exhibit 2 marked as full ..........................
Exhibit 3 marked as full ..........................
Exhibit 4. Notary Held Harmless form dated7/21/15 (lpg) ................................
Exhibit 5. Affidavit of Vincent Majewski dated11/18/16 (2pp) ...............................
Exhibit 6. Affidavit of Rebecca Majewski dated11/18/16 (2pp) ...............................
Exhibit 7. Proof of Service of Subpoena servedon JPMorgan Chase Bank, N.A., dated 4/26/16(6pp) ........................................
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Exhibit 8. Proof of Service of Subpoena servedon ServiceLink Management Company, LLC,dated 4/28/16 (6pp) ...........................
Exhibit 9. Subpoenaed Documents of JPMorganChase Bank, N.A., with Cover Letter (87pp)....
Exhibit 10. Subpoenaed Documents of ServiceLinkNLS, LLC, with Cover Letter (196pp) ...........
(Exhibit page count includes two—sided copying, ifapplicable)
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. - March 1, 2017
(HEARING COMMENCED AT 1:30 P.M.)
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: So this is aa
meeting of the Unauthorized Practice of Law
Committee, and we're here today on a complaint that
was received by the committee. It's dated August 5,
2015, and it was submitted by Attorney John A.
Pagliarini, Junior.
And just to provide you with an
overview, this is an investigatory hearing. The
rules of evidence are relaxed. And our attorney -—
who I believe you have had communications with,
Attorney Piccirilli —— Tom Bergeron, sitting to my
right, he will present for the committee today. So
unless'you have any questions, we'll go ahead and
turn it over to Tom.
MR. PICCIRILLI: Okay.
MR. BERGERON: As Ms. Saunders said, my
name is Tom Bergeron. I serve as counsel to the
committee. Just a few preliminary things before we
get started: The function of the committee is to
investigate whether or not you have engaged in the
unauthorized practice of law, and to make a
recommendation to the Supreme Court according to
what the committee finds.
This is an investigation hearing, and
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. - March 1, 2017
the committee doesn't have the authority to impose a
penalty or sanction upon you. As the Chair said,
this particular complaint that we're hefe about was
filed by Attorney John Pagliarini, alleging that you
engaged in the unauthorized --
THE RESPONDENT: He\is not here?
MR. PICCIRILLI: Don't talk.
THE RESPONDENT: I'm sorry.
MR. BERGERON: The complaint is related
to the conducting of a real estate closing on July
21, 2015, in Tiverton. According to the committee's
rules, it's my function to present the complaint,
and for the committee to consider.
You have a right to consult with your
attorney at any time during the hearing. If you
need a break for any reason, simply notify your
attorney, and he will request the break. Again, due
to the investigational nature of the hearing, the
rules of evidence are slightly relaxed.
And your attorney has been provided
with a copy of the documents that are going to be
produced today. And your attorney does have the
right to object to any evidence, and the chairwoman
will make a ruling if necessary.
As you can see, the hearing is being
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. - March 1, 2017
recorded by a stenographer, and you're entitled to
receive a copy of the transcript at no charge to
you. That should resolve the preliminary issues,
unless Mr. Piccirilli has any questions at this
time.
MR. PICCIRILLI: Well, I have a number
of questions and a number of issues. I don't know
if now is the appropriate time to bring them up. If
you want me to, I will.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Sure.
MR. PICCIRILLI: Well, first of all,
and perhaps your attorney has brought this to your
attention, or not, I don't know, but the first issue
I have is whether or not this committee is subject
to the open meetings law.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: No, it is not.
MR. PICCIRILLI: Is there a definitive
ruling on that?
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Yes. The Open
Meetings and the Public Records Act apply to the
judiciary only in their administrative function.
This function is to determine whether or not -—
MR. PICCIRILLI: Is there a statute on
that?
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Sure. I'm
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drawing a blank. Is it 38(b)? I'm not sure.
MR. PICCIRILLI: I'll look it up. I
looked on the open meetings law, I didn't see any
exclusions under that statute.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: It only applies
to the judiciary in its administrative function.
This is a judicial function within the judiciary's
and the Supreme Court's exclusive jurisdiction of
the practice of law.
MR. PICCIRILLI: Okay. That was the
first question. The next qfiestion I have is, your
rules of procedure, which I'm assuming this
committee adopted ——
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: And the Supreme
Court.
MR. PICCIRILLI: -— and the governing
rules of the committee reference a complaint. My
understanding is a complaint is something issued by
this board, not by an individual. An individual can
make a report to this committee.
Under the powers and duties of the
committee under Rule 4, it says one of your powers
is to investigate all reports of activity which may
constitute the unauthorized practice of law, and to
hold hearings to determine whether the charges are
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — March 1, 2017
substantiated or unsubstantiated. And then under
your rules of procedure, there is a notice to the
respondent of a complaint -- the respondent is
supposed to be provided with a complaint.
The letter from Mr. Pagliarini is not a
complaint as envisioned by your rules. A complaint
should be produced by this committee setting forth
the allegations specifically as to what facts are at
issue, and what specific violations of law the
respondent is being accused of.
This letter from Mr. Pagliarini,
besides being intemperate, unprofessional,
containing rank hearsay, references one issue
revolving around 11-27-2, the giving or tendering to
another person for consideration, direct or
indirect, of any advice or counsel pertaining to a
law question or a court action or judicial
proceeding.
The only possible thought I can have is
the allegation by Mr. Pagliarini is that my client
was providing counsel pertaining to a law question,
because he certainly wasn't involved in a court
action or judicial proceeding. What specifically
“was the advice thatwmymclient_allegedlymgave‘tgua
law question? In fact, the affidavits which you
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. - March 1, 2017
have provided to me by both Vincent and Rebecca
Majewski spécifically said Mr. Paplauskas did not
provide any legal advice. It's curious. I don't
know who prepared these affidavits. They were
clearly prepared by someone with some legal
knowledge. They were notarized in Massachusetts. I
would like to know who prepared those for him.
MR. BERGERON: I prepared those.
MR. PICCIRILLI: That's interesting.
But, again, what is the complaint here? I'm used
to, and all the attorneys here are used to a process
where you get a document and a complaint, and it
sets forth, specifically, allegations that then we
can either refute, deny, admit, or otherwise answer.
How do I answer this? How do I answer
a letter from two years ago, from an attorney who is
not even here to substafitiate or even testify as to
his complaint? It's absurd. This is totally
inappropriate.
I don't know if this is how you guys
always have operated, but I must say, if this is how
you operate, I don't think it's permissible under
your own rules, certainly not under the Supreme
Court provision. I do not have a complaint before
me that my client can respond to.
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CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Mr. Piccirilli,
so it is customary practice, and in conformance with
our rules, that we receive complaints by letter, and
the process is as follows: We receive a complaint,
a screening panel is, I guess, appointed. The
complaint is screened by the panel for
determination, almost like a 12(b)(6), taking all
the allegations as true.
Do we feel as though there's probable
cause that the individual engaged in the practice of
law, and whether or not that practice was
authorized. So the basis, again, for this hearing,
it's an investigational hearing. And also pursuant
to those rules, your client was given a copy of the
complaint, which is the letter of Mr. Pagliarini.
He was asked to acknowledge receipt and
return it to us, which he did. I'm not sure of the
exact date of when that happened. And it pretty
much indicates the specifics of the complaint. And
also pursuant to our rules, we can, sua sponte,
investigate any concerns that we might have. So I
think, at this point, we can proceed.
MR. PICCIRILLI: Well, I'm not done.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Okay. Go on.
MR. PICCIRILLI: I am not done.
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CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Sure.
MR. PICCIRILLI: So I guess we're going
to take this August 5, 2015 letter as a complaint.
Again, I haven't gotten an answer to my question,
which is, if we are using this as the complaint,
what allegations are that my client gave advice for
consideration pertaining to a law question?
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Mr. Pagliarini,
we're here to determine ——
MR. PICCIRILLI: I'm not
Mr. Pagliarini.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: I'm sorry.
Mr. Piccirilli, we're here today to determine
whether or not your client's handling of the closing
or anything that may have happened at that closing
constitutes the practice of law, and if so, whether
or not it was authorized.
MR. PICCIRILLI: Okay. And what
statute requires, says that closings have to be
conducted by an attorney?
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: I'm not sure that
we have a statute, but it's ——
MR. PICCIRILLI: Oh, I know you don't.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: —— but it's the
Supreme Court, and the Supreme Court alone, that can
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determine what constitutes the practice of law. And
even if we look to what is customarily done by
lawyers, that's what we're here to decide, whether
or not what he did was, in fact, the practice of law
and something that should have been done by a
lawyer.
MR. PICCIRILLI: And, again, what is it
exactly that you claim he did that is customarily
performed by lawyers, even though it's not in any
statute?
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Handling a
closing, Mr. Piccirilli.
MR. PICCIRILLI: Handling a closing?
How do you define handling a closing?
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Mr. Piccirilli,
we're here to present an investigation. Do you have
anything further?
MR. PICCIRILLI: Apparently, you're
going to run this any way you want. Go ahead.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Tom?
MR. BERGERON: At the outset, I'd just
like to introduce a series of, essentially, the
primary filings that were done by the various
parties to this. So I'd like to mark these as
exhibits.
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EXHIBIT 1 (UPLC Exhibit marked for I.D.)
EXHIBIT 2 (UPLC Exhibit marked for I.D.)
EXHIBIT 3 (UPLC Exhibit marked for I.D.)
MR. BERGERON: These are the documents,
1, 2, and 3. And for the committee, these are the
top three documents in your packet. Exhibit 1 is
the complaint as filed by Attorney Pagliarini.
MR. PICCIRILLI: I object to it.
MR. BERGERON: I would ask that it come
in as the complaint pursuant to our rules.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: It can come in.
MR. PICCIRILLI: I'm going to object
because the person who prepared this complaint is
not here.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: It's just a
complaint, Mr. Piccirilli.
MR. PICCIRILLI: But it's not
authenticated by the person, he is not here. I have
a right to question him on it. You should have
subpoenaed him to be here.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: I'm going to
allow it in.
MR. BERGERON: Exhibit NUmber 2 is a
letter fram the committee to Mr. Paplauskas simply
notifying him of the complaint. I would ask that it
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come in.
MR. PICCIRILLI: No objection.
EXHIBIT 2 (UPLC Exhibit marked as full)
MR. BERGERON: Exhibit Number 3 is a
letter from Attorney Piccirilli to the committee and
a response to the complaint. This is a letter dated
March 15, 2016. I would ask that that come in as
the official written response of Mr. Paplauskas.
MR. PICCIRILLI: I don't have an
objection to it coming in as a document. I do
object to your characterization of it. It is not a
response to a complaint, because there is no
complaint in this case.
MR. BERGERON: Understood. I would
still move that it come in as full.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Sure. The first
sentence, Mr. Piccirilli, "Please consider this as
Mr. Paplauskas' response to the complaint....“
MR. PICCIRILLI: "Complaint letter."
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Yes.
EXHIBIT 3 (UPLC Exhibit marked as full)
MR. BERGERON: I'd like to ask to have
Mr. Paplauskas sworn in as a witness.
MR. PICCIRILLI: I'm not going to allow
that.
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CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Okay.
MR. BERGERON: Are you asserting his
right not to —— what basis are you —-
MR. PICCIRILLI: Well, first of all,
you didn't subpoena him here. You sent a
threatening letter saying that you have the
authority to order him here without a subpoena.
You know, it's been a while since I
read the Magna Carta, but I think 800 years of
Anglo—American jurisprudence prohibits anybody from
compelling someone to attend a public hearing like
this without some type of due process.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Mr. Piccirilli,
he was noticed. This is simply an investigational
hearing --
MR. PICCIRILLI: Then you don't need to
swear him in right now. Put your case on. You're
not going to make it through my guy.
MR. BERGERON: I will just assert one
more time, I'm asking that he testify -—
MR. PICCIRILLI: Go get a subpoena in
Superior Court ordering him to do that.
MR. BERGERON: Mr. Paplauskas, what is
your date of birth?
MR. PICCIRILLI: He's not answering any
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of your questions at this time.
MR. BERGERON: Okay. The next document
I would like to come in —— I will have you mark some
more exhibits, please.
EXHIBIT 4 (UPLC Exhibit marked for I.D.)
EXHIBIT 5 (UPLC Exhibit marked for I.D.)
EXHIBIT 6 (UPLC Exhibit marked for I.D.)
MR. PICCIRILLI: Off the record, if
it's okay with you?
(OFF THE RECORD)
MR. BERGERON: These are the next three
documents in your packet. First, which has beenA
marked as Exhibit 4, this document titled "Notary
Held Harmless Agreement," or excuse me, simply
"Notary Held Harmless."
This was received as part of
Mr. Paplauskas's response, as well as in documents
provided which will be introduced later, produced by
JPMorgan Chase Bank, and also ServiceLink. So I
would ask that this come in.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Okay.
MR. BERGERON: The next two documents,
marked Exhibit 5 and Exhibit 6, these are
affidavits. The first, Exhibit 5, is the affidavit
of Vincent Majewski, and Exhibit 6 is the affidavit
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of Rebecca Majewski. Just for the committee's
information, Mr. and Mrs. Majewski are husband and
wife, and they were the buyers in the subject
closing which we're here to discuss.
I made several requests for the
Majewskis to appear today to testify; however, due
to their location out of state, they advised me that
they would be unavailable. In an effort to fill out
the record, and for some input by the Majewskis, I
requested that they review these affidavits, which
they signed and had notarized verifying various
facts that are before the committee right now.
MR. PICCIRILLI: As I mentioned, or
questioned, so it appears, Mr. Bergeron, that you
actually prepared these documents and sent them to
these individuals to sign?
MR. BERGERON: Indeed, I did.
MR. PICCIRILLI: And how did you know
what to write?
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: He is not, he
isn't testifying.
MR. BERGERON: I'm not testifying at
this point.
MR. PICCIRILLI: Okay.
MR. BERGERON: First, I would ask that
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both these affidavits come into the record.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Do you want to
just move them all at the end, and if you have a
specific objection, you can raise it once ——
MR. PICCIRILLI: I think I'm just going
to have a general objection to all of them.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Sure. Just go
through them.
MR. BERGERON: I'd ask that they come
in. And just for the record, and for the
committee's information, I will just read the
affidavit of Vincent Majewski.
Mr. Majewski's affidavit reads, "I,
Vincent Majewski, after being duly sworn, upon oath,
depose.and say as follows: 1, that I am the owner
of real estate property located at 528 Nanaquaket
Road, Tiverton, Rhode Island 02878, Tiverton Tax
Assessor's Plat 403, Lot 167.
"2, that I own said real estate
property jointly with my wife, Rebecca Majewski; 3,
that on July 21, 2015, a real estate closing was
conducted at the law office of John A. Pagliarini,
Jr., in Tiverton, Rhode Island, for the purpose of
executing documents necessary to secure my ownership
of said real estate property located at 528
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Nanaquaket Road, Tiverton, Rhode Island; 4, that
William E. Paplauskas, Jr., a notary public,
appeared at said real estate closing on July 21,
2015, in possession of real estate closing documents
intended to secure my ownership in said real estate
property.
"5, that at the beginning of said real
estate closing, William E. Paplauskas presented me
with a document titled 'Notary Held Harmless,‘ which
indicated that he was acting only as a notary
public, that he was not an attorney, and that he was
not authorized to discuss any aspects of the real
estate closing documents, and that I signed said
Notary Held Harmless form at the.time it was
presented to me.
"6, that during said real estate
closing, I signed or initialed each real estate
closing document presented to me by William E.
Paplauskas, Jr., and where necessary, my signatures
were witnessed and attested to by William E.
Paplauskas, Jr., in his capacity as a notary
public." Signed, Vincent Majewski.
EXHIBIT 7 (UPLC Exhibit marked for I.D.)
EXHIBIT 8 (UPLC Exhibit marked for I.D.)
EXHIBIT 9 (UPLC Exhibit marked for I.D.)
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MR. BERGERON: Marked as Exhibit 7, I
have a proof of service received by this office from
the sheriff's department. It's a return of service
for a subpoena for documents from JPMorgan Chase
Bank. The documents themselves are forthcoming, but
this is the proof of service.
Exhibit 8 is, similarly, the same type
of proof of service for a subpoena of documents,
except this is for ServiceLink Corporation. I'm
putting both of those into the record. Exhibit 9,
what I have marked as Exhibit 9, on the top, it's
the letterhead for JPMorgan Chase.
These are the subpoenaed documents as
pertaining to the relevant closing as received by
this office from JPMorgan Chase Bank. Because of
the volume of these, I would just like to highlight
a few documents for the committee's attention, just
so they have an understanding of what we have.
I would first note that all the
redactions in the documents were done by JPMorgan
Chase before returning them to me, and I have added
the Bates-stamping at the bottom for ease of
reference. So I draw the committee's attention to
page 13. And I'm doing this just because there's
several variations of the documents, so I'd like to
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go through just so the committee can see what
documents are in existence. Page 13 is a document
titled "A11 Terms Met." I won't go through the
document, but I would just note the signatures of
Vincent and Rebecca Majewski, as well as the
notarization by Mr. Paplauskas.
Page 14 is a signature certification
affidavit for Vincent Majewski. I see
Mr. Majewski's signature, as well as
Mr. Paplauskas's notarization at the bottom. Page
15 is the same type of signature certification, this
time for Rebecca Majewski.
At the bottom, you will see
Ms. Majewski's signature, as well as,
Mr. Paplauskas's notarization. Page 16 is titled
"Borrowers Identification Statement." Again, I
won't go through the details of the document, but
you will see the signatures of Mr. Majewski and
Mrs. Majewski, as well as the notarization by
Mr. Paplauskas.
Turning to page 25, this document is
titled “Error and Omissions," slash, "Compliance
Agreement." For the committee, I would note the
signatures of Mr. and Mrs. Majewski, as well as the
notarization by Mr. Paplauskas. Turning to page 47,
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this document is titled "Mortgage," and runs from
page 47 to 63. Turning to page 62 of that document,
of that same mortgage document, I would note the
signatures of Mr. and Mrs. Majewski, and turning to
page 63, a notarization of those signatures by
Mr. Paplauskas. That's all for that package coming
into the record.
EXHIBIT 10 (UPLC Exhibit marked for I.D.)
MR. BERGERON: The final document_that
I have has been marked as Exhibit 10. It should be
the final large packet of documents in everybody's
package. The front cover is a letterhead from
ServiceLink. And these are documents received by
this office in response to its subpoena of documents
to ServiceLink.
And these are what we were provided in
response. Again, there are a few documents that I'd
like to go through for the committee's reference.
Turning to page 78, this is a document titled
"Settlement Statement, HUD-l." This document spans
from page 78 to 81 of the package.
For the committee's reference, I would
note the initials VM and RM at the bottom of each
consecutive page, and on page 81, the final page of
the document, the signatures of Mr. and
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Mrs. Majewski. Turning to page 86, this document is
titled "Truth-in—Lending Disclosure Statement."
’This is just a two—page document. On the front
page, I would note the initials VM and RM, and on
page 87, I'd note the signatures of Mr. and
Mrs. Majewski.
Turning to page 90, this document is
titled "Note," and spans to page 92. 0n page 92, I
draw the committee's attention to the signature of
Vincent Majewski. Page 93, this is a document
titled "Uniform Residential Loan Application." This
is a four-page document, but on page 95, I would
draw the committee's attention to the signature of
Mr. Majewski, and, also, on page 96, the signature
of Vincent Majewski.
Turning to page 99, this document is
titled "Request for Taxpayer Identification Number
and Certification." Right”there on page 99, I draw
the committee's attention to the signature of
Mr. Majewski. Turning to page 104, this document is
titled "Request for Transcript of Tax Return."
At the bottom of that page, I'd note
the signature of Vincent Majewski. Turning to page
108, this document is titled "Document Correction
Agreement." At the bottom of that page, I draw the
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committee's attention to the signature of Vincent
Majewski. Turning the page to 109, this document is
titled "Lock-In Agreement," and the signature line
for that document is on page 110, and I would note
the signature of Vincent Majewski.
Page 117, this document is titled
"Notice of Nonrefundability of Loan Fees." At the
bottom of the page, or I should say, the middle of
the page, is the signature of Mr. Majewski. .Page
118, this document is titled "Mortgage Commitment
Letter." 0n page 120 is the signature line, which I
would note is signed by Mr. majewski.
Turning to page 125, this document is
titled "Initial Escrow Account Disclosure
Statement." I would note at the bottom, for the
committee, the initials VM. Page 126, the document
is titled "Tax Information Sheet." At the bottom of
the document are the initials VM.
Turning to page 131, this document is
titled "Settlement Agent Fee Sheet." And I draw the
committee's attention to the middle of the document,
simply noting there is a line in the box that's
titled "Title Charges," second line says
"Settlement," slash, "Closing Fee."
Turning to page 135, the document is
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titled "Residential First.Mortgage Closing
Instructions." Turning to page 150, there's no
title on this document, but the first line says,
"Updated Shipping Instructions." At the bottom, I
would note the signature of Mr. Paplauskas. Page
152, this document is titled "Warranty Deed."
And that's all I have to point out for
the committee in those documents. And I'd ask that
that be taken into the record. If Mr. Paplauskas is
not going to be subject to answer any more
questions, then I would simply say that I have no
further exhibits to introduce, and I would turn the
floor to Mr. Piccirilli to make any statements or
further summation that he would like to.
MR. PICCIRILLI: This is it? You have
no witnesses, no other evidence to present?
MR . BERGERON: NO .
MR. PICCIRILLI: You close your case?
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Mr. Piccirilli,
Member Barone, Carolyn Barone, suggested, too, that
I remind you that, according to our rules, the rules
of procedure, Subsection K on page 3 indicates that
"The respondent shall attend the hearing without the
necessity of a subpoena being served upon him or
her. He or she shall take the witness stand and
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shall testify in the same manner as if under
subpoena." Just want to -—
MR. PICCIRILLI: I don't find that to
be a constitutional rule.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: I'm just bringing
it to your attention.
MR. PICCIRILLI: You cannot compel
someone to attend a hearing without a subpoena or
some summons or some other legal process. I mean,
we're all lawyers here, most of us, except Chief
Vespia ~—
MR. VESPIA: That doesn't make me a bad
MR. PICCIRILLI: —- who actually
probably knows more about law than a lot of us
sitting around here. My dad used to do a lot of
work for Mr. Vespia. But we all know that if you
get served with a complaint in court, if you get
served with a complaint in any proceeding, there is
a summons, there is a subpoena to compel your
attendance.
Now, it doesn't mean you —- you can
invite my client to come, you can tell him if he
doesn't come, there are consequences that may flow
from that. But to compel someone to attend a
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hearing without some form of legal process, I find
that fundamentally violative of what due process is
all about. I mean, don't any of you lawyers agree
with me?
MR. STRACHMAN: Due process is about
notice; you received notice. Due process is about
an opportunity to be heard; you filed a response to
the complaint. Due process is about the ability to
make your case; you were able to make your case, you
were invited to respond.
Due process is about not the formality
of service of process. Didn't the Supreme Court
approve these rules?
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: The Supreme Court
has approved these rules.
MR. STRACHMAN: So these are our law.
This is the same as the law of subpoenas and the
chapter in Title 10 that says "Subpoenas." These
are all laws. So I just want to be clear, you're
not saying anybody is pulling a fast one on you, or
you're going to reschedule this at your convenience
or your client's convenience, or you didn't know
what was going on today, or you didn't have an
opportunity to look at any of these records ——
MR. PICCIRILLI: That's correct.
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MR. STRACHMAN: I mean, the citation to
the Magna Carta, I think, is interesting, but I
mean, this isn't high school, this is a proceeding.
We have the right to proceed as the Supreme Court
said to proceed.
MR. PICCIRILLI: If I can just clarify
something? Because I don't have access to whether
or not -- maybe there is an administrative rule
somewhere, maybe you can provide.it to me. I
understand there is a statute. I understand there‘s
governing rules which the Supreme Court adopted, but
then there's rules of procedure.
I thought this board adopted the rules
of procedure. I didn't think the Supreme Court
approved the rules of procedure.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: The Supreme Court
has approved them.
MR. PICCIRILLI: They have specifically
approved them?
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Yes.
MR. STRACHMAN: Isn't this body an arm
of the Supreme Court, an administrative arm of the
Supreme Court?
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: It is.
MR. STRACHMAN: It's not a bar
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. - March 1, 2017
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association. It's not a statutory function. It's a
function of the Supreme Court, who said implement
this.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Which is a
licensing authority and has exclusive jurisdiction
over the practice of law in Rhode Island.
MR. PICCIRILLI: Again, and I take
Member Strachman's point about the notice, but
there's two different things between notice and
compelling him to answer questions. Those are two
fundamentally different things.
And so I don't necessarily agree that,
even though we have notice to this whole hearing ~-
and I'm not disputing that at all, and quite
frankly, even if there was a requirement to have a
subpoena, I'm sure I would have agreed with
Mr. Bergeron to have my client attend voluntarily.
I would never not do that. I just, I
read that rule, and I find it not appropriate. And
I think that, I would hope that this committee and
maybe the Supreme Court will revisit exactly what
role they think they have to compel someone.
I would be curious if the Supreme Court
thought that they would have the power to send a
letter to someone, the chief judge of the Supreme
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — March 1, 2017
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Court send a letter to someone saying, "You must
attend." And if the person didn't attend, what?
Are you going to put him in jail? What are you
going to do? What is the penalty for not attending?
MR. STRACHMAN: If he's not here to
present evidence, I don't think you can present
evidence for him. He has a right to invoke certain
privileges. Maybe he has another privilege that
says he can't testify or shouldn't testify. But we
have the right to proceed. The Supreme Court told
us to.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: It's an
investigation.
MR. PICCIRILLI: You're proceeding,
but, again, Mr. Bergeron is trying to compel
Mr. Paplauskas to testify. And, again, I think
those are two separate things. The case has rested.
I have a right to respond. Before I respond, I
think the case, as presented, fails on the facts.
You have no direct evidence that my
client did anything that would even come close to
being the practice of law. Forget about, clearly,
he didn't do anything to violate 11—27-2, which is
the statute that delineatee what the unauthorized
practice of law is. I'm mindful of what the Supreme
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Court said in the Little Compton case that says that
the Supreme Court is the ultimate authority to
determine what that is, and it may exceed or go
beyond what the statute says. Or, as in that case,
the court said, Even though the statute says that,
we're going to find by common practice that union
representatives can do certain things that are
otherwise customarily performed by lawyers.
But if it's not 11-27—2, and if it's a
common practice, where is your expert witness?
Where is your witness to testify that says only
lawyers have historically conducted closings in
Rhode Island? Where is your witness to say that?
You're just assuming that.
Mr. Pagliarini can't be the person that
says that, because he wrote it in his letter. His
letter contains blatant falsehoods, by the way. And
you know what? Mr. Paplauskas, I will have him
testify if you deny my motion, because he will
refute specifically the false allegations.
Which, quite frankly, I think
Mr. Pagliarini should be brought up before the
disciplinary council for his explicit falsehoods to
this committee. He knew they were false when he
wrote them. He is the one that should be
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investigated, quite frankly. And I'm going to ask
that this board issue a subpoena to compel him to
testify. I want another hearing date, and I want
him here. I want to cross—examine him under oath as
to some of these blatant falsehoods that he put in
his letter.
MS. BARONE: You can do that.
MR. BICCIRILLI: And I Will. Thank
you.
MS. BARONE: You had that right to do
that today. You had a right for discovery.
\
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: You had a chance,
and I don't recall receiving a request before today.
MR. PICCIRILLI: Because I didn't know
how this hearing was going to proceed. And quite
frankly, I'm going to renew my request that this
complaint be dismissed right now, because you have
presented zero evidence as to what the custom and
practice is of conducting closings in this state.
I think all of us around here know that
we've gone to a bank to refinance a mortgage, and
there's no attorney, there's a bank manager that
conducts the refinance of your line of credit.
That's done all the time. We all know that two
people who want to sell property to each other can
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. - March 1, 2017
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do that without an attorney. It might not be a
smart thing to d6. But if I own property, I can
prepare my own deed, have it notarized, and hand it
over to a buyer. There are a bunch of closing
documents which relate to a federally governed
statute. The federal law governs those closing
documents.
No state law in Rhode Island governs
that. Zero state law in Rhode Island governs the
mortgage documents, except the actual mortgage
itself. And you have uncontradicted evidence, an
affidavit from the two buyers, saying that
Mr. Paplauskas never provided any type of advice as
to what, legal advice as to those documents.
So why are we here? I know why we're
here. There are a lot of members of the bar, myself
included, that do real estate closings, and we don't
want the competition. Business is bad, we all know
that. That's really what this is all about in every
other state, you know that.
You know Massachusetts went through,
there's a Supreme Court case in Massachusetts
distinguishing between certain types of closings and
other types of closings, and how those closings may
or may not be conducted. I'm going to have
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — March 1, 2017
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Mr. Paplauskas, if you don't grant my motion, he
will testify that, in Massachusetts, an attorney
doesn't go to a closing, even a sale, but if
somebody wants an attorney, you call them up on the
phone, "Do you need any legal advice, yes or no?"
And then they hang up.
So there's no evidence to suggest that
the buyers here were prohibited from hiring an
attorney, were encouraged not to hire an attorney,
none of that. There's no evidence of any of that.
So what is the custom and practice specifically that
you're accusing my client of performing, and how is
that the unauthorized practice of law?
I think that's a fair question. And
you have dragged him here, made him pay his own
legal fees, when you could have done this without
dragging him here. You could have had ServiceLink
come here. You could have had some big, you know,
all these companies who are really making the big
bucks off of these closings by not hiring attorneys.
You could have dragged them in here and
subjected them to these questions. Isn't it more
appropriate to ask ServiceLink, do they have any
Rhode Island attorneys that review the title or do
any of that? Wouldn't you ask ServiceLink that?
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — March 1, 2017
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Why are you asking him? It's so unfair. You drag
this man here on this, I mean, offensive letter,
absolutely outrageously offensive letter, by some
guy who is a state legislator and thinks he can boss
you people around. That's offensive. It's
outrageous.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Mr. Piccirilli,
are you making a motion, or are you --
MR. PICCIRILLI: I'm moving right now
to ask this board to end this farce right now, let
my client get out of here. And if you want to
proceed as to how closings, what aspects of closings
should be conducted by an attorney or not, you can
do that without dragging my client through this.
You can do that by getting industry
people in here. You can get closing attorneys, you
can get mortgage people. You can do it in a more
appropriate manner than beating up on my poor little
guy.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Mr. Piccirilli,
we are here investigating a complaint. It's our
job, after the conclusion of this hearing, to
compile a report, a recommendation, and provide it
to the Supreme Court. And that is the stage of the
proceeding that we're at. So we're here for the
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hearing. I remind you of the rule that indicates
that the respondent shall appear and shall testify.
You have indicated that your client is not
testifying -—
MR. PICCIRILLI: No, I didn't. I just
indicated that if’you deny my motion, I will have
him testify. But are you directing this committee
not to respond to my motion?
MR. BERGERON: Well, I think we would
take your motion into consideration.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: We can ~-
MR. PICCIRILLI: You're doing that, or
the board is doing that —— or the committee is doing
that?
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: I'm here as
chair, and I'm handling the conducting of these
proceedings. There is really no motion practice
before this committee. We're here investigating a
complaint. We received a complaint, I will go over
it again.
We formed a three-person screening
panel that reviewed the allegations and found that,
taken as true, there is probable cause that the
unauthorized practice of law was committed by the
handling of this closing by Mr. Paplauskas. Under
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our rules, we then noticed the hearing, and that's
why we are here today. Mr. Bergeron has now rested,
presented the materials in support of the
investigation. ‘Do you have anything that you would
like to eay at this point? Does any member of the
committee have any questions for Tom?
MR. VESPIA: We've rested. Does that
mean, I assume it means that no further questions
can be posed?
MR. STRACHMAN: I'm sorry to interrupt,
but it's like we're half pregnant here. Is he
testifying or not testifying? Supreme Court said he
is here to testify. You have the right to instruct
him not to testify if you feel that there's a
privilege or some statutory violation.
But we all want to hear what he has to
say. I think we've been waiting for months to hear
what he has to say. I think he would help clarify a
few things. I don't think this is as adversarial as
you necessarily think it is. And we'd like to hear
from the gentleman and move on.
So could we get a ruling as to whether
we're going forward with him or not? Because I
think we have a series of questions to ask him that
would help elucidate this situation.
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MR. PICCIRILLI: Just so I'm clear for
the record, and again, I'm surprised that you don't
have a motion practice, but if you don't, then I
guess you don't. If that's what the board —-
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Well, you can
make any motion, and I can say that we can vote.
MR. PICCIRILLI: Well, I just did.
That's what my whole argument has been for the last
15 minutes. I'm moving to dismiss this complaint.
The only complaint you have is this letter from
August 5, 2015. The complainant is not here to
testify about it. You have presented no evidence in
support of this complaint at a11.
You haven't presented any evidence to
suggest that if it's not a violation of state law,
it's a violation of some common practice. You
haven't presented any testimony by any experts, by
anybody who would be able to testify.
I wasn't involved in the Little Compton
case, but my guess was that when that case was
before you, there was testimony, extensive testimony
by union representatives on either side saying this
has been the common practice since the 19305.
And the Supreme Court was obviously
very impressed by that argument. So where are those
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. - March 1, 2017
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people that testified that absolutely under no
circumstances has this ever happened in Rhode
Island; absolutely, this is a common law and
practice in Rhode Island; absolutely, every single
real estate closing, whether it's a sale, a
mortgage, a line of credit?
You know, we're going to tell every
single bank in this state that your bank manager can
no longer have somebody sign a line of credit,
because that is the practice of law. Where is that
person to testify? Because, otherwise, you're just
flying blind, aren't you?
And you want to make your case out of
my guy? It doesn't make any sense. It doesn't make
any sense how you're proceeding here.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: We're going to
move this along. We will reserve decision on your
motion. Would you like to proceed?
MR. PICCIRILLI: So you, as chair, get
to decide that? I'm assuming you're the chair?
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Why don't we take
a break, and we can chat amongst ourselves.
MS. BARONE: We will go into executive
session on the motion.
MR. PICCIRILLI: Thank you.
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — March l, 2017
(Committee in Executive Session, 2:26 p.m. to 2:55 p.m.)
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Mr. Piccirilli,
we discussed your motion. Your motion is denied.
We would now ask if you would, in fact, like
Mr. Paplauskas, your client, to testify. If so, we
would reopen our case to give Mr. Bergeron the
opportunity to ask him some questions and allow you
the opportunity to do the same. How would you like
to proceed?
MR. PICCIRILLI: Would it be
appropriate, since it's my case now, that I call my
client first, and then be subject to
cross-examination? That's my practice. You know,
your case rested, I made a motion ~—
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Our case rested
based upon your refusal to allow your client to
testify.
MR. PICCIRILLI: Okay. You know what,
I'm just going to put on the record that I don't
believe the procedures that you're following are
appropriate. And I hope, at some point, when the
court reviews this record, if they do, that they
will address what I think are serious deficiencies
in the manner in which this committee operates. If
you want to reopen -— do whatever you want. my
40
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. - March 1, 2017
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client will answer any questions that you have.
MR. BERGERON: Okay.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Would you swear
in the witness.
(WITNESS SWORN)
THE WITNESS: William E. Paplauskas,
Jr., P-A—P-L—A-U—S-K—A-S.
MR. BERGERON: Mr. Paplauskas --
THE WITNESS: Before I answer any
questions, I want to say one thing.
MR. BERGERON: Sure.
THE WITNESS: Thank you, Mr. Vespia,
for your honorable service to the State of Rhode
Island.
MR. VESPIA: Thank you very much. Very
nice of you to say that.
EXAMINATION BY MR. BERGERON
Mr. Paplauskas, what is your date of birth?
A. 12/3/1947.
And what is your current occupation?
A. I'm a notary public, mortgage closer.
I just want to ask you a little bit about your
professional history and your educational history.
Did you go to high school?
A. I'm a high school graduate from Central High
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. - March l, 2017
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School. I've been in the mortgage business since
1969.
Did you go to any school or training after high
school?
A. Hard knocks.
Excellent. Did you ever go to law school?
A. No.
Have you ever been admitted to practice law in any
state?
A. No.
And you said you're a notary public. How long have
you been functioning as a notary?
A. Off and on since 1969.
And have you done that as your primary occupation?
A. Yes. The last ten years.
I'm sorry. Can you repeat how long?
A. Full time for ten years.
And just generally about that process, how does that
work, do people contact you to come notarize
documents?
A. No. I get referrals from title companies and
other signing agencies.
So is your business almost exclusive to corporate
clients, as opposed to individuals?
A. That's correct.
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — March 1, 2017
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And are you paid in that job, do you get paid?
A. Yes.
And how do you get paid? Do you get paid -—
A. By the closer.
Okay. And how much do you charge for your services?
A. It varies depending on what type of closing I'm
doing. It could be anywhere from $75 to $125.
Are you, in any instances, are you paid a salary by
any of these companies?
A. No. I am not an employee. I'm an impartial
witness.
And do you act as —- you're employed by yourself,
you don't work for a notary agency?
A. No.
So you're a freelance notary?
A. That's correct. I don't kill it, I don't eat
it.
Okay. And it sounds like you have experience in
real estate closings as a notary?
A. Since 1969.
And you've been doing real estate closings since
then?
A. Yes.
Can you estimate how many per year you have; how
often do you do these?
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. - March 1, 2017
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A. How many per year since 1969?
How about in the last five years, how many --
A. Probably aboutllo to 20 thousand.
Per year?
A. No. Total.
How many did you do last year?
A. I average probably about 75 a month. Are you
asking me this question because Mr. Pagliarini, back
in 2002, the attorneys tried to put through an act
where only attorneys would do closings -—
Mr. Paplauskas --
A. I have a question about that. Because it seems
like what Mr. Pagliarini is trying to do -— who
never attended that closing, by the way. So that
letter that he writes as a person that was involved
with the closing, he was never in the room.
The attorney that was in the roam never filed a
complaint. I find it interesting that I have
somebody that has no firsthand knowledge of what
happened in that room, but yet, he is saying that I
violated law.
He hasn't pointed out what part of that closing
I violated the law in, but yet, he is, I think it's
a back-door attempt to get the Supreme Court to
rule, to make law from the bench, where they
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. - March 1, 2017
45
wouldn't do it before, under —-
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Excuse me,
Mr. Paplauskas. Mr. Bergeron is just asking you
questions. This is an investigative hearing —-
THE WITNESS: I understand. I want you
to know where this is coming from. He wasn't in the
room. How can he possibly accuse me of this?
We understand that. And at this stage, I'm just
simply trying to give the committee a fuller
understanding of both your practice in general, and
we'll get into the specifics. And your attorney has
communicated that, you know, that point to the
committee. You're welcome to make it yourself, but
perhaps we can move along with the questioning?
A. I'm answering your questions. I just find it
interesting, my accuser is not here, yet I had to
take time from my day to be here. He didn't take
any time from his day to be here. All he did was
file a false accusation against me, and then you
guys are going to handle it. So he makes the
accusation, you shoot me. Who buries me?
Can I continue with my questioning?
A. Yes.
MR. STRACHMAN: Are you an NRA member?
So I was just trying to give the committee an
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. - March 1, 2017
46
understanding into your experience. Did you say
that you do an average of 75 closings a month?
A. About 75 a month.
Okay. And are all of these closings in the State of
Rhode Island?
A. Yes.
Do you operate as a notary in any other State?
A. I did at one time. Massachusetts.
When did you operate as a notary in Massachusetts?
A. May have been five or six years ago. It wasn't
worth it.
And when you say you were operating as a notary in
Massachusetts, was that exclusively for real estate
closings?
A. Yes.
And when did you stop doing that?
A. Three or four years ago. Just wasn't
worthwhile. They wanted me to go too far for too
little money. But I still handled Massachusetts
closings for people that live in Rhode Island, or
here vacationing in Rhode Island, and they are
remortgaging Massachusetts property. And that comes
under Massachusetts law, where we have to work with
an attorney.
So you're saying that you still, even though you're
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. - March 1, 2017
47
operating in Rhode Island right now, you still
perform real estate closings on Massachusetts
property?
A. Because the people are here in Rhode Island,
either vacationing or they live in Rhode Island, but
they own investment property in.Massachusetts that
they're remortgaging.
And when you say you do these Massachusetts closings
in Rhode Island because the people are in Rhode
Islandy that means the owners of the property that
is in Massachusetts?
A. Yes. They could be living in Rhode Island, they
could be going to the Naval War College. There are
a variety of reasons why they're in Rhode Island.
Okay. I want to turn your attention to the specific
closing that was in the complaint, which the
complaint suggests is on July 21, 2015. Do you
recall that particular closing?
A. I recall it. I was late.
That wasn't in the complaint. You didn't have to ——
A. I understand that, but I was.
MR. VESPIA: Did you bring a note?
THE WITNESS: I did.
We appreciate your candor. Thank you. Where did
that closing take place?
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — March 1, 2017
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A. At Mr. Pagliarini's office.
And what was your role in that closing?
A. I was bringing the closing documents, and I was
going to perform a closing.
And who contacted you to go --
A. ServiceLink.
And who is ServiceLink?
A. A young lady by the name of —- somebody from
their scheduling department. I can't tell you who
it was in the scheduling department, but my contact
there, once we got past the scheduling department,
was a Janet Tanner.
And more generally, what is ServiceLink, what kind
of services do they provide, do you know?
A. Title. They're part of Fidelity National. They
do title searches, closings, appraisals. They're a
conglomerate.
They're not the lending —- are they the lending
institution in this instance?
A. No.
Have you worked with ServiceLink before; before this
closing, had you worked with them?
A. Oh, yes. About 10 or 11 years. I was aware of
them.
So prior to this closing,‘you did numerous closings
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. - March 1, 2017
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through -—
A. I've been in the mortgage business doing
closings, so I'm well aware of who the players are
that do title searches and appraisal work, and
lenders that you want to deal with and who you don't
want to deal with.
So when I decided to do this, I started to make
contacts, I marketed myself, which is what
Mr. Pagliarini should be doing.
Got you. Before this closing, had you performed
closings which had been referred to you by
ServiceLink?
A. Yes.
When were you hired to go to this closing, how far
in advance, generally, would you say?
A. Sometime before July 21. A few days before,
maybe. Maybe even a week before. Generally, not a
big window.
And what were ServiceLink's instructions to you as
part of -—
A. They gave me the name of the buyer and the
seller, and they gave me my contact, which happened
to be Mr. Pagliarini's partner, Hailey Conn.
And did ServiceLink provide you with all of the
documents that you were to bring to the closing?
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. - March 1, 2017
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A. Yes. They e—mailed it to me.
And how did they provide those to you, did they
e-mail them —-
A. E-mail.
They e—mail you the documents?
A. Yes.
And you then print them out?
A. Yes. Make one set for the closing, and one set
for the buyer. Andithen, because it's a purchase,
there was some documents that I made for the seller.
So you bring multiple copies of the ——
A. Depending on the type of closing, correct.
Are these the same documents that you would have
brought, when you print these out, are these the
same documents that you then bring to the closing?
A. Yes and no. In this particular closing, there
are seller documents and documents to a purchase
transaction, which is different than a refi
transaction or a home equity line of credit. So it
varies depending on the type of transaction it is.
But rather than the HUD, now it's the closing
disclosure, and there are variations of those
documents.
Were you told in this instance who the lending
institution was?
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — March l, 2017
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A. No.
You wouldn't have been told ~—
A. Doesn't matter.
It doesn't matter to you?
A. No.
So you don't have —- in this instance, I believe the
documents show that it was JPMorgan. Did you have
contact with the bank directly, or is all of your
contact with ~-
A. No. My contact is with ServiceLink and Hailey
Conn. Now, ServiceLink had contact with
Pagliarini's office long before me. And they were
well aware that the closing was going to be done by
a notary, and not by an attorney.
The borrower was the one that was kept in the
dark, the buyer, borrower. That should have been
discussed. Because in Rhode Island, you have the
right to choose your attorney to do the title
search. And usually if you do the title search, you
\ do the closing.
That should have been told to them by the
realtor. For just common sense, this is the largest
transaction in most people's lives. You don't get
an attorney? You don't at least talk to an
attorney, take the purchase and sales to one to
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. - March 1, 2017
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protect yourself?
So in this scenario, did you envision yourself as
working on behalf of ServiceLink, as opposed -—
A. No. I envision myself as an impartial witness.
I'm not representing ServiceLink, nor am I
representing the buyer or the seller. I mean, I'm
there to make sure that the person signs the
documents, has some understanding of what he is
doing, and is the person that's in front of me.
Okay. Did you get paid for this closing?
A. I did.
Do you recall how much you got paid?
A. Why do you want to know? What difference does
it make? I'm just asking, why do you want to know?
MR. PICCIRILLI: It could be considered
proprietary information.
A. Yes. I mean, you're asking me how much I get
paid. Want to compare what you're getting? What do
you get paid for a closing?
I'm not here to testify, Mr. Paplauskas. The
question is --
MR. PICCIRILLI: I think my client is
indicating a reluctance to disclose what might be
propriety information. I don't know if, legally, I
can tell him not to answer that question, but I
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would ask this board's consideration. Do you really
need to know that information?
MR. VESPIA: At this point, it probably
wasn't enough.
MR. PICCIRILLI: Clearly not.
A. It definitely wasn't, because I'm getting
involved here. I mean, I have lost a whole day now.
What's worse is it's taking time away from my
granddaughter.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Go ahead.
Is there an answer? Are you not going to answer the
question?
A. No. I don't see any reason to tell you.~ I have
told you what I'm getting is a range of fees. What
does it matter what I get for a closing? Maybe I
did this one for free. I don't think so, but...
MS. BARONE: Did you do this one for
free?
MR. PICCIRILLI: No, you didn't do this
one for free.
A. No. I'm being facetious.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: I guess we could
ask, listed on the closing statement, there was a
fee of $550.
MR. BERGERON: That was part of my
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question.
MR. PICCIRILLI: Well, ask him that
question.
Okay. How much did you get paid?
MR. PICCIRILLI: No. Ask him, "Does
the $550 on the closing sheet go to you?“
MR. STRACHMAN: With all due respect,
you don't have the right to tell him what questions
he can ask. He can ask whatever questions he wants.
That's one good question, but there are plenty of
others about that issue.
Did you get paid $550?
A. No. I should have.
Did you get paid less than that?
A. Yes.
Did you get paid, period?
A. Yes, I did. I do think, in the HUD and closing
disclosure, my fee should be disclosed. It should
be, and also make the title company pay me, because
that is the big risk that I have.
Sure. We will note that for the record. You said
that the closing took place at Mr. Pagliarlni's
office?
A. That's correct.
Who was there when you got there?
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A. The buyer's realtor; the buyer and wife; Hailey
Conn; and I believe there was one other realtor,
probably the realtor that represented the seller;
and myself.
Mr. Pagliarini was at the office; correct?
A. Mr. Pagliarini was sitting in his office. Did
not come into the room, was never, ever in
attendance.
So within the —-
A. When I left, he was extremely aggressive. And
if I didn't think it would cost my job, I would have
gone out in the parking lot with him.
Where within the office did the closing take place?
A. In the conference room. I don't know if they
have more than one.
And at the beginning of that closing in that
conference room, who was in the room at that point?
A. Hailey Conn; the seller's realtor, I believe;
the buyer's realtor, definitely; and the buyer, and
the seller, and me.
And you have already said Mr. Pagliarini was not in
the room?
A. Not in it.
At some point, the complaint suggests that Ms. Conn
left. Do you recall that?
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A. She left when the closing was done and we were
all leaving.
So you said that, at the beginning of the cloSing,
Ms. Conn, you, the two Majewskis, the buyers, and
possibly the other realtors ~—
A. Two realtors. One realtor definitely. This was
two years...
I understand. Were all of those people in that room
for the entirety of the signing of the documents?
A. Yes;
Including Ms. Conn?
A. Yes. She sat to the left of me, at the head of
the conference room table.
Did Ms. Conn ever leave the room while the --
A. Not that I can recall.
MR. PICCIRILLI: Let him finish his
questions.
I'm handing you what's marked Exhibit 4. That's a
document titled "Notary Held Harmless.“ Do you
recognize this document?
A. I do.
Did you bring this document to the closing?
A. Yes.
And is this a document that's provided to you by
ServiceLink, or is this a document --
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A. No. It's a document that came --
MR. PICCIRILLI: Let him finish his
question.
A. Go ahead; I'm sorry. Could you rephrase your
question?
Sure. You said you brought this to the closing?
A. I did.
Did ServiceLink provide you with this document?
A. No.
Where did this document come from?
A. The National Notary Association out of
California came up with a document like that, and I
copied it, because I think they should know that I'm
not an attorney.
So this is a document that you would have brought on
your own?
A. That's correct.
Did you have to advise ServiceLink that you would do
it?
A. No.
So you just bring it on your own initiative?
