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Interview with Wali KhanAuthor(s): Wali Khan and Feroz AhmedReviewed work(s):

Source: Pakistan Forum, Vol. 2, No. 9/10 (Jun. - Jul., 1972), pp. 11-13+18Published by: Middle East Research and Information ProjectStable URL: http://www.jstor.org/stable/2569037 .

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June-July 1972 Pakistan Forum Page 11

INTERVIEW WITH WALI KHANNote: The following interview with Khan WaliKhan, leader of the National Awami Party, wasconducted by Dr. Feroz Ahmed in Peshawer onMay 6.F.A.: To what extent does the interim constitu?tion satisfy the demands of your party? Whatadditional provisions would you want to haveincorporated in the permanent constitution?W.K.: The accord reached between the NAP & JUIand the People*s Party on March 6 had envisageda common formula for the interim constitutionof Pakistan. And the arrangement was that wewould give them our own working paper based onthe 1935 constitution with consequential amend?ment s, the government would hand over its work?ing paper to us, and the two parties would meetjointly to evolve a common formula which wouldbe introduced in the National Assembly andwhich would be called an interim constitution.According to that agreement we did hand overour copy on the 1st of April to the Law Minis-try, but we did not get their copy till theevening of the 12th of April. The Assemblywas to sit on the 14th. So they gave us hard-ly any time. You see how they were trying towriggle out of the situation. In the interimconstitution we could only assert that theremust be responsible cabinets in the provinces.But we failed to achieve that at the center.That*s why we have constitutionally an anoma-lous situation in the country. We have aparliamentary system of governments in theprovinces and a Presidential one at the Center.That is our objection number one, which westill feel strongly about in the federal sys?tem, with four federating units of whatever isleft of Pakistan, and in the absence of a bi-cameral legislature, it is most important thatthere be a federal parliamentary system ofgovernment in order to safeguard the interestsof the federating units. In the latest inter?view he (Mr. Bhutto) has given to Mr. Lindleyof ITA he still seems to suffer from theillusion that he is in an overall majority.That is wrong. That is absolutely wrong be?cause he has majority in only two of the fourprovinces of Pakistan. If it is a federalstructure, I can only throw back at his facehis own argument which he had advanced againstSheikh Mujibur Rahman that although he was inan overall majority at the Center he, becauseof his majority being confined to one provincewhich had an absolute majority, didn*t havethe right to rule over the other provinces.I am going to confront him with the same argu?ment because he has an absolute majority inthe province of Punjab which is 65$ of thepopulation of whatever is left of Pakistan.

That does not entitle him to rule over theother provinces or to brag that the great maj?ority of the people are behind him. He seemsto forget very conveniently that in Baluchistanhe has not got a single member either in theProvincial or the National Assembly. He alsovery conveniently forgets that it was in theFrontier province where Mr. Bhutto himselflost an election. How can he turn around andsay that we have accepted his politics? Wehave not accepted his politics. The two prov?inces which are left have to a.ssert themselvesconstitutionally and they have to be accommo-dated in the central government in such asense that they have some sort of a controlover the policy-making decisions. We don'taccept his position. That is our greatestobjection to this interim constitution. An?other one is the use of emergency powers. Heasked us and we agreed to the inclusion ofemergency powers which every constitution has.But we certainly do not agree with deprivingthe people of this country of ali the funda?mental rights which he has taken away in thename of emergency. Where is that emergency?He seems to be full of flowery rhetoric forIndia. Dhar was here. Aziz Ahmed was here.And we heard ali those flowery speeches. Wedon't see any emergency, and certainly thereshould be no reason why our own courts shouldnot be trusted.F.A.: Your party had ali along opposed Paki?stan' s involvement in U.S.-sponsored militaryalliances. Why have you remained silent whenour government has not only refused to with-draw from these pacts but has shown willing-ness to sign a new bilateral treaty with theU.S.?W.K.: I am surprised, because I have ali alongcondemned this involvement in my public utter-ances wherever I have been. In our centralcommittee resolutions we have condemned thePakistan-American alliance. If you have readmy national assembly speech wherein I havetried to give the viewpoint of the NAP, you'11see that I have taken great pains to illustratethis one particular point on which I have laidgreat emphasis that even Pakistan's inclinationtoward China was a part of the global strategyof the SEATO and CENTO powers. I have saidthat they were trying to bully India into asituation in which it should get under theumbrella. Now that India has gone with Russia,again they have gone to the wrong position ofSEATO and CENTO.

