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The Reminiscences of Mr. Emil Zoerlein
From the Owen W. Bombard interviews series, 1951-1961 Accession 65
Interview conducted: August 1952
Transcript digitized by staff of Benson Ford Research Center: November 2011
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« 1
ft t e n s @ i o f
« 1» 8 K X & 2 0 S I I S X 1
Fart Motor Gwm®W Aroolrfto Qrmi History Seetiet*
August, 3552
fheee Km&e&mmem mm the result of an I n t e r v i e w vlth M r . 2e®*tadt* by M r . 'Oven 3oi<£«ml an a@yi@«i*er 15, 1951, at Dearborn ,
T M 8 internet? was held uaiey the auspices of th* Oral He*
tery See«Un of the tat Mater Coapany Archives.
fa? iaftayeftawMr** fueaiioiii law b«en emitted ffcam tbe as*
cotait. lite questioning was prim.rily its the f&m of topics suggested
to Mr. Soarlein coneeraiHg wh ich he have soae iuti m t e
knowledg®, So editorial ineertione hiev© been aade other t han the
brief spn#ei* of th* 4 a w's a c t i v i t i e s am the index.
ffea 3*i«PM§§ o f the narretive i s e n t i r e l y that of the amor,
l a has rsvieved aad comictad the attamaertpt aad by his s i g n a t u r e he*
Icar mMimmA t b a t i t i s a correct mm M » re^atsceaces.
Thds uraoir i s depo^.ited i a iijc Fora Ik/cor Ccg niisy ArcMvos
w i t h tfee. uB^ratandix^ that i t isay 1 » wed by quali^iad individual®
i s accordance w i t h accepted archival practice as sdainistered by t h e
Archivist.
Bail Zoerleiu
i i
Bom, Stuttgart, (kmnsngr
ms
192(3
1935
I f M
19%%
im mi im 1950
IssRigrated to ttoited State*
Smployed, Long Island MsoMat and Putters Shop, Nev York
foolasJser Hand, Bouft
Bieaaker
Metalworker
Electrical Experisasnt&l
Junior Supervisory Engineer
Senior Supervisory Engineer
Ben&rtiaent Head A
Division Band A
Section S^rvisor A
Address: StO&L Solfvlev Dearoom, Miehifiaa
i i i
MR. m SOEELEIi - COMHWTS
Pag©
Early Life and Work.*.•.««.««.«...«.»««»*«««•*....••«*. X
fool and Die Work at tha Ford Motor Company , 16
Return to G e r a a n y . . . . . . . . . . • • * . « • « . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . » < . * • . 29
Creating tha Ford V-8. 32
Th© Electrical Departa»at and Boater Contracts. U5
Henry Ford'e rhlloaophy of Politica and Race 61
Bdael Ford aad the Ford Motor Company 68
Evolution of the Ford Tost Program. . . .««•• • • . . . . . . . . . . . . fk
Ford Motor Ce^aoy Ssctasarlag .•• .•• .• . . • . . . ••• .• . 90 Aa Electron Microscope*...•••**..............••••....». 131
Aviation Ejqperiffieatatioa, World War II , . ikl
Engineering after World War I I . . . . 179 Reorganisation, 19^*5•••••••••«••«••»•••••»•••»»••••••«• 19W Benry Ford, tba M a n . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . • • . . 212
v
1 was tarn mem Stuttgart* Seraaay* 1 had ay first
ajftttofttoA in OHOMngr* I vent through grafe school, tdg> school, and along with Mjgn •0000¼ * technieal M#i school, lifter high school I attended i pfestteeship for few years, ©©aim along with tecliiJLe&l school»
It was eowpajwry* of wm»o* to eater an «ppr«Me««tttp, That seans a oonfenet was slgoifi iterehy you were ©Minted to stay with this agpreaMeesMii for four years. Yaw father had to pay for that «^«ti««»Mi* iOdteMisJbt »ft«r the i eoad y*ssrs i f th© ap-jwtal&ee** ^wfmmmm wm mU»tmtaiey$ he got a snail eospaaaMoa per week*
If the ftaAbav « M not «10« to w f « i t , 1¾© «toft» would, pay. If the father was able 1» p«r# he had to pay. In sort cases
the fitter* paid tor i t . ffet fee i w not very large* « course, the training was $t&fee rigid ootii. fs?o» the
stendfoiat of ItesrMsg and tie aovol training that went along with it* Ha. ww© forced to go to religious services at least twice a weak.
Our own religion i@teBrt»d what servlne m would so to. It mm s«^rvi«id. If tho state throeo}. tiae shop in which
;/ou received your traltting, and then- i t was left up to the ownsr of the shop, le wm » « w i & l e for the h©y» fh©t mm trm to 193a* a i s was continued ualaljerrufted la spite of the war.
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Bwisg l i e s * psawi of tiie ispaat of the
wm «as quite eevere, ^ t t e t t t e r i y iarlae the second year tfhea we
ware involved ia actual iwr «oa*. We had to do mtaeX war work
along «i tb our imbtiag* ©si laqaast on as Mat qplt* aever©,, psr*
tleu&arly aiace 1 had four Irothers i a the war* I was iateteated
i a doing the toast for the country tbat I could*
ve felt the $£aeh of the StogMjte blockado %ttite strongly,
aad when Geraaa^ went iato euhmrlne warfare, that created quite a
hit of iotas*** over there, te tboegffc that tbat would end the var.
We rea0.i!®ed tfeet that mm a threat *© Jte«iea aad would p^hsaOy
bring the» into the war. for tbat reason there lias soae hesitancy,
as X aaa&li 1 % to enforce the suiw^iae warfare, because th© feelings
betwa#» the Bteited States ssad Serssiay were slwa^a very good.
tefedowk to fee peo§&e over ttax*. *&m i*A «S«aya felt that the
AMirtaiaw wadA sot eater iato the nar* Hbea they catered iato the
war, the sural* eaa& co»a:.drably over there, ©to feeling vae that
A^ariea could aot aaa fust enough. I t was felt that the suh»«in@
warfare would k i l l the tbiag quickly, When the drtm on the liues
Sail**, i t was felt them that i t mm going out fast.
ttere V M & feeling against tbe regixae tfruu Stat ftoaUag
la the part of the eouatry from which I coos, the southern part, was
sa#t&rala«2r etramg* Sbet p u t of tlw country sever was toso eifthuei-
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sstie about tte aj^inintratloa. 33t£# awe- or less a reaction,
againat tte Pruamiiii »7etfev <as> o* tt* ntsJw under the fugliKP of H * ms®. It m tt* urn*® of tovttssjftwg. tte «sj*»»
asjaftettttsja wei* refmoasibie directly to the M s g . *I&B people had
way littles peart i n claaosing thee* Mpms^te^ime. Siey fcere
e^o©4iit©4»
At that Wm Wmm *•» a »fe«g *eeling of a pswmijig social
istic pattern. W aietrict vac a o n conservative, ton found tna
s o c i a l i s t toufcottta* aore t i «1» tatasttift* c a r t e r 3 . MM&ssjrt
i s quite- « bessvy iatattirttil ©eater, Sere m sawm* large zmpmiea
S » king • »* *# t* sp«A# god, ana . t a r c r ths Mm
misted mm did. Tbe king « s S J K W & W. Everybody liked nira treaan-
dously* Tm mMmA mmmmmt mm&'t aush timgtoi of in this nart etf the cotmtry. In spite of that, the people backed the aray strongly.
It wm M l tbat no smttsr Unit ' i ^ ejsjstttiaui m m , thsy would back their aooBtyy f u l l y .
& .!#»?• «rt 100 tt» S»A ftstiOew «M tmttls* ffe had U t t l e fat*. Of couree, mqrttdflg ratiouad. x 4am* t rw—rtiiiT
pitatoeti «gtt sas§ias%. 1¾¾¾ fart of the loot w aoatSqr ayntJaetio. lis
ted sprtiwtte dtesiie, and m t mm a farltf*. %S iftttcSaf h e m ware l ing , I recall ttm W appronticeehip.
ffftlMA to stuaft at ®m 0*el0Ofe la the awning and sorts usttl alowa 0¼¾¾¾¾ at m#t. H§ did &«pe pwso* at ten o'eloeJs for fifteen atawtts, am. tor and a half Dor tiaasr, tartta** $mm at four ofelook
Dor ft lwok» and at sswem oHOaoft an ter for lw»o3% and tbaa back, to waodc again. S»t N I »1»' daps » * sssaaeed to 1mm m^m tom»
Hair* Sort van not the cw*Qi««sf ^ AieooMp training, the oust©®* aiy a pwnttooshif training ms eight hours a dfty and few hours on aatwday, from eight to M M on Satawdaps.
As im m school hmmp m faeBdapt ond fttdopi we only
baft a half a day of school* fta* was cowled en teo^ tdta» «sr
tfrttel«f*«v*»A* the M f e * how* l*t* m pit in tbaa net® Awotod to
Ha- 8¾¾¾¾ stationary eagiaos for powsr plmits 9 crude o i l
•30gis®s aad ssamitim* The m r did sot dnnge the xjroc©dure of the lafpwtteoshit at a l l . Stacr **>*• *o i t yp. &» *aur
yo*r teres ne *st* It m felt that tow mam «ew aeeoaaasy to give
the a«e«§ajy «*psoi«Mtt whieli iw needed to «abl® m to gvadiMfta*
Vhan tha ©imieellery elisaipi. and tho Raiser fled to Holland,
it vaa a terrific dis pp intrasnt* Ttm morale mak oo»ld«mhly. fbsy wsre dipped at that point. I wouldn't sagr that the how front hetr sd the fle»«ft Magi I WM3E& ratber call it 1151;¾; 00-1:,¾, iiorse sense* £» atllttagr felt ttwt tbvjr ©«M tanp cm going and Just drwr trm tha hone firant# Just dwsr last 6rap of »©oA out of thea, butt tho hens front
1I»MBJB« m mm t t e to call ft «mtt» 2ha base front «as fvlsa^pointeJ. % the irindietivotsess of
the peacs. There ms a lot of corr^-srsation aboi.it Wiieon'o r-'ourteec
Points, aa I recall. nan/ fta&t t m thay me® not f a i r , partttadaartar
tba fact that, taaasqf * » fe»©4 of bar ooloataa* That van the biggest
point that aae Aataftaft over. The peopl* fait that the League of
WsMm» sa»aat® wm jaat mother m y of stemming the QamiSB colonise.
Tbay realised that it. W JttSt a ffeatib to xaake that possibU.
1 cmapleted «f apprenticeship training in 1919- The war v%s
ow? than. 1 for asotbar- ha l f year i n the place tfham X ha4
M m i U y , »^*« *® awayafctag «•» h r*«a «p* anA psopl* fan
to iirsetfesa, so ho <•**& mUl mmm star thay» tm a m m ®
until ho could find s t o o l s people, t told h i s that 1 wanted to go on
M t f u a a M m yow «•/ &mst9 could yow stay?* Shaft ftttad t*aj»t
into tha aa«aaaai taaaaa* tha schools wswt toKtam fee*
I atayad for m a t t e hal f yaar and then catered colleap,
^preati^ecbip diplom plue tho oertlficerte for technical training vara
reouirerl for autry to eolSftpu $has* ms «1» a tost required for
aoftartaaj ©©Hags. It ©o«@fst«d s ^ t t y of fraction! and thaoroticaS,
kaoa&sdga. This eolio^s wm open to anyone, and i t «as supported fcy tha atefci. i t was alallar t© a state tattvavaltar hero.
college i n the f * » of m&* W father, holng
X also signed for electrical mmmmmm* X im
St */ the council hut 1 wasted t© see i t throu^ so I
Mb vith i t , hut tha lab
training. In eleetrieal sagtaeeriBg; there laws sears 1 # »
l a taechiUHcal engineering there « • ease physic© lab courses, text
that n t a l l , l a electrical eia#3^@rias m itad physics plug the alee-
Hf mmm*» m*m&wi m& mmm were pmttiMgiy all.
That mads itaelf felt after the f i r s t year and a half of college.
m wm i » fair stats the fi r s t yeas- sad a half, hut after that i t was
W «4*aT tertian* MaWftatoa* i t feat ttted to ate a* *U»«S#l g# I io*pt
oa going. X a M * a * to gat «sr«u# w a l l tat last ttoafr^oattani of &
% Stoat*»when, so to speak, too oottoa f a l l out caaspletely.
ft> titer too last half a pwsr that 1 spent in the
I worked as a laWUwatt* ;pra.fcata apprentices sijailar to
was » # » » 0 @ 0 «»3rt» ft taau 8te& ma the
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pay with taxes dsdantet, ant you could proliatOy *is/ a pair of
H M I * # and ttafe m » « U . «h» m a y val»ise fat* eftmipii raiicejay. Uaay enanged froa dey to day* 13m steams were only open i n the
for 9*sj»js*ag« la *m smmmm mm
*
% 1te tint you .got yow salary ti® prices had, Jw^d, a l
though yow salary n Ld not $m* The salary ess® after the prices
in ths |p5|pp*it JSRSSJ aoefc 'to
gtsfcly, but |f tiie prices
Saturday you osxMft't toy evyttfeg wMfe i t . Ism couM J*»t barely
exist. That aayt i&amB&BL the »tts that 1 waa im collet®.
«»d i t ©ot pro^seiv-ely
two tte Social Darocr&ts » 1 vratooa otber©.
strife I H H a Mdbttaw Also unions eoae t»,
tbe ear, but tliey so*S|y cae* Into power after the
an* sresping for en
i , ami that i n wnen M M of ttece soap *sx orators stated out
along with i t .
•7«
mm a breach of tat latioa&l S o c i a H e t l e
amy*/ ** **** I « k 1 *m»f * * M » m»* the liMr ussnts m i af ter X l e f t , but they «are <pite strong at th* tiae that
I «*» mm vmm.
With conditions m they existed X juat couldn't see any
flatela i n M a l f * 1 l«a* fafla*w*a t^aiim-:', «fW ft«ftf»$ it»s
* mm the youngest on* i a the ftamUy aad X hated to law
I tel. «««4 « 1st *%OMt t t » I f t t t a * §iml*8 mft «mtt mm* t% ma mm geJUlm country. S a t ia th* nay thmt everybody fe l t over there* X
decided to leave for sitter Inland, or mm Halted States, I t was aot
quite clear i a my smai* I feel too mmmgly about going to
ftiqgiaa* because f w n what m beard conditions «st>« f t too good
almm*. i t ma fel t that «he IfeLmm States m e beam. I f a
hiEsself and worked, he had a chance to get ahead;
X had d i i c u l t y getting mmm raay t o o t h e r for i
X had a eloae fries*, mho had goas ttms«# the afpwtioesh% and
ecboul with m , mad he had mm reXaiivsie over here. He and I
mp&r vhartiter w «>m«id gm ©r aot. He said that he would write to his
relat ives and find mtt «a*§ about i t* He did so, aad they invited us
t*m m mm* fit ecrape=i up every penny we had, plus sons assistance from
my Sfitefeivwi aad Aram M a relative© mm here, X® mm* to get
hare, am amdavit W tota signed tey atmt* wiio VUB a citiasn
In tbe ndta* Stages. This f r i»d*» relatives were cisisena of the
tfettod Stata*. » a y It»t4 i a &o©ia» anA tbay law* good mrn^a. to
taut to* respcaslDility for bat* of u*. Ship ma&t m w* tfiUtavat
g i t over here, 1» QBSJM ratJ:*»r fast, aaft left- on Awpsst 4, 3 ® ¾
anil arrival la Wm 5 » OA August 1?, 19¾¾.
% didn't k m i i l m mm gulag **> do here. % just hoped that v* couli f i l t e r back into our froSpsstioti. 0* coarse, we tanr that
no Had to learn the langua^a a ttttit* a m . l a had learned eon® i a
eehool, Hot that wm mvutloUX* ft* didn ' t specially i n that, par
ticularly as sngiaoere. tie d idn ' t taw nfeat «e we getting into.
f l u m mm htm, m& M M A * » s i s ter out with M»
f i r s t to tUaft » 3* ftar M s * *bey i M f ind o»l for M» tut* days after
we lm# laaa&wl. ISsase relatives of M a m s n i t .Si too good financial
e*a***l*m fjittmp} they owned mm bonnes and s© on.
Qs® fourth day 1*3* .lady went out with as, and we canvassed
the shops around Brooklyn. She f i r s t and second vara failures, and
that was a M t demoralizing to as, last va iMMjf% on going* Us eaw to the t h i r d fttwy whielt vat th« Xct j Island Machine w# Pattern Shop em
Sana Street. We ®i8»d for a Je* tiawe. The owe? @mOd tali- a l i t t l e
mmm* He taw m t I cfM» f»o» M tlawe* ami this lady ted t o l d M a
too* 1¾ a l i t t l e Osrsssn to s© and aafesd. aa> several question®
•9-
to tsaft mm m*t i «m&t « 9 * is html 1 » m * $.75 «a few* a m
At mm mm mmy avJdwj «as«i^L*» tmm
amlm* m «ft* ami*** « 1 mm» bote <»^0mnr» and
eiiX^s- Ttiey wmS® Uie for t m metta** ftor m * o i l
upafeaixa iii m * mmmnt sihop. 2ba matinm- <Ol imm to m» |lm*trjr
«nl m l>e ssaeM^d aad processed. X a s tetrad as * to o r iU warn in ®mm mmm mi tap tto» -mm mm
imm m* myt. C* mmm, ft ma osim mmimm mm, i t m * » j m > mAtwmmmm.wm« %%m»tsi&m**, fmtms grand, « M mm* my amirftSift: wtmttwt.
X myfe on 1*¾¾¾¾ t&era. Ia drtllittjf th®se castings you
bsvs to storpaa your d r i l l mmy oac® in a m*3*> X .Jtust ftmVt ten
aw amav- var* m X took ma d r i l l out, nest over to tbt grijjder aad
how to sharpen »y OWB t r i l l * Be 3mm* at mt d r i l l aad said,
x mm m
m i f ay fw»d « 1 1 a l a w ^ of mm> and tma.ywi # d
tap t ^ f f T
1 told She favmm* "tfty H i t sake a i a j i t i g a**®® and pit fSmm* a* mm mM wmm mA da i t % mmmmt" la bad
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twrer htwrd 'of a tapping flxtura* I t was Just a mrnXL shop, Ee
talked to the owner, Mr, Kramer, about i t . Be came to as end talked
i n German as aueh as he eoaU* trying to find out n i l about -mis. Is
wanted 1» know how ansa i t would cost, I told M a that i t eould be
lands in a day. Is wondered i f I eould draw, and 1 said that I could,
lie wanted to tanr if. I eouM mOm Mm m drawing of tba thing, i s was
& l i t t l e skeptical of the whole thing. He didn't have too ouch nancy
to spend en tooling and so forth.
1 aade the drawing at hoae that night ant showed i t to .hia
the next aomlng. He said* 'Hell, X don't know i f we have anybody here that can aake that,"
I said, "I can aake i t for you." 1» said, "Bow long would i t taker I saM # "A day,"
Be hesitated a l i t t l e aad then he let ae make i t . I got i t
aade In a day, and we p i t tbat fixture) on 'the d r i l l press, Our pro
duction wast up km or 900 par cent with aueh lee® effort. It's Just e staple l i t t le gadget*
from then on* tilings tjeoaa® aore interesting. A short wnile later he naked m to take over tbe foreaanehip to replace the foresen
that he bad. Be wasn't qiiita the mm that he wanted end he wasn't on
the Job, Be just went on a binge once In s -while. aeftveUy X told him that I didn't feel tbat 1 could take over this foawsmsolp because
of tbe iMi&wm difference, and these other people that vers working
in there «auian*t fool that tbey mere going to listen to mo as foreaen.
Bo Insisted. Weil, 1 didn't take It at tbat liotaont. X aaid
tbat 1 needed nor® schooling in tbe language. 1 bad already started
attending evening school and 1 discontinued reading Oeraan altogether.
1 Just road English papers, particularly tha Bay York govs and the
pictures and captions under thea.
Two mm®m after this hs^ening, 1 hesitantly took the fore-
sanahip over. X worked along vl«h tho three outers of th® shop, and
it worked out s H right. There aaa a little rasoatiaaat at firet, bat
i t worked oat all right.
I asked hiia to take on bettor work. X didn't like tMs
boiler business that ho had in there* W*a ve iswtallod the oil burners,
«e had to crawl inside of the f ireboxee with l6(> pounds of steam up,
.All thay did was pull the f ire out, but they kept the steam pressure up,
so i t had' to bo done quick, so tho stew treasure wouldn't drop. Us
bad to crawl in through ducts and so form* We made out a l l right, and 1 asked him to take on batter work, say die work or tool work.
Once to a while sons ii abator cane in afao had mm idea and had tho hacking of soiceons else to finance: him to work out patterns
for hla. Be vast out and looked for hotter work* One day he case In
and aaid that he had an ia<juiry from the teeriean ted Bulfoor Cospany
of Loue Island* coneerning asking lattery box dies for automobile
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1*ttsria»« Mr. Wxmmv mtmA m, "GosQA m mm mmmm H*» that!"
1 eaid, "Sea, «a ©an « t e i t a l t t the aacMnery that we
nam nere*
I didn't want to be MM saasooaiala for the .fuot&tioa, be*
cause 1 didn't know eoocsjb about prices end ao forth .
eerfeala jsriea, and v» got the 1¾¾ two days later, wMeh aounded a l i t t l e
uueplelous to aa. Hevei-tbelees^ we e^awtad out and aade the f i r s t die and
got i t -dome i n tarn, but we didn't aake a penny oa i t . Fred Xreatr mm
wary dajafpafteftta* He didn't aay directly that he wouldn't want this
kind of mm* but he was aore .interested in wor* that he knew aore about.
Zt wasn't aoro than a waak later that we got another iao^ry
froa th© Aserienii lard Rubber §i»®«ny to stake two aore. die® for aotor*
cycle btviteries, Sy that tiae I had otwterwed tte ofemtlona end had a
l i t t l e B O X * «qpr4a»a* on tbe 4*0* I aafeoft M s to 1st ae opofte i t ,
m& then he ahOwM oho©* i t* ana i f bo agreed on i t , weH, okay.
altaatly U0m for the aeawJar ooaa tbaa the f i r s t ones, l a said, nCb, we ' l l n o w .get- tbat .web**1
X asAd* *lfciU, aand i t i n . Xf you don't get i t , aotbtsg lost**
& aaat i t .1% and fovea later we-got th© job* tbay
wanted ua to aake two of tbote. On those we aade asaey* Proa then on
he waa arrbimsiastic about getting aore of tfcta work, »M i t worked in
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He RXBO get ft 40b from am investor who loade an. o i l feiUfag
*ouia cUg itself ixu 1% ma ajttXt* an lafrHiftttBg job. 4®% was
not a contract} i t mm Just a t&as aad material Seal. fbere mm eomiga
aosey behtigd i t i f at could do i t .
9he whole tMag. WfM. out. %e«f*4ftilly at thia shop. Shey
vera so free* to ae* tatty Just tool m ia lib* oa* ttf tt» family. X
was out to th* Kranere* cottage aad horao oa week ends. Be let ae nee
his wmommm* It w just like inane, I was just like la beam, they
1 kept om gems « U 1 1 £ & 0:f course, X s t i l l had the urge
to get hack isto ay old busiasoc of e ^ t o e r i s g agate. 1 vaated to
keep om going i a that and particular^ muted to Jo&a the Ford Hetser
Coapeay. 1 bat read ,^1¾ a hit about i t , ptrticularly ©heat Mr. Ford.
1» bad read that be bui l t bosas .for his m^loyma. 1 read this ia
Qmcmm* «* ia i l * * ® three years. «hea I was 1» lew York, X
read m$m about 1% aad. flit awe of the iaafej* e%«sr» Oiar there isbna
you read a book, you von-iar, i s i t true #r is i t mm Kara, from talk*
•St£s ^ 40¾¾¾¾¾¾¾ ^ y f e 81 ¾ 915¾¾¾¾¾ ^p^ft^O^^^fti®^ 36 (8¾¾ ¾¾¾¾¾ sft tfa Kfpe5|J|jj '@3 S& SsBCa s eOsjHS 3L* $ § P ^ ^ '
a a n s*aaaa*eatf*i afataj* of it.. tag* urged ae on so aagb ®mm* I Hasted to get t© Detroit.
Stssbsr o » w to get iato the M e i that I was u-aiaad for, eat
masher two wm to get to the Ford Motor CoB^aay. X told Fred
that X wanted to leave. Is tried to disoo^age mf but bo said that
i f X wanted to l a m that i t was a H M#it, that I f X didn't 111»
i t out there X eonld always cos* back.
X le f t Sew lotH i n the hagSantag of February, 1926. « 1
that X had i s Kind was oaaAag to Bataralt and i s ^ t i g e t i i i g the po»~
n i b l l i t i ec out here and toeing i f X eould get into eagiaeertng hero*
I didn't dMUace what X was doing i n low York. X fe l t rather ungrate*
ful , because tbaae peor.lt> bad helped ao to got along and X fe l t a
l i t t l e gailtsr about Imfag «sem, «U8oua> X had ay m desires to
satisfy.
trod Kroner was «®ry understanding about i t and ati l ! i s
i.i^refcf«iaiu.-: about i t * We etill ©awsspwt, and all three brothers
with their hoys ware up here last year to v i s i t us. They were very
happy that i t turned out the way i t did.
X waa very disappointed ia the view ttm* X got first* It
mm a drub February asratisg when X was coaxaa out of the Michigan
Central Depot to a Baker streetcar. It looked awful. X must admit
that X waa tiaeonragod* MunaUy the f i r s t thing -to to was to hunt
ia> a room* X got a mm m qariagaaU* $mmm and tenor Highway.
X got a room there which was close to the Bongo plant.
Oa Vohruary 16* I want out to the oagOopraat office oat
MX*er SoaA looking for a Job with Ford Jtotor Ctta»aiB/« thay aaid that
:;hesy w i eloeei £ar te«|l@ry and tank th*/ w s a » t Mrijag; anybody
tra£L4a*t. Mrs aeb©iF» I mmt to Cadillac* soft they ear* bJ34a*:
Y M M W I I O - «10 they hired as as a dataller in th© Emdissertiia Deoartea&nt.
I stayed there fta* three aastbs, hoping that the ford Motor
daaja*/ woiild omx w agate* S aflat in close eestseet aft* **e«* 3he
Job at Cadillac w rather ms&stemm-* Balff oi* ta» ve dtaaH
baa* anything t » do, and X Just d i d a H lite i t , probably beetm I
had Ford, i a ay M M .
X want out to Ford again and asked for- a job in cnf/inesring,
a*m M i d , *&* you know anybody l a engtoMriiigf 9
I said, *H®.W
aaici, "Well, tibaft there's m chance to - a t into engineer*
log, hut we have positions open for tool and die aaloers.0 3Ms thing
tone.
to get tab* engicosring aaaaaaUgr* aagaa&laae**
1 took a Jib as a M i as* i t s w0m *»* via an* | a the gfwin»wf t o o l roon uid.ch was a brand, new tocjl roon est Gate k. wh&re thss
new Chwieal AW* MgtaHurgie^. Laboratory i s a w . Brow was. th® su»er«*
3¾¾ ir f ^B3W^^ sa^ to be else* 1 vest to teeHerd, and Hay
1
-16-
wa started out thsr-s naming oaygooa dies. X me doing
regular tool sattwr'n ma*. X wafts Mm tm the s t w t e r ©one, the
oegper soil©. Stay were igudlte complicated dies* SUtefie
di ae xawaYom axitm a Mt of wla1^»»KS@ matt repair» That, was titat
f&Fet JBOW
Iota* om am «H6 M a t out t© set tip d ie t , ife haft to
adjust mm a t the j laee o f oymmtlom.* User® w ©am die .« actually
tamam w r e line® Mes %Sm& ap — to mate a laaoamt u n c o held the
gammrmtor to tbs engine oo a Model f a l t e r . Batt pwtiettXar bracket
wan amSe of theme t i w a & H * for three operation, m t-hought that that Ha* a l i t t l e susljer&cw. 1¾!® eouM a l l he done & die. We mt gprntod ttifff M M to Qlalaav .jsai be amid that he wouM me what,
ha &s*m m* m atdm*t Sat» I f t iny aouU perait us to sake a eosMsa*
tiom d ie , or a grogWMimtw Ate ve eaUod i t .
•fe got pemisslem to »ate «MI w * i t had to a» t© th® super-
i ^ e a t a t . aiA th® etraarlate&demt w u l d no to the Tool X3esi«a fiesart*
aamt« X hel tew a*at i t mm UBS«F B i l l Piooh tbma. X had mmat heard
of Car l la te taam» % got- p e ^ ^ w i m , and they ssn drafts®*® down ta
aake sketches of the idea. Us sad® W s 4*e f and i t i m t e t out beautiful.
i f tamrm u s a ehsmee t o i o t«a«emt*mtt to tls® ajgisseeri.^ laboratory out
mm* i l l too <aM» *a» yam w a r aajto&y «awof w
g^Hj there again tbat old !*6© you aaar x mm
«4T«
tea* 1 ditto11, and l a said, "Well,, there1 o ao chance." So X kept
NP l a t e r traaaf ex-re-l, c«id ve .got
by tbe Mat of XavJUt Low. X anted bis about i t . Be s a M ,
t l a n i tbay do borrow aaa ftm bora* Xf you get out there and
mm bow worn you cam do, ssybe tb®y»XA keep yoa out there. I ' U
^wt y©» a note to ths ss8$op§e®& of f iea . Sab* i t down Wmm aad
1 want down and ibo«#i* *»** i t my .j*e* another one of
tJodnga that wold probably be «ss«etta». M l , a weal, later
X got a call to go to Dearborn. Of coarse, tbat wm a big day.
«» osw « t bare and .fan* Mr. Becker i n tbe
B» eleo beadXad ths ens>loys»nt a t tbat tiae. X*ter on, Mr. Carl Aradt
mm *ajr, picked m up and took w over to tb« Sieet mm. ate*, xt i xiabt out here i a the mam whew tba engine bstt*ft-o» m
mm* ®»t aas tba aaat Metal £'1-¾*. Shay bad a speedboat down at the lower end of the bnildlns
for Mr. Edml ford and am© tbe tli^mx* plant wfelem Hr. asmy
flaw. i M a was right to tbe awrtli of tbe S»©t Metal stay,
end of tba- building m a am eatperisamm oar portion
f t f ^ r f y and mum Fords. Hwy did
«b* aisle, way down to
Sfetal jSwyN tEhe n i t end was need far the atrpOteass end
and fixtures .Mr fenildiag engine ssmmts for tte trt* abfa*. m this work «10 doe® iii bore, f&a§ the sheet
tta* sheet aaatfaajk, uate* the direction of Carl Maet, aa* aael3jr about dD or 90 aft* coat ;Sr. ferd*s own private expsri-
7» ar» J ord ana aStMMA aaeb of "fibs tiae* Hben J #irst
ia, X dH»*t see Mr. yord at am*
Suet tMtt mm mm*% m ©loaed atesa* It i
iHKiH any m i l s axwaaf* It ma •84*¾ ©gjesju
that i t wis Mr. Ford's domain. I was sot aware of this at the 1 jflias joined Carl Ji®!dfc*
When I saw the alaae, I ear ftbBt i t was. a sheet, metal shop
and I knev nothing about the ifexs&ag of sheet laetal and so forth and wasn't interested i a i t to begin atefe* I wwlwed i f there wasn't a mistake amoe so** place - X naked « » 1 ftmdt i f there was a aaMdQtfUfcr af a alstabe* X said that X was emmosed to eons out here as a tool
and die natasr* Be amid* "aa* that's & H rlsht. He need tool® and i l ea
Carl Aradt was a little asenmtvie. 1 » was hard to
end •» form, le had. a net atodj «bat«» an i tog w to it, **t ten fan why a* wanted aaartttag that w-
tt* want «, tool » 4 mSsmt* Tiwm i s no »&eiasferataiittag afecait i t . 1
1 said, "Is that jaat * taaigewsry 4®¾?8
a§ sa id , **So, it*« art taejaaaaQr* ton**© going to *
103¾¾, Bavav&alaaa, I W i t ui ¾' miiid tMt aose day sy day vould
», i t was getting a&aaar* Aoyaay, X mm herei that vas tha vain
for th® t r i - s» tor . tts
.one. Stat was i s Bsees&er, 300$. Xt w a s for wing motors. Xt me Just
would cover that tubular strnetwe. Xt was aaae o f ehroas Kolybd«nusi
t.ubing, veti**, and l a d to ha carefully handled and stressed for velds.
After tbat he asked m to a waai i tt^mlar »ngi,?> *ount
f s r the nvKibcr one f l iwar ship vhioh then vas already built and had
flown* hut i t had a wooden engine aooart on i t . they wanted to
i t to a tubular engine mount. H i l s was tbe mm that had tbe
igm**4&&m* engine l a i t . Ǥ aade that v* and iwrtiOlad i t , and that
ww ajrttfag olipeer and eioawto ite&t w» h M i n ate** He get i a ©nntset
with Harry Brooks and Otto Eoppen and w e got along wonderful,
Ste work on that fUvmt shit *»• rtsftfc i a thy Sngimsi
isg Building. Aa finr as X know when I eons out bore, Otto Koppsm was tfea
designer of the je*> and he «*rri#d i t th5?@»gh. Otto Eepseti ta* Sany
Brooks vrorkad «Xs»«iy together, As far M X l m r f Stery &oste tea
M M ao«£aaor2a«; traittiaf • 1» w pretty X«feJte@M« Sbey mm
ffe» oMofly tor f t ,
X don't who c-lec wesi»l OR i t . Jlaay Baltfe was around tlaww* but JU&w Smith vm a » w i wreaywiwe Is those days, v/bera
thare was am lasfeoiefeile to ha tried out or iteg® tiie;/- u p las tailing
* MtUo to 0 ear, flamy aafttli wm liaaa. * was Mr* Ford'a sj@* an*. X aamvfc whether bo bad oylM»g to do mta, the de»l©i, 4tXthmJ#t he
©iSJjt hate nate «i®p«t*oai bete m l these. X couldn't say far esrt&in
alaftiaar -felmt ~mm a© or ami* 15K oaly os»« tbast 1 l w them mm CmrX
J u i t ay 8te«y Stoifcm ami. 01*0
J^jfijji 3* 0a%j l »avj||. :Jm fe ¾¾¾¾ feifeSJSS " S e m fe U- ¾¾¾¾¾ -¾¾¾¾? ¾ sma j J vKHSSMa*- a afcBt amwawSpJa Wfl jj
desired and bad teo now. a# f i r s t job tbat ws got was to afte tbe
tubular angina aaaat to replete the «@@te m^m aaaat. Us baft to
M i * m a ehmit§e@ 0» the laatfaaaut panel. 1¾ iamtaUaa a sew altimeter
0» i t . Xt bad a difformt imago than too original one.
from there on, we vemt aaam and forth \mtmam wlous sheet
aamiaark, making 44»% mad a fixture imm and tfamrm and what haws you.
w f M n w atop mm tafeoo out of hose wad we wit TOtwmeft for #slbe
a WM3#. JiamUy, «w day Otto aoaparn 0 « wound, m& be told ae tbat
they mm in the pmses of denying matter H i ¥ w plane which ms
si^pcest to be a tubular eoaatruetlam of the fue»iaa»« Xt mm m »U» tmaalar ®mm%mmtim sseceft the olags*
m mM that be wwM mm to haw m b u i l d the fuselage and la ter oa f i t 1*« vhole snip. At that tiao aa got elosaJy «e~
fttsSated, end i t seaaed to cUok. Ve built tbe teUp! and a am
by 10» naae of Bate 1 BIJUigr covered th© wtagn. Ss© wings 'ware built over i s mm f a t t e n ebop wfctoa ws titan under tin* dij-ectiou of Bexasaa
BalaMMU a a wings wewt of wooden oonstmietioa with fetate over the© and cohered witb dope, fbe fusalags was also covered with fabric and
dope*
Tbat sbtp ww tattooed to rmo&m a twow^idasder engine oa*
signed by tbe Ford Motor Coapeny. Ks§>t wae tbe ana Harold Hicks wortssd
©nt. I t taw a t w o ^ S i a i e r , ItortaHEiwa boreofower engine.
M Esper erne to oa i t i ^ s , beo»m be was tbe plane jaecMnie iwar at the a i rport . Be i w t a l l i t d Id© engine &nd l i d the engine worti,
and we bail* uo tb@ a J r p t e e ever baa*.
ffta engine ran rough at ftret. ISsare were eoae relnfbroa**
mots put l a the mat , but i t «w then d e t e c t e d tbat tbere mm mm
Soberest -vlteatian yeriofta t» tbe angina alao. An opposed, two-<:yliiidey
mgim $M m®m bwd to balance.
9am ware soaa obexes Mde on tbe engine mount. M I recall i t , tbete vara two struts pat i n to tab* c m of tbe t a n p o . d o eagiae m a t as it wm designed waa Just a s trai#it type. To tab® care of
-¾¾!¾ b a n to bma §©a© diagonals too.
ffaa angina aVaavH awaja a* tbe ay*** of 3*800 r # ^ i . wMeb i t
aaatt i t mm to fatt throttle. mm**& mem yaa eaa*t • Say mm «80 »va*a» aa »va*a* eased
oil through «K» nags, particuXariy vita
fne sMp ma conpleted then* aad we installed the lanfia end :«^pi»at aa* i t W twit f&gan. atecy Brooke did aU th© teat flying, 1 need t© go ewt ©a Sights with Broohe hot not flights. »i weed to tab* m mb fm & ride. He Haw that little
m mm m mm earn af flat laager eat out fate other side. e t e entered 3» the mm B. trophy mmm in H@6 sad SIB?. Be
to as ami, etna* this lit t l e fU-rwer flane, aad eome dean and set £t heaide a his trl*«i»t©rf jeep In that, g# up, and loop the tri-»otor. Be aa* the first am that leered the tri-mtor.
Vhea this at* atsahfe* the dirtei'hle, was hare, he loaned areaad the djirlgifrle until the peo$&e in &a dirigible get seared stiff. Beaaajjhml aa* lasa nt«i the IwaaaajtaaV* Be was scared, stiff.
Gut at the heat raws he used to tate this little piaas and fellow th«? hoato alon$c. so taader tine Wile Isle bridsse **t^ sane nut the
Cfess tine when ve had the taadrad fft.'ME autaaiafhil© races est
at the Fair ironed, i t had iraiaed before the races started,
tba l i t t l e flirvmr ship out there on ejftSMt oa a platfor®.
to start. Harry bad the flivver ship brought down. He took i t up it errat the rasa track mn
X Zm&m Mr. Ford objected to a l l of theae aGro^atic
if hut he juet wulda'x aay no, definitely to Barry. Be
the thing ami fly i t om; to hit; hone in Biiateejaaa aad set i t
wmmm and fan KtXe Boat. Be was a real darsdevil.
While X mm stiJJ, watfcSa* on the mater two tttvaa* ship.,
X aictiJw'Oy recall that X had a l i t t le hmoket -to sake. X ©ti l l had
not yet seen Mr. Ford. X had to do sans f i l i n g , so- X stand up hare
a* m hoaoh filing a w , aad a i l of a mMm eowibedy joked aa. I
ad await, and there w Mr. Ford. I aaasSy ooHapeed.
la aaM, "Here's a nam who know© how to f i l e , mm® did ym
X aaM, "X leaned what x was « m j w n e i , fhere i
put em heiag to f i l e straight mA. to he able to sake i t
He *fhAt*« the ft**, tfter* do *BK eojae ires*"
X aaM»
St wM9 mm did yoii do
I told W™-
m Mid, *$ai*iv ia the wrong pi&ye then, areaH yenf®
X » OS** then that X pf@leMy ataOaVt l a t « * i
X said, I that 1¾ £» the msmig hut it. mmm ;
I tew to 91 end U t a the almlm ttirough to gat back into X*» Willie to do i t . I t mmm tbat you have ti
ta gat into asgiMrtag.*'
la said, "X)o yon know now oaa rvaiatiojiat"
I said, '•fell.*
l a said, is assart by cutoff?"
X' told him, t ' s tha losmtism of tha M a t e whan the a d »
Bs s*M, You're right, tm m had aaa BOX Miller in
Building 33 toBomv, and he'll have a job for you." (There wm as
oM shanty there.) Ba eaJA, "ran baring tlia Jo* up here, aad t*U he
Mid x«n see you and ten you what to do with i t . " X want down there, and B i l l Miller had a hex with & lot of
parts Ires a 3aoA«l steam engine. Xt was a
oat of those eld en^aw weed in ferry
-S5-
1 brought I t bank, and mm day Hr. -fwWl atqaee* by,
and be said, *Sae«e9» a lot of parts sineing. Sb* engine parts caae
2 M oee*&av4. « * » • ' • M M M«*©ry behind i t . % weajt ta> aaas* tt
built uj? end rtn»4i«. Cn yen do that?"
I said*
1 started vorfeiag i t . Of ©oars©, we didn't I a n sissy
Tlsere was oae l i t t l e latbe out thewa. It mm a wood lstha
e*aav 'we used that marine aad tbe d r i l l press sad started
we 4t4eH baws patterns aad oaetinga for p&rbs-
for tbe buso* wMcli origisallsf* IM a w s t e
tte wood ww in wty poor oonittioai i t waa e n rotted away. I said,
•nfowldaH I t be better i f we'd put a east iron base under i t t I t m&&
«ae* longer.1*
i t to Bgfag M: aad Bfeb, lamllj, and they'll » k a a eaat&aj** fbat waa
tbe only easting tbat we isftda on i t* fbe rest wan a l l tnaclitce
t e ^ f l m «tea«itig at thjtc l i t t l e wood lathe and
aaiging Hit ^orornor battii «sft tbe bmc;,ets for tbda l i t t le onglao. Mr.
Ford 4uet ba^aaai to ems aronnd end mid , "mint are you
I ««10,. *Vmmmm aatt***
Se said, **yow eaa*t sal® a ball on tbe wood lathe,"
X bad one mm mm$y* m X showed i t to Mo. m m±a,
11mM, X«U be defied! Sot «i bavo this oae." m p i t i t ta Ma
soekat « K walied off i*th i t ,
1¾¾ aaxt m>mim *b*y brougbt l a a brsaaa. M r Xalte. Xt
a little aetalvorkiag let be. Of coursa, tbat vas vono«rful. In
tea t p t ^ ^ j tbe Aaat Metal aboa aaa » M i Jtaet tbe 1 ¾ ¾ ¾ ¾ * - of -Hbe
'^aildia^ to tbe west waiJU 'Ht t a n sratfar well afewwi yitb the -Mb.
X Km Jost ajaattig a l i t t l e pressure gaxp* for tbat ea-iae. X waa
sitting tbiwe one day engravix^ tea dial for tats gang*, la e m and
ia ^mde^d bow X ae* doing* ** 1» i M s * l a a s s t fieee of
stow -pipe. Iter? mm- Ms l e n t t would --one tea ant hit too p%e,
I*d Jisap. Jar. Hast saM, "what ate yoa 4ntfa*t*
X said, "1½ Jwt laaJttiig * «mga aad jwet f a t fbaV
iag «a> t b a
m seM, "S&at's a book of a place to do tMs Mad of we**.
It*a too nolfiy bora, iea't it? Xon go to tba Haalo Park Shop, Star*
you f*ai»b w tM© aagtsa, yoa so mm tiaws.* It asked a» i f I ©©eld §»«tgs a aodsl steaa eagtise, a two-'
eyliavfcr, « 4 « aajajtaa. I f®M# "See.*
Bs said, *lEew<» but X wast tbat a l i t t le different than tbe
com-sBticnml eogiiift. X*d lite to tea i t r m t o a p n i and taate."