A. Right. I like them to know what my part of the
closing is, and that I'm not there to, I'm not
representing myself as an attorney, I'm not there as
a loan officer, if they have any real technical
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questions, they have to talk to the loan officer, or
talk to the processor at the lending company,
whatever.
Okay. At the top of the document, there's a line
that says "Loan Number"?
A. That's correct.
And there's numbers afterwards --
A. I filled in that.
You filled that in? And the next line that —- the
next two lines I will read to the committee. It
says, "Please be advised that William E. Paplauskas,
Jr., is not a notary public and not a loan officer
and/or employee of JPMorgan Chase"?
A. It says I am. I think I heard you say it says
"is not." I am a notary.
"Is a notary and not a loan officer“?
A. “Or employee.“
And handwritten in there is "JPMorgan Chase." Did
you write that in?
A. I did.
So did you understand yourself —- are you listing
the bank simply because they're the lender?
A. They are the lender. Yes.
Did you read this document to the Majewskis, or ~—
A. There's a blank copy that I gave them in the set
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of documents. I don't know if it's there or not,
but...
So did —-
A. It is the first document that I went over with
them.
And so, did you read it to them, or did you provide
it to them and tell them to read it?
A. No. I handed it to them, and I went —- I didn't
read word for word. I pointed out the paragraphs to
them, and then asked them to sign and print their
name and date. Asked them if they had any questions
about the document. And I allowed them enough time
to read it if they wanted to read it.
Do you recall if they had any questions about the
document?
A. They, at that time, thought that there was going
to be an attorney doing the closing. And I said,
"We can get an attorney, but it will delay the
closing." There was an attorney there. I said,
"There is an attorney here."
And were Attorney Conn or Attorney Pagliarini part
of that conversation?
A. Attorney Pagliarini was never part of the
conversation until I left the conference room.
So in regards to discussing this document with the
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. - March 1, 2017
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Majewskis, was Attorney Conn ——
A. She was in the room, but she remained silent.
So do you recall any -—
A. No. They said -— they kind of looked at each
other. The realtor said —— the realtor really
should have held them by the hand. I mean, they're
first-time home buyers. But they just, “Okay, let's
do the closing." We did the closing.
After you provided it to them, did you ask them to
sign it?
A. I asked them to sign it. I gave them sufficient
time to read it, and asked them to sign it.
And if you look at the document, do you see the two
signatures there?
A. Yes.
Are those their signatures?
A. Yes.
And the final signature, is that your signature?
A. Yes.
Did you sign that document at that time?
A. Yes.
Earlier today, we went through a whole bunch of
documents. First was provided to us by JPMorgan
Chase, and the second was provided to us by
ServiceLink. In many instances that I was going
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through, I was pointing out either the signatures of
Mr. and Mrs. Majewski or your notarization of those.
When we were going through those, do you have any
dispute with any of those signatures?
A. No, but I can tell you what the borrower says
about all that paperwork. It's too much.
It's a lot of paperwork?
A. Yes. They think it's too much.
So you indicated, when we went through the
signatures of the Majewskis and their various
initials, once you got those signatures -— or let me
back up.
While you were providing those documents to
them for signatures, do you present them to them one
at a time?
A. Yes. I will back that up. All except for the
mortgage, because the mortgage is multiple pages.
Most of the documents are one or two pages. Some
may be three or four. The mortgage, I hand it to
them, "That's the mortgage. This is what gets
recorded at the town hall." And I ask them if they
would initial it and read it.
Okay. When you were providing these documents to
them, do you recall whether they had specific
questions about the documents?
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A. No.
Do you recall any instances in which, when you were
presenting them with the documents, they asked you
for an opinion?
A. Absolutely not. I would refer them to the loan
officer that they've been dealing with, or in some
cases now, it's the processor that gets involved at
the end, and the loan officer is on to the next
closing. I would refer them back there.
By the way, it's interesting, in the
Massachusetts closings that I do, the Massachusetts
attorney spends all of about two minutes. He
introduces himself, tells them his phone number, and
you can call him if there's any questions.
Okay. Once you got those signatures on all of the
documents, what did you do?
A. Time to leave, and time to get the package to
UPS or FedEx, however we're supposed to deliver it.
I can't tell you —— it was shipped by...
(Witness perusing documents)
MR. PICCIRILLI: He is asking you ——
A. It was FedEx or UPS. I don't know which.
So when you —-
A. But in leaving the office is when I met
Mr. Pagliarini.
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. - March 1, 2017
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We'll get there, and I will have you speak about
that in a second. So when you finish getting all
the signatures, you have a11 the documents that have
been signed by you —- or, excuse me -— that have
been signed by the Majewskis, which you have
brought, did you receive any documents from the
sellers in this instance?
A. Sometimes -- in general. This is in general. I
can't remember specifically on this transaction. In
general, sometimes I do, and sometimes I don't.
Sometimes I get a check. I may have received a
check on this transaction, because it's a purchase.
Sometimes I get water bills that are being
paid, or real estate taxes, pay stubs, W—2s
sometimes. Sometimes I don't. There's less of that
now than what there was back in 1969.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: And then those
materials would just go in the envelope?
THE WITNESS: I'm sorry?
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Would you just
send those materials off ——
A. Yes. Put them in a FedEx envelope and ship them
back. The shipping label is provided by the lender
or the title company.
Okay. I'm going to show you what's marked
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. - March 1, 2017
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Exhibit 10, page 152. That's a document titled
"Warranty Deed."
A. That was a document that was handed to me by
Hailey.
Right. So that's all I'm asking. Was that document
provided to you -—
A. It could have been, at the purchase. That's
fairly common.
And does that require anything from you, or do you
just receive it?
A. Just put it in the package.
Okay. That's all I want to know. So when you go
outside the conference room, do you make copies?
A. No.
There's just one original when you leave?
A. That's correct.
And te11 us about the interaction that took place
when you left the conference room.
A. When I left, Mr. Pagliarini decided that he was
going to come out of his office, and he wanted to
know if I was doing the recording. I told him no.
And he thought that that was stupid, and he told me
that. And I said, "This is stuff that was all
worked out prior to me coming here."
Then he wanted to know when the money was going
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to be -— if it was the client's account. I said,
“You have to ask Hailey. I don't have any idea.
That stuff is conversations that occurred between
your office and the title company that I'm not privy
to, and it should have been answered prior to me
coming." And he didn't like my answer.
Okay.
A. And I didn't like his aggressive attitude.
Did you then leave?
A. Yes.
And after you left, what were your responsibilities,
how did you understand —-
A. Get the package to the UPS or FedEx office as
quickly as possible so there would be no delay in
funding the loan.
And who did you mail it to?
A. ServiceLink.
And did you record or file any of the documents?
A. No.
Did you control or release any of the money that was
in escrow?
A. Absolutely not.
And after you mailed those documents to ServiceLink,
did you have any other involvement with the
transaction?
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. - March 1, 2017
A. No.
Did they pay you?
A. They did.
MR. BERGERON: Good. Does the
committee have any questions that they would like to
ask?
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: I will open it
up, if you want to start on that end?
EXAMINATION BY MS. GILLIGAN
I just want to clarify a part of your process,
because when you were telling us back in the
beginning, sir, how your job operates, and that
you're independent, and you've been doing these all
these years, you said you see yourself as an
impartial observer ~-
A. Impartial witness.
Impartial witness, certainly, at these proceedings?
A. That's correct.
And you have done, you said, about 900 a year for
the last ten years or so; correct?
A. Approximately.
Right. And I take that from 75 a month. I used my
limited math skills.
A. I said 50 to 75.
Great. So it's a lot. You also said that not only
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are you an impartial witness, but you also want to
make sure that the people have some understanding of
the documents; correct?
A. my wife and granddaughter don't think it's
enough.
The money. Absolutely. I'm sure they don't. But
you also testified, in response to Mr. Bergeron,
that you want to make sure the people have some
understanding of the documents; correct?
A. Well, I give them an overview of the document,
make sure that they're not on drugs, there's nothing
impairing their judgment, that kind of thing. Ask
them if they're doing this under their own free act
and will.
Sure. And then a little later, also in response to
Mr. Bergeron, you said that generally it would be
your protocol to say, "So, do you understand it, and
if so, sign it“; right?
A. That was on that document there, on the hold ~
harmless agreement, ask them if they understand.
Thank you. Do you ask that question, "Do you
understand it," on every document?
A. No.
Have, over the course of your 10 to 20 thousand
instances, has anyone ever said, “No, I don't
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understand it"?
A. I have had some where I thought that the husband
was browbeating the wife, or the wife was
browbeating the husband into signing, and we did not
go through with the signing.
So if someone said to you, "No, I don't understand
it," what is it your practice to do?
A. I would then tell them, "Let's call the loan
officer, let's let the loan officer explain it to
you~ "
MS. GILLIGAN: Okay. Thank you.
EXAMINATION BY MS. BARONE
Mr. Paplauskas, I'm Carolyn Barone, if you need to
know the names of people who are going to be asking
you questions. You indicated that you are not
affiliated or associated with any closing company;
is that correct?
A. I am not an employee, and there's not an
employment relationship. I'm a 1099 person. I get
business regularly from some companies more than
others.
What are these companies?
A. Title companies or signing companies.
Where are they located?
A. Could be anywhere, ma'am, from Rhode Island to
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — March 1, 2017
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California and back.
You indicated that you marketed yourself; is that an
accurate statement?
A. That's correct.
How do you market yourself?
A. Call them up, introduce myself. Most cases, now
I have a reputation, so I'm known. When I'm talking
with somebody, they want references from me, and I
give them references, and the references speak,
evidently, highly of me.
And these referencés would come from whom?
A. Companies that I do business with, I would give
them references. But the National Notary
Association has a list of companies that hire
notaries to do closings. And then you got to-get in
line and, you know...
You contact these companies and say, "Put me on your
list, please"?
A. Got to do the grunt work.
Do you have any referrals from other attorneys?
A. No. Well, I will back that up. Occasionally, I
get one, but they're few and far between.
Would these be Rhode Island attorneys?
A. Maybe one or two every now and then. But most
of them are out—of-state attorneys that have a
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. - March 1, 2017
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closing to do in Rhode Island.
And how would they get your name?
A. Going through various websites that I may be
listed on, or referrals from people that move from
one company to another.
Okay. How many closings have you attended at John
Pagliarini's office?
A. None -- one. One.
This was the very first one?
A. And the last one.
Now, who pays you for your services?
A. _ServiceLink. On this particular transaction,
ServiceLink.
Are you always paid by the title company?
A. Title company, or a signing company that hires
me.
Now, how does a signing company differ from a title
company?
A. I'm assuming that they market themselves to
these title companies as companies that have
notaries throughout the country that will do
signings, I'm assuming. I don't know. I'm assuming
they do it the same way I do it.
They would be like the middleperson between the
title company or the funding company, whoever is
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funding the money?
A. That's correct.
Then they would get to this -- how did you describe
it -— the service company, and then the company
would come to you?
A. The signing company is its own entity. They
would market the title companies. And then the
title company would go through them to get to me.
ServiceLink is much more of a direct relationship.
They are the title company, and they deal directly
with a notary. Some of them don't want to deal with
notaries. I think we're pleasant people.
I think we're all notaries here, and I agree with
you, we're very pleasant. Now, you stated that the
buyer is, quote/unquote, kept in the dark about who
the closing attorney is, and the buyers are never
told there would be no attorney?
A. No, I didn't say they were kept in the dark.
I've got quotes around "kept in dark."
A. When I showed up, they were surprised, because I
introduced myself and I don't hide what I do. I
introduced myself with my title, and they said ~—
who kept them in the dark, I don't have any idea. I
know ServiceLink doesn't have any contact with them.
That's JPMorgan and the realtor. Why the realtors
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don't point them towards an attorney on the largest
transaction that most people do, I don't have any
idea. They should. And you attorneys should be
marketing those realtors.
Hailey Conn, is that her name, Hallee or Hailey?
A. I'm sorry? Hailey Conn? She represented the
seller.
Had you met her before that day?
A. No, ma'am.
No communication with her before that day?
A. No, ma'am. I'm a Rhode Islander. Tiverton is
like in another world. More than a 20-minute drive.
So the sellers were represented?
A. The sellers were represented by Hailey Conn.
The sellers were not at the closing, so she
evidently had power of attorney, or took care of
their portion while they went somewhere else other
than at the closing.
And your recollection is that Attorney Conn was in
that conference room for the entire time ~-
A. Yes, ma'am.
-— of the closing process?
A. Yes, ma'am.
With respect to this notary he1d harmless clause,
I'm looking at Exhibit 4, your notary held harmless
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William.E. Paplauskas, Jr. — March 1, 2017
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clause, do you have parties to a real estate closing
transaction always sign this hold harmless clause?
A. Yes, ma'am.
And I believe you said you gave them sufficient time
to review?
A. Yes.
How much time is sufficient?
A. I don't know. Two, three minutes, four minutes,
five minutes. I have no idea.
How long did the closing take place?
A. 4S minutes to an hour, generally.
Do you remember this one, this particular closing?
A. Ma'am, you're asking for something two years
ago. It's like asking me what did I have for
breakfast two years ago. I mean, I have no idea.
I figured I would take a shot.
A. I understand. Generally, they're 45 minutes to
an hour.
And how long, usually, in your experience, based
upon your particular experiences, will the buyers
take to review all of the stacks of documents that
they have to sign?
A. Within that 45 minutes to an hour, as we're
passing the documents.
And it's usually, you point to where they have to
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sign; is that correct?
A. No. I went over, I give them an overview of the
document. "This is the note, that is what you're
borrowing, this is your interest rate." It's black
and white. Now it's even on the closing disclosure,
so all that stuff is really up front. And that's
it.
Do you give them three to four minutes to review all
the other documents?
A. As I put them in front of me -~ they have a
right to review everything —-
I know what they have the right to do.
A. If they want to sit there and review it ~-
I'm asking you, in this particular closing, did you
give these buyers three to four minutes to review
each of these documents?
A. I put the document in front of them, I give them
an overview of the document, ask them to look it
over and initial it. Whether they do or not is
strictly up to them.
What does this overview that you give them consist
of?
A. I would tell them it's a note, I would tell them
the loan amount, the interest rate, when the first
payment is due, last payment is due, what the
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1 principal interest payment is, and if there's a
2 prepayment penalty. That's all on the first page of
3 the note. And if there's a late charge.
4 Q. You don't talk about what happens if there's a
5 breach of the note, nothing like that?
6 A. No. No. Not up to me to do that.
7 CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Carolyn, can I
8 follow up on your question?
9 MS. BARONE: Sure.
10 CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Same question,
11 when you, for example, present them with their
g 12 mortgage document, what would you say?'
13 A. "This is the mortgage, this is what gets
14 recorded at the Registry of Deeds. It's 15, 16
15 pages. Take a look at it. Initial each page as
16 you're looking at it." I tell them the initial has
17 to be within, inside the margins, because the
18 registry may have a problem with recording it.
19 And that's about it. If they have any
20 questions about that document, it's time that they
21 talk to the loan officer, or their financial
22 advisor, or their attorney if they have one.
23 CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: And even a
g 24 similar question with a document like this that's'3”
25 just titled "A11 Terms Met." Are you familiar with
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those? What would you say ——
A. That's between the buyer and the seller, that
all terms are met according to the purchase and
sales agreement.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: So you would just
read them the title and give them that overview?
A. Yes, ma'am. Well, I wouldn't say all terms are
met on the purchase and sales agreement, but...
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Okay.
Understood. Sorry, Carolyn.
Sir, getting back to the notary held harmless
clause, when did you start using this clause?
A. Ten years ago, five years ago. I really have no
idea.
How did you find this clause?
A. The National Notary Association.
You're a member of that association?
A. Yes, ma'am.
And has there, throughout the course of your
attending and facilitating these real estate
closings, have you ever run across a situation where
anyone in that room where that closing was being
held thought you were an attorney?
A. Rare, because most cases -— well, not —— about
99 percent of the time, I have contact with the
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borrower. I did not have contact with the borrower.
My contact was with Hailey Conn, and she knew I was
coming, and she knew I was a notary.
How did Hailey Conn get involved in this?
A. She represented the seller, and she was my
contact person.
Okay. She prepared the warranty deed, as far as you
know?
A. As far as I know. I'm not positive. I wasn't
privy to that. I just got it handed to me.
Now, you indicated that —- strike that. I have no
further questions.
A. Actually, most of the borrowers like the fact
that a notary is doing the closing, because we go to
their home, we go to their place of business. To
deal with an attorney, they have to come to you,
they have to rearrange their schedule, versus us
arranging our schedule around them. To come to your
office, they have to come to your schedule.
So if I'm Joe Schmoe purchasing, say it's a new
purchase, you come to my house?
A. Come to your house, come to your place of work,
if necessary.
Who do I pay for your services, who am Iipaying?
A. That's, I don't have any idea. I only know that
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I get paid by the title company. What money
transpires between the buyer and the seller, if it's
on the HUD, or, I mean, that's there. And today
it's all got to be there in the HUD.
MS. BARONE: Okay. I have no further
questions.
EXAMINATION BY MS. MACIASZ DISANTO
I have a few additional questions, Mr. Pap...
A. That's a mouthful.
I'm sorry. Yes, it is. I'm Megan Maciasz DiSanto.
A.‘ I thought my name was a mouthful.
Right? I know. Then there's this one. A couple of
follow-up questions, and a couple of questions about
the people that retain you. So I just wanted to ask
you a question about ServiceLink, and you may or may
not know the answer to this question, but you said
that you have had multiple business experiences
working with ServiceLink in your dealings?
A. Yes.
Are you aware whether or not ServiceLink provides
title insurance?
A. Yes, they do. The title insurance, I believe,
is probably written through either Chicago Title,
Fidelity National, or maybe one other one.
So they are not the underwriter, but they provide
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title insurance, that's your understanding?
A. That, I'm not positive of. I know that they're
owned by Fidelity National, and within that network
is Chicago Title, and there's one other company
that's within the Fidelity network.
In the, I guess, 40 or 50 years that you've been
doing this, are you aware of other people in Rhode
Island who do the same line of work as -—
A. There's a bunch of them.
So you're aware of a bunch of other people who act
as notary publics [sic]?
A. Yes.
Independently, such as yourself?
A. I would like them not to do the closings, and I
get it all, but...
When you say "a bunch" -—
A. It's a bunch. I can't give you an exact number.
I know that I bump into them.
Would it be closer to like three or four, or would
it be closer to like 40 or 50?
A. It would be higher than three or four, it would
probably be less than 40 or 50, I think. I can't
tell you the exact number.
But you're aware of other people who do this work?
A. Yes.
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In these closings that you have been present for
over these years, are there closings where both the
buyer and the seller are represented by counsel at
the closing?
A. There are.
And so in that case, the buyer's attorney would be
there, the seller's attorney would be there, and you
would be there, as well?
A. That's correct.
Now, you said that, for this closing, you --
A. That doesn't happen often, but it does happen.
But that was not the case, obviously, for this
closing. For this closing, you said ServiceLink was
the entity that compensated you?
A. Yes. That's correct.
Is it always —-
A. I never get payment by the buyer or the seller.
It's always been from a title company or a signing
company.
Have you ever been paid by an attorney?
A. No. Well, I take that back. Yes. The few
deals that I have done where the attorney has hired
me, yes. But it's not, it's maybe a handful.
Okay. But you have never been paid by the buyer or
the seller?
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A. Never.
And you're always retained by same other third party
to the transaction?
A. Yes.
Now, you said you have had some experience doing
closings for Massachusetts property?
A. That's correct.
And you had alluded to the role of an attorney.
Could you ——
A. The attorney has to get involved with the
closing in the‘State of Massachusetts. And
typically, when it comes to me as an assignment,
they will also tell me who the attorney is that's
going to be doing the closing, or going to be
participating in the closing.
And generally what happens, the attorney
introduces himself, he or she tells the borrower
that he is available, he or she is available, and
here is the phone number.
Now, when you say they introduce —~
A. If they have any questions, "Call me."
When you say they introduce themselves, do you mean
they're physically present at the closing, or they
have reached out via telephone —-
A. No. They're in Massachusetts. maybe theyLregJ
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doing another closing in another part of
Massachusetts, or they're sitting in the office.
So are they being teleconferenced in via telephone?
I'm just trying --
A. I call them on my cell phone and hand it to the
borrower. They introduce themselves, give the
borrower a phone number that they can call back if
they have any questions.
So usually at the closing, you initiate the call to
the attorney?
A. No. If I'm there, and the attorney is there in
82
person, I hand the HUD to him and let him explain to
his client.
But if the attorney is not there in person, I'm just
trying to understand how it works. I don't have any
experience in this personally.
A. Massachusetts, all they do is introduce
themselves and give a phone number to the borrower,
period.
When do they introduce themselves?
A. When I sit down and dial the phone and say,
“Megan, here is so-and—so.“ And they spend two
minutes with them, and that's it.
So you do initiate the phone call to the attorney?
A. That's correct.
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. - March 1, 2017
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And then they communicate via telephone; the phone
is not put on speakerphone, it's not, they're not -—
A. No. It's on speaker if there's a husband and
wife, or two borrowers, I put it on Speaker so they
can talk to both borrowers at the same time. It's,
"Hi, my name is Megan DiSanto. My phone number is
X. If you have any questions, call me."
But in your experience, they haven't been in the
closing on a conference phone where they're
listening to the entire closing?
A. No.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Megan, can I
interrupt and just ask one question? Are these for
closings that you're doing in Rhode Island for
properties in Massachusetts --
A. Yes.t
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: -- or are you
referring to your practice when you used to —-
A. No. Those are closings I'm doing in Rhode
Island for Massachusetts. When I was a Mass. notary
and did some closings in Massachusetts, yes, then it
was the same thing. The attorney is in his office
or somewhere else ——
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: So there was some
limited telephone contact?
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A. When I did closings in Massachusetts, then we
dealt with an attorney the same way. He would call
and introduce himself, and the phone number, and
that was it.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Megan, I'm sorry
to interrupt, but just one follow—up question on the
same area. And those are closings you still perform
today, occasionally?
A. Yes.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS:. Thank you.
MS. MACIASZ DISANTO: I don't have any
further questions. Thank you very much.
RE-EXAMINATION BY MS. BARONE
I have one follow—up question, just very quickly.
How did you, who made the arrangements to go to John
Pagliarini's office?
A. ServiceLink and Hailey Conn.
Do you know who she works for?
A. I'm assuming she's a partner of the Pagliarini
law office. I don't know for sure, but she is an
attorney at that office.
MS. BARONE: Thank you.
A. It's curious. She was the only one in the room,
why didn't she file the complaint if I did something
wrong?
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EXAMINATION BY MR. VESPIA
Well, I think you know that I am the public member
of this committee?
A. I do.
I'm the only member of the committee who is not a
lawyer, so I just wanted you to know that. I think
Mr. Piccirilli probably clued you in on that. But
thank you for your comments earlier. That's very
nice of you.
A. Well, you did honorable service.
Very nice of you to say that.
A. One of the few public figures.
Is it safe to say that, since 1969, you may have
performed over a thousand closings?
A. 10 to 20 thousand, probably, I guess.
Did the occasion ever arise during any one of those
closings when you were going over the closing
documents to either the buyer or the seller, either
one of them eaid, "Oh, wait a minute, I'm not
comfortable with this"?
A. Yes.
What did you do then?
A. Get them on the phone with the loan officer and
explain just what the problem is.
Suppose the buyer or seller said to you, "I want a
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — March 1, 2017
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lawyer," did that ever happen?
A. Get a lawyer. I mean, I will stop the closing,
and if you can get an attorney to come to the table
now, or we have to reschedule the closing.
Were you ever instrumental in obtaining a lawyer for
anyone?
A. I don't obtain any lawyers for anybody.
Okay.
A. If I did, I would call him (indicating) .
Good ehoice. I think you said earlier that
Mr. Pagliarini was interested in promulgating some
legislation barring --
A. No. Go ahead. I'm sorry..
—— batring nonattorneys from working on a closing?
A. Back in 2002, the state legislature, there were
people -~ including John Harwood, who ended up, I
think, in jail -- who tried to pass Bill H74662,
which was, Ted Cruz was involved when he worked for
the Department of Justice.
The Department of Justice and the FCC, the
State of Rhode Island was taken to court because
there's no history of a closing being done by an
attorney where the borrower, when he absconded with
funds or anything, was crooked about the
transaction. But there had been attorneys that have
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. - March 1, 2017
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gone to jail. One of them was in jail for five
years, and the bar gave him back his license. I
find that interesting.
Who?
A. Think about all the criminals that you arrested
get back their license to practice law because they
know the law. And I think that Mr. Pagliarini,
being a legislator, was trying to get the Supreme
Court to make law from the bench, which I don't
think judges should do.
Had he been successful, you would be out of a job.
A. And I am getting close to the age where I'm
going to be out of a job.
MR. VESPIA: I've been there recently.
Okay. Thank you. I have no further questions.
EXAMINATION BY MR. STRACHMAN
Do you think, sir, that that's what this proceeding
is about, Mr. Pagliarini —-
A. I think that that's —-
Let me finish the question, and then you can answer.
Do you think that this is about; this proceeding is
about Mr. Pagliarini trying to get the Rhode Island
Supreme Court to make 1aw?
A. I do.
What do you base that on?
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. - March 1, 2017
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A. Pardon me?
What facts are there that support your contention?
A. Because in 2002, the legislature backed off when
the Justice Department and the FCC threatened to
sue. And I think what he is trying to do is a
back-door -— all of that complaint, a lot of those
questions should have been answered by the title
company, should have been answered before I arrived
at the table.
Instead -- and I don't know if he did or not.
But I just find it interesting that I can't face my
accuser. My accuser was not in the roam when the
crime was committed, yet he is saying that I.
committed a crime. And the attorney that was there
didn”t say that.
But what facts do you know of that snggest that this
proceeding right here is to further what didn't
happen in 2002? Do you know of any specific ——
A. I think that he's a legislator, and he wants to
get it done that way, rather than through the battle
with the Department of Justice and the FCC.
What's the evidence of that?
A. That's what I'm —— that complaint is bogus.
Other than that letter, that complaint letter from
August of 2015, there's no other evidence that you
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have?
A. Where is he so I can ask that question to him?
I'm asking you the question.
A. No, I'm asking you. Where is my accuser?
No. Excuse me. With all due respect, sir; I'm not
here to answer questions, I'm here to ask them" Are
you saying that the only evidence that you have for
that contention is the August 2015 letter?
A. Yes. The letter that he filed the complaint in.
Yes.
That's it?
A. Because‘it's absolutely, it's horse manure.
I got it.‘ But other than that horse manure, there's
nothing else, no other fact, no other letter, no
other statement -—
A. Other than the fact that he is an attorney. I
think that his complaint is because he doesn't do a
lot of real estate. What people ~—
With all due respect, I'm not asking for a
narrative. You can do that later at another time.
All I'm asking for is what facts that support your
contention that this proceeding right here today is
about some, I guess, vendetta or personal idea that
Mr. Pagliarini has.
A. Because we're here for somebody that was not ingj
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the room, and accusing me of doing something. And
he should be here answering that.
So in addition to the 2015 letter, it's his absence
today?
A. That's one of them, and the fact that he's a
legislator.
Those three facts?
A. And the fact that I don't think he does a lot of
business, from what I saw from his office.
That's it, those four facts?
A. That's right.
Now, you've been, you said, I think you said you
were in the mortgage business since-1969; right?
A. Yes.
NOW, besides being a notary in closings, what other
role have you played in the mortgage business?
A. I have done everything from a telemarketer, to a
processor, to a loan officer, to a manager of loan
officers, to running a finance company, knocking on
doors for payment.
So you have done a lot of things in the mortgage
industry; is that right?
A. Yes, sir.
And for how many years have you exclusively been a
notary?
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — March 1, 2017
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A. Probably just ten years, maybe a little longer.
So a little longer than ten years, you have been
just a notary showing up at closings?
A. Yes, sir.
And you're the guy, when you show up at the
closings, who makes the closings; is that right?
A. I am the guy that presents the paperwork. Yes.
And when you typically go, there's no lawyer for the
buyer; is that right?
A. I'm sorry. I missed what you said.
The closings that you attend in Rhode Island,
typically there are no attorneys for the buyers?
A. No. Most of my closings I do are refinancing or
home equity lines of credit. I do do some
purchases. Some‘of it is local, and some of it is
out—of-state property they're buying in Florida or
somewhere else.
So let's talk about Rhode Island. In Rhode Island,
is it fair to say that in the ten or so years that
you have been serving as a notary exclusively,
almost every closing that you attend, either for a
refi or a purchase, there is no buyer, no buyer's
attorney?
A. Occasionally, I get a buyer at the closing. Not
often. Buyer may be somewhere else. I mean...
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I'm talking about attorneys. I'm‘asking about
attorneys.
A. Occasionally, I get an attorney at a closing.
Not often.
If an attorney is there, why would you need to be
there?
A. I'm there because the title company sends me the
paperwork.
To do what?
A. Transport the paperwork.
So you deliver the paperwork -—
A. And I notarize the document. I hand the
paperwork to the attorney and let the attorney go
over the paperwork with the buyer.
And the lawyer could notarize his client's
paperwork, too; right?
A. I'm just telling you what I do.
Is that right?
A. Yes. Of course, he could. He's probably a
notary.
But is it fair to say, 99 percent of the times
you're there, there is no attorney for the buyer?
A. Yes. Probably about, yes, 95 percent of the
time.
In Rhode Island?
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A. Yes}
For both purchases and refi's?
A. Refi's there's never an attorney. I shouldn't
say that. Occasionally, there is an attorney.
So still around —-
A. Less apt than on a sale or purchase.
So still about 95 percent?
A. Probably a little higher.
And where exactly do you advertise your notary
practice?
A. I don't.
I thought you said you were listed in directories
and websites?
A. I'm listed, yes, on various websites that --
So what are those websites?
A. Notary Cafe.
I'm sorry. Say that‘again, please?
A. Notary Cafe.
Cafe?
A. Cafe, C-A-F—E. Notary Rotary. National Notary
Association. They have a website called
signingagent.com. That's it.
So in other words, do you pay for listings there?
A. No.
You're a member of these organizations?
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A. I'm a member of —— yes. I'm a member of the
National Notary Association. So you could say that,
I guess, my membership fee covers me being on their
websité.
A listing on their website?
A. Yes.
You don't have an advertisement or promotional
materials that you send out?
A. No.
And when you attend the closings, you said your role
is to provide an overview, is that right, of the
documents?
A. Impartial witness. Yes.
And when you provide an overview, do you give an
overview of each of the documents that the buyers
have to sign?
A. Most cases, it's a refi. But, yes, if the buyer
is, yes, I hand all the things meant for them that,
hey, this means that you agree with the purchase and
sale.
So let's say the documents that are in Exhibit 10,
which I think your lawyer has to your right, you
.gave an overview of each of the documents that were
in here to the client?
A. I mean, some of them don't take a lot of
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. - March 1, 2017
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explanation. This says that you cover the property
with all necessary insurance.
I just want to be clear for the record. In this
particular closing for the Majewskis ~—
A. I did nothing for the seller.
For the buyers, did you —-
A. For the buyers ——
Let me finish, please. For the buyers, did you give
them an overview of each of the documents that they
were asked to sign?
A. Yes.
And you were the one who gave them the documents to
sign, you put them in front of them; is that right?
A. As I presented the documents to them, I told
them what the-document was.
So you explained to them what it was?
A. I told them an overview of what it was. "This
is the note," I went over it. “This is, it talks
about you having to cover the property with all the
necessary insurance" —-
You told them what their obligations were under the
note?
A. No. I explained to themiwhat the loan amount
was, what the payment was, when the first payment is
due, final payment scheduled, their principal and
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interest payment, whether there is a prepayment
penalty, and whether there's a late fee or not. And
that's it.
Did you say that you told them about the insurance‘
that they had to provide?
A. I'm sorry, please?
Did you just testify a moment ago that you told the
Majewskis about the insurance that they had to have
for the house?
A. I said that, as you're going through that
package of forms, it has a form that says that you
will cover the property with all necessary
insurance.
So you alerted them to their obligation to provide
insurance?
A. That's what the form says.
You alerted them to that; you pointed it out?
A. That's what the form says.
So the answer is yes?
A. This has an insurance form, and it says you have
to cover the firoperty with all necessary insurance.
So you pointed that out to them?
A. Yes.
And did you point out anything else in the note?
A. No.
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. - March 1, 2017
When was the first time that they were given these
documents to review?
A. I'm assuming, when I showed up.
Did they respond to the documents as if they had
been seeing them for the first time?
A. They never indicated to me.
So they may have seen them before?
A. Correct.
You don't know?
A. I have no idea.
And did they tell you, "We have seen them before"?
A. No.
Did they tell you, "We don't need your overview
because we know what the documents say"?
A. No.
Did they tell you, "We don't need you to explain to
us about insurance or about what the terms of the
note were, when the payments were due, because we
already know that"?
A. I don't explain about insurance. I tell them,
"The form says you will cover the property with all
the necessary insurance." I don't go into, "You
97
have to cover the property, this is a $150,000 loan,
you have to cover it with $150,000 worth of
insurance.“ I don't go into, "If the property is in
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. - March 1, 2017
98
a flood zone, you have to cover the property with
flood insurance." I don't get into that detail.V
MR. STRACHMAN: Could you please read
back my question so that, so we can put the question
to the witness.
(Pending question read)
A. No.
And did they give you any indication at a11 that
they had seen these documents in Exhibit 10 before?
A. No.
Did it appear as if they read all the documents in
front of you?
A. No. I want to correct one thing. I do believe
they may, on a purchase, may have seen the HUD
settlement statement in this case, because it was
before the closing disclosures came out. Because
there was no questions about the closing disclosure,
the HUD settlement statement, as far as the numbers
were --
So it appeared as if —-
A. It appeared to me they saw it.
—- they saw the HUD before?
A. It appears.
Because they had no questions?
A. They had no questions.
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. - March l, 2017
99
And you didn't walk them through it?
A. No.
You didn't tell them, "Here are the calculations for
the seller, here is for the buyer"?
A. I told them, "This side is for the seller, this
side is for the buyer," on the HUD settlement
statement.
You did point that out to them?
A. Yes. That's all.
And did you point out to them how much money they
had to bring to the table, or what their check was,
0r ‘-
~A. At the bottom of the HUD settlement statement.
You didn't show them where that was?
A. Yes, I walked them through -—
You walked them through it?
A. I'd walk them through —— I didn't walk them
through the whole -— I did walk them through, "This
is the loan amount, and this is the money that you
have to" —- that's it.
So some things you walked them through, in your
words?
A. Yes.
And some things, like the HUD, you didn't need to
walk them through?
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100
A. I assumed, there was no question, so I'm
assuming that they saw it. Now, whether the realtor
saw it, or the buyer saw it, I don't have any idea.
I'm just assuming. There was no questions.
Was their realtor in the room with them?
A._ Their realtor was in the room.
Was their realtor explaining to them what the
documents were?
A. No.
Did their realtor go over —-
A. The realtor sat there —-
Let me finish, please. Did their realtor go over
any of the documents with them?
A. No. The realtor sat there and talked to the
other realtor about what was going on in their
lives, like happens with most closings.
You remember that specifically about this closing?
A. I just remember it's what generally happens.
But do you remember --
A. I have never seen a realtor -— go ahead.
Do you remember that specifically about this
closing?
A. I'm guessing. That's usually the way that it
happens.
So your answer is no, you don't remember
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. ~ March 1, 2017
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specifically?
A. I don't remember specifically. No. It's two
years ago.
But do you remember, in this closing, if their own
realtor walked them through any of these documents?
A. I can tell you the realtor didn't. That, I can
tell you.
They did not?
A. No.
He or she did not?
A. He or she did not. It was a she.
Okay. And you prepared this notary held harmless
document yourself?
A. Yes.
And you got the form from the National Notary
Association?
A. Yes.
Did you adjust it?
A. No.
Did you doctor it up or beef it up?
A. I think I added a few words about the title
company and that kind of thing.
Did you discuss it with your own attorney, did you
run it by an attorney in advance?
A. No.
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. - March 1, 2017
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And you were hired to perform the closing; is that
right?
A. That's correct.
And that's, in fabt, what the documents from
ServiceLink say, that your directions were to
perform the closing?
A. I don't believe the documents say that. I think
the documents just say that this is the closing, and
there's closing instructions on there.
But you were hired to perform the closing?
A. That's correct.
And if the document says that you were asked to
perform the closing, you wouldn't contest that;
right? Is that correct?
A. If the document what, please?
If the documents from ServiceLink to you suggest
that you were requested to perform the closing, you
wouldn't object to that?
A. No.
That's accurate?
A. Yes. It wouldn't bother me.
That's what you were asked to do, perform the
closing?
A. That's right. It wouldn't bother me. I said
that.
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. - March 1, 2017
Q.
103
I just want to be clear. It's important that
everything gets taken down. And sometimes it's not
clear because I'm not asking a good question, or
you're interrupting me, or you're not answering it
properly. So that's why, sometimes, we say things
repeatedly. And were there any other notaries at
the Pagliarini law office, do you know?
A. I don't know. I'm assuming the attorney is a
notary. The other attorney, Pagliarini, is a
notary. I don't know if the receptionist is a
notary, I don't know that for sure.
And do you know if, well, do you recall if, during
this closing, the Majewskis, if you ever said‘to the
Majewskis something like, "I'm not a lawyer, but
this is the significance of this document“?
A. No. The form says I'm not a lawyer.
I'm not asking what the form said, I'm asking what
you said.
A. No.
You never said something like, “I'm not a lawyer,
but this is what this means"?
A. Absolutely not.
And you know that for sure?
A. I've been doing this now since 1969. I never...
So you wouldn't have said it here?
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — March 1, 2017
104
A. No.
So if the Majewskis said that, they would be wrong?
A. Yes. The Majewskis didn't say that.
But if they said it, if they said it to somebody
else, that, something like, "He," referring to you,
"He said, quote, I'm not a lawyer, but," that would
be wrong?
MR. PICCIRILLI: Can I objeCt here? I
understand the rules of evidence are very relaxed
here, but now we're getting very speculative. If
the Majewskis may have said to somebody? That's
double hearsay. I mean, that's not even in the
allegations anywhere. Why are we asking questions
like that? I don't think it's appropriate, and I
object.
MR. STRACHMANZ Okay.
MR. PICCIRILLI: I don't know if you'll
rule on that or not, but...f
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: I don't have a
problem with the question.
You can answer.
MR. PICCIRILLI: Do you need the
question read back?
A. Do I know if the Majewskis said that?
If the Majewskis told somebody ~—
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. - March 1, 2017
105
A. I don't have any idea.
Let me finish. If the Majewskis said to somebody,
"The notary who did the closing said to us, quote,
I'm not a notary, but this is what these documents
mean," that would be wrong?
A. If they were here, I would tell them that
they're a liar.
So that would be wrong?
A. That's correct.
At the closing, did you give a copy of the documents
for the Majewskis to take home with them?
A. I gave them an unsigned copy.
So your practice is that you print out, from the
e—mail that you receive from ServiceLink, your
practice is to print out two copies; is that right?
A. I print two copies. I'm a one—man band.
Right. So one is the copy that they're going to
sign?
A. That's correct.
And one is the copy that they can go take home with
them; is that right?
A. That's correct.
Now, there was a deed in this case; is that right?
A. There was a deed that was prepared by somebody
from the seller to...
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. - March 1, 2017
106
Was that deed given to you?
A. Yes.
By who?
A. By Hailey.
Hailey, the lawyer for the seller?
A. Right. Hailey Conn. Yes.
So she gave you the deed, and then what did you do
with it?
A. I put it in the package and shipped it.
Did you ever give it to the buyers?
A. No.
So you never gave them a copy of the deed?
A. No.
Do you know if they ever got a copy of the deed?
A. I don't have any idea.
Do you know if anybody explained the deed to them at
the closing?
A. Not me.
Did the seller's lawyer do that?
A. I don't have any idea. It's two years ago.
You don't know?
A. I don't know.
Do you know if they had any questions about the
deed?
A. Not that I am aware of.
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. - March 1, 2017
107
And what happens if they didn't like the terms of
the deed, or there was something on the deed that
was defective or wrong, what would happen?
MR. PICCIRILLI: I'm going to object.
This is speculative. Can I just point out
something? There is a statute in Rhode Island
called‘Powers of Notaries, 42:30—8, that
specifically says, "Notary publics [sic] may, within
this state, act, transact, do, and finish all
matters and things relating to protests and
protesting bills of exchange and promissory notes,
and all other matters within their office required
by law, take depositions as prescribed by law, and
acknowledgment of deeds and other instruments."
So, quite frankly, if Mr. Paplauskas
explained the documents in this closing to the
buyers, that would be within the scope of his powers
as a notary, whether he does or not. So what are we
doing with these questions?
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Mr. Piccirilli —-
MR. PICCIRILLI: I object. And there's
also another statute, 19-9-6, that says it's the
lending institution's obligation, if they are going
to have a title performed on property, it's the
lending institution's obligation to provide a
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9/5/201 8 8:44 AM
William E. Paplauskas, Jr. - March 1, 2017
108
document to the borrower indicating their right to
have their own title attorney do the title to the
property, and then give them the option to not have
that done, and let the title company or the mortgage
company pick the title attorney.
It's a specific statute in Rhode
Island, 19—9—6. If JPMorgan Chase didn't provide
that document to the buyers, that's JPMorgan Chase's
problem, it's not this man's problem. And if they
didn't know, going to this closing, whether or not
they had the right to hire a title attorney or not,
you have zero power to complain to this man.
Complain to JP —- I didn't see it in
the documents that they provided to you in the
subpoena. Maybe they screwed up, maybe they
violated the state law. He doesn't have that
obligation under the state law.
So, again, we are going so far afield
of what is an appropriate interrogation of my
client. This is really getting to be abusive. And
I object to any more questions along these lines.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Mr. Piccirilli,
we've heard your argument. I don't have a problem
with the question. I'm going to allow it.
MR. STRACHMAN: Could you please read
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — March 1, 2017
109
the question?
(Pending question read)
A. I have nothing to do with that. I would refer
them to Hailey Conn. She is the one that, I'm
assuming, drew up the deed, or somebody from that
office. Somebody did, I didn't do it. It would be,
I'd refer them back to an attorney.
In this case, did you show them the deed?
A. She handed it to me. I don't know if she showed
it to them before.
I'm asking about you. Did -—
A. I did not.
Please let me talk -—
A. I did not.
Let me talk, and then you can talk, so that it's
clear, okay? Did you show them the deed?
A. No.
MR. STRACHMAN: That's it.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: In light of the
time —— actually, would you mind stepping out for
one moment while we chat as a group, please?
(Brief recess taken, 4:19 p.m. to 4:24 p.m.)
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: In light of the
late hour, and the fact that the building closes at
4:30, we will recess the proceeding at this point.
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9757201 8 8:44 AM
William E. Paplauskas, Jr. - March 1, 2017
110
And we will work with your office to reschedule a
time that's mutually convenient. And at that point,
we will let you know of any additional witnesses.
We will discuss among ourselves about inviting
Mr. Pagliarini, to save everyone the effort of
issuing any sort of subpoenas. So we'll be in
touch. Thank you.
MR. PICCIRILLI: Okay, great. Thank
you.
(HEARING ADJOURNED AT 4:25 P.M.)
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C E R T I F I C A T E
I, PATRICIA A. MAGNONE, do hereby certify that the
foregoing is a true, accurate and complete transcript of
my notes taken at the above—entitled hearing.
IN WITNESS WHEREOF, I have hereunto set my hand
this 17th day of March 2017.
PATRICIA A. MAGNONE, RPR/NOTARY PUBLICmy Commission Expires January 10, 2021
Unauthorized Practice of Law CommitteeIN RE: William E. Paplauskas, Jr.DATE: March 1, 2017
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9/5/201 8 8:44 AM
Hearing William E. Paplauskas, Jr.
March 1, 2017
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.
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9/5/201 8 8:44 AM
Hearing William E. Paplauskas, Jr.
March 1, 2017
101:23,24;103:8,9; 20:22 borrowing (1) 106:10;107:17;108:8 cause (2)
108:2,5,1 1;109:7 battle (1) 74:4 buyer's (4) 10:10;36:23
attorneys (14) 88:20 boss (l) 55:1,19;80:6;91:22 cell (1)
9:11;34:20,24; beating (1) 35:4 buying (1) 82:5
35:16;44:9,10;69:20, 35:18 both (7) 91:16 Central (1)
23,25;72:3;86:25; beef (1) 9:1;18:1;20:10; 41:25
91:12;92:1,2 101:20 45:10;80:2;83:5;93:2 C certain (3)
August (5) beginning (4) bother (2) 30:7;3 1 :7;33:23
4:5;1 1:3;38211; 19:7;55:16;56:3; 102:21,24 Cafe (4) certainly (3)
88:25;89:8 66:12 bottom (11) 93:16,]8,19,20 8:22;9:23;66:17
authenticated (1) behalf (1) 20:22;21 :10,13; C-A-F—E (l) certification (3)
13:18 52:3_
22:23;23:22,25;24:8, 93:20 21:7,1 1;23:18
authority (4) bench (2) 15,17;25:4;99:13 calculations (1) Chair (4)
5:1;15:7;29:5;31:2 44:25;87:9 box (1) 99:3 5:2;36:16;39:19,20
authorized (3) Bergeron (40) 24:22 California (2) CHAJRWOMAN (69)
10:12;1 1217;19:12 4:12,17,18;5:9;9:8; breach (1) 57:12;69:1 4:2;5:23;6:10,16,
available (2) 12:21;13:4,9,23;14:4, 75:5 call (13) 19,25;7:5,14;10:1,24;
81 :18,18 14,22;15:2,19,23; break (3) 34:4;40:1 1;62:14; 11:1,8,12,21,24;
average (2) 16:2,11,22;17:14,17, 5:16,17;39:22 68:8;69:6;81:21; 12:11,15,20;13:11,
44:7;46:2 22,25;18:9;20:1; breakfast (1) 82:5,7,9,24;83:7; 15,21;14:16,20;15:1,
aware (8) 22:9;25:17;29:17; 73:15 8422;86z9 13;16:21;17:20;18:2,
48:23;49:3;51:13; 30:15;36:9;37:2; Brief (1) called (2) 7;25:19;26:5;27:14;
78:20;79:7,10,24; 40:6;41 :2,8,1 1,17; 109:22 93:21;107:7 28:16,20,24;29:4;
106:25 45:3;53:25;66:4; bring (8) came (3) 30:12;32:12;35:7,20;
away (1) 67:7,16 6:8;47:22;49:25; 57:1,12;98:16 36:1 1,15;38:5;39:16,
53:8 besides (2) 50:11,15;56:22; can (61) 21 ;40:2,15;41:3;
8:12;90:15 57:21;99:11 5:25;7:19;8:19; 45:2;53:10,22;63:17,
B beyond (1) bringing (2) 9:14,25;10220,22; 20;66:7;75:7,10,23;
31:4 26:5;48z3 11:25;13:1 1;18:4; 76:5,9;83:12,17,24;
back (18) big (4) brought (6) 21:1;26:22,23;28:6, 84:5,10;104:19;
44:8;61:12,16;
62:9;63:16,23;66:1 1;
69:1,21;76:11;80:21;
82:7;86:15;87:2,6;
98:4;104:23;109:7
back-door (2)
44:24;88:6
backed (1)
88:3
bad (2)
26:12;33:18
band (1)
105216
Bank (9)
16:19;20:5,15;
32:21,22;39:8,8;
51:8;58:22
bar (3)
28:25;33:16;87:2
Barone (12)
25:20,20;32:7,10;
39:23;53:17;68:12,
13;75:9;78:5;84:13,
22barring (2)
86:12,14
base (1)
87:25
based (2)
40:16;73:19
basis (2)
10:12;15:3
Bates—stamping (1)
34:18,19;49:18;
54:20
Bill (1)
86:17
bills (2)
63:13;107:11
birth (2)
15:24;41:18
bit (1)
41:22
black (1)
74:4
blank (2)
7:1;58225
blatant (2)
3 1:17;32:5
blind (1)
39:12
board (6)
7:19;28:13;32:2;
35:10;36:13;38:4
board's (1)
53:1
body (1)
28:21
bogus (1)
88:23
borrower (11)
51:15,16;61:5;
77:1,1;81:17;82:6,7,
18;86:23;108:1
Borrowers (4)
21:16;77:13;83:4,5
6:12;31:22;50:14;
57:6,15;63:6
browbeafing (2)
68:3,4
bucks (l)
34:20
building (1)
109224
bump (1)
79:18
bunch (6)
33:4;60:22;79:9,
10,16,17
buries (1)
45:21
Business (11)
33:18;42:1,23;
49:2;68:20;69:12;
77:15;78:17;90:9,13,
16
buyer (25)
33:4;49:21;50:9;
51:16;52:6;55:1,19;
71:15;76:2;78:2;
80:3,17,24;85:18,25;
91 :9,22,24,25 ;92: 14,
22;94:17;99:4,6;
100:3
buyers (16)
17:3;33:12;34:8;
56:4;60:7;71:16;
73:20;74:15;91:12;
94:15;95:6,7,8;
9;30:6;31:7;32:7,25;
33:2;35:4,13,15,16,
17,17;36:1 1;37:9;
38:5,6,6;39:8,22;
42:16;43:24;45:7,14,
22;52:25;54:9,9;
56:15;59:18;61:5;
62:14;75:7;82:7;
83:5,12;86:3;87:20;
89:2,20;98:4;101:6,
6;104:8,21;105:20;
107:5;109:15
candor (1)
47:24
capacity (1)
19:21
care (1)
72:16
Carolyn (4)
25:20;68:13;75:7;
76:10
Carta (2)
15:9;28:2
case (22)
14:13;15:17;25:18;
27:9,9;30:17,19;31:1,
4;33:22;38:20,20;
39:13;40:6,1 1,14,15;
80:6,12g98215;
105:23;109:8
cases (4)
62:7;69:6;76:24;
94:17
107:20;108:22;
109: 19,23
chance (1)
32:12
chapter (1)
27: 1 8
characterization (1)
14:1 1
charge (3)
6:2;43:5;75:3
charges (2)
7225;24:23
Chase (9)
16:19;20:4,12,15,
21;58:13,18;60:24;
108:7
Chase's (1)
108:8
chat (2)
39:22;109:21
check (3)
63:11,12;99:11
Chicago (2)
78:23;79:4
Chief (2)
26:10;29:25
choice (1)
86: 1 0
choose (1)
5 1 : 1 8
circumstances (1)
39:2citation (l)
PfimU-Scrég: é® Allied Court Reporters, Inc. (401)946-550011: Dunn“, A‘mnun {‘roncfnn DI 0707.0 www.alliedcnurtrennrters.com
(2) attorneys ~ citation
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SIP7‘
9/5/2b1 8 8:44 AM
Hearing William E. Paplauskas, Jr.