F.A.: The impression that I get from readingPakistani papers, including Dawn which is not

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Page 12 Pakistan Forum June-July 1972

unsympathetic to you, is that you have notspoken strongly against Pakistan*s further in-volvement with America. I have seen yourstatements on the constitutional matters, onthe law and order situation, but none on Mr.Bhutto*s interviews with the New York Timesand Newsweek.W.K.: They may not have covered them. Afterall most of the papers have their limitations.The trouble is that we do not have our ownpaper. Most of the press, Dawn excluded, isNational Press Trust which is neither nationalnor a trust. They obviously do not cover thesestatements. Nonetheless, the fact does remainthat in all interviews with the foreign corres-pondents, with local correspondents, and in myspeeches I have always condemned these pacts.I would like you to read some of the speechesI have delivered in Karachi and to the ForeignRelations Committee in which I have explainedin great detail that our involvement in mili?tary pacts serves the interests of some of theimperialist powers in their global strategy.I said that it was just like a little frog in-viting big bulls to fight in its vicinity.What happens then is that when the bulls fightthe frog gets crushed.F.A.: What is your position on the Sovietproposal for a regional security alliance?W.K.: That of course was never discussed inthe National Assembly. We tried very hard toget Mr. Bhutto to put these problems beforethe National Assembly where we could put forthour viewpoint. We wanted to know what werethe negotiations that he conducted in China,the negotiations he conducted in Russia. Ournation should be in full position to know asto what does Russia want, what does China feeland what does India want so as we could takea decision on it. All the same the NAP doestake the position that we have to live inpeace and harmony with all the countries,especially our neighbors. That is the standwe take. But what are the implications ofthat fproposalj, we do not really know. Un?less we know all the details, we cannot takea public stand on this issue ?of regionalsecurity alliance).F.A.: You have issued a number of statementson the law and order situation in Sarhad. Howbad is the situation?W.K.: The situation is bad in the sense thatit was the party in power which was incitingthe people to an armed insurrection. Therewere these speeches delivered by the respons?ible advisors in certain areas in the Mardanand Peshawer districts where they had openlysaid that the peasants should take up their

guns and shoot whoever comes to take possess-ion of the land. It is in the police diaryand in the intelligence reports of the govern?ment .This actually started in the times ofYahya Khan when we were going into these elec?tions and they wanted Qayyum Khan to deliverthe goods in the Frontier province. Therewere some army officers (who were involved init) and we have the evidence of it. I amglad that Mufti Mahmood has ordered a probeinto this matter. I know that certain armyofficers were particularly deputed here forthe purpose of organizing armed insurrections.We have evidence in our possession that theysupplied them arms and ali the finances. AndI have the authority of no less a person thanthe former Governor of the province himself,Mr. Sherpao, who told me--and I got the state?ment corroborated from him in the presence ofMr. Bhutto, the President of Pakistan--thatthe two leaders of the Mazdoor-Kisan Party,Afzal Bangash and the ex-Major Ishaque wereboth paid government agents...Ali this law andorder situation is the creation of the partyin power. For four months they were tryingto create conditions in which they could de-clare emergency and say that no responsibleparliamentary government can function in thiscountry, especially in this province. Thatis how they wanted to conquer this provinceby creating law and order situation. I thinkthat any government which calls itself agovernment must control it. It is most ex-plosive in the sense that there are innumer-able factories busy turning out lethal weapons,

sten guns, machine guns--only 12 miles fromhere in the place called Dara. So the situa?tion does become more explosive.F.A.: There is a statement by Mr. Sherpao inyesterday's papers in which he has blamed yourparty for the incidents in the province andhas implied that you had the Mazdoor-KisanParty leaders arrested by complaining to YahyaKhan.W.K.: No. That is wrong. I had only referredto certain army officers, such as Col. Qayumwho was advisor to Governor Azhar Khan. Hewas the one who was instigating ali this, whowas organizing and supplying materials. Alithese people were imported from Punjab. Sure?ly, in Punjab the tenant is much more down-trodden than the one out here. There are muchbigger landlords in Punjab than here. You seethat it was not a landowner-tenant problem.It was a purely political problem. My onlycomplaint against Sherpao was that he was con-tinuing the policy which was initiated byYahya and implemented by Col. Qayum, with thesame purpose and the same result. I tell you

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June-July 1972 Pakistan Forum Page 13

something very strange that happened here.The latest trouble was in the police stationof Khan Mai where 2000-2500 Kisans, some ofwhom had come from the tribal areas and theagencies, had gheraoed four or five villagesand blocked the roads. The constabulary wasthere and the police force was there, but theystood there and looked on. They were therefor 3 days. Then a very strange ';hing happen?ed. On the 2fth day it was announced that ArabSikander had been appointed the Governor ofNWFP and Sherpao had been removed; and thenext morning they were not there. They justdisappeared. What happened? They knew thatthe only protection they had had was gone.Any government which wants to create the lawand order situation can do it, but if it wantsto solve the problem, there is no problem atall.F.A.: You have mentioned people coming fromPunjab and getting involved in the peasantactions here. I remember having read yourstatement in which you had referred to MajorIshaque as an outsider from Punjab. Are thePunjabis really outsiders in this province?W.K.: I didnTt refer to him in this context.I said that the landowner-tenant problemsare universal. They are probably more acrutein Sind where there are bigger Waderas andmuch poorer Haris. I said why had all theso-called Mazdoor-Kisan Party leaders seemedto have forgotten the Haris of Sind, all thepoor tenants of Bahawalpur and all the down-trodden people of the Punjab. The only placewhere they could really find misery and pov-erty was in the Frontier. I didn*t refer tohim as an outsider. I only tried to pointout the peculiarity of the situation, thatthese people forget about all the otherprovinces and concentrate on this one. Theywant to create a problem in this province,and they are confined to the two districtswhere the NAP has an overwhelming majority.The problem isnTt there in D.I.Khan. Thereis no Mazdoor-Kisan Party in Bannu, no MKP inKohat, none in Hazara or in any of the statesor other places. It is confined to the dis?tricts of Mardan and Peshawer which havevoted 11 seats out of 12 for the NationalAwami Party. They have to concentrate herein order to sabotage the political positionof the NAP. That is what I was trying torefer to.F.A.: Now that the National Awami Party hasgot its government in the Sarhad province,what do you intend to do about the peopleresponsible for the deterioration of law andorder?W.K.: We are beginning to do something. Al?ready a Commission has been appointed, with a