He gaw aa tte' aite of tbe bosa imd #trs!ai be iiwbs&* Sa
•ST-
didn't mi a® my m M M i t , a» mm tat* m m^m &%. iii e*ary aatail, mm th® aaiaab-oaav ffeaa tewi to reverse and
a iwfeo -fee eoajeaaate for tiie IcscaUon, In mme0m » stosa aagiae,. csrtalB aimoaltaaa aio oasouiite»da It* a aatta difficult to Mt
eoat to i t i a* va® tooting aa al l tate tisn. la aald* *I wafe i t coim>oa i and tm&lss^ fit sure » . X
mat e w y part. «1 It to mttk MM a fsll-fiiaad engine. X e^Uatera 3ag§id ait* woods X wit It tesulatad, aad X a i t a oa
He ga^' ass tit* alma of tea oore sad stroke lie
l 9 TBBT ym. a* ta ti» aaal* Park Shop and
i t up. X«U aa atowd to mm it."
ami nade at «a» MaaXo &•* aaaa ia i^rtmwy, 1930- X bad learn ia 'tbe
of M* yaa aaaa*
X% fa «a» aaa tta* 1» 1m lawaafealimy m»* I
lfea> f\aa§. aaa- aiiy fmsaaaaaaaa 1¾ fsaaa* It bad to aa £aet It m s sate of to tte sliojs aad etoaeJpd up cm it. mm
Mr. Fort aets»Xly wanted m to m W there and ins ta l l i t .
I»11 n e w forget that day. He vas standing down below with Mrs.
Ford. » » asroMteet and 1 vent v* the tower on the sosffoM. She
old scaffold van weaving fro* site to s i te, and X vas .hanging on.
for dear l ife ' . He shonted to us, and ttaa» Ford laughed.
In Hay, 1930, sy wife reMnded me that It vas *y parents*
golden wadding aaniversary i n Juue, and X should go over there. Sha
was 1* a feslJy vay at that t ins, and I didn't feel that I should
leave, hut ahe insisted that X go. X vent to see Mr. ford, and I
ashed his i f X eould take off for shout six weeks. He ashed m what for, aad I told hia. la salt, "Sas, go ahead. Take a H the tiae you
want* You aaet aja over there. As a Matter of fnet, 1*31 give you
a letter to the Qeraan branch in case you need scue help over there.
You see Mr. Caapaaai, aad he'll have the letter for you."
She following day X saw Mr. Causal!, aM he had the letter
written. I t w s t letter- of Introduction to Wt* aalae who was the
hraach laaager of the German branch. Mr. Ford signed i t hissself. X
went along with that. At that tiaa X was not a citisen yet.
X left i a Hay of 3fP. It vas rattier harried. I ooaldnH
wait for a tenantry jeaatt, ae X aade arrs«^»«tB with the steajsboat
agency to have that dene. Owy praatsed that they vould take ears of
the re-«atry parsdt. Ibey said that they vould have eirerything over
-29-
by the ttae "chat X weuM be raady to sow baek* I was only
to stay about four aeefcii, baae*** of ay wife's eaafttclaa. I laft* aaat # w thaw aaft west home. Of course, there
a lot of axeitam-at there. Sft*y .had Jwr le i» : flags draped a l l the place. «> parents w e . aajgwv capwctrill/ ay mother, natur
ally, and tiiey arranged a golden. Mddlag mm there Just as nicely
m HHf feasibly mania* It eae aaaa, a*fc w the laet tine that X
at that tine when I entered mxmm* msm weren't
the same say ware* mmm mm a feeling of iepeesslsa. aad unrest. I ®aa»t deeorfbe Itf It was Just te the a i r a H around. X could actu
ally feel the difference. I dl&n't raaUy tew what i t was a l l about,
bet that eeniiti®® «as abata amwarlaaSaaa* I tallied ta some of ay toothers and my father about i t . ifr
didn't wast t® talk maa* about i t . faaj «dd» "Hell , it 'e of these aaetttiaa*. m aan*t iawir what WXX eeme. out of i t . *
My father was a l i t t l e more «e»<«iiid®d about i t , beeauee he
was froa thw old school, l e said, " f e l l , theses a fellow by the name
of Hitler who's trying to get on top, and he's twraiag e-^rything
topsy-tm-vey. I'm afraid that. Urn ecwsfery i s going to the rocks, i f
he gets through with what he wants to do, the country is going to the
bim» *a*tt* abaft i s he trying to dot*
-30 -
Bi said, "lie's taylag to mmk» I M I a yowg god
off ralatlofis nMfe every ©ttoaar couatry. Be oaaaa*t
aartaar villi sjfte^r. Ha Just wattta to do ©royttiiiig
l a v H f . 1% ofsodd ©f i t . 1» e®a*t tain faatiy aaaat i t . laara
are a lot of people mmm&. «ao battaaa in him and f olio-« Ma, no w§
liave to ©a a l i t t lo oarafttL"
Snot was. tbto team* fseXJiig that I fait. It mm last »1»
tayataar olffaraat from mtwa I laft. I stayod m®m for four
At the goldoa nodding cslsbration the. vhole family got
graa*ichildrei:i aad grand* araaaa*i3araa« It vaa aieoi 1*11
format it*
Mr. of tao OaxMa teasaeh was H n m » y y Infm aail that
X ««« going ever tbere, because X iaai&*au a telephone oall from bia
asking i t X oeeied any aaly* ®w aaly ftteatioa that mm opto vaa toe
ratava t r ip , a ® raaaraiBaBa aaa aot aaflsttaly aataallaaae. I ajte i f at oouM oaook tte Beam Germs*. Lloyd aad aee what at
eouM do to aaaura ae a lotusa trla*
l a eeHod m ate* aad mm, * f©w ie a l l
th® *ara*aa** A l l you have ta 4o 1» to aa up ta
tlaaat* oat ta* raaeraetia* vaa aat defteiteXy aatealtaaaft. Is helped aa- ia that reefeet, X dida't mm to do a lot of running arouad. I didn't tmm to ua® ay letter at «11» out tit hmm aoout i t .
•31.
Before 1 left, Mr. lotd 0*16* ,4Xe% you can. go, "but when
you cons bask* ooo ae 4ase4^ft%. «© will tew 80¾®¾!¾ else for
you."
When I got hack,. I aw hia, aad he said, "How, l»d like
you to go bank to the Fort Mjwm I^ihoratory. Shore are two aero fellows
waiklag beak there* What yon ooxftt on end what you see back there X
w i t you to keep to yaaraelf and not aey a word to aiiybody about It.
m are designing a V~8 engine. Ihmt do you know about electricity?"
1 mm* "I think that 1 tow quite a M t about i t . "
Ie said, wl*d XOm to hove you work on the in i t ios ayatan
for this «a0m and the genemters and starters and so forth, a l l the
electrical e^iipsaat for- this ea iae* You work sloag with these two
bays back there*"
I went back, and there was Carl SetaOt* and lay laird who
mm then working on the gs@« work, the teslm snoot of the ?«S. Mr.
Ford hieeslf mm in two or throe Muss a day. m. followed i t through,
seeing what was being done and saying do this and do that, She original
ooceept of the f«8 was hia* aa far as I know, sad Carl Schultr and lay
mm were 6***12&ig M * Sato* tnao.
At f«r a® 1 know, Cboraio Sore»se» knew about the ?-B
developg&nt then* Mr. Ford kept everybody away tarn i t but the three
of us aad ttavjoix. 1 don't tot whether Bdael was aware of this de-
wetoojaant or aot* ie newer stojped ia at the beginning* He esan© in
-32-
later en, aaa finally Sereneem esas la aad P. E. Martin.
Mr. ford mm vitally interested in a one-piece easting of
tha e-ylindsr hloek. It had ta 'ha one piece, definitely. At that tiae
th® caseins pr«w:ticcs vara rather young, aad a lot of developswat had
to ha dona.
that was nhottt AOy of U30 wham X mutt haok that*. 1 work
ed along en this engine, on the J#titioa Bye**®.. Mr. Ford told aa
vhat he vented. Be vented a distributor raetmbed on the front end of
tbe engine and driven directly off the orashaft. Is said, You'll
probably ma into a lot of oppositlen on that, hut that is vhat I
and that ia vhat is going to go on this engine.'*
We did sons design work m i t . Us thought of hov ve would
do i t . It vas at that tia» a l i t t le difficult, hut we couldn't say
that i t couldn't he done until we had definitely tried i t . we
on. that until October,
0® Ootoher 10, m* ford oaa® M and saM, *J*d like t©
you wam a Cbristams present for Bieal. I don't know vhat to give his
any aore. Could .you sake a oao-tenth-slae Mdel of ay first cart** I said, "l*m sure that that eaa he am."
He said, "Yea, hut I want it to ran.11
I said, "Well, I havenH seen your first oar exeajt for pictures
of •%*.*
Be said, "You haven't! Caae oa to tbe car. I ' l l show i t to
»33»
you." m meat mm to to* wmtmrn. It wee thea in the garage, end
we looked i t mm.
Be said, "Are yea sere that you eaa make one that rueet*
I said, "we'll try a l l ws eaa. the here looks a little
snail* 1 don't knew whether you earn .get gasoline through a eMail gas*
o l i m line i f yeu want It right up to eeale, hut we'll certaiiOy try
le said, "Do ®m%*n
It cane out that the here was a quarter of am lash, and the
stroke was thre«-*ighths of an inch. That's pretty email. A l l the
eteel parts that he had on the first model were to he made of stain
less steel, on the nodal for Meal* It was <pite an order for a few
months* There was a lot of vork to be done.
Be embed Bay Laird to do the drafting work and the scaling
down. Be wanted him to make aetual drawings with seals dimensions so
that i t would expedite the Job, He wouldn't have to run baek and forth
to the residence, and many parts would have to be remeved to get the
actual stee en them*
lay made, a i l of the irmwtsge, aad 1 sorted making the parte
for It. finally it got to be a l i x t l e too aueh for jamb that l i t t le
shop ewer there with Just one man working on i t , so ws sent some work
over here- to the experimental iteMns Shop, at the lab, .snob as the
stainless eteel anglee afcta* the frame was made of and a lot of these
aafU iparts wbieb tbey ©onld aake §w» bare.
It was a. fallrtlatt Job. It bad a a«U oa the froat end,
a sasa^iied one wMea. wwiait. It baft aa mm^tmm laap ©a tbe
frost e*ee> as* tbat «o»tea* Wo feat aytol** a^Rjan batteries mm
v# for ft ay tba Wmr leady Cospsiy. VO bad apt**** tiros aad* by
tba Fltaataaaaji Costpiy i t .
fita® X mm mmOm. tba car, Mr. Fori eaid sor^tMwi -of hie
f t » t aettues of tba ojur* Be ajaUy % i le a ear that Mm. ford do*
server, a lot of ejaftlt for.* I iiettaetly vm®m®? tbat. le said,
•!*» aba* yoa tba first ejejia* tba* I vaUt. 1 battt i t ia
kitobea, aad Mra. Ford baited ae wit* i * . a » sbeweft i t to ae later
on. Bt didn't aay enytfciwf afeoat tiso f i r s t ride in i t aor amytoteg
'Of tbat aattNtv,
It «—««» elos® to fi&lstsnvjtdae eart i t iodised almost bona*-
lass tbat w@ w©sM get i t dose. Oa Sooestar 23, we ©tarted at six
o*elocfc la tbe mtmdm «od worked straight tbrongb until mm o^loek
C h r i s e s aternlag. 9mm is*** -¾ of i ^ , Ray laird aad nyself. we
•took ayaito. He went © w to tie Sally Jordan &arditt#o^ and get
M®s®lf a es^sg .for on boor. Shan be ona® back, I -went bank over
tea*, feat Secaaoor 23 to mounter 2¾, i t was troaad tbe clonk work*
¥* just took aoAajaje- ens* ia a vbOa -aad erttejaia off.
Oa ®m®*mm Swe Mr. Ford waa tier© wiUi w until tmtm
•*«Mt a* ajgbt. w» mm jvetby oloaa to tbe fHHsb tban. 8» started
•31«*
playing the mouth organ aad did * J i g for m* Ke felt very,
grand. At twelve @»eloek he l e f t . Be ««14, You ' re getting a t e g
okay now. Jaet leave I t tee, eat I ' l l pick 1¾ tip w the mewing.*
At f ive a*a3aan me Baft i t dome.
M g » after ChxletMis X went baa* to work. He e m Sn ami
««14, ®»a* are you doing hasa* 7aa*va worked lang hours. Bow you
go baek home aaft take a week off." X en**, *m$ X lata that X aaat to get baek ta the V-8
X f e e l a l l r i g h t . X rested up o w r the Chrle^a&e hoM*ay»#«
He geld, "Bo, you go aa hoie«w
X said, ®B% X*» etayiag he*t«* He said, ."gea'fa a aaaaheaa aa»*fwa^gua, aren't you? Ball,
stay here i f you aaat *»•* I aaat baek to the V*8 agate and kept on working em that.
She tawjftftam system had taken shape Sa aar aamftn. The dietr l lwtor took shape and got into the drawing stage end to the sake slag*, fie required
a testing f ixture to calibrate the distr ibuter , to calibrate the
speed, and also do e laetr lea i cheeking* we d idn' t have any
yver there whatsoever. We did not have any electric
to drive th is wli'tersttBg ffefc«r®» wbfteh ie a rote blag fixture. The
distributor le aaaaaal to t h i s f ixture , aad i t ' s driven, and the
are deteadasd by a tachometer and the epark edvamoa on the
i i a X .
bia i f we co'tad «et up m electric a»6©r» «e bed •liable e m tban. It was available fro® i
aritaa lay a ataaa esgifie. Bi said tbat be did aot wat asy el^efcric
ia this building even 1&aa»b- direct eurwot aaa mwatSbHa* He didn't
ajtaa ws .may laaaoa for tbat, aaa % 4Saa»t ask for i t .
Be said, *X»11 t e l l ym td»t you can do. You assign a saall
tbat w i l l rua tbe upset tbat you want for tai* calibrating
A &m engine i w ay *a aSfja as *M>QQ r.a.a* aaiaa «eaaa 2,000 r.a«s. Bay to aete a steam engine to rua ap froa to© r . » . a . to
£,<X$ r*»*a* or better i s rather difficult.
Be said, *3Co*i design a steaa eagias tbat «111 give tbat
X started out drawing a* tbe steaa ea#ae» I got away fraa distri-
aid naat back to atamw e^aee* X deeig^d a l i t t l e etas* eagine
with am inch aad a ^Barter bare mid a tea aad % oaaras* stroke. I t aae
about tswaty iaebee long. Xt M i etUl be over in the Mueena, by the
X eeaaaoted i t ay ta art** ay ealibratias aaoMae* Ke
i a getting i t up to 2,to0 r » j f r a a 200 to 2,¼©© r«»«a«. At %,km r.p.nt.
it vaa a l i t t l e erratic. The apaaa aeaftaa't stay oaaatamt} it vealA ebaace.
Ia talking aaaat tbe steam m0m *i«b :¾-. Ford, X told him tbat i t fuact toood pretty good ezov.it la tbe too raagtt of spaed. fie said,
-37
*mm hold i t at that speed and natm the p v n w o© that the speed i^re^ses aligirUy, about a i par aant Increase, under f u l l load,
froa tha speed of under no load condition. That, of course, was a
ptssle at th<s m a i l .
X was working oa i t for a while. Oi .course, X was think
ing te teres of a f l y h a l l ..governor with the suspensions sa^ndarly
to taat advantage of laoytte, & looked, a t the design and said, "Bo, X don't mink that's tha way you want 1» do i t . Cone along with ae,
and I » H shew you a govaaw t h a t ' l l 4® i t , w
Ha took as ever to Buil&im 13 and shwed ao am Arsaiasrten-
Sims eagles with a Wright governor, fhat governor i s built i n the
flywheel* Xt consists of two woiajft* with an off-eester sitspensiom
fulorum point* «he one wight is ao»**tfoeea forcei the other weight
on tbe long a w i s i n e r t i a force. A s aoaant a load Is put om the
•tana engine t i a i n e r t i a force weight kids® fswwsrd .and opens the valve,
feu can calibrate that go^mor so tbat you cm get a higher spaed under
load than ante no load. When X aay under load, I asan the rated f u l l
If an engine is designed ta develop twenty horsepower, when
you take twenty horsepower froa that engine, your speed vl.il increase
ow-hal f of 1 far tent of tha speed under load. I f the load ia over twenty horsepower, the asaetana, the speed w i l l drop because no governor
w i l l put power om the engta** It just controls the valve.
lie Mid, **» aaka case Site tfel% sad 1% sura tbat yam
can do i t * Keep thie Wrt#Kfe governor i n mind. I ' a going to talk to you Ititfg .oa about ttwst f o r aoaa other ajajlioayon**
We made tba i m a v and, by golly, i t i w t o d , so
aa aeed tbat «fig1l«» ia calibrating this distributor.
Nr. Ford ornate* tbe high taaaios vires f m i tha dietri*
tasfeor to th® aperk plug a l l jaoltei lot p i a o t i w with $mt tba eaae to tbe uparH flags attaaMU Ae a ant ler of fact, be Just aaatod
texa&nels " ^ ^ e oat of tba aide of tbe molded Immtmf and tfrtm nm
apriag ©Hps batwaaa the not teradaal and tbe sp&rlt plug, feaaiaale
are what tba M e l . A bad. I t juet bad ttnaa> bron» springs in. tbere, and tbat* a want ae wanted.
vie tried tbat and bad aoaa of tbaae aoldad. Of course,
tbey would break down dieloetrica31y. Saa plastic bora was only (about
aa inch ia disaster aad tayerod off toward, the rear. She fear vires
at the banning tapered doan to tares, two aad one. Ife # » t eoald
set get Use fdslectric avjaagtia in tiaa ma arial to prtfant tba alactri-
cal brtoMoam.. foe iswremt aaalft j ^ s f»a» .one oomtetor to tbe otber
conductor, Saas# of mmm, caused a*nftrlag.
faat aaa an awful lot of «*£af# but be iaeiirted tbat be wasted
tbat. At tbat tiae, titer® Jew* aeaaa»t any bigb uislectrlc Materials
available aa there are nor. fbere mm am awful l o t of tiae, energy aad
eoat tbat want into that. It f inally vaa decided tbat i t wouldn't writ,
<*;*>»
msK\ tiai would wm Babelite- tubes* Ve weald 'put regular iaaltSam wires*
high team*** attaa* and *eajai the® thru tbsae mTmm* Tbm mm better.
mm f t » t eagiaa a** run mm* «* the 3Puw a>avw Mb-, «8
mde a wooden stand and vat i t *m on i t , 1 ¾ prfe a pulley oc the ba@k
sad aad. rmj i t up to tUe lmmm&M»im Shaft of the shop to got i t
started by bolt drive. First m started the engine froa the line shaft
run by a steam engine. A® the engine started, it would drive the line shaft and the steam engine. ' 1 ¾ shop had a wedem floor, and the whole
building shook when this engine ra&, We got what little load we could
baek to the Mite saafti it rami that m® fin©, 35wt was the beginning
of 1931.
After the f i r s t <wt xaa* m* Ford deaiaad to build up an ©Id garage in bask of the Fort iQwara Ijftoomtory aad test it iu there. Be
had a garage bui l t up, two stalls for ears and om partition for mm
test stand, i l a t t t i n engine up in Item and put an air brake on It. fbat wm jttet two pedals, four feet apart aad on© square fooi, and we
cwwM ealeuiat© versus speed, how much power the engine would put out.
a* -ram it that *ay»
we installed enginfts i n wwiwpid Hpftml A 's , and took tbaa
eat aa the road sad drove thea* It didn't develop as WMOB power then
m it doe* sow. l e didn't know how mash power we would get ©at of it*
Hi had am way of amam***af it.
A nam by the nans of Baaa** mmM wm *Hug. the teet drfviag.
That*s S«Ut®*s brother, tba electrician here, fete f^terson, who
Jnst recently easn back v i m mf and Eddy Malea did so»@ driving.
Of course, lay BeMiager end Jinny Ssdtb drove,
latter oa, to June of 1 9 ¾ i t waa decided to send aa engine
over here, and X wold aouat i t oa the dyneaoaeter. Borenaen was i a
em i t by that tfcet. Bt oaaa ia at tba t i n whan tba b l inder blocks
were supposed to bo oast tows at the Rouge, tba tiooe-pieee cylinder
blocks. Be and Isana Relabel!, did aa awful lo t to aeecBsnlisli the
casting of the aono-oieca cylinder blocks.
We lost am awful lot of ea*tiage oa tbat. 1 can't give you tbe ratio of tbe lost ones to ths good ones, but tbere were an awful lo t of
tbem east before tbey got sens good ones. That wee because of tiae core walls being too tbis and core shifts. Soaa casting did not have proper
meblaing stock. It was quite painful to develop that casting. In <hme, 1931, tbe engine was brought over bare and put on tbe
dynasioafter* f ie dynaffieasters were located at the nortb end of tba Engineering Building up ia tbe awtbenet eoraer. we bad six dynajaoaeters there. Xt was set up ready for the test. Tbe distributor was working off A a camshaft at tbe front of tbe engine.
% tbat tiae, Sdeel, P. E. Martin, Sorenaen, and Sheldrlck were
In on i t . Biieldriok waa auppoaed to have been kept away from over there esaiaetely. those were our orders} keep StielAriek out.
It was ©rougbt over bore end put on tbe dynaaoaeter and i t ran,
-41-
last tbe power output wassH right; i t didn»t ran aaootii. levertbeleee,
fbat*a where tbe developaent wort smarted. At that tiae SUeldrick got
into i t .
Pert of tbe design, vork tben ms turned owe* to the bine
mem wbieb was established dowa here la tbe southeast corner of tbe
building. Ea&ry Nador got in on tbe ebassis design. In fact, be was
over at tbe Fort Myers ijabofatory for a while on tbe cbassls design*
The engine was tben developed over bare along vith wbat we did over
tbere. He were werMog ia two direetioa® tben. The body design was
tons by Jos GaLsmb.
Tbe v-8 engine, wben we put i t on tbe dyneraeter in 1931,
bad the distributor on tbe front, aono*block easting aad single tbreat
carburetor, i t was tbe Detroit Lubricator type. I t bad two of wbat r~ we celled bam doors. That wen ojBtwa an e^ooap3J.sbaent tben to aake
tbis oerbwretor for eigbt cylinders.
In the blue rooa was tbe engine exp@ri«ntal group over in
tbe Bn«loe«riii£ Laboratory. Sbeldrick was In charge of tbat. Bale
Boeder and Elaer Sebubert wotted tbere. Carl Sennits was tben brougbt
over bare later on. Baary Bador was tbere, aad Gene fnrkas was over on
tbe otber side, working on ©bassis. Wat* a about a l l I earn recall of
®*aldriek»s grow©. Day Xettfa caae over later ©a. Start was 1933.
1»ey were working on tba ©agin© between tba dyaaaisaeter and
tbe original design, but we were atiU working over « t tbe Fort tfcars
Ufc, oa the i&mm
*®m esglae rem rough IA 1933-» It was a eoa^ination of
carburatioji, aaalfoldlag and timing, valve timing particularly as
ignition biatag too. Ia a taiga of a new engine you have to
first, a aaonally adjastad Mstrlhuter to adjust tha
to tbe requirewmts of tba engine to tba compression ratio of tbo
aagias. From tbat you calibrate as automatic mm® which follows aa
closely aa poasible the aanosl curve. He did aot have aay curve re*
qpireaeate saatlojala, ao these m^mmmm had to he estOMJshed over
here. We didn't have tbe eeuipaeitt over there to do thia. Theae curves vara finally established here, aad ve calibrated
tha distributor to i t . Sehutbs did seas wer* on the ©aashafb, the valve
tlala*, and Detroit Lubricator cans into it then to do work on the
few*tor. fhey ohanged the aixture ratio on i t . that vas a stogie
huretor for eight cylinders. H» aanifold at that tiae vas aot tha type that as- .have now, or not even the type that ve had later oa for a alasl* carburetor.
We haft the distributor curve adjusted. We tried various nwaiharrn and carburetor aa\$ee1aante* and as finally saoothad the out. As I recall, the first/ reading we got vaa sixty-five
Of course, tho dav lopnmvt work went on. Ia 1932, the first V-8 eaaa out. fhe first cars had engines that were built over at
Hptca* tbe f i m l test war* was a l l ions froa there* It wae all
eeatraliieA ®mm& tot a>ani Moratory*
It went into pro&aation* aad we s t i l l kept oa working over
tt»» m tbe ignition tyatas* ©»re waa a lot of mm to be dose to
eaootb out <2» *oagb spots* In 1933 sloag ease tbe beak holiday. Of course, tbe whole
plant oao closed torn* Bwiisfbady was seat bam* Sba next day I got a cat! fro® Mr* <k*a?aall* 1» told ae to cosaa oat* tfcat Mr* ford
to see aa,
1 come oat, aaa be aaaa't bere# 1 wsAtod for bia, ©ad be i a . Of course, be looked quite disturbed* Kc sold, tou atafce
yoM-telf bay around bare* 1*11 be aeeiiag you from tiae 1» tiae.
Where ia tbie otbar fellow wbo used to work vStb you over there?"
I said, "He's boas."
off.
We Mm wbat we bad to do oa toe dtstrtlator. fbe two of us
wotted over bore ia tba asehine ilaa> Firs t we designed an a s s ^ l y
fixture for e^soablifig the high tern Urn wiring harness for pi-oduction,
aa built i t ourselves and tamed it ©war to production at tbe Bouge
More aad HOT© people case oa back and started to eat back
iaao operation agate oat bare* One day taaa» be told met to go into
to* blue mm end. mm along aftta the hoys in m0m throv^ii. B» wanted us to to work out a awems by vhleh
tbt m^m ©am be started by either the eltttefa pedal or the aaatiU pedal to do emay «Ma the loot eaiteiu ve worked om that a
Is the middle of 1933, Sd Huff died. He was i n
Moratory mm there. About a month l a t e r Mr* Ford
« # "low long hav* yam been with the CoB$**ay newt *
I tala M a * Be s a i d , **aat*s long enough, fern take mmt there at
the Electrical Lafeoratoi? where Bd Huff wee." I as® quite elated about It was1 teaUy the turning
point as far as getting baek into eaglmeering* Iham I got ia. there,
strictly eorking for Bd Huff
t h i s ambaaeti'
and i d Buff 's
system, Model A batteries, a l l
plus Mr. Ford's pereona]
quite a flew of them* l e
. Thame eae aattt involved ia that, There was another nan
there vith Btaamsi It might have been fionevan. These two mem worked
on that radio bseaea. That was before I got into the electrical end.
It mas ateeady pretty much worked out by that tlaa* lavhamdJgr, at
ttam% i t mm ft l i t t l a d i f f H w l t to s tart the ywevtr ewaaaiaaaiaa,
because f t seemed tlmt- feftfere taaa things ware rather fUgbty, and
there w a lot of fMataaa between Saal&riafc mA Huff. Huff Just
didn't ears for BljelaricK, aad a e l f l r i e k eoalaaH show M a faea i n
the e%eatrtaal Lab at a l l -
X beard l a t e r no/ X ted to do the electrical dswlopwat
oa the V-8 -toataad of aaviag ta» K e e t s i o a l Oepirtamiit carry -out 1**
iegalonwttt* Mr* tad aniafantly .e»»©ael»d Huff to develop this
Ignition system and drive the- distributor off tbe front end. Huff
eald that i t eaaUaH be dome aad that mmm mm m mm b e a r i n g
vitb i t . If anybody knew Mr. Ford, once be bad am idea i a his mind
he « M i to see i t ttoemab* That was p l i a b l y the reason why he mat
i t owar there? to teat i t away froa. then altogether. That was hie
tmm& of putting things done. I f mm aanMa't d© i t , tbe other on®
wauIA. with a* being new, i t jest ha»®»d to cone along ay way.
i t -was ratter difficult to straighten out th is feeling that
l i s t e d iwwr isaae heta»an ttoe beys that wire i n t*a*a and the reet
of eagtnaarSiig. Of course, Sterna and Or©*® were l a there a long tine
before I got with the Coagaay* ®tey mm mmm®€ i n the eoapany and
mm aaeallamt people. As a neweoaer aaafag i n tamaa* I had to work
tyaiyiaaiid.v'is than I aaiAlaai what had to be done froa aav
on. when s tart ing a new system it-mm to be token rery easy i s order
•not to get them ruff led va, but i t worked eat a m r i g h t . %a got along
. 4 6 -
very aleoly*
a lot of tha **** ftoet *a d i d mm for the f o r i Motor
Ooajany* euch oa ta* «l«oterto«i vot* for eatoaoailae, also our toot e^tlpowt that waa aaaaavaa* at had to mm f t ourselves. Mr*
faal did aot Hat us to- bay e ^ f o a a t oa. tba outside, l i e opinion
vaa that i f we aaka i t oar******, vo Jtwr what i n t o i t tick, as he
would say. Xt vas aaftafttaly aore explosive, but. i t vas quit« am
i ^ t i e a l J r mx of tat ooajtipoast whtofe vas. In there and that mm avttt up lobar em was b u i l t rlgfct to that®,
-1» thsae two oafrtJatoro m&m aad 0**iaa« Tbey contributad, aa awful
lat to- i t beoause of t h e i r tmrn^lmm, their
Stoat' W«S voaaayfal. B**o s t i l l alia*. Gredue i s
It 4Saa«t oaa* aay dlf^wsaoe what yam «aa* Sfedasj he d id i t . If i t
vaa to ttme a piano or aake a piece of eiectrieta e^utpaat or' to
OJI a steaa eagias* i t didn't ante any dJffereae®, jtady. did i t . We
always called mm tody. Mr. Ford tew M a very elooalgr, end be
X «aaa t t too moh in eontaet with mmm at that tiae
of th is radio worJt that he was oanqriag m* a* was working ©lesely with
Mr* CaayotiUU Wmm was Just In t i e ^ , as f a r as J WIG mmmmm€* I s
had mrn^mm to do and ho d i d i t . He worked sort of iM®p©ade»tly.
1¾©¾¾ nw a variety of work that vent throygh tbere at tbat tiass. Aa a® vent along* ibis feeliag betMesa Sisaldrlck aad
aaalifelafc fait that this particular daptrtaant w supposed to be under bia. Snore vie never anybody tbat could do aaytbiog about i t aaeept Mr. fort, and be just didn't fool tbat i t should be under
Bbeldrick and, therefore be separated i t . Hevertheleaa, the fooling grow. a* aoro an iaieyontat dopartaoat geportiag directly to Mr.
Ford.
Mr* Martita and 8r» Isorease® asad to eoao l a tbara abeneipar thej- bad aoaw problems or aaaatMa*: to discuss, l a oat around a table aad talked about things- ffbeo tbey bad trouble down at tbe
production lino and aa eoald belp tbam* ae aade eoae teste for then bore sad filtered tbe saforaoMon aaoftu It aaa u&ixily eleetrioal verb, bat ooae of i t aaa ©a tha mm$» ia the aaobanioftl l i a s .
«aa ipaaiwetei* tbea aero aaier aaa*a*iak* Any iaforan* tion that as bad to «at froa dyaaaoaators MI bad to filter tbroagb aaaMrisfe, and ia aaay eases ae didn't get what ao wanted because of this aatafonlan.
On mm €,. 193¼, Mr* Ford eaae in and said that we bad dome aalta a b i t of work oa tbe oagiaeo aov aad, *I want you to take over mm mmmmm*m Shay aero under thmUgimtt, m there was another
pimch at aa* aaotbor poiat of friotioa*
«A8»
We only bud mm mm to «f«?*te tiia dynSMMters at thst tins, sad this aaa's mm was Bob Site*. He did a U of the engine
testing, and Mr. Iw* aw t» It that wbat laforaaWon be received
was tbe wmot infowattoa. Somehow or ether Mr. Ford alvayv fe l t
tbat eoae people didn't give hin tbe true iaforaaticm, so be neat
to the nam tHawelf and found out. He got firsthand information
instead of what bad been filtered through a lot of nam that possibly
bad i t distorted, t l e f t 1»»» whether aw* people did i t or not,
but be apparently bed tbat feeling.
We took over tbe ebwavwriawe* end tbat stirred up mm
mm drtaihle and amtsgoniasi. 3 was 1» the middle. A few days later
Mr. Martin, Hr. Soreasen, Mr. Wibel and Mr. Crewforci eoae in. Appar
ently Mr. Ford bad talked to them at tbe lunch table. They said,
ym'm going ta take over <ena ay»WeMrtei»* so le t ' s aake this thing up theta* I f you need «eae aore help* c a l l for tt* let*a sate*
pyaemeter Bepertaeat out of i t . We feel tbat one asm can't t-Mr, thing a l l by bftwalf* Tbere ere sin ^mmmtmm up
there. l#t*» build tba thing m*m
I felt good ajbw* tbat. At least big people were in on i t
i a did build 1 ¾ ® djwejaoaater group up a l i t t l e nore. It
waa a group, not a eeetlom. We got. none procedures started oa hw to
teat tbe ©agimee and bow to present the reports, i n otber words,
lafartial fOporta «• " E m ta the test; this is the way i t was tested*
hsrs are the taaaltai* — regardlesB of vbioh way i t looked. Scsaebo&y
hid to pick i t up trm taa*9 Md the devi^ipanb vow*, net is
8traigSitforvard infoaatt&on which is always seeded ia engineering,
is no use fooling £mybo% oa that*
X gained personal contact with Mr. Ford and Ideal. Mr. Sdsel
caae- fa , and he was very iatwested i a tba engines, the perform*
of the engines, and wasted information ease in a while. Ve had
he wanted ready for U % m be caae late the picture at that
ties. % un t i l that tiae he hadnH bean i n the picture very ansa.
The first tiae that ve got in contact with Wml waa during
the •fbHrty Years of Frogfww* shew ia Sew fork in m% It waa at
the Port of -Authority Building;. Tm Ford Motor Coapany put oa a show,
this waa a bract?, new butliiag, and the Ford Mote* Company was 19» first
to put oa a show ia i t . 3 » vendor® and outliers of Ford Motor Coa-
Mr. Ford's personal heloagiags were also
m mmmt imam mm «awo« 3a* anginal buttling was- sot
hut a l l Wm oavjaaomt was taken oat of the original Bagley Avenue Shop,
mm m& aot up Sa a replica of tbe latflttag, iuciadiitg tbs first
I the f i r s t engine wMoh he built , m i e l e g a M aa to to** that
to Sew for* for too show.
m hunt the show up and get f t wwing. 10 get g»ft be wanted ae to stay right there, X was tmm from
uetil the Mddle of January. X r e n t e r tbat w
g*@Q?fil@ brought back. Tbs show V M eioaoft ewey the
la?* Idsel Fori, ctasae tai there with Mr. Heniy ford before
M M nfonei aad looked i t Toe* was tba f i r s t Mae X ant Nr. Meet Ford. They were very pleaded at how we bed tbe show
•irrs^ed- « i had tae B&gley Av me- Shers off iii a sap&rste room right
ia tbe aid(Ua; and a r a n i the «s*ejaa> we had m the The
a l l Ford cars, the old vlnt&p* ears except one.
It wn» em old artMsr. It wee made im fcaeeai, X beliew,
i . Xt bad two big steam cylinders; ee*UU&Sag i s the
were regular wagon wheels. In otber words, jost
Hit© an old wagon and there waa the cor* It bee a
boiler en i t . mm mm mm ©my mm that wasn't * fort 0»,. but be i t down tbe*®. m Just wonted to shew a steats oar eeasarod to
oa mm 1mm ftysemttar work, Edsel ka#t cesdng i n
< M .* laMla —a waiifetws? iafor^.tioaa about the emdM. haw w* 1 wan fount* and wbat be thought should be dona, «1*
gtm. 1® inrfiaVt say, "Sow we aaaa to do tkla." Be would ssy» "It would be nice i f we could do this. It would be ale®' i f m oouJld
ebaage this to that," 5a womlA nevw be d i r e c t , » « 0 1 ? give so order. m course, tbe reason for that probably was that be- tassw tbot Ms father was doing a l l the directing up bore.
M O T I Was interested i n engine designing* sot be followed
i t very elosely. I felt that be laaar toot i f be fid soy aayfMag, be
tesw was* be s t i l l wasn't the fSaa* authority. Later m tfcis aade i t s e l f aore team a l l around, X felt at tbat tlaa tbat there were only
two vaysi e i ther be f e l t tbat be d i d n ' t bave eaougb experience, o r be
fait tbat eoaabody also was giving, orders aad be didn't want to
at took over the ^asamter% wo got aore wltb Mr. Ford. Be used to ease i n i n the
eight o'clock aad say, "Lot's go over to the chapel."
v i t a l l y interested i n these aa&oran* l a asked oaoe in a wails want we
eoald do to help t r a i n the bays over tbere, to give
We'd e i t 9 « i n the Caaaai on tbe 3a*tiaa»l side, and be would
aoaat oat yowgatoro aad say, "bow a**Va a atee bay. ®ere»a one tbat
needs a l i t t l a training! there's • U t t l a trouble at bona. I t ' s aot tiie
boy tbat*s to blaaaj i t v o tbe paronte tbat are to tOaas. We bare t o
•5®»
ata what m eaa, do to get the boy ©at of 1«« habits, tt iftMstewr habits
aa had* Mr* f o r i fisted the ohildsaa out by a m . He knew ewery one
of taaa*
Be wee thinking then of trying to help these heps In aotae
way* *• ^** talhlBg about a progwi uaoer abieb we eoala bring those
bay* 1» tbe shops, lab a boy go oat attft the aen, aad train nla by
letting M& see what was being done, and let MM do as well as he can.
He said, 1feJlf just picture yo»s@lf. You've ©one through
m apprenticeship, Saab'a what we would like to do hero to brain our
people like thai* Q%m thea am apprenticeship tiae, then try than R ^ ^M f l ^¾¾¾¾ fc ^ t!!* 3¾^¾ ^
It happened oalt* of tea that vc vent to the Chapel in the
aaauinaa* Sou never knew when he would aoae in, what he *®Ht@fi and abaaa «oa would be aaxt* l e aight aaat ia ana soy, "£at*a g© for a
trip eat to &Uaa**
We'd unp & the oar, and on the way out there you aight be
tUeeuseing different things. Qm mm we were discussing gasoline fuel
iajeebtoa* aad eow^isg eaaa out of i t* We aade fuel iajeetor puape
aaa fuel tnjeebw aaiala* at&ea oaa be piawiaaaaV but he wasted to design
im own sad sake tfaaa* We did!
Sheee coiitactu were froa day to day* e ^ t i n e s tw% three and
four tinea, a day* Yen never knew when he would come in and what he
would bare on. hit. alaa*
-53-
Ho vould talk about a progpaa. la would never specifIcally
tatt you, "to are aaaas to Ao ta4®.w loa were supposed to pick i t
up tram the conversation sat than aj» aaa d© i t . If you vest i a the
wrong diraatSea, be would l e t you taov ovaataaUy* i e would, aay,
"•Tbat Isn't whet we had i a aaa*.* You vouia .feel out again aad see
whteh way y§» vere supposed to go. feu bad to adapt yourself to Me
way of thinking, fern. bad. to toad teoMad tbe lines, i t waa awful
teri at 1 ¾ * l*glo*Jaa» aat after you got oaojetfateft witb hla you could
just about oae how hia mind worked. I do**t aeaa to aay tbat aayhody
ever kaow what be -was thinMag about. Vmm wasn't anybody
that ever kaow what he waa tbiaklng about directly.
a* 1ft* «* «ot ftfto mtmm&m heater developaoat
aaae thea, and aaa* trouble waa experienced with
ao on. That was the first tiae tbat I got in
with Mr. loaaett.
Ve hod difficulty with a heater. Bs called as and aaid that
Mr. ford hat drive® ttas* oar with a heater aad was pretty nearly petsoaad.
Ve brought the ear in bare aad we couldn't find aay leaks la it at am.
Baaattt was interested la getting hot water heaters m the ears froa a
safety staasdpeiat, «s he olaa**d.
I eoataoM Mr. ford on this leakage. I said that I was sorry
that tiiis thing happened to M a . i s aaid, *aa*t do you aaamf Ve didn't
a leaky heater on the ear.*
«5*»
I MSA, *I a*ev» aa ta* tea ««r bate* aad we eo»ia&«t find any leaks on i t . lir. Bennett gbsSa* 'that put ware pretty nearly
polsonsd i a t»® oas\w
l e sa id , aot aa*" Be tiaraed axaaaA and walked away*
1 aoatacted Mr* Bsasett #qftfa and told him tbat X bad 1%¾!?**
vatis Mr* fata* l a aaSA, "ton bad me business ta talk, to fir. f o r d . I
told ym. abat vaa wrong with that as****.* & a t was i t . we couldn't
ftaft aaytbiai wrong v i t b tat boater*
.Bennett cot into sagtiiaoring and assign, directly and indirect-
aar* taroagb e«htr aaaa]««
Oas dey we were tlttS«g 1 » Mr. Ford aboot baatora. He ©aid,
«Ibnt do yea ttHak ataa* the bot wstsr beater? ®
I so ld , "^11, I tUtak tbat there's a definite place for one.
I tbiak i t ahould bo loft aa to tbe aaatta* If tbey aaat a bot air
tbsm aa/ vaa% a a a i i f aa don't, soasbely ia going to s e n tbea oao. Sears and Rosbucli i s golag to se l l i t } liontgoaary Hard is going t o sell i t . Ve loo* that sate* If aa baa?® i t ber% we bave i t available.
i s said, "Well, i f .yarn think a bot water beater baa a place .ia a ear* i U r tgbt . Baavt soae work oa i t . w
Vs started out aatwfag sasplos from various m^Umm tbroagb
tba Purchasing Departsierit. we'd tatt tbe 'Pmbasing fiapartaemt* "Mow wa want esaplos o f boaters. It- *aa*t ear* vbere you get tbea froa.
• Send tiaaj la here for tests so the* ws mm eataaaaaa what ws want
and whet ws aaai«*
Sample© mm sent 1» froa tha Eton MtBaJaaftartag Cea»aBy»
from Idaho?- and Baa»Mk> tad thea one eaas la fast and tartan* fro®
a l & I Sehomtosy f4am Brooklyn, lew Sank* It was followed a day
later ay a visit froa a Say HetoUtt and a Mr, Alflaaa*. tony MaioHu
is an a*te*sisy hero in torn, ant $ar« Alflata is tho owner of tha B a A
Say aaaaaiaa how the taat was earning along. He Just had had th®
I told them that wa hadn't aaatfaaai the test yst, hut that
we wouM let thea know through the Pavanaslag Septrlaamb what the results
mm. they taaiaaat that their tost aa aaaaaoaai first, ttsy said,
*ea»ia raafty amd ia tho pfaaaaa of tooling for- this heater, so i f there
is a possibility that we aaaU nake the heater for the ford Motor Cosa-
MM», 'we wmild haws to intense our tealtof.*
A fav daye later Mr. laueoH called .sad Inquired shout this
aaytlaalar heater, as were: wondering how he got into it. Is wm vitally
interested, l e aatt that he had. mm ins tailed ta Me oar and had triad
it, and it worked beautifully* *Sae laataUatlaa is flue., and etarytmiag.
is Just iaek eoup,* he said.
.56.
He net these results to ton Purchasing I pariisant vtta the itlon that the Stem would be tbe best inetallatioB. It was
up to thaat to work out too prices sa l ths orrangwaciute with too stein*
Smotnreri «0 nod nothing to do with that. «he» Purchase got the iriformiiott on the Stat* tbay appar-
ently wm applying already tor the I I I laboratory fteatara. fbay
wanted to give orders to the E & A laboratory beaters. We dlda't agree
to that. We said that as far as we ware concerned the Stoa beater was
tbe beat. I f that didn't f i t In priee-vise that wee a different story.
the S a A Laboratories was next to It, and tbe Eton was i n between. We
«Saat3y dsoidad to buy the Iton .beater.
Purchasing. Bay want after our offiee to get this tiling lined up. I
W&ste that th* ©rigisel iaAtt*#t of Bennett ia th® hot. water beater waa l oaptod- by bis interest ia E « A beater in tbe bagiiming.
fa* mm beater waa adapted msA put on the oar and functioned
pretty good. It waaa*t the ultlmte i'a beaters., but i t waa a good heater, inateJ^ttoii-wiee aad pef^»aiE»«^s®.
•If*
Later on, UAmW&m cam bank to 119 through oar 6 M m »
that tbey couldn't mU enough tost water heaters. Thay wondered i f
the public didn't take to hot note? haatew. I t waa turned around
tbat tiis public ettfe't aaat my hot water heaters} they wanted hot
e*ff netttey»»
did a l i t t l e thanking. i » found, tbat the £ & A Laboratories
sold their beaters to our dealers at a aueh .higher price thaa to other
places l i t e Hoatgoaexy Ward, so they uaderaold us? therefore, oar hot
water beater didn't s e l l .