March 1, 2017
28:1 34:20;35:12,12; 108:4,5 26:24 55:11
claim (l) 43:19,21;44:10;46:2, compare (1) consider (2) council (1)
12:8 4,14,20;47:2,8;48:16, 52:18 5:13;14:17 31:23
clarify (3) 25;49:3,1 1:62:11; compel (6) consideration (4) counsel (4)
28:6;37:18;66:10 69:15;70:6;76:21; 26:7,20,25;29:22; 8:15;1 1:7;36:10; 4:18;8:16,21;80:3
clause (6) 79:14;80:1,2;81:6; 30:15:3222 53:1 country (1)
72:24;73:1,2; 83:14,19,21;84:1,7; compelling (2) considered (l) 70:21
76:12,12,15 85:14,17;90:15;91:3, 15:1 1;29:10 52:15 couple (2)
clear (6) 6,6,1 1,13;94:10; compensated (l) consist (1) 78:12,13
27:19;38:1;95:3; 100:16 80:14 74:21 course (3)
103:1,3;109:16 clued (1) competition (1) constitute (1) 67:24;76:19;92:19
clearly (3) 85:7 33:18 7:24 Court (34)
9:5;30:22;53:5 College (1) compile (1) constitutes (2) 4:23;7:15;8: 17,22;
client (20) 47:13 35:23 11:16;12:1 9:24;11:25,25;15:22;
8:20,24;9:25; comfortable (1) complain (2) constitutional (1) 26: 1 8;27: 12,14;28:4,
10:14;11:6;26:23; 85:20 108:12,13 26:4 11,14,16,22,23;29:2,
29: 17:30:21 ;34:12; coming (6) complainant (1) consult (1) 21,23;30:1, 10;3 1 :1,2,
35:11,14;36:3;40:5, 14:10;22:6;45:6; 38:11 5:14 5;33:22;35:24;37:12;
12,16;41:1;52:22; 64:24;65:6;77:3 complaint (51) contact (14) 38:24;40:22;44:24;
82:13;94:24;108:20 COMJVIENCED (1) 4:4;5:3,9,12;7:17, 42:19;48:10;49:22; 86:21;87:9,23
clients (1) 4:1 18;8:3,4,6,6;9:10,12, 51:8,9,10,1 1;69:17; Court's (1)
42:24 comments (1) 18,24;10:4,6,15,19; 71 :24;76:25;77:1,2, 7:8
client's (4) 85:8 11:3,5;13:7,10,13,16, 6;83:25 cover (9)
11:14;27:22;65:1; Commitment (1) 25;14:6,12,13,18,19; contacted (1) 22:12;95:1,19;
92:15 24:10 26:18,19;27:8;32:17; 48:5 96:12,21;97:21,23,
close (3) committed (3) 35:21;36:19,19;38:9, contacts (1) 24;98:1
25:18;30:21;87:12 36:24;88:13,14 10,13;44:18;47:16, 49:8 covers (1)
closer (4) Committee (37) 17,20;55:24;84:24; containing (1) 94:3
41:21;43:4;79:19, 4:4,5,13,19,20,24; 88:6,23,24;89:9,17 8:13 credit (5)
20 5:1,13;6:14;7:13,17, complaints (1) contains (1) 32:23;39:6,9;
closes (l) 20,22;8:7;13:5,24; 10:3 31:17 50:19;91:14
109:24 14:5;17:12;21:1,23; Compliance (1) contention (3) crime (2)
closing (117) 24:16;25:8;29:20; 21:22 88:2;89:8,22 88:13,14
5:10;11:14,15; 31:24;36:7,13,18; Compton (2) contest (1) criminals (l)
12:12,13,14;17:4; 37:6;40:1,24;45:9,13, 31:1;38:19 102:13 87:5
18:21;19:3,4,8,13,17, 25;58:10;66:5;85:3,5 concerns (1) continue (1) crooked (1)
18;20:14;24:24;25:1; committee's (12) 10:21 45:22 86:24
33:4,6;34:3;35:16; 5:11;17:1;18:11; conclusion (1) control (1) cross-examination (1)
36:25;39:5;43:6; 20:17,23;22:18,22; 35:22 65:20 40:13
44:14,16,22;47:16, 23:9,13,19;24:1,21 conducted (5) convenience (2) cross—examine (1)
18,25;48:2,3,4,22,25; common (7) 11:20;18:22;31:12; 2721,22 32:4
49:10,14,25;50:8,12, 31:6,10;38:16,23; 33:25;35:13 convenient (1) Cruz (1)
15,16,21;51:13,20; 39:3;51:22;64:8 conducting (3) 110:2 86:18
52:10,19;53:15,23; communicate (1) 5:10;32:19;36:16 conversation.(2) curious (3)
54:6,17,22;55:13,16; 83:1 conducts (1) 5922,24 9:3;29:23;84:23
56:1,3,22;57:6,23; communicated (1) 32:23 conversations (1) current (1)
59:17, 19;60:8,8; 45:12 conference (8) 65:3 41:20
62:9;68:16;70:1; communication (1) 55:14,17;56:13; copied (1) custom (2)
71:16;72:15,18,22; 72:10 59:24;64:13,18; 57:13 32:18;34:11
73:1,10,12;74:5,14; communications (1) 72:20;83:9 copies (4) customarily (3)
76:22;77:14;80:4,10, 4:11 conformance (1) 50:1 1;64:13; 12:2,8;3 1 :8
13,13;81:11,14,15, companies (13) 10:2 105:15,16 customary (1)
23;82:1,9;83:9,10; 34:19;42:21;43:9; conglomerate (1) copy (10) 10:2
85:17;86:2,4,14,22; 68:20,22,23,23; 48:17 5:21;6:2;10:14;
91:21,24;92:3;95:4; 69:12,14,17;70:20, Conn (19) 58:25;105:10,12,17, D98:16,17;100:17,22; 20;71:7 49:23:5111 1;55:2, 20;106:12,14
101:4;102:],6,8,9,10, company (28) 18,24;56:4,1 1,14; corporate (l) dad (1)
13,17,23;103:13; 54:19;58:2;63:24; 59:21;60:1;72:5,6,14, 42:23 26:16
105:3,10;106:17; 65:4;68:16;70:5,14, 19;77:2,4;84:17; Corporation (1) dark (5)
107:16;108:10 15,15,17,18,25,25; 106:6;109:4 20:9 51:16;71:15,18,19,
closings (46) 71 :4,4,6,8,10;78:1; consecutive (1) Correction (1) 23 7
11:19;3 1 :12;32:19; 79:4;80:18,19;88:8; 22:24 23:24 date (5)
33:17,23,24,24; 90:19;92:7;101:22; consequences (1) cost (1) 10:18;15:24;32:3;
Allied Court Reporters, Inc. (401)946-55001 1: nLnna. Annunn Franck". DI 000’)“ www olliadnnurtrpnnrfprernm
(3) claim — date
9/5/201 8 8:44 AM
Hearing William E. Paplauskas, Jr.
March 1, 2017
41:18;59:11 detail (1) 13;19:9,18;21 2,4,17, due (15) entity (2)
dated (2) 98:2 21;22:1,2,3,9,19,20, 5:17;15:12;17:6; 71:6;80:14
4:5;14:6 details (l) 25;23:1,3,7,10,12,16, 27:2,5,6,8,1 1;54:7; envelope (2)
day (5) 21:17 20,24,24;24:2,4,6,10, 74:25,25;89:5,19; 63:18,22
45:17,]8;53:7; determination (1) 13,16,1 8,19,21,25; 95:25;97:1 8 envision (2)
7218,10 10:7 25:3,6;56:19,20,22, duly (1) 52:2,4
days (1) determine (6) 24,25;57:1,8,10,12, 18:14 envisioned (1)
49:16 6:22;7:25;11:9,13; 15;58:4,24;59:4,12, during (4) 8:6
deal (5) 12:1;31:3 15,25;60:13,20;64:1, 5:15;19:16;85:16; equity (2)
49:5,6;71:10,1 1; dial (1) 3,5;67:10,19,22;74:3, 103:12 50:19;91:14
77:16 82:21 17,18;75:12,20,24; duties (1) Error (1)
dealing (1) differ (1) 92:12;95:15;101:13; 7:21 21:22
62:6 70:17 102:12,15;103:15; Escrow (2)
dealings (1) difference (1) 108:1,8 E 24:14;65:21
78:18 52:13 documents (83) essentially (1)
deals (1) different (3) 5:21;13:4,6;16:12, Earlier (3) 12:22
80:22 29:9,11;50:18 17,22;17:15;18:24; 60:22;85:8;86:10 estate (22)
dealt (1) direct (3) 19:4,13;20:4,5,8,I3, ease (1) 5: 10;]8:16,19,21,
84:2 8:15;30:20;71:9 17,20,25;21:2;22:1 1, 20:22 25;19:3,4,5,8,13,16,
decide (2) directing (1) 13,14,17;25:8;33:5,7, eat (l) 17;33:17;39:5;43:19,
12:3;39:20 36:7 10,14;42:20;48:3; 43:16 21;46:13;47:2;63:14;
decided (2) directions (1) 49:25;50:5,10,13,15, educational (1) 73:1;76:20;89:18
49:7;64zl9 102:5 17,17,23;51:7;52:8; 41:23 estimate (l)
decision (l) directly (2) 56:9;59:1;60:23; effort (2) 43 :24
39:17 51:8;71210 61:13,18,23,25;62:3, 17:8;110:5 even (14)
Deed (17) directories (1) 16,20;63:3,6;65:18, either (8) 9:17,17;12:2,9;
25:6;33:3;64:2; 93:12 23;67:3,9;73:21,24; 9:14;38:22;47:5; 29:13,15;30:21;31:5;
77:7;105:23,24; DISANTO (4) 74:9,16;85:18;94:12, 61 :1;78:23;85:18,18; 34:3;46:25;49:17;
106:1,7,12,14,16,24; 78:7,10;83:6;84:11 15,21,23;95:9,12,14; 91:21 74:5;75:23;104:12
107:2,2;109:5,8,16 disciplinary (1) 97:2,4,14;98:9,1 1; else (7) everybody's (1)
Deeds (2) 31:23 100:8,13;101:5; 72:17;83:23;89:14; 22:11
75:14;107:14 disclose (1) 102:4,7,8,16;10524, 91:17,25;96:24; everyone (1)
defective (1) 52:23 10;107:16;108:14 104:5 110:5
107:3 disclosed (1) done (18) elucidate (1) evidence (17)
deficiencies (1) 54:18 10:23,25;12:2,5, 37:25 4:10;5:19,23;
40:23 Disclosure (6) 23;20:20;32:24; e~mail (4) 25:16;30:6,7,20;
define (1) 23:2;24:14;50:22; 34:16;42:14;51:13; 50:3,4,5;105:14 32:18;33:1 1;34:7,10;
12:14 54:18;74:5;98:17 56:1;66:19;80z22; e-mafled (1) 38:12,14;88:22,25;
definitely (3) disclosures (1) 86:22;88:20;90:17, 50:1 89:7;104:9
53:6;55:19;56:6 98:16 21;108:4 employed (1) evidently (2)
definitive (l) discovery (1) doors (1) 43:12 69: 10;72: 16
6:17 32:11 90:20 employee (4) exact (3)
delay (2) discuss (4) double (1) 43:10;58:13,1 7; 10:18;79:1 7,23
59:18;65:14 17:4;19:12;101:23; 104:12 68:18 exactly (3)
delineates (1) 110:4 down (2) employment (1) 12:8;29:21;93:9
30:24 discussed (2) 82:21;103:2 68:19 EXAMINATION (6)
deliver (2) 40:3;51117 drag (1) encouraged (1) 41:17;66:9;68:12; 1
62:18;92:11 discussing (l) 35:1 34:9 78:7;85:1;87:1 6
denied (1) 59:25 dragged (2) end (4) example (l)
40:3 dismiss (1) 34:15,21 18:3;35:10;62:8; 75:11
deny (3) 38:9 dragging (2) 66:8 exceed (1)
9:14;31:19;36:6 dismissed (1) 34:17;35:14 ended (1) 31:3
department (8) 32:1 7 draw (6) 86:16 Excellent (l)
20:3;48:9,10,1 1; dispute (1) 20:23;23:9,13,18, engaged (3) 42:6
86:19,20;88:4,21 61:4 25:24:20 4:21;5:5;10:10 except (4)‘
depending (3) disputing (1) drawing (1) enough (3) 20:9;26:10;33:10;
43:6;50:12,20 29:14 7:1 53:4;59:12;67:5 61:16
depose (1) distinguishing (1) drew (1) entire (2) exchange (1)
18:15 33:23 109:5 72:20;83:10 107211
depositions (1) doctor (1) drive (1) entirety (1) exclusions (1)
107213 101:20 72:12 56:9 7:4
describe (1) document (76) drugs (1) entitled (1) exclusive (3)
71:3 9:12;14:10;16:2, 67:11 6:1 7:8;29:5;42:23
Allied Court Reporters, Inc. (401)946—550011: bunniv Amman Pramhm. DI 07.07.11 www.alliedcnnrtrenorters.c0m
(4) dated - exclusive
Hearing
9/5/201 8 8:44 AM
William E. Paplauskas, Jr.
March 1, 2017
exclusively (3)
46:13;90:24;91:20
excuse (4)
16:14;45:2;63:4;
89:5
executing (1)
18:24
executive (2)
39:23;40:1
Exhibit (42)
13:1,1,2,2,3,3,6,23;
14:3,3,4,21,21;16:5,
5,6,6,7,7,13,23,23,24,
25;19:23,23,24,24,
25,2530: 1,7,10,1 1;
22:8,8,10;56:18;
64:1;72z25g94z21;
98:9
exhibits (3)
12:25;16:4;25:12
existence (1)
21:2
experience (6)
43:18;46:1;73:19;
81:5;82:16;83:8
experiences (2)
73:20;78:17
expert (1)
3 1 : 1 0
experts (l)
38:17
explain (5)
68:9;82:12;85:24;
97:16,20
explained (4)
95:16,23;106:16;
107:16
explaining (1)
100:7
explanation (1)
95:1
explicit (1)
3 1 :23
extensive (1)
38:21
extremely (1)
55:10
F
face (1)
88:11
facetious (1)
53:21
facilitating (1)
76:20
fact (10)
8:25;12:4;40:4;
77:13;89:14,16;90:5,
8;102:4;109:24
facts (8)
8:8;17:12;30:19;
88:2,]6;89:21;90:7,
10
fails (1)
30:19
fair (3)
34:14;91:19;92:21
fairly (1)
64:8
false (3)
31:20,24;45:19
falsehoods (3)
31:17,23;32:5
familiar (1)
75:25
far (7)
46:18;49:14;69:22;
77:7,9;98:18;108:18
farce (1)
35:10
fast (l)
27:20
FCC (3)
86:20;88:4,21
federal (1)
33:6
federally (1)
33:5
FedEx (4)
62:18,22;63:22;
65:13
Fee (6)
24:20,24;53:24;
54:18;94:3;96:2
feel (2)
10:9;37:14
Fees (3)
24:7;34:16;53:14
few (10)
4:19;20:17;22:17;
37:19;49:16;69:22;
78:8;80:21;85:12;
101:21
Fidelity (4)
48:15;78:24;79:3,5
figured (1)
73:16
figures (l)
85:12
file (3)
45:19;65:18;84:24
filed (5)
5:4;13:7;27:7;
44:17;89:9
filings (1)
12:23
fill (1)
17:8
filled (2)
58:8,9
final (5)
22:9,11,24;60:18;
95:25
finance (1)
90:19
financial (1)
75:21
find (9)
26:3;27:1;29:19;
31:6;44:18;45:15;
76:15;87:3;88:11
finds (1)
4:24
finish (8)
56:]6;57:2;63:2;
87:20;95:8;100:12;
105:2;107:9
first (20)
6:1 1,13;7:1 1;
14:16;15:4;16:12,24;
17:25;20:19;25:1,3;
40:12;59:4;60:23;
70:9;74:24;75:2;
95:24;97:1,5
firsthand (1)
44:19
first—fime (l)
60:7
five (5)
44:2;46:10;73:9;
76:13;87:1
flood (2)
98:1,2
floor (1)
25:13
Florida (1)
91:16
flow (1)
26:24
flying (1)
39:12
follow (l)
75:8
following (l)
40:20
follows (2)
10:4;18:15
follow-up (3)
78:13;84:6,14
Forget (1)
30:22
form (10)
19:14;27:1;96:1 1,
16,18,20;97:21;
101:15;103:16,17
formality (1)
27:11
formed (1)
36:21
forms (1)
96:11
forth (2)
8:7;9:13
forthcoming (1)
20:5
forward (1)
37:23
found (1)
36:22
four (8)
46:17;61:19;73:8;
74:8,15;79:19,21;
90:10
four-page (1)
23:12
frankly (5)
29:15;31:21;32:1,
16;107:15
free (4)
53:16,18,20;67:13
freelance (1)
43:15
front (8)
22:12;23:3;52:9;
74:6,10,17;95:13;
98:12
full (4)
14:3,15,21;42:17
fuller (1)
45:9
function (8)
4:20;5:12;6:21,22;
7:6,7;29:1,2
functioning (1)
42:12
fundamentally (2)
2722;29:11
funding (3)
65:15;70:25;71:1
funds (1)
86:24
further (9)
12:17;25:12,14;
37:8;77:12;78:5;
84:12;87:15;88:17
good (4)
54:10;66:4;86:10;
103:3
governed (1)
33:5
governing (2)
7: 1 6;28:11
governs (3)
33:6,8,9
graduate (1)
41 :25
granddaughter (2)
53 :9;67:4
grant (1)
34:1
Great (2)
66:25;1 10:8
group (1)
109:21
grunt (1)
69: 19
guess (9)
10:5;1 1 :2;38:4,20;
53:22;79:6;85:15;
89:23;94:3
guessing (1)
100:23
guy (7)
15:18;26:13;35:4,
19;39:14;91:5,7
guys (2)
9:20;45:20
HH74662 (1)
86: 1 7
GHailey (17)
49:23;51:10;55:1,
gave (13)
8:24;1 1:6;49z21,
22;58:25;60:1 1;73:4;
87:2;94:23;95:12;
105:12;106:7,12
general (5)
18:6;45:10;63:8,8,
10
generally (9)
42:18;48:13;49:15,
17;67:16;73:11,17;
81:16;100:18
gentleman (l)
37:21
gets (4)
61:20;62:7;75:13;
103:2
GILLIGAN (2)
66:9;68:11
given (3)
10:14;97:1;106:1
giving (1)
8:14
18;64:4;65:2;72:5,5,
6,14;77:2,4;84:17;
106:4,5,6;109:4
half (1)
37:11
hall (1)
61 :21
Hallee (1)
72:5
hand (7)
33:3;60;6;61:19;
82:5,12;92:12;94:18
handed (4)
59:8;64:3;77:10;
109:9
handful (1)
80:23
handing (1)
56:18
handle (1)
45:20
handled (1)
46:19handling (6)
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(5) exclusively — handling
WWHearing William E. Paplauskas, Jr.
March 1, 2017
11:14;12:11,13,14; 69:10 5:1 107:23,25 investment (1)
36:16,25 himself (3) impressed (1) instruct (1) 47:6
handwritten (1) 62:13;81 :17;84:3 38:25 37:13 invite (1)
58:18 hire (3) inappropriate (1) Instructions (4) 26:23
hang (1) 34:9;69:14;108:11 9:19 25:2,4;49:19;102:9 invited (1)
34:6 hired (4) included (1) instrumental (1) 27:10
happen (5) 49:14;80:22;102:1, 33:17 86:5 inviting (l)
80: 1 1,1 1 ;86: 1; 10 Including (2) instruments (1) 110:4
88:18;107:3 hires (1) 56:11;86:16 107:14 invoke (1)
happened (5) 70:15 Indeed (l) insurance (16) 30:7
10:18;11:15;39:2; hiring (2) 17:17 78:21,22;79:1; involved (8)
44:20;49:22 34:8,20 independent (1) 95:2,20;96:4,8,13,15, 8:22;38:19;44:15;
happens (6) historically (1) 66:13 20,21;97:17,20,22, 53:7;62:7;77:4;
75:4;81:16;100:16, 31:12 Independently (1) 25;98:2 81:10;86:18
18,24;107:1 history (3) 79: 13 intemperate (1) involvement (1)
Hard (1) 41:23,23;86:22 indicated (8) 8:12 65:24
42:5 hold (3) 19:10;36:3,6;61:9; intended (1) Island (36)
Harmless (10) 7:25;67:19;73:2 68:15;69:2;77:11; 19:5 18:17,23;19:1;
16:14,15;19:14; home (6) 97:6 interaction (1) 29:6;31:13;33:8,9;
56:19;67:20;72:24, 50:19;60:7;77:15; indicates (3) 64:17 34:24;39:3,4;41:14;
25;73:2;76:1 1; 91:14;105:1 1,20 10:19;25:22;36:1 interest (4) 46:5,20,21;47:1,4,5,
101:12 honorable (2) indicating (3) 74:4,24;75:1;96:1 9,10,12,14;51:17;
Harmless' (1) 41:13;85:10 52:23;86:9;108:1 interested (1) 68:25;69:23;70:1;
19:9 hope (2) indication (1) 86:11 79:8;83:14,20;86:21;
Harwood (l) 29:20;40:21 98:8 interesting (7) 87:22;91:1 1,18,18;
86: 16 horse (2) indirect (1) 9:9;28z2g44: 1 8; 92:25;107:6;108:7
head (1) 89:12,13 8:16 45:16;62:10;87:3; Islander (1)
56:12 hour (4) individual (3) 88:11 72: 11
hear (3) 73:1 1,18,23; 7:19,19;10:10 interrogation (1) issue (5)
37:16,]7,20 109:24 individuals (2) 108:19 6:13;8:9,13;32:2;
heard (3) house (3) 17:16;42:24 interrupt (3) 54:11
27:7;58:14;108:23 77:21,22;96:9 industry (2) 37:10;83:13;84:6 issued (1)
HEARING (21) HUD (11) 35:15;90:22 interrupting (1) 7:18
4:1,9,25;5:15,18, 50:21;54:17;78:3, information (6) 103:4 issues (2)
25;10:12,13;15:11, 4;82:12;98:14,18,22; 17:2;18:11;24:17; into (14) 6:3,7
15;25:23;26:8;27:1; 99:6,13,24 52:16,24;53:2 18:1;20:10;22:7; issuing (1)
29:13;32:3,15;35:22; HUD-l (1) Initial (5) 25:9;36:10;39:23; 110:6
36:1;37:1;45:4; 22:20 24:14;61:22;74:19; 45:11;46:1;55:7;
110: 10 husband (4) 75:15,16 68:4;79:18;97:22,25; Jhearings (1) 17:2;68:2,4;83:3 initialed (1) 98:2
7:25 19:17 introduce (9) jail (4)
hearsay (2) I initials (5) 12:22;25:12;69:6; 30:3;86:17;87:1,1
8:13;]04: 12 22:23;23:4;24:16, 81:20,22;82:6,l7,20; Janet (1)
Held (11) ID (10) 18;61:11 84:3 48:12
16:14,15;19:9,14; 13:1,2,3;16:5,6,7; initiate (2) introduced (3) job (6)
56:19;60:6;72:24,25; 19:23,24,25;22:8 82:9,24 16:18;71:21,22 35:22;43:1;55:11;
76:1 1,23; 1 0 1 : 12 idea (13) initiative (1) introduces (2) 66: 12;87: 1 1 ,13
help (2) 65:2;71:23;72:3; 57:21 62:13;81:17 Joe (1)
37:18,25 73:9, 15:76: 14;77:25; input (l) investigate (3) 77:20
hey (1) 89:23;97:10;100:3; 17:9 4:21;7:23;10:21 John (6)
94:19 105:1;106:15,20 inside (1) investigated (1) 4:6;5:4;18:22;
Hi (1) Identification (2) 75:17 32:1 70:6;84:15;86:16
83:6 21:16;23:17 instance (4) investigating (2) jointly (1)
hide (1) impairing (1) 48:19;50:24;51:6; 35:21;36:18 18:20
71:21 67:12 63:7 investigation (4) JP (1)
high (5) impartial (7) instances (4) 4:25;12:16;30:13; 108:13
28:3;41 :24,25,25; 43:10;52:4;66:15, 43:8;60:25;62:2; 37:4 JPMorgan (12)
42:3 16,17;67: 1;94:13 67:25 investigational (3) 16:19;20:4,12,15,
higher (2) implement (1) Instead (1) 5: 18;1 0: 13:15:14 20;51:7;58:13,18;
79:21 ;93:8 29:2 88:10 investigative (1) 60:23 ;71:25;108:7,8
highlight (1) important (1) institution (2) 45:4 Jr (6)
20:16 103:1 48:19;50:25 invesfigatory (1) 18:23;19:2,19,21;
highly (1) impose (1) institution's (2) 4:9 41 :7;58:12
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9/5/201 8 8:44 AM
Hearing William E. Paplauskas, Jr.
March 1, 2017
judge (1) later (3) 44:15;88:24,24;89:8, look (6) 75:17
29:25 16:18;67:15;89:20 9,14;90:3 ~ 7:2;12:2;27:24; mark (2)
judges (1) Law (46) letterhead (2) 60:13;74:18;75:15 12:24;16:3
87:10 4:3,22;6:15;7:3,9, 20:12;22:12 looked (2) marked (l9)
judgment (1) 24;8:9,17,21,25; liar (l) 7:3;60:4 13:1,2,3;14:3,21;
67:12 10:1 1;1 1:7,16;l2:1, 105:7 looking (2) 16:5,6,7,13,23;19:23,
judicial (3) 4;18:22;26: 15;27:16, license (2) 72:25;75:16 24,2520: 1,1 1 ;22:8,
7:7;8:17,23 17;29:6;30:22,25; 87:2,6 lost (1) 10;56:18;63:25
judiciary (2) 33:6,8,9;34:l3; licensing (1) 53:7 market (3)
6:21;7:6 36:24;38:15;39:3,10; 29:5 Lot (12) 69:5;70:19;71:7
judiciary's (1) 42:6,8;44:21,23,25; light (2) 18:18;26:15,16; marketed (2)
7:7 46:23;84:20;87:6,7,9, 109:19,23 33:16;55:12;61:7; 49:8;69:2
July (5) 23;103:7;107:13,13; limited (2) 66:25;88:6;89:18; marketing (1)
5:10;18:21;19:3; 108:16,17 66:23;83:25 90:8,21;94:25 72:4
47:17;49:16 laws (1) line (13) Mass (1)
Junior (1) 27:19 24:3,1 1,22,23; M 83:20
4:7 lawyer (14) 25:3;32:23;39:6,9; Massachusetts (25)
jurisdiction (2) 12:6;85:6;86:1,2,5; 50:19;58:4,9;69:16; ma'am (9) 9:6;33:21,22;34:2;
7:8;2925 91:8;92:15;94:22; 79:8 68:25;72:9,1 1,21, 46:8,9,13,19,22,23;
jurisprudence (l)
15 : 1 0
Justice (4)
86:19,20;88:4,21
Kkept (5)
51:15;71:15,18,19,
23
kill (1)
43:16
ldnd (4)
48:13;60:4;67:12;
101222
knew (3)
31 :24;77:2,3
knocking (1)
90:19
knocks (1)
42:5
knowledge (2)
9:6;44:19
known (1)
69:7
knows (1)
26:15
L
label (1)
63:23
lady (1)
48:8
large (l)
22: 11
largest (2)
51 :22;72:1
last (7)
38:8;42:15;44:2,6;
66:20;70:10;74:25
late (4)
47:19;75:3;96:2;
109:24
103:14,16,20;104:6;
106:5,19
lawyers (7)
12:3,9;26:10;27:3;
31:8,12;86:7
least (l)
51:24
leave (4)
56:14;62:17;64:15;
65:9
leaving (2)
56:2;62:24
left (8)
55:10,25;56:1,12;
59:24;64:18,19;
65:11
legal (7)
9:3,5;26:9;27:1;
33:14;34:5,16
legally (1)
52:24
legislation (1)
86:12
legislator (4)
35:4;87:8;88:19;
90:6
legislature (2)
86:15;88:3
lender (3)
58:22,23;63:23
lenders (1)
49:5
lending (6)
48:18,18;50:24;
58:2;107:23,25
less (4)
54:14;63:15;79:22;
93:6
letter (27)
8:5,1 1;9:16;10:3,
15;11:3;13:24;14:5,
6,19;15:6;24:1 I;
29:25;30:1;31:16,17;
32:6;35:2,3;38:10;
lines (3)
58:10;91:14;
108:21
list (2)
69:14,18
listed (4)
53:23;70:4;93:12,
14
listening (1)
83:10
listing (2)
58:21;94:5
listings (1)
93:23
Little (9)
31:1;35:18;38:19;
41 :22;46:19;67:15;
91:1,2g93t8
live (2)
46:20;47:5
lives (2)
51:23;100:16
living (1)
47:12
Loan (20)
23:1 1;24:7;57:25;
58:1,5,12,16;62:5,8;
65:15;68:8,9;74:24;
75:21;85:23;90:18,
18;95:23;97:23;
99:19
local (1)
91:15
located (3)
18:16,25;68:24
location (1)
17:7
Lock~In (1)
24:3
long (5)
42:1 1,16;51:12;
73:10,19
longer (3)
39:9;91:1,2
23;73:3,13;76:7,18
MACIASZ (3)
78:7,10;84:11
Magna (2)
15:9;28:2
mail (1)
65:16
mailed (1)
65:23
Majewski (27)
9:2;16:25;17:1,2;
18:12,14,20;19:22;
21:5,8,12,18,19,24;
22:4;23:1,6,10,14,15,
20,23;24:2,5,9,12;
61:2
Majewskis (18)
17:6,9;56:4;58:24;
60:1;61:10;63:5;
95:4;96:8;103:13,14;
104:2,3,1 1,24,25;
105:2,11
Majewski's (3)
18:13;21:9,14
makes (2)
45:20;91 :6
making (2)
34:19;35:8
man (2)
35:2;108:12
manager (3)
32:22;39:8;90:18
manner (3)
26:1;35:18;40:24man's (1)
108:9
manure (2)
8912,13many (7)
43:24;44:1,2,6;
60:25;70:6;90:24
March (1)
14:7
margins (1)
47:2,6,8,1 1;62: 1 1,1 1;
81:6,1 1,25;82:2,17;
83:15,20,21;84:1
materials (4)
37:3;63:18,21;94:8
math (1)
66:23
matter (3)
51:3,4;53:15
matters (2)
107:10,12
may (20)
7:23;11:15;26:24;
31:3;33:24,25;46:10;
61:19;63:11;70:3;
75:18;78:15,15;
85:13;91:25;97:7;
98:14,14;104:11;
107:8
maybe (14)
28:8,9;29:21;30:8;
49:17,17;53:15;
69:24;78:24;80:23;
81:25;91:1;108:15,
15
mean (19)
26:9,22;27:3;28:1,
3;35:2;37:8;52:6,17;
53:7;60:6;73:15;
78:3;81 :22;86:2;
91:25;94:25;104:12;
105:5
means (4)
37:8;47:10;94:19;
103:21
meant (1)
94:18
meeting (1)
4:3
meetings (3)
6:15,20;7:3
Megan (5)
78:10;82:22;83:6,
12;84:5
Ifi’iin-U-Scriptfiy Allied Court Reporters, Inc. (401)946-550011< phoniv Avnmm Pranafnn. RI 02020 www.alliedcnnrtrenorters.com
(7) judge - Megan
WW1 8 MMM—
Hearing William E. Paplauskas, Jr.
March 1, 2017
Member (10) 7829,11 7:1 1;16:2,1 1,22; numbers (2) 21 :22
25:20;29:8;37:5; move (6) 58:9,10;62:8 58:7;98:18 once (4)
45:24;76:17;85:2,5; 14:15;18:3;37:21; nice (3) numerous (1) 18:4;48:11;61:11;
93:25;94:1,1 39:17;45:14;70:4 41:16;85:9,11 48:25 62:15
members (1) moving (2) nonattorneys (1) one (49)
33:16 35:9;38z9 86:14‘ O 7:22;8:13;15:19;
membership (1) Mrs (7) none (2) 27:20;31:25;41:10;
94:3 17:2;21:19,24; 34:10;70:8 oath (2) 46:8;50:8,8;51:15,
mentioned (1) 22:4;23:1,6;61:2 Nonrefundability (1) 18:14;32:4 25;53:16,17,20;
17:13 much (12) 24:7 object (10) 54:10;55:2,15;56:6;
Met (6) 10:19;41:15;43:5; nor (1) 5:23;13:8,12; 61 :14,18;64:15;
21:3;62:24;72:8; 52:12,17;54:4;61 :6, 52:5 14:1 1;102:18;104:8, 69:22,24;70:5,8,8,9,
75:25;76:3,8
middle (2)
2428,21
middleperson (1)
70:24
might (3)
10:21;33:1;52:23
mind (1)
109:20
mindful (1)
30:25
minute (1)
85:19
minutes (11)
38:9;62:12;73:8,8,
9,1 1,17,23;74:8,15;
82:23
missed (1)
91:10
moment (2)
96:7;109:21
money (8)
46:19;64:25;65:20;
67:6;71:1;78:1;
99:10,19
month (4)
44:7;46:2,3;66:22
months (1)
37:17
more (12)
15:20;16:4;25:10;
26:15;34:22;35:17;
48:13;55:15;68:20;
71 :9;72:12;108:21
Mortgage (22)
22:1,3;24:10;25:1;
32:21;33:10,10;
35:17;39:6;41:21;
42:1;49:2;61:17,17,
19,20;75:12,13;
90:13,16,21;108:4
most (11)
26:10;51:23;61:18;
69:6,24;72:2;76:24;
77:13;91 :13;94:17;
100:16
motion (14)
31:19;34:1;35:8;
36:6,8,10,17;38:3,6;
39:18,24;40:3,3,14
mouthful (2)
8;71:9;73:7;84:12;
99:10
multiple (3)
50:1 1;61:17;78:17
must (2)
9:21;30:1
mutually (1)
110:2
myself (8)
33:16;49:8;52:4;
5524;57:24g69t6;
71:21,22
N
name (8)
4:18;48:8;49:21;
59:11;70:2;72:5;
78:1 1;83:6
names (1)
68:14
Nanaquaket (2)
18:16;19:1
narrative (1)
89:20
National (9)
48:15;57:11;69:13;
76:16;78:24;79:3;
93:20;94:2;101:15
nature (1)
5:18
Naval (1)
47:13
necessarily (2)
29:12;37:20
necessary (9)
5:24;18:24;19:19;
77:23;95:2,20;96:12,
21;97:22
necessity (l)
25:24
need (10)
5:16;15:16;34:5;
53:2;68:13;92:5;
97:13,16;99:24;
104:22
network (2)
79:3,5
new (1)
77:20
next (7)
notaries (6)
69:15;70:21;71:12,
13;103:6;107:7
notarization (7)
21:6,10,15,19,25;
22:5;61:2
notarize (3)
42:19;92:12,15
notarized (3)
9:6;17:11;33:3
Notary (52)
16:13,15;19:2,9,10,
14,21;41:21;42:11,
12;43:13,15,19;46:7,
9,12;51:14;56:19;
57:1 l;58:12,15,16;
69:13;71:11;72:24,
25;76:1 1,16;77:3,14;
79:1 1;83:20;90:15,
25;91 :3,20;92:20;
93:9,16,18,20,20;
94:2;101:12,15;
103:9,10,11;105:3,4;
107:8,18
note (23)
20:19;21:4,23;
22:3,23;23:4,5,8,22;
24:4,12,15;25:5;
47:22;54:21;74:3,23;
75:3,5;95:18,22;
96:24;97:18
notes (1)
107:11
notice (7)
8:2;24:7;27:6,6;
29:8,9,13
noticed (2)
15:14;37:1
notify (1)
5:16
notifying (1)
13:25
noting (1)
24:22
NRA (1)
45:24
number (14)
6:6,7;13:23;14:4;
23:17;58:5;62:13;
79:17,23;81:19;82:7,
18;83:6;84:3
15;107:4,21;108:21
objection (4)
14:2,10;18:4,6
obligation (4)
96:14;107:23,25;
108:17
obligations (1)
95:21
observer (1)
66:15
obtain (l)
86:7
obtaining (1)
86:5
obviously (2)
38:24;80:12
occasion (1)
85:16
Occasionally (5)
69:21;84:8;91:24;
92:3;9324
occupation (2)
41:20;42:14
occurred (l)
65:3
Off (6)
16:8,10;34220;
42:13;63:21;88:3
offensive (3)
35:2,3,5
office (26)
18:22;20:2,15;
22:14;48:1;51:12;
54:23;55:5,6,13;
62:24;64:20;65:4,13;
70:7;77:19;82:2;
83:22;84:l6,20,21;
90:9;103:7;107:12;
109:6;110:1
officer (11)
57:25;58:1,12,16;
62:6,8;68:9,9;75:21;
85:23;90:18
officers (1)
90:19
official (1)
14:8
often (4)
4325,8021 1;91:25;
92:4
Omissions (1)
10;73:12;75:22;
78:12,24,24;79:4;
83:13;84:6,14,23;
85:12,16,19;87:1;
90:5;95:12;98:13;
105:17,20;109:4,21
one—man (1)
105:16
only (12)
6:21;7:5;8:19;
19:10;31:11;38:10;
44:10;66:25;77:25;
84:23;85:5;89:7
open (4)
6:15,19;7:3;66:7
operate (3)
9:22;46:7,9
operated (1)
9:21
operates (2)
40:24;66:12
operating (2)
46:12;47:1
opinion (1)
62:4
opportunity (4)
27:7,24;40:7,8
opposed (2)
42:24;52:3
option (1)
108:3
order (1)
15:7
ordering (1)
15:22
organizations (l)
93:25original (1)
64:15
others (2)
54:1 1;68:21
otherwise (3)
9:14;31:8;39:11
ourselves (2)
39:22;1 10:4
out (28)
17:7,8;25:7;35:1 1;
39:13;44:22;50:7,14;
55:12;57:11;59:9;
61 : 1 ;64:20,24;8 1 :24;
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R’Ein-U—Scri‘pi® Allied Court Reporters, Inc. (401)946-550011: Dunww Ammuo Frauen“. DI 07070 www allindonnrtrennrters.cnm
(8) Member ~ out
Hearing
9/5/201 8 8:44 AM
William E. Paplauskas, Jr.
March l, 2017
22,24;98:16;99:8,10;
105:13,15;107:5;
109220
out—of-state (2)
69:25;91:16
outrageous (1)
35:6
outrageously (1)
35:3
outset (1)
12:21
outside (1)
64:13
over (15)
4:15;29:6;33:4;
36:19;59:4;67:24;‘
7422,19;80:2;85:14,
17;92:14;95:18;
100:10,12
overview (13)
4:9;67:10;74:2,18,
21;76:6;94:11,14,15,
23;95:9,17;97:13
own (13)
9:23;18:19;33:2,3;
34:15;47:6;57:16,21;
67:13;71:6;101:4,23;
108:2
owned (1)
79:3
owner (1)
18:15
owners (1)
47:10
ownership (2)
18:24;19:5
P
package (8)
22:6,12,21;62:17;
64:1 1;65:13;96:11;
106:9
packet (3)
13:6;16:12;22:11
page (47)
20:24;21:2,7,10,15,
21,25;22:2,2,5,19,21,
24,24,24;23:1,4,5,7,8,
8,10,12,14,16,18,20,
22,23,25;24:2,4,6,8,9,
9,11,13,16,19,25;
25:2,5,22;64:1;75:2,
15
Pages (3)
61:17,18;75:15
Pagliarini (31)
4:7;5:4;8:5,1 1,20;
10:15;11:8,1 1;13:7;
18:22;3 1:15,22;44:8,
13;49:9;55:5,6,21;
59:21,23;62:25;
64:19;84:19;86:11;
87:7,18,22;89:24;
103:7,9;110:5
Pagliarini's (6)
48:1;49:23;51:12;
54:22;70:7;84: 16
paid (18)
43:1,1,3,3,8;52:10,
12,18,19;54:4,12,14,
16;63:14;70:14;78:1;
8020,24panel (3)
10:5,6;36:22
Pap (1)
78:8
paperwork (9)
61:6,7;91:7;92:8,
10,1 1,13,14,16
Paplauskas (30)
9:2;13:24;14:8,23;
15:23;19:2,8,19,21;
21:6,20,25;22:6;25:5,
9;30:16;31:18;33:13;
34:1;36:25;40:5;
41:6,8,18;44:1 1;
45:3;52:20;58:11;
68:13;107:15
Paplauskas‘ (1)
14:18
P—A—P-LA—U-s—K—A-s (1)
41:7
Paplauskas's (3)
16:17;21:10,15
paragraphs (1)
59:9
Pardon (1)
88:1
parking (1)
55:12
part (10)
16:16;44:22;48:15;
49:20;53:25;57:22;
59:21,23;66:10;82:1
participating (1)
81:15
particular (8)
5:3;47:18;50: 1 6;
70:12;73:12,20;
74:14;95:4
parties (2)
12:24;73:1
partner (2)
49:23;84:19
Party (1)
81:2
pass (1)
86:17
passing (1)
73:24
past (1)
48: 11
pay (6)
34:15;54:19;63:14;
66:2;77:24;93:23
paying (1)
77:24
payment (9)
74:25,25;75:1;
80:17;90:20;95:24,
24,25;96:1
payments (1)
97: 1 8
Pays (1)
70:11
penalty (4)
5:2;30:4;75:2;96:2
Pending (2)
98:6;109:2
people (22)
32:25;35:5,16,17;
39:1;42:19;46:20;
47:4,9;56:8;67:2,8;
68:14;70:4;71:12;
72:2;78:14;79:7,10,
24;86:16;89:18people's (1)
5 1 :23
per (3)
43 :24;44: 1,4
percent (4)
76:25;92:21,23;
93:7
perform (9)
47:2;48:4;84:7;
102:1,6,10,13,17,22
performed (5)
12:9;31:8;49:10;
85:14;107:24
performing (1)
34:12
perhaps (2)
6:12;45:14
period (2)
54: 16;82:19
permissible (1)
9:22
person (13)
8:15;13:13,18;
30:2;31:15;39:1 1;
44:15;52:7,9;68:19;
77:6;82:12,14
personal (1)
89:23
personally (1)
82:16
pertaining (4)
8:16,21; 1 1 :7;20:14
perusing (1)
62:20
phone (13)
34:5;62:13;81:19;
82:5,7,18,21,24;83:1,
6,9;84:3;85:23
physically (1)
8 1 :23
Piccirilli (89)
4:12,16;5:7;6:4,6,
11,17,23;7:2,10,16;
9:9;10:1,23,25;11:2,
10,13,18,23;12:7,12,
13,15,18;13:8,12,16,
17:14:2,5,9,17,19,24;
15:4,13,16,21,25;
16:8;17:13,18,24;
18:5;25:13,15,18,19;
26:3,7,14;27:25;28:6,
18;29:7;30:14;32:8,
14;35:7,9,20;36:5,12;
38:1,7;39:19,25;40:2,
10,18;52:15,22;53:5,
19;54:2,5;56:16;
57:2;62:21;85:7;
104:8,17,22;107:4,
20,21;108:22;110:8
pick (1)
108:5
place (7)
47:25;54:22;55:13;
64:17;73:10;77:15,
22Plat (1)
18:18
played (1)
90:16
players (1)
49:3.
pleasant (2)
71:12,14
Please (13)
14:17;16:4;58:1 1;
69:18;93:17;95:8;
96:6;98:3;100:12;
102:15;108:25;
109:13,21
plenty (1)
54:10
PM (6)
4:1;40:1,1;109:22,
22;110:10
point (18)
10:22;17:23;25:7;
29:8;37:5;40:21;
45:12;53:3;55:17,24;
72:1;73:25;96:24;
99:8,10;107:5;
109:25;1 10:2
pointed (4)
44:22;59:9;96:17,
22Pointing (1)
61 :1
poor (1)
35:18
portion (1)
72:17
posed (1)
37:9
positive (2)
77:9;79:2
possession (1)
19:4
possible (2)
8:19;65:14
possibly (2)
45:7;56:5
power (3)
29:24;72:16;
108:12
powers (4)
7:21,22;107:7,17
Practice (34)
4:3,22;7:9,24;10:2,
10,11;11:16;12:1,4;
29:6;30:22,25;31:6,
10;32:19;34:11,13;
36:17,24;38:3,16,23;
39:4,10;40:13;42:8;
45:10;68:7;83:18;
87:6;93:10;105:13,
15
pregnant (l)
37:11
preliminary (2)
4:19;6:3
prepare (l)
33:3
prepared (9)
9:4,5,7,8;13:13;
17:15;77:7;101:12;
105:24
prepayment (2)
75:2;9621
prescribed (1)
107:13
present (10)
4:13;5:12;12:16;
25:16;30:6,6;61:14;
75:1 1;80:1;81:23
presented (10)
19:8,15,18;30:19;
32:18;37:3;38:12,14,'
17;95:14
presenting (1)
62:3
presents (1)
91:7
Pretty (1)
10:18
primary (2)
12:23;42:14
principal (2)
75:1;95z25
print (6)
50:7,14;59:10;
105:13,15,16
prior (3)
48:25;64:24;65:5
privilege (2)
30:8;37: 15
privileges (1)
30:8
privy (2)
65 :4;77: 10
IVEiu—U-Scrégotél) Allied Court Reporters, Inc. (401)946-55001 1 z mun» Ammm (‘mnatnn RI 07.020 www.alliedcnnrtrenorters.com
(9) out-of—state - privy
9757201 8 8:44 AM
Hearing William E. Paplauskas, Jr.