judge of High Court to preside over it, tofind out what were the factors which went intoit, what were the forces which initiated it,why did the officers look on as helpless spec-tators. We are going to see to it that thereport is not only made public but it is im-plemented, and ali those people who have fail?ed in their duty are punished. We are goingto expose ali those people. I am absolutelypositive that we can do it. I want to gobefore the Commission and say that this iswhat the Governor has told me in the presenceof another gentleman. He tells me now thatI have access to the government secret reportsI can tell you that both Major Ishaque andAfzal Bangash are paid government agents. Itold Mr. Bhutto that it is his (SherpaoTs)government, it is your government, what youpeople are trying to do in this country.F.A.: Since Mr. Bhutto's coming to power andas a result of your struggle for democraticrights your party has picked up some supportin Punjab and Sind, especially in Karachi.Do you think that it will be necessary foryou to change your party program or yourpolitical style in order to consolidate thisstrength and to become a national leader inthe sense that you have following in ali thefour provinces?W.K.: We have always been a national party asour very name indicates. We were the onlyparty who were in ali the provinces of Pakistan,including East Pakistan. We were the onlyparty which had the democratic bases and anelected character right from its inception.It is not the character of our party which haschanged; the country's politics have changed.Thanks to Mr. Bhutto and thanks to Gen. Yahyathat they have supported us in this way thatthey have brought out the real character ofthe party. There is no need for us to changeour policies. We have always been a nationalparty. There is no need of changing our com-plexion. We have always been a progressiveparty. There is no need for us to change ourpolitics because our politics have always beennational. Only the people wouldn't listen tous previously. But on our part we have notchanged our policies. Only the people are be?ginning to change in the changed circumstances.With this confrontation and the way they con-ducted themselves against East Pakistan andagainst the democratic forces, the way theyfailed in the restoration of democracy and thetransfer of power, they have brought out theNAP's character to the forefront?but onlyafter a lot of damage had already been done.F.A.: There seems to be an impression thatwhile advocating the rights of the nationali?ties, you have failed to emphasize the issueswhich are dear to the masses. For example,

(continued on page 18)

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Page 18 Pakistan Forum June-July 1972

guided us and raised such a hell against theenemy that he could not oppress us anymore.Major Ishaque was thrown into jail because helaunched a countrywide campaign against theoppression of peasants in Sarhad, especiallythe massacre of Mandani. Mukhtar Rana, whomthe leaders of hi^s own party have jailed forfive years, gave us unflinching support. Incooperation with the workers of Lyallpur, henot only organized demonstrations and carriedout propaganda for us, but under his leader?ship the workers of Lyallpur rendered usfinancial help. At a time when our movementwas under severe repression, help of everypenny would boost the morale of peasants andmake them think that there was somebody tohelp them and that they were not alone.Why is Wali Khan Panicky?

...Wali Khan's nephew Fareedun Khan, whois the son of Abdul Ghani Khan, recently re-turned from Bombay. After having spent a fewmonths in his village, he hoisted the flag ofthe Mazdoor-Kisan Party in the porch of AbdulGhani Khan's house. I don't know if he hasbeen influenced by any movement in India. Ihaven't met him yet. The peasants have toldme that he does not greet his landlord rela-tives. When compelled, he covers his handswith a cloth-sheet before shaking hands withthe landlords... Even Wali Khan's own tenantsand servants, with the solitary exception ofSubhan Khan, have joined the Mazdoor-KisanParty... Recently somebody wrongly reportedto Khan-e-Khanan that he was going to begheraoed that night. He called in thePakhtun Zalmai from ali over and startedissuing daily statements against the Mazdoor-Kisan Party. Major Ishaque says that we havemade him the propaganda minister of theMazdoor-Kisan Party.

NEWSFRONT (?ontinued from pase ^)ment*s onslaught against the dissenting in?tellectuals in the country. Paresh Chatto-padhyay, who has written some excellent crit-iques of India*s development strategy and whohas exposed the myth of Indian socialism, wasaccused of distributing "Naxalite literature."World-wide protest against Paresh*s arrest hasbeen lodged with the Indian government. Amongthe best known of Paresh*s writings is his"State Capitalism in India," Monthlv Review,March 1970.

Tariq Ali Denied EntryTariq Ali, a former leader of the radicalBritish students and a citizen of Pakistan, was

recently prevented from entering Pakistan.The government of Pakistan invoked an order

INTFfcVIFW (continued from page 13