After we fata* out, we told the hummtm SepartaiBt about i t*
This thing filtered mm, hut aoa wmfa was done about it* I don't know
i f Hr* ford kaew ahout mm or aot. I didn't t e l l bis about i t . 1
thought that i f tbe iBfonoation weat trough, he'd bear about i t anyway.
Wa bad aade tbe tests and we submitted tbe results. Pure-baaing i s supposed
to tab® the part mamMm to price, but listen to engineering. So Pur*
chasing finally decided to buy tba ttoa, and that was that.
the: tollovim year mio l lo end ;,lf i-^ro e m around agate. Wa
already know tbat tbay bad uadereoM us out i a the f ie ld . X talked to
Purchasing about i t . Xt woo Charlie Carroll . Be knew about this who!*
thing. 15» tmUmM was tbat we bad to go along with tbe© regardless of
wbat they did the year before. In other words* tbey were set up. That
»58-
beys wanted to gat i a aad s a i l ttsair product* They seat l a saaple*
aad bad tbaa lastaUed ia our cara aad mt the lafesaatioa beak as to what
tiae installation was* Whoa they had that iaformticn. they want hack aad
said their beater sesasvhwa e l se , may hat «s do - aa* engtasorliig tor
itaat. That's what i t aasounted to.
later oa 1 talked to Mr. l d** l Ford about i t . Be aaid. "Yea,
I heard about this thing, bat don't yen worry about itj we'll
of i t . *
These ta* boy*, !4aiollo and alfl***» oausod m
erouble. As a aatter of fact, they also aade beras. »*y eaa* out vita
ttaa ausieal bora tha* waa ao popular at oaa tiae. Shay war* trying to
gen tbat to the Ford Motor eoapaey. Of ceuree, Mr. Ford wouldn't go
for anything l ike that, «s used to M s * the horns and put a auabar of
thea la front of the huaper and go oat- to vaa Born Bead, aad toat thea.
this oa* tiae X wasn't aloag, but Charlie Bela, who i s not
tfith us aay aore, t M the checking of tha boras. Tony Maiollo went out
with hia. They tried tho haras out there, and Tooy ashed hia what ho
thought .of hia born. €he@rli* Holm sa id , "Well, i t ' s ao good; i t doesn't
Tony told hita, "You'd better approve tMs aura or alas yarn
mm what's going to haptea to you."
Sola turned around and said, "As far as I 'a
can Jaap fa the lake."
fbare vaa pressure being afoaejfe a l l around. I t
S»oaitt©m bore a l i t t l e ume@wf«r«le, hut 1 fe l t that, "I 'm acting
i n the beat interest of tbe #©apeay. If tjie Coapany doesn't l ike it,
tbey earn ten m differently. Here's tbe testj here's the resultj
there, are tbe reooejaioiatiotts. Froa tet on i t ' s out of ay
the tests mm tm mltaamt*
lar ly teseh, benauee aaaattt wasn't too close to as. He couldn't go
aloes oaaatta* hat i t aade I t s e l f f e l t l a t e r on.
and ayself , and also the beginning of the feelings vMoh later oa
developed aad were quit© difficult to overooas. 'Zbm.t mm the heater
Saw* waa Hw begiaaing of the pressure on Bennett's side
Baaaeh's side that antes* i t se l f known l a t e r on| only i t i s auoh
aevero. aa***a was a l i t t l a aore of a dlploaat and want aloag vlth us
a l i t t l e a m laatttiattfflp.
Thia heater hua^asa vas out of tiae way. Of couroe, the.
work aad various odds aad ends kept oa going, l ike Mr. Ford's
up a* Xr*m Mountain when be wont oa vaoatiom. Mm had ©as that was
of oak. tti fai t that waa too heavy. Se vantad one mt o f white pine
t^s wanted a m«ir Isttoe. also rnted a!,!- of ^be e^pipaent that
of' stock. Saar ait. Wjd to be twelva iaab®s lona and variewi
l a 4^aw*fta»|. round, a^atca» bes^a* ©ra*% steel, stainless
and copper. I t a l l had tc "be neatly fitted Into a box. i t bad to
b« aide ready to esad up to Iron Woaataia for bis
I f that* was m ©siterl^l to be «eat
we to take ears of tbat. I womM say tbat was aa iftfllcattoB of
M s inability to enjoy vacation without saaetMiif tbat be could do
vi t l i hie hands*
§NS ae3»aav Jf^s9^W83? ^¾^^^^¾¾^^^ ¾* 11¾¾¾!¾¾!!¾!!¾ "*¾¾¾¾¾¾¾ ^ fefia j a • w8fe
never bad a vacatioa. During the tiae be was bore, wa wouldn't dare
go. wnoa be want away, be gave yon soae projsot to do and said, *&ow
1»H bo boot l a six or aft** I W U bare i t daaa by tbea* warn*t
you? lm*U have an aaowor by ttaa, wan** yout" Shot was tbat.
One day be told aa tbat we should take aore tiae out to root
aad to aa sure to get a good mart's sleep and ooas i a refreshed in
t t » aorotag.* Bs sold, "You know, you PQStm are around bore a l l day
long and work l ike ta® devil . I earn walk off the 40b any tiae, but
you *aa*t«* Be was aware of that.
'Si appreotatad evorytMag "teat was .done for ate. fie aay aot
have said so i n so aaay words* but you oaalA feel. i t . Bs bad a
bin, at least as far as we
~6*-
Tou could f e e l th» Sriw tebted fete M l Us l a t e n t i n the 40% and
ia the Siatto!**!*
I often •*£#, "I f ee l tt when De mam into the bui lding.
X don't son him, tab 1 know in©** in tint twiXiiag:.™
W3MB 1 hett oontaot wttto fete, X didn' t haw ton feeUtng that
he was ©. mm- i t p f l » feeing* You eould talk, with fete just like aay*
body elae — a* ioSfW?©. Sou Salt s t ease with hla* at leant X did*
The uncsiray e&axie pbnre about Sr* Ford waa aor* or less hia
eatlaieteea. He mm able to inspire people. X think i t waa i n both M a swaer of dealing with people n d i n M s physical presence. Xt
was a @®mimb&.m of M s pre««ee # the look in M s eye t the deteisslaed
cxpraeniQn m b i s faea* and s t i l l ho talked sof t ly . B@ could inspire
you* Be inspired & great deal of loyalty too* because of n i l tfceae
elauMetarletiea and the interest.; ha had i a th© indiv idual ,
Mr. ford was Intewtsbed in the l i t t l e asm that pushed the
brooa down at the end* He went up to k t % talked to frfa end shook hojafl*
with Maw tou can't .help but getting oattased about working for an
tmftiMmX like Omt who weogniMS yoa, knowa your nana and asks you
te an Jj»tt*lAe*X« '.»»» proai that wotting f o r a aen Hk® that.
On tba otter aide, i t night also result i n I r t e t i a n . you w i H
always f i n d t i m e inditriduala that feel Mr. ford would walk up and talk
to this, mm mm fee*® but wottlda't &xm owar ana talk to Mm* Tmm
-6¾-
would be antagonism teMs tad two jam, ffaturally Mr. Ford
go around and talk to everybody a l l at ORS tlx*. So would atop-
save you. Aa a aatter of feet, I feel ha would rather talk to a
l i t t l e aaa than to a big nan. I think he fe l t more comfortable with
hiaforbape. fbab was brought out right afbar Mr. l&sel Far! died. After
he died, 1 eaa Mr. Ford. Of course, 1 tailed to hia about i t aad told
him bow sorry X fe l t , m asM, "Shat ooaiag from you does mere for aa than i f « aaa eemlng from. Ses?ena@» or on® of thee* mmm-
he realised I really maaat. i t . Mr. Ford same i n one day eemral year* after tai
He said bo aanted three vaults brought i a the upper room next to hie
liiere I was losafcei, m said, '"'We'll fill, those vaults f e l l of
fney* H never- eaten us again l iba they did Sa tha last
and I west torn and looked a t them* Of course, they ware quite dilapi»
dated, bat he brought thea out anyway and said, "We'll f ix thea up, put
m good shape aad get the looks e)a*atta«*
ae bought 1&aa» for #8© a piece. we brought them out, fUeed up and set them in there. From aba* oa, Mr. Liebold
i a osee 1« a aatia with a padteaes ttaaar Ms aaa* deposit 1¾ i s the
vault and than lock i t aa asaia.
I n ©titer i*Qr«% they bad the ir oaa ©ash depository* ®fiy
didn' t vast «0 b» ®att#tt by a ta&iaay eaaJA* Nr. IdiaboM took car®
of the depositing.
Mr. ford blaaod tba 0 ® » of tola baafe boMday oa ta* law
lavfc *ws# & osid, ••800/ «*«• trying to got mo l a the mmm but
they ootfUtaH do it."
or oourso,. i t lo aaU4oaoiai that a l l dartsg mis boMday
th© ford Itebor §mmm had each to pny their espioyses and
earry on*
Khan bo woo rofs-rria^, to Sum. lawa* bo aaamt .Java by tha i r
oat&ntaaa> iatwestit aad e i i s^et i r ioMes X m is. vaa reforming
owe to «aU Street fiasaoe capi ta l i s ts rather tb&n the r a o i o l typo*
although X think everybody knows h i * feelings towards «rewa was ojiiltt
aevare* lo n d e aoae rwsrJks oaee i n a ^blle* Bo said, "tfefortamtoly
us have the Jews aroood, but vo have to have th@m«*
& tout aa onoe, Tou tow, a, Jaw i s en Sadtviiual that kleka
you town I n ffee gutter, hut yoa*w* sot to have Be keeps the white
s a aolafu"
Be never ay loaaaa taat* that waa Just food for thought. He wottM « * § a reaerk, Site taat J w t -out of a blue sky. and leave you to
put your own iat@ar$t®t&tl« oa it»
-6V
Mr. Ford mm interested iu the coaditlorte ever lm
l e discussed that with ®s whoa 1 returned from ay trip. Be
to k m hov I f«lt about mmm aaa* that t bat f a n
<y froa i t ao 2aa*> X t o M him exactly mm% 1
i , that X f e l t a. tease aboila* over there.
Bb said, "Maybe this f e l l w Hitler will ao sway with the
t r a M * wmmm mm mam* but 1 M that babi»t his* fee Jews are
faabfag hia aa** mm%*m aba* ba aatt. I mm be aaast the Java i
a raos rathssr than tbe ©s it&ligrtie grts© la Qeiaaay that aaa
! •» aattt 2 ^ be mm mmm of Hitler's racial
f a t be s t i l l bad the feeling that eattaa those mmm.
th® Java s u a b l e ten* i W . . » an«r atbaapted to a ^ a i a that. A l l
yen eeuM ear aaa that K t l a r was prob&biy put out by, fern saight c a l l
the big J e w to class bene® aa the l i t t l e
big eos*. 10» s ight toko i t that *ay.
the €SJte. I thittk Hitler was Jus* a faaai&e «ho -worked hlasslf iato
^aai was aooietod by a mmm prooowo group over there. I don't
mm mm had aaytfeftnt to do vrtth i t , fesakly. I a*)ajaaaai that
opinion to Mr. ford , but he ages* t say ansa about i t .
ctfy® @ aero ipalifrfwig thro^lb "fee b'ff Mfagt doaa bera. 2
believe tb ia aaa a U t U a l a t e r aa. It just ooaaa to- ay atad aoa. I
rmmb&s- whom .Draw Bwsoa ( M t o p d Mm to eitber a foot mm or
a bioyola rase. 1 tMak i t m a foot rue© oa loodwara Awaaue*
2 was weOMag aloag with Mr. ford. He mas ta iMag about
the goiwrtwmt oosdi t io» sad ao forth. X bad plaaa forgotten that
tide Brow Peereoa bail noted M s for ttta cballange, t followed Srew
mmmm*B "imsMmm aad Ma artielec la tt» paper. X said, "Watt*
aaata ae a t a M iaaa) a im mm. mm Uht saw taaaaaa** Mr* ford
tamed fissowi* aad. be looJiii at ae. Aarfe at taatt anaaat i t aaat
tteoa*fe aa l i f e a &*atw Wmmmt^mm I aaata W afcua* -©sera vaa
ae i l l fooling aftert«ia?dii* aa p iwaay thong* 1 aaa a data fool*
Mr. Ford was #Hte bitter against Boosevelt. ISaat was
aotiiseoble ta tho beginning* ae was bitter against loeoevelt because
of Ms Sew Bool and the WUU & was very Utter about Geserai a»gb
JohruiOi^, tha Stft aM& H l i t ^ *
l a said assay tSaas tbat tbe Governosnt eoald not control
primte e«toa^is« because i t would do away vtab ooa^ftitioa. He said,
"Wa auat bswe oo^etitton*5- 8s aaa « flea believer in ttat« feat
was shown in bis owaeedai®* a l l tha sa«" aroasid the slant.
Saaa aaaa* tba ii»ai3y§iit aaoalft* be was always interested la
setting, aa oaa aaa a aaaat the other* toaiMaee i t waaa*t bandied
gaits. r4#t> aa to in bunging two aaa'a iioads 'teajrtaar and
a^iag them tore at aaea other, bat ta* iaaa beMat i t was-, I feells***
to auiM aa eoapstitiosi oataaaa tisaaa two, and aoiaetfring good would
coae out of It* 1$« lawn side of tbe individuals vould suffer through
that.
For aeaayJ*, the development of the distributor vas definitely
a slap towards Sheldrick and luff when he gave mis distributor develop-
aent to ae. Of course, as ve did i t , naturally 8'neldrlck and Buff
didn't have mush love for ae.
fhis vas Just one part of putting m In eoapetition with them
ia a sense that between the tea of ue we would work ©at better ideas
for his oaa purposes, an idea oeme out of i t a l l right, but i t did
ruin personal relationships* 1 would say teat was true of aaay arrange*
aents in this Ooapany.
Mr. Ford didn't discuss with m the philosophical basis of
why eoapetition was good or where i t ease froa. 1® Just aaid, "Coa*
petition auat be existent to achieve @m^Mos»n So f e l t i t was in
herent i a huasn beings.
Be never eanreaaed the idea that war wm® a natural result of
eoapetition. His feeling towards war was that i t waa stirred up by
soae people to gain an end, to gain by slaughtering.
Mis feelings vere that aost of the wars were started by England,
directly or iodtraetly. Be aaid, %aoaovar you find a war or soae strife
in the world., you always find England behind i t . " He fe l t that waa part
of Kngland'a iaperlal polioy, tbe "divide and eon^er*' type of proposition.
Of a l l the people in the world, ae a race, he had tbe highest
-67-
for mm Oaaaae. Be aia**aaj& the*. Si'w tMs l a an odd
thing *vr at to aa/* *** • * » t* t t yoa Just ao. ho said i t to
aa. Be said, "Tlse Qmmm e«* San*ettiaae» They art good .«
woifcire. fhey are {aattfat im tfeatv w&jfc. A lo t of thaa mm
Yoa earn tfust titan,* That wae M s deling oa. that.
Mr. Ford felt the colored people ware opprssaed. l a fe l t
they shoaM he helped tad educated. Xt waa part of hie i d l i n g for
that led M s to the various tMaae he did do aroaod here for
After m heater jab* Mr. Edsel .Ford need to eoae i a
Se wa» ejfcttt cr;i U.cal. i t wanted a quiet Job and
a o@«r#e# l a those dots we- did not 1mm aay
.<in,i« eould be ehaofcsd. Ms brewtifet tbat to hia attention, ana he aaid.
" M l , eea yoa tbat a f A m where ths* «aa be doj»t B
1¾ seaticmed the vartawajtty of Michigan ao be ^couragsd m
to vow* vi ta tba tfciversliy of Hie****** We than established a eon*
s e r i a l ©nt there to fir. OtJfar, and bo vetiU test thaa for vs. We
eomlA m yStfct then* vfttfe it,, or we would mm the results ia and have
Or, Qtltajr aat at a oejaaalMai basis, fat rslatiom la*esean us and fir.
«69»
Qetgar aad the llilvafalty o f Michigsm was
we got a l e t o f .good lufcamtioa from thea. fhay beaded
aa la ovary way thay joseibly could, i t proved the
of the f«i|fcf8iM*4,S#> right aloag as f a r as we qqnl*!
difficult %e owrcoas without a
had to heme that i a mind.
Mr. Ideal l o r d aaa very critical ead was vary sincere about
she noise lewis ia autoaobJUyea. Se was also
as bo tabs ears o f f of the atasmaliaa .Use at will, bring
oat here, tear thea domi i f we limed, look thea over and shew thea to
to nark over hero whore the
That used to he a l i t t l e #3a?arSasatil garage., l e had
f raot ioa l ly every aeon* aa absuever he d i d at sea what aa had that had eons off the production Mas. l e
right baek to the production line aad .saw to i t that th* thing a
Me w » naming a test p rogr« baa i a addities to our
ais was p r i o r to aba test aaaafc*
He didn't develop amy aeoustieal aaterials. we deweloyed
the application, of aataalan: .aooustioal matertala aad where to .nut i t
m mm
taste, i t
m tbe fire
pn& QSX tbe tft^f 1^ er
Of tbe noise lavet.
a <lP©st,l©3& af isel&tiag
outside of the fire anil.
to opplleetioa oa tae lasido raShes* then en th® outside
to i f tb*y
the iMsos «f the fire vail
Hi were 1»
Soat all.
the
accslarator rot or tbe
itojaf througb a
©as mm be aat'V4tal3y
effect on tba la
in.
tbrottle rod. a* thea bed thet
iaeh i n Ahaavatr mm a etNO0at natal . V n t i n 4>Va
•bout five-eighths of en
to th«
strueted thet It vould
quite critical
through this rod.
radiate a high
Io>t 'SPSo® 1¾¾¾¾11¾¾ 3¾¾¾¾ Oa
Xlttls
m t particular part had a? aaay
without »seh thought or any realisation that i t might oause trouble.
You didn't Isaow, because there was so p?@e«d®at tbat you could go by*
fbare mm no previous ean?eri@mce tbat you could go by.
aaaal ford aakad m to do way with that noise level but
quick! We desipsii « rubber «eparatar of a cross section, aad of a
suitable duraraater bardaaafi aad aeaan&aa tbia rod, put this insula
tor in aataaaa* aad i t a a gone, i t we* qaita deiigbted with that, and
we p i t i t i n production as uuiclOy as ae could. As a matter of fact,
ve mm node ranlaaaaaata later on, ao that tbe ears already out without
i t could be changed very six-ply. Be was very such interested i a that.
I t i s true tbat Story Ford tmw® quite jealous of anyone
that established a close contact with Bdael. I know of one instance
of that in tbe acouatlcal treatments of tbe aatoaoaUa. Ve bad started
a co-operative program at tbe University of Michigan and bad gotten
soae instnHieatet loa to aake our own »oasureaoats on the road. While
at tha vttaasaiay of »©Mem, they weaM carry oa with laboratory i a -
strvaaonte for wMeh ve did not have trie f ac i l i t i e s .
l a pacbased mm .sound Meters and eu sOysera. 1 h&ipsnea' to
look through soa® reports on tiie tapes tbat they ran oa tbe sound re*
cording, when Hr. Ford coat i n . B i said, "What do you aava beref"
I said, "It 's the wfaipamt for sound recording in a ear."
ife said, "Well, bow do you aake these sound recordings?n
I showed M a the i n s t r u c t s we used* Is said, "Where did
-71-
y w get tbe lastrmmmstf*
1 said, > • bought i t . I t ' s « sound aster ."
Be said, "Well, how teg has thing beam going on?"
1 said, *f©r salts a while. I t are trying to asks tbe ear
quietes- and mm what we tew to do to d© i t . "
Be said, "Who ie interested i n bbUf*
I said, "Mr. Edsel Ford le lateta****, and we are working
eloeely with tabs."
Mr. Ford said, "Well, as far as I'm ©©aeeraed, you earn take
I f i t was an order, 1 didn't do i t . W® more or less sboved
a lack of interest to Steel 's sapivaeli to the nrohlem* mm Bdjsel had an ideal or idea that he wanted t o go through,
he would push his argaaats t© a certain extent, i n some oaeee, he
i i v M s m f throagh, and i n other mm®, i t Just died out. You wouldn't hear the reason why i t died out or eaything. I t Just died a natural, death.
I t was afferent i n later years that Sdeel developed a synical bitterness and resignation toward everything i a relation to the €eapsay,
sotiood mast. & seemed to have the attitude, "Oh, what's the use? I ' l l go alomg with it.*
tta*** the way I took i t . He wm% likely fel t what he was
doing was of so use so he night as well get along and sake the beet of
•78-
i t until th* tiae cam when h® could change things.
1 wondered eftea hov oloso Mr. Ford and Sdsel really vara.
From vhat va could observe around her®, vhaa thay vara together and vhen they talked to each other, i t seemed to he close. When thay
vara alttiag off to th* -ooraer son* place, ve oould see the expression oa Edael'e face aad tho expression on Benry Ford* a faee, aad w* wondered eftea Just hov close they vara.
X have seen thea aaay tlaee when they vara sitting down oa. a bench placed along outsit* the blue rooa over there. She too of thea sat together oa this bench for hoars at a tiae. Am X aay. yon could tell the nature of the conversation by observing their facial expressions. You oould never see that their conversation* were actually heated. You
wouldn't go up close to i t , of course, lit would just look froa a distance, aad you would see tbe expression oa bis face aad oa BSael's faee.
Many tlaaa X woaiored how close tbey really were aad whether they were father aad son in sp i r i t .
Edsel always had a worried expression aad a painful expression. Mr. ford's expression was stera. Xt aeeaed that Mr. Ford was Baying,
"It*s going to be this way." &wov*r, I never heard thea talk that way
with other Individuals around. Mr. Ford and Sdsel did not Joke auoh with each other er tease
each other, at tlaaa that l a t t i s f t i e together the** wasn't aay Joking going on.
-13-
I mm the wiad taaasX was buil t between »3© aad »37
under tba supervision of lorry analArlea* M i la tbe larger one.
They oat a l i t t l e one poviommly f o r aeronautical verb over at tiie
airport. I t vaa a thirty - s ix lacb t r aw l , a tubular job.
1 believe they did a l i t t l e radiator work in tbat. 1 wasn't i a oa that then. 1 thtak Sale loader d i d soae work oa tbat
along wilts A l Seper and larry tetter vho vaa over there. Harry
Richer woo an aeronautical eKgimer. l a d i d sons sarorjaiitical work
for Mr. Bdsel too. We'll coae to that later oa on this flying wing,
the bat-wing job.
In the l a t ter part of 1936, this wind tuaael was bui l t , but
no rafriger&tioii vae icatailed. Aorefore , tbe tatforature eoald aot
be controlled below vbat i t was outside, which l a the swaaer was liable
to go up to aisety aad alsety^fiv©* You could newer establish a def*
tidta figure of what tits thoraal effleloacy of a radiator was, because
the taanaratara would change.
Mr. Ford csaw i n one day and said, "I wast you to tabs over
the wind tunnel. Keep absldricfc away froa there!"
I said, "I would l i k e to wary auch, but Vm a fra id 1 cna't
do aucb with i t the way I t ia now. We don 't bare refrigeration and we
can't control tsaaaaataxa i a ta»». B
Wm said, "Well, you p i * i t 1» right easy.*
We started getting tnformtioa as to what wo needed, bow aucb
- 7 ¾ -
nt would used to l a s t s l l the cooling coils, ths
and what equipaant we wouM need. We got the inforraatioa
t eM lixsa shout It. m wanted the apprcxisKSte price oa i t , what i t wonM cost to do i t aad tba length of t iae i t would take to
natural^ ve figured the soot with am aow eejaipaeat} eoa>
and coat hod to he sew anyway. Warn be saw the figure of
the coapressor, he said, "You doa't need that. Cheek oa the
that 's out at Highland Park. 'Share a big one out there. Cheek
see i f you oaa use that."
Of courae, tfeta lews had f i l t e r e d right oa dowa threap body that we were going to put cooling in tbere. One day Mr. Crawford
eaaa i n . So wanted to know what we were gains to do i n cooling
there.. X said, *va*se) going to do Just what the word iwpliee, put
eooliug in tbe wind l a a s i aad be aM» to asatval le said, " W i , that's going to eost a lo t of
X said, "wall, we're not sure yet wbat i t eosta."
A day l a t e r Mr. Edsel called ae and said, "what are you doing
with this ©©©ling out thwef X w t o f s t t a i you. went to put coollag ia the wind Tunnel B u i i n i ^ , "
X said, "So, Mr. ford, i t i s not the wiad tmwml G i l d i n g , i t
is the wind tunnel i t se l f ."
Be said, ''Well, John Crawford told. m you wanted to
«75«
ate the whole autlalag mm there."
1 aaid. "Bo. i t was not asanb that way. User® aust he a
alaaaaeretoaalBf. suae plane. A i l we Med is to refrigerate the
tunnel proper to control the teapereture within the tunnel, we don't
eare what outride tsaferateire we have*1*
ie said, '"wall* that's altogether different. I ' l l he seeing
you."
the aaat day he stopped by and got further inf©raatioa. Is
said, "Soabody'e aixsd up oa this, this is all right."
Ve checked ©a this big eoavaaaaor out at Highland Park, and
it was available* aatatally ** cheeked on the price of i t . Froa the
Aceownting Itepartaeat at the Soug* a g s l i ecet of #9,000 for this
compressor. 59» aew ecapreseors would have eost us $21,000,
I presented the figures to Mr. ford, lis aaid, "Why scoebody's
crasy on this thing, that eoanrasaor is go old it's off the books. You
ebeok oa the 'date i t was bought. I ' l l bet you'll find it's off the
books.'* I did, and sure enough it was off the books.
Be had a faatattlc memm to re»§«b«r that single piece of
®t«i|wattb. Yet there was no mm trying *o fool hla. He'd get it anyway.
• Ve ohecked and found it was off the book®. When 1 told hla
that, of course, be waa delighted, lie said, "You bring that in right
away." Ve oalled BUI lailaage down at the Bouge. Be was very, very
co-operative and brought it in.
-76-
was a anaotia* about set-ting i t up. We would
to dig a well down i a too floor* I t bad this great big flywheel
feet to aaaaate** We mode the drawings on i t i a
vith the Powr and GmmmmWm Sepsrtnsat at the Souge
aadsr Mr* Isasom, sad tOmm i t to Mr* Ford with the f ly*
i n the well. It said, *I% wo f » aot going to dig a hole
la the grousd> Set it up* Bring it up oa a pedestal so we eaa see
m could go Just so high* I t nearly hi t
[. 1 guess we were only about throe or
froa these avaasbssaa. 1 was afraid i f the halt e w l e t go i t would
the heaas and. tear the building down, that belt weighs
tons. fevertheiasB, i t had to be dons.
m set i t up that way, brought i t i a and worked with fork
lee Machine Ceapaay to furnish the refrigeratioa coils «~ tha evap-and the xeaalwara and .al l of that — to sake tha in*
ai aunerviae the installation* Our own persomaal did
the tastattJsc* m felt, sines Y«k ms twmmMm ths soi ls , thay
should be hold responslbla for the rest of the installation. Sine©
it i s an aaana&aaas iitstallatiua, i t i s extreasly daagoroas. York
the iastallatfoa, and we get i t going within three laontfcs.
we also designed aad built a new oontrol table for it with
i t more flexible so we eould get the desired
mffm
I t turned out that wa could get twenty degrees below aero
wttb a ate*/***** borsofoww- »..f««v input. tt» fjmawllaT aotor
borsepower vaa increased f*e* 250 to -Voo horsaoowar, because tbe
inst&ll&ticai of tfe© coding coils was iatroitioing as additional a i r
friction factor wfatfb w« bad. to mmmm agaio by pooping i n aore
power. &m propeller was ebaaged ffea* a two Made to a three blade.
lb© wiaft taaaal woo used to sates tests oa pacing nysteas.
In those days we had considerable trouble i n the field with radiators
boillrig mm aad ovorboatiag,. aWa*, was tat to the cms true tion of
the eagiae and radiators.
On the V-8 eagiaa you aa* passing your exhaust gaees through
Hie water jacket aad out. You are transferrin exhaust boat into Wm
water Jacket. ®ts* boat boo to be raaovod by tbe radiator, i t results
i a a higher cost of the resistor. 1%»» a beautiful condition i a the
winter because you get a quick waranp, but i n tbe saaaar you pay for
i t ia s*»tt©»*l *aa4«a*r aa*****?*
@f*n though you put l a extra copper, you s t i l l .ran the chance
of overheating, Tba purpoas of this wind tiamal was. to ietorxia* what
the ©oUag point of our ayaaaa was or, i n other words, what a i r taaper-
ature could wa atawft before wo ballad with f u l l power input. He as*
teblishad wbat wo W f cam, and what we called thaa, am sir-to-lsail
Mr. Ford p n up the mmem>*m0» mmtm et *M» Wm,
out with dtffteO.tr* «o never bad a titemc-eyphon system m tne
ei#.t-^/lii^r Job. «§ hud what «0 used to eell. n little peddle
wheel i n the cylinder hasd. I t w aore of aa agitator toea anything also .
It hod two disadvantage, oae was that yon didn't get a
dteeet ftsspiig action. Bmm^, i f yon did have a direot p»aeping
action, VIM would tnll* i m & degression i n the cylinder block, thereby
louertsg the filing point. 1¾© idea wan. to build up a pressure i n the
oylinder hloek and thereby raise the boiling point.
eba od froa tiss eyliaiar bead to tbe Mook. you were foralag your
water lata lias block end censing a certain restriction through tbe blook,
prefcrsS>ly at the outlet of tbe «yti»isr bead, ao that you would build
up ft pressure within the block, ttorefore, you raised your boiling point.
That it what waa al«wrt»ly IIMIO to lapme coMitions. that was done
ia 193? - fba paapa ware sowed froa the beads iato the block aad a larger
pnap snatallad to create a seiamej.
Of course, you can go the other way and pae? too aueh water
tinongb 14*0»* whits then w m M M up on toy o f the radiator aad
flow over. Finally your water 2e*el goes down, and year boiling point
gotta down viva the t§mmw of water, there ia a asdlias aaetttaa* *•
ties eaaat&ty of water tlirough the cylinder bloek, tba radiator capacity,
-TO*
the air b©Hiag teapersture aad tbe power iaput*
to ae ©©soldered.
M aeeeptad irtaaiart asd asaastaaat eeatttiea is from aa
eight to -tea degree drop through the radiator in t e a a s r a t m . If tbe top of the radiator oat of the eagtae at £00
llaaly to got it aaa aad back late, the eagiae at
190 degrees aad asa* aa too do#eo»s through tbe
Before as atta't imm mm test facilities to f i a d the reason for
aa the radiators ia the wiod
the hoabere for mm for a i r veiooitiae as
A beater » only as good as tbe tightness of the body. I t aaa uite
valuable l a that.
aa also did friction developiant work, or ^terMaatioo of
Mats** bataeea th® emgUta sad tbo roar vaaai. aa* aba ef»©ieeoy of
plant as a whole. You are putting ia so aaafe powor at the
I you*re taking out so aueh at ths roar wheels. You
your efficiency whfca i s ooapilod by aaay faeters all tha way
the l i n e . WO safer hero to ths fr ietiom of the eagiae. ®e*e i s
also the frietion of ths treasaissiom, ths frictioa of the rear axle,
tha frlc tioa of the rear axle beartags aad the rear vocal friction
to the ground, the mttter mction. f eu oaa determine your input
versus your output and get your effieiency.
Mr. Bdael. ford nas very, vary intarosted i a styling. He
attempted to carry aoao of his style ideas into tha tuaaal. He asked
vaxied us to aaa sura the a i r m e t i e r of a * o # of a certain s t y l e .
Of eeurae, I t t«esa*t take anon change la a body to in
crease the air friction, but i t takes an awful lot to get the air
fraottw deaa. » » » hart t o get. a e r o are flat potato.
in tba visa tunnel. H i twde a fraae tbftea van etraeaHaan. Us sot
the oar upas this fseaa aad then svapoaisd the fraae from the ceiling
fiPISP *3La5"" -CJO fcaa Ji ¢¢8¾¾^^* ¾¾ aaa*o> ^¾¾¾¾¾¾'1''''¾¾!¾¾ * WH8& a ft o ¾¾? ¾¾¾¾ ^NBSF ^ fcfciS«€Jjt
HPSNS t L' a ( ^ ^ ^¾^1¾¾^¾ 0¾¾¾^ ^MStt3t ^ • 5!¾¾¾¾ Ja**>2P Po%a$ aaa @ @St Bfe-fc <avfe p $saVs> alM&
0!¾¾¾ i GKJCa RSMSJ ^ 0¾¾ ¾ ^^ 5saa i5t8 ||jJR ' ¾¾ "Sfc 80 fc2fta~ ¾¾¾^ Sa MS aaaVSKXEa ^ (¾¾
proaaure applied oa tlai * aw rood la pounds. Of mmm, you aaa
calculate that la aaay different anglea. Yea have a square foot area
of the car — let ue aa - a silhouette area. That, of course, doesn't
aaam a thing, heoause you 6am* t have a flat section pushing oa thia
flat: silhouette air. You have angtos, ourvoa aad mmmm things.
All va oould do vaa take a particular body- m oar style aad aay thia
•at.
style gives us so snob wind
82i hear* at twanty-five stiles au
a ouree nateS,q waalft. 'Haws result is the psrsbolie
a i r resistance ateest goes up igte saueree of t h
We and then a
a M a i A f l a a oavasa
We could ran a earva oa that. then we»d
plat
end l e .one off the biggest
. We would
la . It
in a
Bdael mmmm tfcie body sxyie
to ae atttsad of ths air fb*atta» oa «11 At f i r s t ao
, say, a clay
a cla§r g r U l . Ha knew ths sbia Miction a* «jay is
polished piaoo of aattil* onee wo get down to fSas
with aotallie paper or tin foil,
ttaaaat* You eonM newer gat
was still another factor. It was quite difficult.
Our fSaatana aad iMwlts i® wind tsnaeJ
In the strung of the ear. It was applied,
tf tmrwmmmif WMW etyjktet and the pmstift&i 'MA O&W tWO
different ideas* Mr. Bdsel vas v**y a&tori&l la
;.cx«aoy. as was mm lageaia
aaa ia eisarge «4 tbat tfae> ami Joe Oalaiflb. Xt
lob Gregory- Joe Galessb ma a little oldsr aad
little angle s t icking out oa tbe aide cost you oae aad a half power at seventy miles aa bow, ant the equivalent in fuel.
joe mmm m» ottM in with tba styling. He mm sort of
am advisor for Gregory, but Cfcegory carried tbe aaje? responsibility. It aad Mr. Edsel Ford were very close. Edsel aaa ia till of the tia» looking
Ford had very littl© interest i a etyiiag. Be waa
.of m engineer. WSmS, wm a atyllet. Mr. Beary Ford aade eeaaeats oaoe in a while, but sot too strenuously.
In about »36 or ' 3 7 , you f ind ths Lincoln Zephyr earning in
and the cabriolet. I don't know wtattar these mm SaeaV
applied by Otagojy ©r whether tbey wow ife^tty'a ideas mi
by Steel. X don't know Just who suggested wiiai to whoa. Xt
aa 12» ooabination of the two. Froa wbat X kaow of Mr. Sdsel ford, X
thlak he bad aa awful lot to do with it, Let's aay Bob Oregory probably
poligj&ed those SHaao up. . 13¾¾?" were very close.
tQW work doaa to ads^t t> eabriols i to eithar * tisfeury
or o Ford eliooolo was cul$ii»&tod. OJ^MOOO the Sales Beaarvasat end
laglaeariag to yawls*) l&m^tsz^i&ilit:? as aunh so possible,
ttay awloped e, chassis ana tmxi put any holy on that, faey called
e ^ r l o l e t had heem: so successful itftowwlee that tbey « « » 1 to aake
en* of either a Ford o r m. Wmemm I ecmlda't say what haa*
feast to timt mm uttJawMr* I do**t know wfey i t aaa discarded.
Stay fjfoaaMgr Salt i t vaa a**»jaaj*a- to- aatt the amber of aodels doom
as smeh aa aaaalftl* production-vise oogiaooriag voraua stylists.
1 » -did a lo t of work, on defxmtlag atadsbioldo aad noises
caused Uy a t f velocity o m the oo%* Tbat aaa <ilffieult t a to *a»
earns* the a i r watoattr be twees the 00% aad tbe wlad taaael wall was
au@a Matter 13a» what you ham 02 the mad. You are taking a aauy
and puttie i t H* a eoaftnod «#00«. mm wmmmm mmm astaaaa that
the velfxiity would «0 ap. I f y o u ' i aaa oevaa^r allaa aa how i a the
vlad waaaal* tbat would aot aaaa that you had seventy a U e s aa hour an
the » 1 * of the holy, 9mm vs*sa*e/ waa aoob higher, i t waa difficult
to 4®tersil»e at what actual t N * gpwt H » noises would ievaloo.
bring the ear back l a was wtaft. tuaael, aaybe at that speed the v*loc±ty
«8U
It wm M i R t e to ths public sat mm mmQmm to our •rlwapa to tafco thase mm out on the }?ublic highway# i t happened that one of oar people aaa Jmm m mmMm% out oa Van lam Road.
A:i?i^»t,iy *>• a*** hoard afeast ft* too toy no ©erne in. Tb&t
ahem loirsatw* »ji* le o«M # *ie should tae a teat track around
tha airport. i r 1 « wanted us ta think about i t , develop i t aai keep hi»
iafOiaa& of what aa plaaaed to do.
Jfpsismtly he baft mm talked to Bay 3®hli»ser shoot i t . .Bay i^^lfjgyy «as sitting right m, top of u© to .get this jajag developed hut not to disturb the airport m i t could s t m he was* for airplanes* X oasttat that was a personal laterest on his side.
nevertheless m started faking layouts of the track, what i t shauM 1®©¼ lite and Bhmtim. Whet facilities we should haw. i t wasn't
we vere going through the expense of building a track, we Bight as
well nake a good track so we wold hate various fac i l i t i es . - Ve were
thinking oainly of acoustical work so we wouldn't haws to go out on
tba road to do i t . I t i s awfully difficult.
I f you run an acoustical test, you have your asters in the
hack. M l of a sudden you haw to slow down heeause there i s a truck
in front of you or another oar caaes whizzing by, and you get a peak
in the reading.. That was our pot, to be sure we got a stretch of the
track that was absolutely saooth and straight in order to get good
readings wi^ conpare these reedings.
fhey had a layout aade. Hoffman who was with aa a l l of the
tiae, sort of ay right-hand item, nade the drawings oa it. We had a
high-speed track. Chi tbe outside of the Mgh-spee<I track, we had the
various composition tracks aueh aa bricks and eobbleetone and Belgian
block, and then thia wobble road we bate. Ve also thought we should
have a aud pit and a water p i t . Ve also thought we should hare a
skid section to cheek t i re friction on wet roads and on dry roads.
Ve submitted these drawings. Mr. fiahllnger didn't quit©
agree with i t , laseauso it would .slightly lapalr tbe aetivitiea of tba
airport. Regardless of what Mr. Ford thought, it waa all right with
th© e»#pti©n of too water pit. « 0 had i t arranged ao we eould run
water into the water pit fro® tbe main line. Vhen we were through
vita i t , or i f we wanted to ehsage the level, ve'd Just run that water
«»86*
to «b» mam.- Ho 4ttam*t mm «£** mm* BO said, H p * * , mot
to vooto that eaouiat. of It was floored out to require 3?*,00C
0mmm o f n&tor to f i l l i t 19 to am e i g i ^ a - i ^ b . l e v e l .
So tottd MO to pit a t§am ai^teippfianii .-of that oaaaaitsf*
Maea & it.
ft* .lid tMt. He pot tit© « M * uatetgwii i*. X think l t»s
torn feet wisrgraym a*tfe a noM for 0» slectrie puop so you earn p i
mm amd pit, of oooroo, «00. aJoma** Xt mm $m% a
Of- hmimz aatar Mm go to i t and earn***, i t «
l e v e l |psa vaMMU Tbat vas bttft.% m*. l o l tasre waa
tiott aatoaam Mr. .fattUNgNr and owostooo. H« sort 1
Ea^ae^rlsg m Wm lavajo* mf.eU was s t i l l tader Mr.
aa»MMit^ ta tste over as auea as m s f f l s ,
H o a * liigiaoeriag m% fato the f l s t a i after tho original
mm l a i d oat. Tm ara%isgs mm s t i l l
or ig ina l %gf|gi was
eafraamm mm 1mm* mm$ "So**** mmr get it. car to
Btsad up t o g# @ w that.**
i mm, *mi> l e v a p w i t . " % mm i
that 1 fai t « l i t t l e leery about.
I esM, •!«» m% m mm wtfae * Ford oar ana put i t
that treok tweirfcy-f i w mm, mmt tmm « fOmrtmm% (vith the knee
action they had thee) and it*!! oollspse the first few tiaee.* we
tried i t out, end i t actually bflg§eHiA that way,. Ths ina* gats**
Of course, Mr. Pord d idn ' t object to building i t . Be just
mM i t was two rough. Be didn't tttfg* wo ooaM subject a car t©
Mm- that . flttt, m9m doing, that now, or at least
1 bod i M t b i ^ : to do with i t . at ran th®
wehbla track for tweaty-five tripa at the rata of twenty-fiva ailea
At a lower speed i t wmM. aateb e l ^ e l y ths
a? tbe m^m$ mA i t was dangerous. You would get a
aad i t would throw tat oa* off the hasps, but
was all 'right. tm*, -of oouro®, vvatt laaa to- be to the sat****! frequency of the firings and the
the test track waa bant* but very painfully.
9m l i t t l e grain In 1te center of the mm acf«*anl >4aB* I i M ^a t s f t t@ m s M i M i l
i t out of steal, asking i t so we eould change the grade at w i n
-68»
fiat to mm dogree. xt *ai
r a i l s la the grouai aad have tha oowfeer oartSaat the big!
OB sMdos, All you wouM do woo ahm® tbe ootoldo porfcioas la,
would give pa* a sleeper grade* aa* ..lot f t out to gftat you a
Ida. You eouM adjust i t iowa t o a
that, out they didn't wast to go ta tka
m ouggooM «bat aafiaas thay bant tbe b i l l aaa to Mr* Jaass who wan around here Ham, but e^pa^atly it
that they wouM build it v» aim dirt. X doaH
la the ehsaper of tie* two* Ma ia ftaad*
At ens taae there aaa t a l k of wsttiau a a i i t oa the
aide of the teat taaatj i a other words* ooae up oa tha wast side
up the M i l . , turn arouad, haw a few wa*y spots oa was of
built f o r that*
l b s test trask was built paiafully sad put late
pored al l ^<m§ l a th® dSYelojaaab of tttfs by i
• Xt latplraft oaaafaaiaaila proasara. f roa outside to gat
ab could see the uador%iag^ reaction sad fael i t .
I t
4».
eedures wMeh, of course* wo had to devise ourselves. ¥e were aot
peraitteA to eotttaet any of our ooafatltaxa whether tbat b© through
the g H or direct contacts through per&omel from our eonpetitors,
which 1 bought was not *pit© right or fair, After all , X fe l t i f
wo wore 'Kith thio Company •»& loyal to this Conpaay, that didn't aeon
that we .had to divulge «ay of our ideoo to then, neither would they
to at* fo change ideas aatlaaarla&wiaa and fool the other fellow
out aa to what he's doing for overcoming a trouble of that sort, I
think that's perfectly a l l right,
Ve didn't fey to do that unofficially bare. I was told
once by Mr. Ford whom be aanroanhaa m about tbe SAS — 1 asked bin
i f I could Join tbe Sft% and tbat X was asied several tiaas about
I t — "X wouldn't i f X were you* MX these fellows do ia oaebaage
t teir idoaa down there and oacbang© tbe inforaation they have."
S@. woo. 'Opposed to iflaat* Of course,, we oouM never ©on*
tact anybody froa our eos^etitors. tbat was absolutely against tbe
low.