March l, 2017
probable (2) 52:24 quote (2) 62:2; 1 03 : 1 2 9:14;3 1 :20
1019;36:23 protect (1) 104:6;105:3 receipt (1) regards (1)
probably (13) 52:1 quote/unquote (1) 10: 16 59:25
26:15;44:3,7;53:3; protesting (1) 71:15 receive (6) Registry (2)
55:3;78:23;79:22; 107:11 quotes (1) 6:2;10:3,4;63:6; 75:14,18
85:7,15;91:l;92:19, protests (1) 7 1 : 19 64: 10; 1 05 2 14 regularly (1)
23;93:8 107:10 received (8) 68:20
problem (6) protocol (1) R 4:5;1 6:16;20:2,14; relate (1)
75:18;85:24; 67:17 22:13;27:6;36:19; 33:5
104:20;108:9,9,23 provide (16) raise (1) 63:11 related (1)
procedure (6) 4:8;9:3;28:9; 18:4 receiving (l) 5:9
7:12;8:2;25:22; 35:23;48:14;49:24; range (1) 32:13 relating (1)
28:12,14,15 50:2;57:8;59:6; 53:14 recently. (1) 107:10
procedures (1) 78:25;94:1 1,14;96:5, rank (1) 87: 14 relationship (2)
40:20 14;107:25;108:7 8:13 receptionist (l) 68:19;71:9
proceed (8) provided (13) Rare (1) 103:1 0 relaxed (3)
10:22;28:4,5; 5:20;8:4;9:1; 76:24 recess (2) 4:10;5:19;104:9
30:10;32:15;35:12; 16:18;22:16;33:13; rate (2) 109:22,25 release (1)
39:18;40:9 56:24;60:9,23,24; 74:4,24 recognize (1) 65:20
proceeding (12) 63:23;64:6;1 08:14 rather (2) 56:20 relevant (1)
8:18,23;26:19; provides (l) 50:21;88:20 recollection (1) 20:14
28:3;30:14;35:25; 78:20 reached (l) 72:19 reluctance (1)
39:15;87:17,21; providing (3) 8 1 :24 recommendation (2) 52:23
88:17;89:22;109:25 8:21;61:13,23 read (19) 4:23;35:23 remained (1)
proceedings (2) provision (l) 15:9;18:1 1;29:19; record (14) 60:2
36:17;66:17 9:24 58:10,24;59:6,7,9,13, 16:8,10;17:9;18:1, remember (9)
process (14) Public (10) 13;60:12;61:22;76:6; 10;20:10;22:7;25:9; 63:9;73:12;100:17,
9:11;10:4;15:12;
26:9;27:1,2,5,6,8,l 1,
12;42:18;66:10;
72:22
processor (3)
58:2;62:7;90:18
produced (3)
5:22;8:7;16:18
professional (1)
41 :23
prohibited (1)
34:8
prohibits (1)
15:10
promissory (1)
107:11
promotional (1)
94:7
promulgating (1)
86:11
proof (3)
20:2,6,8
properly (1)
103:5
properties (1)
83:15
property (22)
18:16,20,25;19:6;
32:25;33:2;46:22;
47:3,6, 1 0;81 :6;
91:16;95:1,19;96:12,
21 ;97:2 1 ,23,25;98: 1;
107:24;108:3
proprietary (1)
52:16
propriety (1)
6:20;15:1 1;19:2,
11,22;41:21;42:11;
58:12;85:2,12
publics (2)
79:1 1;107:8
Pulling (1)
27:20
purchase (12)
50:9,17;51 :25;
63:12;64:7;76:3,8;
77:21;91:22;93:6;
94:19;98:14
purchases (2)
91:15;93:2
purchasing (1)
77:20
purpose (1)
18:23
pursuant (3)
10:13,20;13:10
Put (15)
15:17;30:3;32:5;
40:19;44:9;63:22;
64:1 1;69:17;74:10,
17;83:2,4;95:13;
98:4;106:9
puffing (1)
20:10
Q
quickly (2)
65:14;84:14
quite (5)
29:14;3 1 :21;32:1,
15;107: 1 5
98:3,6,11;104:23;
108:25;109:2
reads (1)
18:13
real (23)
5:10;18:16,19,21,
25;19:3,4,5,7,12,16,
17;33:17;39:5;43:19,
21;46:13;47:2;57:25;
63:14;73:1;76:20;
89:18
really (8)
33:19;34:19;36:17;
53:1;60:5;74:6;
76:13;108:20
realtor (22)
51:22;55:1,2,3,18,
19;56:6;60:5,5;
71:25;100:2,5,6,7,10,
11,12,14,15,20;
101:5,6
realtors (4)
56:5,6;71:25;72:4
rearrange (1)
77:17
reason (2)
5:16;53:13
reasons (1)
47:14
Rebecca (5)
9:1;17:1;18:20;
21:5,12
recall (11)
32:13;47:18,19;
52:12;55:25;56:15;
59:14;60:3;61:24;
38:2;40:19,22;54:21;
65:18;95:3
recorded (3)
6:1;61:21;75:l4
recording (2)
64:21;75:18
Records (2)
6:20;27:24
redactions (1)
20:20
REEXAMINATION (1)
84:13
refer (4)
62:5,9;109:3,7
reference (4)
7:17;20:23;22:18,
22references (6)
8:13;69:8,9,9,1 1, 13
referrals (3)
42:21;69:20;70:4
referred (l)
49:11
referring (2)
83:18;104:5
refi (3)
50:18;91:22;94:17
refinance (2)
3221,23refinancing (1)
91 :13
refi's (2)
93:2,3
refusal (1)
40:16
refute (2)
18,19,21,25;101:2,4
remind (2)
25:21;36:1
remortgaging (2)
46:22;47:7
renew (1)
32: 1 6
reopen (2)
40:6,25
repeat (l)
42:16
repeatedly (1)
103:6
rephrase (1)
57:4
report (2)
7220;35:23
reports (1)
7:23
representatives (2)
3 1 :7;38:22
represented (6)
55:3;72:6,13,14;
77:5;80:3
representing (3)
52:5,6;57:24
reputation (1)
69:7
request (5)
5:17;23:17,21;
32:13,16
requested (2)
17:10;102:17
requests (1)
17:5
require (1)
Min—Scripféb Allied Court Reporters, Inc. (401)946-55001 1 z Dhanw Ammm Pranefnn. RT 02020 www.alliedcourtrenortersxom
(10) probable - require
9/?2018 8:44 AM
Hearing William E. Paplauskas, Jr.
March 1, 2017
64:9 right (50) 51:25;76:4,8 second (3) set (3)
required (1) 4:13;5:14,23; same (15) 24:23;60:24;63:2 50:8,8g58z25
107:12 13:19;15:3,17;17:12; 20:7;21:11;22:3; secure (2) sets (1)
requirement (1) 23:18;28:4;30:7,10, 26:1;27:17;40:8; 18:24;19:5 9:13
29:15 18;32:10,1 1,17;35:9, 50:13,15;70:23; seeing (1) setting (1)
requires (1) 10;37:13;47:1;51:18; 75:10;79:8;83:5,22; 97:5 8:7
11:19 54:8;57:22;64:5; 84:2,7 seems (1) Settlement (7)
reschedule (3) 66:22;67:18;74: l 1, sanction (1) 44:12 22:20;24:20,24;
27:21;86:4;110:1 12;78:12;88:17;'
sell (1) 98:15,18;99:6,13
reserve (1) 89:22;90:1 1, 13,22; sat (3) 32:25 several (2)
39:17 91:6,9;92:16,18; 56:12;100:11,14 seller (20) 17:5;20:25
Residential (2) 94:1 1,22;95:13; SAUNDERS (69) 49:22;50:10,17; shall (5)
23:1 1;25:1 102:2,14,24;105:15, 4:2,17;6:10,16,19, 52:6;55:3,20;72:7; 25:23,25;26:1;
resolve (1) 17,21,23;106:6; 25;7:5,I4;10:1,24; 76:2;77:5;78:2;80:3, 36:2,2
6:3 108:1,11 11:1,8,12,21,24; 17,25;85:18,25;95:5; Sheet (3)
respect (4) risk (1) 12:1 1,15,20;13:1 1, 99:4,5;105:25;106:5 24:17,20;54:6
54:7;72:24;89:5,19 54:20 15,21;14:16,20;15:1, sellers (4) sheriff‘s (1)
respond (6) RM (2) 13;16:2l;17:20;18:2, 63:7;72:13,14,15 20:3
9:25;27:10;30:18, 22:23;23:4 7;25:19;26:5;27:14; seller's (3) ship (1)
18;36:8;97:4 Road (2) 28:16,20,24;29:4; 55:18;80:7;106:19 63:22
RESPONDENT (7) 18:17;19:1 30:12;32:12;35:7,20; send (4) shipped (2)
5:6,8;8:3,3,10; role (5) 36:11,15;38:5;39:16, 29:24;30:1;63:21; 62:19;106:9
25:23;36:2 29:22;48:2;81:8; 21;40:2,15;41:3; 94:8 Shipping (2)
response (10) 90:16;94:10 45:2;53:10,22;63:17, sends (1) 25:4;63z23
14:6,8,12,18; room (23) 20;66:7;75:7,10,23; 92:7 shoot (1)
16:17;22:14,17;27:7; 44:16,17,20;45:7; 76:5,9;83:12,17,24; sense (3) 45:21
67:7,15 55:7,14,17,17,22; 84:5,10;104:19; 39:14,]5;51:22 shot (1)
responsibilities (1) 56:8,13,14;59:24; 107:20;108:22; sent (2) 73:16
65:11 60:2;64:13,18;72:20; 109:19,23 1525;17:15 show (6)
rested (5) 76:22;84:23;88:12; save (1) sentence (1) 51:7;63:25;91:5;
30:17;37:2,7; 90:1;100:5,6 110:5 14:17 99:14;109:8,16
40:14,15 Rotary (1) saw (6) separate (l) showed (3)
retain (1) 93:20 90:9;98:21,22; 30:17 71:20;97:3;109:9
78:14 Rule (7) 100:2,3,3 series (2) showing (1)
retained (1) 7:22;26:4;28:8; saying (9) 12:22;37:24 91:3
81:2 29:19;36:1;44:25; 15:6;27:20;30:1; serious (1) side (3)
return (3) 104:18 33:12;38:22;44:20; 40:23 38:22;99:5,6
10:17;20:3;23:21 rules (22) 46:25;88:13;89:7 serve (1) sign (15)
returning (1) 4:10;5:12,19;7:12, scenario (1) 4:18 17:16;39:9;59:10;
20:21 17;8:2,6;9:23;10:3, 52:2 served (3) 60:10,1 1,12,20;
review (9) 14,20;13:10;25:21, schedule (3) 25:24;26:18,19 67:18;73:2,22;74:1;
17:10;34:24;73:5, 21;27:13,15;28:1 1, 77:17,18,19 service (8) 94:16;95:10,13;
21;74:8,11,13,15; 12,13,15;37:1;104:9 scheduled (1) 20:2,3,6,8;27:12; 105:18
97:2 ruling (3) 95:25 41:13;71:4;85:10 signature (17)
reviewed (1) 5:24;6:18;37:22 scheduling (3) ServiceLink (35) 21:7,9,1 1,14;23:9,
36:22 run (3) 48:9,10,11 16:19;20:9;22:13, 13,14,19,23;24:1,3,5,
reviews (1) 12:19:76z21; Schmoe (1) 15;34:17,23,25;48:6, 9,1 1;25:5;60:18,1 8
40:22 101224 77:20 7,13,21;49:12,24; signatures (17)
revisit (1) running (1) school (7) 5 1 : 1 0,1 1;52:3,5; 19:19;21:4,18,24;
29:21 90:19 28:3;41:24,25; 56:25;57:8,18;60:25; 22:4,5,25;23:5;60:14,
revolving (1) runs (1) 42:1,3,4,6 65:17,23;70:12,13; 16;61:1,4,10,1 1,14;
8:14 22:1 scope (1) 71 :9,24;78: 15,18,20; 62:15;63:3
Rhode (37) 107:17 80:13;84:17;102:5, signed (7)
18:17,23;19:1; S screened (1) 16;]05:14 17:11;19:13,17,22;
29:6;31:13;33:8,9; 10:6 ServiceLink's (1) 24:12;63:4,5
34:24;39:2,4;41:13; safe (1) screening (2) 49:19 significance (1)
46:5,20,21;47:1,4,5, 85:13 10:5;36:21 services (4) 103215
9,9,12,14;51:17; salary (1) screwed (1) 43:5;48:14;70:1 1; signing (9)
68:25;69:23;70:1; 43:8 108:15 77:24 42:22;56:9;68:4,5,
72:11;79:7;83:14,19; sale (4) search (2) serving (1) 23;70:15,17;71:6;
86:21;87:22;9l :1 1, 34:3;39:5;93:6; 51:19,19 91:20 80:18
18,18;92:25;107:6; 94:20 searches (2) session (2) signingagentcom (1)
108:6 sales (3) 48:16;49:4 39:24;40:l 93:22
Miya-U—Scriptib Allied Court Reporters, Inc. (401)946—55001 1 < phoniv Avenue. Crangtnn. RI 02920 www.alliedcourtrenorters.com
(11) required - signingagentcom
9/?2618 8:44 AM
Hearing William E. Paplauskas, Jr.
March 1, 2017
signings (1) speak (2) stop (2) support (4) 66:1 1;92:17
70:22 63:1;69:9 46:16;86:2 37:3;38:13;88:2; » tells (2)
signs (1) speaker (2) STRACHMAN (14) 89:21 62:13;81:17
52:7 83:3,4 27:5,16;28:1,21, Suppose (1) ten (7)
silent (1) speakerphone (1) 25;30:5;37:10;45:24; 85:25 42:15,17;66:20;
60:2 83:2 54:7;87:16;98:3; supposed (2) 76:13;9l:1,2,19
similar (l) specific (6) 104:16;108:25; 8:4;62218 tendering (1)
75:24 8:9;18:4;47:15; 109:18 Supreme (28) 8:14
similarly (l) 61:24;88:18;108:6 Strachman's (1) 4223;718,14;9:23; Terms (6)
20:7 specifically (13) 29:8 11:25,25;27: 12,14; 21 :3;75:25;76:3,7;
simply (8) 8:8,23;9:2,13; strictly (1) 28:4,1 1,14,16,22,23; 97:17;107:1
5:16;13:24;15:14; 28:18;31:20;34:11; 74:20 29:2,21,23,25;30:10, testified (2)
16:14;24:22;25:11; 63:9;100:17,21; strike (1) 25;31:2;33:22;35:24; 39:1;67:7‘
45:9;58r22 101:1,2;107:8 77:11 37:12;38:24;44:24; testify (22)
single (2) specifics (2) stubs (1) 87:8,23 9:1-7;15:20;17:6;
39:4,8 10:19;45:11 63:14 Sure (22) 26:1;30:9,9,16;31:11,
sit (2) speculative (2) stuff (3) 6:10,25;7:1;10:17; 19;32:3;34:2;36:2,7;
74:13;82:21 104:10;107:5 64:23;65:3;74:6 11:1,21;14:16;18:7; 37:13,14;38:12,18;
sitting (4) spend (1) stupid (1) 29:16;41:1 1;52:7; 39:1 1;40:5,17;52:20;
4:12;26:1 6;55:6; 82:22 64:22 54:21;57:6;67:2,6,8, 96:7
82:2 spends (1) sua (1) 11,15;75:9;84:20; testifying (5)
situation (2) 62:12 10:20 103:11,23 17:21,22;36:4;
37:25;76:21 sponte (1) subject (4) surprised (2) 37:12,12
six (1) 10:20 6:14;17:3;25:10; 38:2;71:20 testimony (3)
46:10 stacks (1) 40: 12 swear (2) 38:17,21,21
skills (1) 73:21 subjected (1) 15:17;41:3 third (1)
66:23 stage (2) 34:22 sworn (3) 81 :2
slash (2) 35:24;45:8 submitted (1) 14:23;18:14;41:5 though (5)
21:22;24:24 stand (1) 4:6 10:9;12:9;29:13;
slightly (1) 25:25 subpoena (13) T 3 1 :5;46:25
5:19 start (2) 15:5,7,21;20:4,8; thought (9)
smart (1) 66:8;76:12 22:14;25:24;26:2,8, table (4) 8:19;28:13;29:24;
33:2 started (2) 20;29:16;32:2; 56:13;86:3;88:9; 59:16;64:22;68:2;
so-and-so (1) 4:20;49:7 108:15 99:11 76:23;78:11;93:12
82:22 state (18) subpoenaed (2) talk (ll) thousand (4)
somebody (13) 17:7;32:19;33:8,9, 13:20;20:13 5:7;51:24;58:1,2; 44:3;67:24;85:14,
34:4;39:9;44:19; 20;35:4;38:15;39:8; subpoenas (3) 75:4,21;83:5;91 :18; 15
48:8;69:8;89:25; 41:13;42:9;46:4,7; 27:17,18;110:6 109:13,15,15 threatened (1)
104:4,1 1,25;105:2, 81:1 1;86:15,21; Subsection (1) talked (1) 88:4
24;109:5,6 107:9;108:16,17 25:22 100:14 threatening (1)
someone (8) stated (1) substantiate (1) talking (2) 15:6
9:5;15:11;26:8,25; 71:14 9:17 69:7;92:1 three (10)
29:22,25;30:1;68:6 Statement (11) substantiated (1) talks (1) 13:6;16:1 1:46: 17;
Sometime (1) 21:16;22:20;23:2; 8:1 95:18 61:19;73:8;74:8,15;
49:16 24:15;53:23;69:3; successful (1) Tanner (1) 79:19,21;90:7
Sometimes (9) 89:15;98:15,1 8;99:7, 87:11 48:12 three-person (1)
63:8,10,10,1 1,13, 13 sue (l) Tax (3) 36:21
15,15;103:2,5 statements (1) 88:5 18:17;23:21;24:17 throughout (2)
somewhere (5) 25:13 sufficient (3) taxes (1) 70:21;76:19
28:9;72:17;83:23; statute (13) 60:1 1;73:4,7 63:14 times (1)
91:17,25 6:23;7:4;11:19,22; suggest (4) Taxpayer (1) 92:21
sorry (14) 12:10;28:10;30:24; 34:7;38:15;88:16; 23:17 Title (40)
5:8;11:12;37:10; 31:4,5;33:6;107:6, 102:16 technical (1) 24:23;25:3;27:18;
42:16;57:4;63:19; 22;108:6 suggested (l) 57:25 34:24;42:21;48:15,
72:6;76:10;78:10; statutory (2) 25:20 Ted (1) 16;49:4;51:18,19;
84:5;86:13;91 : 10; 29: 1;37:15 suggests (2) 86:18 54:19;63:24;65:4;
93:17;96:6 stenographer (1) 47:17;55:24 teleconferenced (1) 68:23;70:14,15,17,
sort (1) 6:1 summation (1) 82:3 20,25;71:7,8,10,22;
110:6 stepping (1) 25:14 telemarketer (1) 76:6;78:1,21,22,23;
sounds (1) 109:20 summons (2) 90:17 79:1,4;80:18;88:7;
43:18 still (7) 26:9,20 telephone (4) 92:7;101 :21;107:24;
spans (2) 14:15;46: 1 9,25; Superior (1) 8 1 :24;82:3;83: 1,25 108:2,2,4,5,11
22:20;23:8 47:1;84:7;93:5,7 15:22 telling (2) titled (25)
IVEiu—UuSei'épf® Allied Court Reporters, Inc. (401)946—55001 1: Dhaniv Avamm Franctnn. RI 0207.0 www.alliedcnnrtrennrfers-com
(12) signings - titled
Hearing
9/5/201 8 8:44 AM
William E. Paplauskas, Jr.
March 1, 2017
16:13;19:9;21 :3,
15,22;22:1,l9;23:2,8,
11,17,21,24;24:3,6,
10,14,17,20,23;25:1,
6;56:l9;64:1;75:25
Tiverton (6)
5:1 1;18:17,17,23;
19:1;72111
today (14)
4:4,13;5:22;11:13;
17:6;27:23;32:11,13;
37:2;60:22;78:3;
84:8;89:22;90:4
told (15)
30:10;50:24;51:2,
21;53:14;64:21,22;
71:17;95:14,17,21;
96:4,7;99:5;104:25
Tom (5)
4:12,15,18;12:20;
37:6
took (3)
54:22;64:17;72:16
tOP (3)
13:6;20zl 1;58:4
Total (1)
44:5
totally (1)
9:18
touch (1)
110:7
towards (1)
72:1
town (1)
61:21
training (1)
42:3
transact (1)
107:9
transaction (12)
50:18,19,20;51 :23;
63:9,12;65:25;70:12;
72:2;73:2;81:3;86:25
transcript (2)
6:2;23:21
transpires (1)
78:2
Transport (1)
92:10
tried (2)
44:9;86zl7
true (2)
10:8;36:23
Truth-in—Lending (1)
23:2
trying (9)
30:15;44: 13;45:9,
25;82:4,15;87:8,22;
88:5
turn (3)
4:15;25:12;47:15
Turning (15)
21 :21,25;22:2,4,
19;23:1,7,16,20,23;
24:2,13,19,25;25:2
two (24)
9:16;16:22;29:9,
10;30:17;32:24;
33:12;56:4,6,7;
58:10;60:13;61:18;
62:12;69:24;73:8,13,
15;82:22;83:4;101:2;
105:15,l6;106:20
two-page (1)
23:3
type (7)
15:12;20:7;21:1 1;
33:13;43:6;50:12,20
types (2)
33:23,24
typically (3)
81:12;91:8,12
25:4
UPLC (12)
13:1,2,3;14:3,21;
16:5,6,7;19:23,24,25;
22:8
upon (5)
5:2;18:14;25:24;
40:16;73:20
UPS (3)
62:18,22;65:13
used (5)
9:10,11;26:16;
66:22;83:18
using (2)
11:5;76:12
usually (5)
51:19;73:19,25;
82:9;100:23
voluntarily (1)
29: 1 7
vote (l)
38:6
W
UV
ultimate (1)
3 1 :2
Unauthorized (7)
4:3,22;5:5;7:24;
30:24;34:13;36:24
unavailable (l)
17:8
uncontradicted (l)
33 : 11
under (15)
7:4,21,22;8:1;9:22,
23;26:1;32:4;36:25;
39:1;45:1;46:23;
67:13;95:21;108:17
Understood (2)
14:14;76:10
underwriter (1)
78:25
unfair (1)
35:1
Uniform (1)
23:11
union (2)
3 1 :6;38:22
unless (2)
4: 14;6:4
unprofessional (1)
8: 12
unsigned (1)
105:12
unsubstantiated (1)
8:1
up (25)
6:8;7:2;31:22;34:4,
6;35:18;57:12;61:12,
16;66:8;69:6,21;
71:20;74:6,20;75:6,
8;86:16;91 :3,5;97:3;
101:20,20;108:15;
109:5
Updated (1)
vacationing (2)
46:21;47:5
variations (2)
20:25;50:22
varies (2)
43:6;50:20
variety (1)
47:14
various (5)
12:23;17:1 1;61210;
70:3;93:14
vendetta (1)
89:23
verifying (1)
17:11
versus (1)
77:17
Vespia (10)
26: 1 1,12, 17:3727;
41:12,15;47:22;53:3;
85:1;87114
via (3)
81:24;82:3;83:1
Vincent (12)
9:1;16:25;18:12,
14;19:22;21:5,8;
23:10,15,23;24:1,5
violate (1)
30:23
violated (3)
44:21,23;108:16
violation (3)
37:15;38:15,16
violations (1)
8:9
violative (1)
27:2
VM (4)
22:23;23 24:24: 1 6,
18
volume (1)
20: 1 6
W-2s (1)
63:14
wait (1)
85:19
waiting (1)
37:17
walk (5)
99:1,17,17,18,25
walked (4)
99:15,16,21;101:5
wants (3)
34:4;54:9;88:19
War (l)
47:13
Warranty (3)
25:6;64:2;77:7
water (1)
63:13.
way (8)
12:19;31:17;44:14;
62:10;70:23;84:2;
88:20;100:23
website (3)
93:21;94:4,5
websites (4)
70:3;93:13,14,15
week (l)
49:17
welcome (1)
45:13
What's (4)
53:8;56:18;63:25;
88:22
white (1)
74:5
whole (5)
29:13;38:8;53:7;
60:22;99:18
wife (7)
17:3;18:20;55:1;
67:4;68:3,3;83:4
William (6)
19:2,8,18,20;41:6;
58:11
window (1)
49:18
within (10)
7:7;55:9,13;73:23;
75:17;79:3,5;107:8,
12,17
without (8)
15:7,12;25:23;
26:8;27:1;33:1;
34:16;35:14
witness (21)
14:23;25:25;3 1:10,
11,13;41:4,5,6,9,12;
43:1 1 ;45:5;47:23;
52:4;62:20;63:19;
66:16,17;67:1;94:13;
98:5
witnessed (1)
19:20
Witnesses (2)
25 : 1 6:1 10:3
word (2)
59:9,9
words (3)
93:23;99:22;
101 :21
work (10)
26: 17;42:19;43:13;
46:23;49:4;69:19;
77:22;79:8,24;1 10:1
worked (4)
48:21,22;64:24;
86: 1 8
working (3)
52:3;78:18;86:14
works (2)
82: 15,84: 1 8
world (l)
72: 12
worse (1)
53:8
worth (2)
46:1 1:97:24
worthwhile (1)
46: 1 8
write (2)
17:19:58: 19
writes (1)
44: 1 5
written (2)
14:8:78:23
wrong (6)
84:25;104:2,7;
105:5,8:107:3
wrote (2)
3 1 :16,25
Y
year (5)
43:24;44:1,4,6:
66:19
years (24)
9:16:15:9;42:15,
17:44:2;46:10,17:
48:23:56:7;66:14,20:
73:13,15;76:13,13:
79:6:80:2;87:2:
90:24:91 : 1,2, 1 9:
101:3:106z20
young (1)
48:8
Z
FVEiu—U-Scrégfi® Allied Court Reporters, Inc. (401)946-55001 H Phnniv Avenue. Cranstnn. RI 02920 www.alliedcourtrenortersxom
(13) Tiverton - young
9/5/201 8 834Z'ATM
Hearing William E. Paplauskas, Jr.
March 1, 2017
zero (3) 25:6;6421 40 (3) 93 (1)
32:18;33:9;108:12 16 (2) 79:6,20,22 23:10
zone (1) 21:15;75:14 403 (1) 95 (3)
98:1 167 (1) 18:18 23:12;92:23;93:7
18:18 42-30~8 (1) 96 (1)
0 1930s (1) 107:7 23:14
38:23 45 (3) 99 (4)
02878 (1) 1969 (8) 73:11,17,23 23:16,18;76:25;
18:17 42:2,13;43:20; 47 (2) 92:21
44:];63:16;85:13; 21:25;22:2
l 90:13;103:2419-9-6 (2) 5
1 (4) 107:22;108:7
13:1,5,6;18:15 5 (7)
1:30 (1) 2 4:5;1 1:3;16:6,23,
4:1 24;19:7;38:11
10 (10) 2 (5) 50 (4)
22:8,10;27:18; 13:2,5,23;14:3; 66:24;79:6,20,22
44:3;48:23;64:1; 18:19 528 (2)
67:24;85:15;94:21; 2:26 (1) 18:16,25
98:9 40:1‘
104 (1) 2:55 (1) 623:20 40:1
108 (1) 20 (3) 6 (4)
23:24 44:3;67:24;85:15 16:7,23,25;19:16
109 (1) 2002 (4) 62 (1)
24:2 44:9;86:15;88:3,18 22:2
1099 (1) 2015 (10) 63 (2)
68:19 4:6;5:1 1;11:3; 22:2,5
11 (1) 18:21;19:4;38:11;
48:23 47:17;88:25;89:8; 7110 (1) 90:3
24:4 2016 (1) 7 (2)
11-27-2 (3) 14:7 19:23;20:1
8: 14;30:23;3 1 :9 20-minute (l) 75 (5)
117 (1) 72:12 44:7;46:2,3;66:22,
24:6 21 (5) 24118 (1) 5:11;18:21;19:3; 78 (2)
24:10 47:17;49:16 22:19,21
12/3/1947 (1) 25 (1)
41:19 21:21 8120 (1)
24:11 3 8 (2)
125 (1) 19:24;20:7
24:13 3 (6) 800 (1)
126 (1) 13:3,5;14:4,21; 15:9
24:16 18:20;25:22 81 (2)
12b6 (1) 38b (l) 2221,2410:7 7:1 86 (1)
13 (2) 23:1
20:24;21:2 4 87 (1)
131 (1) 23:5
24:19 4 (6)
135 (1) 7:22;16:5,13;19:1; 924:25 56:18;72:25
14 (1) 4:19 (1) 9 (3)
21:7 109:22 19:25;20:10,1115 (4) 4:24 (1) 90 (1)
14:7;21:1 1;38:9; 109:22 23:775:14 4:25 (1) 900 (1)
150 (1) 110:10 66:1925:2 4:30 (1) 92 (2)
152 (2) 109:25 23:8,8
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In The Matter Of:
Hearing
William E. Paplauskas, Jr.
V01. II
May 9, 20] 7
ALLIEDgCOURT REPORTERS, INC.
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STATE OF RHODE ISLAND AND PROVIDENCE PLANTATIONSSUPREME COURT
UNAUTHORIZED PRACTICE OF LAW COMMITTEE
PROCEEDINGS AT HEARINGIN RE:
WILLIAM E. PAPLAUSKAS, JR.
VOLUME II
PLACE: STATE OF RHODE ISLAND SUPREME COURTBOURCIER CONFERENCE ROOM7TH FLOOR .
250 BENEFIT STREETPROVIDENCE, RI 02903
‘DATE: MAY 9, 2017TIME: 1:00 P.M.
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PRESENT: ....
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DEBRA A. SAUNDERS, CHAIRWGMANJANET GILLIGAN, ESQUIREMEGAN MACIASZ DISANTO, ESQUIREVINCENT VESPIA, JR.DAVID J. STRACHMAN, ESQUIRETHOMAS BERGERON, ESQUIRE
FOR THE RESPONDENT ..... GREGORY P. PICCIRILLI,ESQUIRE
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INDEX
WITNESS PAGE
JOHN PAGLIARINI
DIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR. BERGERON ......EXAMINATION BY MS. MACIASZ DISANTO ......EXAMINATION BY MR. STRACHMAN ............EXAMINATION BY CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS ......RE—EXAMINATION BY MR. STRACHMAN .........EXAMINATION BY MR. VESPIA ...............RE—EXAMINATION BY MS. MACIASZ DISANTO...RE—EXAMINATION BY CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS...CROSS EXAMINATION BY MR. PICCIRILLI .....
HAILEY MUNNS
DIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR. BERGERON ......EXAMINATION BY MS. GILLIGAN ............. .
EXAMINATION BY CHAIRWOMAN'SAUNDERS ......CROSS EXAMINATION BY MR. PICCIRILLI .....
72121252628293233
66798384
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9/5/201 83:46 AM
WITNESS
INDEX
JOHN MAJEWSKI
DIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR. BERGERON ......EXAMINATION BY CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS ......EXAMINATION BY MR. VESPIA ...............EXAMINATION BY MS. MACIASZ DISANTO ......RE—EXAMINATION BY CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS...RE—EXAMINATION BY MS. MACIASZ DISANTO...FURTHER EXAMINATION BY CHAIRWOMANSAUNDERS ................................EXAMINATION BY MS. GILLIGAN .............EXAMINATION BY MR. STRACHMAN ............FURTHER EXAMINATION BY MS. MACIASZDISANTO .................................CROSS EXAMINATION BY MR. PICCIRILLI .....
REBECCA MAJEWSKI
DIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR. BERGERON ......
101131132133134135
135136137
145146
159
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NO.
EXHIBITEXHIBITEXHIBIT
EXHIBITEXHIBIT
111213
1415
EXHIBITS
DESCRIPTION (UPLC'S)
STATUTE l9—9—6(1PG) .......... 37STATUTE 42—30—8(1PG) ......... 54STANDARDS OF CONDUCT OFNOTARIES PUBLIC(12PGS) ....... 573—29—2002 LETTER(13PGS) ...... 16812—20—2002 LETTER(17PGS) ..... 168
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II ~ May 9, 2017
(HEARING COMMENCED AT 1:00 P.M.)
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Good
afternoon, gentlemen. I'm Deb Saunders. You
may recall I'm chairing these proceedings
before the Unauthorized Practice of Law
Committee. If you would just do me a favor
and identify yourselves for the record.
MR. PICCIRILLI: Greg Piccirilli
for William Paplauskas, Jr.
MR. PAPLAUSKAS: William
Paplauskas, Jr.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: I will take
a moment, if it is okay, and go around the
table and introduce the members of the
Committee that are here today.
Starting at the other end of the
table is Attorney Janet Gilligan. Megan
Maciasz DiSanto. Our public member, Chief
Vespia. And Attorney David Strachman.
You may recall Tom Bergeron, our
staff attorney prosecuting for the
Committee.
You may also recall when we were
here last on March 1, 2017, we were in the
middle of testimony of your client. In light
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. - Vol. II — May 9, 2017
of the fact that we have additional witnesses
here today, we are going to proceed out of
order and ask to have those witnesses came in
first to testify and then continue with any
further questioning of your client.
MR. PICCIRILLI: Yes, I have no
objection to that.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Great. With
that, I will turn it over to Mr. Bergeron.
MR. PICCIRILLI: Just to be clear,
I think we are on my presentation of the
case. I understood the Cdmmittee rested. I
called Mr. Paplauskas. He was under —— I
examined him. I think we ended the
cross—examination. Mr. Strachman was in the
process of cross-examining him.
I understand the witnesses are
here, but I think it's my choice to call them.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: To refresh
your recollection, you had a motion to
dismiss pending. That motion to dismiss, you
may recall in reviewing the transcript, you
indicated that you did not want your client
to testify unless your motion to dismiss was
denied.
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II — May 9, 2017
It was, in fact, denied. So then
it was contingent upon us reopening the case
and questioning your client. So we are
continuing with the prosecution of the case
by Mr. Bergeron.
MR. PICCIRILLI: I don't remember
it that way.
MR. BERGERON: I'll start by
calling John Pagliarini as a witness.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Sure. Good
morning, Mr. Pagliarini. I'm Deb Saunders.
I chair the proceeding on behalf of the
Unauthorized Practice of Law Committee. 1f
you would please state your name for the'
record.
THE WITNESS: John A. Pagliarini,
Jr.
Being duly sworn, deposes and
testifies as follows:
DIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR. BERGERON
Goodlafternoon, Mr. Pagliarini.
A. Good afternoon.
I'm Tom Bergeron. As you know, I am counsel
for the Committee and I'll be asking you some
questions today.
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9/5/201 8 8:46 AM
William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II — May 9, 2017
After I'm done, Mr. Piccirilli,
counsel for Mr. Paplauskas, may ask you a few
questions.
A. Okay.
What is your date of birth?
A. February 19, 1964.
What is your current occupation?
A. Attorney.
When were you admitted to the Rhode Island
bar?
A. June of 2000.
Are you admitted to the bar in any other
state?
A. I am not. I am admitted —— I am a member
of the Federal Bar and United States Supreme
Court Bar.
Have you practiced law in Rhode Island since
you were admitted to the Rhode Island Bar?
A. I have.
Have you been in private practice since then?
A. I have.
Do you practice any particular fields of law?
A. Real estate.
And what kind of things do you do in real
estate law?
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. ~ Vol. II — May 9, 2017
A. Under the umbrella of real estate, I do
residential closings, commercial closings. I
do zoning and planning, land use law and ad
valorem, which is property tax appeals.
You said in your capacity as an attorney, you
conduct real estate closings?
A. I do.
And is that —~ which party to the transaction
is that on behalf of?
A. It could be seller or it could be the
buyer, or it could be both in the same
transaction.
So you have done all these of those before?
A. Absolutely.
Could you generally estimate for the
Committee just how often you do Closing
transactions?
A. I would say the office, at the time of
this appeal, was probably doing about 150 a
year.
So a considerable number?
A. A considerable number.
The complaint in this matter relates to a
real estate closing that took place on July
21, 2015. Do you recall that?
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II — May 9, 2017
A. I do.
Do you recall that closing?
A. I do.
This is Exhibit 1. I am handing you a
document that was previously marked as
Exhibit l.
A. Okay.
Can you take a look at that document for a
second?
A. Yes.
Do you recognize that document?
A. I do.
What do you recognize it to be?
A. This is a complaint I filed with this
Committee.
And on the last page —— can you go to the
last page?
A. Yes.
IS that your signature?
A. It is.
Could you generally describe that document to
the Committee?
A. As far as the basis of the complaint?
I guess generalIy you have already
categorized it as your complaint to the
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II — May 9, 2017
11
Committee?
A. It is my complaint to the Committee. I
tried to inform the Committee of the facts as
I believed they occurred and why I felt that
this was a matter that needed their attention
to go forward.
We will came back to more of the substance of
it later, but is that a fair and accurate
copy of what you sent?
A. It is.
This letter identifies a man named William
Paplauskas; have you met Mr. Paplauskas
before?
A. The day of the closing.
Is Mr. Paplauskas here today?
A. I will assume so. I met him once.
Do you recognize him?
A. I would so no to that.
You don't recognize him?
A. I do not.
Back to this closing in particular, did you
have any role in preparing documents in
anticipation of that closing?
A. I prepared, along with Attorney Hailey
Mhnns, who'was Hailey Conn at the time, I
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K.
Na.)
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II — May 9, 2017
12
would have reviewed the seller's documents
because the seller was unable to attend the
closing.
We did the seller's side of the
transaction prior to the buyers Gaming in it
for the scheduled time.
Okay. Where did the closing take place?
A. It occurred at my office at 3913 Main
Road, Suite E, Tiverton.
Do you recall who was in the office that day?
A. It would have been myself, Attorney Conn
at the time, probably the Realtor, Janney
Arricell, and Vincent and Rebecca Majewski
and Mr. Paplauskas.
And where within your general office did the
closing take place?
A. In the conference room.
And do you know who was in the conference
room at the beginning of the closing?
A. At the beginning of the closing, it would
have been everybody present but myself.
Did you ever go into the closing room?
A. I did not.
Were you present in.the closing room during
the signing of any of the documents?
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777777975/201 8 8:46 AM
William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II — May 9, 2017
13V
A. I was not.
Where were you during the closifig?
A. I was at my desk, which is a separate room
closer to the door.
And so what happened after the closing
started?
A. After the closing started, Attorney Conn
came out to me and said that Mr. Paplauskas
was not an attorney and that she was
uncomfortable being in the roam.
MR. PICCIRILLI: I will object.
This is hearsay.
MR. BERGERON: I suggest it is not
hearsay because it's not offered to prove the
truth of the matter, it's just what was told
to him.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: I wiil allow
it.
A. In our practice, we often have attorneys
who prepare documents on the seller's side,
but then do not attend the closing. It is
disconcerting for us that are physically
there because you never know what will happen
at a closing.
If an attorney is representing the
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II ~ May 9, 2017
14
seller and they prepare documents, it's our
expectation that they are going to physically
attend the closing.~
MR. PICCIRILLI: I'm going to
object. What is the relevance of the
seller's documents? That is not why we are
‘here today.
THE WITNESS: I am trying to
answer the question.
MR. PICCIRILLI: The question was
what did Ms. Conn say when she came out of
the room.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: I will allow
it.
THE WITNESS: We don't like it
when ~—
MR. PICCIRILLI: I will object.
MR. BERGERON: Let me rephrase the
question.
THE WITNESS: Thank you.
Start from the beginning, speaking directly
to the point of what happened after she came
out?
A. Ms. Conn came out and told me
Mr. Paplauskas was not an attorney, he was a
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II ~ May 9, 2017
15
notary public. I said please remove yourself
from the room. We do not represent the
buyers. I do not want you on malpractice
covering any information given to the buyers
of the property, so She left the room. It's
my belief that the Realtor also left the
room.
Do you know at what point in the closing this
are interaction took place; was it at the
beginning?
A. It would have been near the very
beginning.
And where was -— did you say that she exited
the room and you told her not to go back in?
A. That is correct.
Did she go back in?
A. I don't believe she would have gone in,
unless to go in and say that she was not
going to stay in the room.
Do you know where she would have been for the
remainder of the closing?
A. She would have been in her office.
Just to repeat, you were not in the
conference room during the closing?
A. That is correct.
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. - Vol. II — May 9, 2017
16
And what happened after the closing?
A. After the closing, Mr. Paplauskas and the
Majewskis exited the conference room. I was
in possession of the seller's document, the
deed.
And I went to convey them to
Mr. Paplauskae, saying are you going to go
and record them, at which point he informed
me that no, he did not do that. He sent all
of the documents to the lender, and the
lender would then forward them to the title
company for recording.
This made me uneasy because I'm
holding that deed in escrow and I tendered it
to him, even though I didn't receive the
funds or any knowledge that they would be
sent to me shortly.
My recollection is that it did not
go on record for three days.
Why don't we stop there for now.
A. Okay.
After he came out with the closing documents,
did you look at any of the executed
documents?
A. I did not.
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II ~ May 9, 2017
l7
Did you provide him with the deed?
A. I did, amongst other documents.
Can you say one more time what the other
documents, other than the deed, would have
been?
A. Residency affidavits for the seller. We
have other seller documents that we prepare,
things along the lines of proration of taxes
if there are issues down the line because
some closings occur before the next property
tax bill comes out.
We have certain disclosure forms
that we prepare. He would have been given
whatever we needed to give him.
After Mr. Paplauskas left your office, did
you have any more contact with him?
A. No.
Do you know generally how long after the
closing you filed your complaint?
A. A matter of weeks.
Just talking relatively in terms of time, I
think you are saying weeks?
A. Yes, maybe two weeks.
And could you explain to the Committee why
you felt a need to file this complaint?
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. ~ Vol. II ~ May 9, 2017
18
A. To me, this is a much bigger issue than
Mr. Paplauskas and whatever he did or didn't
say in the conference roam.
This was occurring approximately,
I believe, when in 2014 or 2015 the new rules
came into place for the Consumer Finance
Protection Bureau.
And we are under heavy scrutiny to
conform with all of the new policies that
this Federal Government agency was putting
upon closing attorneys to the point where we
had to upgrade software.
We had to put security protocols
in place. We got insurance in case the
office was hacked.
We spent a considerable amount of
money protecting our office because this is
our profession.
We have a notary public who shows
up to do the closing who is not subject to
any of the same rules that we are subject
to. This is the biggest asset the Majewskis
may or may not ever buy.
In my opinion, a notary can say,
sign here. He cannot say this is this form,
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. ~ Vol. II — May 9, 2017
19
your interest rate is this. That is
officiating a closing.
What I found troubling was the
recording, where Mr. Paplauskas told me that
he didn't do the recording. Now I don't know
where my original signed deed is going. I
don't know —— it's not going to be in his
custody because he said he was overnighting
it to a lender.
I inquired about who would be
doing the recording and I don't know was the
response that I got. When, I don't know was
the response that I received.
And then you start taking a look
at the bigger picture. My escrow account,
every month the interest is swept. I don't
know if the person who was doing this is
subject to those rules.
So now this goes to a policy of
the Rhode Island Bar Association, that all
the interest in my IOLTA account is swept
monthly for indigent defense.
Now you start wondering when an
out—of-state bank is doing this practice, are
they under the same rules that I'm under, so
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II ~ May 9, 2017
you start getting into equity.
Then you get into the issues of I
represent the seller. Well, normally the
seller has vacated the house. They have
tendered the keys for the buyer. If there is
a loss due to a fire before that house is
recorded, now we have an issue.
The seller has to bear the cost in
this notary transaction for insuring the
house for'an additional two or three days and
that is not ordinary and customary in the
State of Rhode Island.
I looked at it in its totality and
it was just enough that I felt that this
needed to be addressed by this Committee on
whether or not a notary public, under these
new rules —— once the Consumer Finance
Protection Bureau started changing the
closing world in the State of Rhode Island,
and everything that I'm subject to, I think
it's time that the Committee looked at who is
doing closings as a consumer—protection
iSSue.
MR. BERGERON: Okay. Do any of
the Committee members have questions for
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9/5/2018 8:46 AM" '
William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II ~ May 9, 2017
21
Mr. Pagliarini?
MS. MACIASZ DISANTO: I have a
question.
EXAMINATION BY MS. MACIASZ DISANTO
Are you»aware of the Department of Justice,
whether or not attorneys should be required
to attend real estate closings?
A. I am not.
Are you aware if attorneys need to be present
for a11 and conduct all real estate closings?
A. I am not.
I was just asking you that because I don't
know if that has changed since these new
federal regulations.
A. Okay.
MR. STRACHMAN: I have a question.
EXAMINATION BY MR. STRACHMAN
Was there any indication that Mr. Paplauskas
was doing anything other than serving as a
notary, in other words, ascribing the
witness' signature, while at your office?
A. No. I did have a conversation with the
buyers post-closing, but I will leave their
testimony to them.
What did they tell you?
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II — May 9, 2017
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MR. PICCIRILLI: I will object.
A. They were unsettled ~—
MR. PICCIRILLI: A ruling,
please.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: I will allow
it.
THE WITNESS: It is my
recollection they were unsettled. They
expected an attorney to be officiating their
closing.V
That means you did not conduct the closing,
the closing was conducted by your associate?
A. Technically at the closing, the settlement
agent is the buyer's attorney, which leads to
a very interesting happening in this case.
As the buyers walked out of the
room and I asked for a copy of the settlement
agreement, it was not signed by
Mr. Paplauskas, who said that it got sent to
the bank and that somebody there signed it.
I have a non—attending party who is the
settlement agent, which is very odd.
So the transaction was not complete?
A. That is technically correct.
MR. PICCIRILLI: Objection. That
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. - Vol. II — May 9, 2017
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is an incorrect statement of the law.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: I will allow
it.
THE WITNESS: Until the deed was
recorded that completes the transaction.
There was no recording of the deed?
A. Yes.
There was no signed equivalent of the HUD—l
form?
A. Buyers signed, sellers signed, settlement
agent did not sign. Now whether or not that
makes it defective, I don't know.
It was not completed that day in your office?
A. I will say correct to that statement.
Your clients did not get their dough?
A. That is correct.
Right?
A. Yes.
And they didn't know for sure when they would
get the dough?
A. Correct.
And your clients are still insuring the
property?
A. Correct.
And you don't know for sure who Mr.
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II ~ May 9,.2017
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Paplauskas is sending these documents to?
A. That is correct.
Original documents, like the deed?
A. Correct.
Is that right?
A. He said he was sending them to the lender.
And it is not a matter of his misleading
anybody, we are not talking about that, you
just didn't know where it was going for sure?
A. That's right.
Compare that to a lawyer showing up at the
closing, why is that different if a local
lawyer frdm your town would have appeared for
the bfiyer?
A. If a local attorney showed up, he would
have left-and I probably would have gotten a
call within an hour or two that it was on
record and that we were done.
And then he either —— the custom
in Rhode Island is that my seller's
proceeds -— he issues the checks, he is the
settlement agent.
If the seller requested funding by
check, he asked me to hold it in escrow, he
will give me the seller's proceeds, a
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$500,000 check. I would hold it.
He will send me a text message and
say, I am on record and I can release the
check immediately. It normally happens
within the same day by the close of business.
When did your clients actually receive their
funds in that case?
A. It’is my understanding three days later it
was wired.
But you didn't know leaving that closing
exactly when it would be wired?
A. No.
And you didn't know what day it would be
wired?
A. No.
And you didn't know who was going to wire it?
A. Not at all.
All you knew effectively was there was a
notary acting as a currier, right, who took
the documents and relayed them to the lender?
A. Yes.
MR. STRACHMAN: Thank you.
EXAMINATION BY CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS
Mr. Pagliarini, in all of your years or your
experience as an attorney performing
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II ~ May 9, 2017
closings, how often have you experienced a
ndtary appearing on behalf of ——
A. This was the first instance. I know it
occurs daily because there are title
companies that are run by notaries public
that do not have attorneys on staff. It does
happen daily, just in my happenings, it just
never occurred.
RE—EXAMINATION BY MR. STRACHMAN
I'm a little confused. You said your
partner, or associate, Ms. Conn, you didn't
want her.in the room with the buyers; is that
right?
A. Correct.
Why was that?
A. We get paid by the seller to represent the
seller. Because there was no other attorney
in the roam, I didn't want her giving legal
advice.
Now, one can make a philosophical
argument that it could have been more
important for her to be there in case
something was misstated. I asked her to
leave the room.
So that the buyer would not be misled or
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misunderstand/that the buyers were not
getting legal advice from MS. Conn?
A. Yes. It can get confusing at a closing
who you represent.
Who was advising the buyers at the closing?
A. I would say nobody. And I am not going to
allege that it was Mr. Paplauskas, but the
only one in the room —— and I am not certain
if their Realtor was in the room, but it was
not us.
Why did the closing have to go forward that
day? Why not say to the buyers, go get your
lawyer and come back tomorrow?
A. It's not that easy because there are
moving trucks involved. There are a host of
reasons why you never want to do that just
from that.
You're locked into a rate, it's calculated?
A. There's a variety of reasons.
MR. PICCIRILLI: At this point, I
object. This is becoming highly speculative
as to what happened in this case. He was not
representing the buyer. Whatever happened
with the buyer, he was not in the room. This
is all speculative as to what might have
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II — May 9, 2017
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happened or what did happen. Ask the
Majewskis when they came in here, don't ask
him.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Overruled.
This is an investigational hearing. We are
getting information about what went on and
what goes on.
Why not close the next day? Why not tell
them to go home and get a lawyer?
A. The Majewskis to get a lawyer? Because
now is'the lawyer that they get on that
lender's list an approved attorney? Do they
have to redo the documents?
There is normally a redrafting fee
of $250 to redraft documents for a different
date. It just sets off a series of
problems.
MR. STRACHMAN: Thank you.
MR. VESPIA: I have a question.
EXAMINATION BY MR. VESPIA
Would it be fair for me to assume that you
brought this complaint, for the record, more
or less as a test case because you were
concerned with this type of conduct from a
notary public happening too often?
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II - May 9, 2017
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A. my concern is not so much Mr. Paplauskas,
as long as the question moves forward.
MR. VESPIA: That answers my
question. Thank you.
RE—EXAMINATION MS. MACIASZ DISANTO
I don't practice in the area of real estate,
so forgive me. Have you ever done a closing
where the buyer did not have an attorney
other than this one?
A. Did I represent that buyer?
Let's say you represented the seller; have
you done a closing where the buyer was
unrepresented?
A. I cannot think of an instance where that
would occur.
And in your experience, does the lender
normally provide the buyer with an attorney?
A. It depends. The buyer can ask for anybody
in the State of Rhode Island to do their
title, but certain lenders require approved
attorneys on the list to be the settlement
agent.
Let's say in a rare instance there was no
loan involved in theEreal estate transaction.
A. Okay.
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. ~ Vol. II ~ May 9, 2017
It is my understanding there would be far
fewer sort of documents to be executed?
A. Yes.
So the closing would be significantly
simpler?
A. Yes.
But in that instance, the buyer could hire
any attorney?
A. Or not. Usually they would because
somebody is going to issue the title policy.
Usually a cash deal is usually a more
sophisticated buyer, it is not their first
closing.
You could get anybody, yourself
included. Where you admit you don't do real
estate, under the rules of the State of Rhode
Island, you could write the title policy.
I see. Have you ever represented a buyer at
a closing where the seller did not have an
attorney?
A. Where the seller did not have an attorney?
That cah't really occur because then the
seller would be drafting their own deed.
Normally in that instance, we would probably
represent both sides of the transaction.
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II — May 9, 2017
In what circumstances would you represent
both sides?
A. If we were asked by both sides. If we
called you and said, you're purchasing a
property, who is your legal counsel on the
seller's side and he said, I don't have one,
we would say, do you want us to prepare the
document.
I assume there is some sort of informed
consent‘that goes on because you're
representing two parties?
A. No. Because it is A transactional base,
there is no disclosure like that. If there
becomes a problem, we step out and both sides
have to get their own attorney.
Do you think that it's impossible for a
closing to occur without both sides being
represented?
A. I don't think it's impossible, it's highly
unlikely.
You're not familiar with closings going
forward without both sides being represented
either by two attorneys or one attorney?
A. It depends on who the person is.
Personally, I am selling a piece of land at
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II — May 9, 2017
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the'end of the month and I will represent
myself, so I don't have an attorney. It
depends on the buyer and the level of the
sophistication or the seller and the level of
sophistication.
RE — EXAMINATION BY CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS
Mr. Pagliarini, would there be an occasion
for the seller to have a lawyer and the
lender to have a lawyer and the buyer to have
a lawyer?
A. There could be. Usually that is in the
instance that was raised where your family
member or friend wants you to write the title
policy, and you have that right in the Rhode
Island.
In a transaction, that's where the
money is, it's the title policy. The lender
may call me up and say, we want you to do the
closing, but she will do the title.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS : Okay . I
understand.
MR. BERGERON: Do you have any
questions, Janet?
MS . GILLIGAN : No .
MR. BERGERON: No more questions
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. ~ Vol. II - May 9, 2017
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from the Committee. Mr. Piccirilli you are
free to cross—examine Mr. Pagliarini.
CROSS EXAMINATION BY MR. PICCIRILLI
Generally speaking, there are closings that
can be categorized in two types for
residential real estate; those involving
purchases and those not involving purchases?
A. You want to have a closing that does not
involve a purchase?
Yes.
A. Could you clarify?
You're a seasoned real estate attorney; have
you done a refi where there is no sale?
A. Yes.
You have done a refinance closing?
A. Yes.
Where there is no buyer?
A. That is correct.
No seller or no buyer?
A. That's correct.
Just a borrower and a lender?
A. Sure.
Have you taken a line of credit out on your
house?
A. Me?
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II — May 9, 2017
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Yes.
A. I don't own a house.
Do you know anyone thét has gone to a bank
and taken a line of credit or home loan
against their house and have the loan
officers do all of the paperwork and explain
the documents and no attorneys are involved;
have you ever heard of that situation?
A. Okay.
Have you ever heard of that type of
situation, Mr. Pagliarini, in your l7 years
of practicing real estate law in the State of
Rhode Islahd?
A. The only kind that I would say where that
is accurate is in a HELOC, a second loan on a
house, that can be done in a bank's office.
Without an attorney present, correct?
A. Usually.
Is that practicing law?
A. In my opinion, yes.
So all of the banks that have been doing this
for decades, if not longer, that have loan
officers who prepare documents, or someone in
their back office prepares them, and they
explain the documents to the borrower, that's
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. ~ Vol. II — May 9, 2017
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illegally practicing law, in your opinion?
A. Sure. Yes.
So you would want someone who gets a line of
credit against their house to be forced to
spend money on an attorney that they really
don't need to?
A. Yes.
Have you ever been involved in a commercial
real estate transaction?
A. Yes, Sir.
Isn't that typically where the lender does
have their own attorney that prepares and
represents the lender in the transaction?
A. Yes.
And the borrower and seller have their own
individual attorneys?
A. Yes.
But in most residential real estate
transactions, there is no separate attorney
between the lender and the borrower; isn't
that true in your experience?
A. Between the lender and the borrower, in
most cases that is correct. But going back
to the question that anybody can do a title
would make it a different situation.
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II — May 9, 2017
I'm not talking about anybody doing title,
Mr. Pagliarini. I'm talking about the
typical situation where a borrower is buying
real estate, goes to a bank, the bank tells
them, as they are required by 19—9—6, that
they have a right to their own title
attorney.
The bank can have their own
closing attorney. Most borrowers will have
the bank pick the closing attorney and the
title attorney, and there is only that one
attorney at the closing, correct?
A. Most of your statement is correct. I
don't know that most borrowers would just
pick off the bank's lender. So many times
they have their own attorney.
Do you have any relationships with any
mortgage lenders?
A. Sure.
And have you gotten real estate closings
through that mortgage lender where the
borrower lets the mortgage lender pick and
you happen to be the one that the mortgage
lender picks?
A. The mortgage lender does not pick. The
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II - May 9, 2017
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mortgage lender gives them at least three
names and somebody is picked off of that. I
have been the recipient of that selection
process, yes, I have.
Your experience is they give at least three
names?
A. That's the way it should be done.
I'm not asking you if that's the way it
should be done. In your experience, do you
have any idea how the mortgage companies
present these attorneys to the buyer?
A. Usually there's a list. Certain lenders
have a list of attorneys and based on the
CFPB in October of 2015, those lists have
been peered down.
I can tell you that Washington
Trust has eight lawyers in the State of Rhode
Island on their list. It's a short list.
Again, are you familiar with 19—9—6?
A. I am not.
MR. PICCIRILLI: I Will have thiS
exhibit marked.
MR. BERGERON: Would you mark this
as Exhibit 11.
EXHIBIT ll MARKED FOR IDENTIFICATION
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. - Vol. II - May 9, 2017
Q. I will ask you to review that statute,
Mr. Pagliarini, that you do not seem to be
aware of, even though you claim to be
experienced in real estate law for the last
17 years.
A. Okay.
THE WITNESS: I would respectfully
ask that Attorney Piccirilli change his
'tone. I find it annoying.
MR. PICCIRILLI: I will not change
my tone, Mr. Pagliarini. You don't have the
right to tell me that.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: I do. We
are all officers of the Court here. If we
could just keep it polite and respectful, it
would be much appreciated.
MR. PICCIRILLI: I have no respect
for this witness. And if you are going to
tell me to be polite, I will.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Mr.
Piccirilli, that is unnecessary. So if we
could proceed, please.
Tell me when you are done reviewing that
statute, Mr. Pagliarini.
A. Sure.
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II ~ May 9, 2017
(WITNESS PERUSES DOCUMENT)
MR. BERGERON: I would object to
Mr. Pagliarini giving official, legal opinion
as to the reading of a Statute. He may
express his understanding of it.
MR. PICCIRILLI: This witness
claims to be an experienced real estate
attorney, yet he does not know this statute,
which'is fundamental to what title companies
are obligated or mortgage companies are
obligated to advise their potential
borrowers.
He testified about his
understanding and his practice of how
mértgage companies have lists of approved
attorneys, et cetera. He clearly has some
knowledge of this. I am asking if he is
aware of this statute.
MR. BERGERON: Sure.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: I believe he
answered you.
MR..PICCIRILLI: First he said no.
And now I am asking him to review it to see
if it reminds him of it.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: For the
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purpose of?
MR. PICCIRILLI: Refreshing his
recollection. If he does not recall it after
this, I don't see how he could be qualified
as a competent witness with regard to real
estate.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: We have not
offered him here as an expert. We asked him
customarily questions about what he has done
and what went on.
MR. PICCIRILLI: Then I ask that
all testimony regarding what is customary in
the real estate practice in Rhode Island by
this witness~be stricken.
My assumption was that he was
testifying as someone with l7 years of
experience who has performed 150 closings a
‘year. That means he has some experience in
this area of practice.
If he doesn't know this statute,
then I would suggest that he doesn't have the
requisite experience in this state, and that
any testimony regarding what is customary and
regular practice regarding real estate
closings in Rhode Island by this witness be
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stricken.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Mr.
Piccirilli, I'm going to ask you to move on
to something else. Please proceed with some
other line of questioning.
MR. PICCIRILLI: You're not
allowing me to ask him about’the statute?
THE WITNESS: If I may, I believe
this statute is the fact pattern that I gave
to the member that you have the right to
select your own title attorney in the State
of Rhode Island.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: He has
answered, so preceed.
And it has to be in writing?
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: We can all
read the statute.
Do you know whether the Majewskis were told
in writing as to whether or not they had the
right to a title attorney?
A. That's a form in the closing package that
the buyer's attorney customarily has signed
during the closing process.
I represented the seller. I would
be unknowledgeable or without knowledge if
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the Majewskis signed that document becauée
Mr. Paplauskas would have been in custody of
that document.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS:
Mr. Piccirilli, please move on to something
else.
Did you ever ask the Majewskis, when they
came out and said they were unsettled there
was not an attorney there, did you ever ask
them did the mortgage company advise you that
you have the right to your own title
attorney; did you tell them that?
A. I believe you will have the right to ask
the Majewskis that question. My recollection
is they thought there would be an attorney in
the room.
So the answer is no, you did not ask them
that question?
A. I don't know who wrote their title
insurance policy. It could have been an
attorney. All I know is that Mr. Paplauskas
officiated the closing and was not an
attorney. That doesn't mean he wrote the
title policy.
You already testified you were not present in
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the room when the closing commenced?
A. I did.
Did you have any communications regarding
this particular closing with anyone prior to
the date of closing?
A. Attorney Conn would have been in contact
with the lender to schedule the closing.
Would Attorney Conn, in that capacity, be
responsible for finding out things like Who
is going to do the closing for the buyer and
the borrower?
A. That would be a legitimate question. She
can answer that. I can't tell you whether or
not she recollects the answer to that, but
she is outside.
I am going to ask you, you said she came out
of the room and she was uncomfortable?
A. Yes.
Did you ask her at that time, didn't you
clear this with the lender first? Did they
tell you they were sending an attorney? Did
you find out when the funds would be
available? Did you find out who would be
coming and representing the mortgage company?
Did you ask her any of those questions when
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she came out and SAID she was uncomfortable?
A. No. She told me Mr. Paplauskas was not an
attorney.
Did you ask her any of those questions before
you filed your complaint on,August 5?
A. Irrelevant to me.
So the answer is no, you did not ask her?
A. That is correct, sir.
Let me see if I understand this. You're
representing a seller in a transaction?
A. Yes.
And it's not the practice of your office to
find out from the buyer or the buyer's
borrower when they are going to have the
funds for the seller?
A. When they ere going to have the funds for
the seller?
Yes.
A. We contact the lender or the lender
contacts us and says we are scheduling the
closing. Fine. Our office is available.
The buyer and the seller both live in the
Town of Tiverton. The closing is in
Tiverton. They came to our office.
At that point, I'm just the
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. - Vol. II - May 9, 2017
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seller's attorney. The buyer's counsel is in
charge of the funding. My expectation is I
was going to get it that day.
Again, Mr. Pagliarini, you said you have been
doing this for quite a while. Isn't it your
experience that if you're representing the
seller, you want to know who the buyers
attorney is or who the bank's attorney is?
A. Yes, sir;
You would not generally agree to schedule a
closing unless you knew that in advance,
right?
A. I am the seller's attorney. I, in this
case, was told by the bank the closing is at
a certain date, time and location.
Whether or not they told Attorney
Conn it was Mr. Paplauskas who would be the
settlement agent, I can't answer that.
I'm talking about your practice. This is
your law office. Ms. Conn works for you, or
she did at the time?
A. She did at the time.
Ultimately it's your responsibility, Mr.
Pagliarini?
A. Yes, sir.
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And again, is it your practice to schedule a
closing if you don't know who the attorney is
going to be that's conducting the closing?
A. As I testified earlier, this is the first
time that a non—attorney showed up to do the
closing.
That is not my question, Mr. Pagliarini. my
question is before you even agree to schedule
a closing, wouldn‘t it be your practice to
know who the attorney is representing the
bank and the buyer?
A. On the other side of this transaction, I
believe Ms. Conn dealt with the lender
itself.
She apparently was comfortable scheduling the
closing without knowing whether there was an
attorney or not -— you have to let me finish
my question, Mr. Pagliarini, before you
answer. Ms. Conn apparently felt comfortable
scheduling this closing without knowing if
and who was going to be representing the
buyer and the borrower at this closing,
right?
A. We did not schedule this closing. The
lender scheduled the closing. We, as the
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II — May 9, 2017
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seller's agent, showed up at our own office
and Mr. Paplauskas walked in with the
documents. It was a surprise to everybody
that he was not a Rhode Island licensed
attorney.
So you were not involved. You allowed
someone else to use your law office to
conduct a closing; do you normally do that?
A. Yes, sir. There are reasons we do that.
This goes back to my complaint where the
Consumer Finance Protection Bureau has
certain rules in place.
My copy machine is secure.
Mr. Paplauskas, and I am not intimating that
he could have, he could take this to the
local Staples and run this entire closing
package, including the buyer's application
with their entire credit history, through a
copy machine.
Mr. Pagliarini, if you don't stop
pontificating ——
A. I'm answering your question.
MR. PICCIRILLI: I ask the Chair
to direct him to answer the question and not
go on with this unresponsive pontificating.
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CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Mr.
Piccirilli, please calm down.
MR. PICCIRILLI: I don't want to
have to come back here again. The witness is
being unresponsive to my question. I ask you
to answer my question.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Mr.
Piccirilli, I find you are being combative.
This is an investigational hearing. Please
be respectful. We are all officers of the
Court.
Mr. Pagliarini, please continue.
THE WITNESS: Can the question be
read back, please.
(QUESTION READ BACK)
THE WITNESS: Yes.
How often do you do that?
A. If I may answer the question.
You just did.
A. I was directed to answer the question.
You answered it, and now I'm asking another
question.
A. My answer is yes.
How often do you do it?
A. I do it as often as needed.
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In the last year, how many times have you
done it?
A. I have no idea, sir.
A dozen times?
A. Sir, understand ~—
One time? Ten times? A hundred times?
MR. BERGERON: I ask that he be
allowed to answer the question.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Mr.
Piccirilli, please allow him to answer.
Please do not talk over the witness, as the
stenographer is trying to take this down for
the record.
THE WITNESS: The rules have
changed. I can no longer —~ I should not go
to a Realtor's office and close. Their copy
machine is not secure.
I used to close at the public
library or town hall. We cannot do that
anymore because there is a memory chip in a
copy machine.
If another attorney calls me up
and says, John, I'm from North Providence and
I have a closing in Tiverton, can I use your
office, absolutely.
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If somebody calls and says, I'm
title counsel, you're the seller's attorney,
my office is in Providence, the récording is
in Little Compton, can we hold the closing at
your office, absolutely. That's the answer
to your question.
You didn't do that in this case.because you
just said if it was an attorney that you knew
or an attorney that called you and said, can
I do the closing at your office, you would
say okay. Apparently nobody did that in this
case, ask if there was going to be an
attorney, did they?~
A. We were told by the lender that the
closing would be on such—and—such a date and
such a time at my office. I don't know who
is going to show up.
Just because I deal with you as
the attorney doesn't mean that one of your
associates won't show up.
I will tell you, Mr. Pagliarini, I would be
really uncomfortable waiting to see who shows
up at my office for a closing without knowing
that in advance. You're not uncomfortable
with that?
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II ~ May 9, 2017
A. I don't believe that's what I said.
You just testified that you did not know who
was coming to your office, that anybody could
have walked in your office saying they
represented the title company and you would
not have any idea?
A. I will say yes, that's a possibility.
You wouldn't even know if they were licensed
to practice in Rhode Island; they could have
been an attorney in'Massachusetts that showed
up. Would you ask them for their bar card?
A. I would not.
That seems like a very secure scenario.
A. I object to that statement.
You never mentioned anything about insurance
in your complaint?
A. What type of insurance, sir.
You testified that your seller had to
maintain insurance for a few days after the
closing, but you didn't put that in the
complaint, did you?
A. No.
Is that correct?
A. I would have to reread the complaint.
Well, reread it.
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A. Okay. I do not see that fact, sir.
The first complaint you have is that
attorneys are required to maintain
malpractice insurance but notaries public are
not. Do you know whether Mr. Paplauskas had
insurance?
A. I do not.
If I told you that he did, would that
surprise you?
A. Is it malpractice?
If I told you that it was errors and
omissions insurance as a notary public, does
that surprise you?
A. That does not matter, it's not my
statement.
Number 2, you say, It's reasonable to ponder
what recourse the buyer may have against the
notary public should the buyer default on the
loan, securing the purchase property claiming
they were not properly informed or if the
notary failed to disclose if there was a
prepayment penalty.
Are you saying that only an
attorney can tell a buyer whether or not
there's a prepayment penalty and what the
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II — May 9, 2017
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implications of that are?
A. I'm saying that there are many land mines
in a closing that the settlement agent could
walk into by not discussing with the
bdrrower, particularly on a refinance, as you
so aptly raised the issue, with the right of
rescission.
There are many issues that you
need to discuss so that you have a
well-informed buyer.
And aren't those usually performed by the
mortgage company?
A. I disagree with that. There are 60 to 100
pages of documents. Each page, we look at it
and we explain cursory to the borrower and we
answer any questions they may have at the
closing.
You are not the only one who can answer those
questions; can't a notary public answer THOSE
questions?
A. Absolutely not.
Are you familiar with 42—30—8 of the Rhode
Island General Laws; are you familiar with
the statute?
A. I did not memorize the entire general
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II ~ May 9, 2017
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statutes, can you please be more specific as
to what that statute says?
MR. PICCIRILLI: I ask that be
marked as Exhibit 12.
MR. BERGERON: Mark this as
Exhibit 12, please.
EXHIBIT 12 MARKED FOR IDENTIFICATION
(WITNESS PERUSES DOCUMENT)
THE WITNESS: Okay.
You're a notary public, aren't you, Mr.
Pagliarini?
A. I am.
Doesn't this statute say that notaries public
have the power not only to explain what is
involved in a mortgage, but they can prepare
the documents; isn't that what this statute
says?
(WITNESS PERUSES DOCUMENT)
A. I don't see that. Where do you see that?
The promissory note, Mr. Pagliarini.
A. They can sign a pramissory note, but where
does it say that they can draft them?
Transact, do and finish all matters and
things related to promissory notes.
A. I would have to read the entire statute to
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. - Vol. II — May 9, 2017
find out what the definition sections are.
IS it your testimony, Mr. Pagliarini, that
you do not think anyone but an attorney in
the State of Rhode Island can explain what a
prepayment penalty is to a borrower?
A. As a settlement agent, I would say that a
notary public should not be doing that.
A notary public shouldn't, but if the statute
says they can, then you're wrong, right?
A. That's your interpretation of the statute,
sir.
Are you familiar with the standards of
conduct for notaries in the State of Rhode
Island?
A. I think the Secretary of State gave me the
little book at the time and I am sure I read
it 20 years ago.
MR. BERGERON: I totally would
object to Mr. Pagliarini being asked to
provide legal oonclusions with respect to the
various statutes. He can certainly reply as
to his familiarity with them, but to the
extent that he is being asked to render some
sort of legal opinion on these documents, I
don't think it's appropriate. I think that
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II — May 9, 2017
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is the province of the Committee.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Can you
please explain the reasoning for the
questioning on.these statues?
MR. PICCIRILLI: I will ask
Mr. Pagliarini, since he is here to
pontificate his belief of what the practice
of law is, if he's aware of the standards of
conduct which the Secretary of State has
promulgated most recently in November of 2009
under Section 6 where it says, This section
does not preclude a notary public who is’duly
qualified, trained or experienced in a
particular industry or professional field
from selecting, drafting, completing or
advising on a document or certificate related
to a matter Within that industry or field.
Are you familiar with that, Mr. Pagliarini?
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Hold on,
Mr. Piccirilli. There is an objection
pending. I believe you were the one who
elicited from Mr. Pagliarini an opinion as to
whether or not something was the practice of
law.
I understand that Mr. Pagliarini
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II — May 9, 2017
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is the complainant and filed a complaint in
this matter. If you could just finish up
with this question and move on to something
else, please.
MR. PICCIRILLI: Does that mean he
can't answer the question?
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: He can
answer this question on.whether or not he is
familiar with this provision.
MR. PICCIRILLI: I will ask that
this be marked as an exhibit.
MR. BERGERON: Could you mark this
as Exhibit 13, please.
EXHIBIT 13 MARKED FOR IDENTIFICATION
THE WITNESS: What section in
particular, sir?
MR. PICCIRILLI: Section 6, Page
10.
(WITNESS PERUSES DOCUMENT)
THE WITNESS: Reading Section A, A
non—attorney notary public should not assist
a non—attorney drafting, completing,
selecting or understanding a document or
transaction requiring a notarial act,
rendering legal advice or otherwise engage in
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II - May 9, 2017
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the practice of law. Or is it Section B,
sir?
MR. PICCIRILLI: I said Section B,
and you know that. That was being snarky.
THE WITNESS: This section does
not preclude a notary publis who is duly
qualified, trained or experienced in a
particular industry or profession field from
selecting, drafting or advising on a document
or a certificate related to a matter within
that industry or field.
If someone is a notary who has been
practicing in the area of mortgage lending
for 30—some-odd years, almost 49 years,
almost as long as I have been alive, someone
who has been doing mortgages for that long,
you would say that they are duly qualified,
trained and experienced in mortgages,
wouldn't you?
A. Again, I am not in the position of
answering that question.
MR. PICCIRILLI: I'll Withdraw the
question.
One last question. Did you refer to this
document from the Secretary of State's
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. ~ Vol. II ~ May 9, 2017
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website? Did you refer to that before you
filed the complaint?
A. This document ——
My question is, did you refer to it before
you filed the complaint?
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Allow the
witness to answer, please.
Yes or no.
A. No.
MR. PICCIRILLI: Thank you.
NUmber 3, Attorneys hold deeds in escrow
until they are recorded usually that day.
Attorneys do not hold deeds in any kind of
escrow, do they, in Rhode Island?
A. We do it all of the time, sir.
Don't you usually, at a closing, have the
buyer's attorney, or whoever is conducting
the closing for the buyer, get the deed from
the seller and say to the seller, we are not
going to disburse until this deed is recorded
because we have to run the title and make
sure there are no intervening liens or
anything on the title? Isn't that how it
usually happens?
A. By definition, it's held in escrow. And
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there are other things that are factored into
that. The attorney needs to know that the
funds are readily available before they
record.
You've never had a closing done,
Mr. Pagliarini, where the bank has not wired
the funds into whatever account they need to
be disbursed from and you had to wait for the
funds?
A. After the recording?
No, before the recording.
A. Yes. You wait and the deed is held in
escrow until. There are also times like this
where the seller signed the document a week
before that it is held in escrow.
Held in escrow by whom?
A. I held that deed in escrow. The minute I
handed it to Mr. Paplauskas, had he been
an attorney, it would have been held in
escrow until such time that.it was recorded.
And then the practice in Rhode Island is only
attorneys record those documents?
A. NO.
In fact, the practice in Rhode Island is that
attorneys usually do not record the
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documents?
A. That is probably accurate half of the
time.
At least half the time, if not more?
A. Yes.
You use title examiners, don't you?
A. Title examiner has nothing to do with the
recording.
Do you use a title examiner?
A. Sure.
Do you give the deed and mortgage to the
title examiner to record?
A. Absolutely not.
You're the only one who records?
A. The title examiner is not.the person who
does the recording.
Who does the recording in the office?
A. What office are we talking about; at the
time or my new office?
Either one.
A. It depends. I have two closings on
Thursday and I've been asked to do the
recordings myself because of proximity. If
not, we have an individual, who I'm sure has
been BCI checked, and who is the runner, if
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William E. ?aplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II - May 9, 2017
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you will; who goes to town hall and does what
he needs to do.
A non—attorney?
A. He is a non—attorney.
You entrust that deed and that mortgage to
that non-attorney to go record?
A. That person has a contractual relationship
with the firm, so yes.
Okay. Fair enough. There was a mortgage
company involved in this transaction, both a
mortgage company, JPMorgan Chase, and a title
company, ServiceLink, correct?
A. Correct.
They are both subject to oversight by the
Consumer Finance Protection Bureau, correct?
A. Presumably.
And so Number 4, you're concerned about the
oversight, there was oversight in this
transaction. Both the lender and the title
company had that oversight, correct?
A. To me that's a stretch. I'm not going to
say yes or no to that.
Isn't the CFPB primarily directed to mortgage
companies and title companies; isn't that the
primary purpose of the CFPB?
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A. Yes, sir.
So they have the oversight?
A. Yes.
And Mr. Paplauskas has a contractual
relationship with those entities, correct?
A. Presumably. I have not seen the contract.
Just like your title runner has a contractual
relationship, right?
A. It's not the same as you just described.
It sounds exactly the same to me.
A. Does it?
And I bet every single member of this
Committee who has a reasonably open mind will
agree it is exactly the same, Mr. Pagliarini.
And your refusal to acknowledge that
seriously undermines your credibility,
doesn't it, Mr. Pagliarini?
MR. BERGERON: I will obviously
object to that statement.
MR. PICCIRILLI: I'll Withdraw
it.
Number 5, Closing attorneys are subject to
oversight by the CFPB in the Rhode Ieland
Supreme Court for negligence and malfeasance.
Is your title runner subject to oversight by
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. ~ Vol. II ~ May 9, 2017
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the CFPB and the Supreme Court for negligence
and malfeasance?
A. No.
You said Mr. Paplauskas left the closing
without campleting the settlement statement,
as the settlement agent signature block is
left blank.
There is nothing under Rhode
Island law that requires a settlement
statement to be signed by anybody, is there?
A. By anybody?
Correct, under Rhode Island law.
A. As a practitioner for 17 years, which you
are going to go to next, I don't know the
answer to that, if there's a Rhode Island
Statute.
Anything governing the signing of the
settlement statement, or as they call it now,
a CD, there is no requirement, other than
what the Federal Government has under the
CFPB, right?
A. I would say it's more that while they have
regulatory over it, that it very well could
be the individual lender's control.
Let me ask you this, Mr. Pagliarini, a buyer
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II ~ May 9, 2017
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and seller know each other. The seller has a
piece of land, no mortgage, only worth about
$10,000 or $20,000. He says to the buyer, do
you want to buy it, and the buyer says, sure.
The two of them sit down and draw
up a deed. They exchange the money, somebody
goes to record it. There is no settlement
Statement. Is that illegal in Rhode Island?
MR. BERGERON: I object to the
request for a legal opinion. Mr. Pagliarini
can respond with his understanding. And I
also object to answering hyfiotheticals that
are unconnected to ~—
MR. PICCIRILLI : I ' ll Withdraw the
question. I think I made my point. I would
ask this Committee that if they don't keep an
open and reasonable mind about these things,
to think about that real hard.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS : Mr .
Piccirilli, you can save any statement you
would like to make for later on, after the
case has been completed.
MR. BERGERON: Do you have any
further questions for Mr. Pagliarini?
The only people in your office at the time of
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this closing were you, Hailey Conn, a
Realtor, the buyers and Mr. Paplauskas; there
was no secretary in your office at the time?
A. No.
You don't have a secretary?
A. No, I did not.
MR. PICCIRILLI: I have nothing
further.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Does anyone
on the Committee have any follow—up questions
for Mr. Pagliarini?
MR. BERGERON: Now that
Mr. Pagliarini is leaving, do we agree that
he is free to leave and we have no further
questions?
MR. PICCIRILLI: I have no further
questions of him.
THE WITNESS: Thank you.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Good
afternoon. If you could please identify
yourself for the record.
THE WITNESS: HAILEY MUNNS
Being duly sworn, deposes and
testifies as follows:
DIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR. BERGERON
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I'm Tdm Bergeron. As you know, I'm counsel
to the Committee and I will ask you a serieé
of questions. After that, members of the
Committee will get to ask you questions. And
Mr. Piccirilli, counsel for Mr. Paplauskas,
will be able to ask you questions.
A. Okay.
What is your date of birth?
A. My date of birth is November 16, 1987.
And is munns your married name?
A. Correct, yes.
What name did you go by previously?
A. Hailey Conn.
What is your current occupation?
A. Attorney.
When were you admitted to the Rhode Island
Bar?
A. 2013.
And have you been admitted to practice law in
any other state?
A. No.
Have you practiced in Rhode Island since
being first admitted?
A. Yes.
And have you been in private practice all of
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — V01. II — May 9, 2017
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that time'?
A. Yes.
And are there any areas of law that you
practice in particular?
A. Real estate.
Can you describe for us the work that you do
in the real estate law world?
A. Sure. Mainly focused on residential
closings, transactions, buyers, sellers,
lenders, Realtors, whomever, in the closing
process.
Have you conducted closings yourself?
A. Yes, I have.
Have you conducted them —— what parties have
you conducted them on behalf of to a real
estate transaction?
A. Either the buyer, the seller or the
lender.
So you have represented all three of those
during closings?
A. Correct.
Could you estimate for the Committee, just
generally, how many closings you do a year?
Very generally is fine.
A. Very generally, I would say that's tough.
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How about per month?
A. Per month, we can say -— I would estimate
about 50.
And do you keep that up for most months of
the year?
A. I would say since September it would be
that amount. Previously it was a lot less.
And the complaint that we are here to discuss
today involves a real estate closing that
took place on July 21, 2015; do you recall
that closing?
A. Yes.
Where were you working at the time?
A. I was working with Attorney John
Pagliarini.
And what position did you hold in that office?
A. I was an associate attorney.
Were there any other associates that worked
at that firm?
A. No.
Were there any other attorneys, other than
you and Mr. Pagliarini, that worked at that
firm at that time?~
A. No.
And the complaint identifies a man named
69
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II - May 9, 2017
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William Paplauskas; have you met Mr.
Paplauskas before?
A. At that closing, yes.
And is Mr. Paplauskas present here today?
A. Yes.
Do you recognize him?
A. Yes.
MR. PICCIRILLI: It's not like
identifying a defendant in the criminal case.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Allow
Mr. Bergeron to prosecute his case, please.
MR. PICCIRILLI: Do you want to
put him in a lineup?
MR. STRACHMAN: He is thorough.
What party did you represent in that
transaction?
A. We represented the sellers.
And do you recall if anybody was representing
the buyers in that transaction?
A; I do not recall.
Are you familiar with a company called
ServiceLink?
A. Yes.
And what is ServiceLink?
A. I believe they are a company that, I
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. - Vol. II — May 9, 2017
think, a company that you use to provide
documents in a secure way, if I am
remembering correctly. I have used it very
few times.
And during this closing that we are talking
about, do you remember having contact with
aanody at ServiceLink?
A. For that particular closing, no, I don't
remember.
Do you not -— do you remember having contact
with them or do you not remember the contents
of your contact with them?
A. I don't remember contacting them for that
transaction in general. Yes, I have, but not
for that particular one. I don't know if I
did for them or notf
Would you be able to recall any of your
communications with ServiceLink prior to
closing that day?
A. No.
Do you remember discussing with ServiceLink
whether there would be an attorney present at
the closing that was about to take place?
A. No, I don't remember that.
What documents —— did you prepare any
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Ku‘
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documents in anticipation of this closing?
A. Yes.
And what documents did you prepare?
A. When you represent the seller, you
typically draft a deed. And for Rhode
Island, there are residency affidavits.
Aside from that, it would just be regular
office, like, hold harmless agreements and
whatnot for a seller.
Do you recall whether you prepared a deed in
this case?
A. I believe I would have, yes.
This has previously been marked as Exhibit
1.
A. Okay.
And I will turn this to Page 152.
A. Okay.
If you could take a look at that.
(WITNESS PERUSES DOCUMENT)
A. Okay.
Do you recognize that document?
A. I do.
And what do you recognize it to be?
A. It's the deed I drafted for this closing.
Is there a second page to that?
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. ~ V01. II ~ May 9, 2017
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A. Yes, there is.
And is that your signature on the bottom of
the page?
A. Yes, it is.
And did you draft that document prior to the
closing?
A. Yes, I did.
And did you secure the signatures of the
sellers on that document prior to the
closing?
A. Yes, I did.
And what is the purpose of that document?
A. It is to transfer title from the sellers
to the buyers.
Because you represented the seller?
A. Correct.
Did you bring that document to the closing?
A. Yes.
And did you provide that document to Mr.
Paplauskas during the closing?
A. Yes.
At some point during the closing?
A. Yes. We needed to because we were told
that he was recording the documents.t
MR. PICCIRILLI: I Will Object as
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II ~ May 9, 2017
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to we. That's hearsay. Who is the we that
told her he was recording?
MR. BERGERON: I'm moving on.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: I will allow
it.
I want to talk about the logistics of that
closing and your memory of it.
A. Okay.
Generally, where did the closing take place?
A. The closing took place at my office in
Tiverton.
Who was in the office that day?
A. It was myself and John. I know the
Realtor who was representing the sellers was
in attendance, and the buyers came to sign
their side of the documents as well.
Where within the office did the closing take
place?
A. Our conference room.
Were you present in the conference room at
the beginning of the closing?
A. I believe I was, yes.
Do you recall who was specifically in the
room at the beginning of the closing?
A. I don't. I could guess, but I know you
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don't want that.
We would prefer your recollection.
A. Right.
Was Mr. Pagliarini present in the room?
A. I'm really not sure.
Did you stay in that room, the closing room,
during the entirety of the closing?
A. No.
When did you exit the room?
A. As soon as I had done my side of what
needed to be done, I left.
And can you describe that for us; was that
the beginning of the closing?
A. Yes. I wasn't in the conference room for
too long. I either handed or finished
signing whatever needed to be signed by the
sellers and then excused myself.
And why did you exit the room? Do you
normally exit the room or do you usually stay
in the room?
A. There is not a need for an attorney
representing the sellers to stay if the
sellers are complete with their side of the
transaction. I left at that point.
Also, we knew the buyers were
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. - Vol. II — May 9, 2017
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signing documents with a notary and we didn't
need to be in there in case any questions
arose.
At what point did you find out that Mr.
Paplauskas was a notary and not an attorney?
A. I think when he introduced himself.
And how did you react when he introduced
himself as a notary?
A. I think I just was unaware that a notary
would be conducting the closingr so maybe a
little surprised.
Had you ever experienced that before?
A. No.
And when he told you -— he introduced himself
as a notary, correct?
A. Correct.
And is that when you left the room?
A. I believe so.
What did do you after you left the room?
A. After I left the room, I spoke to the
listing agent, who technically is on the
seller's side, so we were discussing the rest
of the closing and whatnot and I went into my
own office.
Did you have any discussions with Mr.
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Pagliarini about Mr. Paplauskas being a
notary?
A. I think he mentioned some concern about a
notary discussing documents with the buyers,
but at that point, it wasn't our —— they were
not our clients and we could not do anything.
He also expressed concern about
handing over original documents to a notary
that would have to record just because there
is that step in between getting to town hall
and whatnot to put all of those documents on
record that we were uneasy with.
Did Mr. Pagliarini instruct you not to go
back into the room?
A. He did.
Where were you for the remainder of the
closing?
A. I believe in my own office.
Were you present in the closing when the
Majewskis realized that Mr. Paplauskas was a
notary?
A. I don't recall.
Did you witness the Majewskis signing any of
the closing documents?
A. I don't believe so.
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For any of that portion of time that you were
in the closing, which you said was at the
beginning, did you ever advise the Majewskis
on the meaning of any of the documents?
A. No.
Did you ever discuss with the Majewskis any
of their legal obligations?
A. NO.
What happened after the closing finished?
A. After the closing finished, I think we
discussed the time frame of when documents
would get recorded mainly because we wanted
to make sure it was happening in the same day
so our clients could receive their total
proceeds and the buyers would gain access to
the property.
Do you remember specifically what you were
told?
A. I don't.
After the closing ended, did you look at any
of the executed documents for any reason?
A. No.
And was it at that point that you gave
Mr. Paplauskas the deed, or had you already
given it to him at the end of the closing?
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A. I think we gave it after he finished with
the Majewskis.
Did Mr. Paplauskas leave your office with the
deed?
A. Yes.
After Mr. Paplauskas left the office, did you
have any more contact with him?
A. No.
Did you have any more involvement in the sale
of the property after that transaction?
A. No.
MR. BERGERON: Does the Committee
have any questions for Ms. Munns?
MS. GILLIGAN: I have a few
questions.
EXAMINATION BY MS. GILLIGAN
I am trying to be clear about the sequence of
how things happened that day.
A. Okay.
When the buyers came in, you then went into
the conference room to go and see what was
going to happen with the closing; is that
right? Or were you already there in the
room?
A. It's hard to recall back then. I do know
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II — May 9, 2017
8O
I signed the deed definitely, and maybe
additional documents, with my clients ahead
of time. I don't remember if ~- I think
their Realtor had power of attorney, so
typically we will see if the others, the
lender, has any documents that need
counter—signatures by a seller.
At a minimum, you're sure that the sellers
had signed previously?
A. Yes.
Ahead of the closing?
A. Yes.
So you really didn't have too many documents
to sign or even if the Realtor signed with
the power of attorney that day, correct?
A. Correct.
It was pretty soon after you met the buyers
and Mr. Paplauskas that you discovered he was
not an attorney; is that correct?
A. Correct, yes.
And is that because he introduced himself as
a notary public at the outset or did you ask
him what his Status was, if you remember?
A. I'm sorry, I don't remember how it was
brought about.
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But at some point almost immediately, it
seems like you understood that Mr. Paplauskas
was not an attorney, correct?
A. Yes.
And at that point you told us you were
somewhat surprised to hear that?
A. Yes.
In fact, even though you were still a fairly
new attorney, at that point you had never run
into that situation before, correct?
A. Correct.
Because every other closing that you had
done, there had been an attorney on the other
side; is that right?
A. Yes.I
At that point, it's fair to say that you left
the conference room and went to consult with
Mr. Pagliarini; isn't that true?
A. Yes.
And you asked him, what should I do?
A. Sure.
There is no attorney here, what Should I do,
correct?
MR. PICCIRILLI: Madam Chair, I
don't know if it's appropriate for me to
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object to a Committee member's question, but
it is leading.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: This iS an
investigational hearing and I will allow it.
And it's your testimony today that Mr.
Pagliarini told you he did not want you to be
inside of the room for the rest of the
closing?
A. He definitely did tell me not to go back
in.
And the reason again was what?
A. So that we would not run into any issues
offering legal advice to clients that were
not ours. So we wouldn't be in a Situation
that we didn't believe what was supposed to
be happening. We thought they would have an
attorney on their end and we didn't know if
he would be offering legal advice as a
notary. We had no idea what could arise, so
it's best to remove yourself from the
situation.
And did you remove yourself? That's your
testimony; is that correct?
A. Yes.
And it's my understanding the Realtor also
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left the closing with you; is that right?
A. Yes.
The people left in the room were the buyers
and Mr. Paplauskas; is that correct?
A. Correct.
And you testified that you did not make any
observation or overhear anything regarding
them asking him about his status with them
that day, correct?
A. Correct.
.No discussion about why didn't they send an
attorney, why are you here, nothing to that
effect at all?
A. Not that I can recall.
MS. GILLIGAN: Thank you. I have
no further questions.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: I have a
question.
EXAMINATION BY CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS
Ms. Munns, you enter into the conference
room?
A. Yes.
And what do you do? Do you recall what your
role was or what your involvement was in the
room for the brief time that you were in
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there?
A. My involvement would just be to check that
all seller signatures were executed. And at
that point, I would have handed over the
executed documents that were needed on the
buyer's side. Then that would be it.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Thank you.
MR. BERGERON: No other questions
for the Committee. Mr. Piccirilli.
CROSS EXAMINATION BY MR. PICCIRILLI
Is it Munns?
A. Yes, Munns.
How long have you been practicing law in
Rhode Island?
A. 3 1/2 years.
At the time of this closing, you had only
been practicing for about a year and a half?
A. Correct.
And Mr. Pagliarini testified that his office
did about 150 closing a year; did that seem
accurate to you back when you worked for him?
A. Yes.
About a dozen a month?
A. Sure.
At that point, maybe you had been involved in
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. ~ Vol. II — May 9, 2017
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150 closings, at most?
A.-Sure.
Would you do all of the closings in his
office?
A. Not every single one, but the majority.
Had you ever represented a seller before?
A. Yes.
I'm talking about when you did this closing
in 2015?
A.'Yes.
How many times?
A. It's tough to say. That is‘really tough
to say.
More than a couple?
A. Yes.
And again, would it be your practice if you
were representing the seller to inquire of
the buyer or the buyer's mortgage company or
the Realtor as to who would be representing
the buyer?
A. Not necessarily.
Well, what would‘you want to know as the
seller's attorney? What would be the most
important thing that you would be looking to
find out in relation to a closing?
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. ~ Vol. II - May 9, 2017
A. We would need a copy of the title exam.
Isn't the most important thing trying to find
out when the client will get the money?
A. We have a set date on the purchase and
sales contract that we go by that.
Have you ever, as a seller's attorney,
provided the deed and other seller documents
to the buyer or the mortgage company prior to
the closing date if the seller is out of
town?
A. I wouldn't provide them to the buyer nor
the lender, really.
No?
A. No.
Have you ever been in a closing on a Friday
afternoon?
A. Yes.
And the client does not get his money on a
Friday afternoon, does he?
A. Correct. If it's not on record, right.
And it usually does not go on record if the
closing is Friday afternoon, right?
A. It depends on how early in the afternoon,
but sometimes no.
It is not unusual for a seller to have to
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wait a few days for their money after a
closing, right?
A. I would not say unusual. We try to do
everything we can to make it all happen in
the same day.
But sometimes that doesn't happen?
A. Correct. Sometimes it does not happen.
If a closing happens at three or four in the
afternoon, the town halls are closed by the
time you are done and there is no way you are
getting on record and no way you are
disbursing that day; is that correct?
A. Correct.
It happens not infrequently that sellers have
to wait at least a day for their money?
A. Sure, yes.
Do you know in this case how long the sellers
had to wait for their proceeds?
A. I don't.
When you left the room, did you inquire as to
when you would be expecting the funds for
your client?
A. Not when I left the room, no.
When did you inquire about when you would get
the funds?
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A. I believe I asked once the buyers finished
signing their side and the closing was done,
on to the next portion.
Who did you ask?
A. Mr. Paplauskas.
What did he tell you?
A. I don't recall.
Prior to the closing, you had communications
with the lender for the title company for
this closing, correct?
A. I would need a refresher on who it was.
Okay. I will show you a document, Exhibit
10, Bates stamped 41.
A. Okay.
And this is Page 3 of 4 of an E—mail exchange
providedlby ServiceLink.
A. Okay.
And on Page 3 of 4, if you could go down to
NUmber 3, it says, From Hailey Conn,
Wednesday, July 1, 2015 to Renee Hancler,
subject, this property.
A. Yes.
And you wrote, is it correct that you wrote,
My office will be handling the seller side of
the above—referenced closing. Please forward
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the documents once obtained. Thank you.
Please let me know if there is anything else
or if you need anything from me at this
point. Look forward to working with you.
Best regards.
Does that refresh your
recollection that you initiated an E—mail
communication with ServiceLink?
A. Yes.
And at that time, what did you understand
ServiceLink's role to be in this closing?
A. It would have just been —— I don't know
who ServiceLink was. It would have just been
the contact that I was provided by, most
likely, the buyer's Realtor.
You got an E—mail back from, it looks like J.
Arricell. Sorry, that's not the one back.
Sorry, it's the one above that. Carolyn
Migliori, later on July 1 to you.
A. Okay.
Was that your E—mail, [email protected]?
A. Which one?
NUmber 28. They go in reverse order.
A. Yes, that's my E—mail.
And this E—mail says, Is this a split closing
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with you issuing the owner's split policy or
are you just representing the seller?
A. Yes.
Did—you find that an unusual request?
A. Probably.
Sellers usually do not provide the title.
insurance policy for the buyers?
A. Right.
When you got that E-mail, did it raise a
question in your mind of what's going on
here?
A. NO.
You never E~mailed back and said, wait a
minute, who is the attorney representing the
buyer here?
A. No.
This is dated July 1; is that correct?
A. Yes.
And the closing happened on July 21; is that
correct?
A. I believe so.
Three weeks went by and in that three weeks,
you never once contacted ServiceLink or
anybody else and said, who is the attorney
representing the buyer?
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A. NO.
Is that your normal practice, Ms. Munns?
A. At that time, yes, I wbuld say.
Not anymore?
A. Not anymore.
Did you ever tell Mr. Pagliarini when you
walked out of the closing that you were
uncomfortable with what was going on in that
room?
A. I think I did.
You think you said the word uncomfortable?
A. I don't remember.
You said you prepared an internal document or
office document cal1ed a hold harmless
agreement?
A. Yes.
What is that?
A. That would be just a generic document
drafted by our office for us and the client
just if there is information you get from
third parties, that we would hold those third
parties accountable rather than our office,
something like that.
I don't remember specifically for
that office what it stated.
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You are in a practice now that does a lot of
real estate work?
A. Yes.
And the office that you are in now has a
similar type of document?
A. Yes.
And basically that document says, one part of
it, that there are real estate taxes that
have to be apportioned between the buyer and
seller; is that correct?
A. Yes.
And the information you got for those taxes
or other liens, water bills, sewer bills, is
based on the information given to you by the
city or town or water company; is that
correct?.
A. Correct.
And if that turns out to be wrong, it's not
your fault, don't sue me?
A. Yes.
And a lot of the time the seller's attorney
will prepare that?
A. They would for their own individual
clients. Actually, it is most likely on the
buyer's side, if it exists at all.
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And sometimes both sides would prepare it?
A. Sure.
I want to get what your normal practice is
with regard to your current real estate
practice.
A. Okay.
How many closings of residential real estate
involving a sale would you say that the
seller is represented by an attorney? What
percentage, 50 percent, more or less?
A. I would say more than 50 percent. I would
say actually about 75 percent would be.
So you're saying that the sellers come to a
closing with their own attorney?
A. Yes.
And that attorney prepares the deed and other
closing documents for the seller?
A. Yes.
In the 25 percent of the transactions where
the seller has no attorney, who prepares the
deed?
A. The buyer's attorney would.
And have you been in that situation where you
have prepared a deed for a seller?
A. Yes.
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And are you representing the seller when you
prepare that deed?
A. No.
If, for example, Mr. Pagliarini testified
that you were representing both the buyer and
seller when you prepare that deed, that would
be incorrect in your mind, correct?
A. That would be incorrect.
In fact, it would be unethical?
A. Yes.
In fact, you indicate to the seller
specifically when you prepare documents on
their behalf that you are not representing
them, that you are representing the buyer; is
that correct?
A. We actually ——
MR. BERGERON: Are we talking
hypothetically or with respect to this
particular case?
MR. PICCIRILLI: We are talking
generally what her practice is and what the
general practice in Rhode Island is with
regard to real estate closings.
I think it is very important that
this Committee understand that Mr. Pagliarini
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testified that if the seller is not
represented, and his office, as representing
the buyer prepares those documents, he is
representing both the seller and the buyer.
That is unethical in Rhode Island. You
cannot represent the seller.
In fact, the practice in Rhode
Island is you tell the seller, I don't
represent you, even though I'm preparing
these documents on your behalf.
In fact, you charge the seller, don't you,
for that drafting of the documents?
A. Yes.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Mr.
Piccirilli, if you could please ask Ms. Munns
questions in regard to what she has
customarily done, that is fine. Other than
that, the practice in Rhode Island, I would
ask you to stay away from.
MR. PICCIRILLI : Okay.
Again, understand that the questions
regarding closings at this point are based
upon your experience and your practice, okay?
A. Yes.
Again, it's your testimony that if you
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II ~ May 9, 2017
prepare documents for sellers who are not
represented, you make it clear to them that
you are not representing them; is that
correct?
A. Yes.
Now, if you're representing —— strike that.
Who represents the buyer and who represents
the mortgage company in a closing?
A. When?
Do you represent —— in your office, who do
you generally represent?
A. If there is an attorney representing the
seller, then we say we represent the buyer.
If there is not an attorney on the seller's
end, we represent the lender. We are the
settlement agent.
So the buyer has no attorney in that case?
A. Correct.
It's your practice, if you conduct a closing
and there is no seller's attorney, neither
the seller nor the buyer have an attorney?
A. Correct.
Interesting. And you make that clear to both
the seller and the buyer at the closing?
A. That's probably up for question.
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II — May 9, 2017
Are you familiar with the requirement in
Rhode Island that a mortgage company advise a
prospective lender that they have the right
to their own title attorney?