At any rate, we devised the test procedures aad dOriaod
foras for various tests and organiied tiie integral program* Our f i r s t
program consisted of broke stops and brake tests, because wo wore also
botborod with brake trouble. That was the area of mechanical versus
hydraulic brakes.
Mr. ford shoved a great deal of ralaataaea to ourronder
.90-
m aaaaa* out mm kta* of In
on mm ear of balf-asd^iwilf.
I ttoiak be felt tat tayftrouHe brakes aero aore or loss
by GsaeraO, Koterit Basto patents* X gnats he didn't
to bare say f a r t of i t . Be s t i l l tm a Eaetoaleal brake aaa
% solid iwd going from the pressure point to the oad
of baring a tuba. If that tabs vaaM break, >« Of course, a valve eauXd. brook too,
can go to eatroase oa that. I%<rauLies are oast so widely la. the field that 1&&t fear ia alaoat eliadaatad coawletoly.
Easel ford had soae bydroalle brakos plaood oa the ears. Mr. Ford aad ha drone the*. Steal bat those cars built up iova at
In tba aaaatiae* SbeMrlek aad the
^aaaforrod to tba H^p. They had beaa sored oat of eoapXetoly. They vara dowm at Gate a. ®ey also wantad soae of our
m voro told ta let oaly tan of
X guess tbe object of the ao** ams to got Bbeldrick oat of Mr* Ford's hair. X thiak there aaa mother object behind it. Tbat was
froa Mr. e*e****m'a side, St wtsed to
they cauM control it a l i t t l e easier than out bare. This
as Nr. Ford's private
«9U
mm mm built up down at tbe long® an*
Bitted far touting wet* here. Say were tasted, end the latteaaitian waa given oat ae i t happened, m I r e c a l l , tte testa were not ua*
favorably tat Mr. ford waa just Stanly set on e-^iuaaieai brakes as
wel l aa oa %mmmmm t^piaami tot ms «H«
gte e o n t i w r a y over the apring ttoopenslon -dates boon to •round i f3§ whom tb© Iteesry fivet eawi oat* Smy t r i e d to pot tte loi^itudir^l spring* on the ismsay* X belle*® that Mr. Edsel ford
was quite iaeteaaartal t© get Xoaajltafttaal springs on tbe car, Mr*
Soreasen, Mr. Nertfe and Mr. I M , I think, were pretty well eet. a o l A r i o * waa leipposed to woA i t oat*
Several ch&saie mm teUt up witb the longitudinal
spring* and wore sot out hero on the ftaat> and there tbay aat. body wouM look at them* fate tea to ho daoided by Mr. ford
a H y . ftey mm reoabaittii^ after Mr* ford said def ini te ly , *m eJbenfln in enrlnael*
$hat waa ths end of SteMrlete. Be was told not to t h i s new spring f o r leaal* I doa't know whether Slml&rSek approached Mr. Idnel ford to b u i M tt:ese ears with tbeae new springe or whether Mr.
lapel f o r i origittmtad tte idem. J&^wny, the obaaaia wero brought out
here end set on the f loor for oboermMon end e o i M t t o of anybody, mi
at onee SteMrick waa out.. 1 mmm that mm tile baeie season.
Later on "before Steldrick waa temiisated, they fastd a
b u i l t «9* a* hod vrnma. two* 8OB» wwe with the m r transversa
eyvfata* end th© front springs wow. lo^itudiiial, i s had mm with.
1%&> rear epnnge wwewers© ana toe rront coix springe*
U@ also worked on 41fforeat types of springs sad snspen*
sioas out he*® on a smaller aa*-» both .rear engine laoumtsd ana front
engine w » b M # trawlers® engines at tins rear* tne independent
spring ihorOby the axle was suspended i n the middle, and the wheels
wouM he sprang independently with n o i l anriaaa* At f i r s t we in*
stalled sooe of these in th© s i s t f »ber»OJ»ower slant* Later cm. we
insta l led caste tbe flw*»o?2lBae* ears.
iteery l a i o r was working on one. roar-eagSiie arlw*f and
Jliflaerfcsoji was working on soother* H&es© were Henry POrd'e priwabs
ideas. At that tlaa ttaa* was a l o t of ta lk Of i^ar-engine drives
on -'both the eosfsotitifo. sides, and eiwybedy aaa talking about it*
It was started over i n Qefaany m aha folkswagea* The suspension
we had was eir.iliia.i- to teat of t t » latter.
5.¾ were working on a elaaatfa wbtob would sitsaiste this
Geiraui ear* the Vaiittaaajaat the taaaasaoant spring as a fnlaaaa
around the crater of the rear axle housing in the rear th* easts*
of the front mmim> i a treat . the ©wastry of that was not worked
out so that you would get a atvaigat vertical ramasnt of the wheels.,
fas wheole would mm rad ia l ly not* of eonrse* teteed eoasiiorsble
M r s wear. Of eoai«% that voulaa't wwk .out properly.
-93-
Store were several mm mOX up with the eu*1&/4Kavjeyejar
V-8 engine witt W e typo of spring suspension, fheee four sprigs
were coll springs. We also h u n t up- anas chassis with. Immerse
mouutei englaos.* roar smatftei engines, these were sill tested oa-tbe
trash aad out on the road.
1 doa't aaov i i rec tay tbat Mr. ford weat along on these
tests and obaarvad the results . Of ooura% he got informtloii on
th® ears tot wore driven down South to ©aotgts. or to Iroa Memtaia,
through the drivers.
Ve a t the teea* a h s p ^ x t rather indifferent about the
report. that he would get froa tt»ae drivers, fhey ware: -not test
people, These faUoaa alea't aaov* Ifcay'd give i t tba l i ly onee i n
a amUaw Vhen ttwy fesjaft out taat ha waa looking f o r , they swayed' in
Ms dteaetiea to- gftaaaa atau » e y vaoldaH dare give bin the straight
JL P jfM^ Sc l tt
All around the E^iaaerix^ Ifep&rls&nt eojaoezaed with t h i s
d«.'V0iopr:Kiit work*, and airtlealaf3y we at the teat track, frowned upon
that procedure* fou aovar have twice the sane conditions. These fellows
oould Just mizc-omtix^ tiMtae ideas ©stireay. At no tiae would i t t i e i n
with what wo found, at the teat track.
Worn Sor#as©% Martin aad tha root wore interaoted i a chang
ing aaa apriag owapoaoion* thay wouM safport Ideal ia hia ideas..
The parjsaae of putting out a. lower horsepower engine was to
-90»
put ©at a lover sake a l a v
found eat later oa* in order to
Gripped of vhat you sight c a l l
tioa oa the tba fiuish of the
Tou
the ear at a
-. I t was thi was a primary part* 1
bailt a l o t Ughtor for the
You
>. You had to r* WOT MHB «a(iJ9y«si»*wM 4MHM, mm mmm Chassis. All WOO
did was pat a samllar angina 1 » i t *
What l i t t l e you sawed em the t r i a aad oa the laaarloa. i f ••t fan a t , was to tat tamo of ahoat Is*, fhat was
i*. It saeaa to he awful hard to save aoney hy taking off. It east to heat the head whoa you put it oa. It steaks
a you take it off, i t doesn't seam to result ia the saaa proportion in the savings.
Mr* Ford wanted to ante the ear as
At f i r s t Mr. ford was pleased with #wtgt eoas£eta& of
tre, I believe, around four or five laehee ia r. Shat vaaatte* in a t i m o d e a s aaoamt of frietioa
and heat i n the
to conventional mim is the
Ia aa aitjkVawlianna* engine i t ttpalaaaaaat of tha engiaa i s j year coat i a aot affected aa
awful lot by i t . You take tba eoapariaoa between tba 221 cubic
you still bad to go through complicated patter* ecalpaaat to aaki tbe cylinder block. As a natter of fact, it aas
oa the siaty-horsepaaar thaa on the e:
r, it You saved a for pounds of iron, but that coat of that iron
i s so little coopered to the aaobiaing cost. Your saaehialng cost is
fbe saving derlred froa that i s vary alaute. It wasn't worth tbe
You st i l l bad to bar* eight platans. You had to
rings or four nags for each, piotoa. You*"** .got to ban
There i s a ftUgbt aawtsgs, yes. the total weight of tba oar was
tbat the bowepowor/woigbt ratio of the alJrty-liorsepowor oagiae to the ear did aot result i n say savings or any iaerease of ecoaoay. la.
order to push that car under full loads with passengers ewer a road,
you f**ai*aa so amy horsepower* You «aam had to open the throttle
of m&mm ia*
•96-
©sly way that eouM oa aeeoaslishsd is to s l i f t e r w#i«ht ear. mtio had to fee Just ao aaea ia order to gala
.Mr. Fori, always Mslited the six-^liader fee fait tfcsre was a waste ia power staso there was as ©werlap. I t is true. She power «U*rfaeil&aa is attSaaaat la a six-cylinder
eagiae. Skat loos la eoonsay Is Tory hard to prove ewaa for & top f l igh t eefftgseer who might alt torn aad try aad flgaro i t oat, fee*
me eis-cyliiiier oagiae has loom adapted for its short a c®rtala speed, a earteia r.p.a* of' tise eagiae. At
r .p je . you a m get aore roughness oa a six-cjliadsr oagtai
am eight^liador eagiae. Ska* wm mm of Mo ofejeoMoas — the difficulty of fesjaaeiag at law
had a six, aad owsryfeody else had a sia, why shoaM Ford
six, le experi^atea vith a sin way beck oa his Model K.
with i t* I t attte** ®memm right. I «tsaaa, kaowiag h ia ,
that that would r o i a the thing tm Mm Day Ufa. Be had a fixed opiadoa
Edsel Ford waatsd to asks a six, hut ho kaew that h i s father
to i t . is started to sake a six without h i s father* e
•97-
say they vara truck anginas. Tbere VAS a, l l t t l a aore before tbat.
Mr. Ford lesarnod thay vera working on a six. Tbat vas at the Rouge. Sholdiiek by tbat tiaa bad bean transferrad to tba Rouge.
Mr. Sdsel Ford bad started tbe devalopatat em a six-cylinder, L-hsad
engine. Mr. Ford israediately started out bare working on a six-cy
linder, overhead-^va engine.
Thaso overhead valve euginea vera designed vltbomt push
rods. In otber worda, the eaashaft was ©a top of tbe velvaa* We .
bad several aa?atttaaatt*« One was the cliain drive froa the crankshaft
to tbe oaaabaft located on top of tba cylinder head, ao tbe cams vould
engage directly to the valves, i t van just as if you bad taken aa L-head engine and turned i t around and put the cam up above, therefore eliminating push rods.
Nowadays w* mm hydraulic tappets, and that factor is elimin
ated. An awful lo t of work i s being done to eliainete the hydraulic
tappets. We'll bear and see aore about that in future years.
Another ejrrangaateat was where the- eaashaft, also located on top, was driven by halical, spiral, ground genre. These gears, of oourae, were awfully eostly. fhey wore generated gears. Ton had one
on tbe crankshaft] you bad one on the vertical abaft reaching out through
the oaaabaft, and another one on that vertical abaft reaching over to
tbe camshaft at a ratio of two to one. Several engines of that type
wore bui l t . They're s t i l l here in our departaent. Game Farkaa did
-98-
There was f.rietioa hetwiem ib i s Intend engiisf wbiek was
< M V * 1 Q ^ I a t the Bouge tad the mmmm&. mXm engine here. Mr. .fort waa pushing the ovarbead valve engine, the other oat vas iewioped
at the Rouge) Wml initiated ths towlopasnt tea there. There vas a coaflist U-tweaa the two. I SMHSJS the idea behind i t vas to delay their dewiliifeawt vork down thars by what was being dene ©nt here.
iwiybody was bam' be at least was interested l a a
slx-t-ytoier engiiis. I t fttan't xttt«r audi what the valve engine
agipaegeasnt waa. Tba tee was taaawe*
day kopt on working aa the alK-cyliiid^r Job out bare. I
know we designed a avJtttaae of various t;ypa« of distributors, go®. mmmm and what have yon for- i t . we even did testing a t i t am taa
®$mmmmm* Wmm mm.warn or tvej»e of t t e w a a j i a a i built. X
don't aeanU. faa/ 'xa s t i l l bare* .tat of thaa ware sofapped, bat
« * * Mr. Ford wanted to prove through tea mat the amifeasat oould
not be worked oat i&tisfaotoiily. Va west into ana*a*v« testing mm mm, checking the aaonat
«f ea*Ja sti-eteti.. Sat chain stretch aaata% of course, result i s poor
ttatfag. Timing would ehaa§e, aad therefore, it would upset your
economy aad power. Mr. Martin was wary interested ta chain drive.
Stpnrtaaat sort of prohibited that right off tba bat. I t aas Just
aa engine, plus the aoias faotor. avaiaal, spiral gaars had to be
perfectly adjusted, sad tiny have to stay perfect or they whine.
Development work vaa kspt right up oa it. Ia the aaaatSs*, tba L-head, six-cylinder engine was being
dewlopecl toe. -mat didn't stand still either, fhey bad wary good
results with i t . that is whan tbe idea was conceived to apply it oa
tbe trucks only. That's where the lata**** oa the trucka began. Mr. Ford wasn't too much interested in what tboy wore putting i a the trucks.
.j fflwfi A Ba P KE €^B3FSJ ^PSiSS 0¾¾¾¾¾¾¾*¾^¾? JPaSftftdL JSaVa «&> 3¾¾*¾¾¾* ¾¾¾¾¾¾ a 6@aav )j]e 8aS 8 < j(a> Siyj 'v J
and. »*1.
fhey decided they would pat ©as of these sla^llaaer oagiaos
la a ear. I think it would have boon a futile attaapt to pat one of
these oagiaes in a ear wataaut advertieioe it baeaaas yarn couldn't do anything arsaad bare that be ftttaH know. 1 think bo kaew they
vera godag to p t i t i a the truck, and ho didn't care aacb about i t . As
a matter of fact, I tbu& he kaow tbe six-cylinder vas hero to stay. He
Just tried to retard it as aucb as possible ao ae aot to appear that be changed M s mind eoapXotely. Soasbo% else was apt to do i t against
-100»
his w i l l . Let*a pot It that way
Tbey Just put the six^yllnder ia ears* Is would never
drive one, as far as we know free inforzaatioa that we got froa tbe
driver. Se always tad a Ford atatot-ayllnaer Job, a black Fordor.
1 think alta everybody aoxfctag oa tbaa ho just said to
hijaself, "Let tbaa go and see what happens.** So tbey weat ahead
with the six.
The aoverMSnt asked, for al*^liaaar vablal*e)» both i a
eoaaoroial and passenger oars, e* the beginning of the war. These
partioute ones had the frmt-aowated distributor, later on the
Soveraosat orders that mm in reejaented that tba distributor be
vertical and be waterproof. Tba* was another help to bring the six
la .
I Ooa't tfedaa Ir* ford vm very mgry at tba Cfeavjraaaat
for insisting that he have that vertical dlatrlbutor. As a aatter
of fact, X didn't think he oared aueh about i t one way or the other.
He did teH us we should, dovelop a distributer for the four-cylinder
engine which, of oomrse, was oarriod through on the teaetor.
The sway bar, of causae* was tried out oa the teat track.
Va aborted that the n i * o r haaulnge would not last, particularly
during the wot weather. Mud woold aaanaulate i^ound ttses® bushings,
and they vould start to get aoisy* They would grunt. Every tiae
the tprfjiga would AafXaat, W hew a g*uatf and you would think
-Ififc-
the fiwl would fan o f f .
a* had a
ay office. 1 had I t
i t , sat X mmmat i t to Mr. Sisel
do msmmm ataa* i t #iiek
i t brought over here to
X told Mr. SlKddriek
om to Mr. Shfildrlek
. xt was a
to ee done about i t , m l I
tbey did do something about i t . Follcwi^ up ae
to Mr. Martin tad a copy to Mr. Basel tad about
bar hoftfeiogs would not l a s t , aad ssasthlsg would haws to be
i t .
i t
i t got eold aad there was snow that ths sway bars aase a lo t -of aoiee.
Bert spring Mr. ford oaae iato ay affftaa with Mr. @anfsaXl one
and ho wanted to know, "what i s going oa with these easy barsf
i s a lo t of trouble out i a the ftaUU*
I t o ld hia that w® know about i t , and he said, " H e l l , why
i s a » t tsaathiag. done about i t f*
I said, "80 passed tbe $M0mmMm oa. to Bagiaearing m
i t .
about thatf"
-102-
I told 1*1» that we wrote a eoaannieafcion to 1¾?. Martin sad a copy to Mr, Easel. He said* "Do you have a copy of ttole coaautiicatiesif *
X said, "*•»." I reached i a say f i l e and gave i t to bio.
He sal** "let ae hove that*" I heard later on that i f 1 hadn't had that coaounication,
he would have fired ae right there with Mr. CeapaaH* fhat Is why he
brought CAnajaall along, i f I hadn't bad. any proof that we found It
and reported it , i t wouldn't have been good far ae.
Thia did not reflect back on Basel. Bdsel knew about it,
and Sbeldriek knew about i t . Shelirick was supposed to do soaething
about i t . Sheldrick didn't follow up quickly enough. Sheldrick always
felt that the testa on a tee* track were- not reeoonable.
Following that taaa Mr. Ford cane into ay office, fony Oslato
got into trouble on the sway bars* This v i s i t was on a Saturday, and
1 was a l l by ap^alf over there.
» e following week be cms in again. Be said, "LeVa go
over to the test track and try out »mm sway bar cars." Be bad Wilson
bis driver with bin and aaaalf*. Me got 1» the oar and went over there.
In riding over there in lava car, I felt that the sway bar
had been removed froa the car we were riding in. Ha went over there,
aad he called out Tony Cttata* He sat in back with ae. Mr. Ford sat
right in frost, and Wilson vaa driving.
Mr. Ford said, "Tony, coae on in the ear. We want to try
-103-
out this ear aad see how the ewsy bar works.'* We vast around the track,
and Mr* Ford teamed hack and laid,. "fany* what do yon think of this
sway har la thie earl"
Tony said* "Matt* gee, that's wonderful! that ear perforas
wonderful. That sway hsr sure has done a lot of good for thie ear.*
I anas foay » poke* I d©a*t know whether he took the hint
or not, out seyway aha mmmmM,m stopped. Ms came around the treek,
end We* Ford asked us to stop in the garage* They pulled the oar in
tat garage. He aaiaV "toay> wiH you pull the sway har off this eart1*
fssay e»wlsd under taaxa* .and he mm out wit& his flash
light, m said, **»si?e is ao « f ear on tfeesa* Mr. Ford,**
8e .said, "And you s t i l l sofa that this ear rides good. You
s£.id it had a good sway har. Btaw let's take 0»» of your oars here
vith a swey har on aad take that iway har off, and we'll ride that
ear.**
Me palled out another ear* aad ©any crawled under it end
started taking the sway har off. 1 tried to help Ma, and Mr. Ford
pulled ae hack, He said, % » stay book here and let Ma do it."
Ve pulled the sway har off that and drove around the track.
Mr. Fcwi asked Sony again, "ana* do you think of this ear?" Tony,
of course, was speechless. He didn't know what to do. He said, "bell,
it's all right/' That, vas a l l he could :09. fwo days later Tony was
fired.
-10¾-
In eoB^noetioa with, the taot track, en* eooree,
on ew aottvttia® M her* In the Laboratory with m t® started mm ®oa® *mmm mwmmm mm^mmt mm mm wMeh
difficulties ted developed %y that %$ao. He switched froa tha
f i r s t to use a stop
with a series generator are ealte Mga, aad, therefore, i t i s dif
ficult to obtain preper voltage regulatioa @a a A eenoeia* 0 swhsidiary of Usaon Wire
the B. B. aad N* Company of Log^^art, Misma, for saaat taaaratore. It aaaat than ta evitcb froa the
1898«
Mr, feelia, who was then with Mr. Shaldriafc doom at the la m^mmwme* had aaae seas omataete with the Seeex mra
B3-M* to saaait soae of their saapias. They tried
HI- tests ap hero* Oat- toots did aot
the f i o M @a regulator aad gaaerater failurea aad hattery fodlarea.
Wo did ejgteaetwo tooting sad. had already 1
tooting* aat tried to help along la ieteraSaSag the
trouble, we tried to eliminate i t in conjunction with the Essex
Wire maaaaabtetlve aad »,1*M, Me spent eoae tiae out at R.B.M.
aad watched their oaaxaaiaes aad aaie suggestions ae to what shouM
he done. We spent tftaae days aad ttsree nights down tbere working
through to keep production going. We thought ve had the trouble
eoaettet eX.isrirtated, although we didn't fosi as though i t waa com*
pletely a&laiartad* It .paired major oh«ng@» in tbe regulator
ami on the iHRaerator.
We found the failure to be oa tbe contact points of the
regulator* A voltage regulator is aiaiay a valve tbat shut® off
toe flow of current froa the goaemtor to tba gea«*at©r field eon-
trolled by the battery voltage. battery voltage will dictate
to the regulator when to shut that field current off or when the
battery im full..
Of course* the battery voltage ia a liar. It ia a com
promise. It is the specific gravity of a battery which determines
the level of charge in tbe battery* Tbe voltage i s the next con
venient aeans of coatfoUiiag tbe p » » t o r eacvaat through the battery
through tbat voltage regulator.
A fie l d current has to flow through two contact points which
eoastetly vibrate at vex&ou* ftooneaeiae. dreading upon the voltage. 0¾¾¾- *t2C3 ^3fcfc6H3K& ^^^^^^^^^^¾^^^^* 5* aS Qi 5a fifl»e^»e> ¾ ¾ ¾1 ¢ ¾¾¾¾?¾¾¾¾' a 1¾¾¾!*
mtarial of which these contact points ware aade wee <pite c r i t i c a l .
The origiaal insulator* were aade with silver alloy which l a close
got aad ®m
We triad various coatact-poiat materiel* oat here, we
aloo triad to ebaage the froojaaacy at mm tiie
wa improved t M c*onditiou aonowtet bat as*
There wore also distortion .factors iavolvsd $»
foratiasi of i t* The woltaait reaalatoar has to ho calibrated ao that
i t poisata the voltage potential of 7.3 volts at rooa teaiorataro,
8,% volts, at w o , ami 7-0 to f .1 vaMa at 18© dogmas
That tmwmmm oejvaaoatioa has to ho built into too
that was a difficult thing to do in mm tine.
i t , but i t wasn't
X convinced Mr, Martin that wo should go oa a Malted
of the regulator l a the aaoust of 'about 10 par gfat fart to
IS par cant i a the ffearbem aroa where wo eoatd. watqfo tt BO agreed ta the M -per coat production, aad wo waat om like
tbat, s t i l l working om i t .
without a voltage regulator, m put that oa §0 per coat, aad put the
sa 10
im the field, that psoeadare Is fallowed
tm ®m mm ia a lalN3»oAe*y mam yam art blue la tat
face aad yam give It ta M s t Public aad you get a dlfJavaat picture.
Aw 20
so 'aa fafv whet ass fiffifoig Hurt** production} <a*f
Mr. Martin aaa told frfa» that I theaafkt aa would
with various people, fhay fait i t waa a l l right mm, i t was la -goat shape so thay lot it loose. They wast into
100 pa? oaat. Soavame, a law aoatho later X really thought skies wore falling down oa thea.- A m of
A mmOmmm mm called taw at the Rouge la Sheldric^'a
Va had a reprssentatiw of the !*£. aad M. Company, a rep-
of mmm Wire, Mr. HarMa, Mr. Soroaoaa, Mr. Sheldrick,
Teelle and too representative froa Aawrtean Boeefe at mm cos-
« 1 0 8 .
expected tMs mm «11 going to be diaped bach i a ay lap again. - It was to a aartaia axtast.
Hfeile we vara s i t t i n g i a the aaaaaat* ell of a sudden the
deer opened and In cane Jar. Ford. He said* "aaa* are you boys talk
ie SBOtftf*
I said, "eVas ta ihisg about voltage regiilatotw,*
I t said, ym$ I aaaa. faa*ta Just trying bo blase
Bail for this. & V s not a t fault. It's you fallows who are at fault.
You wsfod too fas t . B@a*t you felaao i t oa Wav* Be burasd arouad aad
walhed out again*
W® steiptoi iaaeitsjbily fiMss. with now design regulators sad
a&th one that was sala&tbat by iJaerioaa Boeoh* The Aasrteaa iosoh
A f t i i a ^ t f ^1¾*¾ seat to aJm%m^->mm WlMiiifirilT ffi 'nwrn f%te&h awa*-** awi.i't' jUsaaVjt v>L!UwmAiMjmitp'&MM
100 per cent either. I would say production was about 98 per eant.
m got these m^mmm f roa Bosch ami wo laibtabed 9mm
to aaa* part of those regulators ourselves in a little plant out in
fhooate, meiag tea aaa* tosiga as letch,, mm t ry ing to laprore
ewen on. that aad d id so as w» went along, fimlly, i t turned out into
a predaeafele pric*s«right regulator,
A regulator is am aajasj, that v i l l .always be a trouble mmr
i n a car , because i t s operation, i s based oa too aany ether factors.
I t was aade into aworkablo ^guiat^, and we produced as aaay as Bosch
and bopt tba Haas going. R.8.M. waa discontinued.
2h# saw stosign we had stared prsTiously didn't
tiae devoted to it . Wo did as mxM as wo oould. S t i l l i t
i n our mind. Is laat an evdUattaj sossa of those and ©hanging fas alloy
of tbe coatiot»poiat aatarlal*
ve ttooft iaali&e alloys — oat twptan aad one silver alloy.
Tbey ware emaged parallel-wiet m tbat w# would get tbe beat on
tbe uiy^ter, aide and tbe low te»pef«te^ oa ta» ejt&ajr wonM give ae tbe conductivity. Tbe tungsten which bad
ity gave us the beat seaiiitattca.
m bu i l t , X think, about a dozen af thea over hare aad put
% e a » a r o ^ bare. 1 bad one ta ay •** for a long tiae. I t
that thaw tttlngs were ii&teatruetablffi; yoa Just eaalaVt hart
r tumble developed* we trased i t hack* and i t waa not
% It wan either tbe iterator or high raaistaaca ia the the battery.
« n A .01¾ tmainw» t&aa the oat we bad ia nrodssctioa. The eoanlaints ox
ma predmotlon type laaaiaew Iterated right along. I t waa fe l t m long as toe r«gulator worked fa i r ly well, a» abould not go iato a nev
ihisia required t>r«tiegllv rsteolimjc of all of t ie f s s i l i t l a s .
book with good ftwav&te* <B» ^t,vaBmbiXit..y of the asw tagulator
-HO-
in adjusting sprinjg
»e
'fefiOttBp
Ve
. It
of the
it on ti
stt i s ia tbe
to- go If
of tbe
tea i t
itey tlaa aa
fhmt is s t i l l mmamm. to got a
it it*o
ia. «• « ia*t do aay
tfkf ft.a eousttd mt&ri&lly la tbat.
in tbe ears oaf daoigasd tba lf^^tt*#1<Mt
yoafcfca that aouM fit into «av eaaa* It aa®- a
you aa*3A yak ia ear aaav In tftaa* at cowse,
•Warn* Hmmm it ajsiaya aaa ta l i t 1» wm 1 The Fofft Maaaa €aaiaaQF put tba fSaat
It vaa ttot Majestic.
Tba s*al» mm mm aSm pat over o&u
im a*ta*ao mm» mm
te"fe. S$^cif ieatiesis can bo ott up to suit one wsmliar
cicely aitfe
•atta l a the
i s aanta a trtefcy
ig$mmm **• fmik mm a b i t leery aa to vhetber tMs
aaata buaiaese aa* aYavttAa ticooraiag t© boyle aad i a a stmisbtfor-
ward aaaaar* He naked us is look late tbat, Mb i M aad sert of
kept o*utft*t a*tfe tUem aad mm to ft "tbat iMae* vara haadlsd. aa
fair ami aa a* tew bow*
I #oa»t xaamU «mtf«t»s znxu&m froa aaa radio aaaa*
liavaavar to mmmm* Stijostfe mm m® mem rod!©. Then Wmam mm $a art mmm mm Wmsm» Wtim and %ej?*©a* at jaejEson, aaa
aate wdloft for us. St vaa- iMwlty #$3&t up aftaaaa Mo amnttfae%iif**
o » ao it aaa&ae't a* t**t V »*6» jaat '©ao. «a*t vaat aaoog pretty
Mr. Ford ttaatfit wa should avtag la another amm to follov
tte I W U A work throat, m they a t * * * * loraoa Cbabbwb ia . He oaao
i a about »38 ar may fi^ I E sorooa rooa over ttaue*
a a t along «*1fe tn,. fo e©BtS»» tbe etoty ce tba starter development, tbe ao*
eelarator pedal m clutch pedal orraagiamat woo aot aoeefted. Mam*
ejsamnt, reticularis Mr. Sorenstam, taom thought tbat Wm l i t t l e button
oa tho site va i l l bo amen abetter aad to leave i t ao i t aaa. fhe
pmote control j, or the ©©isaoid esat*ol# oaao ia later oa aad aaa
adapted laeauee i t foil i a pri@©-wis®» The foot buttons wore dieeon*
% y a u
Wire who were the suppliers of Ha £00% button
so lev due to tbe fact that t i l : the
to wl®B©id oaatasla* Htsey thought wo should also ao aear to controls, fhey could give ue that for practically the atae
just- brought in without aueh enestl©*. Hr. Fori didn' t ehjeet to tfcat
atom*
taat track, electrical mmi^mm aad Mr. Fold 1 ®
which, wore ^y^imflw. #1-1- of tbin ttae off aad oa.
Mr. Ford bad «e aaka a v A a t O U with a generator oa i t . 1
mm tiia **iM-driven wheal aaa about iour feet l a diaaatar. m and*
aa alteruator for i t . He- aouatid the wind-drivea wheal
taa al^raatar abaft aat - fa t i t oa a pedestal, ft was
Z doit*t kaov what be m with i t .
bad already eoae oat. l e $*t b u i l t oae for hia oa that basis. As a
Matter of fast, we did got mm. af tb® mmm %p» win&nlll generators.
That was with a single Made aad the wimt goveraor oa the blade. ¥«
got oae of «***•• It aaa steading ©var tkaga for quit* * vM3*. 8»
i a i t . Be warned us to build one.
*113-
Just about that Mm he also undertook tb® dewelopaeat
of a heating system over i a the I bore House. It's behind the dairy
hara over there and was reoeatSy tame dowa. Cutter was tba archi
tect om that, fbe object was to beat a house froa a fireplace by
heat eonroeUo& which was to build a f i r e ia tbe fireplace tbea the
flue would go straight through, but through the fly© would go boat*
iag pipes, fbe air would be taken ia at the bottom aear the floor
l eve l and proceed to go throagb these booMag pipes to be varaed up
and case out the top of ao outlet. We were going to circulate by
gravity. It was aa excellent Job. It's being used now* That was bis personal iiaa* That's where it actually started. That was al
ready b u i l t up.
Itr. lord asked ao to develop a teaperatar® control whereby
the teaporatee ia the room could b* controlled. You realise you
have aa open fireplace sad .you have heating pipes going through it .
You can control the temperature fairly well. I mast mention that
this control was supposed to be obtained without using electricity.
It coo bo done, but it aakae an ungodly big malt. There
were to be ao batteries or ao electricity of say Mat. Is also wanted
to knew bow consistent the temperature i s in the room and what the
relative feumidity i s . «a put a recorder over there, * bygroaetar and
a teapefatwe recorder, wbieb would operate for a week between wiadops.
It showed on a chart at exactly what t i n t tbe teaperataro was what.
I went over there every Sunday end changed the ehart. X
put a new ehert em end brought the other ene heck end eaapiled e
of the tsaneratHxes. kssMsft the fire»l&c® aa\ of
control Sn the rosso, without the nee of
eXaotrielty or any oatsnsi port, wee o l i t t l e aore diff icul t . we
whieh were «taeig*ed end buil t by the Detroit
Tbey const©tad of a eeppar powder hiecuit end
rubber. You use granulated copper, added that into a biscuit aad
heumd i t with rubber. You put that biscuit i a a
held the outer edges r igidly . You put a take-off is
any aaaa* to traaaait notion* As thie powder got hot. i t
at a .rapid rate aad,. therefore, eause a aeweaaat.
MI be appliod to aaything. He weed i t for tfceraost&te i n tbe
wo ueed that instead of either a bimetal
wMoh was f iHod with either gas or l iquid with a high
coef ficlant f lu id ,
ae thought this biseuit idea would be $m the thing,
wo aade a control up whioh weulA fasten over the register- witl
thie l i t t l e bisouit hanging on the side, with just a lower up
tbe deeper. Ae the tssiperat»f® eheagad oa tha biseuit, i t weald
a n t would ©my give you btaperstiire eoatgol at that location, X* a iaea> i»twraXJy, yam want aa average tesparatare. Xt amy aa cold over here, not it's not up there where this eeatroi bung, the* una too dtfJloulty with that, but he wouldn't pexstlt ua to put. any reaoto ooatrol oa this because ao electricity eouM aa mood* If ao coaXd mm used electricity, i t would novo boon
alava*. «a, i t atateft out fairly won, but 1 9 » temperature was
not eaaaisipast a l l H a way around aba rooa which woo prowed by tha
saaasiar* Wm bmttag apaaaa etiserwlse wata** wary slseXy* m mm that m mm not. getting, according to tha aaouat
of aaai aad wood that had to at *aa& aeor aaaat* topaotoh emeieney out of aba f**a»3**a« The roaeeii far that was whoa tbey put tat duet i a , thay carried i t up to the eoHing and thea down and ease i n through the hottoa of cat floor o^afaj therefor®, your gravity food woo destroy* ad. You M i a certain, eaouafc of raeistancs ftts» to the coldness of too ducts on tha bottom, 11» convection eon bo completely changed. That was already taataUaA, aad wo eouMa't got at i t to pu l l those duets out agaia*
Vs proposed pitting in a blower* Mr. Ford wouldn't let us use em eXoetriii blower* There woo to be ao etsotrtalay ateaevar* at" Hiougbt bohiad it was to aske a heating ayatam that the fmm could
use. Is had boM aa that he was miam, to tmiM a dosta hosas Witt this hestiitg system to, but ao elaettisity would be used. Be was tbiakiag
•US*
of the fejsaref.
Fiually i t turned out tbmt ve aaa to bare aoae electricity,
so w s«t UJ? a windssill genofator. Tbey bad oa* over there, am o l d
mm mm a tvc-b^s propeller aad a thirty-two volt generator oa
the tower, but th* propeller woo not omoiomt enough to give uo oar electricity at low wind velocities, we aado a four-blade pro-f e l l e r aad eat that up there aad got pretty flood resulta. Of eoarae,
ao viad — ao. s4a««yiaita> we tnataHod latttsrSeo then which would
be a etnadVby for tba tiae there waa no wind. There waa the queetion of water. Nc electricity, of course,
waa to be used. There i s a v e i l over there. You earn l e t a bucket aaaa and pul l , out a auelart£w«i of' water, and you have water. Bow ©as you got i t up otherwise?
Mr. Ford eaae along mm an idea of using a string just about a sixteenth of an inch i a diaaeter whieb would, be suapeoded
around the pulley across th« * * t a » o f atm mm aad arouad tba puHty on top. If you would revolve that s t r ing , water would sdnere to the
string and eoae up on tiie striag. Of ooureo, I t vas a awall awoaat,
depending upon tbe speed at which you run the string and than drop tee water of f into a trough on top aad run i t out, and there's your
water. That worked, a l l r ight turning i t by bead.
Mr. F o r i f inally consented to use am electric aetor to drive that puap. That's tbe way they got that water out of the wall over
Be want f u r t h e r end had a a a n l l classical l a b b u i l t up
i n t o en addition of t h i s buiiiing over t h e r e . Bob i&jith was im
o a that. They *© flo » o r t a taa* Tbey used t o aw
aat pfopswi. food for hia . Ha a t e H * * * there, l a took -aaae o f tbe
asabers o f tbe aaoogeaaat over t o the Moore louse, aad tbey a t e over
there. I t vas sort of starting a l i t t l e private d i n i n g roam
fhey vara w o r k i n g oa soybean food and soybeai
aentlag with the horaones from the oov*a urino. l*m a o t c e r t a i n
of that} I vas not eonatobed with t h a t , lob S a i t h was i n o a that.
t h i s i s where I was brou#t i n oa the aeyheaj
with Sr. aaaaiaavw may r e q u i r e d a mi l l which, would fmlverias
meal to very aisute p a r t i a l e s . fhey 4*1 i t before, b a t y o u ooolA s t i l l
taste I t i a l e e oreaa. This a i l l was sappeood t o be aade ao
g i W i t dowa even f l a w mm «ha» they had psv/fieualy.. i t
they ground i t down f i n e , but t ho aoaaa t the soybeaa a a a l booaas a o i a t ,
l a a dry s t ags you can juot g r i n d i t dowa so a v a i l , ao you
aake i t to a n infinite mmmtm in granules. The aoaaat y o u bfiag i t
i n eeaiomt w i t h mmtwm i t would swell up again, so you h a d n ' t ga ined
anything* Katm-ally, t he a a a l l e r ym c an aafea t h e o r i g i m l g r a i n s , the
you would havo. You would a a t expans ion , b u t i t wou ld
«3A§»
did what m oomld to bring i t down aa tint m wm
mm trie* to gviaa i t «tt» tut they ***mt mmm&Hmn
had f a i r l y good laatttt* *ne aoybean loo ore®* toot «
Later on tbey brought i n this soybean whip cream wbteh
result* with It. Hr* f o r i had nofcod 2*. HuddUaaa to
M l a aiaaaae ovor fere at tbe mill where tbsy did
i t , but the p » wn« dsaaged. » a y oonMtt*t control i t no i t woo
abaoluieJy not daaagad*
a>. Ford noted u@ to bulla up a vnoinsi syntaa by vMob bo
hoped to p i t t i n ataa* in a eaeteftsir and then e w « t e thai
% iaftajwal ajspwaioii of «a» gatia. -of wheat, i t would hrea* i t
we built U T , a ^clLftg- ayetaa* I t wa« a vacuum pnap vith an
c Tcllcg valve that would b u i l d up a vacuum in tfela con-drop i t to &-osre)B ;ierie p^y sure again ia a task for fgta
mm®*t. Xt dspoadod upon the .aaistee « a M of the ema! i t s e l f *
»llf*-
ill other words, the mmmt of UmmmA
Ford wanted that particular maktac taken o w to the
put is the little laboratory over there* Is waa going
to m mm work as i t la^aaVV I t aaa there for a laag tise. i t
• repairs that had to he aada aad aaa taken back
om X never board asytfeins of i t any sore. Be dicta't
mm wm*m%m*t. T dlaa.*t incuir® ao ta what the situation waa. As
far •§ I know, they did met develop a prooooa to do exactly as ha
Somebody amy bare. I a.oa't know, tbat waa the cud of that.
M l of that want oa Immmm tba autasc&ile buslmeee, aad
i ia a wtttio we'd work m a steam oagtao which maMaaetioaed
. there aaa something oa there that ho dlda't easetly like,
mm aa the Mills engine wMob was a particular bobmy of bis-* that
ia supposed to be aa engine that has. perfect cutoff om both aides of
the stroke. It woo aot quit* perfect. Be aada us aake it perfect,
aad we f t a e l l y got i t to work perfectly..
It also bad an oil. governor, a paddle-wheel governor oa i t .
That was sluggish. We worked t a t out. The only reason far it was
nut in yaw baavr seaalatsmw oi l which would *®»mm tbe ilsnirltT therefore tba apsed rates wouM ebaage. ft* used less . o i l , aad it
a l l right.
tsSk ®i§9S5 1(¾¾¾-¾! ¾¾- ¾¾ "1¾¾¾*¾¾¾ $ ^ l%i$f8a 888 15¾¾*¾¾¾ OSS s* 3wa s»- ^NBea S
and oeulpaaat that vara going late tha Hasew. We had sonsthlng to
ao with th® steea engines over there - - the Xoeatloa of the steaa
engines — but i t was just ad*lsery*wise. I t was what we thought
•houM he done.
I epent quite a hit of tise over i a the Museum, particu
larly oa this eaabsaatloa g#s~stea» engine that oeae froa Highland
Park. 1 advised the positioning of that.
JUs Bishop was also over in the Musswa working on tha evo
lution of the steam engine. I couldn't say for certain whether
Norton, a aaa from England, was present. I tew there were other
people along vith Jla Bishop.
There was cos fellow around here by the nana of Sanger. I
don't know where Mr. Ford picked hia up. It seeaed that Sanger was
around here Just to get into everybody else's hair. Ba seeaed to be
a l i t t l e eccentric and outer. It seeaed as though he wasn't a l l right
upstairs. It went around firing people right and .loft*
Ha was the nan to whoa Mr. Ford gave the authority to run
the laerborn Engineering laboratory, ae a joke. He told Mr. Voorbese
what to do and John Soreataa. I didn't get too aueh in contact with
hia* Is oaae over to ao several tiaee about the steam engine Mr. Ford
wasted fixed up here. I could see what I was in for so I just steered
clear of hia. I didn't want to get tangled up in that ases.
John Soreason was telling m that ganger came around and
told hia to pat m felt coat aad go boas. He told Voorheee ho vas
fired. That mm Just a big joke around here. I felt X amomSda't
gat tabled up «taa that hoy. 1 «W% have time for tt . It Just
looksa ridiculous, to ao, hut apparently Mr. Ford got a big kick out
of i t . Finally ha aaat hla out to a farm aad loft hia out at tbe
tana.' Ss 'mm owa\ba * oJavjajeta*> ^hat hay aaa*
l a 1937, m aovod tajfco a ford homo, la had just roatad
a bouse doaa l a East Dearborn, i t soeaad that every tiae we moved
into a house, i t was sold, We .had found another homo...
One day I earns to work,, aad 1 ashed Mr. Ford, "Could X
take a day off to move?*
la sal*, ^mm*9 tarn amtmayt Soa*t yea pay yow roatt
mmm Of® you going to move tot #
2 eald, "Wall, we have a hoaa dowa la Seat Dearborn."
Be Paid, oaa*t you move into one of our 'houses around,
hero? Coat oa* Jtaap im tho oar, aaa we*ll m over and- look at i t ."
He took us over to this home oa Southf ield aad tad Bond,
not- tba first oae; i t ' * the seeoad mm up. «a opened the door, and
the house had Just mm reeomditi«ed tavoaej»y*t, with a haeaaaut
put under aad a l l that.
He salt, "Do .you Hiss ltt* X aaid, "It loot* a l l ***** ta as, amt X wouldn't weat to
take advantage of anything of that sort. 8
He mM$ "arUg fom wife mm « 4 mtm it to bar. I* «§«i tfbae. 4%. you sttm aove ia .*
Be left, «ai I wont I m , got ay wife and
tad showed i t to her. I t was qplte • • 1 1 , of course
"Of course, im aaa't refuse i t . "
1 M i Mr* Ford tiiat i t a i l ri#.t. Be said, *mU9. •il ltj lifli a £tfcjtf£tt& 'flrenftlli itllll'iii '41VS ffl'lfcMjIBlJV «t»4f e M | ^
m took tb» howi, and I &sk<ad what tb* seat would cost.
Be said, forget ft! It doesn't eost yon anything. Ton Just stay
I asAA, ***** •** I wouldn't wont to atay there i f ! •»
not paring a«y -pent for i t at a l l * 0
It said, SSaBt Is mm af yowr bwa$&eae« Tom £aft stay
an long m yom like-."
Of course, ay wife and 1 debated tbat we didn't Hat i t ,
to bum. m did tbat in 1939 • we bui l t oat
I toM M B we were iatesdiaii to build, aad be said, yoa like thiii stesef l »* t i t good eaougbf*
X said, W a fiat, but X don*t want to take
your generosity, particularly since you don't le t us amy rent."
Os mm, i t doesn't aake any difference
Wm* X « • » • • »
-123*
ova heme so If you wast to b o m , go
batX4f#
I said, "Baa there m Fordson Safttat, la this
« *
. l i : said, *mmm about® is it?" x told hia tha
Be said, "Vm. going to go oat ant see what it loose lite."
t o look at this l o t , ant i t % a pretty alee location lew, .yam 1st
say T -Hti yff dig th® beaaaeat*9
I said, l*a sorry, but it's mXL
tm wim labor oa this |@b, sat I voulda't want to start say by having aoasbody also do seas work aad
off the job. i t i s a l l tafcea oars of by
i* tabea mm of by eoatrsator* »mm
He amid, "Mall, Haw eaa help you on
to do that ouimavws."