A. Am I familiar with the practice?
The requirement, the legal requirement in
Rhode Island.
A. Yes.
You're aware that there is a statutory
requirement that the lender tell the buyer or
the borrower you have a right to your own
title attorney?
A. Yes.
In your practice do you normally see a
document that is prepared by the lender
advising the buyer of that right?
A. No.
It's usually done —— is it your practice or
your understanding that is usually done at
the loan application point and never gets to
the closigg attorney?
A. Right.
For example, in this case with the Majewskis,
if they had been advised by their lender of
their right under the title for their own
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title attorney, you would not necessarily
expect that document to have made its way to
Bill Paplauskas and your office at the
closing, you would not expect to see that
document, right?
A. It could be part of the closing documents
provided by the lender, but we would not have
seen that.
In your practice representing mortgage
companies in closings, how often do you see a
document from the mortgage company that you
ask the buyers to sign at the closing saying
you were told you had a right to your own
attorney?
A. You sign that every time. That's in every
closing package for Rhode Island.
And it's signed at the closing?
A. Yes.
Are you sure about that?
A. Yes.
Shouldn't,that be signed at the time of the
mortgage application, not at the time of the
closing?
A. Yes.
Why would it be signed at the closing and not
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II — May 9, 2017
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at the mortgage application?
A. Perhaps to reiterate that you are either
using your chosen own title attorney or a
title attorney chosen by the lender.
It's a little late in the day'for that, isn't
it?
A. I guess so.
Is it just reiterating what they've already
agreed to in writing?
A. Most likely.
In your practice that you're in now —— by the
way, what is the name of the practice that
you're in now?
A. It's the Law Office of Michael Lima.
What is your law office's practice with
regard to recording; who does the physical
recording of closing documents?
A. We have two hired individuals who act as
our recorders.
Are they W—9 employees or 1099 independent
contractors, to your knowledge?
A. I don't know that.
You don't know?
A. No.
They are not attorneys, right?
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II — May 9, 2017
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A. No.
No, they are not?
A. No, they are not.
Have you had any conversations with the
Majewskis about this complaint that has been
filed by your former employer?
A. No.
On the day of the closing, did you have any
conversations with the Majewskis?
A. I did not.
MR. PICCIRILLI: I have nothing
further.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Does anyone
on the Committee have any follow—up? Thank
you, Ms. Munns.
THE WITNESS: Thank you.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: We will take
a quick break.
(OFF THE RECORD)
(RECESS TAKEN FROM 2:51 P.M. To 3:01 P.M.)
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: We are back
on the record. Good afternoon, Mr. Majewski.
I'm going to ask you to please identify
yourself for the record.
THE WITNESS: Vincent Majewski.
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II - May 9, 2017
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Being duly sworn, deposes and
testifies as follows:
EXAMINATION BY MR. BERGERON
Mr. Majewski, I am Tom Bergeron and as I
think you know that I am counsel to the
Committee. I will ask you a series of
questions. After I'm done, members of this
Committee can ask you questions. After that,
Mr. Piccirilli, who is counsel for
Mr. Paplauskas, will get to ask you questions
as well.
A. Okay.
What is your date of birth?
A. 8—12—70.
Did you graduate from high school?
A. Yes.
What high school did you graduate from?
A. Diamond Regional Vocational Technical High
School in Fall River.
And what year did you graduate from high
school?
A. 1988.
Do you have any further education after high
school?
A. Electrical Engineering, U—Mass Dartmouth.
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-And is that what type of degree?
A. Bachelor.
Do you have any education beyond that?
A. No.
Did you ever go to law school?
A. No.
Are you admitted to the bar anywhere?
A. No.
What is your current occupation?
A. I'm a sales representative.
In what capacity?
A. A regional sales representative for a
company called Acull Polyurethane.
Do you have a territory?
A. Yes.
What is your territory?
A. Pretty much the East Coast.
And from ——
A. From Florida, up to Ohio.
So a large swath?
A. Yes.
Have you ever been engaged in the real estate
business?
A. No.
The complaint we are here to discuss involves
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. ~ Vol. II - May 9, 2017
a closing that took place on July 21, 2015;
do you recall that closing?
A. Yes.
Were you the buyer in that transaction?
A. Yes.
Where is that property located?
A. 528 Nanaquaket Road, Tiverton, Rhode
Island.
Is that your primary home?
A. We have remodeled the house, so we have
not moved back into it yet.
But you purchased it as a primary residence?
A. Yes.
And the complaint identifies a man named
Mr. Paplauskas; have you met Mr. Paplauskas
before?
A. At the closing.
I want to ask you about what took place prior
to the closing.
A. Okay.
Prior to the closing, did you have anybody
representing you?
A. No.
Did you take out a mortgage on the property?
A. Yes.
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II ~ May 9, 2017
And what bank did you use?
A. Chase.
And did you have any communications with
chase bank prior to the closing?
A. Yes. I gave them all of my information.
What do you recall those cammunications
being?
A. The painful steps of everything that they
need to know for verifying my incame and
getting a mortgage.
And prior to the closing, did you have any
contact with a business called ServiceLink?
A. No.
Do you recall whether during the pre—closing
mortgage process either the bank or
ServiceLink asked you to select an attorney
in any capacity?
A. The bank —— my original conversation when
I was going for the mortgage is I could get
an attorney or I could use —— they wou1d get
one for me. I remember that conversation.
I don't know if it was an attorney
or someone to help with the closing. That
was the conversation I had with the
representative from Chase.
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Where did you have this communication?
A. It was on a phone call and we E-mailed
back and forth and we were on a couple of
phone calls. I remember that because he was
in Cleveland, Ohio and I was going to be
heading to Cleveland, like, the following
month. I said I would use whoever the bank
would get for me.
What was your understanding of what you had
told the bank with respect to representation?
A. My understanding with Chase, and I have
done real estate transactions before in
Massachusetts with other properties that I
owned, another house, was that I was going to
have an attorney. That was my assumption at
that time.
And what communications or what was it that
caused you to conclude that?
A. I just thought that's how it was. I had
assumed I would have an attorney because I
have closed on properties in the past and
there was always an attorney involved.
Was this after you had spoken to the bank
about the mortgage process that you concluded
this?
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II ~ May 9, 2017
A. This was as we were getting closer to the
closing.
What were your expectations with regard to an
attorney going into the closing?
A. I just assumed that the bank would provide
an attorney.
Prior to the closing, did the bank or
ServiceLink ever indicate to you who would be
conducting the closing?
A. That, I don't know. I remember being
contacted by ServiceLink to set up a date and
time of the closing, but I don't remember any
other details of that.
At that point, when it was getting
to the closing, because it kept getting
pushed off, I don't remember any details of
that.
Do you recall whether prior to the closing
you reviewed any of the closing documents?
A. I did download everything that was
E—mailed to me from Chase, but I can't tell
you I went through them in detail.
I want to talk about the closing itself now.
A. Okay.
Where did the closing take place?
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A.’At the law office in Tiverton,
Pagliarini's law office, the seller's
attorney.
Where within the office did the closing take
place?
A. It is a small office, but straight in
there, past a little foyer, in a conference
room.
Do you recall who was in the conference room
at the beginning of the closing?
A. My Realtor was there.
Do you remember your Realtor's name?
A. Deb Robbins. She is also a friend,
personal friend, for 25 years. My wife and
I, when we originally got there, and then
Mr. Paplauskas showed up.
Was Mr. Pagliarini —— was Attorney Pagliarini
present in that room at the beginning of the
closing?
A. No.
At what point did you find out that
Mr. Paplauskas was a notary and not an
attorney?
A. Actually, it was after he introduced
himself. It was right at the beginning.
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. - Vol. II ~ May 9, 2017
Right at the beginning?
A. Yes.
How did you react?
A. I had no idea that that happened because
like I said, in other transactions, I had a
lawyer and I didn't have any issues. We just
wanted to close on the house.
Sure. This is what has already been marked
as Exhibit 4.
A. Okay.
I am showing you Exhibit 4.
A. Yes, he discussed that with us.
Do you recognize that document?
A. Absolutely.
What do you recognize it to be?
A. That he was not there to give legal
advice, he stated he was not an attorney.
Is that a document that he provided to you at
the beginning of the closing?
A. I do remember that coming up pretty quick.
Is that your signature on that document?
A. Yes, it is.
And do you recall whether Mr. Paplauskas said
anything to you at the time about that
document?
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A. I don't really recall the details of
that. Again, there was a lot going on with
the closing of this house.
I think at the same time I was
under the assumption that the sellers would
be there. And they could not make it, so we
were frustrated that we were not going to be
able to move into the house until four days
later, so it wasn't a closing. I do remember
that. He told me straight out he was a
notary.
Do you recall whether you reviewed the
document yourself at that time?
A. Yes, we looked at it, but I didn't think
it was a big deal.
What was your understanding of the document
at the time you signed it?
A. That, like it said, it is a'hold harmless
agreement that he is not an attorney. I
remember him saying he is not there to give
legal advice. It was just to do the closing.
To me, he was just a person facilitating the
closing.
Ana you signed it?
A. Yes.
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At the time, what did you think would happen
if you didn't sign the document?
A. That never even crossed my mind.
Now, was Ms. Munns, or Ms. Conn —~ there is
an attorney named Ms. Conn, Attorney Hailey
Conn, and her name is now Hailey MUnns; do
you recall Ms. Munns being part of that
closing?
A. Hailey was there. I know she came in and
out of the room.
Do you recall whether she was present at the
beginning of the closing?.
A. I don't remember that, I'm sorry.
That's’okay.
A. I remember being introduced to her when we
walked in and we were using the office to do
the closing and that was about it.
Do you recall if Ms. MUnns ever indicated to
you that she would not be taking part in the
closing?
A. I don't remember that at all.
You don't recall when she exited the room?
A. No. I remember there being some confusion
going on, as I thought about this. Again,
because they were not going to be there.
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They being the sellers?
A. The sellers were not going to be there and
we were trying to at least move stuff into
~ the house. I don't know if they were working
on some other document so that we could
actually put our personal property in the
house over the weekend.
Once the closing began, who presented the
closing documents to you?
A. I can remember he did.
Mr. Paplauskas?
A. Yes.
How did he present them to you? Did he
present them one at a time?
A. Yes, it was one at a time.
Did he read the title of the documents to
you?
A. Yes, he did. He went through all of the
documents pretty thoroughly, what we were
signing and what we were doing, if I remember
correctly.
Do you recall how he knew what each document
was?
A. I kind of had the understanding, being at
closings and signing your name a lot. That
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was all I remember. I was chomping at the
bit to get it done. I don't remember a lot
of it.
I remember being extremely
frustrated because the sellers were not at
the house. I remember the tone of that day.
My wife and I were upset that we are here and
we cannot move into the house. That's what I
remember the most.
Did you read every document that was put in
front of you?
A. Pretty much.
Did you read the whole thing; did you read
every word?
A. I skimmed it.
Do you recall whether Mr. Paplauskas gave you
any explanation as to the documents?
A. I don't know. I didn't really ask for
much explanation. He told me what each
document was as he handed them to me and why
I needed to sign them.
I didn't get the last part.
A. Why I needed to sign them. He let us know
what each document was, kind of like this
document. It's not like he didn't explain
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it. I remember him explaining stuff, but I
don't remember in how much detail.
Beifig at closings before, I knew
we had to sign things, I guess is what I was
trying to say.
I am handing you what has been previously
marked as Exhibit 9.
A. Okay.
Can you turn to Page l3?
A. Yes.
Do you recognize this document?
A. Kind of..
It's entitled All Terms Met?
A. Yes.
Is that your signature on that document?
A. Yes, it is.
Did Mr. Paplauskas present this document to
you at the closing?
A. I believe he did, yes. Again, I don't
remember exactly, but I want to say that
Ernie and Nina, the sellers, were not there,
so I want to say this had to be taken for
them to sign.
Do you see your signature?
A. Yes. my wife and I signed it.
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. ~ Vol. II
9/5/201 8 8:49 AM
May 9, 2017
You signed it?
A. Yes.
Did you
A. Yes.
Did you
A. That
date it?
sign it on July 21, 2015?
was the date that I closed, yes.
Do you recall ever having any particular
discussion about this document?
A. I don't remember. I don't remember that.
Again, I go back to that whole point that we
were not able to close that day because the
sellers were not there.
Can you turn to Page 14?
A. Yes.
Actually, excuse me, Page 16.
A. Okay.
It is a document titled Borrower's
Identification Statement.
A. Yes.
Do you recognize that document?
A. Yes.
Did you sign that document?
A. Yes, I did.
Do you see your signature?
A. Yes, I do.
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II — May 9, 2017
Is that a document that Mr. Paplauskas
presented to you at the closing?
A. I believe so, yes.
Did you Sign it at that time?
A. Yes.
Do you remember any particular discussions
about that document?
A. I'm sorry, I do not.
Can you turn to Page 25?
A. Yes.
It is a document titled Error and
Omissions/Compliance Agreement; do you
recognize that document?
A. I do remember this document, yes. Only
because it says errors and omissions and it
kind of caught me. That's the only reason.
Did you sign that document?
A. Yes.
Do you see your signature on that document?
A. Yes.
Is that a document that Mr. Paplauskas
presented to you at the closing?
A. Yes.
Do you recall any discussion about that
document?
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A. Again, I remember that each page he handed
us, he did give us an overview of what it
was. He was trying to explain it to us, but
we were —- I had no issues with what he was
handing me and what he was doing.
Can you turn to Page 47?
A. Yes.
This is a document titled Mortgage; do you
recognize that document?
A. Yes, I do.
It spans from Pages 47 to 63?
A. Right.
Can you turn to Page 63?
A. I do remember initialling every one of
these pages, yes.
Is that your signature on that document, Page
63.
A. Sorry. Yes, that is my signature.
Did you date it?
A. Yes.
Did Mr. Paplauskas provide that document to
you at the closing?
A. Yes.
Did you sign it at the closing?
A. Yes.
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II — May 9, 2017
Do you remember any particular discussions
about the mortgage?
A. He did go through the details'of the
mortgage with the money and all of that, but
I had already kind of gone over this with the
guy on the phone from Chase, but yes.
I am handing you what has been previously
marked as Exhibit 10.
A. Okay.
Can you turn to Page 78 for me, please?
A. Yes,
It is a document titled Settlement Statement
HUD—l?
A. Yes.
Do you recognize that document?
A. I do.
Can you turn to Page 81?
A. Yes.
Is that your sighature on that page?
A. Yes, it is;
Is that a document that Mr. Paplauskas
presented to you at the closing?
A. Yes. I remember this from the closing.
Did you sign it at that time?
A. Yes. We signed it there, yes.
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II ~ May 9, 2017
Do you specifically recall any discussions
regarding this document?
A. He explained all of this to us. It was
just kind of going over them; thé mortgage,
what our down payment was and what the
monthly bill would be. I remember that.
I don't remember many more
details, otherlthan that he did go through
the document with us.
Can you turn to Page 86, please?
A. Yes.
This is a document titled Truth and Lending
Disclosure Statement?
A. Yes.
Do you recognize that document?
A. I do.
'Can you turn to Page 87?
A. Yes..
aIt's a continuation of the same document.
A. Right.
On Page 87, is that your signature?
A. Yes.
Did you date it?
A. Yes.
Is that a document that Mr. Paplauskas
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presented to you at the closing?
A. I do remember that, yes.
And did you sign it at that time?
A. Yes.
Please turn to Page 90.
A. Okay.
That's a document titled Note?
A. Yes.
Do you recognize this document?
A. I do, actually.
If you turn to Page 92, is that your
Signature?
A. Yes, it is.
And did you date that?
A. Yes, I did.
Is that a document that Mr. Paplauskas
presented to you at the closing?
A. I remember that, yes.
And did you sign and date it at that time?
A. Yes, I did.
Do you recall any specific conversations
about that document?
A. No. I think at this point I was still
thinking about how much taxes were in
Tiverton, to be honest with you. Somewhere
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II — May 9, 2017
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in the document I think I missed how much the
taxes would be on the house, and that's
nobody's fault but mine.
Please turn to Page 93.
A. Okay.
It's a document titled Uniform Residential
Loan Application.
A. Yes.
Do you recognize that document?
A. Kind of, I do.
If you could turn to Page 95, do you see your
signature on that document?
A. Yes, I do.
And did you date that?
A. Yes, I did.
And was that a document presented to you at
the closing?
A. Yes.
Did you sign it at that time?
A. Yes.
Do you remember any discussions about that?
A. On this one, I can't say I remember
discussions. I remember it getting explained
to me, but just not specifics.
Please turn to Page 99.
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II — May 9, 2017
A. Okay.
This is a document titled Request for
Taxpayer Identification Information and
Certification?
A. Yes.
Do you recall that document?
A. Yes.
Is that your signature on that page?
A. It is.
Did you date it?
A. Yes.
Was that provided to you by Mr. Paplauskas at
the closing?
A. Yes. I thought that I was already sent
this from Chase one time before.
Did you sign it at that time?
A. Yes.
Please turn to Page 104.
A. Okay.
That document is titled Request for
Transcript of Tax Return?
A. Yes.
Do you recognize that document?
A. Yes.
Did you sign that document?
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II ~ May 9, 2017
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A. I did.
And that is your signature at the bottom?
A. Yes, it is.
Is that a document that was presented to you
by Mr. Paplauskas at the closing?
A. I thought for the transcript of the tax
return, I thought I had to do that sooner
with Chase, but I don't remember that one at
the closing. I didn't date it, obviously,
because it's typed in, but I remember signing
one of those and sending that to Chase way
back when for them to get my tax returns.
Page 108.
A. Okay.
That is a document titled Document Correction
Agreement?
A. Yes.
Do you recognize that document?
A. I definitely signed it and that is
definitely the date there, but honestly, I
don't really remember that one.
Page 111.
A. Okay.
That's a document title Acknowledgment of
Receipt of Appraisal/Evaluation.
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II ~ May 9, 2017
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A. Yes.
Is that your signature on that document?
A. Yes.
Did you date it?
A. Yes.
Is that a document that was presented to you?
A. I remember that because it was about the
appraisal.
Did Mr. Paplauskas present that to you?
A. I believe he did, yes. Yes, he did.
Did you sign it at that time?
A. Yes.
Page 117.
A. Okay.
This is a document titled Notice of
Nonrefundability of Loan Fees.
A. Yes.
Do you recognize that document?
A. I do.
Is that your signature on that document?
A. Yes.
Did you date it?
A. Yes.
Is that a document that Mr. Paplauskas
provided to you at the closing?
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. ~ Vol. II ~ May 9, 2017
A. I believe so, yes.
Did you sign it at that time?
A. Yes.
Do you recall any discussions regarding that
document?
A. Again, like I said, I remember each
document he handed to me he explained to me.
Other than that, no, not specific to this. I
remember the nonrefundability term. That's
what sticks out in hy mind.
Page 118.
A. Okay.
This is a document titled Mortgage Commitment
Letter?
A. Yes.
Do you recognize that document?
A. I remember getting this from Chase, yes.
Is that your initial?
A. Yes.
And‘if you could go to page 120, the final
page.
A. Okay.
Is that your signature?
A. Yes, it is.
Did you date it?
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A. Yes, I did.
Is that a document that was provided to you
Mr. Paplauskas?
A. Yes, it was. I had already seen this
document because Chase sent this to me.
You saw this ahead of the closing?
A. Yes.
And it was presented to you again at the
closing?
A. I remember seeing it. This is ringing a
bell that I‘saw this from Chase Bank. I
remember signing it at the closing. At this
point, we are getting close to the end of
signatures.
Page 125.
A. Okay.
This is a document titled Initial Escrow
Account Disclosure Statement.
A. Yes.
Do you recognize this document?
A. I do.
Is that your initial at the bottom?
A. Yes, it is.
Is that a document that Mr. Paplauskas
presented to you at the closing?
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W018MWWilliam E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II — May 9, 2017
A. Yes. Part of that being this is the
property flax, yes. This sticks out in my
head, yes.
Do you recall any particular discussions with
respect to this document or the taxes
contained in it?
A. No. I was already fuming at this point,
but We were'good. Not for anything else,
just the taxes.
Page 126.
A. Okay.
It is titled Tax Information Sheet.
?A. Yes.
Is that your initial?
A. Yes, it is.
Is that a document that was presented to you?
A. I believe so, yes.
Did you initial it at that time?
A. Those are my initials, yes.
The last one is Page 152.
A. Okay.
That is a document titled Warranty Deed?
A. Yes.
And it spans two pages?
A. Yes.
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127
Do you recognize that document generally?
A. Yes.
And what do you recognize it be as?
A. A deed to my property.
Do you see your signature anywhere on that
document?
A. That's what I was looking for.
MR. PICCIRILLI: The buyer does
not sign a deed.
MR. BERGERON: I understand the
state of the law.
I'm just asking whether you were required to
sign it?
A. No, I didn't sign it. I don't remember,
other than just looking at it.
So you don't see your signature on there?
A. No.
Is that a document that you saw at the
closing?
A. Yes. I remember seeing this at the
closing. I am almost positive I did.
Do you recall when?
A. I brought this up on—line.
I am just asking you if you reviewed this
document at the closing?
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A. Honestly, I don't remember. I honestly
don't remember.
That's fine.
A. Maybe I needed —— he might have shown it
to me, but they needed to sign it because
they were not at the closing.
But this was a document -— you were not asked
to sign that document?
A. No.
And do you remember any discussions during
that time about the deed?
A. At this point, I think I was frustrated
that we could not close because they weren't
there.
Now that we have gone through the documents,
do you have any specific recollections of
instances where you discussed the details of
any of those documents; has it brought up any
specific recollections?
A. No. There was nothing that stuck out that
was sore to me or caused me an issue.
What happened after the closing finished?
A. There was some conversation of whether or
not we could get into the house. And I think
that's when either we had a conversation with
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II - May 9, 2017
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the seller, the seller's representative.
Who was that?
A. John. I am trying to remember the day.
We were trying to figure out for insurance
purposes and everything else of us being able
to leave the attorney's office and go to our
house.
I doh't remember exactly what it
was, but I thought there was something else
that needed to be signed, holding Ernie and
Nina —— like if we screwed something up, it
would be our fault. It was different because
he let mevknow straight-away because of
health issues they could not be there.
Who let you know that?
A. Him. We knew as soon as we got there we
would not close because the sellers could not
be there.
After the documents were signed —-
A. No, it was before the documents were
signed. We were told we could not close.
After all of the documents were physically
signed and everybody stood up, what happened?
A. The conversation was what do we do to be
able to get into the house.
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Ana who was that conversation with?
A. I think at that point in time —— I am
trying to remember exactly who we had the
conversation with. We might have —~ I don't
remember exactly who we staited the
Conversation with to make that happen.
I can remember Mr. Pagliarini
being part of the conversation, but that was
after. He kind of —— they had to get in
touch with the sellers to figure out if it
was okay if we could get into the houSe.
That's what was transpiring at that time.
And you did not take or did you take
immediate possession of the property?
A. We did move stuff in.
Right after?
A. Right after the closing.
Did you ultimately come into full ownership
of the property?
A. Yes.
And I was going to ask you do you live there
now, but you said you are going to move in?
A. We lived there for —— it was a few days
after the closing before we moved in, by the
time the paperwork came back and legally they
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no longer owned the house. We moved in right
after that. Then we moved back out in May of
2016.
MR. BERGERON: Do any Committee
members have questions for Mr. Majewski?
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: I do.
EXAMINATION BY CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS
Mr. Majewski, as these documents were being
presented to you, I believe yofi testified you
were given pretty much an overview of each
document as it was presented to you?
A. Yes.
Is it fair to say he is not reading the
documents in their entirety verbatim and
asking you to sign, he gave you an overview
or paraphrased each document?
A. I remember him going over the documents.
I want to say it was not verbatim because
same are lengthy. I remember skimming them
and talking about them.
I can't tell you 100 percent
whether or not he went over every sentence'or
not.
I believe you stated that you were advised of
what your monthly payment would be; were you
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advised specifics of what your mortgage
obligation was?
A. Yes. I had already knOWn that before, but
signing the name to the paper.
But Mr. Paplauskas went over that with you?
A. I remember him discussing the line items
on that page.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: I have no
further questions.
MR. VESPIA: One question.
EXAMINATION BY MR. VESPIA
With respect to each document that was
presented to you that you signed, did you
have any questions as to the content of the
document? I understand that when it was
presented to you, you were given an overview?
A. Yes.
But did you have any specification questions
as to the content of any one of the
documents?
A. I don't remember having any Specific
questions. It's not the first house I closed
on.
You have closed before, right?
A. Yes.
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MR. VESPIA: Thank you. I'm all
set.
MS. MACIASZ DISANTO: I have a
question.
EXAMINATION BY MS MACIASZ DISANTO
I'm just a little confused. You said the
closing was not able to happen and it was
your understanding that's because the sellers
were not present?
A. Whatever happened, I remember Ernie had
some heart trouble and he was in and out of
the doctor's office. We were trying to get
it closed before he was going for an
operation. I do remember that.
And that day, we were assuming ——
because we worked around their schedule to
close when they could be there, I was
expecting to see them when we went into the
office.
But the sellers were not present?
A. They were not present.
But you didn't think the closing was
finalized because they were not there to
receive the purchase proceeds in person; is
that why? I am confused.
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II ~ May 9, 2017
A. If I remember correctly, they needed to
sign. I thought they still needed to sign
the deeds or something like that. They still
needed to sign so the transaction would
happen. I remember the conversation that my
Realtor was getting rejected.
MS. MACIASZ DISANTO: Thank you.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: One other
question.
RE—EXAMINATION BY CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS
Did anyone discuss with you that perhaps
there was a power of attorney for allowing
the closing to proceed in their absence; does
that sound familiar?
A. I do remember someone talking about power
of attorney, but for some reason the closing
was held up.
And you think it was because they were not
physically present?
A. Right. We had to hold off. This is the
21st, which was a Friday, if I remember
correctly, because it was the weekend. I
would have to look back.
Is it possible it could have been for another
reason?
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;
y, i
l A. I thought it was because they were not
2 able to attend. I remember them talking
3 about a power of attorney and I thought there
4 was another holdup. If I'm remembering
5 correctly, it was because they were not there
6 because I was expecting to see them there.
'7MS. MACIASZ DISANTO: Just one
8 more question.
9 RE—EXAMINATION BY MS. MACIASZ DISANTO.
10 Q. Was there a Realtor present, the seller's
ll Realtor?
. 12 A. Yes.
g‘):13 Q. And your Realtor was present as well?
14 A. Yes, that's right. Jane, I think, was her
15 name.
16 Q. Was the seller's Realtor's name?
17 A. Yes.
18 FURTHER EXAMINATION BY CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS
19 Q. When you say present you mean there for the
20 day or throughout the closing?
21 A. I can't remember if she was there for theé
22 whole closing, but I remember her being there‘
23 because she was trying to —— I remember
. 24 talking to her about being frustrated. Ernie5
K15 25 had a lot of'stuff to move out. Because he
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II — May 9, 2017
was not well, I made arrangements to move it
myself, so I was having conversations with
Jane at that point.
MS. GILLIGAN: I have a question.
EXAMINATION BY MS. GILLIGAN
You were not able to move in fully until the
following Monday; is that correct?
A. It was the following week; I don't think
it was Monday. It was not Monday. It was a
few days after.
If I said to you that July 21, 2015 was a
Tuesday, does that refresh your recollection
at all?
A. Was it a Tuesday?
Yes.
A. I will assume that you are correct because
you looked at your calendar. Why do I
remember this being a Friday? If that was a
Tuesday, maybe we did not get the final
documents. Something happened that we were
not able to get in the house.
One of the problems was I was
trying to surprise my dad that week, having
him come over, and we did not own the house
yet. That's what is sticking in my head.,
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One of the documents that Mr. Bergeron had
you look at, which is the warranty deed,
which is on Pages 152 and 153 of our exhibit
packet, it shows it was received by the Town
of Tiverton on July 27, 2015, which would be
the following Monday.
A. Which makes more sense because over the
weekend, we could not move into the house.
And were you able to move in,~perhaps, even
Tuesday the 28th?
A. We had already put stuff in the house.
But to fully move in, and, as you said
earlier, take possession?
A. Correct. And now I remember rolling up a
couple of nasty rugs to get the smell out of
the house so we could maybe sleep in the
house. At that point, we were sleeping in
hotels.
MS. GILLIGAN: Thank you.
MR. STRACHMAN: I have a question.
EXAMINATION BY MR. STRACHMAN
How long did this whole process go from the
beginning when you first met Mr. Paplauskas,
until the time you left?
A. At the signing of all of this?
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Q. Yes.
A. A couple of hours, maybe. I don't
remember it being a long time. I don't
really know.
Q. You think a couple of hours?
A. Maybe less than that. I don't remember 1t
being super long.
Q. And during that time, Mr. Paplauskas told us,
I think this is right, that he walked you
through the documents, his words?
A. I heard him saying that he did go through
the documents.
Q. And he explained the documents to you?
A. I don't remember in detail, but I remember
him going over each document.
Q. And your wife was there with you?
A. Yes.
Q. And if you and your wife had any questions,
did he answer any questions for you that day?
A. I don't remember us having many questions.
I don't remember.
Q. Did you have discussions about any of the
documents?
A. I remember cracking a couple of jokes, but
I‘don't remember any discussions.
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II — May 9, 2017
And do you know what kind of deed that you
received?
A. So that also came later. What do you mean
by what kind of deed.
Was it a warranty deed, a bargaining sale
deed?
A. I just remember it being a deed.
A quit claim deed?
A. I just remember it being a deed.
You didn't know what kind of deed you received?
A. I just thought it was a deed for the
property.
And was there anybody who explained to you
the different kinds of deeds?
A. I don't remember that.
Did anybody explain to you what your
obligations were under the mortgage, the
promissory note or any of the other documents
that you signed?
A. I remember obligations, money owed, that
kind of stuff, going through that, yes.
Did you discuss that with Mr. Paplauskas?
A. Again, I don't remember exactly.
Virtually all of the documents that you
testified that you saw and that you signed
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that day are documents that you saw for the
first time that day?
A. Some of the documents, I remember seeing
them E—mailed to me from Chase.
What were those?
A. The breakout of the money, I remember
seeing that from Chase. I thought there were
a couple of other documents that Chase had
already E—mailed me.
Would you say those were the financial
documents?
A. Most of the financial stuff.
Legal documents you got that day?
A. Yes.
Like the mortgage, the promissory note?
A. Yes.
The representations?
A. Yes.
And the indemnification and the documents
describing your rights and obligations?
A. I read them that day, yes.
And do you know when this closing ended?
A. Again, clarifying that the let was a
Tuesday, I remember them fully closing on the
house or getting the ability to say it is my
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house the following week.
So you left that day, that Tuesday, and it
was your understanding that the closing was
not complete?
A. Correct. There was something else that I
have not seen yet today that we did with
Ernie and Nina to make them feel comfortable
that we could move into the house.
Did anyone tell you when —— let's say at the
end of that one or two—hour period you were
there, who told you when this thing was going
to end?
A. Again, there was a conversation about it.
I don't remember who. And I could have sworn
it was because of health issues on Ernie's
part.
I didn't ask you why.
A. Right, but I don't remember who said to me
when it would end.
You went to a closing and it didn't end?
A. Right.
You didn't walk out with a check?
A. Correct. I was not getting a check.
Or the keys?
A. Right.
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Your end was the keys and deed and you didn't
get that?.
A. That's right.
And you didn't get that until six days later?
A. Correct.
And you walked out not knowing what day you
were going to get those items, right?
A. I am having a small recollection of it is
going to take this much time, but I don't
remember who would have said that.
None of the documents that you signed said
this closing is going to end on that Tuesday,
or whatever day it was, and you'll be able to
get in and get the keys that day?
A. No.
And you didn't take the keys that day when
you left, did you?
A. Correct.
When did you pick up the keys?
A. We were already in the house, but when we
became responsible for the house was, I would
say, the following week. I remember now that
she said the date, being that was a Tuesday.
I just asked about the keys; when did you get
keys to the house?
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A. At least a week after the closing.
You didn't have a set of keys for a week
after that day?
A. If you want to say physical keys, I got
physical keys that day.
You did get keys?
A. Yes.
What didn't you get until a week later?
A. I didn't get the paperwork saying this is
my house.
And did you insure the house or did you get
homeowner's insurance?
A. Not until it picked up on —— there was
something given to me, and I have not seen it
here, that stated that Ernie and Nina would
not be responsible if we screwed something up
in the house while we were there.
When did your homeowner's insurance begin to
run?
A. I assume that day because I told my
insurance agent that.
When did it start to run?
A. I couldn't tell you the exact date.
Was it sometime after that?
A. It would have been after I would have
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II - May 9, 2017
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received the paperwork. I remember telling
my insurance agent, because we needed
insurance on the house to do the closing.
You came to the closing expecting to have a
lawyer there?
A. Originally, when I was dealing with Chase,
and because I have done closings in the past
in Massachusetts and the banks I dealt with
then, it was always an attorney.
That is not what I asked you. Did ——
A. I assumed there would be an attorney here
as well.
When you walked into Pagliarini's office, you
expected there would be Mr. Attorney there
saying, I am your attorney representing you?
A. Yes, I did. I remember ServiceLink
setting up an appointment for the closing
because Chase used ServiceLink. At that
point, I still thought it was an attorney.
And you came and there was no attorney?
A. Correct.
And instead there was a notary?
A. Which for me, I didn't have a problem with
that. I didn't see it to be a problem.
MR. STRACHMAN: Thank you.
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MR. BERGERON: Any other questions
from the Committee?
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: I think I'm
all set. Thank you.
MS. MACIASZ DISANTO: I have one
question.
FURTHER EXAMINATION BY MS. MACIASZ DISANTO
You said you've closed on properties before?
A. Yes.
And they were always in Massachusetts?
A. Yes.
Have you ever hired your own attorney?
A. No.
Let's go back. So before you closed on this
property, you had purchased and closed on
other properties?
A. Correct.
And they had all been outside of Rhode Island?
A. Correct.
And at any of those other transactions, have
you ever hired an attorney on your own?
A. No.
The lender has always provided an attorney
for the closing?
A. The‘ banks I dealt with, yes.
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. - Vol. II ~ May 9, 2017
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And your ——
A. To clarify, I closed on a few preperties
and I used the same bank.
You used Chase?
A. In Massachusetts, I used the same bank
three times.
A Chase branch?
A. No, nothing to do with a branch. In
Massachusetts, the bank I used at the time,
it was the same bank and I had the same
lawyer each time from that bank.
From that bank?
A. Yes.
What was your understanding as to who that
lawyer represented; did they represent you or
the lender?
A. I thought it was both of us. They are
there to explain things and to take care of
the closing.
MS. MACIASZ DISANTO: Thank you.
MR. BERGERON: Mr. Piccirilli.
CROSS EXAMINATION BY MR. PICCIRILLI
Is it Majewski?
A. Yes.
Mr. Majewski, when this attorney that you
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II ~ May 9, 2017
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used, you said, on three prior occasions or
for three properties you bought prior to the
property ——
A. Yes.
Did he explain the difference between a
warranty deed and bargain and sale deed and a
quitclaim deed?
A. No, I don't remember that.
Why did you not use an attorney in this case
in this closing?
A. my original conversation with Chase was
they said they could handle it.
Did they specifically tell you that an
attorney was going to be present on their
behalf at the closing?
A. I don't remember them specifically saying
an attorney.
Did you ever ask them the name of the person
who was going to be at this closing that you
were going to meet?
A. No, I didn't.
When you bought your other properties, how
did you find out who the attorney was going
to be that represented you at the closing?
A. Each time —— the first one was in 1995,
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II — May 9, 2017
but each time it was meeting them at the
bank. Actually, the law office called me to
set up the closing.
In this case, who called you to tell you
about the place of this closing, the date,
time and place of this closing?
A. I remember the company ServiceLink.
When they called you and told you where it
would be and it would be at a law office, did
you assume that that law office you were
going to would be representing you?
A. I honestly assumed it was a lawyer, not
necessarily that law office, but yes.
But you never asked the name of who the
lawyer would be?
A. No.
You had to a bring a lot of money to this
closing, right?
A. Yes.
$127,190?
A. That sounds about right.
Who told you you had to bring that amount of
money to the closing?
A. That was from my dealings with the guy at
Chase.
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And did he tell you how you needed to bring
the proceeds to the closing, by certified
check or wire; how did you get that much
money to the closing?
A. I had that money in the bank, so I don't
remember the details of that exactly. I just
knew I needed to have that money.
Did you bring the check to the closing? We
are not talking $10,000, we are talking
$127,000?
A. Mind you, at this time I was in fourteen
different hotels, traveling through three
different states to close on this property,
so-there was a_lot going on prior to this
closing, which is why I was so frustrated
that day, knowing I would not be moving into
the house.
I remember the money, but I don't
remember if I wired the money or if I brought
a check. I don't remember.
Other properties, I remember going
to the bank, getting a cashier's check and
walking in with the cashier's check.
Where were you living immediately prior to
buying this house?
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II — May 9, 2017
A. I was in hotels fourteen days prior to
buying that house. I moved out of my
property ——
Let me —- I don't mean to cut you off, but I
want to be clear. When did you first see
this property for sale?
A. A couple of months before we closed on it.
How did it come to your attention?
A. I found it on Redfin.
How did you come to pick the real estate
agent Deb Robbins.
A. Deb Robbins and I have been friends for 25
years. She has businesses and is a broker
and Realtor. And I called on a house and
then I called Deb and Deb set ufi the
appointment for us to see it.
Is Deb a Rhode Island Realtor?
A. Yes.
Is she also a Massachusetts Realtor?
A. She also helped me with three other
properties prior to this one.
At any time you had a discussion with her
about this property, did you have a
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conversation with her about whether or not
you should hire a Rhode Island attorney to
help you with it?
A. No. It never even crossed my mind.
Why not? This is a pretty big investment.
A. It did not cross my mind. After home
inspection and closing on properties before,
it never crossed my mind.
You do specifically remember Chase telling
you that you had the right to pick your own
attorney?
A. I remember them saying I could get an
attorney or they could take care of it, I do
remember that.
Now, was it your intention to buy this house
as your primary residence?
A. It was my intention. It was not my
intention to knock it down.
You said you were living somewhere and that
you had to be out at a certain time?
A. Yes. We had to be out by July 3, out of
our apartment in Boston.
Did you explain that to your Realtor when
they were preparing the P&S agreement, that
you had to close by a certain date?
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A. I was trying not to push the closing
because I knew the seller waé having a lot of
health problems. We said we wanted to try to
be in at the beginning of July and that did
not happen.
For whatever reasons, the timing
between Chase and the documents, and some of
this was my fault, not my fault, but the time
frame of Chase getting everything ready to
close. I remember calling Trevor at Chase,
like, can we get this closing happening.
You said at some point you knew the property
would not close on the date you had to move
out of where you were living?
A. Yes.
How much time before that did you know? Was
it the day before or a week before or two
weeks before?
A. I knew when we moved out of Boston we
would not close on the house and be able to
move from Boston to the house. I knew we
would be in hotels. Because of work travel,
I planned a bunch of work travel so the
company would pay for my stay.
At that point, you didn't think you needed to
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consultant an attorney to advise you as to.
what your rights were with regard to the fact
that there was a delay in the closing?
A. No.
You talk about the seller Ernie, did you know
him beforehand?
A. He worked for the naval base. He was a
naval captain. I had a lot of respect for
him. I met him for the first time when we
were checking out the house.
It was one of those things. He
was not feeling well and he had stuff to get
rid of. I said, Ernie, don't worry about
it, I'll take care of it.
Now, with regard to the financial documents
for the closing, how much money you had to
bring, how much your mortgage payment was
going to be, how much the taxes were going to
be, you were explained all of that prior to
the closing by the bank, right?
A. Absolutely. I just had rose—colored
glasses on the tax rate of Tiverton. That
was my joke earlier.
They told you what the payment would be and
that included the taxes?
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Correct.
A. No. I don't remember.
I noticed you talking with Mr. Pagliarini out
in the hallway.
A. I hired John after all this was done
because a mbnth after this, I had an issue
with my current employer, or my previous
employer, and I wanted him to look at a
document for me.
Do you recall approximately when it was that.
you hired him?
A. It had to have been around September or
October, maybe. It was close to the end of
the year because my company was being sold,
so it was around that time frame.
Why did you pick Mr. Pagliarini?
A. Because we were at his office and he
seemed like a nice guy. He drove a Jeep.
Did you know that he had filed this complaint
that brought us here today before you met
with him?
A. I had no idea about that.
Has he ever explained that or told you about
that since he represented you?
A. This legal document, it was more like he
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A. Absolutely.
You said you moved into the property some
days after the date that you were physically
at the law office signing the documents; is
that correct?
A. We went from the law office —— and this is
something I have not seen here. There was a
discussion between the seller's Realtor, my
Realtor and us about us being able to move
into the house and bringing stuff to the
house, doing laundry and sleeping there.
There was something else I signed saying I
would be responsible for living there for a
timevframe.
Was that something that was prepared by
Mr. Pagliarini's office?
A. I don't remember where that came from. I
remember that —— I swear I think the Realtor
came back. We left there and went to the
house after the law office. I remember
that. And Janney came by, which is the
seller's Realtor.
Did you have any communications with anyone
at the law office after you left on the let?A. When we were done?
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II — May 9, 2017
read through it and gave me a synopsis, this
is my feeling of this document. And that's
all I really remember.
It was not a lengthy engagement that you had
with him?
A. No, nothing like that.
MR. BERGERON: Can I just clarify,
are you asking about the complaint filed?
MR. PICCIRILLI: I'm asking about
the work he performed for him concerning the
review of the employment.
MR. BERGERON: You‘re asking about
the work he performed for him?
MR. PICCIRILLI: The review of the
employment problem.
THE WITNESS: Yes. It was closer
to the end of the year and the colder
months. It was something real quick.
Since the fall of 2015, have you had any
communication with Mr. Pagliarini before you
saw him here today?
A. I want to say I saw him chit—chat at a
restaurant, the Boat House Restaurant. We
ran into each other. Maybe it was around the
time he was running for Senator.
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Now, you said you moved out of this property
in May of 2016; is that correct?
A. That's correct.
And where did you move?
A. At the same time, my wife's dad was
diagnosed with stage 4 bladder cancer and he
is from Pennsylvania. And she is an only
child, so I rented an apartment in
Pennsylvania so she could be with her father.
Where did you stay?.
A. I travel for work two or three weeks out
of the month. I am on the road for work, so
I home—based myself out of Pennsylvania for
that time frame.
Have you stayed in this property in Tiverton
since May of 2016?
A. Not until the other night.
So you went almost another year without
living in the property?
A. Pretty much, yes.
You do realize that when you sign the loan
documents, you're certifying that this would
be your primary residence?
A. Absolutely.
Did you change your Rhode Island driver's
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‘I’158
}
l license?
2 A. I never did because of the issue with the;
3 house and other issues with the town, which
4. this has nothing to do with.
;
5 We were going to remodel the housei
6 and then the town had zoning restrictions on
7 us to remodel the house. And that turnedi
i 8 into another issue with the house. And we
9 had to knock down the house, which was not my
10 plan.vé
ll Q. Did you hire an attorney to help you with
. 12 that? i
x") 13 A. John helped me with the zoning issue for !
l4 the town.
15 Q. I thought your testimony was he only helped
16 with your employment issues?
17 A. When you said this, it hit me that we had
18 a zoning issue in the beginning of 2016, when!
19 the town had said it was okay for me to Startl
20 remodeling the house. And then after we wereI
21 starting that, the building inspector saidi
22 you have to stop. I screwed up and I called !
23 Mr. Pagliarini, and he helped me with
. 24 representing us for the town. i
f. 25 MR. PICCIRILLI: I have nothingi
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further.
MR. BERGERON: Any follow-up?
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Thank you
very much, Mr. Majewski.
THE WITNESS: Thank you.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Good
afternoon, Ms. Majewski. I ask that you
identify yourself for the record.
THE WITNESS: Rebecca Majewski.
Being duly sworn, deposes and
testifies as follows:
DIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR. BERGERON
My name is Tom Bergeron. I think you know I
am counsel to the Committee.
A. Yes.
And I will ask you a series of questions and
some of the members of the Committee will
follow up with questions. And Mr.
Piccirilli, who is Mr. Paplauskas's attorney,
will have a chance to ask you questions as
well.
A. Okay.
MR. PICCIRILLI: Are you going to
ask her all of the same questions you asked
Mr. Bergeron? If you are, I will step out
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for a minute and let you do that.
MR. BERGERON: I don't plan on
doing that. I will ask her the general
questions we have been discussing.
MR. STRACHMAN: Is she a borrower?
MR. BERGERON: No. I will not go
through all of documents, but she was in the
room during the closing.
MR. VESPIA: Can we stipulate
there was a time that she acquiesced to all
of the documents that were presented to her?
MR. BERGERON: Yes. We will not
go through all of the documents.
Q. Ms. Majewski, what is your date of birth?
A. 8—4—83.
Q. Did you graduate from high school?
A. Yes.
Q. Where did you go to high school?
A. Central Dauphin East in Harrisburg,
Pennsylvania.
Q. Did you ever go to law school?
A. No.
Q. Are you admitted to practice law?
A. No.
Q. What is your current.occupation?AJ
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A. I'm a housewife.
And have you ever been in the real estate
business?
A. I passed the test, but I never actually
made a transaction or worked under someone.
What state was that in?
A. Massachusetts.
The complaint in this matter involves a
closing that took place on July 21, 2015; do
you recall that closing?
A. Yes.
Were you a‘buyer in that transaction?
A. Yes.
And where is that pr0perty located?
A. 528 Nanaquaket Road, Tiverton, Rhode
Island.
And do you recall -— I will ask about prior
to the closing. Did you have anybody
representing you —~ do you recall whether
anybody‘was representing you prior to the
closing?
A. We had Deb Robbins as our Realtor, who was
speaking with Janney. I forget her last
name, it starts with an A, to help us with
the formal transactions. And she set up
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II ~ May 9, 2017
looking at the property and everything.
And did you take out a mortgage on the
property?
A. Yes.
Are you a borrower on that mortgage or is
your husband the sole borrower?
A. It has to only be Vin because I don't have
an income, but I em on the paperwork. I have
to say, he did that 100 percent. It was
on—line.
Sure.
A. Sorry.
That's fine. Do you specifically recall
prior to the closing any conversations with
the bank or any individual regarding whether
there would be an attorney at that closing?
A. I did not. I really was ignorant to
that. I think it was assumed that there
would be an attorney, but because Vincent had
previous closings of other properties, there
has always been an attorney there, but I did
not actually see that paperwork.
And the closing itself, where did that take
place?
A. At John Pagliarini's office in Tiverton.
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. ~ Vol. II — May 9, 2017
Where within the office did it take place?
A. When you walk in, you go to the back, to
the right, there's an office.
Was this a conference roam?
A. Yes.
Who was in there during the closing?
A. I know John wasn't, I don't think, the
whole time. He was in the office right
across. But Hailey was in and out. Our
Realtor, Janney, the two of us. He was in
and out I think.
During the closing, did you meet Mr.
Paplauskas?
A. Yes.
And at what point did you find out that
Mr. Paplauskas was a notary and not an
attorney?
A. Immediately. He did provide us with his
card and he introduced himself. He had all
of our paperwork from Chase.
Sure. I'm handing you what has been marked
as Exhibit 4. Do you recognize that
document?
A. Yes.
And what do you recognize it to be?
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. - Vol. II — May 9, 2017
A. That he is not an attorney. He did say
that.
Was that your understanding at the time he
presented that to you?
A. Yes, and that he would not be able to
explain or provide us with legal advice.
Sure. Did you sign that document?
A. I did.
Is that your signature?
A. Yes.
How did you react when he told you that he
was not an attorney; did you think about it?
A. No. Actually, it was not until afterward
that we are like all of our personal
information just went into this person's car
and there they go with it.
It was sort of at that moment, but
in the beginning we thought that's how it
would go because that's how we did —— the
.loan process was on—line. And however we
needed to buy the house, that was what we
needed to do. It seems like it was all
foggy, really.
That's okay. I just want to ask you about
the signing of the various documents. How
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II ~ May 9, 2017
did the closing proceed; did Mr. Paplauskas
give you the documents one by one?
A. Yes.
And did he describe the title to you; did he
read the title of the document to you?
A. Not in the clarity that I would have
remembered from previous closings. It wasn't
like —— it was not really explained so much.
How did you know —— while these documents
were being presented to you, how did you know
what was in the documents? Did you read the
whole thing?
A. Good point. No.
So they were provided to you?
A. Yes.
And he gave you the title; did he provide you
any explanation with the contents of the
document?
A. For each document, I would hate to say for
sure. That's a tough one.
You don't recall?
A. No.
After all of the documents were done being
signed, then what happened? What happened
after the closing finished?
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. ~ Vol. II - May 9, 2017
A. There were a couple of things that Hailey
had to go get, another form. This is very
vague, and I realize that. We were held up a
little bit.
Mr. Paplauskas was saying we may
need this. Then Hailey had to go fax
something or he wanted a copy of this or
something. I vaguely remember needing
something at the end of the closing.
And this was after everything was signed?
A. Yes.
And everybody got up from the table and went
outside, did you have any discussion with
Mr. Pagliarini about the closing?
A. Just that it seemed a little not
professional. We all felt that way,
including our Realtor.
Professional in what way?
A. Just like, after it's all done —— again,
it was all fast and we were closing and
excited, but it was just -— I think
especially with Vincent going through
everything on—line, all of that huge process
and then maybe just assuming that we would
have a formal attorney that would be
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representing us because it's a big deal
buying a house.
You personally expected there to be an
attorney there?
A. I did. I had purchased my own home in the
past and I had an attorney, too.
This is my last question before I turn it
over to the Committee. How do you like
living in Tiverton?
A. I adore it there. I'm from Pehnsylvania
and I think it's the best place.
Are the taxes high, though?
A. Yes.
MR. BERGERON: If anybody else
would like to ask some questions.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: N0
questions.
MS. GILLIGAN: No.
MR. VESPIA: No questions.
MR. PICCIRILLI: No questions.
MR. STRACHMAN: No questions.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: We don't
have any further questions. Thank you.
Let's take a short break.
(RECESS TAKEN FROM 4:10 P.M. TO 4:15 P.M.)
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CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: We are back
on the record. We are resuming after a short
break. My understanding is staff Attorney
Tom Bergeron, presenting on behalf of UPLC,
has no additional questions for Mr.
Paplauskas. Mr. Piccirilli, the floor is
yours.
MR. PICCIRILLI: I have no
questions of Mr. Paplauskas, either.
I ask these be marked as Exhibits
14 and 15. Exhibit 14 is a March 29, 2002
letter from the Federal Trade commission and
Department of Justice to the Rhode Island
General Assembly indicating the Federal
Government's strong opposition to proposed
legislation regarding restricting real estate
closings to licensed attorneys in the state.
Exhibit 15 is a subsequent letter
of December of 2002, pretty much reiterating
that position.
EXHIBITS l4 AND 15 MARKED FOR IDENTIFICATION
Far be it from me to explain it
any more strongly than the esteemed Attorney
Ted Cruz, who signed on behalf of the Federal
Trade Commission at the time. If you're pro
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II - May 9, 2017
Ted Cruz, yay. If you're not, don't hold it
against me.
In all seriousness, if you read
those reports, and I am sure your staff
attorney probably has already been over a
recent case in Massachusetts involving real
estate closings, I think what this Cammittee
is going to find is you are woefully and
inadequately being presented with
documentation and evidence to make any
informed judgment as to what would constitute
the practice of law with regard to real
estate closings.
You have chosen, for whatever
reason, to treat this as an adversarial
proceeding, not a type of investigatory
proceeding where you could ask members of the
Rhode Island Bar who practice in real estate
to come before you and make a presentation.
Members of title companies in the State of
Rhode Island and members of the mortgage
industry, and all of the other individuals
who could come before you and present very
reasoned and historical and legal
perspectives as to what real estate closings
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involve, how they developed over time and
really develop what that all is.
Instead, we are here because you
dragged my client under the threat of
whatever, punishment for the unauthorized
practice of law, for cammitting what could
potentially be a crime in this state.
If I come across a little
difficult, it's because I take great issue
with the way you have chosen to present this
case or deal with this issue. If it was
truly an investigation, why didn't you open
this up? Does the Rhode Island Bar
Association even know what you're doing right
now?
Do the members who practice real
estate know what you're contemplating? Does
the mortgage industry in this state have any
idea of what you're proposing to rule on?
Does the title insurance business in this
state have any idea?
I have not told them, but maybe I
should have. But they're the ones that made
presentations to the General Assembly when
legislation was proposed.
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They gave broad perspectives as to
the pluses and minuses of trying to regulate
in this area. The same thing happened in
Massachusetts.
The Amicus briefs that were filed
in the Massachusetts Supreme Court case would
fill up this table. And the same in many of
the other states that have contemplated
this. It's only a handful, as you will see
from these letters.
It's only a half dozen states that
have even attempted to regulate this. I just
learned from my client today. I did a lot of
real estate. I don't do a lot anymore,
mainly because it has become so regulated and
because mostly non—attorneys are doing it
nowadays. There's not a lot of money to be
made as an attorney.
My client told me title companies
do web closings. Imagine going to close on
your house and there's nobody in the room?
You're signing with your finger on a computer
pad and you're the only one in the room.
You could be at a Starbucks doing
that, and somebody is on the video screen
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telling you what to do.
If any of you have ever been
involved in real estate closings, and I am
sure you have, both from buying, refinancing
maybe commercial, maybe investment, you know
that there are all kinds of different
transactions.
You know there are different
issues that come up when you deal with that.
There's no cookie cutter, clear way to
resolve that. You're not going to do it here
today.
Are you going to say Mr.
Paplauskas engaged in the practice of law
because he said that if you sign this
mortgage disclosure document, you may be
subject to a penalty? Really? Is that what
we are here for?
He is a notary public. I have
given you the statutes and regulations. Not
only does he have the right, he has the
obligation to provide some minimal
information of what he is having someone
sign. That is his obligation as a notary.
And there's nobody in this room
Allied Court Reporters, Inc. (401)946—5500115 Phenix Avenue, Cranston, RI 02920
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9/5/201 8 8:49 AM
William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II ~ May 9, 2017
173
and nobody that came here to testify that is
more knowledgeable about real estate closings
than this gentleman sitting next to me. I
dare anybody to challenge his expertise in
that area. As a notary, that's all he needs
in Rhode Island.
And forgive me, but the hokum,
poor me, I don't know, should‘I have an
attorney or not, give me a break. You have
bought three or four properties and yOu don't
know whether or not you should get a Rhode
Island real estate attorney involved for
however much money you're bringing to a
closing. I don't buy that. I don't buy that
stupidity. What I buy is the guy did not
want to pay a lawyer.
I am not going to waste any more
time. I made my point. I would really
seriously suggest that this Committee really
think about what you're trying to accomplish.
If you're really trying to
accomplish some regulation of real estate
closings, you better invite a lot more people
to this table to explain what goes on. You
have only gotten a smattering of it.
Allied Court Reporters, Inc. (401)946—5500115 Phenix Avenue, Cranston, RI 02920
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9/5/201 8 8:49 AM
William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — V01. II — May 9, 2017
I think whoever you recommend this
to is going to fault you if you don't. If
you recommend this to the Supreme Court under
the way it is right now, I don't think they
are going to be very happy.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Anything
further? Are you through?
MR. PICCIRILLI: I have nothing
further.
CHAIRWOMAN SAUNDERS: Okay. Thank
you.
(CLOSED AT 4:30 P.M.)
174
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9/5/201 8 8:49 AM
175
C—E—R-T-I—F-I—C-A—T—E
I, BARBARA WARNER, Notary Public, RPR,do hereby certify that I reported inshorthand the foregoing proceedings, and thatthe foregoing transcript contains a true,accurate, and complete record of theproceedings at the above—entitled keeper ofrecords deposition.
IN WITNESS WHEREOF, I have hereunto setmy hand this 12th day of May, 2017.
BARBARA WARNER, NOTARY PUBLIC, RPR,CERTIFIED COURT REPORTER
*MY COMMISSION EXPIRES OCTOBER 15, 2018.
Allied Court Reporters, Inc. (401)946—5500115 Phenix Avenue, Cranston, RI 02920
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9/5/201 8 8:49 AM
WilliamE. Paplauskas, Jr. - Vol. II
94:16;107:24;111:6;
HearingMay 9, 2017
114:15;119:10; 144:2;150:11 application (5) assuming (2)
$ 148:2;161:4;162:22; ago (1) 47:17;97:20;98:22; 133:15;166:24
164:13 55:17 99:1;120z7 assumption (3) 5
$10,000 (2)Acull (1) agree (4) appointment (2) 40:15;105:15;
I
65:3;1499 102:13 45:10;46:8;63:14; 144:%7;150:16 109:5l
$127,000 (1)ad (1) 66.13 apportloned (1) attempted (1)
I
149:10 9:3 agreed (1) 92:9. 171:12I
$127,190 (1)additional (4) 99:9 appralsal (1) attend (5) I
14820 6:1;20:10;80:2; agreement (6) 123:8 12:2;13:21;1423;i
$20,000 (1)168:5 22:18;91:15; Appraisal/Evaluation (1) 21 :7;135:2
II
65:3addressed (1) 109:19;115:12; 122:25 attendance (1)
:
$250 (1)20:15 122:16;151:24 appreciated (1) 74:15
28:15 admit (1) agreements (1) 38:16 attention (2)l
$500,000 (1)30115 7228 appropriate (2) 1125;15028
!
25:1admitted (9) ahead (3) 55:25;81:25 Attorney (161)
;
8:9,12,14,18;67:16, 80:2,11;125:6 approved (3) 5: 17, 19,21;8:8;9:5;
A 19,23;102:7;160:23 alive (1) 28:12;29:20;39:15 11. 24; 12: 11; 13: 7, 9,
adore (1) 58:15 approximately (2) 25, 14: 25, 22. 9 14;:
ability (1)167:10 allege (1) 18:4;155:10 24: 15,25: 25,26: 17,
140.25advance (2) 27:7 aptly (1) 28: 12; 29: 8, 17, 30: 8,
able (15)45:1 1;50:24 allow (9) 53:6 20,21 ,:31 15,23 ,32: 2;
67:6;71 173098; adversarial (1) 13:17;14:13;22:5; area (5) 33:12;34:17;35:5,12,
114:11.129:5 25;169:15 23:2;49:10;59:6; 29:6;40:19;58:13; I9;36:7,9,10,I 1,12,
2133;914:213; 26:19;27:2;57:25; allowed (2) areas (1) 20,22,42' 9, 12, 15,21,
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134:13 97:24;131:24; along (2) 76:3 17;71:22;75:21;76:5;
Absolutely (9)132:1 11:24;17:8 around (5) 80:4,15,19;81:3,9,’13,
9:14;49:25;50:5.advising (4) always (5) 5:13;133:16; 22; 82. 17' 83: 12'
53:21.61zl3glog’fl4. 27:5;56:16;58:9; 105:22;144:9; 155:12,15;156:24 85' 23, 86: 6; 90: 14,24'
153:2’1.154:1.157:2& 97:16 145:10,23;162:21 arrangements (1) 92' 21; 93. 9, 14, 16,20,
access (15
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78:15 17:6;72:6 171:5 Arricell (2) 21; 97. 4, 12,21 ;98:-:,1
accomplish (2)afternoon (11) amongst (1) 12:13;89:17 14; 99. 3 ,;4 104: 16,I20,
173.20 22 5:3;7:21,22;66:20; 17:2 ascribing (1) 22, 105: 15,20,22',J
account (’4) 86:16,l9,22,23;87:9; amount (3) 21:20 106:4,6;107:3,17,I23;'
19.15 2160.7. 100:22;159:7 18:16;69:7;148:22 Aside (1) 108. 17; 109' 19,
125.1’8’ ’
afterward (1) annoying (1) 72:7 110: 5,5, 134' 12, 16;
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63:15 113:19;114:10; 49:20;91:4,5; associate (3) 163:17;164:1,12;
Acknowledgment (1)116:1;124:6;125:8; 171:14 22:12;26:1 1;69:17 166:25;167:4,6;
122.24 139:23;140:23; apartment (2) associates (2) 168:3,23;169:5;
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25:19 22:14,22;23:11; appeared (1) assumed (5) 69:21;99:25;168:I17
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9/5/201 8 8:49 AM
Hearing William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — V01. II
May 9, 2917|
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available (3) 171115 bit (2) 18:7;20:18;47:11; 16. 22; 18: 6;42: 8;
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21:5,9;38:3;39:18; becoming (1) 157:6 2525;102:23; 139: 3; 144:4,20, i
56:8;97:9 27:21 blank (1) 104:12;161:3;170:20 154: 17, 19, 21; 173: '1
away (1) beforehand (1) 64:7 businesses (1) Can (53) 1
95:19 153:6 block (1) 150:13 10:8,16;17:3;;
began (1) 64:6 buy (7) 18:24;25:3;26:20;l
B 111:8 Boat (1) 18:23;65:4;151:15; 27:3;29:18;33:5; 5
begin (1) 156:23 164:21;173:14,14,15 34' 16,35: 24;36: 8;!
Bachelor (1) 143:18 book (1) buyer (54) 37: 16;41: 16' 43' 13'
102:2 beginning (l9) 55:16 9:11;20:5;24:14; 48: 13; 49: 15 24, 50 4,
back (30) 12:19,20;14:21; borrower (17) 26:25;27:23,24;29:8, 9, 52: 24; 53: 18, 54. 1,
11:7,21;15:14,16;
27: 13;34:24;35:23;
47:10;48:4,14,15;
77:14;79:25;82:9;
84:21;89:16,17;
90:13;100:21;
103:11;105:3;
114:10;122:12;
130:25;131:2;
134:23;145:14;
154:19;163:2;168:1
bank (31)
19:24;22:20;34:3;
36:4,4,8,10;45:14;
46:1 1;60:6;104:1,4,
15,18;105:7,10,23;
106:5,7;125:11;
146:3,5,9,10,1 1,12;
148:2;149:5,22;
153:20;162:15
banks (3)
34:21;144:8;
145:25
bank's (3)
34:16;36:15;45:8
bar (11)
8:10,12,15,16,18;
19:20;51:1 1;67:17;
102:7;169:18;170:13
bargain (1)
147:6
bargaining (l)
139:5
base (2)
31:12;153:7
based (3)
37:13;92:14;95:22
basically (1)
92:7
basis (1)
10:23
Bates (1)
88: 13
BCI (1)
61 :25
bear (1)
20:8
became (1)
142:21
15:10,12;74:21,24;
75:13;78:3;107:10,
18,25;108:1,19;
110:12;137:23;
152:4;158:18;164:18
behalf (9)
7:12;9:9;26:2;
68:15;94:13;95:10;
147:15;168:4,24
belief (2)
15:6;56:7
bell (1)
125:11
Bergeron (47)
5:20;6:9;7:5,8,20,
23;13:13;14:18;
20:24;32:22,25;
37:23;39:2,19;49:7;
54:5;55:18;57:12;
63:18;65:9,23;66:12,
25;67:1;70:11;74:3;
79:12;84:8;94:17;
101:3,4;127:10;
131:4;137:1;145:1;
146:21;156:7,12;
159:2,12,l3,25;
160:2,6,12;167:14;
168:4
best (3)
82:20;89:5;167:11
bet (1)
63:12
better (1)
173:23
beyond (l)
102:3
big (3)
109:15;151:5;
167:1
bigger (2)
18:1;19:15
biggest (1)
18:22
bill (3)
17:11;98:3;118:6
bills (2)
92:13,13
birth (5)
8:5;67:8,9;101:13;
33:21;34:25;35:15,
20,22;36:3,22;43:1 1;
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55:5;97:11;160:5;
162:5,6
borrowers (3)
36:9,14;39:12
Borrower's (1)
114:17
Boston (3)
151:22;152:19,21
both (l7)
9:11;30:25;31:2,3,
14,17,22;44:22;
62:10,14,19;93:1;
94:5;95:4;96:23;
146:17;172:4
bottom (3)
73:2;122:2;125:22
bought (3)
147:2,22;173:10
branch (2)
146:7,8
break (4)
100:18;167:24;
168:3;173:9
breakout (1)
140:6
brief (1)
83:25
briefs (1)
171:5
bring (6)
73:17;148:17,22;
149:1,8;153:17
bringing (2)
154:10;173:13
broad (1)
171:1
broker (1)
150213
brought (6)
28:22;80:25;
127:23;128:18;
149:19;155:20
building (1)
158221,
bunch (1)
152:23
10,12,17,1 8;30:7,12,
18;32:3,9;33:17,19;
37:1 1;43:10;44:13,
22;46:1 1,22;52:17,
18,24;53:10;59:18;
64:25;65:3,4;68:17;
85:18,20;86:8,11;
90:15,25;92:9;94:5,
14;95;3,4;96:7,13,17,
21,24;97:10,16;
103:4;127:8;161:12
buyers (25)
12:5;15:3,4;21:23;
22:16;23:10;26:12;
27:1,5,12;45:7;66:2;
68:9;70:19;73:14;
74:15;75:25;77:4;
78:15;79:20;80:17;
83:3;88:1;90:7;98:12
buyer's (11)
22:14;41:22;44:13;
45:1;47:l7;59:17;
84:6;85:18;89:15;
92:25;93:22
buying (5)
36:3;149:25;150:2;
167:2;172:4
C
calculated (1)
27:18
calendar (1)
136:17
call (5)
6:18;24:17;32:18;
64:18;105:2
called (13)
6:13;31 :4;50:9;
70:21;91:14;102:13;
104:12;148:2,4,8;
150:14,15;158:22
calling (2)
7:9;152:10
calls (3)
49:22;50:1;105:4
calm (l)
48:2
came (20)
15,21 ,22, 55:,4921'
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68:;669:2,:75 12;|83' 14;:;874 101. 8'|
111. 10, 113' 9'
114: 13, 115: 9, 116: 6,
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156:7;160:91
cancer (1)'
157:6
capacity (4)
9:5;43:8;102:11;
104:17
captain (1)
153:8
car (1)
164:15
card (2)
51:11;163:19
care (3)
146:18;151:13;
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Carolyn (1)
89:18
case (26)
6:12;7:2,4;18:14;
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147. 9; 148'4, 169: 6;
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35:23
cash (1)
30:11
cashier's (2)
149:22,23
categorized (2)I
10:25;33:5 l
caught (1)
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Hearing
9/5/201 8 8:49 AM
William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Volf. II
May 9, 2917
160:19
certain (8)
17:12;27:8;29:20;
37:12;45:15;47:12;
15122025certainly (1)
55:21
certificate (2)
56:16;58:10
Certification (l)
121 :4
certified (1)
149:2
certifying (1)
157:22
cetera (1)
39:16
CFPB (6)
37:14;62:23,25;
63:23;64:1,21
chair (3)
7:12;47:23;81 :24
chairing (1)
5:4
CHAIRWOMAN (56)
5:2,12;6:8,19;7:10;
13:17;14:13;22:5;
23:2;25:23;28:4;
32:6,20;38:l3,20;
39:20,25;40:7;41:2,
13,16;42:4;48:1,7;
49:9;56:2,19;57:7;
59:6;65:19;66:9,19;
70:10;74:4;82:3;
83:17,19;84:7;95:14;
100:13,17,21;I31:6,
7;132:8;13428,10;
135:18;145:3;159:3,
6;l67:16,22;168:1;
174:6,10
challenge (1)
173:4
chance (1)
159120
change (3)
38:8,10;157:25
changed (2)
21:13;49:15
changing (1)
20:18
charge (2)
45:2;95: 11
Chase (27)
62:1 1;104:2,4,25;
105:11;106:21;
117:6;121:15;122:8,
11;124:17;125:5,11;
140:4,7,8;144:6,1 8;
146:4,7;147:1 1;
148:25;151:9;152:7,
9,10;163:20
check (11)
24:24;25:1,4;84:2;
141 :22,23;l49:3,8,
20,22,23
checked (1)
61 :25
checking (1)
153:10
checks (1)
24:21
Chief (1)
5: 1 8
child (1)
157:8
chip (1)
49:20
chit~chat (1)
156:22
choice (1)
6: 1 8
chomping (1)
112:1
chosen (4)
99:3,4;169:14;
170:10
circumstances (1)
3 1 :1
city (1)
92; 1 5
claim (2)
38:3;139:8
claiming (1)
52:19
claims (1)
39:7
clarify (3)
33:1 1;146:2;156:7
clarifying (1)
140:23_
clarity (1)
165:6
clear (7)
6:10;43:20;79:17;
96:2,23;150:5;
172:10
clearly (1)
39: 16
Cleveland (2)
105:5,6
client (1 1)
5:25;6:5,23;7:3;
170:4;171:13,19
clients (8)
23:15,22;25:6;
77:6;78:14;80:2;
82:13;92:24
close (18)
25:5;28:8;49:16,
18;108:7;1 14:11;
125:13;128:13;
129:17,21;133:17;
149:13;151:25;
171:20
86:3,] 8;87:22;91 :19;
152:10,13,20;155:13;
closed (12)
87:9;105:21;114:6;
132:22,24;133:13;
145:8,14,15;146:2;
150:7;174:12
closer (3)
13:4;106:1;156:16
closing (268)
9:16,24;10:2;
11:14,21,23;12:3,7,
16,19,20,22,24;13:2,
5,7,21,24;14:3;15:8,
21,24;16:1,2,22;
17:19;18:11,20;19:2;
20:19;22:10,11,12,
13;24:12;25:10;27:3,
5,11;29:7,12;30:4,13,
19;31:17;32:19;33:8,
15;36:9,10,12;41:21,
23;42:22;43: 1,4,5,7,
10;44:21,23;45:11,
14;46:2,3,6,9,16,20,
22,24,25;47:8,16;
49:24;50:4,10,15,23;
51:20;53:3,17;59:16,
18;60:5;63:22;64:4;
66:1;68:10;69:9,1 1;
70:3;71:5,8,19,23;
72:1,24;73:6,10,17,
20,22;74:7,9,1 0, 1 7,
21,24;75:6,7,13;
76:10,23;77:17,19,
24;78:2,9, 1 0,20,25;
79:22;80:1 1;81:12;
82:8;83:1;84:16,20;
85:8,25;86:9,15,22;
87:2,8;88:2,8,10,25;
89:1 1,25;90:19;91:7;
93:14,17;96:8,19,24;
97:21;98:4,6,12,16,
17,23,25;99:17;
100:8;103:1,2,17,19,
21;104:4,11,23;
106:2,4,7,9,12,15,18,
19,23,25;107:4,10,
19;108:19;109:3,9,
21,23;110:8,12,17,
20;1 11:8,9;113:18;
115:2,22;116:22,24;
117:22,23;119:1,17;
120:17;121:13;
122:5,9;123:25;
125:6,9,12,25;
127:19,21,25;128:6,
22;130:17,24;133:7,
22;]34:13,16;135:20,
22;140:22,24;141:3,
20;142:12;143:1;
144:3,4,17;145:24;
146:19;147:10,15,19,
24;148:3,5,6,18,23;
149:2,4,8,15;151:7;
152:1,1 l;153:3,16,
20;160:8;161:9,10,
18,21;162:14,16,23;
163:6,12;165:1,25;
166:9,14,20;173:14
closings (37)
9:2,2,6;17:10;
20:22;21:7,10;26:1;
31:21;33:4;36:20;
40:17,25;61:21;68:9,
12,20,23;85:1,3;93:7;
94:23;95:22;98:10;
111:25;1 13:3;144:7;
162:20;165:7;
168:17;169:7,13,25;
171:20;172:3;173:2,
23
Coast (1)
102:17
colder (1)
156:17
combative (1)
48:8
comfortable (3),
46:15,19;141:7
coming (4)
12:5;43:24;51:3;
108220
COMMENCED (2)
5:1 ;43:1
commercial (3)
9:2;35:8;172;5
commission (2)
168:12,25
Commitment (1)
124:13
Committee (38)
5:6,15,22;6:12;
7:13,24;9:16;10:15,
22;11:1,2,3;17:24;
20:15,21,25;33:1;
56:1;63:13;65:16;
66: 10;67:2,4;68:22;
79: 12;82:1;84:9;
94:25;100:14;101:6,
8;131:4;145:2;
159:14,17;167:8;
169:7;173:19
committing (1)
170:6
communication (3)
89:8;105:1;156:20
communications (7)
43:3;71:18;88:8;
104:3,6;105:17;
154:23
companies (10)
26:5;37:10;39:9,
10,15;62:24,24;
98:10;169:20;171:19
company (23)
16:12;42:10;43:24;
51:5;53:12;62:10,1 1,
12,20;70:21,25;71 :1;
85:18;86:8;88:9;‘
92:15;96:8;97:2;i
98:1 1;102:13;148:7;
152:24;155:14 i
Compare (1) i
24:11i
competent (1)'
40:5i
complainant (1)!
57:1 I
complaint (25) |
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102:25;103:14;l
155:19;156:8;161:'8
complete (3) :
22:23;75:23;141:4
completed (2) |
23:13;65:22
completes (1)
23:5
completing (3)
56:15;57:22;64:5
Compton (1)
50:4
computer (1)
171122
concern (3)
29:1;77:3,7
concerned (2)
28:24;62:17
concerning (l)
156:10
conclude (1)
105: 18
concluded (l)
105:24
conclusions (1)
55:20
conduct (8)
9:6;21:10;22:1 1;
28:24;47:8;55:13;
5619;96:19
conducted (4)
22:12;68:12,14,15
conducting (4)
46:3;59:17;76:10;
106:9
conference (14)
12: 17, 18, 15. 24,
16. 3, 18. 3 ,7:4 19,2IO
75. 14;79:21 81: 17;
83: 20, 107. 7, 9, 163.4conform (1)
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confused (3) 1
2610;133:625i
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confusing (1)
27:3
confusion (1)
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9/5/201 8 8:49 AM|
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol, IIHearingMay 9, 2917
110223 147:11;151:1 25:19 30:11;50:18; described (1)j
Conn (19) conversations (5) cursory (1) 109:15;167:1; 63:9 :
11:25;12:11;13:7; 100:4,9;119:21; 53:15 170:11;172:9 describing (1) l
14:1 1,24;26:11;27:2; 136:2;162:14 custody (2) dealing (1) 140220 i
43:6,8;45:17,20; convey (1) 19:8;42:2 144:6 desk (1)i
46:13,19;66:1;67:13; 16:6 custom (1) dealings (1) 13:3 '
88:19;1 10:4,5,6 cookie (1) 24:19 148:24 detail (3)}
consent (1) 172: 10 customarily (3) dealt (3) 106:22;1 13:2;i
31:10 copy (8) 40:9;41:22;95:17 46:13;144:8; 138:14i
considerable (3) 11:9;22:17;47:13, customary (3) 145:25 details (7),
9:21,22;18:16 19;49:16,21;86:1; 20:11;40:12,23 Deb (9) 106:13,16;109:1;i
constitute (1) 166:7 cut (1) 5:3;7:11;107:13; 117:3;118:8;128:1:7;
169:11 Correction (1) 150:4 150:11,12,15,15,17; 149:6g
consult (1) 122: 15 cutter (1) 161 :22 develop (1)g
8 1:17 correctly (5) 172:10 decades (1) 170:2i
consultant (1) 71:3;1 1 1:21;134:1, 34:22 developed (1)Ii
153:1 22;135:5 D December (1) 170:1;
Consumer (4) cost (1) 168:19 diagnosed (1) i
18:6;20:17;47:11; 20:8 dad (2) deed (46) 157:6;
62:15 counsel (10) 136:23;157:5 16:5,14;17:1,4; Diamond (1)1
consumer-protecfion (1) 7:23;8:2;31:5; daily (2) ,
19:6;23:4,6;24:3; 101:18i
20:22 45:1;50:2;67:1,5; 26:4,7 30:23;59:18,20; difference (1)'
contact (9) 101:5,9;159:14 dare (1) 60:12,17;61:11;62:5; 147:5
l7:16;43:6;44: 19; counter-signatures (1) 173:4 65:6;72:5,10,24; different (9)
71:6,10,12;79:7; 80:7 Dartmouth (l) 78:24;79:4;80:1; 24:12;28:15;35:25;
89:14;104:12 couple (9) 101:25 86:7;93:16,21,24; 129:12;139:14;
contacted (2) 85:14;105:3; date (31) 94:2,6;126:22;127:4, 149: 12,13;172:6,8
90:23;106:11 137:15;138:2,5,24; 8:5;28:16;43:5; 9;128:1 1;137:2; difficult (1)
contacting (1) 140:8;150:7;166:1 45:15;50:15;67:8,9; 139:1,4,5,6,7,8,9,10, 170:9
71:13 Court (7) 86349101513; 11;142:l;147:6,6,7 DIRECT (4)
contacts (1) 8:16;38:14;48:11; 106:1 1;1 14:3,6; deeds (4) 7:20;47:24;66:25;
44:20 63:24;64:1;171:6; 116:19;118:23; 59:11,13;134:3; 159:12
contained (l) 174:3 119:14,19;120:14; 139:14 directed (2)
126:6 covering (1) 121:10;122:9,20; default (1) 48:20;62:23
contemplated (1) 15:4 123:4,22;124:25; 52:18 directly (l)
171 :8 cracking (1) 142:23;143:23; defective (1) 14:21
contemplating (1) 138124 148:5;151225; 23:12 disagree (1)
170:17 credibility (1) 152:13;154:3;160:14 defendant (1) 53:13
content (2) 63:16 dated (l) 70:9 DiSanto (12)
132:14,19 credit (4) 90:17 defense (1) 5:18;21 :2,4;29:5;
contents (2) 33:23;34:4;35:4; Dauphin (1) 19:22 133:3,5;134:7;135 :7,
71:1 1;165:17 47:18 160:19 definitely (4) 9;145:5,7;146:20
contingent (1) crime (1) David (1) 80:1;82:9;122:19, disburse (1)
7:2 170:7 5:19 20 59:20
continuation (1) criminal (1) day (40) definition (2) disbursed (l)
118:19 70:9 11:14;12:10;23:13; 55:1;59:25 60:8
continue (2) CROSS (4) 25:5,13;27:12;28:8; degree (1) disbursing (1)
6:4;48:12 33:3;84:10;l46:22; 45:3;59:12;71:19; 102:1 87:12
continuing (1) 151:6 74:12;78:13;79:18; delay (1) disclose (1)
7:4 crossed (3) 80: 15;83:9;87:5,12, 153:3 52:21
contract (2) 110:3;151:4,8 15;99:5;100:8;1 12:6; denied (2) disclosure (5)
63:6;86:5 cross—examination (1) 114:11;129:3; 6:25;7:l 17:12;31:13;
contractors (1) 6:15 133:15;135:20; Department (2) 118:13;125:18;
99:21 cross—examine (1) 138:19;140:1,2,13, 21:5;168213 172:16
contractual (3) 33:2 21;141 :2;142:6,13, depends (5) disconcerting (1)
62:7;63:4,7 cross—examining (1) 14,16;143:3,5,20; 29:18;31:24;32:3; 13:22
control (1) 6:16 149:16;152:17 61:21;86:23 discovered (1)
64:24 Cruz (2) days (11) deposes (4) 80:18
conversation (15)
21:22;104:18,21,
24;128:23,25;
129:24; 130:1,4,6,8;
134:5;141 :13;
168:24;169:1
current (6)
8:7;67: 14:9314;
102:9;155:7;160:25
currier (1)
16:19;20:10;25:8;
51:19;87:1;109:8;
130:23;136:10;
142:4;150:1;154:3
deal (6)
7:18;66:23;101:1;
159:10
describe (4)
10:21;68:6;75:12;
165:4
|
I
discuss (6) !
53:9;69:8;78:6;i
102:25;134:11; i
139:22I
discussed (3)I
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Hearing
9/5501 8 8:49 AMI
|
WilliamE. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II
May 9, 2017
78:11;108:12;
128:17
discussing (6)
53:4;71:21;76:22;
77:4;132:6;160:4
discussion (6)
83:11;114:8;
115:24;150:24;
154:8;166:13
discussions (11)
76:25;115:6;117:1;
118:1;120:21,23;
124:4;126:4;128:10;
138:22,25
dismiss (3)
6:21,21,24
doctor's (1)
133:12
document (134)
10:5,8,11,21;16:4;
31:8;39:1;‘42:1,3;
54:8,18;56:16;57:19,
23;58:9,25;59:3;
60:14;72:19,21;73:5,
9,12,17,19;88:12;
91:13,14,18;92:5,7;
97:15;98:2,5,1 1;
108:13,18,21,25;
109:13,16;1 10:2;
111:5,22;1 1210,20,
24,25;113:11,15,17;
114:8,17,20,22;
115:1,7,11,13,l4,17,
19,21,25;116:8,9,16,
21;117:12,15,21;
118:2,9,12,15,19,25;
119:7,9,I6,22;120:1,'
6,9,12,16;121:2,6,20,
23,25;122:4,15,15,
18,24;123:2,6,15,18,
20,24;124:5,7,13,16;
125:2,5,17,20,24;
126:5,16,22;127:1,6,
18,25;128:7,8;
l31:11,16;132:12,15;
138:15;155:9,25;
156:2;163:23;164:7;
165:5,18,19;172:16
documentation (1)
169:10
documents (96)
11:22;12:1,25;
13:20;14:1,6;16:10,
22,24;17:2,4,7;24:1,
3;25:20;28:13,15;
30:2;34:7,23,25;
47:3;53:14;54:16;
55:24;60:22;61:1;
71:2,25;72;1,3;
73:24;74:16;76:l;
77:4,8,1 1,24;78:4,1 1,
21;80:2,6,13;84:5;
86:7;89:1;93:17;
94:12;95:3,lO,12;
96:1;98:6;99:17;
106:19;111:9,16,19;
112:17;128:15,18;
129:19,20,22;131:8,
14,17;132:20;
136:20;137:1;
138:10,12,13,23;
139:18,24;140:1,3,8,
11,13,19;142:11;
152:7;153:15;154:4;
157:22;160:7,11,13;
164:25;165:2,9,11,23
done (30)
8:1;9:13;24:18;
29:7,12;33:13,15;
34:16;37:7,9;38:23;
40:9;49:2;60:5;
75:10,I 1;81:13;
87:10;88:2;95:17;
97:18,]9;101:7;
105:12;112:2;144:7;
154:25;155:5;
165:23;166:19
door (1)
13:4
dough (2)
23:15,20
down (9)
17:9;37:15;48:2;
49:12;65:5;88:18;
118:5;151:18;158:9
download (1)
106:20
dozen (3)
49:4;84:23;171:11
draft (3)
54:22;72:5;73:5
drafted (2)
72:24;91:19
drafting (5)
30:23;56:15;57:22;
5829;95:12
dragged (1)
170:4
draw (1)
65:5
driver's (1)
157225
drove (1)
155:18
due (1)
20:6
duly (7)
7:18;56:12;58:6,
17;66:23;101:1;
159:10
during (15)
12:24;13:2;15:24;
41:23;68:20;71:5;
73:20,22;75:7;
104:14;128:10;
138:8;160:8;163:6,
12
E
earlier (3)
46:4;137zl3;
153:23
early (1)
86:23
East (2)
102:17;160:19
easy (1)
27:14
education (2)
101 :23;102:3
effect (1)
83:13
effectively (1)
25:18
eight (1)
37:17
either (9) ,
24:19;31:23;61:20;
68:17;75:15;99:2;
104:15;128:25;168:9
Electrical (1)
101125
elicited (1)
56:22
else (12)
41:4;42:6;47:7;
57:4;89:2;90:24;
126:8;129:5,9;141:5;
154:12;167:14
E—mail (7)
88:15;89:7,16,21,
24,25g90z9
E~mailed (5)
90:13;105:2;
106:21;140:4,9
employees (1)
99:20
employer (3)
100:6;155:7,8
employment (3)
156:11,15;158:16
end (15)
5:16;32:1;78:25;
82:17;96:15;125:13;
141 :10,12,19,20;
142:1,12;155:13;
156:17;166:9
ended (3)
6:14;78:20;140:22
engage (1)
57:25
engaged (2)
102:22;172:14
engagement (1)
156:4
Engineering (1)
101:25
enough (2)
20:14;62:9
enter (1)
83:20
entire (4)
47:16,18;53:25;
54:25
entirety (2)
75:7;13 1:14
entities (1)
63:5
entitled (1)
113213
entrust (1)
62:5
equity (1)
20:1
equivalent (1)
23:8
Ernie (8)
113:21;129:10;
133:10;135:24;
141:7;143:15;153:5,
13
Ernie's (1)
141 :15
Error (1)
115211
errors (2)
52:11;1 15:15
escrow (12)
16:14;19:15;24:24;
59:1 1,14,25;60:13,
15,16,17,20;125:17
especially (1)
166:22
estate (46)
8:23,25;9:1,6,24;
21:7,10;29:6,24;
30:16;33:6,12;34:12;
35:9,18;36:4,20;
38:4;39:7;40:6,13,
24;68:5,7,16;69:9;
92:2,8;93:4,7;94:23;
102:22;105:12;
150:10;161:2;
168:16;169:7,13,18,
25;170:17;171:14;
172:3;173:2,12,22
esteemed (1)
168:23
estimate (3)
9:15;68:22;69:2
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39:16
even (12)
16:15;38:3;46:8;
51:8;80:14;81:8;
95:9;110:3;137:9;
151:4;170:14;171:12
everybody (4)
12:21;47:3;129:23;
166:12
evidence (1)
|
169:10 I'
exact (1)I
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exactly (9) 1
25:11;63:10,14;g
113:20;129:8;130§3,
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EXAMINATION (I20)
7: 20 ,21. 4, 17; !
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66. 25 ,:79 16; 83. 19,
84:10;101:3;131:7;
132:11;133:5;
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146:22;159:12
examined (1)
6:14
examiner (4)
6127,9,12,15
examiners (1)
61:6
example (2)
94:4;97223
exchange (2)
65:6;88:15
excited (1)
166:21
excuse (1)
114215
excused (1)
75:17
executed (5)
16:23;30:2;78:21
84:3,5
Exhibit (21)
10:4,6;37:22,24,
25;54:4,6,7;57:1 1,13,
14;72:13;88:12;
108:9,11;1 13:7;
117:8;137:3;163:22;
168: 1 1,18
Exhibits (2)
168: 10,21
exists (1)
92:25
exit (3)
75:9,18,19
exited (3)
15:13;16:3;110:22
expect (2)
98:2,4
expectation (2)
14:2;45:2
expectations (1)
106:3
expected (3)
22:9;144:14;167:
expecting (4)
87:21;133:18;
135:6;144:4
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Allied Court Reporters, Inc. (401)946—550011th:. .._:-_ A ...... a Fun mn‘n»
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Hearing
9/5/201 8 8:49 AM
William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Voi. II
May 9, 2917
experience (10)
25:25;29:16;35:21;
37:5,9;40:17,18,22;
45:6;95:23
experienced (7)
26:1;38:4;39:7;
56:13;58:7,18;76:12
expert (1)
40:8
expertise (1)
173:4
explain (16)
17:24;34:6,25;
53:15;54:14;55:4;
56:3;1 12:25;1 16:3;
139:16;146:18;
147:5;151:23;164:6;
168:22;173:24
explained (8)
118:3;120:23;
124:7;138zl3;
139:13;153:19;
155:23;165:8
explaining (1)
113:1
explanation (3)
112:17,19;165:17
express (1)
39:5
expressed (1)
77:7
extent (1)
55:23
extremely (1)
112:4
F
facilitating (1)
109:22
fact (l 1)
6:1;7:1;41:9;52:1;
60:24;81:8;94:9,11;
95:7,11;153:2
factored (1)
60:1
facts (1)
11:3
failed (1)
52:21
fair (5)
11:8;28:21;62:9;
81:16;131:13
fairly (1)
8] :8
Fall (2)
101:19;156:19
familiar (11)
31:21;37:19;53:22,
23;55:12;56:18;57:9;
70:21;97:1,5;134:14
familiarity (1)
55:22
family (1)
32:12
far (3)
10:23;30:1;168:22
fast (1)
166:20
father (l)
157:9
fault (6)
92:19;120:3;
129:12;152:8,8;
174:2
favor (1)
5:6
fax (1)
166:6
February (1)
8:6
Federal (7)
8:15;18:10;21:14;
64:20;168:12,14,24
fee (1)
28:14
feel (1)
141:7
feeling (2)
153:12;156:2
Fees (l)
123: 16
felt (5)
11:4;17:25;20:14;
46:19;166:16
few (8)
8:2;51:l9;71:4;
79:14;87:l;130:23;
136:10;146:2
fewer (1)
30:2
field (4)
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(6) experience — hac1ked
9/5/201 8 8:49 AM
William E. Paplauskas,Jr. - Vol. IIHearingMay 9, 2017
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11:24,25;66: 1,22; 152:3 honestly (4) 162:17 initial (5)i
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171:11 hearsay (3) 150:1;152:22 immediate (1) initiated (1) i
hall (3) 13:12,14;74:1 hour (1) 130:14 89:7
49:19;62:1;77: 10 heart (1) 24:17 immediately (4) inquire (3)i
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87:9 heavy (1) 138:2,5 163218 inquired (1) 1
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155:4 held (8) 20:4,6,10;33:24; 53:1 inside (1) j
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happened (17) 30:7;151:2;158:11 23:8;1 17:13 indicate (2) insure (1)i
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I
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(7) Haney — into
9/5/201 8 8:49 AMl
Hearing William E. Paplauskas, Jr. - Vol. II
May 9, 2017
144:13;149:16; issuing (l) 129:16;l49:7;152:2, 37:1,5;61 :4;87:15; 158:1
154:2,10;156:24; 90:1 12,19,21 111:3;143:1 licensed (3);
158:8;164515 items (2) knock (2) leave (5) 47:4;51:8;168:175
introduce (1) 132:6;142z7 151:18;158:9 21:23;26:24;66:14; liens (2)
5:14 knowing (5) 79:3;129:6 59:22;92:13
introduced (7) J 46:16,20;50:23; leaving (2) light (1)
76:6,7,14;80:21; 142:6;149216 25:10;66:13 5. 25
107:24;1 10:15; Jane (2) knowledge (4) left (22) likely (3)-
163119 135:14;136:3 16:16;39:17;41:25; 15:5,6;17:15; 89: 15 ,92 24,:99 10
investigation (1) Janet (2) 99:21 24:16;64:4,7;75:1 1, Lima (1)'
170:12 5:17;32:23 knowledgeable (1) 24;76:17,19,20;79:6; 99: 14
invesfigational (3) Janney (4) 173:2 81:16;83:1,3;87:20, line (6)
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169:16 Jeep (1) legal (18) lines (1)
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173:23 69:14;74:13;129:3; 9:3;31:25;53:2; 97:6;108:16;109:21; list (6)'
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Hearing
9/5/201 8 8:49 AM
William E. Paplauskas, Jr. - Vol; II
May 9, 2017
89:4;134:23;137:2;
155:8
looked (4)
20:13,21;109:14;
136217
looking (4)
85:24;127:7,15;
162:1
looks (1)
89:16
loss (1)
20:6
lot (15)
69:7;92:1,21;
109:2;1 11:25;112:2;
135:25;148:17;
149:14;152:2;153:8;
171:13,14,17;173:23
Mmachine (4)
47:13,19;49:17,21
Maciasz (12)
5:18;21:2,4;29:5;
133:3,5;134:7;135:7,
9;145:5,7;146:20
Madam (1)
81:24
Main (l)
12:8
Mainly (3)
68:8;78:12;171:15
maintain (2)
5 1 :19;52:3
Majewski (12)
12:13;100:22,25;
101:4;131:5,8;
146:23,25;159:4,7,9;
160:14
Majewskis (16)
16:3;18:22;28:2,
10;41:18;42:1,7,14;
77:20,23;78:3,6;
79:2;97:23;100:5,9
majority (1)
85:5
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23:12;137:7
malfeasance (2)
63:24;64:2
malpractice (3)
15:3;52:4,10
man (3)
11:1 1;69:25;
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93:7;118:7;138:20;
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54:4,7;57:1 1,14;
72:13;108:8;1 13:7;
117:8;163221;
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149:11;151:4,6,8
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120:3
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minimal (1)
172:22
minimum (1)
80:8
minuses (1)
171 :2
minute (3)
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149:4,5,7,18,19;
153:16;171:17;
173:13
month (8)
19:16;32:1;69:1,2;
84:23;105:7;155:6;
157:12
monthly (3)_
19:22;1 18:6;
13 1 :25
months (3)
69:4;150:7;156:18
more (23)
11:7;17:3,16;
26:21;28:22;30:1 1;
32:25;54:1;61:4;
64:22;79:7,9;85:14;
93:10,11;118:7;
135:8;137:7;155:25;
168:23;173:2,17,23
morning (1)
7:11
mortgage (47)
36:18,21,22,23,25;
37:1,10;39:10,15;
42:10;43:24;53:12;
54:15;58:13;61:11;
62:5,9,11,23;65:2;
85:18;86:8;96:8;
97:2;98:9,1 1,22;
99:1;103:24;104:10,
15,19;105:24;116:8;
117:2,4;118:4;
124:13;132:1;
139:17;140:15;
153:17;162:2,5;
169:21;170:18;
172:16
mortgages (2)
58:16,]8
most (15)
35:18,23;36:9,13,
14;56:10;69:4;85:1,
23;86:2;89:14;92:24;
99:10;112:9;140:12
mostly (1)
171216
motion (3)
6:20,21,24
move (19)
41:3;42:5;57:3;
109:8;111:3;112:8;
130:15,22;135:25;
136:1,6;137:8,9,12;
141:8;152:13,21;
154:9;157:4
moved (8)
103:11;130:24;
131:1‘,2;150:2;
152:19;154:2;157:1
moves (1)
29:2
moving (3)
27:15;74:3;149:16
much (21)
18:1;29:1;38:16;
102:17;112:12,19;
113:2;119:24;120:1;
131:10;142:9;149:3;
152:16;153:16,17,18;
157:20;159:4;165:8;
168:19;173:13
Munns (14)
11:25;66:22;67:10;
79:13;83:20;84:1 1,
12;91 :2;95: 15;
100: 15;110:4,6,7,18
myself (8)'
12:11,21;32:2;E
61:23;74:13;75:17;
136:2;157:13 3
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name (14)
7:14;67:10,12;
99:12;107:12;110:l6;
111:25;132:4;
135:15,16;147:18;:
148:14;159:13;'
161:24
named (4)
11:11;69:25;
103:14;110:5
names (2)
37:2,6
Nanaquaket (2) I
103:7;161:15f
nasty (1)g
137:15j
naval (2)i
153:7,8j
near (1)i
15:11'
necessarily (3)I
85:21;98:1;148:13
need (13) 1
17:25;21:9;3S:6;
53:9;60:7;75:21;
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88:11;89:3;104:9;!