He ayosarad to be a Mttla snappy and ehorp about it* He
t® to i t , but I refused. I fait that ao were going to do i t
tfe want an building i t * 1 sbsenaft therm in tarn
usually to sea haw they ware getting alxmg, aad oae day soma of thi
g i r l . Bi H i j<jgflf*ylitg as to wbo vaa buii&isig tba tout©, waa was
tbe contractor ©a It aad, so form. X asked tbe aaa to describe tats
aaa* Mko l a r r y Baaaata**
tba dmooriptioa fitted Ma. vatta I didn't got definite
memmwm tarn* i t vaa Wmm »saotfcf i t .male aaase* Bis iaugbter Harriot vas l i t t l e apparently, aad ba vas cheeking to aaa who vaa
awalttsf tba bouse aid, I i a a g t e , to aa*-aaa vas mrtm for vhat. la otbar word** ba vao ohoeklng op oa aa.
Slat wont by. Mr. road* of course^ stopped ay tbere once
ia a visile to look i t over. Quo day a* tsao ta* ami bo asid* "Say,
yoo are boAdiag a pretty 'big housed
I said, i aaa that now tbat I .look at i t . It looked like a aaaXl bole in tbe around* but right now i t looko Hat It's a prater .g§©d«*iwd Saaaau*
Be said, "Are you euro you earn carry itt"
i mm* *%Btmtoar»* m vaat on and wa finished it up. Bs did roaeat i t , appar
ently, a bit. vbaa X decided oa tiie .slat of tba bouse to bo- built.
KsTertbelsss, wo wore fuSy aware of whs* aa wore- saaat* mm va oould
take earo of i t , *
fa* bouse woo bunt and ooofteM.. Ms moved ta before
X mm, m imm\ mm of.* mt satd, • « * * * , why aa*»t yom t»t a law* i t* lab
us pit ft taaat awsaii i t ami j s t ft vegetable gardea im the beak.® it
. X said* "We v H S mm * awftftu Hy vUO mm a garden, bat
for fits t taa being a* have aaay** m $» m aat thJagfi ebaaacd a t aat
aat i t t a .abaft* io w i l l mm* ohoat i t l a t e r ©a.*
Mr. Ford said, "won, anyway, let's fat a feces around i t . "
X said, (fHo» thank yen. m dea*t want a fese© around there." ttat again dMn*t sot vary v a n . fl» wasted to do scrasthiag,
bat I Jaat 3 ¾ ! - refused. I felt tbat ve ware galas to da th ia our*
.aelvea. i t* * « 4 tt*# -aw*
3t Jt^Paaa?^ Wf$$B^ a$t5@|M&®0 3¾¾¾¾¾* ^0¾¾*¾ mmWSffi jp^^isjiovat ^BSaU^ Bfta*a- W aa va-
Mr* Ford j a w s took aat* aa l a t e n t i a people that be mm* I
know of oath oaaae be asttwiHy I N U * h@Mo@ for aaeb fae§Ia, but
X ****** faavo aay 1*** o f i t .
Mr. ford ****** t r y to tapeo* hia earn f ie** on ao. Tm only
thixag tarn* be eaa**a*»* on. **• that i t vat a raider Xarva house. X
sold, mmU» m have tat t w ehiliroB, and oa they grew a*, they * m
bring other oMldron. X woaM Wm prtvojiy ia the ewaateg enee i a a
« « 1 » , ao a* had a l i b r a r y i ^ « t t 8 baoav*
•426»
of he did build boots for
lot of beartasheo, 1
of this bo aaTntaln ay ova
I did. I felt that
m& mm that bo that 1 was building a
m money i t
as bi«
aaa Maleilo deej. oa Hei beater® floras, ay Of
hot a i r heater. Louie Welch was a
out hate i s the fata garage, which ass right
Inspection Department i s now*
tmd® f lasHy sewered with faaSJmgor sad sorted a shop for
Masetf oat m iPwi, butt&iag healers* I be l ies ho had bought the
.right froa the first hot a i r sygj|jlier» which was Sunday* hb
oat of a oaa-plso® drawn fftwdl so there wouldn't bo any
2©¾¾¾¾ , 5' ee 8f p ^,i 3"Ke* P ^^¾?1 ! ¾¾^¾ Mft S N fifSjy 0%¾¾ ^tl^JSKPa^ ^3¾ I Q RBLS1
1 don't
«•327-
Anyway Louie suba&ttaA beabam, sad we checked thea. Shay
were a l l right ae & hot air heater, hut ve s t i l l felt the hot water
heater would he aora in dsaaaf by im pi&llc If i t waa handled right*
% f e l t i f the hot water heater would get a fai r chance eat
in tne timtA* m were eertada that nobody wanted, hot a i r heatere say
mm* Your hot air heater simply depends upon apeed and power input of
your engine. At low mmA ym don't get aay heat. At high speed you
get- too such* fhat's the trouble, $h@ hot water heater was i a to
stay, hut between the 1. end A. letotaftorla* and Louie Welch, there
waa motion f ^ B . He had S, and A. Laboratories reputation froa the
past* i t had tlds new jmmmm easing i s at the m e tiae.
fhey tried to Safiueaoe the engineers running the teats to
aake ta loot s i l l y , ttat's what they tried to do. Stoat Just went
ag&iait sy grain enanlata3y«
Severthelesfi we kept the I. and A. laboratories out, we
suoceeded in keeping thea out with Ur. £d§el Ford's- help, because he knew
the situation. Louie Welch waa s t i l l in. Mr. Ford believed i n hot air
haters. He knew Lenta* so Louie aade hot a i r heaters. Ve had $0 per
cent hot air boaters end 50 per cent hot water heaters, but s t i l l under
prossure with tfeia E . sad A. L^wto ry gong.
From tben on, Mr* Ford asked ae to espond the laboratory over
'there. Gregory first had the 1mm roe© wMch uaed to be a denoe ba l l
in souscwee'c corner.
-128-
9
on® with a wio l la , one with a tmsajat and one with a base fiddle.
Hay wuld practice t i l day lung do*m there. fie wight ccaae wn ami nay, *®mm 'oa, let* a go &mm to tbo iaaf* ball**
At one tfce* be aid l u s t that to a*» St woo before tills
date sow. Be eaid, "Let's go down to tba dense b a l l . Ha oaa talk
there wore Just tba ssysieiam. Mr. ford aad myself there*
la> oat iow% -aid bo asked tbaa to flay a walta. That aaa hie faror* i to , of course, to bad Just taikod business about ooaethlag or otiaar
I a*JA» •***, •***.*
****** l o t aa aoo you* 0» oat aad *******
I stood there by mjmm£f oat danced arouad.
Be said, "Tbat isn ' t the way. Bo, you're aot doing i t rigbt.
I«U ahaa you low do i t . "
about aiding. Clam you sSagf * I eaid, "So**, like a **»*•" Be csllevi for George mmm who was Me mmmm Ham aad s sM
to bin, ^So aad ext Bay S a M ^ i r l *
1 » wont out and got Ray r^ilinger, fboy a l l eaaa l a . Be
said, "Sow lot's sing *Boa* on th* mm*** Sara* couldn't aiag it)
•48»»
bo eouMa't keep a tuna, Of course, l a y Beblisgor mm. s ing, m
Bay mms®m*» »>. ford end myself rtoei there singing "Borne on
tbe Hange.1* X f e l t « l i t t l e ridiculous. tee minute ve were talking about e> mrehlem which I had
cm my Mad, and the Hearts etfaabt we were dancing and singing. Be
said he thought that would brook wm the day a l i t t l e mare.
At eat time he hat everybody i a the whole laboratery go
down to the attnese h a l l and s i t around* fbey had loud speakers
around* fhey wore brosdoasting a program from th® Martha-ewary Chapel.
I t was a f i f teen minute period twice a week I tfalsk* Everythiag stopped. We'd go down there, s i t around and Hate®, be the program,
l a t e r om Ǥey had spoabars Instal led a l l over the lab , and the broad*
oast mm- i a over them. tforybo% had to oatt wrking and l i s t e n to
i t .
Mr* Ford aaked to e n a a i tbe e looteieal labsmberr norm
aad tana ^ 0 lower roes maw tmm Bob Gregory. Be used i t for styling
aaa* there. X mWim tgtf* was aa attempt to coafia* Gregory• s actlvl-
Wm» although we d i d sooi mora soae» At that time the I l e a of electron
aicroaocpia started, ma haws aa isolated room bo pat aa electron i n . Also, we wanted darkrooms for microscopic work aad a email dark
room to develop photo mierosoopo aaeje &waa.
Sob Gregory didn' t foal wary good .about' hawing Huts extra
apace taken away i r o a Mm. He was acmtSaam. as i t was, hawing a l l o f
nod®!® standing m Uwm* 1 tMnk timt was to* t la* Mr. Steal ¾ ¾¾ 1¾*'¾¾¾ 3* !¾ * 8¾¾¾¾¾¾¾1 "S®ataiiXaj|t J JCBKl SSWBJJjFy ¾¾!¾¾¾¾¾¾¾¾!¾¾
be knew i t wm by bighftr authority ma timt i t wis supposed to he
. I could do nothing about tbe situation. X «00 sij^ly told to
tivlo rooji and eapmd tbe electrical laboratory.
fie aat uo a m a witMn a, roan waa « ^ « ^ f w m tte
floor. Oae eectioa was a aoxoem room with double screens auaiigafl
lor radio work aad working on iavestisRticjaa. Another rooa waa n
quiet mm vith the wstto alt apneas* & otber words, ve were
fata tba a«BrtAoia wo*. We aaaa 1ay|aj ta do .eoae ©f i t
ae waa huaaaly possitle within tba confines where we mm* m s t i l l
bad floor teyavsjeiaeiia, but tbat waa wry, very annor, because we bad i t wry taawiSy easprtad, and tba walla wore aad® of sou*
«e also bed a adofoaooje 900a wMeh. wo could nm i n light or dart, and a pbotograpbia darkroom in bask of. i t and am
At the aaae tiae, Qregoay wan trying to de^lpp stylas on
% i i i . { M % i f i M t i l ^ r m X aa*u say Me.
Ford didn't exnctly l ike Mr. Qpigosyi be M a t had mob to do with Mau
'a work woo strictly with Meal Ford and the rent of tbe
As far as 1 kuw, Mr. Jvaa nev«r went ftom l a 11» a i l i n g
•131-
X mm® saw kj§i la. t a c t * . He mm** asprove tba finished style
la tha eexller veara before Hi aim u caae m^a
Joe €aXa*% »a« to a* «ae et»ftlaaV * » Ford want i n far styllag
lea bare a peculiar split there whiOh in true ia aJsast automotive c a w hotaeea. the stylists oa eaa hand and the
on tm other. W®m i«& layavjejaaaaft the eagliioerlng ***** and Edsel
Ford reproeented tlx) styling olio*
mm mam mm mU% m* •** mm Mr. for* ladleated ae
vould l i as to gat into a* alee tron aloreseepe dovalojaant, m did
•oa*: ******** m i t . «0 fSssati out that M individual i a Toronto nod
started building oat. Sisee Thoaas vas auita v e i l acquainted vitb
a&aateairi* devices, a* bat ain ft over to too abet at ooaXA find oat about vhat tMs. am* did over i n Pronto.
taat **nt that*, ***• of a****** at ej*vA***t ttom out
about i t , although the .aaouat of mmmm m bad doat on i t gave uo
M O i s * of wAat m eouM «©, so m started. eaaMtaaj
He bad ao o£aar castao* with say other mm of
and ao copies to ** *f» *• * » orierod to build oat
what va oould find i a books of eloatrm develoiaants. Scat's «at
*2**t»a* .sdorooeoio by this
«132-
t l a a , i c e ^ i i g to what w® found In books, but aaa* haft boon aada
e^rc:lalXv aaattew*** w a m i § M i W # wltsa m started.
et&rtacl twdlcilBg this aad got ate; pretty wail.. I ' d say aa had
I t about p $at oaat eaaalatift* t mm% fa some trade mgsaSaa feat
General a**tttaie aaa doing dotalojaaat ®a a laboratory type electron
microscope. I t aaa a hertsaatal type. Ia th* asar futar* I t aaa
to be av&Hahl® aa tba aarhat, so aa fjwt^fatoly waa^iigtf^ General
SSaJMSffesjSLJ ta ^flaa ¾¾¾¾¾*¾ W8> 1¾¾¾¾ 3*¾¾¾¾¾1 ^ SSffl afi S *'' ¾¾®!^ 3^8^^^a "1¾*¾¾!¾ 1¾¾¾¾¾ '¾¾¾¾¾ tSSe
that stage* t -mm, M3m ta ba isforaed tfeo aaaaat t&u thing
m.mm*m
m told 1¾-, Ford abas!; i t , aad. he said, "Gat i t right *aay.tt
t m , w* had to lo t than finiab i t f i r s t . She s w a t i t aaa finished,
they seat i t i a , although the;/ said thsy wouldn't guarantee i t was
going to work Just tlis ^ i t ahouM booaase they ttaaH have aaob
:Wmm%m tiaa an i t . i t aaa j w t buil t , and thay bad tried i t and
got abeam on i t . Shay bad mm iadioaMaaa of what i t looked 3***,
but they eaid fhey wwlfla't psamat^e St.
mmy saat in a 1¾-. Hagaiwu a i m i t to aot i t up and get i t
i a aa«vad**m* Sa worked oa i t for few weeks, i t worked, but you
aaa&fe't got definition m i t .
Ia tba mmmWm, through oar ******** *Hk the m**r* i% of
Mobl^sm, wo beard that WA waa also working oa ®sm that was ready to
be put oa ta* awatavai i t m »afiy for sale. I mm mmmmt Mr.
«433«
^ C a r r o l l mo mm in elMttge of Ma tallursisal «4 the
Ma i f be mm* mmmm mmm **• * t*m
mm -^mm It* bat «eiM»g «e*Sa*tt, I * U tmm mm- wttoUy mmmimA In I* too.
Be obeols*I». «mt m+WaOmmmmm* is . M r ^ t fir., over 1 « » (!»*« ae*fta an autliarity oa this <ana of wark) found that RCA had oca ftaAy for aalo.
Mr. McGorroll brought the isOmmMm mm mm* 1 sen-
en i t . Si said, "ik&iH ym let McCarroU get Me fingers in '0000]¾, i f any, v U l eeas eat tee.9 Be waited to
It wold cost to buy i t . X told M * U$*0©0. &% emM,
% i itao4 « i l bur
SioB«i mm sat mmmm* % mm*t mm u mm m m mm* m i t , tew/lit i t out Out m% i t an <iwa bers,
Oft March &*, 3*«tt» ft?* Hassan .iVosa Ges**rsa Electric com
bere stiS Inaairel about tan fhasb&Ni of this elaatrom ©ieroseese. 'tints
that i t waan»t iwttag att ; and General Electric
i t hse*. Tbey eatd titers use no use spending •
i t . tour st tfee begiBmiog i t woo3Jte*t workj m Hot
satisfy aaju %•!* &m i t to yon* At * a i t a Y of foot, oo mmVm'%
43e-
to got paid f o r i t . I f Mr* for* wants f t , m mm ten i t . *
We returned i t to them, aad they amid they would f ix i t
up and send i t lank Inter on. Xt never did eoae haak.
On October 5, m, we roooiMd the I*CA jaicrosoope. That
in getting that. We bad talked with Mr. ford about i t before. As
X said before* Mr. MoSerreil mm X bad talked about i t , and ho and X
bought the HCA womM be tbe proper tiling to haw since we bad aeon
one at: the University of jmmmm* St was a productiaa aodel whic&
«a §®t i t up i a the newly bui l t derkrocsa at t l
of tbe o r ig iml dano* .ball %M®h mm dowa there* Xt wai
Mr. ion McCutcheoa aaa* out and talked to us about the
he it an expert on tea* type of
going to aat i t m mm. m f o r t h , i a did net i t up eat got i t S»
Ve didn't have anybody ao on
to learn i t ourselves. i&Cxitcteon had a a a who be brought up
•fa****!]?. i@ dlda't l a w how to operate oae either, but be iii
thia type of a a * before ao bo ww working witJa no and Mr*
On HoveB&er 8, Mr. I;!ora oaee i n and raiered bow the
stallation mm going and how ve were getting along. He said, "Who
i s «11 following It upt"
X aaid, "Mr. MeCorroli i s in on i t . We asked Mr. MoCutcheoa,
and another son from the Roug@*:!
He said, "We don't want these follows around here. Keep
the© out of here* Keep MeSarroll out of here completely.'*
X said, "Would you sHad telling Mr, C a r r o l l thntt"
Ie said, "So, 1 want you to do it. 1*
X aaid, 'frankly, X doa't l ike that."
He said, "what i s the aafctavf Are you soared of hlaf *
X said, "Ho, I ' a not seared of M % hut i t pute ae i n a
peculiar situation i f X t e l l hia he cm.'I come in here to work on
this electron aleroeeops. After a l l he was quite instruaental i n
netting it.**
1® said, ? ,I want you to t e l l hla."
I waa i n the corner again. X was supposed to go to MeCarroll
and t e l l hla, Tou can't eons i n here any aore."
Xt was very hasleslly useful to i K a r r a l l i a aetallurgioal
work, auoh aore so than we oould use i t In eleetrieal. We had no use
for i t . As far as the function of the inatruaant i t se l f i s eoaoerned,
•leetronisally we oould use It, hut jRopoaely we had ao use for i t .
X eerefully hroke this thing to Nr. McCarroll which, of
course, built up some resentment i n hia again towards ae, although he
-136-
mmM ten i * * l l s a € that I m not mm ** out off my earn doing*.
I f I ***** «o i t , I tmrnlft * * » *••* i a my@m$ the ***** amy.
JICKej*- ' BHfcfiS' *5*** jj* JP' fifrfe1 1*¾¾!¾¾¾ ¾¾^ *¾!¾ ¾¾¾*¾! ¾****¾"* 0¾¾ a***^*i
a ****lia*> w of tattag M * ***** out oa ****&*. I t hart Mm M
I called Mao. Of course, I kaav weXl, sad ho
ao. I said, "Bow, bete i s the Bitmtioo mm wo ruaaSag into. Mr,
l a said, • ¢ • 1 1 , a n right, i f «*»*** ta* «ay i t i a , va*U
a**/ ***y- ! •** bin* Fine!"
Ha §mmmml to aa**j»***A the situation. Be mmm i t ,
aeja***3»> a* ho staged oasy f*a* i t , aad w® koot oa aorateg oa i t
Mr* f o r i did aot give mo any reason aby MsCarroll
Mtv 9*** **v ho did that* h« **»]«*»* soever you. He had a
Har i t , aad that *** a l l * mWbmm Wm roaooa aaa, ** a o w got t»
«dght ejMStion hie actives oaoo i a a v h i l e . leu atgat
a* you **»*» aot. 3» tide ****>, i & * * ' * ^ s t i o a i t
2 fvlt that the ordar woo aware eoougb. Xf be bad e
bo w**Ma*t giw* ae an answer for i t .
3m* electron saloroooope aaa supposed to be used i a
4******* wm Baary ted. aaaadtal. I t aaa *>» ****** oaJJof that
pa?o*tl§r bad Br . MsOtoe, wj® A M oma here ^uite often to mm m Mmr em, fa«ee*t*** t h i a wi t ter . E « i the m^mmt tbey had, thay aftajtyr covdd not deteiiiioe tbat mm® mymmU w$3X sot dtsaolve
i a tba btaam blood, i t mm mm mmml mMmf tbat mpta
aaH d*aaat*i« MP1* l^ord eJKIaed that they jfe.||Ot; dSaoelw®,
i» had. Of wh3t>i9r bo
i t with mm of the testers o a at tho hospita l , I doa't knew* X
4«af t know »00» i t earn fiwa. if® Jo** «*M» *X»* certain that
crystals do aot eiaaela* im mm h m blood* and that's
s H of tbo trouble X aaa** tov.te bo jp* hla
mm th® aoot oamaios otvattaa* you'll *ph» ejyaetroa was to s e l l a that fpsblsa. Us
going to hova i t up bora i a s w spsee. Xa
to Ao a l i t t l e a a i i o a l laaoaroh.
aa fjot i t oat atta, aad, of ®mm®$ Mr. Ma&aafall «oa * » -
laaaatad l a i t f toa a i^-fcaHuyglcsl e imteoiat . iftSeli was laa iso l*
eoulto't sea tftgr i t should bo out here i f work was to bo doas for tl
ford Beajitaa* $3m that aa olootroa aioroooopi wm^tim a
Xt doss not tali® a trained tecbaiyism to oparata i t .
im aaay. I t i a aaaaaattqr u> mm tush * person t o
-138»
what p t n t l s t t i picture. ••Est *a
i t earns out bare, va aat i t m mm gat i t into
brought over by a lady t^cl-nieian who I aow understand ia tba
topnoteh authority at CaiaaU W w t t ^ . She mm mm and brought
>eefcaens of m» Ummm and G O forth along in gtaaa Jara. Wa
ptetavee of thaa* fhey took tbaai back to tba hospital aad an*
the pictures. Apparently ve couldn't got l i e lafoxaatlen tbey
Ir. W l l n s o contacted aa once. He aemtieaed that
the apeoia@n# over bare w net a satisfactory aatheil,
deteriorate i a a very abort t i a e . fhey should be taken iranediately,
i n order to definitely establish wbat tbey consist of. Be
what the possibilities were i n getting this electros
to the hssts&tal so as to eliMaate the t r toe.
Apparently he bed aaatiaiai i t to Mr. ford before aad got.
a negative answer ao be tried through ae. He didn't t e l l aa that.
X triad i t . I talked to Mr. Faxd* m said, Iftfe, they're Just talk*
Sag o w there* » e y Just don't want to aahe that trip over mm* I t ' s going to stay here. 3bat*» a l l there i a to i t . *
He didn ' t want i t aaar there. Be wasted tbem to bring
m ooulA nee tbe diffioulties of tat Henry ford Hospital,
but, v© kept a* going for a, while. She epeciaama from tbe hospital
kopt oa mmmMm vaek by wok. » a y jaet as*3a**% ink* aay sense
out of i t . » e y Just Mem** oome mm amy more.
Finally 1 approached Mr. Fort again i a another direction.
m said* "MeH, maybe i t vould be a good idea to send i t over there,
but you nan get another one for here." At least we bad tbe omeotlon
solved of getting i t over- tbere.
tit eeat tee Meroeeope ever to tbe hospital my* bad many
'Over Warn* aod tba doctors. .
I ' a s t i l l i n eamtaet vi ta the doctors m r there, particu
l a r l y one doc-tor who i s by personal doctor. I Jtwt asked him roeent-
3y, and 1 ask hia e w y «m«a in a white wben 1 go over there, bow tlte
electron mioroaeope waa eemtag along. Be said, *fia*. i t ' s Just do*
tug a wonderful Job."
fa*, faet that sugar ey»a*a*B do or do aat dissolve iix iaanaa
blood has o m f beam established thus far to ay kaowlaeme. Maybe the
hospital has sow information, X don't base.
^" ¾¾¾¾¾*¾ *feij8JWeVy '8¾!*¾¾!!¾? ¾¾¾!! ^ ¾ ^ ¾ ¾1^ ¾?¾ ¾. 38^^^^^6^6^¾¾^^^¾¾ WSfeS" 38SR 8L £ is>ejto
Mr. Henry Ford asked ae to bring this flying wing over which was stored
i n the hangar building, i t waa designed aad built for Mr. Sdsel Ford
book S» 3933 ** *3*# during the beak 'holiday.
He ha*, th is -am. terry Kareher dssijgR this jgjjaao for Mre-
fcmr asm cm that, tester. aaay I$aeh» AX Eeper end
&usaellj i e w s f t p i l o t , le wee ewppeeet to test f l y i t . J
didn't ee* i t , bat here's tbe story I got. Bnsoell taxied i t down
the raaway i a on attempt m Wm off wham I t started to f i sh ta i l on
him* and bo eet i t dowa. l e mm be woaldoH f ly i t . so thea i t woo
At the time who® i t wm bout* 1 amm*t this* Mr. Ford
anything about i t . I t woe $m% earried on. later on he
it probably throat* i d e a l m mmmm Smew ©boot i t .
In 19¾ he anted ae to bring i t ower here aad set i t wp
dowa i n the room next to tiae asaaaaamm» room ami have a wall pat «
m nobody eould get i a there essept ourselves, ead to attempt to 1
a euobination heliooptar aad etandard airplaae oat o f i t .
1 was going to do the da*i§» work art
cal emaiaear aore or lees. We brought i t over aad
tftem for a while, l e aobad ws to apply the principle oa that em wbioh
he :had a patent. Shot wae to turn the propellara amy from a horiaomtal
pooitioa to a vertical posit ion Atoms from a motor. That part i s a l l
the question we ashed omtaaleas i s how le that
Sag to stay up in the aftyt Supposing m pull i t up In the air by
warfcfaal thrust. We thea haws to shift oar propellers, what i s
to happen unt i l m hate gained enough velocity to get wing l i f t *
That was bwwgbt to Me atteatton. & s ©sly thing I
cooM see out of i t was to out a third propeller oa i t , a tractor
or p i M r propeller which we could start up wails the thrust pro-
p e l t e a ware e t u i @m sad gat a forward motion high enough to gat
wing l i f t . After tbat wing speed i s attained, than lo t tbe other
two propellers down or stop tasje, Be thorn oouM gala aore speed
or .go along a t a aaaaaal. spaed wsaafe is piwiOod by t&@ one pre*
35»t eouaiod a l l rtgi i t . "You go ahead aad do that," Be
said. Be got JJaay f a i t h to design a toa-eyllader sagAae, ttaa-
eppesed. That was i n a f iv«-cyliader area so wa would just take
tbe five and gut two Of them together. We actually b u i l t three of
those to be pot t a th is airplane*
l a the aasotlae we ware a t i l l wary aueh hazy about whether
th is M a g was going to work at a l l . We had a U tbe weight factors
figured* A standard profiler nHajly w i l l aot give you enough thrust
to l i f t tba wel#£fe we had. Saa ear was before tea horse. We get
oag^es but did aot he** aa airplane. We bad th* engine*, but aa did
aot aaa* th* facilities to 31ft feat airplaac o f and get i t l a t a a
horizontal actios.
we investigated standard propellers aad blades, Tba avail
able fig**** wa bad wore ft*e potato thrust par horsapaver, which
it- 5-*.E8acii&taly tiiMx-vvl out developing p ro f i l e r blades
am a seals modal — * thli'ty-filx I H © propeller. Mi bant up tha
aseesasry test dyaamamttar far i t em wbieh ma suspended a dyna
mometer am sables g ^ - i f a y to vhat as did war at the wind twaf l
with tha ear with a p » a a i taha«#ff at the baek mat th* arapaXier
that aawe m twelve pcursiis ttanset per aereepcami i a tha f i rs t medal.
That was time* He could apply that mwtimm a f a l l alee propeller.
«bo f a t t e arose* "mm da we get aba air mat froa above
the wlag va«a the propsliar is np?B With the propeSJar ap ahowe the wing, we wars trying to l i f t ewrsslws by the boat straps. Pressure
weaM be towa m the a*** sot t© Us© aVsamft.
faat i s r o a l % ths thing that bitted the whole program.
We approached him with the problem that we couldn't U f t the airplane
the way i t was. l e amaaaateft cutting s lots i a the wlafe letting the
a i r out. i n s a yom wore up there, yoa woali olsos mba s lots sad ao
ay that f*iwt Madbergb i a the picture j he was aroaad
bare. nr. fort* Nr. tesaott and Mr. Madbor^h oaat down there oaae.
Mr. f o r i , showed Mw t b i i tfjytwn* and t o M him what wo mora eoiag to
iCSa a(a a3S| a Ne j i ¢0¾¾¾¾ Jfiea1 3® S W89F8li3» Jtte 6 ft ^@83a5 a •0¾*!¾¾©¾¾'¾ iaeas Re*3f ff ^ 4SBflf 0¾¾¾^
"Sow do you gst yonr air out froa between the wimgfw
I sa id , "Sam**a the big osammfaa mow.**
In saidj *tteat about the ©pellea4! Caa you git
ttaaat out <nr tte f w j e i i a r t s
1 shewed M i l the fi®*»s a* the
Mr. Bennett Jwped is.. <laa***a ae eruption this oaa he
dome. aa**j ie §# ^^lastl©* **aa* it. I jppy I t tarn be doae. A U you ham to do Is p i t the m^mUmt en. You mn mil jommmt up.*
1 looked a t him. I pretty near bal lad ***** 1 a a M ,
fmm a n of ©w laaaiamtla* that He have gathered here, w ® aay i t
i s i a ^ a a i h l a . " Mr. Ford d ida ' t Wm i t that 1 aaid this. helped out. Ss said, *&*sJJ r X eaa*t ae* hov
to do i t the way i t l a mmmsm mm* Yea eaa. eat i *
t w n » mmm | w » w w «*# » I M W W « fm^fmsam*
Jatt Sm®& ta. haad aat foot heeavaa .he d ida ' t
he mm t^.V^nr about. Sham I amaoBei bagit at M«» he didn't
like it aat *>• Ford «fc*t 1 1 ! ^ it,. About a day later m ca l led aa
aad mm* % f the aa*t tn@ x otan iowa there aad aaae asaa •**»
®mMm 1 aaa»t ***t y*» t » ***** a l i . a w aa**
X a***, % a , i f p » mm p ^ f t&ikiag aaoat, X
aaa** taaav « t t a w y«m*w Bis aattsaa* waat way back ta U3%. Shi®
mi halt p i led up
Mr* Wmm mm* ***» mm mMm «m It* llayoe y o u ' l l
«aft a way o«t»» %*» **** ftr warn* «*y»
Froa ttsgB oa, o f coarse, iMsgs begem t» »30* iowa. we
kept ©a woridLag, but I f e l t t t mm Jtmt * waste Of tJa*, F i aa l ly
ft* mm tMaliiU€ about tmlag tba «fcals wing, out the mmmmim o f I t ooorot «0* X 'Jmm mm m astag awe *ow, i f yarn
bad 00 ^ f j $ * P " * that yoo could design fro® the ground 0$ wtta tbat
airgOaae for It iastsojl o f a*****!*** %hlz tfeiag to i t .
X iaagia* ?agaa2y 000k ta Mr. Part's *Sad he s t i l l carried
this m&mt p lam v i m Sew &ook«. faa second staei was flows
doom to F l o r i d - Brooks oroohod om m hay oat 0*0 aaror foaad* *a*t
aroaa Mr* Ford's heart wUsa away l&fz. Harry aaa now oleaa to blatj
Mr. Ford I l i a d Barty wary ***** Bstsy **• a orlaoe of a fallow.
a ^eSew 185¾¾!! ® 1¾¾ ^l^^^P^^^ 18?¾!¾¾¾¾* ^¾¾* 3P §Pf r k ^e^^^ aSeSe So 0¾¾ S*a pB* s>
^ Sl a a e ^ ^ ^ - aj e' Sa ^ ^ ^ J S B ^ ^ ^^^^aw a s@f6E3t a* KSHftfe tfipSa; ^**¾¾¾¾¾¾¾-* SKSJS 'f f* fp ia §P
o f foot, lie to ld as, % i o o % mmmt mm oaa f i r - " awaa i f aa had to go ©at of team, wo eouMa*t toko aa airplane, ft* hat to tea* a t ra in or a oar. Ba f«fta#e owarya@% to f l y .
Htm© 1 ww tax mmt at the 1¾* Myars
earn i s sat day. 2 valla* out the 4e» vita Mm. Just as we watted
eat the door s we ussr a ipXaafi ©OBlig cm? haw 1¾¾ the m&mmm ted tfiaotian. * mm wmMm* «>• I * * n I *w#e* what*®
the aatter with Mas0
1 said, feyh® «**• waning rush."
Is said, "m, that muOm U too mm*n Wm plam mm closer, tad HasUy ve ««wXd see tt» Mm flying eat at the side. Is
mm ® w to tba airport ttai eat down* & souiaa't
went up $& nmm* M m mm down, X could mm the d@@r open, x ©o»M
see Carl Wesae! who mm m airplane mcbaaic otar t&ars, cad tbe pUot
2aA SeUar. ion®®! ma etaaftiaf, In tba te, Apparent he didn't
a par^Mta v l t l i kfta* at thay gat ft d«w% tte. brefces swst have
mutt up l a flaate* .Mr. Ford stood
rigut fUtro sad ««9 i t . le at**, *rs***a m. oad off airplanes,"
W tbe. tte that f ouT-esgi^ ship we® tmr tfcsre that
ISM jant hnUt with torn WAmm engines m i t . A mm. later that
wa® stit 1.¾?* IS® airplane lensiaeas vent down pretty fast
ttay eaaiaVt drey It tesdial^y e*aaa» there ww
m m mm0®*mm» ehip ft*
this fSylag wing that Bdsel *w4
& spark l a the btgffiolig t© get bosk bo tbe airplae© business. X
bmov tlaaa aaa a lot of isgitfiy fras the oatetas so to may Ford Motor
» spark 4» Msa to -got beak H*o aoootbist tbst aaa aaa* mmmm m
planned bo bmild these pleas* or steat ho waited to to with i t . 1 #®a»t
mm* m Jtn* asatad to aammmyt that one into * hol^ooobor*
After ao gs*e oo too vork oft tho helicopter, 1 got late tha
general m%iYl%&&& m hat xtgfft along l a the Hoetrisol 1«%, fowwn
* ®¾¾ ' ^ 4^^96¾ ;^WSMJ •flf'fe^ef^B^^^ft^^Jf* '"9 ^ a ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ¢^¾¾¾¾^^ ^¾©¾¾¾¾¾¾ ^^(Sp^feo)- jSfn- JP' P S s] ''
bad to follow feet Wmmm all the may dom the l ias , «vaa as far as
system* fa* agaMa* aysbam asm 0r%iaally dssip»ed for twelve volts
and raeelaot aa tmmX Sot of yaslabamat aadar amlm salts.
% also kept oa fain*. aaJiias farther dowolaBmaats em mm
l a 15¾¾» t r ior to the »39 aadsls tbe fan wse eomaeoted directly to
the zmtiimmft. the «»***amjamr was show the fan ami aaa accessible/
yam ooald mm at i t . l a *kk Hay started oat mewing tbe faa ap, abieli
also maaat mrnim It back .in order to mat fadtator olaaraase* I t
r e q u i r e d a redesign of that distributor.
8r, Soreness caae out sad t o l d us what to do« Be said,
"S» tm location i s going t o oa ao get t o e iaforaation aad .fit the d i s t r i b u t o r i n t o the aasistiag p l o o o . It has to he i a there.*
Ve started making layouts, Of course* we c o u l d n ' t see how
we o o o M s o t eaoufjb clearame or a i r d la teanea b s t o a s a the electrodes
to era© in our ««11 spaee.
a w j y t t d a g i s buil t around it.'**
l a this case soaethiiig e l a a came f i r s t s and the distributor
had to he f i t into i t . We showed the layout to S h e l d r l c k aad Sorensen.
I told them wo dida't f e e l the thing was going t o work because of i t s
eoaflnod gptee and a p o a a l h l l i t B r o f » i« twro . We c o u l d n ' t seel i t aay
more. I t was an u t t e r l y different design hut for the same location.
Be said, " W e l l , you tot up wotsiy about t h a t . "
O f oourse, I f a i t the P » « « T O was on to get t h a t distributor
off the f r o n t and put i t up o a top l ike a conventional distributor.
3a*t s teed* teeasen said, "Jou l e t us worry about i t . We'll
take care o f t b a t a a a l « * I know t h a t distributor was m the way o u t .
Tbe design was cosseted. We did tho best we e o u l d with i t .
Wa went Into production oa i t aad, of course, ©sporienoed trouble with
soistur© » 4 distance o f tesaalcjg.
Mr. ford alwsye told me, 'She distributor f i r s t .
1 that was the buiMup towards pressure t o mow i t
-1½-
off the tmmU- Mr. f o r * a*a**t am** St off tbe fwatg be wantsd
i t o* mwm*
X saw tbo * * » had ooao that southing bad to be dome
%»a*;tfw x wasn't going to tote tbo bioae for a l l o f this thing, x
«ot * U t i l e tired of i t by tbot time. I thought the tiae bom eoas
'save to a m i i t i a smWm iwmmtm, so we and* up
with aietrilarto** 3a fyoat» up isaTfcfnal* **# th*
O H * vas the thing Mr. Fori ttte't like, ao gear driws on
t h * aafttrf***** I ^ r t ^ l e s s 1 i t gMOf doom tfcare
along on this thing.
frrgy»4.a4 avid they t>jd * scafcras t f «r
but mm «o**4 not attest tats e*a««B**a*f
X told $*e» we hod ff*?wy preliminaries
log* «n& would bo glad to pm it to H»s i f they a W t t e l l
that i t mm f r o * a* ***** Stay t*** i t and applied i t
That's tke way they ooM thai* Govsrs^nt vehicles, they wouldn't
hove mIM asy over that* without this ta** of mounting. Us- eould%*t
s e l l any mm* l a a*att** to tbs*, a* hat trouble vith tba Joey
contract due to distributor location X
uolly we had to got i t off tho front*
-1U9-
X couldn't eoae straight out with, i t ,
mm mm m shocking the
out
aoem and with carried on. aa only had about s i x 9000!»
srylag to aoof - Of*
Xa aoout A ^ a t , i ^ l > wo got Into the
mijliae ^ob hero Mr. Uric^lisr and Mr
Mr. Jar i , woo with- tba®* S o y aanau us. i f wo could
l a sort o f a sosssulti^
OS the electrical end of l t # fea
Ibsy did aot hawo tost o^pd^paaat
jtgy ia, They weatod us to help tfea* Ttlrng i a
i get thorn aorlag. wo did that.
Us kept l a contact with tba
with
am had to 00
. It
Just a
test, f a c i l i t y f o r tiam mm ataaaoea in a oontn^tlag eapaeity.
In jeajatt, Mr. Sereaeea mm ft* mm mm at wanted
a l a r g e a l t i t u d e obaaher far V i l l o w ana i n wMeb the t a a j e r e t e v *
could be cbaaged mmmmmmmW *** .paaatfa. X t had t o fane*
tiaa fms ground l a v a i wy t o &D,000 taat. 9 a * was far eou ipaea t
Of course, t i l l s vat an aaall p«^ea. Be get aaat i n -
t i a e ve g a t the re aaja*t anyone who hat t r i a d t o change taajMHatsx*
eaA p r e s su re ummmmm^f* Wmmmm or teayarataza earn he changed
r e a d i l y , hat to do that 9$m%mmms0& i a oayoM alaaiarA r e f r i g e r a
t i o n . Change o f pwwaw without t a a a t r a t a » change i a just an
e n M t t a of fee c o n t a i n e r , but to ehango t h s t e a e i i ^ t a a e o u s l y
iJPfiftS? a^^^aa^^^|aaa$'jf 1¾¾¾¾¾? aslSMStfe ¾¾¾¾¾ ^ ¾¾¾ P§R G I S4Me> *8i] ©$3 !eaetta ^^a*a»^^S I8^§3fi0%ejtta
t o n haw a o aeons of t r a n s a i t t m s : aaat froa a c o l d tody to a hot body
At 60,000 feat tbe eta»apharic y r a a w e i a 8.1 inches o f
aereiay, w h i l e i t is 29.92 a t mm l e v e l . lorn earn realise «h*t l i t t l e
a i r yon have i a a coatainer aad what MttSo yon mm to t r a n s f e r beat
i a . that i n t e r a s t e d aa wary ww*. Tbat aaa s o a e t h i a g wo c o u l d g e t
our teeth i n t o .
First o f a m wo got-aat of Boh Gregory'a .asm mm mm Mm
»151-
* sketch o f ¥$mf? wo ttaujgjat ta* tMsg would lods. li&», • tfr wg
f»*» May/% X siippaso* Ue gs»s I t t o a** to a»M m ar t is t 's drawlag
of i t a* wo would haw* Bowatliiag im talk about, aad whet wo wore
going to put where* and to summit to Mr, Sor*aaea for Me approval.
X told bin we hut the ci-ustefc ready aad to stop by. So
®*M, •a**** floe.* l a okayed i t . X s t i l l bam the atetob l a ay
offlee. Be satd, "I*t»e go, lat»« build i t ***** quick. Aa far aa
a*** to mmmm&, mmmmmi I t oostt*
X eaid, "At laaot $125,000." Be said, "Okay, $125,000. Let's go. We'U eaarga i t to
the VtUe* tat project.*
He start** t© mm* * * fa**** a **** or ier so eould keep tract of
ear H a * whlak wa apsst, so later om aa could mmm ** *»
Willosr Bum project. Ms got «*** moving aad pat aaa or two aaa oa It
off aad om. We just Juaped from om Job to another as you can realise
with :0aaTt*** or flfteoa Job* iawyao Mr* Ford*® projects which ba
aamtoi *SX ta* tn». » 0 0 ® bad to be ***** r i g h t <£*i«k.
Jayway we ga* t h i s thing going. We ^ftn^w^i refrigerotiea
^SBBW"9K^ S* SSBs a- 8 08¾¾** •So sSIJf'' 8n*s2i* fllfimjai^aj e** (jj ~ ?£)$a St s% <w5' 84¾¾ ¾ **SJ*J ^ ^ ^ 3BH ^Se5 ssw
with f t . Shay saM it Just a * * W t ba done, to got seventy below
sero at 60,000 foot with 2.1 mmm of aaroury. ®a> refrigsr&tico
wowM be terrific- They n i l were J&aptic&l about i t .
At teat mm? a W t ao oat and want tbe #8» beeawaa war iolori t iea
bad already ©ema la, aad tbey mm loaded vitb other work.
a W a oaro whetta* or not they would got thie ooatiaet for
got the Iocs! representative out a
his a a s w .ia to am iaaaft*r ao to
i t .
Kb said, "Wall, oar people arm mot interested .la i t , aad
X #aa#t talk thea lat© i t . fersossiay X*d HSa» to do i t , to gat iato
i t aad eoo what aa eaa do far aaa, bat our Boot®* *m fork are mot
J said, '^tould i t to amy good i f 1 go dowa bo fork vitb
Me satd, *x% mm. you* d haws to go *lgbb ma to the
X asAA, " A l l right* let's go aad do it*
taVm go aat to
we wemt ck>va thora* Ia the maaatiao 1 bat
fwfdfimematiem osoaeitar X »3M»«*ti». am «jw»ta i
to be aa expert oa rafrissretiaa, bat by tm^fim
-153-
•> I had m idea 1st ay sdnd *****
a 60,000 feet altitude.
aat mm mm first,
ia tfeu thing. Of aours^ h* aaa
I** Wm
i t **t m m m
F t e U y i t boi lod mm to p t t t o 3
1 aaid, "Caa we aaa* aa a^folataant with
to t a l k mm blau"
%a got graatot. m oat doaa with
told him viiat tat waatod to do* toat i t was aaaa atteiptsod before. St would c-erbaiiily ta a laathar is York's
bat. we aislalaed. i f the* woald furnish tbe
Va wm gotag to take care of the oantrcds a
give ao the refrigerating aquipraent and evaporator coils to oat into aa mm Ja*»
mm around aad aaid, • * » right, ***11 do it."
l a ttaa't do tMr, aeooriias to ay fit***** 10 wont baoh
mum m$$m®m weren't quite sure ©f i t at
i t ioald mm a long study bat
had they oaa* oat with eaaftt****** tons, i t ae**** ao i f I woe .law
o j p p n i s mmm oat ttopsogb ttaaw vacuum s ^ s . I t I t get® to contact v i th o i l 1« tint paap, put here an expiosimi. 1» changed
taw a i l to triHg«»©jf©l sloomel aa roeiiaawied by Mr* MsCloaa,
ttaa txiroae. out to be quite a development m we want
alms, Zt teak quite a wM3m a» 'build i t . «e » a a i a y bad ths
lower teak brought & tha ang l^ r ing BniMlag aad f a t en a l l o f
th® mttagi aad M m t s f a m of *Mna vara disigaad ami mate
mm. to tttflaiamal Uneo lew t i a ^ f a t a M out low pressures ant wJtiob
ware unavailable eosa^rci&lly. l e f i t ted i t el l ap bare, wired i t
up with ©host aowam n*iaa of vtea, sbiwed the wbole thing out to
VJUav Baa, eat i t i a place, built, i t ap aad tooted i t .
m 3tarte-d that job 4» jbrnnast, 19--2. Oa Jaauary i S # VM
the alt i tude ehaabar woo aaaittrtad. I t wag pretty fast work mmmmm*
lag wbat wo bad to deaiga aad b«tM. I t wao a terrific undertaking.
OB ag-rll 28, 19^A wo nude the f i rs t teat won and want ap t o faet without eooliag. Zaat'o jeat eaMamt teaaeratea to
eoi tbat aattytlalag waa •Mgfrh and whether ma* bad any leakages? waethar
tha <mmm& paape msuli .tarry the load* m& %@w i n t . wa oooM go aa.
» e goal wo oot far ourselves mm to ge froa growad lawal to 60,000
omsty.
First wo M a t for M r tlgMehiag of the obaabar to @@e tbat
m « M R * % mm- nay mtmml I t i e p ttamgh ta*e aartla*1aa> t a m e *
t @ m » ^ ^ r . o a * «a* *m t i g ! * .
L a t e r en m aeon a n o t t e r t e a t . Xdadbergh becaee i n t e r e s t e d
then. Of aaaa*, be wee .im 4tw picvore r i g h t along. M l during the
ttaa of thin aeyclopaerit wo*% on t i iU a l t i tude ehoabar Mr. Ford v a a a H
on® b i t s^torastat im i t . le didn't e m tm i t at a l l .
1 » mm t o ae at, Hit outlet at the a w woUt. aad r i g h t a f t e r
Hr. Br iber asked ae to get tea* to help w i t h too a i i m a f t p i a n o . M r .
Ford said, ! ,Hov; yon don't mm t a A© aay of this kind o f wosfc i f you
don't wont to. xt a l l depend* bow yon. fool. Xf yon aaat t o do i t ,
« 1 night* Xf y«a don't vav* to do i t , yon # » * t I m to do i t * tom'tt
a* a u mm*m
X said, "I aaat to 4» it. X foal i t ia ay Job, a l t h o u g h X
have relatives ow there, ms im the coun t ry that if*** m ay hoae
ao I 'm do it." l e a n H Satajaataft in « 1 ejftttatt eboiaar work a t a l l .
* i a p i r t d about i t aaat l a & a k U a , l e t ' s i t going!* a&t mm a U *
0« 4afi3L 2 B , j o k k we ntte tba f i r s t taat m i a t o 60,000
foot ••num. eeoling. m bad aaa* aore iastallatiori o f i n s u l a t i o n ,
iw»f aoro install&tlcin of inntsvaoiBtation to do mA- ao forth, aad put
the ttaftattax t®«nh*e on t a m% the rifrigeratieB. portion tend? t o r u n
a teat along with mi^mm$m*
Madhog^i. mm a w mm mmmm p i g . m volunteered to go
feu m only bad oaa oayssn ipstois la operation. :rher« aore two*
otto Hia for «tea§*by ** *»**• would m wmm* m eoaM
awlteb from ©no to the other v*1**Yjt effeet to tbo individual in
tho ohaafcer*
St wanted to go 1¾¾. 1 to ld fafet no only bad oaa oxygen
system ia there, m mMt *%b*t'a a n rt#sfc. Ym*U bo a t tha coa-
t*a&** and 2*11 just g £ » you a sign. I*a aot solas to taUi t^rouali
tbo feaaaaom eystea. 1*11 Just git® you ®$&m, I f I go l ike 1¾!®,
X want to hoop on goJag. i f I go l H a mm, X weat to atop, i f X
fold up or bloak oat*, l o t m# d o n as fast ao you oaa**
m mmm »*# ^ vo »«§«- n» f i rs t a n with Mr.
Li^Otesh i n the oboabor. Ha MA aot mm oooMag on, but Dr. Clark
w a l a the a i r lank. X aaa a t the oontroSB.
feat a admits up to 4Y,OQO feet tie f i r s t tiae. Be toat .Has this aad
just blaeaod eat* mm m b iaete i eat* m d«f§pem hia m 35,000 feet,
mm itfet Mm- aaa***** and ho wasted m .90 hook up oaoo aaae.
i s aaat up * sooottd time, aat ha toat up to h?,wc> laot aad mmm out*
m drafted Ma to to,OGO feet whoa ho came to. l a used tha
lafeerewi system and wanted to a* dropped oa fast aa ho cauld to ground
Jaaai, She ****•» aaaaaat m m»m simulate « s i f *@® 200% a vaamte.
#
Wm m got §mm to ag,0» foot, h® took his oay#ea maats
off aa& tftaaar i t oatolia* He ins fSjeHiotiy a l l right after that.
w*w>*m*m mmmmM®*%m* m: mmmt m mm mm mmm* mm*mi*mwm* **** m ^^m^m, m mm^^mmmmm immm. Im ¾¾¾ ( { i i a t e a t gffwtf. X o w l . lajmj as 'fftt-lff1* out o f toa
olaaiaa?, its **a*'t look any aaras tat 1 look r i # i t aaa. He aaa
rea l ly « s 3 J ^ M a l t * the operation e w ttotga «a «Mat*t haw amy
cooliag a* i t yat .
fjw f i r s t cooling t ta ta ram i a f u n c t i o n vith pressure
^mmmwm oaaarraft am Wmm 6, 19-½* At that tin* aa ram a taat i a *
@m$m mmm* X» ®m ©hsiiw? vara Mr. WmmAm aaa aa® eMef taat
pilot, t r . 01»*%, M N Cooper, tt» aaoiataat to Br* Clark, ami aysatf.
a* aaat to 39,000 fast «af imaas mmmt&* (mm plant aaa
s a m g i i -aa m oaatA **t OOIPW%> a*3av mm a t 35,300 f as t . Tfeat
mmmgmm to tint Bar®*** of S t a a t a i a our** v a M i a a * later i t s p m a a *
«® hwv* la*** to ipe ia teas th** that, oat mm wm m* Wmmm of St*a»
~ ^ * * % n ^ l * * % _^^^^l^?i^^:0. J | **Jfc ^^1^81¾)¾^¾' ^P^ts ^¾!¾*^*^ |@ma a a § wa 8 ***¾¾ ¾¾ !¾¾¾¾¾¾¾!?¾ fiflBP -¾ a a ^ S *
1 aotic«d my ssteroph^ aaa fiaaJi * * aaa aa mmmmmm t a m mm, Mmm t t aaa mmm * * Mmm* m& x •**!**>** osiaaati^M
*m aayoaa a p a i *
A l i t t l e l a t e r tba ooaasoMom haMam aat a o a M suit, tfattsar*
ami the Jsotat, osp&rsted. x l o o t #1®% aad I t soparated. Of oourt*,
X aaj&£e*t talk t@ *®X4*i*t
l Itt # eWa?* Oa* faces «aj®* * M t
ska aad tiKi f®|§»M 4ttaeH cover i t .
I l l efl^cts at a i l . Svsrsrtiiisg ea*
Ss i s s t i l l Xar, Clark was tiie ISiaat
¥ i u w im* that m$ m* at
Ha
gs# a**fc * » I M . * * m$tm mm tm ®m mm
that mm to ||p* ftajft* ant to ae**** Interested ia that at al l . At
a aattaif «f ga i t , ft® anja*t istai«a«g»t | » tt* S a i l altitude
aat awtajt bwittf j^ijy ®11 the aay
teaajmatt*
a l l y or oae or the ott o , i t i t
Xt aaa a
-160-
with sixty-four Uttls finger switches mmm&* Al l
mmHA #e waa aft tfeta amltea, and i te t ewlbeh ami. |
^ haw giatasaa aff toe wlsoie thing.
< a l^aw^a a^e^^a^O^SeS? 5Jfc3i ae5Wci ^88¾^^ ^ g^g flNe m\$^ 3h ¾¾¾¾¾¾¾ ^®¾®¾
vith the engine and to find oat what the
Shay l a d ooanlaSat® hook hat newer get
mm aaa igaitioft treafcia, ©at
^Sfe^ ¢0¾¾¾¾¾¾'¾ J ^ f i S ^ S ^ k Jj0 -e5oa$e* €^^88^^¾%¾^'' ^¾¾^¾¾^ ¾¾¾¾1¾ *¾ e Ba* ajB 8fi a ejr
^ea ayabw aaa a^aMe^ M i For*
ifotor did aaa to put tats ignition syotaa oa tale engine, we
didn't -mm tae ignition aptaa. I t waa a
X went down thesa aad eat inoutMs
fimaHowtr. Of
tola and f t a t t aad mutaty, I t o l d t t e r ight a t the outset o f tt
aeetiag that 1 waa ^^Tft^ily green, oa that ¥Hfaig wyj that 1 Joat
od to M o t e * I aafead than I f they wouM alad i f 1 Just eat
Colonel Booty saift, "aa*!! aoh yarn later what you
It .* '
tiny had* It ao
Mmv tbo wmmm *m mm Coloaai ®m*w mmM m, *9mX
tm% mm haw® ym got to sort 8 Colossi Robay was a topaotch wagiaoer
and dot® to a**1tu
*I3* t » 00k so i f yam mm mm Wt®mmmm of mt^ria l that this head
is ** m mm off*
He said, •*** «a l w «« i t ifotlis, X yaderetaajd aaaao*-
aeat mm% you dowa to f$ad out how ford Motor Goapoay oaa bala ao out*
low long M M * 700 00* 0m m m wmm of who*, yea torn do f»* uo?"
1 said, "Saa*** rathas" aaos^ootod to m mm* Vll do i t
m mm m x mm* mm two a*** to too- Soa^f*
i t ) t a* wmm to **d mat 9** mm do**
aastobo* 0*- tfa© tied* aad did * li t t t e fliprJojf 0* too thiag« VO
X tfasaakt amis tha mt&mtm siastlo VKUAA- watlE i a to thda thins-
She f irs t thing X d im' t ear* mo* **o*t ova **** they taUsad
1 mm% back sua, got my ism Baffa** a®& ham Aim start ley-
out aaifc* 8* aaaa* t spit® §ati@fSa& *&i& tbe else ami <*|.jtt,wH: lihat
X taa4# "ife 0 » » * % b M i yarn*** #at to give mm aaastRtag
.qpmis so they o«® ; p * i t i n * * p o t e s t ***** ^ * y ***•% * * t t for a
ar« aalt. I#t»® t ry amA ta»e®o» the aiuta**) a® mmaa aa »©**Jsta**
lawar^aXaaa ba aaat aloag vmn md l a t a I t oat. We out
tba mmmmm of the oltos^atai down, g«9§a aa »aicn tfaoa ao aa oouti
.oat tetooM to moo a *a*«s** ***u***t,
vfe baft a soft a o M aada team a t ta t tatgo aaal rooa Sa ta©
days a** baA soma f loats s a l ^ a i n <&** ***» . tit brougat the* out
boro O O R mzhii&a mmm* Xm t&e *****JB*>, aa b u i l t a l i t t l e alti tude
M ^ ^ x w y i n wa oomM p i t ^teso tfefwgp tost •jhta out here,
•mis olaaiar aaa taaa%»fo«r iaobso i a t lsaatar aaft forty tastes losg,
soft aas **ttt ta teas *a£ thwe ******* xt aaa rowad-tiia-cloGk
m r k prootioal ly . Xt ta s t i l l mm ta the S loetrtaal l a b .
w* baft m a******* ciiaater «***»• lie bat Wm ftae** there,
distributors in this altitude c&aatoer under reified
before we*d gat Wm flashing-own? w& burning.
Is tried f i r s t * bat* rubber bead, One would go to 6,000
foot) oae woalft go to 2,000 foots the otter oae weald go to 12,000
fact, ®*ey «*f@ emtio* torn. eould»« t depend ia*®* the© definitely.
we tried the soybean conpound. The sojteaa oeaneuai would
go m ta 3$,mm font, but than i t mm. aaeetajM, Instead of horaiag
We wore vowisricg what else we could urn. I finally thought
i*t tea* Xf we ground up mm. mm mm oeabiaad. i t with
phrenolie resin f we could see what that would do.. We did that. He
aolded oae hea&i we j e t had OKMgh material to aake oat head, we
brought that dowa aad mehincd i t . I t was hard to aaebias, and to ha-
gin with i t waa hard to aold. Aay wood pulp Materiel will eoabiat with fhrenoMo resin, hat the aioo «111 not, ao you mm to head i t .
We aoMed this one, aaoMaed i t aad. fat i t l a the teat
Xt want m to «5,009 feet, we contacted the Monsaato CfcaadcaJ
.sad wondered what they had l a tnsofctsig resistant tsaterinl that would
st i l l aetfatata a high dielectric strength, fte two go i n the opposite
i n aaother. To hring the two together waa difficult.
-164-
Sfsassate sohaitted seme nateriale. «e molded eaa* oat of
tat* material* We either oat traokiag or dieloctric faiiuree. we
told MMraaats about mm mim**tmmA aatsrial. fbsy said, *6feU, we have seaetblag like that, oat it's bard to mold."
I eaid, "amU, brlns i t oat» 8®fil try to moM i t , *
Mr. MsOowaa dowa a t the Flaatics Lab mas weiy iw>lpful oa tills. He did a weaftarfal Job working witb aa, aad ao old tbe boye
dowa at the tool room ia making these molds, i t was marwelaas ths
way thay got this material m*
be molded some of this »oaaaat@ material, tasted thea,
sad tbey reached be,000 last. We had a dosen of thea made ay to
determine the ooasiobeaey bo spowe wo would get bt,0Q0 aright along.
mx, every ems was Manama* for%-twm, famiaMivas — forty-one,
£©rty*»two, forty • three j there was always that range*
fhey wottlA are owor i t at that c©ili«g, bat the aamsat yea droafod ia altitucie or imeraafed ths pressure, i t woaM fanctloa
agaia. Seat was tbe H a l t of that diameter aad tbe arc-over distances,
we. couldn't do .amy better than that with tbe pmaH siae.
X eaUod &&amL R&tm? east mM we had some a******* norm.
Be said, "Bring them right dowa." 1 flaw dowa sad. gave thea to him.
le said thay would put team in a 3-26.
I said, "aTett, yaw 8*@6 ioseo't go high ememgh.* Be said. "Hon aaam th is head will briam ma as Maher
» i*al «m got*1
i tela* *»*», by about »»oo§ ***%.*
Be Mid, "Brother, i f you a w do that, you «121 m%
ia-
day Mr. Seraaasa «M«d aat said* "Vhat da you
bright Field ** Hatse distributors?" Of eeara% at kept
aad ee did Mr. Briefer right aloag. fhey followed it
m said, "tfcil f f t l than.*
1 sa i led CaaaaoX Bobey, mA m aaid* "I wee just
c a l l yea. Bow soon oaa you give uo 8,000 a day?*
1 ***** *Jot tagf* aaay. aa only bare a siaglo <avi% wm*
m w i l l bo la**y i f i t ataado up booaaaa it l a aot hardoaod yeti it**
a t i i l soft, m oaa p^obehly gat a hxmared a day, bat wo earn start
out aattag a*u>ti*oa*alsr aaUte. aat aat our Moli lag Oaaartaaat up to
go. 1 would roughly say wttbla three wees* we oaa giwo yea 2,00© a
day* Xa tho laaatia** we ' l l aaas ao aaay of t i e soft aolao as wo oaa.*
10 kept oa going aat we «*** then l*tooea alaoty aad a hundred
a day. Within three weeks* wo *are toady to go iato production to 8,000
a day. that solved tho p***l**v
Tney t m g h t all tlis old heads back. Mind 70» aew,
tbere waa a war on. wa bad 15,000 airplanes sitting oa tba ground
because of that ea» l i t t l e dlatrfbwtor. libera me a 40b to do, aad
I t vas dene; ****** a l l there waa to i t .
At «** mm t la t , as 000a aa we got thraggh with tela, wa
ware eeatasted by Allieon, ta develop a distributer far thea far the
AlUaoa attgine, using tba aaat principle, i t waa a different size
mm a dtfJaraat mmmmmm m% mm mm» w^m^^ m m mm ms,
Pe¥, m m mm distributors for Alliaon.
Allison was having trouble with altitude, fhey awldnH
get ay very high beeaase of their distributor. Tbat was their
Oaoe aa got a ca l l frmi aepnblio Aircraft. fhey bad Just
bad a crash that aomlng wilii .a F*k7. 2bey we*» building pJb?»s
dowa there, may thought i t was ignition failure, m a aas mm of
mm mm heado. 1 Mated to go down right away to Had oat aat see
i t ,
X mm oat to Wilier mm ma& eaUad Seaming to f ly us
dowa to Sew York, Wo took a tbat tbey bad oat there. One of
mm t*ntmt*m>%<® fmA to ae aionn* naturally. % flaw down to Bestiblle
aad Xoelsad tfcf* thing over* I t was not am ignition failure and i t
vas not a f a i l u ^ i n the distribut&r bead) I t waa a cable failure.
Here was eaother profeim tbat eoafroated aa. It waa the
aaln cable which want gfea* tba distr ibutor be tbe aagasta. Tbat
had punctured. That cable «a@ la through sort of a hard robber alee™.
«a*a*** the hard robber a«aS»*
Wa wggeatai that they mm mm aleeros aat of this aaa
aaterlal aad mead soma of those alaovos oat to Vrtgat Field, tbat
did aaay with that trouble,
At tim tail. «md <rf ms d^lo^ent, Ui bergh got iaaa
this thing* Be cane mmm mmm* Be ***** *i bare aoaa inform-
tioa from ttrlgat Field. Wouldn't i t ba good to do further d*welop-
aoat worn to ga higher «»** 10,000 mm would i t I® amy good i f
X»A got ao airplane aad w®»4 run soae teste out bora at wUXow tout®
X said, "ghat would be f laa.*
Lindbergh want to WaaMxtgton and got. a brand-stew airnlaao.
Xt wo* m f«4f. Be brought I t out bora, m& wo i M a « test
worn .out bora.
Be didn't want to put both of tbe new head* oa this tela
ignit ion* tm haw* aaa• mtm% aagaoto and two oiatrlbatoro* ********
want to go up with both mew ones aad bo e***H want togouj? with
both e ld one*, is said, «Qae new om* aad on* old oa*. VJhicbensr oa*
conks out, I earn st i l l ****** to to* other on*. X can let along oa
one, for m wkCb* at least , to laa§* t t
Be took off mm got up «• 38,000 foot whom tbe standard oa*
gar* out* Of course, you can't run wary long with a single distributor
mm mm mm, and be aaat up to t OO© feet, so said as aomU
of shst fSJgfeea m
Oa mm mm mm. fSJgfet abate as vent np to k%WO feet,
so go Mgbar* tried to keep tae sanerobarger cool
i a m& boob Of fum gji, Up*, m mm tiweogb Jast l a tlaa aa
just fraa a etaatav ia tea
ay tae tiae be bad com $m*
m as wore sailed by wMgbt F t e M bo ass is t
testing a <SB ignition systea that tbey bad
alto^jtiter different f roa tfe© ^icti l la system* General Electric
bad oawaloped a systaa mmm they bad the aagatto sad •
taomeaait* fbey bad that wait doaigaai aaa
Itted i t to wrlgbt field for testtag. Shay bad ebeokod i t <
>. fbey «4a*t t e l l ue M resuite tbey feaad* nay just
us to obeeb i t aad give them
-159-
*h*t mmtrnm ae of eaother am of Mr. ferd«* peculiarities.
X Horn aittetag tit tho e o M m taJd* with four Ckmerol Electric
engineers taltos about thia 12Mae> Mr« Fori eaas t& throu# the
center door ana saw us over there. The eeafereaoe table me right In 1*0 addde s f i t M g space ower tbore.
Be walked tmnrrrt the mmimmm table. 1 said h»*n*» to
bH*. Be aaid, *Hb» .ere the®* mmmmmmt* I introduced hjhm to thea.
Ho aaid, *8h»t ore 9 0 « talleSag obeatf"
2 said, "11**1® telkl&g about this iguiiioa sysiaei far the
t * U you hoir to do it.**
feaadad, of course, aad so was 2.
Of course, tho faeliag l a the eoamiet&ea ebaagad a a l t ,
particularly since I criticized sea* of their deaigas. She wait
aaa aot tooted yet mmm* « course, 1 iaexad at the diaaeter aad bad
baeh l a ay amad tho dlaaatar which ve started oat with ea mm Scintilla
system. Siis ia*a«t- amy bigger tbaa a Soiatills; i f anything i t aaa a
little aaallor.
m tatted It aad fouod tba eoOlag was )6,000 feet aad ao .aore. Qeuerel Hootrio ©laiaot i t would go 90,000 feet.
lia tried i t mmmSL Warn®, aad wo could aajaat 35,000 or
36,000 feet. Ve eest the reports to Wright f i e l d , fbsy sailed UB
dowa there, i t had » meeting « « 1 Oaneval aaetrte 4¾¾¾ there* and
General Kleetrle e«4d# Tee can't aaderstaist tis&t thie aosanH go
a^r hi#*sw than 36»00O fast*"
Colonel Sobey eald, "Well, that's th© sane thing as we're
getting here. that's a l l we got 35#O00 or 36,000 feet, there*•
proof that the Job isn ' t right* What weald pour recommendation be,
Mr. moariala* to brtag this thing up to at least- «5*009 faetf"
I said* "An i n e r t i a i s dJj«eter, separation of the elec
trodes, get more sro*ovor distance and the nee of a aoa*barsiag mater*
i a l . n fhoy again had hard rubber i n this unit.
General Electric said, "We ean't mold the staff, «ould yon
mold i t for us?"
I said, f,l don't maov. 1*11 have to oaatast my samamnmmsxt*"
S e y aoid, "As as tiio dSJwtter i s eonoeraed, ve feel
this l a right."
Bebey said, "well, what mare do you want. You've -got the
proof here and you've got the proof there. Tbey are two independent
teste. Both of them torn out the M O O . WO want as large a diameter."
Of coarse, that built up the feelings setae more. Ve wanted
aa Ijisrease of £voa six to eight lasbsa in diameter, fbey had already
i n the a w t e toolad up for the sis inch diameter unit.
Of emmrwe, i t was dlfflealt to eoowtrt them ower to a new
-171-
a T%TW& s ox
at***
X laat. X a** «Ha» to
«§# is at**!**** X vrat© thaa &
itaetfto to to eight
t t mid « 4
trie took
at i te ta . i t took mm *,
to otoaafa ®3JL tteir tooio* with tiia o M Selatilte-'^pe
it
i a aat said, "fcVj
ta
la their six iach
ftatillar thay aaat ttmix mm
iiW5ts.3JUtii3i
a» «»»*» i s a@v at Wright fioM*
se, *m» oat
at willow Hun.
Mr* yard mm oaAt* interested & tMts ignition dsvslop-
« H H t w>oa>aa* lie followed ejhat nJinM very closely. Hs liumired
about i t every day «»1 wanted to know bow we ware oondag aad what
Wm taaaUa won*, m mxmA -as to be mm to be aonsermtiw an our
want ta t i l l ^ ¼ ? . Se daxn mm wbat yoa t a l l thaa i a right."
1 said, ^ 1 1 , tfce only thing l can t a l l thea i a *%et ae
mm. Mm mmmmm* mm. i t wm do i n tba airplane under actwel
mmmma i a sjajejbay story, fja* w i l l l a w to be determined by
Wright Field. EbeyM better bo dam careful wham they eheeh i t . "
This testing with Liaato^r^i f e l l i n ant correlated, aa a
amtter o f foot* an mm+mm c o i t i o n where the distributor wold go
for that i a that mdatr actual coalitions y#» have olaaa a i r at a l l
tlaea* Wm got good ven'Mlation. Xa m altttaaa etaabor mmm yen
Just pwap the- a i r out, the a i r tssiaas 4us toa» hlgh-tsnsion cur-
fomt i a the al*4ta4» ebaaber aaft, therefor®, dacreaaee t i e r » s i s t .
sm§o of the air . Your 1*^1 w i l l be . l o w a o o o r i ^ t i the lonisa-
ttam af the air* l i other aaj!**, the a i r tecws a batter ooaiaetor
tbat eviiybody ffatfttm* that esaisture w i l l doersnai dielestri© etxangth.
Ssafc i s two a t ground level. 1 ¾ moment you go to altitude, evety
l i t t l e b i t of aa&atHr** aot too emh, w i l l help you. increase i n
dieloctsrie strength, we got into cuite a conversation and confer*
eneo witb American Bosch, Usey were duabfounded, and so was Wright
Field*
aatiuaallar these people are specialists on these tMngs*
1&eir research engineer up there Just could not believe that moisture
sided to a i r w i l l add to dielectric strength*
aa found out over here we could aid moisturs to it* Ife
wanted to try aad see what relative humidity would give us what dew
point, so we added moisture to i t * Whenever we added moisture to i t ,
we got a higher altitude. * dloa*t know what i a the beck bad hap
pened. We decreased tiie relative huaAiity again* Sown wont the
altitude. Increase i t , up went the altitude.
we finally e^lstaed i t this way. At high altitude where
a i r oaaalty i s low, you had slaaoluftaly sowing, there that would «oa>
duct eleetriel%v I f you add a l i t t l e aoiator© to i t , tbe aolsture
w i l l act as an i.ueulatar and give you increased belghti that i s only
true at alUtua*a» %»t must be morougsly aana*wft»oa> A certain
ejaooat of aoiatsire w i l l increase a flaab-over distance at low pres
sures, but not at ground level pressure. I t ia detrimental at ground
level peaaavraa* but ansta!?* where tba a i r density is low, a l i t t l e
moleture i s beneficial*
of effect of aeiotve t& too vmtm at a l t i t u d e
altitude mam further mmmm tho eMoortrie ******** 01 88 0¾¾¾¾¾¾* I3a*1#<d8 ** 8M5 4a* *3 ?89 ae?3a fe aj ii OeSfc '3*%Hl6Ee%*5 1 8 ¾** ¾¾¾!'¾¾*- * ft j tSS f
onto thatf we ******* ZmMm for i t . it mo $m% mm- of too *******
My. Ford followed this iipaitioa develofnaiit right
ther©tt#Oy aad «o 444 Mr. So******, Mr. Mtrtis and Mr.
ant Mr. M i t e # aaa <pita Sj matoft in i t . £**xyane mm
with a***!**; «baaa airfaaaoo up ia mm air. It ****** law*** that at
that tla* 15,000 planes note sitting on tho ground. These vara am *Jfc7*o* m ©f oar fUJanv psotaotioa for ©or ho»a*r* mm oittiag
oa the gpmt. Stay e*MM*** get * * wham the mmmm eould go.
lis dida*t bmm Wm mm tpm of trouble am the aoaaoro.
9a\t *** a different ianltloa system. Baasors my go up to 30,000 foot. M 1 ! proaealy a i s te t — 30,0011 or 35,000 foot. Xour ftgatoro
haw to go up higher to ****** mm other fighters. Sea/ have to ho
to ha euro to got mp there ia a harry,
ta &*Tt, m* Wm+ wm o***» ********** l a di«e©t fool ia*
laxly daaSgoed far ths
to apply dixoet fuel injection to
Us #mlapo& aad haUt f**t Jajeoter pgsjo had foal ia^setor
aosslos and applied i t m thi® tei-c^linder eagiao* It worked
pretty fair* although the aalarlag devices which are r«4pired 0a
fuel iajostioa are tuite trieky* I t takes a lot of developing
We followed tae ftieeel prdtelala oa these fuel tajee*
tloaa* You can** follow i t 1M per seat, but tbe basio prioeipla
is tbe save, a© 62e?laoaaaat*> of course, of tbe pus** are naob
e a l l a r then that of dieeel basauaa your ratio i s such higher*
It use working in fair condition. As a natter of fact,
I took a vocation for a week aad went up North* Tbero was so s&teb
interest m this fuel injection that tbey wanted sose Infor-
aatloa m i t . Mr* Serowon w lined up too to follow i t up.
I t^orotojoa tbet after I bod gene for a day, tbey ©eat
oat tbe Mats Police to try and loaata no* I took a boat froa
tfeokintse and went up to Georgiaa Bey. Soreasea was trying to locate
ae about this fuel injector. Soretiiiea wanted to get i t col la ted
and to gat dewalopnent on i t ao i t eoald be used* I t was finally ooanleted aad used 0¾ tbe J^oyliiider
cyele engine .designed by Kr. ¥arkas« ighla engine was run on the
dynw»e t^ f but we bad failxe<es, and tbe eagiae woe finelly
scrapped.
On December S, 18*3# aa bad a c a l l froa «right yield asking
i f we would taka oa a extract oa the quick plant change, and
-1?6»
mm Us* s-sk mm WM mm at v a u w nam.
•ad t o contact Wtr» Saaaoaaa* 3Jhoy #ta> ana that saaa afternoon Mr*
Soreasen called aa aad asked aa ta take t h i s aa*
wa got a m information em i t mid started out to get tint
p e r s o n ! toga#aw* We took &cm mm t a $mm m i e w Baa woo waro
acquainted vl th tiie sigot jaatalvork. «e aad oao or two- Of our
giUt Hie whole thing to find out what waa aoeoasary.
mm tfpecirieatioas of what Wright Field wanted waro tine.
In order to change a p a w r plant or am ottglao oa. the atta too
installation aa I t mm* I t took forty-th^e aaa hours, Th&t mmm,
«r aaurae. that a lo t of thslr aloneo aot on mm «aun& «•«
pairs aad angiaa charges whan thoy saouM la** beam l a the air. Be heard later oa through «mft#fat-tal. sourooo froa
aad thoir Uason m^mmm that 85 oar coat of the *j*7*e aero sitting
I t took fartsr-thrae hours* aad 1ft**; waatad to ariag i t
iowa to an hour aad a half i a eases of th® airplanes where the suaer-
We started worked with f ieM. Sbey
sat li&son paraaaesl tmm the power plant lah eoae up here at
give aa the s|p»ifi©*tiooa vhieh would he eapifqtjb'Ifr to fuel aad
fhey gave «a a plane to wor& with, we
m the lab. m toofe the wlase off aad Just
mo aU wa sooted. *» «Ja» ball a oaatai a B-Sfc brought l a from Wlllov mm ao we could wee* on that
enan ' t too aueh interested i n the B-Sfc aa wo found
out later. Tte* ?~47 had to go. ay vested along en both of thea,
f inally they aefcad us to «uf*«cfcan*a the B-a*. ma definitaly
1 M l *?• Ford aboat this iUif,. aad. be aald, *I won't
part of It. I f you waat ta tafcs it* suit yourself. I won't
any part af i t . " J mmam that be felt bis personal work, would suffer <
to t W . B Mai of yaa*> although w» carried it oa aa umtal. 1 did
notion at that tine that be grow cool aad contacted
vho was mm the avaaxlBjiaBAa* of m^mmmm out bare,
did ansa of Ms work. More aad aero be took i t awe?
-178-
i t to Wbtp&tb* I aaaansa i t was basaaae be was losing Jatereet.
nr . Ford asked about mitoaohilo heaters. lie said, "How
axe ve doing mtb the autaaoblle iseataraf low i s tbe hot a i r
heater showing up eoi^&ted with tag tot water heater, * which wo
had gotteo peradeeioa to vm prevlom^-. TOXB happened March 13,
% t©M him that tmm what wo heard 1*® hot water heater
waa woU-itted i a the f i e ld . P O T the tat-issaatloa which we had froa
the Sales and Aecessoriee Beparbaeat they were selling very v e i l ,
except that their were myelttflsd vhy the dealers voolda't se l l more
of' the hot aatar hooters. She dealers would eosgl&ia that our heater
was higher to price, and they were undersold.
Sbat goes back to the story about tbe E and A Laboratory
whlea undorsold us out %M tha f i e ld , fbey coos in here end had
'their beaters fitted to our core.- S&ea they had the necessary i n
stallation infcarnation, tbey went baek and made the heaters and sold
thea bo a l l oopply booses such as lemtaars Auto Supply and Montgomery
iftird umdor a different awe* Stcy wars aaa»*aiuU4ag the ford product*
leering that, wo fel t a lot tetter about the argunont wo had
with Bennett and Mr. Bausch and the 1 aad A laboratory people. We
told Mr. ford about WM conditioa, and. ba said, "Hell , they ' l l k i l l
themselves on this Job*4
m didn't stake aore coraaente on i t . She main thing he was
- I B *
hot air heater mm not to m MmmmMmmt under any
anyway m bud gained the ground of §ettia4
use tbe hot mter heater. S* bet later laattor ana i s
the and of ***. Mmw -¾!¾! had
that; he bed l a id i t w t . m mm- £» em tan i n i t i o s
eHti& had assigftea M » H i ^ t t # B ep^e» f w i t* Ae nee UP in a U t t l e mm m the all© bete, aod he did his ignition
Mr. Peed aaae i n one day, end he aat i e em th© IsaAMm asratoa end deaiaa an i&nitlsa system far
Be said aaay Mm had oaa, bat ho didn't l i k e i t .
the oaa that aaay had mm regularly aoantad. It
a ©oafoatiOBai tjp» distri-hutor similar to tha Madel JU Xt
tieallar *1»a the Model A. Siere oaaim he &l4**t l ike that
aistributoif. So taamtad i t up ia front.
I t aaa up to us to design the distrfhuteep far 13MS front
8p m thia tiae aaay oaatm *m* Mr. ford vers tint
1 » oa mm mm$m* So had * draftoaam thoro. He im st i l l 31 ^ la eSe* 3* ¢$ 3¾¾*¾ ¾ olNS|S eaa f i 5 ® si aa aaW 5fi * a Sa9
l a aofor told ao i t vaa folas to be tha new Modal T.
•iao~
V* *** mm 1 » * * * * * ; m mmMrn of tte ftv»»®yliai*r
oagta® aa* tua soa* lay**** on what' too nbraiioa frequsacy
*** **at tbe aaplitudg was*
I think i t i s iapoaolhl* to balance tbe five^liader
wa0m mm the speed range timt i t aaa to xa*. tm mm b&laoce
i t for a eert&ia speed, yoo* 1¾* omgiaa raa wesaierfwlly saooth
a t eey^dte sueed*. 'bat s a i « t doom below tbat n & d o* ao ahaea
that *p*s#, *g*yi tbe vibfotdoa i s tgr r i f ic .
Vbaa tba engine aaa wsaatag at bigb fixed spasds or a
l i t t l e Mgbor than high fiaod spoads aad yea vould look at i t ,
i t aaa ^uet going back aad forth, sideways aad *r*ry which way.
*©» got ooarod to look a t i t .
mm oat o f balaaoo eomditioa vould create a couple, as
i t 4* esOisd i s balancing- You'd get a diagonal ooapJa, a M tea
oaglas vould aobblA. I t i s awftOly difficult to got a uaivercol
Jat** wm*m ta tbe drive abaft and try aad maintain a fair
«ligjmmt for a convention! i s i iwwsal #ei»t. iaaa. Perk** baft been
working om and got same ftaU-typs uMvaroal Jotats. Tkwy mm aoa-
a a r o i a l ^ aada, but they're aafuUy a^aasiv*. I t ****** out a*
far- as the Miration of the f******* wm sonoarmed, ****** aaothar
¾¾ 1 98 ¾¾¾!*' *)ejJnw W* -JajjjP8wfc feiSSae ' j f 6 Q0& '818s<a JpS ^ *ft>& •896 % ¾¾¾ ^ 93 58ftjJ*
mm smiat to tay ***• "m nap* m mm$m t**
ta mmm- $m® tba
I awsaaft a t that t la* that J 3 w as i tb
a w tattfe wmm. tt* mM$m®$m m m top.
St&t t s j t i n rossc© Mr* Fori, took f t aaay from hla
I t task to its*
Hm HgoBt aoiartsaft Q&mWEmi&mt ami go to a
saittri^toi 1 . Hr* font «a£& ttat at f f j | sot aaar of
*f*»a «»» ta 1 » j » txmk* mm. m mm*9
1Blii§' SNPa%^lliS| i^lSS? ^¾¾!¾¾ jp&!NP§i' 1¾¾¾¾?¾¾¾ n jfMl
Kslgaa& far ' tt* ?*S aaabja* I t v a a a
» l Jnet faafata* that t h * disfelfeutor b M to- %* to front. «ffcafe i a
tba ptopajf $3a@% to ftfiia i t A i r o e t l j frasa too camshaft.w
tttav of aamt, *» % good la** ta «taw t t mamkMt
ttatas. BtawMag-tris® mm mmmmm.^*mm i t baa it®
Wm* $m*mm that m *a*a i t l i a l w
te «nio ms alBtaaaa*. I
«aaa*
•
«m mM b® mnm mot hoar about th® wartta** mmmmA distributor.
yygm ttsan oa, ths dtetiribwtor situation boeamo hottar
and ©ottor haeintae tfeeja m s toss ae^tatian towards gatting i t off tbe front and putting i t wp sn top mo& using the esmveattanal type
of d lot^bater . tbe agitation earns tern tna production aids mot from tbe balers. 1 rooel*ed l i t e r s froa dealers ami owners oa this.
Somehow this thing got oat that 1 was the designer o f the diGtriiautor
Omo mam froa @mm M a nam* as m l a t t e r . Es said tfc t mo mom b e M mm one might la * iMwtag mim with igmitftssi fttXamm,
Ba mM that bat m» M a* Hn»# bo asm** have mmm ay aaemv X
r^ssiwd l e t t e r s o f that sort .
Z don't want to eay that I woo t o M by Mr. Pord sad X d i d
omaotly mo bo t o l d a®, but it* a two. It s t i l l would have bsom op
to mo to t r y to aaavlaaa bio* wbieh I attempted from tiias to tla®.
Ivory ttaa I attempted i t , as m aaUaa it to thorn© days, I got
spmobidV or X got the silent tiMtatat for teas en? four masks.
O o o s s i m B y I t r i a d it mmd bmpt 0» t ry iag i t .
1» ths tetfew port of HA, He. t&Cawol l talked to mo about
i t oaoo. Be tsUofti ma w about diytrfbut-ora. Sa osmm i n then as
cider ma^mmvt that was bio function, We talked mboat it , sad ma
t r i a d asweaal times to mmim® Mr. Ford. I t just d idn ' t succeed.
X mm* ®m v U l go a&ead a^d mm up soma wood modal aoob>
upa to mm fm^om versions of whore distritutore eould bo nonated
and bow i t e***a m mmm&Smmt* W® did jam tbot. ** e a M , "Mayo*
i t would m a good idoa to prts Mr, lenry Ford IX l a ©a thf* text of
thing, m& tsM&m bS» of what has gioe an, and what aa are trying to
•*.«
m .mm he wo*dd do that. He mm talk to Henry ford II
aat probably la**** oa ** couia SJ?MP» a aeetlag. betono* nr. Ford n ,
of what we mm going to do. m mm f loating around in aid-air and
eould not w to definite aealsi&n*«
wanted to icaow, ^ a t are wo going to use oa the aw oagiaoff* Tm
diotri>ator ^oottoa aU© afgliaJt t o other engine* ******* mm Mm*
cylinder engine. I t applied, to a l l of than.
out, i t vaa v i t a l to l»o« mmM m "mm going to do because it affected
tl*> whole m*$m of the engine ao to ***** this thing i s aouated. I f
tho distributor is aowtod i n tbe roar of the eyUaamr block, i t
aeaas a enffe**** pattern oad UmOmm oowid«r*Mo design vara.
Onto a 'block i s aade for the distributor aotmtad l a mm roar, you
***** *** i t on mm tmm mm@mS,- dist^it^utor wOmm $m threw a l l
yassp patterns away practically.
On « H n r y 4, 3^5, Mr. Ford and Mr. Beary ford SI o**o l a
-18*-
re<{erding 4bb3bribnbore. Tbey to laoir nbab tbe distributor
situation was, AjnaiaatSy, Nr. i C s M I bed taUtad to Mr. Beary
Ford 11, and he, la turn, talked to Ma grandfather, last brought
tM» mm obostt. Be eiaaaapjtlar aaeagh* ttt» la « 0 t*Ut the thing
oaar*
m talked about the vwt ioa l ssoiaitei distributor. We
ObGMA h i» » seek-up «nl a aejgi* Of the St»«oylisdar emgiaa. AO m talked, Mr. Seary Ford teeml to bo falte favorable, mo a t t i
tude had changed eoigOetely towards vertical aniatted distributers.
1 wm mm& mmmmo. ths way h® acted, 2 thought that the boabo
wooM bo dropped any tiae, but fa* was vAto I'awrabls to i t . Mr.
Ford didn't say yea or ao, bat 1 could ball froa hie talk aad his
actios® that he didn't hare too nueh ebJeoitoa be the wr t i ea l
a ^ e l aistrilMtors*
They left again, and, of course, that eaesursgoi m to
beep goisig oa tto aar laal. aauabsft distribtttor dove yojaaaat*
OK Jmmry I T , Nr. ataxy f«*4 » » § McCarroll esaa
i n again. Sfeey laalatf at the iaviala wo hid of the vertical type
dietritetere. $&ay thought a l i t t le furtte* iniwatigatifen would be
required before i t waalA be definitely stated i f aa were going bo work oa ite vc^icaUy mounted diotribntor or stay i n the boriaontal
distributor. It appeared to m mm- that m* Ford haft indicated to
Mr. aenay Ford U tha* he ata ato* not asaay togo aaa way or the
other. That- ia the way i t appeared to mm«
At that tine, Mr. C a r r o l l asked m to look over the new
oi-eaaimtica^ as i t was taking piece. Share waa a reorgaaiaatioa
of the complete Engineering Separtzaent. They were really starting
to reorganise.
1 » knew Mr* lenry Ford was net weH; a few of us knew i t .
We could t e U by hie reaction that he was slowing down considerably
and that his aental faci l i t ies weren't as they were three or four .
years aieo.
As a natter of last , when ft*. Sdsel Ford died, that was
the turning point. Easel's death was the biggest alow he ever had.
% fee l that was the turning point of Mr. ford . From than on he kept
on going down* I t seeaad that, his vitality, his enthusiasm aad his
memory dropped* It was a crusher fear him. 1 noticed a change in his
appearance, his health and his mental attitude from that point for*
ward, definitely*
Mr. MeCarroli asked me to consider taking over a l l of the
electrical development work, and also to consider that our department
over there was to he incladeci into general eagiaeeriag which i t was
not before* I t was etrletly under Mr. Ford, ko wore responsible to
Mr. Ford and to Mr. Campsoll.
When n r . HsCarroll told m that, I so ld , H e l l , you know
what the s i tuation i s here. I wish yarn would t a l k to either Mr. Ford
-1B6-
o r Nr. Cejspaaii. about i t* Talk i t over with t&aa firet. Xt i s a l l
right « i m as* X taw* that toe Extginsering fiepartaaat bee to he
reergojilaod. «h«tev*r i a to aa done, I ' l l be glad to
vith it."
Ha cppareatly vast ta Mr. Caapeall aat talked
i t because X was eallad by Mr. CaafaaH. Be eased at i f anybody had
j jp^ m atleapt to stove into this psartieuLsr depnrfaant. X said,
"He*, tbex® were mm talks about i t with Mr. MoCsrroU that i t was
Mr. Csaptsall eaid, "Wbat do yoa thlsfe about itt*
X said, "wall* eventually it»a going to ooaa anyway, m
can't have our dop»taamt bora stand oat l ike a Clalstaas tree. We
taet oan't function that way. ®s§ faci l i t ies there should be
to be valnoMa to the Coayany# and why wot use thaa."
le said, "You tear who yoa are working for. Yon an
for Mr. Ford. Don't le t anybody t e l l yoa aay different."
X said, "That puts aa on the spot. After al l , whan the
ihgiaaortiig Baaartaaxt ia reorganised, I eaa't t e H 1
I'a woj^slaii for Mr. Ford, aa& tbay should, atay away froa ae. that ia
not ay 400* Shot i s aoaebody a&ai'a Job.*
He aaid, "You kaov who yoa are working for.*
X saw Mr. McCarroll l a t e r on again, aad X told Ma tbat.
l a said, *To» ean gait yaaraatf. Xf you want to get along in this
orgaaisatioii, you know what you have to do. Of course, you cam get
along, out f t won't BO as good m I t would be If you go with tbe
2 said, *Thare ia ao amee*i0n bat what i t has to as ro~
organised, aad I*» wil l ing to do I t . Somebody boo to deer It, aad I
as*** brook .away Just mm this."