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128:4,5;129:10;i
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149:1,7;152:25; l
164:21,22g
needing (1)
166:8
needs (3)
60:2;62t2gl73z5
negligence (2)
63:24;64:1
neither (1)
96:20new (6)
18:5,9;20:17;I
21:13;61:19;81:9§
next (5) §
I7:10;28:8;64:14;5'
88:3;173:3I
nice (1)
155218
night (1)
157:17
Nina (4)
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William E. Paplauskas, Jr. - Vol. IIH arin Ye gMay 9, 2917
Il3:21;129:1 1; 91:14,19,22,25;92:4; 170:12 oversight (7)
I
141:7;143:15 O 95:2;96:10;98:3; operation (1) 62:14,18,18,20;
nobody (5) 99:14;107:1,2,4,6; 133:14 63:2,23,25
27:6;50:1 1;171:21; Object (13)110:16;129:6; opinion (7) overview (4)
172:25;173:1
nobody's (1)
120:3
non—attending (1)
22:21
non-attorney (6)
46:5;57:21,22;
62:3,4,6
non-attorneys (1)
171:16
None (1)
142:11
Nonrefundability (2)
123:16;124:9
nor (2)
86:1 1;96:21
normal (2)
91:2;93:3
normally (8)
20:3;25:4;28:14;
29:17;30:24;47:8;
75:19;97:14
North (1)
49:23
notarial (1)
57:24
notaries (4)
26:5;52:4;54:13;
55:13
notary (38)
15:1;18:19,24;
20:9,16;21 :20;25:19;
26:2;28:25;52:12,18,
21;53:19;54210;55:7,
8;56:12;57:21;58:6,
12;76:1,5,8,9,15;
77:2,4,8,21;80:22;
82:19;107:22;
109:1 1;144:22;
163:16;l72:19,24;
173:5
note (5)
54:20,21;119:7;
139:18;140:15
notes (1)
54:24
Notice (1)
123:15
noticed (1)
155:3
November (2)
56:10;67:9
nowadays (1)
171 : 17
number (8)
9:21,22;52:16;
59:1 1;62: 17;63:22;
88:19;89:23
13:1 1;14:5,17;
22:1;27:21;39:2;
51:14;55:19;63:19;
65:9,12;73:25;82:1
objection (3)
6:7;22:25;56:2O
obligated (2)
39:10,11
obligation (3)
132:2;172:22,24
obligations (4)
78:7;139:17,20;
140:20
observation (1)
83:7
obtained (1)
89:1
obviously (2)
63:18;122:9
occasion (l)
32:7
occasions (1)
147:1
occupation (4)
8:7;67:14;102:9;
160225
occur (4)
17:10;29:15;30:22;
31:17
occurred (3)
11:4;12:8;26:8
occurring (1)
18:4
occurs (1)
26:4
October (2)
37:14;155:13
odd (1)
22:22
off (7)
28:16;36:15;37:2;
100:19;106:16;
134:20;150:4
offered (2)
13:14;40:8
offering (2)
82:13,18
office (76)
9:18;12:8,10,15;
15:22;17:15;18:15,
17;21:21;23:13;
34:16,24;44:12,21,
24;45:20;47:1,7;
49:16,25;50:3,5,10,
16,23;51:3,4;61:17,
18,19;65:25;66:3;
69:16;72:8;74:10,12,
17;76:24;77:18;79:3,
6;84:19;85:4;88:24;
133:12,19;144:13;
148:2,9,10,13;154:4,
6,16,20,24;155:17;
162:25;163:1,3,8
officers (4)
34:6,23;38:14;
48:10
office’s (1)
99:15
official (1)
39:3
officiated (1)
42:22
officiating (2)
1922;22z9
often (8)
9:16;13:19;26:1;
28:25;48:17,24,25;
98:10
Ohio (2)
102:19;105:5
omissions (2)
52:12;1 15:15
Omissions/Compliance (1)
115:12
once (6)
11:16;20:17;88:1;
89:1;90:23;1 1 1:8
one (46)
17:3;26:20;27:8;
29:9;31:6,23;36:1 1,
23;49:6;50:19;53:18;
56:21;58:24;61:14,
20;7l:15;85:5;89:17,
18,22;92:7;104:21;
111:14,15;116:14;
120:22;121:15;
122:8,11,2l;126:20;
132:10,19;134:8;
135:7;136:22;137:1;
141:10;145:5;
147:25;150:23;
153:1 1;165:2,2,20;
171223
ones (1)
170:23
on—line (4)
127:23;162:10;
164:20;166:23
only (21)
27:8;34:14;36:11;
52:23;53:18;54:14;
60:21;61:14;65:2,25;
84:16;1 15:14,16;
157:7;158:15;162:7;
171:9,11,23;172:21;
173:25
open (3)
63:13;65:17;
18:24;34:20;35:1;
39:3;55:24;56:22;
65:10
opposition (1)
168:15
order (2)
6:3;89z23
ordinary (1)
20:11
original (5)
19:6;24:3;77:8;
104:18;147:11
originally (2)
107:15;144:6
others (1)
80:5
otherwise (1)
57:25
ours (1)
82:14
out (56)
6:2;13:8;14:11,23,
24;16:22;17:11;
22:16;31:14;33:23;
42:8;43:9,16,22,23;
44:1,13;55:1;76:4;
85:25;86:3,9;91:7;
92:18;103:24;
107:21;109:10;
110:10;124:10;
126:2;128:20;129:4;
130:10;131:2;
133:11;135:25;
137:15;141:22;
142:6;147:23;150:2;
151:20,21,21;152:14,
19;153:10;155:3;
157:1,11,13;159:25;
162:2;163:9,1 1,15
out—of-state (1)
19:24
outset (1)
80:22
outside (3)
43:15;145:18;
166:13
over (17)
6:9;49:11;64:23;
77:8;84:4;1 1 1 :7;
117:5;118:4;l31:17,
22;132:5;136:24;
137:7;138:15;167:8;
169:5;170:1
overhear (l)
83:7
overnighting (1)
19:8
Overruled (1)
28:4
116:2;131:10,15; 9
132:16g
owed (1)
139:20
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105:14;131:1 !
owner's (1)
90:1
ownership (1)
130:18
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packet (1)
137:4pad (1)
171:23
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88:15,18;113:9;
114:13,15;115:9;:
116;1,6,13,16;i
117:10,17,19;118:!10,
17,21;119:5,11;i
120:4,11,25;121:8,
18;122:13,22;i
123:13;124:1 1,20,121;
125:15;126:10,20;
132:7
pages (5)
53;14;116:11,15;1
126:24;137:3
Pagliarini (56) i
7:9,11,16,21;21:1!;
25:24;32:7;33:2;!
34:11;36:2;38:2,11,
24;39:3;45:4,24;1
46:7,18;47:20;48:312;
50:21 ;54:1 1,20;55:2,
19;56:6,18,22,25;‘
60:6;63:14,17;64::25;
65:10,24;66:11,13;
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Hearing
9/5/201 8 8:49 AM
l
William E. Paplauskas, Jr. - Vol. II
May 9, 2917
17;130:7;155:3,16;
156:20;158:23;
166:14
Pagliarini's (4)
107:2;144:13;
154:16;162:25
paid (1)
26:16
painful (1)
104:8
mmun132:4
paperwork (7)
34:6;130:25;143:9;
144:1;162:8,22;
163:20
Paplauskas (80)
5:9,10,1 1;6:13;8:2;
11:12,12,15;12:14;
13;8;14:25;16:2,7;
17:15;18:2;19:4;
21:18;22:19;24:1;
27:7;29:1;42:2,21;
44:2;45:17;47:2,14;
52:5;60:18;63:4;
64:4;66:2;67:5;70:1,
2,4;73:20;76:5;77:1,
20;78:24;79:3,6;
80:18;81:2;83:4;
88:5;98:3;101:10;
103:15,15;107:16,22;
108:23;111:11;
112:16;113:17;
115:1,21;116:21;
117:2];118:25;
119:16;121:12;
122:5;123:9,24;
125:3,24;132:5;
137:23;138:8;
139:22;163:13,16;
165:1;166:5;168:6,9;
172:14Paplauskas's (l)
159:19
paraphrased (1)
131:16
part (8)
92:7;98:6;110:7,
19;] 12:22;126:1;
130:8;141:16
particular (14)
8:22;11:21;43:4;
56:14;57:16;58:8;
68:4;71:8,15;94:19;
114:7;1 15:6;117:1;
126:4
particularly (1)
53:5
parties (4)
31:11;68:14;91:21,
22partner (1)
26:11
party (3)
9:8;22:21;70:15
passed (l)
161 :4
past (4)
105:21;107:7;
144:7;167:6
pattern (l)
41:9
pay (2)
152:24;173: 16
payment (4)
118:5;131225;
153:17,24
peered (1)
37:15
penalty (4)
52:22,25;55:5;
172:17
pending (2)
6:21;56:21
Pennsylvania (5)
157:7,9,13;160:20;
167:10
people (3)
65:25;83:3;173:23
per (2)
69:1,2
percent (6)
93:10,ll,12,19;
131:21;162:9
percentage (1)
93:10
performed (4)
40:17;53:1 1;
156:10,13
performing (1)
25:25
Perhaps (3)
99:2;134:1 l;137:9
period (1)
141 :10
person (7)
19:17;31:24;61:15;
62:7;109:22;133:24;
147:18
personal (3)
107:14;111:6;
164:14- Personally (2)
3 1 :25; 1 67:3
person's (1)
164: 15
perspectives (2)
169:25;171:1
PERUSES (5)
39:1;54:8,18;
57:19;72: 1 9
philosophical (1)
26:20
phone (3)
105:2,4;l 17:6
physical (3)
99:16;143:4,5
physically (5)
13:22;14:2;129:22;
134:19;154:3
Piccirilli (71)
5:8,8;6:6,10;7:6;
8:1;13:1 1;14:4,10,
17;22:1,3,25;27:20;
33:1,3;37:21;38:8,10,
17,21;39:6,22;40:2,
11;41:3,6;42:5;
47:23;48:2,3,8;
49:10;54:3;56:5,20;
57:5,10,17;58:3,22;
59:10;63:20;65: 14,
20;66:7,16;67:5;
70:8,12;73:25;81:24;
84:9,10;94:20;95:15,
20;100:1 1;101:9;
127:8;146:21,22;
156:9,14;158:25;
159:19,23;167:20;
168:6,8;174:8
pick (8)
36:1.0,15,22,25;
142:19;150:10;
151:10;155:16
picked (2)
37:2;143113
picks (1)
36:24
picture (1)
19:15
piece (2)
31:25;65:2
place (22)
9:24;12:7,16;15:9;
18:6,14;47:12;69:10;
71:23;74:9,10,18;
103:1,18;106:25;
107:5;148:5,6;161:9;
162:24;163:1;167:11
plan (2)
158:10;160:2
planned (1)
152:23
planning (1)
9:3
please (30)
7:14;15:1;22:4;
38:22;41:4;42:5;
48:2,9,12,14;49:10,
11;54: 1 ,6;56:3;57:4,
13;59:7;66:20;70:1 1;
88:25;89:2;95:15;
100:23;117:10;
118:10;119:5;120:4,
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171:2
PM (6)
5:1;100:20,20;
167:25,25;174:12
point (37)
14:22;15:8;16:8;
18:1 1;27:20;44:25;
65:15;73:22;75:24;
76:4;77:5;78:23;
81:1,5,9,16;84:4,25;
89:4;95:22;97:20;
106:14;107:21;
114:10;1 19:23;
125:13;126:7;
128:12;130:2;136:3;
137:17;144:19;
152:12,25;163:15;
165:13;173:18
policies (1)
18:9
policy (9)
19:19;30:10,17;
32:14,17;42:20,24;
90:1,7
polite (2)
38:15,]9
Polyurethane (1)
102213
ponder (1)
52:16
pontificate (1)
56:7
pontificating (2)
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poor (1)
173:8
portion (2)
78:1;88:3
position (3)
58:20;69:16;
168:20
positive (1)
127:21
possession (3)
16:4;130:14;
137: 13
possibility (1)
51 :7
possible (1)
134:24
post—closing (1)
21:23
potential (1)
39:11
potentially (1)
170:7
power (6)
54:14;80:4,15;
134:12,15;135:3
Practice (48)
5:5;7:13;8:20,22;
13:19;19:24;29:6;
39:14;40:13,19,24;
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172:14 -
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104: 14
preclude (2)
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117:22;1 19:1,17;!
120:16;122:4;123!:6;
125:8,25;126:16;
131:9,11;132:13,16;
160:11;164:4;!
165:10;169:9
presenting (1)
168:4
Presumably (2)
62:16;63:6
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108:20;111:19;
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(11) Pagliarini's — prfetty
xv.
\-
9/5/201 8 8:49 AM
Hearing William E. Paplauskas, Jr. - V01. II
May 9, 2917
112:12;131:10; 105:13,21;145:8, 80:22;172:19 169:3 12:13;159:9
151:5;157:20;168:19 16;146:2;147:2,22; punishment (1) readily (1) recall (47)E
previous (3) 149:21;150:23; 170:5 60:3 5:4,20,23;6:22;
155:7;162:20; 151:7;162:20;l73:10 purchase (4) reading (3) 9:25;10:2;12: 10;f
165:7 property (31) 33:9;52:19;86:4; 39:4;57:20;131: 13 40:3;69:10;70:18,20;
previously (7) 9:4;15:5;17:10; 133224 ready (1) 71:17;72:10;74:23;
10:5;67:12;69:7; 23:23;31:5;52:I9; purchased (3) 152:9 77:22;79:25;83:14;
72:13;80:9;1 13:6; 78:16;79:10;88:21; 103:12;145:15; Real (48) 23;88:7;103:2;10436,
117:7 103:6,24;111:6; 167:5 8:23,24;9:1,6,24; 14;106:18;107:9;
primarily (1) 126:2;127:4;130:14, purchases (2) 21:7,]O;29:6,24; 108:23;109:1,12;I
62:23 19;139:12;145:15; 33:7,7 30:15;33:6,12;34:12; 110:7,1 1,18,22;
primary (5) 147:3;149:13;150:3, purchasing (1) 35:9,18;36:4,20; 111:22;1 12:16; I
62:25;103:9,12; 6,25;152:12;154:2; 31:4 38:4;39:7;40:5,13, 114:7;1 15:24;1 18:1;
151:16;157:23 157:1,15,19;161:14; purpose (3) 24;65:18;68:5,7,15; 119:21;121:6;12454;
prior (23) 162:1,3 40:1;62:25;73: 12 69:9;92:2,8;93:4,7; 126:4;127:22;
12:5;43:4;71:18; proposed (2) purposes (1) 94:23;102:22; 155:10;161:10,17,19;
73:5,9;86:8;88:8; 168:15;170:25 129:5 105:12;150:10; 162:13;165:21 '
103:18,21;104:4,1 1; proposing (1) push (1) 156:18;161 :2; Receipt (1)
106:7,18;147:1,2; 170:19 152:1 168:16;169:6,12,18, 122:25
149:14,24;150:1,23; proration (1) pushed (1) 25;170:16;171:14; receive (4)
153:19;161:17,20; 17:8 106:16 172:3;173:2,12,22 16:15;25:6;78:14;;
162:14 prosecute (1) put (7) realize (2) 133:241
private (2) 70:11 18:13;51:20;70:13; 157:21 ;166:3 received (5) 5
8;20;67:25 prosecuting (1) 77:1 1;1 1 1 :6;1 12:10; realized (1) 19:13;137:4;139:2,
pro (1) 5:21 137111 77:20 10;144:1i
168225 prosecution (1) putting (1) really (20) recent (1) |
probably (8) : 18:10 30:22;35:5;50:22; 169:6 ,l
9:19;12:12;24:16; prospective (1) 75:5;80:13;85:12; recently (1)
‘30:24;61:2;90:5; 97:3 Q 86:12;109:1;112:18; 56:10I
96:25;169:5 protecting (1) 122:21;138:4;156:3; RECESS (2)
Iproblem (4) 18:17 qualified (4) 162:17;164:23; 100:20;167:25
31:14;144:23,24; Protection (4) 40:4;56:13;58:7,17 165:8;170:2;172:17; recipient (1)
156:15 18:7;20:18;47:11; quick (3) 173:18,19,21 37:3
problems (3) 62:15 100:18;108:20; Realtor (26) recognize (26)i
28:17;136:22; protocols (1) 156218 12:12;15:6;27:9; 10:11,13;11:17,19;
152:3 18:13 quit (1) 66:2;74:14;80:4,14; 70:6;72:21,23;
proceed (6) prove (1) 139:8 82:25;85:19;89:15; 108:13,15;113:11;
6:2;38:22;41:4,14; 13:14 quitclaim (1) 107:11;134:6; 114:20;115:13;I
134:13;165:1 provide (13) 147:7 135:10,11,13;150:14, 116:9;117:15;i
proceeding (3) 17:1;29:17;55:20; quite (1) 17,19;151:23;154:8, 118:15;119:9;120::9;
7:12;169:16,17 71:1;73:19;86:11; 45:5 9,18,22;161:22; 121:23;122:18; 2
proceedings (1) 90:6;106:5;116:21; 163:10;166:17 123:18;124:16;
5:4 163:18;164:6; R Realtors (1) 125:20;127:1,3;I
proceeds (6) 165:16;I72:22 68:10 163:22,25'
24:21,25;78:15; provided (10) raise (1) Realtor's (3) recollection (9)
87:18;133:24;149:2 86:7;88:16;89:14; 90:9 49:16;107:12; 6:20;16:18;22:8;
process (9) 98:7;108:18;121:12; raised (2) 135216 40:3;42:14;75:2;
6:16;37:4;41:23; 123:25;125:2; 32:12;53:6 reason (6) 89:7;136:12;142:8
68:11;104:15; 145:23;165:14 ran (1) 78:21;82:11; recollections (2)i
105:24;137:22; Providence (2) 156124 115:16;134:16,25; 128:16,19
164:20;166:23 49:23;50:3 rare (1) 169215 recollects (1) 1
profession (2) province (1) 29:23 reasonable (2) 43:14I
18:18;58:8 56:1 rate (3) 52:16;65:17 recommend (2)‘
professional (3) provision (1) 19:1;27:18;153:22 reasonably (1) 174:1,3I:
56:14;1 66:16,18 57:9 rather (1) 63:13 record (25)i
promissory (5) proximity (1) 91:22 reasoned (1) 5:7;7: 15;16:8,19;:
54:20,21,24; 61 :23 react (3) 169:24 24:1 8;25:3;28:22;i
139:18;140:15 public (20) 76:7;108:3;164:11 reasoning (1) 49:13;60:4,22,25;§
promulgated (1) 5:18;15:1;18:19; read (14) 56:3 61:12;62:6;65:7;5
56:10 ~ 20:16;26:5;28:25; 41:17;48:14,15; reasons (4) 66:21;77:9,12;86:20,
properly (1) 49:18;52:4,12,18; 54:25;55:16;1 11:16; 27:16,19;47:9; 21;87:1 1;100:19,22,
52:20 53:19;54:10,13;55:7, 112:10,13,13;140:21; 152:6 24;159:8;168:2
properties (12) 8;56:12;57:21;58:6; 156:1;165:5,1 1; Rebecca (2) recorded (6)
R-‘EEn—EJ-Scx-igm’a‘i Allied Court Reporters, Inc. (401)946-55001 15 Phenix Avenue. Cranston. RI 02920 www.alliedcourtreporters.com
(12) previous — recorfled
V.
i.“Azw/
Hearing
9/57261 8 8:49 AM
William E. Paplauskas, Jr. - Vol. II
May 9, 2017
20:7;23:5;59:12,
20;60:20;78: 12
recorders (1)
99: 1 9
recording (15)
16:12;19:4,5,11;
23:6;50:3;60: 1 0,1 1;
61:8,16,17;73:24;
74:2;99:16,17
recordings (1)
6 1 :23
records (1)
61:14
recourse (1)
52: 1 7
Redfin (1)
150:9
redo (1)
28:13
redraft (1)
28: 1 5
redrafting (1)
28: 14
RE-EXAMINATION (5)
26:9;29:5;32:6;
134:10;135:9
refer (3)
58:24;59: 1,4
refi (1)
33:13
refinance (2)
33 : 1 5;53:5
refinancing (1)
172:4
refresh (3)
6:19g89z6; 136: 12
refresher (1)
88: 11
Refreshing (1)
40:2
refusal (1)
63: 1 5
regard (9)
40:5;93t4g94223;
95: 1 6;99:16;1 06:3;
153:2,15;169:12
regarding (10)
40:12,23,24;43:3;
83:7;95:22;1 1 8:2;
124:4;162:15;168:16
regards (1)
89:5
Regional (2)
101:18;102:12
regular (2)
40:24;72:7
regulate (2)
171 :2, 12
regulated (1)
171 : 15
regulation (1)
173:22
regulations (2)
21:14;172:20
regulatory (1)
64:23
reiterate (1)
99:2
reiterating (2)
99:8;168:19
rejected (1)
134:6
related (3)
54:24;56:16;58:10
relates (1)
9:23
relation (1)
85:25
relationship (3)
62:7;63:5,8
relationships (1)
36:17
relatively (1)
17:21
relayed (1)
25:20
release (1)
25:3
relevance (1)
14:5
remainder (2)
15:21;77:16
remember (127)
7:6;71:6,9,10,1 1,
13,21,24;78:17;80:3,
23,24;91 : 12,24;
104:21;105:4;
106:10,12,16;107:12;
108:20;109:9,20;
110:13,15,21,23;
111:10,20;1 12:1,2,4,
6,9;1 13:1,2,20;1 14:9,
9;] 15:6,14;116: 1,14;
117:1,23;118:6,7;
119:2,18;120:21,22,
23;122:8,10,21;
123:7;124:6,9,17;
125:10,12;127:14,20;
128:1,2,10;129:3,8;
130:3,5,7;131:17,19;
132:6,21;133:10,14;
134:1,5,15,21;135:2,
21,22,23;136:18;
137:14;138:3,6,14,
14,20,21 ,24,25;
139:7,9,15,20,23;
140:3,6,24;141:14,
18;142:10,22;144:1,
16;147:8,16;148:7;
149:6,18,19,20,21;
151:9,12,14;152:10;
154:17,18,20;155:2;
156:3;166:8
remembered (1)
165:7
remembering (2)
71:3;135:4
reminds (1)
39:24
remodel (2)
158:5,7
remodeled (1)
103:10
remodeling (1)
158:20
remove (3)
15:1;82:20,22
render (1)
55:23
rendering (1)
57:25
Renee (1)
88:20
rented (1)
157: 8
reopening (1)
repeat (1)
15: 23
rephrase (1)
14:18
reply (1)
55:21
reports (l)
169:4
represent (17)
15:2;20:3;26:16;
27:4;29:10;30:25;
31:1;32:1;70:15;
72:4;95;6,9;96:10,11,
13,15;146:15
representation (1)
105 : 1 0
representations (l)
140: 17
representative (4)
102: 10,12;104:25;
129:1
represented (l 6)
29: 1 1;30:1 8;31:1 8,
22;41:24;51 :5;68:19;
70:17;73:15;85:6;
93:9;95:2;96:2;
146: 15;]47124;
155224
representing (33)
13:25;27:23;31:1 l;
43:24;44:10;45:6;
46:10,21;70:18;
74:14;75:22;85:17,
19;90:2, 14,25;94: 1 ,5,
13,14;95:2,4;96:3,6,
12;98:9;103:22;
144:15;148:11;
158:24;161:19,20;
167:1
represents (3)
35:13;96:7,7
request (4)
65:10;90:4;121:2,
20requested (l)
24:23
require (1)
29:20
required (4)
21 :6;36:5;52:3;
127: 12
requirement (5)
64:19;97: 1,6,6,10
requires (1)
64:9
requiring (1)
57:24
requisite (1)
40:22
reread (2)
5 1 :24,25
rescission (1)
53:7
residence (3)
103:12;151:16;
157:23
Residency (2)
17:6;72:6
residential (6)
9:2;33:6;35: 18;
68:8;93:7;120:6
resolve (1)
172:11
respect (7)
38:17;55:20;94:18;
105:10;126:5;
132:12;153:8
respectful (2)
38: 1 5;48:10
respectfully (1)
38:7
respond (1)
65:11
response (2)
19:12,13
responsibility (1)
45:23
responsible (4)
43:9;142t21;
143:16;154:13
rest (2)
76:22;82:7
Restaurant (2)
156:23,23
rested (1)
6: 12
restricting (1)
168: 16
restrictions (1)
158:6
resuming (1)
168:2
Return (2)
121:21;122:7
returns (1)
122:12
reverse (1)
89: 23review (4)
38: 1 ,39:;23 156: 11
14
reviewed (4)
12:1;106:19; .
109:12;127:241
reviewing (2)=
6: 22; 38. 23
Rhode (51)
8: 9, 17, l8, 19: 20;
20. 12, 19;24: 20, .
29:19;30:16;32:14;
34:13;37:17;40:13,
25;:41 12;:474,:51 9;
53:22; 55.,4 13, 59. 14,
60. 21 ,;24 63:23 ,64. 8,
12, 15 65. 8; 67. 16,22;
72: 5 ,84: 14, 94: 22,
95:5,7,18;97:2,7;
98:16;103:7;145:18;
150:17;151:2;i
157: 25, 161. 15,I
168. 13, 169: 18 ,21,
170: 13, 173. 6, 11|rid (1)
Ii
153213|
Right (59) |
23 17, 24 5 10, l
25' 19' 26. 13; 32. 14,
36. 6; 38. 12;41. 10,20;
42:11,13;45:12;
46:23;53:6;55:9;
63:8;64:21;75:3;
79:23;81:14;83:1;-
86:20,22;87:2;90:
97:3,11,16,22,25;
98:5,13;99:25;
107:25;108:1;l
116:12;118:20; 1
130:16,17;131:1;
132:24;134:20; .
135:14;138:9;
141:18,21,25;l42:3
7;148:18,21;151:10;
153:20;163:3,8;
170:14;172:21;174:4
rights (2)
140:20;153:2
ringing (1)
125:10
River (1)
101: 19
Road (4)
12: 9, 103. 7, 157' 12,
161' 15
Robbins (4)
107: 13, 150. 11, 12:;
161:22role (3)
11: 22' 83. 24' 89. 11
v00
Rifin-U~Scrig}%® Allied Court Reporters, Inc. (401)946—55001 1: thniv Avpnnp. Prangtnn. RI 02020 www.alliedcourtrenorters.com
(13) recorders — role
f.
9/57201 8 8:49AM'William E. Paplauskas, Jr. - Vol. IIHearing
May 9, 2017
rolling (1) 100:13,l7,21;131:6, 155:18;166:15 79:17 15;]10:2;112:21,23;
137:14 7;132:8;134:8,10; seems (3) series (4) 113:4,23;1 14:5,22';
room (60) 135:18;145:3;159:3, 51:13;81:2;164:22 28:16;67:2;101:6; 115:4,17;116:24;
12:17,19,22,24; 6;167:16,22;168:1; select (2) 159:16 117:24;119:3,19;Q
13:3,10;14:12;15:2,5, 174:6,10 41:11;104:16 seriously (2) 120:19;121:16,25;
7,14,19,24;16:3;18:3; save (1) selecting (3) 63:16;173:19 123:1 l;124:2;127:9,
22:17;26:12,18,24; 65:20 56:15;57:23;58:9 seriousness (1) 13,14;128:5,8;=
27:8,9,24;42:16;43:1, saw (7) selection (1) 169:3 131:15;134:2,2,4;2
17;74:l9,20,24;75:4, 125:6,11;127:18; 37:3 ServiceLink (17) 157:21;164:7;i
6,6,9,14,18,19,20; 139:25;140:1; seller (63) 62:12;70:22,24; 172:15,24
76:17,19,20;77:14; 156:21,22 9:10;12:2;14:1; 71:7,18,21;88:16; signature (23);
79:21,24;81:17;82:7; saying (15) 17:6,7;20:3,4,8; 89:8,13;90:23; 10:19;21:21;64:6;5
83:3,21,25;87:20,23;
91:9;107:8,9,18;
110:10,22;160:8;
163:4;171 21,23;
172:25
rose—colored (1)
153:21
rugs (1)
137:15
rule (1)
170219
rules (8)
18:5,21;19:18,25;
20:17;30:16;47:12;
49:14
ruling (1)
22:3
run (7)
26:5;47:16;59:21;
81:9;82:12;143:19,
22runner (3)
61:25;63:7,25
running (1)
156:25
S
sale (6)
33:13;79:9;93:8;
139:5;147:6;150:6
sales (3)
86:5;102:10,12
same (19)
9:11;18:21;19:25;
25:5;63:9,10,14;
78:13;87:5;109:4;
118:19;146:3,5,10,
10;]57:5;159:24;
171:3,7
SAUNDERS (58)
5:2,3,12;6:8,19;
7:10,11;13:17;14:13;
22:5;23:2;25:23;
28:4;32:6,20;38:13,
20;39:20,25;40:7;
41:2,13,16;42:4;48:1,
7;49:9;56:2,19;57:7;
59:6;65:19;66:9,19;
70:10;74:4;82:3;
83:17,19;84:7;95:14;
16:7;17:22;51:4;
52:23;53:2;93:13;
98:12;109:20;
138:11;143:9;
144:15;147:16;
151:12;154:12;166:5
scenario (1)
51:13
schedule (6)
43:7;45:10;46:1,8,
24;133:16
scheduled (2)
12:6;46225
scheduling (3)
44:20;46:15,20
school (9)
101:15,17,19,21,
24;102:5;160:16,18,
21
screen (1)
171 :25
screwed (3)
129:11;143:16;
158222
scrutiny (1)18:8
seasoned (1)
33:12
second (3)
10:9;34:15;72:25
Secretary (5)
55:15;56:9;58:25;
66:3,5
section (8)
56:1 1,1 1;57:15,17,
20;58:1,3,5
sections (1)
55:1
secure (5)
47:13;49:l7;51:13;
71 :2;73:8
securing (1)
52:19
security (1)
18:13
seeing (4)
125:10;127:20;
140:3,7
seem (2)
38:2;84:20
seemed (2)
24:23;26:16,17;
29:11;30:19,21,23;
32:4,8;33:19;35:15;
41:24;44:10,15,17,
22;45:7;51:18;59:19,
19;60:14;65:1,1;
68:17;72:4,9;73:15;
80:7;84:3;85:6,17;
86:7,9,25;88:24;
90:2;92:10;93:9,17,
20,24;94:1,6,1 1;95:1,
4,6,8,11;96:13,21,24;
129:1;152:2;153:5
sellers (25)
23:10;68:9;70:17;
73:9,13;74:14;75:17,
22,23;80:8;87:14,17;
90:6;93:l3;96:1;
109:5;111:1,2;112:5;
113:21;114:12;
129:17;130:10;
133:8,20
seller's (24)
12:1,4;13:20;14:6;
16:4;24:20,25;31:6;
45:1,13;47:1;50:2;
76:22;85:23;86:6;
92:21;96:14,20;
107:2;12921;135:10,
16;154:8,22
selling (1)
31:25
Senator (1)
156:25
send (2)
25:2;83:11
sending (4)
24:1,6;43:21;
122:11
sense (1)
137:7
sent (6)
11:9;16:9,17;
22:19;121:14;125:5
sentence (1)
131222
separate (2)
1313;35:19
September (2)
69:6;155:12
sequence (1)
104:12,16;106:8,1 1;
l44:l6,18;148:7
ServiceLink’s (1)
89:11
serving (1)
21:19
set (8)
86:4;106:1 l;133:2;
143:2;145:4;148:3;
150:15;161:25
sets (1)
28:16
setting (1)
144:17
settlement (16)
22:13,17,22;23:10;
24:22;29:21;45:18;
53:3;55;6;64:5,6,9,
18;65:7;96:16;
117: 12
sewer (1)
92:13
Sheet (1)
126:12
short (3)
37:18;167:24;
168:2
shortly (1)
16:17
show (3)
50:17,20;88:12
showed (5)
24:15;46:5;47:1;
51:10:107216
showing (2)
24:1 1;108:11
shown (1)
128:4
shows (3)
18:19;50:22;137:4
side (13)
12:4;13:20;31:6;
46: 12;74: 16;75:10,
23;76:22;81:14;84:6;
88:2,24;92:25
sides (7)
30:25;31:2,3,14,17,
22;93:1
sign (38)
18:25;23:1 1;54:21;
74:15;80:14;98:12,
73:2;108:21;113:1is,
24;114:24;115:19§
116:16,18;117:19;'
118:21;1 19:12;_
120:12;121:8;122§2;
123:2,20;124:23;i
127:5,16;164:9
signatures (3) i
73:8;84:3;125:14:
signed (35) i
19:6;22:18,20;
23:8,10,10;41:22;
42:1;60:14;64:10;
75:16;80:1,9,14;l
98:17,21,25;109:1'7,
24;113:25;114:1;'
117:25;122:19;
129:10,19,21,23;
132:13;139:19,25
142:11;154:12;
165:24;166:10;
168:24
significantly (1)
30:4
signing (15) .
12:25;64:17;75:16;
76:1;77:23;88:2;
111:20,25;122:10
125:12;132:4;
137:25;154:4;
164:25;171:22
similar (1)
92:5
simpler (1)
30:5
single (2)
63:12;85:5
sit (1)
65:5
sitting (1)
173:3
situation (8)
34:8,11;35:25;
36:3;81:10;82:14,21;
93:23 i
six (1)
142:4
skimmed (1)
112:15
skimming (1)
131:19
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9/5/201 8 8:49 AM
William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Voi. IIHearingMay 9, 2917
sleep (1) specifically (9) State's (1) 111:3;1 13:1; 5:14,17;166:12;
137:16 74:23;78:17;91:24; 58:25 130:15;135:25; 171: 7; 173224
sleeping (2) 94:12;118:1;147:13, statues (1) 137:1 1;139:21; talk (4)I
137:17;154:11 16;151:9;162:13 56:4 140:12;153:12; 49: 11 ,74. 6, 106:23;
small (2) specification (l) status (2) 154:10 153: 5
107:6;142z8 132:18 80:23;83:8 stupidity (1) talking (17)
smattering (1) specifics (2) statute (17) 173:15 17. 21 24: 8; 36: 1,2;
173:25 120:24;132:1 38:1,24;39:4,8,18; subject (9) 45. 19 61: 18,71: 5;,i
smell (1) speculative (2) 40:20;41:7,9,17; 18:20,21;19:18; 85: 8 ,94: 17,20;'
137:15 2721,25 53:24;54:2,13,16,25; 20:20;62:14;63:22, 131: 20, 134: 15,
snarky (1) spend (1) 55:8,10;64:16 25;88:21;172:17 135:2,24, 149. 9 ,9, i
58:4 35:5 statutes (3) subsequent (1) 155. 3
software (1) spent (1) 54:1;55:21;172:20 168:18 tax (8)
18:12 18:16 statutory (1) substance (1) 9: 4; 17: 11, 121: 21;
sold (l) split (2) 97:9 11:7 122. 6, 12; 126' 2, 12'
155:14 89:25;90:1 stay (7) such-and-such (1) 153.22i
sole (1) spoke (1) 15:19;75:6,19,22; 50:15 taxes (10)
162:6 76:20 95:19;152:24;157:10 sue (1) 17:8;92:8,12;i
somebody (6) spoken (1) stayed (1) 92:19 119:24;120:2;126§5,
22:20;30:1‘0;37:2; 105:23 157:15 suggest (3) 9;153:18,25;167:112
50:1;65:6;171:25 staff (4) stenographer (1) 13:13;40:21; Taxpayer (1)I
someone (10) 5:21;26:6;168:3; 49:12 173:19 121:3 I
34:23;35:3;40: 16; 169:4 step (3) Suite (1) Technical (1)
47:7;58:12,15; stage (1) 31:14;77:10; 12:9 101:18
104:23;134:15; 157:6 159:25 super (1) Technically (3)
161:5;172223 stamped (1) steps (1) 138:7 22:13,24;76:21
sometime (1) 88:13 104:8 supposed (1) Ted (2)
143:24 standards (2) sticking (1) 82: 15 168:24;169:1
sometimes (4) 55:12;56:8 136:25 Supreme (5) telling (3)
86:24;87:6,7;93:1 Staples (1) sticks (2) 8:15;63:24;64:1; 144:1;151:9;172:1
somewhat (l) 47:16 124:10;126:2 171:6;174:3 tells (1)
81:6 Starbucks (1) still (6) Sure (31) 36:4
Somewhere (2) 171:24 23:22;81:8;119:23; 7:10;23:19,25; Ten (1)
119:25;151:19 start (7) 134:2,3;144:19 24:9;33:22;35:2; 49:6
soon (3) 7:8;14:21;19:14, stipulate (1) 36:19;38:25;39:19; tendered (2)
75:10;80:17; 23;20:1;143:22; 160:9 55:16;59:22;61:10, 16:14;20:5
129:16 158:19 stood (1) 24;65:4;68:8;75:5; term (1)
sooner (1) started (4) 129:23 78:13;80:8;81:21; 124:9
122:7 13:6,7;20:18;130:5 stop (3) 84:24;85:2;87:16; terms (2)
sophisticated (1) Starting (2) 16:20;47:20; 93:2;98:19;108:8; 17:21;1 13:13
30:12 5:16;158:21 158:22 162:11;163:21; territory (2)
sophistication (2) starts (1) Strachman (13) l64:7;165:20;169:4; 102: 14,1 6
32:4,5 161:24 5:19;6:15;21:16, 172:4 test (2)
sore (1) state (22) 17;25:22;26:9;28:18; surprise (4) 28:23;161 :4
128:21 7:14;8:13;20:12, 70:14;137:20,21; 47:3;52:9,13; testified (11)
sorry (7) 19;29:19;30:16; 144:25;160:5;167:21 136223 39:13;42:25;46:4;
80:24;89:17,18; 34: 12;37:17;40:22; straight (2) surprised (2) 51:2,1 8;83:6;84:1i9;
110:13;115:8; 41:11;55:4,13,15; 107:6;109:10 76:11;81:6 94:4;95:1;131:9;
116:18;162: 12 56:9;67:20;127:1 1; straight—away (1) swath (1) 139:25
sort (4) 161:6;168:17; 129:13 102:20 testifies (4)
30:2;3 1 :9;55:24; 169:20;170:7,18,21 stretch (1) swear (1) 7: 19;66:24;101:2
164217 stated (4) 62:21 154:18 159:11
sound (1) 91:25;108:17; stricken (2) swept (2) testify (3)
134:14 131:24;143:15 40:14;41:1 19:16,21 6:4,24;173:1
sounds (2) statement (15) strike (1) sworn (5) testifying (1)
63:10;148:21 23:1,14;36:13; 96:6 7:18;66:23;101:1; 40' 16:
spans (2) 51:14;52:15;63:19; strong (1) 141:14;159:10 testimony (9) i
116:11;126:24 64:5,10,18;65:8,20; 168:15 synopsis (1) 5'25'21. 24',:40 12,:
speaking (3) 114:18;117:12; strongly (1) 156:1 23' 55. 2' 82. 5,23'I
14:21;33:4;161:23 118:13;125:18 168:23 95:25;158:15
specific (6) States (4) stuck (1) T thinking (1)
54:1;119:21;124:8; 8:15;149:13;171:8, 128:20 119:24
128:16,19;132:21 11 stuff (9) table (5) third (2)
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Hearing
9/5/201 8 8:49 AM
William E. Paplauskas, Jr. — Vol. II
May 9, 2017
9121,21 5:15;6:2;7:25; 9:17;35:19;68:9; 141:10 unsettled (3)
thorough (1) 11:15;14:7;69:9; 93:19;105:12;108:5; type (6) 22:2,8g4218
70:14 70:4;82:5;141:6; 145:20;161:25;172:7 28:24;34:10;51:17; unusual (3)
thoroughly (1) 155:20;156:21; transcript (3) 92:5;102:1;169:16 86:25;87:3;90:4
111:19 171:13;172:12 6:22;121:21;122:6 typed (l) up (39)
though (5) told (32) transfer (1) 122:10 18:20;24:1 1,15;
16:15;38:3;81:8; 13:15;14:24;15:14; 73:13 tyPes (1) 32:18;46:5;47:1; l
95:9;167:12 19:4;41:18;44:2; transpiring (1) 33:5 49:22;50:17,20,23:;
thought (17) 45:14,16;50:14;52:8, 130112 typical (1) 51:11;57:2;65:6; i
42:15;82:16; 11;73:23;74:2;76:14; travel (3) 36:3 69:4;96:25;102: 19;
105:19;110:24; 78:18;81:5;82:6; 152:22,23;157:11 typically (3) 106:1 1;107:16; 1
121:14;122:6,7; 98:13;105210; traveling (1) 35:11;72:5;80:5 108:20;127:23;5
129:9;134:2;135:1,3; 109:10;112:19; 149:12 128:18;129:1 1,23;
139:11;140:7; 129:21;138:8; treat (1) U 134:17;137:14;i
144:19;146:17; 141:11;143:20; 169:15 l42:19;143:l3,16;
158:15;164:18 148:8,22;153:24; Trevor (1) Ultimately (2) 144:17;148:3;f
threat (1) 155:23;164:11; 152:10 45:23;130:18 150:15;158:22;E
170:4 170:22;171:19 tried (1) U-Mass (1) 159:18;161;25; .
three (16) Tom (6) 11:3 101:25 166:3,12;170:13;:
16:19;20:1-0;25:8; 5:20;7:23;67:1; trouble (1) umbrella (1) 171:7;172:9I
37:1,5;68:19;87:8; 101:4;159:13;168:4 133:11 9:1 upgrade (1)
90:22,22;146:6; tomorrow (1) troubling (1) unable (1) 18:12j
147:1,2;149:12; 27:13 19:3 12:2 UPLC (l) I
150:22;157: 1 1; tone (3) trucks (1) Unauthorized (3) 168:4
‘173:10 38:9,11;112:6 27:15 5:5;7:13;170:5 upon (3)
throughout (1) took (8) true (2) unaware (1) 7:2;18:11;95;23j
135:20 9:24;15:9;25:19; 35:21;81:18 76:9 upset (1) i
Thursday (1) 69:10;74:10;103:1, truly (1) uncomfortable (7) 112:7l
61:22 18;161:9 170:12 13:10;43:17;44:1; use (10)
times (9) total (1) Trust (1) 50:22,24;91 :8,11 9:3;47:7;49:24;
36:15;49:1,4,6,6; 78:14 37:17 unconnected (1) 61:6,9;71:1;104:1,
60: 13;71:4;85:1 1; totality (1) truth (2) 65:13 20;105:7;147:9i
146:6 20:13 13:15;1 18:12 under (17) used (8)i
timing (1) totally (1) try (2) 6:13;9:1;18:8; 49: 18;71:3;144:18;
152:6 55:18 87:3;152:3 19:25,25;20:16; 146:3,4,5,9;147:1§
title (50) touch (1) trying (17) 30:16;56:11;64:8,12, using (2)i
16:11;26:4;29:20; 130:10 14:8;49212g79217; 20;97:25;109:5; 99:3;1 10:16I
30:10,17;32:13,17, tough (4) 86:2;111:3;113:5‘; 139:17;161:5;170:4; Usually (16) l
19;35:24;36:1,6,11;
39:9;41:11,20;42:11,
19,24;50:2;51:5;
59:21,23;61:6,7,9,12,
15;62:1 1,19,24;63:7,
25;73:13;86:1;88:9;
90:6;97:4,12,25;
98:1;99:3,4;111:16;
122:24;165:4,5,16;
169:20;170:20;
171:19
titled (15)
114:17;115:11;
116:8;1 17:12;
118:12;119:7;120:6;
121:2,20;122:15;
123:15;124:13;
125:17;126:12,22
Tiverton (14)
12:9;44:23,24;
49:24;74:11;103:7;
107:1;1 19:25;137:5;
153:22;157:15;
161:15;162:25;167:9
today (13)
68:25;85:12,12;
165:20
town (14)
24:13;44:23;49:19;
62:1;77:10;86:10;
87:9;92:15;137:4;
158:3,6,14,19,24
Trade (2)
168:12,25
trained (3)
56:13;58:7,18
Transact (1)
54:23
transaction (26)
9:8,12;12:5;20:9;
22:23;23:5;29:24;
30:25;32:16;35:9,13;
44:10;46:12;57:24;
62:10,19;68:16;
70:16,19;71 :14;
75:24;79:10;103:4;
134:4;161:5,12
transactional (1)
3 1:12
transactions (9)
116:3;129:3,4;130:3;
133:12;135:23;
136:23;152:1;171:2;
173:20,21
Tuesday (8)
136:12,14,19;
137:10;140:24;
141:2;142:12,23
turn (18)
6:9;72:16;1 13:9;
114:13;115:9;116:6,
13;]17:10,17;118:10,
17;119:5,1 1;120:4,
11,25;121:18;167:7
turned (1)
158:7
turns (1)
92:18
two (13)
17:23;20:10;24:17;
31:11,23;33:5;61:21;
65:5;99:18;126:24;
152:17;157:11;
163:10
two—hour (1)
174:3
undermines (1)
63:16
understood (2)
6: 12;81 :2
uneasy (2)
l6:13;77: 12
unethical (2)
94:9;95:5
Uniform (1)
120:6
United (1)
8:15
unknowledgeable (1)
41:25
unless (3)
6:24;]5:18;45: 11
unlikely (1)
3 1 :20
unnecessary (1)
38:21
unrepresented (1)
29:13
unresponsive (2)
47:25;48:5
30:9,11,1 1;32:1 1;!
34:18;37:12;53:11;
59:12,16,24;60:25;
75:19;86:21;90:6;!
97: 1 8,19
V
vacated (I)
20:4
vague (1)
166:3
vaguely (1)
166:8
valorem (1)
9:4
variety (l)
27: 1 9 i
various (2)
55:21;164:25
verbatim (2)
13 1 : 14,1 8
verifying (1)
104:9
Vespia (9)
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Hearing
9/5/201 8 8:49 AM
William E. Paplauskas, Jr. - Vol]. II
5:19;28:19,20;
29:3;132:10,11;
133:1;160:9;l67:19
video (1)
171225
Vin (1)
162:7
Vincent (4)
12:13;100:25;
162:19;166:22
Virtually (1)
139:24
Vocational (1)
101118
WW-9 (1)
99:20
wait (6)
60:8,12;87:1,15,
18;90:13
waiting (l)
50:22
walk (3)
53:4;141:22;163:2
walked (8)
22:16;47:2;51:4;
91:7;110:16;138:9;
142:6;144113
walking (1)
149:23
wants (1)
32:13
Warranty (4)
126:22;137:2;
139:5;147r6
Washington (1)
37:16
waste (1)
173217
water (2)
92:13,15
way (14)
7:7;37:7,8;71:2;
87:10,1 1;98:2;99:12;
122:1 1;166:16,18;
170:10;172:10;174:4
web (1)
171 :20
website (1)
59:1
Wednesday (1)
88:20
week (9)
60:14;136:8,23;
141:1;142:22;143:1,
2,8;152117
weekend (3)
111:7;134r22;
137:8
weeks (7)
17:20,22,23;90:22,
22;152:18;157:11
well-informed (1)
53:10
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128:13
whatnot (3)
72:9;76:23;77:11
what's (1)
90:10
whole (6)
112:13;1 14:10;
135:22;137:22;
163:8;165tl2
whomever (l)
68:10
wife (5)
107:14;1 12:7;
113:25;138:16,18wife's (1)
157:5
William (4)
5:9,10;11:1 1;70:1
wire (2)
25:16;149:3
wired (5)
25:9,11,14;60:6;
149:19
withdraw (3)
58:22;63:20;65:14
within (8)
12:15;24:17;25:5;
56:17;58:10;74:17;
107:4;163:1
without (9)
31:17,22;34:17;
41:25;46:16,20;
50:23;64:5;157:18
witness (37)
7:9,16;14:8,15,20;
22:7;23:4;38:7,18;
39:1,6;40:5,14,25;
41:8;48:4,13,16;
49:11,14;54:8,9,18;
57:15,19,20;58:5;
59:7;66:18,22;72:19;
77:23;100:16,25;
156:16;159:5,9
witness' (1)
21:21
witnesses (3)
6:1,3,17
woefully (1)
169:8
wondering (1)
19:23
word (2)
91:1 1;112:14
words (2)
21:20;138:10
work (8)
68:6;92:2;152:22,
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12
May 9, 2017
worked (6) 11 (2) 2013 (1)
69:18,22;84:21; 3724,25 67:18
133:16;153:7;161:5 111 (1) 2014 (1)
working (4) 122:22 18:5
69:13,14;89:4; 117 (1) 2015 (12)
111:4 123:13 9:25;18:5;37:14;;
works (l) 118 (1) 69:10;85:9;88:20;f
45:20 124111 103:1;114:5;136:1;1;
world (2) 12 (3) 137:5;156:19;161:9
20:19;68:7 54:4,6,7 2016 (4)1
worry (1) 120 (1) 131:3;157:2,16;I
153:13 124:20 158:18i
worth (1) 125 (1) 2017 (1)
65:2 125215 5:24 !'
write (2) 126 (1) 21 (7)i
30:17;32:13 126:10 9:25;69:10;90:19;;
writing (3) 13 (3) 103:1;1 14:5;136:1i1;
41:15,19;99:9 57:13,14;113:9 161:9i
wrong (2) 14 (4) let (3)i
55:9;92:18 114:13;168:11,11, 134:21;140:23;Q
wrote (4) 21 154:24 i
42:19,23;88:23,23 15 (3) 25 (4)-
168:11,18,21 93:19;107:14; .
Y 150 (4) 115:9;150212§
9:19;40:17;84:20; 27 (1) |
yay (1) 85:1 137:5i
169:1 152 (3) 28 (1)
year (11) 72:16:126z20; 89:23
9:20;40:18;49:1; 137:3 28th (1)
68:23;69:5;84:17,20; 153 (1) 137:10
101:20;155:14; 137:3 29 (1)
156:17;157:18 16 (2) 168:11
years (11) 67:9;1 14:15
25:24;34:11;38:5; l7 (4) 340:16;55:17;58:14, 34:11;38:5;40:16;
14;64:13;84:15; 64:13 3 (6)
107:14;150:13 19 (l) 59:1 1;84:15;88:15,
8:6 18,19;151:21 i
Z 1964 (1) 3:01 (1)'
8:6 100:20
zoning (4) 1987 (1) 30-some-odd (1)
9:3;158:6,13,18 67:9 58:141988 (1) 3913 (1)
1 101:22 12:8
1995 (1)
1 (7) 147:25 45224;10:4,6;72:14; 19—9—6 (2)
88:20;89:19;90:17 36:5;37:19 4 (7)
1/2 (1) 62:17;88:15,18;
84:15 2 108:9,11;157:6;
1:00 (1) 1631225:1 2 (1) 4:10 (1) 1
10 (3) 52:16 167:25
57:18;88:13;1 17:8 2:51 (1) 4:15 (1)
100 (3) 100:20 167:25
53:13;131:21; 20 (1) 4:30 (1)
162:9 55:17 174:12
104 (1) 2000 (1) 41 (1)E
121:18 8:11 88:13 '
108 (1) 2002 (2) 42—30—8 (1) i
122:13 168:11,19 53:22 :'
1099 (1) 2009 (1) 47 (2)
99:20 56:10 116:6,11
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9/5/201 8 8:49 AM
Hearing William E. Paplauskas, Jr. - Vol. II
May 9, 2017
49 (1). 58:14
5 (2)
44:5;63z22
50 (3)
69:3;93:10,11
528 (2)
103:7;161:15
6
6(2)56:11;57:17
60 (1)
53:13
63 (3)
116:1 1,13,17
7
75 (1)
93:12
78 (1)
117:10 i
.f 81 (1)I
117:17'
8—12—70 (1)=
101:14 I
84-83 (1)-
160:15I
86 (1) I
118:10I
87 (2)
118:17,21
9
9 (1)'
113:7
90 (1)
119:5
92 (1)
119:11'
93 (1)i
120:4
95 (1) g
120:11 i
99 (1)
120:25
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