He said, 9mmtt waaaaalf." I woo i a 14» aiddle, aad in a
Following tbat, Jack l i tara* also talked to aa. about this
incorporation. X t o M hia the i m e thing, J knew Jack n a i l . Ae a
matter of fact , bo woo a m e a d o f ****». fta oouM mm the «ltu&tion,
but i t Jaa* waa lafb ta ao to aake the waa.
I didn 't i aa l i t was ay roopoaolMlily to say to Mr. Ford,
"Sow, Mr. f o r i * wo are aot going to work for you amy aore. %> are
m&mt over bore oa this eide. n Soaabody else abould have token care
.of iaaa).
X don't really think Mr. ford would haw discharged aa aa
the spot for saying tin*. I Jus* fa i t i t w a s a e t a y J o b t o g o t o M r . Ford
and say, " I eeaaot Ao this work for you amy more. we ' l l bare to eaaage
too department.* That l a ridiculous.
Mr* Ford had. fjeowa vary, vary ©old to as. Se saw a l l these
things going on. As i t wont oa, aore and more o f M s peraoaal interests
want ever to Mr. Riepoth. iiopotti*s shop was practie«01y working 100
per seat ifor Mr. f^ord.
1 didn't oere. I felt that if 1 hain't tee ay hast* i t
waa Ms privilege to go to imobedy also and let ooaahedy mm do
i t* 1 didn't vorry ***** it . 1 did my heat.
As I aaid, Mr. wbaraa mUmA about i t , and I told hisi
the aane thing. About mm mm Um, I r . Ford cane 1«, ant ha talked about
the <mMm% «i*«*a**il**% St mm, "lew, don't he in to© nash of
a ***** about Ms w r t i c a l a***ribe*e*>« think about i t . " There woo
the proof that ttaw* mm mm ©bstaolafi la the way. 1 a t i t t kept
oa voicing and kept at it as I tymmt that *mmtualiy i t vould mm
to tbat.
m that aama tiaa, wo get note mm0m of radios froa the
Phileo .Mia e**s«**j****« At the soae t in* there was also amah teaeloa
about tbi* mmmAtm^m that was o^osod to go oa. i t dida't
bother aa aay because 1 waa too baay to worry aboat i t , aad X bad to©
nash to do. l i had- our P-<V/ quick engine orange prograa there yet. We
wore tied up vit& ftniajbft field. The reorganisation dida't bother aa
aay. I waa leaded with work. I didn't bate tiae to worry about what
waa going oa and 1 didn't mm shout i t . I f anybody wonted to roaraaalaa,
brim, i t dowa the Mae mm way i t should bo, f l a o l This hash-lush arauad
tbe eornor, and tha rnnoro, and nhat have yon, X dida't go by tbat.
«***-
On May % Hr* Sewy ford XI mm i n . «e tslbai
shottt tbe disfcriiTUtor trouble at the IUI.2U whtth* ©f course, re-
flaetaft back on - 3 » vertical distributor again* S» said, rti:on«t
taaaatt mm im p v onaaytjaxt. tt»»t yoa mm aay change* avoaad
bare at a i l . Xt i s yaw- yi*«©. t t them ba la f t .
X didn ' t place auoh weight on this atstsaeat. X d idn ' t
bad told hia, m aaybe HtffcaYatt bad told his, that there aaa seae
question ae to aaat tbay slxmte do tmm*
»a s«M» HQkay, it« s your departaent aad yea s t i l l work
along tba way you have been.**
I mm m .bad float other a c t i n g s after Nr. fay* 1* Oeorgia
t r i p whose be bat the f i r s t s&taea* Before than Mr. whereat and ay«
s e l f ware supposed to aaat Mr. Henry Ford XX wham be oaae book froa
rooaived am invitation mm 10m wmm Badio Corporation to v i s i t the
plaat end see future deve^opas&t worts on W at tbat tiae aad also the
radio <l®vel<3pseai and what they mm doing.
m aakad ns, at one of tbe awageaent asetlsgs which were
held over i s tits Body m90mmMm ^rilxilm m a rooa there, to aaet
Mm at PniladelpMa- be was peasant vith a l l this other people, and X
was present, l a bad pleased to go. Aa a matter of feet, wo bad our
m
The afternoon of the clay we were supposed to leave — we
were supposed to leave at ooven o* cluck — we got a wire saying
that tbe trip was cancelled, la dldm»t know why or what had happened.
¥e d i te f t botoer to l»o«ttgato either leoouos we- fel t ft mm*% say
uso mm i t*
X Just kept aa working om what I had to do* X had ay hand®
f a i l . X 41a**t have mm to hotber a i m orgirtaa^iiej. ebaagee. X
juot tteiagh*, w X f l i do. ay Job. I f anybody feel* i t t«a*t sati«faoter#,
they can ooaa and toU me." My eoasofaase woo clear.
Aoout taaa* aias •*** 1 aawa no rseora or wm% i n ay aoax ~» a
^biagp1 wwtft about in &»e*ti*g tae dynamometers wbfeb were up here at
the norm arid of tbe 'buildijag down to abet woo them the o^oriaantal
garage. w* made layouts and plans for it* We wore i n favor of that
booassa i t woo epito noisy i n toe bunding wlta the dyaaaaaator
we aada layouts and pleas. Mr. Bauoob aad Mr. Eablingar
eatorad the picture, also Mr. Kroll. We submitted too layouts to
Plaat Snglasoriag down at the Bongo* She dyasaasaters wore supposed
to have boom set oa too floor oa foundations i a the floor deep oaougb
to support toe dynsaoaaterii proper^ to a et^cif icatioa to which dyae-
ing with mm sltoraMoa* fbsy if* aot want to break toe cement, fast
was a otas&tag. order i a too Ford Motor Company toot you could aot brook
a cement floor. We an knev i t . I felt, that i a order to soke a good
installation the foundation should be in the floor at least three
to fera? feet deep and to be isolated*
I t was reported book to m .from f lent lagineerlag ymtmm-
nel that Mr* launch ordered not to break the concrete, but to build
cement bases up from the floor to the height of approxiatatflly two
aad one-half foot ahovo the floor.
You hare 'to realise that the operators have- to work on the
engines, fhey have to look at the scales, and the scales are usually
arranged so they are at eye's level so they can make an accurate read
ing* If you raise these scales two end one-Imli' foot, a man looks up
in the sky and tries to sake readings. I t can't reach the engines. I t
ia mm&mm*
X called to their attention that thie simply would not vork
out. Shot didn't mat* any difference.. I wale this remark, *If you
must keep those bases above the floor, at least put a sub floor in
and bring lite floor level up to the base of the dymamometmr. You then
would be baek to standard conditions sgaim**
That, of course, would be an awful iaatallatioa. You normally
wouldn't do that, fhe moment that remark was made by me this drafts
man from Plant ingioeoring. wmmt back — i t wasn't * draftsman, but i t
was smmema** foUow-ttp mo — to the teog% and i t started to sjaterisl-
ize that they were going to put a sub timer i a . fhey were going to put
-106-
i a a l l of the ainlag* tho oloctrieal leads l a this sab flooring.
Shay wouM east i t in ©ssamt. wMob 'is about as ridiculous as- X
f»ftMia a©@. to nut mtsr "nines l a oaasat.
•«b» neat day -this foliay-x^ ana for ibaweh eons oat again* Bo aaid, "Vfe're a l l set** Bo abound a@ tat prtate and aaat they vera going to go ahead with.
X ©old, ^ 1 1 , I eertaialy weald M** to have a word
mm Mr. avaantu*
I «8lXe4 hia cm tte phone* 2hey ooulda't find Ma, and
they «ii»»t know where ho aaa. m* mm said, 1 knov where ho i s . X locate far smu M & called en tba tsieae. he sat M a that aa*a%* ^ero ho was, X doa*t mm* M talked with hia,.
and ho saM tbat X wanted to talk wi th hia. Bmweh refused to talk
aaa hero ovorai#t to put these bases i n and sot than up. !Iho place
X said to wmmU, " I f a mo mm hucklng peep}* life* mis*
fun*!! Juet haws to lot i t go aloag ao i t i a . "
as job ana fteishod out, and Mr. Ford haofoaod to ooao la one day. Bo waited to knov l imit the i^mmmmm* Be didn't really
ooao 1% eat X sot M a up there at mm mmm door. Be said, "Cos*
oa. taVo M O aaay mm,m whoso rooa right meat to as. Ho aaid,
*mw aro the dyaaaoao^o ooaing. X*V» take aaay ea t* along.*
That aaa a time he ttM about the ^ l i t i c a l situation
sad the war situation aad so forth.
Mr. Ford want dowa to the dyueatoaeter*,. sod he looked at
i t . SO said, "Hay pit this platform up heref *
X said, "That's the way Mr. Bausoh wonted i t * 1 was power*
less. Hi had soother way out, hut he Just built i t up overnight."
tir. Ford said, * l * l l t e n you what you should do. Put a
.groat big fence around it , hut don't lot siyboiy Hsu* Jiamy Smith
was there, aad he heard i t *
mavartaalaas* we etill hod to make i t work* The dynaaoasters
were s t i l l under ae. Wte 'tried the best we could with the dyaaaotieter.
Xt worked* as i t wore, but we bated to. show i t to anybody* It was
Just am awful setup for a dymracmotor. tie could have made a very nice
setup out of that room don® there and soundproof i t .
mam that tiae, tarn ms^ffm^mblm had taken place a l i t t l e
more, and a Sir. Patoa came i n . Clyde R. Patau was brought i n by Wv*
l^Carroil; be 'was supposed to act so a consulting engineer. He was
rather aa eccentric sort of a fellow. You could never figure out
what h® wasted. Be was very, very determined. In aaetlaga* he almost
acted ridiculous at acne times. 3» was very, very defeaiajjbaal in patting
his ideas through in any way he could. 1 saw right then and there that
he wouldn't .last very long wita hia ideas aad actions.
Before the groat reorgaoizaticai took place, there vae an
-19½-
* with Beary Fori IX ae tbe
She oaly one of the MBH vho bad aurrived .around Henry Ford XI
tola reorgaaioatioa, who waa eloae to Edsai, woo Jack Wiiara». MeCarroll
woo always i » betoooo* He woo very eloae to Mr. Bear? Ford. X don't
r, and s t i l l eaa*t aawa«w*MaV why Mr. McCarroll was put i a ao
He.woo »© ©tea* to Mr. Warn® *«ra i a a l l of M E
X always toougbt tboro woo a elaah.
At toe asae tiae X .know toot Mr. Beary Ford did aot
9Safi@ ao- *aUee B8B8PaeS^ J @42sJ@P3 Sjja a" EfcSP ^¾¾©¾ SSSi Sp1 8¾¾¾¾ J SKSS sCa l ¾¾! 30e$o
ooaMa't figure wa© would f i t in*
This internal reoigeMmtfom waa dome quietly. Xt aaoaad
to ba groups consisting of MsCorroXl, Mr. ttaaraa sad Mr. Boeder. Ti&y
Tellbarg waa to on f t too. Wmm f i t mmm into too
X» toe Wmtmmim Beportaaa* Mr. Carroll aad Mr.
for soma ebaagoo. esrroll woo in .obarga oi
p tbat depertoamt alia Mr. Uaruh ao aa aaofotaat to bia.
alaost worked at 0 » eaae lo re l .
X wouM say tola reer^aalsatloa began to tola
Mr* Ford eaaa amok fraa Georgia- % un t i l tbat tiae i t bad
a* less exsloratorr. Hbea bo eaae 'book froa Gsor&ia. bo oaaa i a a
*§J 9jjjP^ UST 1)8¾¾ 3jr®^te^?To' ^Mftfla* e?a ^HafJfaaae ¾¾¾!¾ ajaaa^t $ ¾¾*¾ 33 0 ®¾*¾*
-Iff-
hardly talk, m eaid, "X juat wanted to owe i n to say hel lo to
yoa* Mrs* Ford doesn't know that I 'a out* i ' a not supposed to be
©nt. 1 Jaat want to sir lailXo to yon and I've got to rush r i g h t
**
Xt vas about ten i i i the aomlng. lie looked white i n the
fane. X Mm never seen hia Hke that before. While he bad gray
hair, bia hair waa absolutel/ silver white then. Xt ehanged com-
pXetely*
a e l a a t words he said were, " I t ' s going t o be rough on
yon for a while, but don't yon ^ t . ' fben be l e f t . Shat waa the
last tim: I feOkaft to Ma* X mm Mm after that at a distance, but
X didn't talk to hia any aore after that. Mr. Ford seemed to be
aware these ftfowtgpfi were going to take place.
X really don't know what to mention next beeanae from now
on, i t tarts* Vhat tawaapired froa here on askes m wonder at tinea
whether loyalty and conscientiousness actually pay. X do not desire
ta east any reflections upon the iniividwala involved since X hare
no proof aa to iðer or not they anted ioeordliig to SnetawMoaa*
Mr. F&ton broaght in Mr. Belts who i a now heed o f the
E l e c t r i c a l Department over there. Be brought him i n to se and i n t r o
duced hia to ae« W© walked ttorough. tba place., and Mr. Belts thought
we hod a aarveloue setup as far as the equipment waa concerned and
a l l that.
-196-
Bis %®mm ***** *a*a* "X*1X *a gottlag S» yow heir ©as of these days.*
I Baid, *<2mwm isa't mich to ba gotten into, but it* a a l l
right." 1 43/am*t know what a* aeemt by getting i a ay hair. 1 aa*
1 ¾ mmm mm mmm mm aba* he was supposed bo tabs over too Electrical iep^saat.
mm desk was placed right i a the middle of tbe M s room,
that i s , right i a the saddle of th* Bngiiaseriag fttttatfaw.. i t was
tables mm &3m& the eido there. X felt from than cm that the people who meed to work vi th
me over therm etieaged their attitudes soaehow* they grow cold or
reticent. Bmmmm mm em that affected them, ami X couldn't figare
out what i t was.
One time Mr. MsCarroll mm ia and voaderad i f wo couldn't
find room for Mr. Belts's desk i n my office. Of course, between
Theme* and ayemlf we just had one took. Urn had irawiag tables in there,
a aaall darkroom for electrical vork and a asultituuQ of Mr. Ford's ^mim^^ which ve ooulte't move without bis permission.
There were also four safes la there, three assail anas with the aoaey
i n . She fourth one X had vith seme personal belongings of Mr. Ford's
and seme of ths aosa e eessivo laboratory m-plvmn%f mmU as ths gold.
a®? the Mr. ford k e p t foroenel wmm l a t hese safe*. Tha t l a vbi
he told » i *X*» g a l a g to b r i n g I s safes, a ad a® a r e gaiag t o J**t
««11 tha* fall of i aay. Shey at® aat g®mg to c a t c h a a
Hat a f t e r the bank h o l i d a y , * Theee v a a l t a vara r i g h t
€^f? @ @$s*1B*5Me * 31 ^¾¾¾^*? ^ 6 8(¾ ¾ ^ * ¾*" ^^aa*^^ ' **%¾' 0?¾¾!!¾**¾ ¾*¾¾¾ w wa y@ a aa^ jt
X v o u l d a H know where ta pu t B e l c h ' s desk* Aa far a s X vaa
It vaa. a l l right to bring his desk l a .
iaasaraeladdt 20» sag**® l a thara v fc ich vaa c u t
for anybody 's i n v e s t i g a t i o n . I t v a a t o l o o k a t
as aort o f a show pieee. There mm a aaimtodo o f o t h e r things l a
f, I $ » t t o a t 12» mmm am* t o the
i t voaM bo a better place to have i t over *ant*« That
5188¾^^¾? a v ( dL3wapaawi 8s 4fKSf 3L 3(. a Meaa Svjj ^w**J* • ¾¾ !*¾¾' a183 v a* 3¾¾¾**¾¾ a** w$n a***> ^ajmv e Je SjNft
oa aa* X aotte aad ao oaa t o U .aa, f e d thea a l o t
I d i d a o t kaov. H e v e r t ^ l i j s s , the whole- t h i n g
went a v e r ta Body E n g i n e e r i n g aad node m
1. x thought i t vaa a l l right aad f i n e , bat X
»1JS«
ed that eoaebody lejuiA have t o l d se wtiat was going oa. 2 think I t
vas i « « r o i l * s respoisiblllty to do that at that t i a e . fhia f r o a t i -
aoao between ty people end ayaelf Increased sore and now*
At the »o«o«oaeitt naaUaaa no held over there, tharo were
Henry Ford I I , Mr. Craig, Mr. McCarroll, Mr. TtOlberg, Vharaa end
Boeder. Kaitseh ema over once i n a while* fh&aga went along pretty
weH although I felt that. I wen being pushed aside a hi t . Sat active
o f the Coapany waa coming more and aore iato Henry Ford I I ' c
The Engia^riu^ Deparv^eat definitely did need a reorgani
zation. In the f i r s t place we did not have the adequate matter of
people and the oaalliy of people wbteh ve needed for a large progress
which the Coapany baily needed, i n Bagineerlng the groups were broken
up, and there were clear l i n e s of authority with c e r t a i n groups speci
f i c a l l y designed to oarry out epoeific functions ao they could be
efficiently*
There wm Mnooln IngSneeriag which was under Mr. Johnson
and Mr. Wharaia. Ford Engineering was under Mr. Sheldrick an long as
be was here. After that i t waa wider Mr. Header, Be had Ford
ing and CNaaarelal fegjaaarlas* ft» idea that people worked against
each other was constantly i n view.
mm the official iraoaaattai&lan took place whoa Bennett and
Bauach left the ecopaiy, I was not in close eaataat vita that. Of
-199-
t. I kasr afeat Isiwels'a sltaetAoa wm oM I 1 esalda't «Mt|tty aae
TOuld f i t -into toe plct.ure, or
Bennett am* laueeb just aaaMe/t fit into too
Ford II. Hs tot tweh different imm>. % couldn't
a aaa ma leaastt f i t lato too pic twe of (gr Fcard II bad alaaaad i t .
1 kaev Mr. leafy ford. II said I knew Mr* Bdeel ford, Tie>/point was toot Mr. Beary ford II ytmld pica
not succeed; i t would carry oa froa there.
I board after taat Mr. Ford JWssailid to sot aa a
directors to rua too Cmgm& after bo Soft until
laaxSaa toSy taa uasnia aoro la tba
of «Mob 1 vas <
toe alnutos aad so forth. I
jife Sjy 8¾¾¾¾¾¾ ^Sa^^ 'JalQ^^ -jpfVliJ oft aV ^^PO^^^pf 'Sfa'iSs iweo ' Wa suja aa
alto
of
ipMVtod tout 1 be poaont at
is- requested that of Mr.
*»t .knew. 1 eaaaa* i t woo lb?.
Mr. Ford
. I saa>«t
Ford II. I
or , Mr * ford -bad gone- to Georgia, aad I diia*t see
such of M » , nor old X wast to bother hia vith anything af that sort*
I f e l t what was coming, although f e l t neglected or hurt because 1
wasn't told, atamigb* out that i t vas cming. If they f e l t they wanted
to change the aamaawama* of the dmma*aaaafc» fine, hut Just say so*
That happens ia any compauy. 5hey should come cut as ma-to-raan sad
say, "Bov here, ve are going to sake a ebsaage in the setup. We are
goiag t© put this asm i a . Us foe! that he eaa do better than what
you'vo done.'* fhat would have been fine, a l l right, but nothing was
said.
On Apr i l 29, 19½, Mr, McCarroii and Mr. Janes, who had come
with tiie Gcjvany in the. aaaatiaa* esse ia, and Mr. James asked ae i f X
would take over electrical research and the s i r conditioning development
verb at research.
X said, "fee, 1*11 be happy to." I knew then that the situs,
tion where X was was not too jromisiag and that X vas in Mr, Belts'e way,
Mr. James said ho would contact ma later. Will, X was
waiting. X didn't hear any nor© shout i t and X was e t i l l working
on the *-*7# the aellaoaasr* the igaitloa system and l i e voltage re
gulators. Of course, X hadn't seen Mr. ford for euit© a while.
Charlie Thomas and Belts, of course, were very busy with
each other, fhaaas bad taken to Belts. Tu<*-r vera looking at farm
•mctenmy and talking farm e^uipsent* Beits was going around patting
cur people on the back over there, and he probably was telling them
«801-
that they had twea misused i a toe pest* Anyway, things grew quite
eooi^eated, altoouftfe I mm s t i l l working with ay P-Vf and a l l to®
other work toat X bad.
On July s$> 1 9 * 6 » *** * - * T *sa ««ei»lotod aad taat flown,
l a bad the power plant change aw?ea&ed ao i t waa reduced f r o a forty*
three hours to tweiity-thr<?e minutes, am could remove an engine from
the BlmlMnB f*ii& nut another *«tfrfae on i n twenty-three ainsitsa,
To accomplish toot toe complete installatiom was revised
around toe e x i s t i n g airplane, observing, of coarse, too increase i n
weight. We d i d n ' t want to increase the weight too much. As i t was,
we increased tbe weight by thirteen and one-half pounds.
If t h i s system ted been designed into the o r i g i n a l airpleuie
and token into consideration, we would actually have reduced too
weight of toe airplane* As i t was, in toe conversion from too e x i s t
ing airplane acme weight bod to be added here and there, such as toe
quick disconnect engine fitting of which there were four* They could
have boon incorporated t i g h t i n toe fuselage, where we added then to
the fuselage as an additional .part. A number of other things could
have resulted i n a reduction of weight.
the airplane was tost 'flown by Ltavtaaaat Arthur Murray
from Wright f i e l d , r i g h t out a t the a i r f i e l d here. He was supposed
to c i r c l e toe airport several times to be sure be was e l l c l e a r , and
so a last s ign to ue who were on toe ground — there wore only three
of m Hbmm — im mm supposed to coat ta m a warn* dive.
5Se people tbere wore an A i r Force inspector, Mr. Webster,
J i a C&llaJaar, tbe pbotogre^r, who X asked to cent to, and tbe sachem
ic Lloyd Freeaan, vho is sow out at the Wayne County Airport , and ay-
s e l f . We mm the only ones who were there. Maey had orders that
to keep everybody away froa there i n ease sonething should
Anyway, as a l a s t sign the pilot vas supposed to eoae i n on
a power dim, and then he would take o f f for Wayne County or Romulus
Airport where he bad more rooa. M s field i s ratter s a a l l feu* a
P-4?. We Just gave Mm enough gasoline to get there. After a l l i t ' s
quit® an undertaking.
X don't have to say that X was oaite tense when he caae down
i n his power dive and went right straight up on a c l i n k . The Air Force
inap&'ctor who was rather a comical Xriahnin poked as aad aaid, "See,
wbat d i d X tell you. Be has to set her up on her t a i l to keep the
engine froa falling o f f . "
The pilot took o f f f o r Wayne County or Boaulua Airport, and we
followed out there with the c a r . Ve got there and we hadn't seen Mm
yet. m l a a V t coat i n . Be should have been there aneh before we got
out there so we were worried.
Finally, after ten or fifteen Minutes he caae. • Be brought
the ship down, end we asked h i a where he was and wbat happened. Be
mM m bad * bit of trouble with the lajfeandia controls of the landing p r . fhey wowMa*t respond lawstJately eo he tried the* oat & few tines. Be pulled the* out and let then tea a, few tines to see if tbey wool* function properly. Be said there was nothing Wong with thea, that tbat happens once la a while when tbe hydraulic system Is air locked, aat it takes a little tiae to restore the circulation.
fhat was all right then, aad the next Monday ~ it was on a Saturday we aad® the test — he took, off for Wright Field. That ship was supposed to be flows, around to a l l of the aircraft gatrafacturers as a i^mnstrator to shew that i t eaa be done.
The iaforaatioa which m got Aran vrlajet Field was tbaa th* aircraft avnafaatasx** eartaaaly didn't oo-operote vita the Mr Fere* to change their systems, to «a*e m fttiek disconnect .power plant, they were in pfwtetioa, aad they didn't feel they abauM aake aay ehaagea.
Oat was tao end. of the p**T, ond i t van ejieepted. She only raoaaat we had later en was tbat we had to ceapile three reports whleh were ta ho* tmm showing a l l the tests that mm aad* on tha Individual pieces aad a eaavjSnte progress report of what vaa done, m had to make three copies for aright Field, Tm weeks later they wanted forty-two copies aore, plus aatwraXiy all the blueprints, m turned everything over to Wright Field, and that finished that 40b.
On August 22, 1 hsppeaed to run iato Mr. Tallberg and aaked hia what tha situation was around here, aad i f he knew of any changes
that wenM affect »@. Also X i«M bin taat Mr. 4mm talked to nt about going over there. sXXoorg called Mr. 3mm and asked what the situation ms. Mr. Janes told Ms that, m waited to talk with Mr. Bolts first hafOr® he would sate a awaj*
Following that, 1 w«a aligned t© research under Mr. Janae, to aaaarriae «» Ogmmmamm which were sti l l town, here aad not l a the new buiXAi^. The Aowlofenit of the new MAttag started out than. Mr. V. 0. iKfiolo had aaetttoiaf, to do with the origia&l design. Of course, the sirehiteot was working on 1%. 'the arehiteet is -over here right now putting up new tagSaseriag Building. Bis naae waa Gmm* MassM.
avAlaJaf* mtmm with Mr. lanes. Mr. Raviolo had s t a r t s it with tbe aroMtaots. 1 taste into i t then. Mr. c. 1». Bouchard was working on it . Finally, Mr. W. mm who taw to »«e»eh with Mr. Jsaes entered into it. Be was quite active in ms dyi«joa®t®r work. Thay had one
dynaasaeitar eell set up in aaMewea aa a saapla for the future build-iag. mm bad 'Operas tbat cell. We were all wooing together i n
the aaitt direction for the new building and s t i l l keepi&g on our testing over here with what facilities we bad.
Tbe new building waa to be a dywoneter building. Tbe &jnmmMt®r® are omr there now md are in operation partly.
Oa feeaehar 7» 19^* Mr. Jaate eaUed ae over there i n a
nawtlag w i t h M a , l e ia fa imed me t h a t be bad changed bis mind and
that be was go ing to t u r n the eJyectr ieal researeh ever to Mr. Patterson
as. he mm a l r e a d y Xiaed up* I f aad when he started electrical re-
search ««* he had not d e f i n i t e l y dec ided he vas going to start i t — m* Pat terson mm to tame It over,
le- s o l d I IAOUM stay mttfe dynamometers and work together w i t h Oxley O R tmm new emvelomammt, am* taam Mr. OxXay would take over the tynsmome'ters, 1 asked him where that would leave me. le said, " f e l l , work a long w i t h Ga&oy, the areiamset, and Bouchard to develop the b u n d i n g , "
Oalmy would team over the testing. 1 said, "ball, 1 had
a aaarVt»4amm4 t a l k w i th James, and he never told ae what the
reason was. As Car as I'm eoneemed, i f this is an idea of having me cult* 1 won** emit. If the Company wants to get r i d of me, they hftwg to f i r e me,"
fim said, " that ' s a good a t t i t u d e to take. If you feel that you haven't done anything wrong i n the past, why a l l right. Let .some* body cone and te l l you and prove i t to you that you'vs done wrong.*
I worked a long w i th Jamea, and we got along swell. James
was a v e r y n i c e fallow. Qm November 6, 1 9 4 $ , we were pewaaeatly transferred to
^ s e a r c h and worked w i th the individuals I wmtioaed before, plus Mr. S w i f t , on toooue c o n v e r t e r s . Swi f t was i a charge of the torque
•806-
emme%m? 6**aikaa*vjiv at Seseiirchj. and I sat up teat proceduree for aoroa* c-tmvertere aad aada soae tests. 1 Just siaply worked with Swift.
At about that tiae X vent in and talked to Mr. Youagren;
X m t s i to flad out Juat vhat tha situation vaa. X introduced
ayeeif to hia, as X had aarrar met Ma before. Be said, *fes, I've beard about you.* Ba wanted to know vhat X had dene ia tbe past
aad s© forth, sad we kept oa tslMsg.
1 vas a Mt axeltad, antanaUgr* X was uadar a tension which i s not suite siaple to explain. I t was about four or four
forty-five in the afternoon. Ve had talked about fifteen aHuttes, and he excused hiaeelf. Be said, *I have an appointaent aad X
have to leave, fie eaa probably continue this conversation at soae
inter date** from then on nothing happened.
I t did affect as. As a natter of fact, X did have a nervous breakdown. Bebody knew about i t around here, x kept on working with, the Research boys over there, fhey were pleasant! they were a l l very
nice people over there.
On August 17, Mr. Taliberg asked as in the presence of Mr. A. 1 . Vall ier i f I would reorganise or organise the engine fabricating group where the new engines would be built, ie told a@ there was a large developieat program i n the asking, with a anaber of engines to m developed and built* m asked ae If I would take
that over* It would come under Administrative Engineering.
1 told hia that I vould like to think i t over aad would he
Mad i f I took a few days to think i t over* He said, "Ho, that's
a l l right* feu think i t ever and lot know,'*
In the leaaatime then Mr* Mcpherson stopped in ay office
down there aad introduced himself. 1 had never ant hia before,
ye had about an hour's 'talk, Ste» vasa'i anything said about what
had happened in tbe past or about the reorgssHsatiem* We just clntply
talked about the dpwmoaeter sot*©, what m were going to do, and what
was to happen, what instrunents end things 1 vas going to need. Be
was very interested in talking about the development work and testing
facilities. We should be sure to have the proper testing facilities
for the coming torque converters. We had a very plaaeant talk, aad
he l e f t .
On August 19, Mr, Tallberg called ne again, and he said
that he had talked with Mr. McPherson end that Mr. Mcpherson thought
that he had not explained to m thoroughly enough what the sice of
this Eagia® fabrieating Departstaat vas to be. The group would also
Include Inspection. Finally, it would become a section.
Mr. Tallberg asked as i f be could definitely bank on me.
I said, "1 asked for a few days." I knew Mr. fallborg from way back
through Mr. Edsel ford. He was close to Mr. Edsel Ford. I said,
"fas, I ' l l bo glad to do i t and I' l l do a l l I can to organise this
-ao8-
group aad ejqpand the Inspection fegmrtmeat to where i t should be."
X took toot*
On SeptoBoar 16\ 19½* ve started organising toie group
which w s t i l l o v e r m toe other buHdlug, i t vas a small .group
-as too floor space would, paamit. lit started a saoll iaapeetioa
group eoaslstlug of f ive aaa* Tiie ass inspected a l l parts.
Sventually. ve kuev toe floor space vas insufficient .
Ms worked towards obtaiaiag aore floor space vfc*f$\ vas not available'
la. toe other b u i i a ^ . F ina l ly , m concentrated oa this area as
toe only space toot vas available*
Wm i tehta© shop bod already been moved froa toe other
building to vbere i t Is now. fftd* space was s t i l l available where
the old ffstal Shop used to be. aar OsMiaamr s t i l l had M s pet
gorsgo dowa bore oa too coraor* 9aat was finally to into bore-*
I t was ylaaned toot we. could haw© Ibis space.
We established a i&speetiaa group down .at too lower
end 'Of toe Imil&iais. fbe l»Ma© FabricmMjK atom was here* Later
on whom too garage of Bahlinger's was moved, wo took over toot space.
Of coarse* we increased toe nuaaer of toe personnel count i n both
groups.
Later on Mr. f s i lberg asked ae to toko over the tolling
of the records of a l l Company ear", pool cars and ao forth which
aifaraatly they di ia ' t have many' rooordo of or what number of gallons
of gasoline were used for the Company cars. Yau couldn't get a proper
inventory. We had to keep a proper inventory and get on e nhonge
when the »IXas#i wee f i l l e d , m i get new ears out and ao em* Va had
to establish the records.
They could never anoouat for the number of gallons of geno*
line used, they ware 5*000 or 10*000 gattono ohort a year. Me put i s
pumps torn here where you punch a card for what gasoline yam take out*
that eliminated the lose.
Later aa fSsHhera asksd oe to also take owar "tba ^ t ^ r h a ^ t ^
aachine Shop and along with i t tho project which had already heea
started — the aoney was already allocated for it «- to auppleaent the
Iteehtne a©p, which would change eons of the aaehsaes t© aore aodera
aacminea* tts were to eXiaiaate the old«tarne aaehinea.
X also had to estafclica a new plating and a new beat
treating shop* Is did that and got it rolling* lie got tha Maohine
Shop in operation and tao f*latiag Ihop in operation* Is were a
little delayed on the Heat Treat Shop due to eearcity of amterialo
now, hut we are getting it together*
Xn the aeantiae I had fowai out from a vary reliable
source that the team of Mr. Belts and Mr. raton had rented a rooa
at the Dearborn inn. All the people that vere working for ae at
one Mm mm asked to go over there one by one. ®*gy had a talking
to, aad, of course* from then oa they were cold towards ao.
m m
1 do a s * know wbat the omsmsmmm mm, hut I ansa i t
was, ®tm either wort .for us or e l a t f Oat sway f rom h i a . * It wm
rather underhanded, and that I s the poiat that 1 mentioned, before
t h a t hurts sad i s mot conducive to team eea^aaartsg*
.1 don't want ta a j a a a r a e v A M K B a l about i t out 1 feel
this way, I've done ay "best for the Ccapeny In what 1 thought was
r i g h t * I d o n ' t t h i n k 1 cotttt have tone aay better, I stayed away
from political satana* and I didn 't net a i a e d un with mm Of these
fakes that Aid go on whether i t vas Bennett — of course, be was a
good friend of aine asyw«y — or ashlinpsr or Hay Ranseh.. I had
nothing to do with thea,
Ths people I worked with, Mr, Ifenry F o r d , Mr* Ideal F o r d ,
Mr. Sorenesn, Mr. P. E. Martin and. Mr . Wlbel, were gentlemen through
and t$exMjgtu WXbel wac i n charge o f the tmmtmmtm, IMaaataast»
fhoas people were a y contacts, although I was responsible t o Mr .
Henry F o r d .
I n aany eaaaa, 1 w gm^»od to have crossed these p e o p l e ,
b u t I didn 't do I t . I ' a etltt surprised that Mr. F o r d d i d n ' t fire ae
b e f o r e . 1 got by with i t soaahow.
I s t i l l feel, t h a t the treatment I received during, the re-
organisation ms unfair and without reason and I know who was partially
responsible for the way i t was handled. I t i s regrettable t h a t a l l
the i?zp<erienee and know-how which I t^ewwlated i n the aaay y e a r s , at
-an-
a cost to the Ford Motor CoB$»ay, cannot he made use of nov. Xt la therefore ejttreasly painful to 0004*1» tbo nany costly ©rrora which
are nade# while hawing to stand by helplessly, or when one i a under
a nuneger who breaks practically every rule in the book, whether
etliics or Cc apany policy and has. no idea of engineering aad freely
adults that he i s only working for the Oogamy because of th® high
salary .ho receives* S t o ia aot to appear as a Mttar attitude, but
i t aeons to be tho Ford blood in ay wains.
Moat of the tines X mm Mr. leary ford he had a gray auit
on; it wee a gray herringbone auit. X can e t i l l see hia.
Be had grey piercing eya* and a sharp expreeeioa. Be had
am alert mind, that i s , up to a point. After Edsel passed, we oould
definitely see a slipping in both hie s w a y sad his mrntal faelli.ties.
Be wouldn't react as quickly aa he usod to before that.
X never ran into anything where Mr. ford would went things
that had bean done away with long ago. Be didn't do that, although
there were l i t t l e things that he would forget. X reaeaber i a one
iaiitaaee he l e f t his glaeeee ttwe. Of mmm$ he never admitted
that he had to wear glasses. Bo left them there to do a l i t t l e
tightening up of the aerewa on the side, or he wanted tbaa fined up*
A day later Mr. Campsall caao i n , and he aaid, "Mr, Ford
loat his glasses, and he didn't know where he left than. Did he by
any chance leave thssa here?"
X said, "Xos, he did Is&ve them here."
& didn ' t xmmBm? that he left his glasses there to have
some; work dome on thea. Sbmt wm wmm& for Jb&m* l i t t l e incidents
of that naftay* kept e*»disg mp»
day and ho looked at my head of hair. Is said, *Xou haven't got
much hair loft, hare youl Wmk mm you doing about i tT"
1 mM, "0b> nothing, there xaa' c auoh that eon. be done
about i t , "
m mM, "If you use teroseme and rub teosom® om it every
morning, you ' l l see that your hair w i l l grow."
X tried i t a few timma, aad, of course, X eomldeH grow
any, f laaUy, a weak latar be said, "low are you making out with
your hair; tvemtemmftT"
X said, "X had to diseoatSmus i t in order to stay i n
olvmmtioa."
He said, "Hell , X got aammfthing else. Sou go ee# Mr.
Heboid, Se's got some pills over there that came from France.
Sake one of those ovary morning bof«e breakfast vlth a glass of
hot water, I ' l l make, your hair grow**
- X took a few of thta, but i t just turned my stomach upside-
down, X disoomtinued that, and from thore on he didn't ask about
Mr, Ford had a very deep interest in health and diet aad
things relating to tiae body. Sack in 1033 or 193 he in one
»213
ay hair, aay aoas. Be always prided hiaself about Ma bead of hair,
l e alaey* kept i t grooaad very aatafuUy*
At one 'tiae X bed a cold aore oa ay lips. Of' course, any
body tbat bed a cold sow was eating ton aany egggf Mr* ford said,
You 're eating to© aany eggs, f««.cuJ«rly fried egge. lay off the
fried egga. Just drink a lot of water* iriak a glaes of hot water
before braakfaet every aerating, tbat 1» is^rtant to start the day
witb a glase of hot water,1*
Be ateaye did that, aa a aat*er of foot. Be bed hot water
in bis car a l l the t iae. we bad to put n special beater which was
run ffcoa the engine to keep that water hofcfel* vara. Be didn't be
lieve in cold water.
I had lunch with Mr. Ford several tinea la the private
dining room, iverybody was in there. Mr* Soreasen and Mr* Martin
vere tbere, and a l l bis people. Mr. Edeel was also there, Mr. Ford
ate very, very sparingly, Bo also ate dry food with a &laae of hot
water to begin, f i n i t e l i t t l e piooes of dried f i sh . I t was- very
dry with no fat on i t . Be had mm soyboaa bread end nuts* Be always
had nuta in hia pockets either m^Mmm or walnuts* le carried around
germ of wheat i n his pocket.
After dinner he w U | bad a cup of tea. with a cup of
hot water afterwards. Be'd drink the tea firat, aad then he 'd drink
tbe hot water after, mm I ate with hia, he didn't -reach for any
-E1&-
seasoning, foster used to prepare toe food for Mr. f o r d , aad
Soger used to serve. Between, toe too they prepared toe food.
when he went out of town on toe " F a i r lane," tosee two
boys were always with hin.
Mr. Ford never suggested tost X take up a certain type of
food, l i k e soybean foods or wheat germ foods. He also never aestloned
his idea of toe perfect typs -of food for toe future*
Mr. Ford used to worry considerably about h is weight* X
reaeaber one incident when Mr. K r o l l emm in over tosre to ta lk
about soae trouble with voltage regulators at the Rouge, there
was Mr. Ford and Mr. K r o l l , Charl ie fhoaas and myself. K r o l l , of
course, waa quite a corpulent geaftlaaan* Mr. Ford said, "Well,
Bleb* you*» getting fat. Oee whis, you*re getting fydto a toaay
on you."
Charlie fhoams talked up aad said, "Tea, look at ae! I'm
auttlag ay weight ®&v&»n
Mr. Kroll s a i d , " H e l l , anybody can buy a large vest."
Mr* ford s a i d , "Ion fellows ought to keep your weight down,
p&rtieulsrly you. Rich. You are pitting t o that age when you shouldn ' t
carry e l l that weight arotaid on you."
Mr. Ford did not believe i n what be sailed p i l l pushers*
He didn't believe in doctors. He believed i n osteopaths. Ha re*
eeived two treatments a week over at toe Cl inton Xaa froa an osteopath.
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I t was a Hr. Ctam&tsv frott Crosse Folate,.
At erne t*ma whom X was - t i l l 9 » at the Fort Myers &ab*
oratory, X bad a taniXm eoXd.. He state l a end said, «Hm* look
MMM. of bad this amem£aa>*
X said, "'Sw* X*ve got a eold," He as*** mCmm Oml We'll go aver to the Clinton laa.
«se» is a doctor mm there, mad yom «m«*
Mr. ford took mm over there, and tMs dootor gave mo a
lamemaaa*. Ho told m % m& a toimjeratw© of 102 degrees ntoemmeit. Ba told am to go borne. He said to bare my wife call him, and fae»d «eUL her what to do, what diet to pat mo on* i f eeuree, for mm first two days i t was Jast ortagO' juice -ma a. bated potato, thea some boHod iena*amas vigour, the mmmm or bmttwr, Xt mm oat a l l right,
X was ejaita emntlaamt in that dootor* St got me oat of that thing pretty <julck.
Mr. Ford resolved these taaataaats from Sr. Coulter.
While Mr, ford did»*t bolievo in dootors, ho s t i l l supported
the Ford »ssiit«X* X aaeaa ho ataa*** other paaasa s t i l l believed $a sector8. A S * was aSa* eomtrsdistoiy to his nature, Ba f&ways
thought that what he bought was right, and swerybody also should
believe It as right,
while U s ford mm s t i l l aUem, tamaa was. very Simla
inovm earn** aee ie i i i i* a** mmmi^mmB:*
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As X recall, Mr* ford was aot subject to colds, whan he
did have a cold, Ms remedy was water, l i s law was to drink a lot of water when he had a cola.
Nr. Ford's language and aanvasaloaa would change froa time to tiae. l i s line of speech was ejiieb and snappy*
At f i r s t X had dtmaaltF i a talking wito Mr. Ford, l o explain something to Mm, i f you used engineering terms, for instance, i a figuring, out th® horsepower or toe torque of an engine, when youfd
toll M a the foaaal* or aigebra.ie functions, he couldn't see that. When you'd write i t out i n algebraic figures, be could see i t . Be wanted i t written out.
Xt was revolutions times pounds — we used to cell i t pound® feet, and be wasted i t foot pounds — divided by 33*000 or
wb&tever toe factor waa. l a used H x L over P. He coulfla't aee tout.
Ae a matter of fact, he insisted that toe scales be
arranged so that he could read toe direct borsepower right off toe scale on the dynaaooster. Ha bad a number of scales where toe hand bad toe r.p.m. shown, and you could move opposite toe hand, and you could see the horsepower, which, of course, was not corrected horsepower* It was toe developed horsepower on the dynamometer. That figure bad to be corrected versus, temperatore, atmospheric pressure and bwsidlty. Mr. Ford wasn't too much interested
in mm cor-^ctioa factor - tftnt ha wanted to m® wm what the
WBlas was doing fight now. fQa* i» got mm not- a tea* fSgaa*
corrected to aaa Jawel aMaaej** ana OS too temperature 68 dogma
Fao3»na@it*
I quite often, vould. aaAate smm prtaciplee X was. laying
ta explain to fwriow ctmctruotioa aMfear on. i n n R»suoM»ory or on
tlie thought fin s»|a& anon quldosr t£ you could relate i t to a stomi
engliio or a water mmX «r to H» Motel f #
X adgfct say tia& My» ford had a ratl^r lisitesl wooaealaiy
talk, to Hiaks hepem** he naa& too M A ^ M M ^ i ^ m m t a ^ . T esa't
mate eat what he to- j^djffg ahast.1*
Is orclina^y eoaveroatlens Mr* Ford g^e-gally jost used
ooisao® tesooa&jio. 1 o*n*t recall that m used any slang to ssy
Ktei speaking with aaafeodr, Mr. Foxd*a wArna ohaaged very
fast from out thing to e^that. X had dimewliy following hla soa*
tlaae whoa ho wosM do that, ion hod to now aad think very fast,
1¾ now projects Mr* For;;, wouldn't haw® to tev® i t ohowa.
In soao iftsteooea i t aim* t reauire mash shsw^g* I f i t won mwm» mm *• was mmXim with, i t didn't t^Om wmm loaniag* M
Othsr ^ f a y that wata ooajAioatod to *¾¾ ha wanted 'to ha ilfwi.
-S3-
Wmm Mr* Iuv& bad an, id®% you baa to bo able to pick out
of his Kiari vnnt lie aaant md iteaaslate i t for Ma* <93ant vaa tba
nan* difficult Hiisg. Bo iiouift i^vor c©«& atxa**!*, out and .009- vhat
at vaaaon* » • m®m talk -about i t , aad tarn i t was up to yom to
ptek i t tte loose ends. m& wmm i t aa i tet you though* 1% vas. If you vast i a the wmm dirootioo* you board about it* 1 » vould fellov
up t© see what you vere doing. Once »r* Ford feast out vhat a per
son eouM do# he aore or taw pros you free reia* Bo vould lot you
go in your own dtroctlsa.
X doa't thiak he m i d switch Ms aethod of approach vhea
mV&m. mM MMmmk paaaSn* I t van always tha samo*
Whan Mr* Ford vantt oaaa te you with a ejanrttan. to en
aolata, soaotlaos he«d want a ftiiok deoioiomi eonatiaoa i t van
prolonged.. Mr, Ford would ante a <pt©k deoJjiio% a snap Judgment.
&gm*$m® he'd any, "feu think about It* Let's think about i t , "
Xn other oases. ni» this decision oa the wind ti«»>»i a»a ta^ttiaii
xoMaaiv&Ua, l a there, ho nade a quick anele&an* So seM, "Do
i t ri#*t nm*i right now**
Qv.ce that Mr. Ford had eetabliahed a pattern i n engineer
ing, he would show a certain amount of o^ervatiam. He vonlanH
want changes* Mr. Ford nasted to keep the m&mm^mn Mm beoaaoo
of a preooieat sot on tho Model T. Wta- a n of his ideas i t iieomod
that the Hotel * was too nchlsraemt for hUa* IvorylMag had t©
ooil axotnd toe Model f. iforftosiig tost wm
ted to Is mm way recite wito ton Naaal T sua
B» f la*l mmm? always earns from Mr« Wmey fort.
After toe mom- T wen* out,, I don't tola* ba loot iBaaiaat
Is eagiaeor^. X tfaVnk too V-0 es^iue i s aa oaaaolo of toot,
tod f ive-cylimfe-r alco, and tba sialgNavaapoaar eaglae*
Gooasissially, Hr. Ford would asw or loss eltgiit too
mto of omgtaooro. aVd rMtea« aoaa developaattto aad now* "llsXl,
ha awaalA mm mmm letter*** Bo aowor took toot attitude wlto ao.
Wm i l y groat AlMppoftfttnaat I had with *>Hit was at too
ttiBg wo ©JbaBjpi froa too aaa&R eortoarotor to too Chmi^ler«Qrov©s
oarlaaTatosr* Baa&IXit of oow@% he eca&siciter d a Goaer&l Motors car-
huretor. Ao far as aa was oaaoaxasd*. taat was a Si Foul* corporation.
Qsaadler «jf Groves war® too ©s jlseers that worked with
l^yyi^y auwa anfaa; fjifg dual, oadRnator 'toot wo «lt%gtBd lator 0¾ away froa too o i»#e e*a4awaaor f»aa Sttrolt lo^rieator. They
tootr rslatioas with laoftiai aad aaat with Bolloy Carburetor
dsMlsfvft ottotoar oarteator i a toa wot style with mmm la*.
out aad woro roa% to he pat
Into iwoaaat&au Mr. .Ford aalsati 1® ower taaaa to doialop- a
1¾¾¾' Cl feiifeHBa?' 'w 93Pwl& SeJfcB Si 8¾- -Jiis5 5Eaaa i 5 ^¾^^¾¾¾^ ¾¾!¾¾!?*¾ aa alft ^^¾^^^^^^^¾^^^^¾^ ^ ^ ^ t t ^ 3&
Ite set out iasediatoto- aad worked oa i t to th© fullest of
ospooity Qmm? there to got it through. abv foremasti cad Mr. llels* QQ> "1*¾¾¾%* ^H-lffiy Btaa^^T P© "lISSSp ffiffieiaaffi '4*¾¾%*
caasitted t h a ^ e l ^ s for a eaartBia mmmt of Basils. From tbaa 0 % Cha©jdier"Gr»ves of Bolley
Xt to aXsset mm, ^ o D s i U i l i t y to mm a mm*0mm eastiag of a
with noszle oars aad «axythi®g oast ia*
bat i t 3»«£%ir®d ^saoadoas tias for
*£ao tiaa was here ahum the
to go tabs production* Mr* ®mmmm kept close contact
a i m us ao to now they ware eeadag aad whom wo were ready.
eoMitaeats with Baadlx .had ram oat* Mr* Soreaeem said,
Xa the amemtiat Mr. ford had t o l a m, %o»«t you
this Chsadler-arorea carburetor warn yours is ready.
the arrsageasats had already besa aado with leadia and so
«221»
forth, Mr. wmmm mmm m mm mmmm aa* mm, got to
lalaaea mm mmmw^mma oosteisator* Lot i t loose* You 0 0 »
still, work 00 yoar% tad m earn got into it later**
I amid, *Jrt» tola not to w oast Hie ®mmmt*mmm
osrbarotor**
said, *S0X1# «*»> told youf*
1 said, "f« know dam watt,*
Is sold, "viell, I U 1 bx*4»g Mm 1» this o tsssaoon,* Mter %w^j.y the "few© of 1¾¾¾ oaat in» Sorstasoa ff%s|4,
:'l«ve 4ust talked to Mr. Ford about thie carburetor aad ebout re*
%M&M$*ta ths Chaadlar'-OrQims oarburttoro* Hho told won to aaaa i t -aa aatil yows is roaiyf*
I said, "Mr. ford did.1* Mr, ford said, mt » y did.* M turned around eat walked
away* Mr* Ford said that, Shot vas the only dJLeaanoiBtaaat 1 had
vim hint. It faaliy hit deep* Mr, goroaooa *asw»
Mr* ford waHied away* Mr* Sonea was there* Be -sold, * W , don't you worry* 1 know what i t ' s all about* Selsase the
anaaa*a*4»a»*Mi mmmlmm aad lot ft go,*1 We did aad that was the
aad of that,
Mr, Wm& did that thea to get- IrflassXf out of a spot, x
aaa*t baow whether ho 4» i t afcife .anybody ale** ast1* the oa%
mm i t happened to ao* BO had bean definite enough 00 both of us
was no adgutt3aygttgSf1iii@ elsattt that.
him m&mimmA tmm of this sarcasm aad tasting and lowering thair
ova a § t i w t § » ©f what tan? hod aoooafM^A, I f ha mm*% take m Xm$m **• »*% earn eould es©eet soaa raps froa hla* Be would
r i fe Mm*
I t wasn't oasnetly on. paaraoaal basis. Sosatisea ha would
ridicule the aaa for doing acsas Uiing and say, "Xou should have known
h e t t » . Bam** yon know anylfefeatt aaaat yaur Jobf®
# ¾¾? 3P 98a? * sflSeS ^ 8 3 59?¾^¾¾ !¾^¾ iflft ^^^^^ S a Qj e aa ^ €^^3awlft3? SBaW^N^ ae ^ 2jLJf i86
the alburn me$m mmmm mm m vttty tanaa****, ho wosiad
closely with Mr. JtoCarroli on tint laetollurgical end*
ttare i s a li'&tlo difteeat story behind tie* alustoa
angina* teosaas a ^ a d to uao that teak engine ao a precadent
to asks a car engine, Butt particular one had overhead valves.
Mr* Ford a£aj)y wasn't M M l a i t , so ho naked us to have,
the angina shipped out bare to be thrown away. Shay bad developed
i t t o w at the Bongo s a l had aade dyafiSMeter teste aad had tan or
three ot H M O engines U n i t . Two of tea wore east dowa hare all.
boned up. He just bad to disposo of than, fbmt TOO the end of
1 don't kaow bow far he was interested in magnesium
dov«lopaoato» I ksow toe tt paeslUH foaaftiy was bui l t doom at the
Hang® end no doubt nas mm Me i a # K * Of mmtmg bast was
prior to the war aad satisfied toe war needs at that tint,
t aa*H mm m* Ford ted amah etatliSMtal fea*tta> Is
ww a ragged individual. 1 guess ha Jawja*i people first % their appear
ance ttaalx* oulek reaction to a aaastlaa he would sarism to •WMWW- I
wotAte*t mar ha mfM$& a deeisioa too mjiokly. Be womM ao oa froa there,
taatdag* aad watt until toes® people aamogod to ostoaUah. toamsalvos
is Ms mind*
X mm Mr. t o r i had a yaiawa**. mm relationship with
mmm Bdison aad Harvey Firostoac. Beyond that 1 wouldn't know of
aayoao.« Ae a person, Mr-. ford ootid be a want poraoa at times. At
m mm time, bo ooaM ae Mte stoma.* Xt dapoiiM open what waa
the object toot oame up ttoa and what waro bis QflHtoip' at toat
X mmm aotioet mm Mr. fm& was ao©%« ¥ou could talk
to his any tfisa* Be roeoatod haviag pooplo runaiag after him. Be
would l i t Wm do It far a wMlo and M M up t te i r enthusiasm aad
toadr pride, aad a l l of ft oudaea thay wore dropped* Baey ware out
things aad giving toam positions of rsapoaaibilit^ .Just to aae bow
timy would roaot. I've *aa» toat. «a bod. one aaa oat hers, x forgot
liis ana* Who »s put* is charipi of obaesio, Mr* fard took ipl^i a *tis*ag to Mat at Wm hegismittg* Be built hia up pretty e&aaa to
Slwldrick. Ao a aattar of fact, there was naoh frictioa between
tea aaa, i t got aw sowar** but mm m$m was. kept rightup to
m top IrnmU m mmm t» -mmm, out aim mmmmm out of tbe
plant. Whether eoaebody aaa 2Jaa& % to antes h*% 1 4oa*t m a * * *
out anyway ae woo caught at It* mm aoaent He woo caught at i t , Mr.
Ford fired bin iwdiateXy, «afe goo® fro® a high, aaaa* right dowa ' 8 8 l| ^ a 8f jj *a Me Je$8fc eva *es IfctSSa 0 eBJO M ¾!¾!¾¾¾¾ '^f^S^R^ ^e^ii^Sf^ se^a$ ^^3aawJ(la^^^ ^0¾¾ 'SSe^Ra} ^¾¾^
Just heard the story tfcat no swiped staiatMag and that be was caught,
fiat was i t , Saat was »r* Ford,fo aeaotlaa to that type of preposi
tion. Bang* ,«®4 ba was thaaaghl
X wuuM ifonnfr an laa$iast like that would reqpalre a l i tt le
checking into bote® tha aaa is f trad.
Hr« Fsrd was easily of fended aad showed wary strong reactions
if soaobe&y ©pposad »a* ft* vouXda*t lose Wm tsapor at those tfaao* m would Just walk away. You could eos the e^esoiou on his face
change, you could te l l what ate&a of adad he was in by looking at
bio facial mm»mm* If you mm mm the vricklas upon his tee*
sstghty careful*
le wouM temporarily hold a grudge oaoo as had bean crossed
that way. I « o ^ « o o © d that very oftea. waam 1 approaobad hia with
-2S5-
seaething or mmmm d idn' t go right, be would Just stay avay f a r
thrae or four weeks or possibly a aeatt. fou wouldn't see hla, aad
than he'd eoae back.
During the t i a t he stayed amy, you wouldn't dare go after
l e a r a hov to take asnrensh bin*
As far as I r e o a l l , I never aav h l a vhat you vould c e l l
aad, as otter people described h l a to ae* Be shook h i s l i n g e r aad
so forth, I've heard, hut I never saw M a i n tbat eoaditloa. Be
never r e a l l y got angry while I knev h l a .
Mr. f o r d would aot apologia® for M s mistake i f he t o l d
you to go ahead and do soaetihing and I t worked out to your disad
vantage. Be wouM say nothing. He'd Just ignore i t and pass over
I t .
I don't think Mr. Ford ever v o r r l e d . As a natter o f f a c t ,
I've wondered aaay t i n e s , with tao aaay things he had on M s Kind
and the r e s p o n s i b i l i t i e s he had, hov be could a a i a t a i a aa even
disposition, as he d i d and hov he could sleep at nights and hov he
could go dancing at nights. Ie bad h i a eXd^fasMeaed dances around
here and f i n a l l y over i n the Kecreation Building, I just couldn't
figure I t out.
Ve f e l t ©one o f tbe agitation out here that vas going
through the Ford Motor eonpaay for union organisation and th© steps
bin. He thing to do to vait until be back. You had to
that mm mm* to eaatat ft. <Eaat mm m Mr. Ford's mmwm#m.
Urmmw. m mm m together around mm conference table l a tfas
Blue Boom, fasre vas Mr. foerbess, Mr. Joba Sorenaon, ayeelf, sad
1 tflolaat taata oast be some photographs of i t . Be vaa sitt ing ©a
tha esnfasanae table. He oalled tbe abotosraaber la ha< soae
plctaQ?as. takea.
Mr. Ford vas talking about the uaioa at the Rouge at tbat
tiae. Bo aaid, "Hiay**® trying to organise tbe Rouge pleat. How
would ym fellows feel i f soae of these flanttae vould eoas up bore
to talk to you about labor relatiotts aad labor in general? Sons
of these faUova can't even mm l*telUa*atly. Hov vould .you
feUovs feel about it?"
That vas the question he sprung oa us* Of course, nobody
aade aaeh of a ooaasat about i t . That is a l l ve heard about i t froa
his end.
I didn't see anything of the »37 strike other than vhat
I saw-la mm newspapers. It never really reached out to Dearborn
at a l l . I stayed avay froa i t eanplataly*
ttthou# Saanett's Servlee Befartaeat bad a lo t of anti
union activities going oa, pulling badges and discharging of aen,
I didn't see any of that out here.
I don't think nosey meant anything to Mr. Ford, l a never
carried any aoney with hla. Ba never borrowed anything froa aa, but
•287*
I know people he borrowed from.
Be used to have a bunch of new dollar "bin* i n his pocket
once in m while and would pull thea out. They were brand-new dollar
b i l l s . When be went down to the schools, he passed tbem out to tbe
children, I suppose. 1. sew Mas once, when he case i n . pull out a
bunch of single dollar b i l l s , $11 brand-now. Be fingered through
thea and said, "Bice green stuff, i sn ' t i t ?"
8cm people would bore Mr. Ford, eepeelaHy people with
very technical language. Xf Mr. Ford vas s i t t ing, he'd just fold
hia anas and cross his legs and s i t and say nothing. 411 of a
sudden he*d just get up end walk away.
1 would aay itr» tad was a stubborn aen. Be waa aet in
Ma ways most definitely. Shot is iUaetaafted by his refuaal to
change certain thinga.
I think Mr. Ford liked to be alone. I know he took &
rest. Bin schedule, m 1 resamber i t , waa to- get up early in the
morning, eoae in here, or go out to th© tmm, or go down to the
Bouge even before ve caae in here. At IOIOO a.m* he would go boas
and have teeakfeat with Mrs. Ford. After that he would take a rest.
Be would eoae back, and. at 1*00 p.a. they would have luach here.
Once in a while they took off froa here end went out to
Milan or to the Bouge eoae place. Froa there be would take a rest
again. Around, four or five o'clock he'd be around here, again and
-288-
pmUmWw b» S»r@ an t l l six or o'clock. ft»t wm day after
day. Is falloaaa that peatta/ ragalarly.
a>. fori, would pop i» at odd ttesa. You lawer tow iftest
b e ' d I got so I f a i t i t as aaa i a the bulldteg* I was
aavar c«c«s®M» I f 1 « eaaa 1% ftee; I aaa glad 'to aaa Ms,
Eo ms a hard san to ttaderataad. Ife waa a quiels>ciaui«izv,
oharso tar . Aa far as 1 r e c a l l on the dealings I had vim hia, 1st
woo consistent in M E ideas. Bennett says om of the thin^* that
bothered him the most about Mr* Ford was hio inconslfcteacy. 1 doa* t
helieve that. I t doesn't add 1¾). Of course, lie had different rela-
tioas w i th bfet than I had*
Mr. Fori wao any mm peoplo ha aat for the f i r s t tdaa
or new people., The pec$3e would have to ba on Ms level or olose
t o hie level m be "wouifi be shy with then.
I would say lit** Fori was given to deyuresalng seemed
t o t h i n k and $eaam a 1st* Yon could see lata eayftcaaa. mm walla you
talked with hUt. When he'd cone J % you'd always tew to have two
chaira ready. He'd occupy one. You'd occupy tbe other, Sonetine©
be wouldn't even s i t oowa, but when be did s i t down, whan tm wanted
t o H o d out aoaatlttng, be said, "What's new tedayt"
Froa there an 1 » didn't nay a word. f « ware sitf©«& t«
tell M a everything, pick out the things he was iatereetea in and
t e H fete taa rooalts yoa oetateed.
Qf course, he'd s i t tiers, lite® you through, he«d
It vent Into & long conversation into relating things. Be amy nave
given different ideas or orders and aade ooaaamta about i t , aad then
m want off. Baartfceae b*»d take yom along. He'd say, ' t e e on along.
m*U go ©at for a ride and ve*l l talk ease aore about i t ." BamUmm b«*d oall you into Ma office. You'd al t doom i a
his office, viad up tbe old socle boa aad ait tbere vhU* this ausle
bom. played may aad talk, ton bad to be pwpawd for different needs.
limy tints be cans into ay office oat of his door and said,
*Coas on. Lst*s go out. for a ride. bVtt go out tbe back door. Charlie i s i a Caapaall'e offiee. Be's watting for aa. Let* a go
out the back door.*
goreasen vas tearing his .hair out down tavat>
whether It was of the practical joke type. We beard a lot about
i t but we never noticed i t aach around mm* l e bad ajaite a sense
1 recall when ay boy went to school over bare. Of course,
be asked ae to send hia over there when we aoved into this bouse.
Stare was no school or traejajNnTvBtian arouad tbere, so he said.
-230-
Hmm& you neve out there., your hoy will go to the Greenfield Village
to school, and he 'll bo picked up by bus."
fan boy uoed to ooa* l a t& tho ovoatag and go bona with
aa* He was eight or nine years old. One evening the boy was there
with ao. Mr. Ford esae l a . OS course. he shook bands with Ralph
and asked Msi how school was going and was anita aloe to bin. The
boy pretty near f a l l over*
Mr* Ford said, "Cane oa. Let's go into the office."
mm ooat into tba office* Be said to Ralph, "Start an the amsle
box* Viad i t up sad lo t i t play over there*®
Mr* ford reached book In his drawer and bad ooao toys In
there, ooao l i tt le toys like l itt le alee aat frogs and ao forth* He
nave Ralph a handful of tbat aad said. "Bate, take these bone**
9$ started talking to as about Hitlar. lis aaid t "You know,
those boys that are over there in Geraeayf Hitlar i s taking then
oat and putting a gun i a their hand while they are at this age. low
would you l ike i t . "
BO kept oa talking aore about the conditions over there.
Belph was sitting beside us. I didn't feel we should talk about
this business l a front of this boy while th® boy aay he ready to
conceive ideas In his head at that ago aad say, "Sow Mr. Ford i s
ay god. t*m going to heMem what be believes.* Z didn't relish
Mr, Ford .sMBa§d to think Mtl«r*s program against too Jews
we* .good* to Uxiugat tt bitting tem^te trouble spots.
St would half to eleaa «p tbat ares.
Mr* •1¾¾ received sone deoopitioa froa over 'there i a OaiMsaiy.
X tMnk that mm about tbe tins Mnfflierg* oa®* hank froa over mm-* m Mr. Faal » s « toa» was, '"Ssoy seat m mm ribbon mm* fhey
tatt mo to ****** i t or elae 1 % not aa immiem* Vm going to keep
i t . # Skat w to o«% ooaaemt.
mm% the Second World «te, Mr* ford. aa*t, ""ana ia just
another thing starte* by the as Feat* aad Wm nbajISatu they're going
to do the mat in this war m Hay aid ir. th® last war. the Qmtmm
aat the IngUsh were fighting each other, end s t i l l thay aero trading
with each other. Aay were sending stuff bank aad forth. they were
aaannltlon and antwrial book and forth while people were
Mltod out in the field. ©Us ia going to ten out about tba ease
way." So bat that tmMm i t was a bwinaao, a aonsy*eikiag
proposition*
I don't know what led Mm to join the tearioa First Coa»
•tttas*
1 dem»t atta* Mr. Fori ««®ssed to be the jealous uOMAml
as far as tiae success of # t i *» ma mmmmA or ^mmmm of paopte
to their loyalty, at least not in Me iaaadtat® surroundinga. I
don't think you eouM call, i t Jealousy m so aaay words.. X know
he talked ehont the Da fattta* the i)u fonts mm eomtroiliag a l l the
ware ead world affaire mm m forth down the Mae. that was his
aairthau I cen*t « » « he mm Jealous.
Mi?, ror4 seemed to mmm WmwmU* »« Ssooswelt imtesseXy.
the .£iu font® end the Btorgsas mm th* two he mentioned* he lamped
then. Be didn't say much about irockefeil^r, to me anyway. Mr* Ford
seemed to fool aaims strongly that there moo. a 'M Foot-Jewish-Roosevelt
cllqtie that was more or less tied together. This warn pretty deep in.
him.
Besmett metes a sataaamnt that he definitely had a per-
.seoutton oomjimm as far aa. those peoplo mora eoaeoraei and that i t
honored Mr. Ford .all the time. I would ear « aaa pretty deep i n
him. It was a faaammmmail thing.
le felt these people were ©at % get him poraomally* that
ioaoooiy was after hia, aad thai, mx Street was after the Ford Motor
Compamy and mmm Ford. Maybe X shoulto't cal l i t fear, hat that @em*
plex was fteseat at a l l tfmas* geaaseiy was trying to get something
out ©f hiau Hat could possibly escgAaia one of Bennett's strongholds,
the loot that Baaastt was his promotion,
Mr. Ford didn't seem to he worried shoot his personal safety,
heoettSO you'd see hia driving &roxml l a his ear a U sy hiaaolf most
any tiae. I don't think m was ®£mM tor his sake. I think he was
vitally afraid of the hoys* sad Edsel* e 11010%. ge wanted them
-233-
protected ia tbat
I couldn't amy ahat ooaaected Mr. Bsaaott with Mr. Ford
or why he bod aaab a bold oa Mr* Ford; whether i t waa bis
of doing things aad pm»im Mr- tort, I eeoMa't say. I
ever Mr. Ford told M*a to do soaothiag, h» jaaped aad did i t . I t 's
like the oM story whom be told. 1 6 » to tear toe smko«tocka down at
the. Rouge, isrry Saaaatt was roft%- to m sad do it* Mr. Ford
ably felt here he bad a ana rcgiu-lless of what be toM hia he'd
aad in i t ; be would carry out e*aava.
I doa't know wbethor Mr. Ford respected Barry Beaaatt
.altogether to Ma wtlAtagpaso to ao w&mam for Maw 1 can't
coive that ba would respect Mm altogether that way. Be just found
MM useful oa certain occaslow* When this individual nulled soae*
totag Mr. Ford toou^bt wasn't r i ^ i t , bo Just wrote i t off to eaperi-
oaco to see bow the individual would react.
I board about too John Gillespie story, bow be was to flad
out what Beaaett was iolag. X don't fcaow anything spsolfle about i t .
the only one X know of tost bo bad ebeek a* Beaaatt — X don't know
bow far i t wont - w.s ]»ttUa*w« Of course* miM&wr was a l l
l a glc-vs to a
It was mmumWfr indirectly guided by Isaaatt. fbo Sendee
%m bed ***m una «BB» tOO «00d MtfaOr. 1¾*¾ i&dividUalS Wit Im. ebJOPMI ^Q^St jjtL # 81¾¾¾¾*¾¾' Jptf ^ ^ ft ^^^¾¾^¾^^1¾¾^^^ ^Sjjjl?' ^ n i#<a i*D | 3P • linnet SHJjjjp' ¾¾¾¾¾¾¾¾¾ ¾®!¾¾ ¾¾*¾¾¾
tha Service X tpartaent, I m had any difficulties with thea, ^though
X knew things *oram»t hftad3«d the way they could have been bandied,
these was just nothing that anybody cenM ## about i t , because the
mmmmmt of that Service Saparuaast reached bach to Mr. ford aat
Dsliiii^erj he aaa*** the buttons
mmm* ** **» *M» *>• ford! however, Dahllager
» M d to be the wblnnlaK bar occasioasllar. I saw the results of -aant
on Dahlinger. X aean that he was whipped by Mr. ford. Bay was cuite
a eaatlewntallst. When he got whipped, yam could see i t a l l over.
Bay was considered as the pipeline of Mr. Ford around hero.
The way It appeared to us was that lay on*}* talk Mr. ford into nest
anything, one way or another.
X doubt vary aueh whether Mr. ford respected Bay's knew-
3#d§@ and ability, mm you talk about roopoct, as X know Mr. ford,
1 don't think he within Ma would respect such a thing. X think he
would reseat i t , but be would see am mrmmm whore he could, work
through that iadlvidtini to bis end. Theae were useful tools for
biau
there wasn't aiiythlng Mr. Ford didn't know about. Be was
perfectly aware of the thing* Barry laawttt did. Aa X aeatiomd onoo
before-, I asked Ma once niy Us put up altn a aan l ike Bennett after
-235-
m got tftmeja with t h i s beater mm* Be sold, "Well, what 's the
difference? xf I pat soieitoody elite i n hie plane, give then a few
cognising hunan f r a l l i t y in that sense. I t ems a pretty cost ly r o
of baam f m i i i t y .
As f a r as X har, £. 0. Liebold's relations with Mr. Ford
along and Liebold disappeared, froa there on, Mobolft was dead;
Martin, and Hoary F o r i worked wry closely tonetl
ga every way. He tried to follow Mr. Ford's wishes
as far as be could, Wmn be ran ay againat a Rtiatfcling
block, bo didn't mind t e l l i a g hia. Be kaev bow to t e l l h i a . Mr. Ford
a lot froa Mr. Martin, note from Mr. Martin mm he d i d froa Mr.
ion vas foroeablo. Whan be bad an idea or soaetbing
to say, be forced %U way ^rongb. Be did .assy things that did not
with .Mr. Ford's vifshes.
X didn't kaov of any trietlon between Martin six*.
to cesapleaemt each other. Ebay seeaad to work v a i l
I think ths friction betimes Mr. Ford and Mr.
way back. Ever aiaee I 've been here, there's bean a certain of friction ever/ once in a while.
Qeei®ioaaXly Mr* ford used to give orders to keep Sereaeea
out of His experimental office. I f e e l tbat. Mr. Ford real ised that
fir. Soroaoem hod done a l o t of good i n production 900000» Be has
done a l o t of good, p a r t i c u l a r l y i n easting work. le*8 done an ex-oollont job ia eavayiaa; eoapttay paXloiea. ifeatovor Mr. Ford told
bis* If i t suited Soreasea* i f be aav i t was r i g h t , bo aav i t througb
ra@8r€l®sa of' what obstacle© be hod ta overcome. tEbat was bio force
f u l way. $h® f r i c t i o n between toe tea was apparent a l l too way along
too 11a®. It would appear .and disappear, but you knew i t woo there.
X aaa't think Smmmm and Bennett ware what you might c a l l
good mmm, mmm woo a certain l i t t l e mta&mlsm eaistiitg there,
Barry Boaaett conceived toot leaooh was toe oae wa© would stop iato
Soreasea's shoes. Xt was dc-fixtitely l a the picture, Bausob was
fbe only occasion I baaw of t h i s bad feeling betoaoa
Serenaem sad Bennett was too one mmmm out at vmm Hum abere
Bennett took a swing at Bosooe Smith, aad Soreasoa won too f i g h t .
I don't know amok about too story om Willow Bun. 1 board
about the lacidont out there but I didn't pay aaob attention to i t .
I wasa't too much latoreated .is these thirds, X bad .my l i t t l e beaten
over toere whore X could sake things and work on anything that hadn't
been dome before. faaa Imtrl^sjaa ae. Aot woo my hoofaa. aaai went
on as far as rumors and ao forth wore eooeeiaed, I d i d n ' t pay much.
attsatlcaa to it*
t'cat node m* ford iaeiie mmmm had to go. He dtj®»t
:-11¾¾ used to be t t» p l u i t c ^ ^ - r , Be toM s» &
left that Seroasea mmm be oat. Of aaataa, I
that w smother ©as of these mmmm* I i » » t pay amah attestioa
i t .
Ilhea m* Wm® mm boot ~~ X Mak f t m i tte the last year he was dowa i a ieotgia *- bs stopped la
aald mall®* 1 » a***, "a«'f aaa fellow ttet aa***
ai» fiaa here oa oat." 1 a o w 1*@«ght of Soreasea, I t
a few days before egaasaatdy,
I mM, "Who aa aaatf baa was hotiawiag aaf • Ba mM, "Chz^U®. I bat Frank call MJS aad t a l l hia he
He gave fwmm a sob story that ho had iaeeae tax to
r. She* ettasH aatai amy dSfteasoo to as. Ba*a oat,*
I aaala aa l aMa Mr. fara*a mmmm for m he meter told m, mm for Ms &®&d@troag JH§*. his
ia patttag his ideas ftoross. I >isagiao as .felt Mr* ford
was smtttas elder so ho oottld fores his maw threveh aore mere*
plwa Barry ieaaett stepptag 1» diotatiag to Maauf oe turlag as well
was gottiag iato latttiaaamai definitely, l a was i a
oa that. That's way Mr. fibol left. Mr. Wibel vould aot be dictated to by Beamett} he refused to be dictated to by Beaaett.
Benaett*s interest la Pwchactag could, ham ptoaibly beaa
deat by the heater incident. Bo hJaself worked on that, plus Rauschj Bausch was his aan ta work on. that. .10 aligned Baaaoh. to that particular pro-Joot*
Jf^na t5fc36an\ fiiHP@ nn fc al ^» ^Kal e K 5NBtPp |p ¾¾¾¾¾*¾ ^SJSWo^PB Sfeltj CJCa$8©£ ^¾1* TL 0¾¾¾¾¾¾?1
was Inside of that place. X heard they had a room down under the Hi-Lir«j where ho would go and take a rest, hate ooapany down there fj j probably had a bar est up down there*
Baanett aakes the statement tbat ho resigned froa tho Coapany, tbat he loft i t and that he newer waa asked to leave. Bennett know hatter. 1 eosmidsi? thst too rldleultms to i s a • — I T
ing i t , most .-^finitely. fhere was an apparent friction between Mra* Meal Ford and
Mr. Fold. That was aawlaan. X think i t was because @f the relation of Xtelsr*
People close to annal generally vent out, Ilka Crawford, Black mfi Kansler. Mr. Ford was talking about Ksazlsr. Be aaid.
Mr. Ford bad 'tt© - 1 0 0 1 1 » » for aanabnr whataoever. Stanett said Mr. ford once nade the statoaant, "Oh, Bdael
mm WmOmv mm *© *• banters." I don't ^¾¾¾ p a o n l t y that
ta ttiajaafalaaat l a Ms son. X think he hid the daafpoet feelings
for fct* sea. I think be adalfad bm iojy ansa* X think be mm
tiding to educate Edael ta* bard way and didn't know when to atop.
Hr. Ford saoasd to regret be bad bean tbat way when Edsel
passed oa, from mm way he anted, whether i t was regrets of wbat
be did to E^sel, i f a bard to toy. .Anyway be felt awful attar that.
1 would be aore or less took tbe responsibility on Ma abonlders.
It ia possible, as Bennett says, that Mr. Ford fa i t tbat he had caused
Edsel a great deal of nnbappiaass and regretted i t . Any huaon being
wonM feel tbat way.
Ton would mm Wm* Ford with Mr. Ford wry seldom, tie
beard ate was i n ite plant aoat alaae. I don't think aha went into
Mr. Saaeron's office wary aneh. 1 would aay iwrliig ny tiae hare,
I've probably seem bar three tinea.
Mr. Ford always told ae she was Me guiding star. She
guided hia. Xt s c a r e d that she aaa the he®® i a the boat ami he
waa tba boat omtaila of ooaaOB ianawaeta*
I aaa!*** figure oat what Mr. ford'* religious beliefs
wort. I know be did heXiave i n a higher being. Just what be be-
Moved, l eould never figure out.
Xt aaaaa ho tela** with aa about. mimmmmUm* I t 'e
not aalt* c law l a ay a***, an said* *fou know seise day we're a l l
going to eene back. We think we're going to die, but noes dor «o*f
« 1 1 aaing to cone book**
1 thin* tbat ia what bo aaid. X ' a aot positive shout it*
Sa taHssd about, it. bat I doa't recal l tba vary wmm bo aaid.
Nr. Ford said bo f a i t bo oaa guided by a higher faroe
Mfwwflf aad that he vas doiag these things because ho vaa raided.
but 1%. guided." X couldn't connect vbo vas guiding hia, Aether i t
van Mre* Ford who vaa guiding hia m mmrnmr i t vas a high<
X didn't mm: the mmUm **oa Ma\ that be vaa. a
through which aeaa divine power was being fuaneled to do good i a
tha world* X mmmmXiw * n * H aajjUwt in it*
Xa .Moadag up ay oonaee-^oaa, experiences aad ap&nltme with
aad of Mr. ford oad Mr. Rdsel ford, i t any appear Sa tha above rela-
5»n» v 8 ' a y ^ B SPBo S ^ ^ ' 0¾¾® ¾' < a fcfi* ¾¾¾??)¾¾©¾ '©• ^ SBvWBKft * W^ p P ( a)aaa p9~
interested i a obtaining personal advantages, aad 1
Any psrs^aai atvantoges, ether mm aalaing haawlodge l a
engtnaeiing, mm- bo diapravoA by the foot tbat ay salary was about
aa low as i t eould be unt i l Mr. Bdael ford aad Mr. Martin vara l a
i n adjusting It w a mmmmMm lovei l a accordance with
ta this world. Mr. ford would not hear of i t , .and had
to do vim i t .
I t ooennd that Mr* fort's *a*aaa*t l a aa
-241-
siaply this* X appealed to b k as a i tadtrldual sat fas eoald saa
possibilities to claim "another John ^mdersee,** aad that be could
aake anajmasra at w i l l , mm mm igmm® at the Mm unaa ba asked.
tbat I bad. * collage eAicatioa. I uas asked to strike taat portion
out, u&icb* of course, 1 refused..
3B£S ossuraaco w toon follosad by the 'usual, silent treat*
meat aad a Asrtiav afcftft to Mr. liepottt,
Xm conclusion, I s t i l l consider I t a groat privileee aad
honor to bos® boon asooelated with 00 groat a aaa as Bleary Ford and
a etm. greater aam as Biosl Ford. Both mm a traaaaoous inspiration
to aa, aad i t .is ay hope end wish tost I a l l l ba able to show the
present Ford family tba saas loyalty that X hare shown their father
•ad ercar^a'thar a i m Wm paraaaunt interest l a "Kngineeriag without
Pol i t ies . m
A S D E J C B A
237
question: Did Bennett attempt to have Mbv Ford ease Sereasea outt
That 2 aaa*t kaav.
49 aaeittaas Beameti denied the story ta»t Mrs* Ideal Ford a t a
of Itooetor'e l i f t i ng mm mmmm @u#t leave or would not take o a t . Could you oofssant on that?
1 don't knew. 1 wasn't at the meeting. I wouldn't to
mmUmt Did Mr. Ford diaouss Wmmmt Cottgttla, the Silver Shirts that type o f organisation
I t .
t
1 don't know anytiiiag about i t .
242
p o t i o n s Bid Mr, Ford t a l k to .you about the arramgeaante that side with various banks i n order to
ao.
-4*3-
faga S&2
Qjawtloas MA Mr* Ford vk» any eoasento m to what Johnson talked about at toe tiae Ooteeoa flaw up to Detroit to visi t hint
Answer: Ho.
Page 2%2 Question Isanett aafa Steal meed to he. aa tgasrt after toning wlth
M s fatoor sad be so ftugtrotod toot he'd throw up.
/maver! 2 don't snow aoout toot.
Page 2½
Question: Bid Edael gees to yield Me ietess to his fatoer? Answer, aot X as»«t say whether ho- m& or aot*
Alfiero, Mr., 56» 58-59 Allison, Fred, 167 timrlam Bosch, 108-210» i ? 4 Aaerioa First Coamittee, 232 Americas lard Rubber Casipsay, 12-13 AraiagteaHSim® engines, 38 Appreetioe system, Ckmasay, 1*5 Arndt, Carl, 18-19, 21 Bagley Avenue Shop, 50-51 Bakelite tube, 40 Bask Holiday, 1933, 44-45 Beaker, Mr. (Cashier's offiee), IB Belgian block, 86 Belts, L. L . , I96-I9Q, 201, 205, 210 Beadix, 220-221 Bennett, Barry, 54-55, 57-58, 60, 125, 127, 143-144, 179, 199-200,
211, 227, 229, 233-235, 237-240 Beaaett, Harriet, 125 Biebop, J l a , 121 Bishop end Baneoek, 56-57 Black, Bob, k% 239 Bouehard, C. L«, 205-206 ^raaen,'' 31 Brisker, M. L . , 150, 157, 16*1, 166, 175 Brooklyn Mary Yard, 10 Brooks, Barry, 18, 20-21, 23-24, 145 Bubb, Janes, 124 Bugas, Mr., 195 Bureau of Staadarda, 159 Boras, George, 129 Cadillac, l6 Callahan, Jim, 203 Cameron y # j , 24o CJampsali, Frank, 29, 44, 47, 102-103, I86-I87, 190, 200, 212, 230,
238 Carroll , Charlie, 58, 195
Chandler, M. E . ' 220 Chubboek, Horaoe, 132 Clark, Dr., 158-160 Clinton Ian, 215-216 Continental* 131 Cooper, Mr. (Br. Clark's assistant), 159
-245-
Cornell University, 139 Coulter, Or. Lawsoa B . , 2l6 Craig, B. J., 199 Crawford, John, h$9 75, 239 Cutlery E. J., l i t Bshlinger, Ray, fcl, 85-86, 12¾, 127, 329*130, 193., 209, 211, 23M35 Dearborn Inn, 210 Dele© type eyetea* 113 Detroit lea Machine and Carrier, 192 Datroit Lubricator Conpany, k2-k% 115, 220 BSE, 1¼?, 190 Donovan, Mr. (worked oa radio beacon), k% Pulaage, B i l l , 76 Du Poat Corporation, 220, 232-233 £ U Laboratory, 56-58, 128, 179 Ebling, George, 2$8 Edison Institute
Greenfield Village, 52, 231 Fort Myers laboratory, k2-Uk, 32, 216 Martha-Mary Chapel, 28-29, 52-53» 130 Msnlo Park Machine Shoi^, 27-28 Sarah Jordan fiosrdlnghouse, 35
Henry Ford Museio*, 121, 198 Meaaeraehaidt 109 engine, 198 Steaa engine aodel, 37 Steaa engines, location of, 121
Schools, 52-53 Edison, mmmg 22k Ende, Carl, 17 Esper, Al, 22, 7 , 1 1 Essex Wire Company, 105-1Q6, 108, 113 Eton Itonfseturing Coapaay, 56-57 Ever Bendy Coapsny, 35 **ai» Lane," 215 Ferkaa, Gene, US, 98, 176, 181 Firestone, Barrey, 22¾-Firestone f i re and M i r Ccapaay, 35 Ford, Clara, 196
Firat Ford, 35 Martha-Mary Chapel, interest in , 28-29
Ford, Edael, 10, 26, 63, lk, 211, 21k Acoustics, 68-72 Administration, 200
- 2 ½ -
Ford, Edsel Airplane, flying wing, l40~l4l, 146-147 Brakes, hydraulic vs. mechanical, 91 Death, 166 JOynaaoaater y interest in, 50-52 Engine design, interest i n , 52 Engines, 6-eyiiader, desire for, 97-96 Exhibitions, "Shirty Years of Progress," flf.y., 1933, 50*51 Ford, Henry, relations vi th , 72-73* 97-98, 131, 239-2¾© Ford V-8, design of, 32-33, 4 l Gregory, B . , relations with, 83-84, 131 Beater contract, interest i n , 59 Beater purchase, interest i a , 128 Personality? 242 BeUability Base, 23 Spring Suspension, Interest in, 92-9% Sprung, 81-84, 131-132 Sway bar dewalojpemt, 102-103 Tallberg, Y. Y., relations with, 208 Wind Tunaal, 74-76
Ford, Henry, 45, 58, 152, 211 Adminiatratiwe ideas, 66-67» 219, 224-225 Administration, reorganisation, 1945, I87-I89* 194-196, 199-201 Altitude emnmmwr, interest is, 157, 160 Aaerioa F i rs t Coaaittee, 232 Appearaase, 212 Aviation* interest in, l^~lk6 Bank Soiidey, 1933» 44-45 Banking, attitude toward, 63-(¾ Beadix earbwretor, attitude toward, 221-222 Bennett, S. B . , relations with, 54-55, 58, 234-233 Brakes, hydraulie ws. mechanical, 90-92 Brooks, Barry, relations with, 24, 145 Carburetors, design of, 220-222 Car heaters, interest in, 55 Children, interest i n , 52-53* 230-231 Cooling eysteas, 79 Coapetition, dearies of, 66*67 Competitors* 90-91 Conversation, 217-218 DeOainger, R. f relatione with, 234-235 Baneiag, old-time, 129-130 Diet, 23^-215
•g47-
tta Bendaiscsaces of Mr. JmsU Zoerlsla
ror«, neary Mstributor
Design of, X80, 188-185, 189-190 Interest i n , 101, 11*7-150
Doctors, attitude toward, 215-216 Du Pont, attitude toward, 220, 232-233 ibwsKawters, 193-19%
Control of, %8-52 Beading of, 217-218
Sdlson, T. A . , relations with, 22¼ Education, ideas about, 53 E l e c t r i c a l Laboratory, control of, k& Electron microscope, 130, 132-1½)
Conservatism, 219-220 Control of, 91
Engineers, attitude toward, relations with, 53-5¼, 220, 223 Engines, 6-cylinder, attitude toward, 97-101 Engine test, methods of, koAl England, 6j~68 Exhibit ion, "Thirty Years of Progress," H . Y . , 1933, interest i n , 50-51 Experimental engineers, interest i n , 19 Fireplace beating, experiments with, 114-117 Firestone, H. S r . , relations with, 22¼ Firs t Ford, 33-35 Food experiments, 11.6-11¾ Ford, Clara, relations with, 2to«gtl Ford, Edeel
Death of , effect of , 63, 186 Relations with, 33-35, 71-73» 97-0, 233-23%, 239-2*0
Ford, Eleanor Clay, relations with, 239 Ford, experimental 5 cylinder, assign of , 180-1¾ Ford, Beery II, relations with* 16V185 Ford, 60 H.P. ¥-8, 95-96 Foard v-8, design of, 32*33* 3 ^ 2 Fuel Injection, interest i n , 175*176 Gasoline fuel injection, 53 German decoration, attitude toward, 232 Germany, interest i a , 65 Coveraaent c o n t r o l , 66 Qredus, A., relations wito, % . Sregory, lobert, relations with, «0-131 lealto, I86-I87, 195-196, 212-2X3, 215-217
-2½-
Ford, Beary Health ideae, 233-21% Beaters, iaterest la, 179-180 Helicopter, design of, 1%Q-1%5 Hitler, attitude toward, 65, 231-232 Bev«r> 121-122, 230 I n i t i o s systeaa
Aircraft engines, 173-176 Ideas on, 32, 39, %6
Kaasler, E. C , relations with, 239-2½ Liebold, E. 0., relations with, 236 Lincoln Cabriolet, design of, 83-0% Martin, P. £., 236 McCarroll, R. H. , 13%-137, 195, 223 MeClure, Dr. R. S., 138-139 Meebanioa, intereet i n , 2%-27, 29, 38-39 Metallnrgy^ i n v e s t in, 223-22% Money, 63-6%, 197-198, 227-228 Moods, 22% Moore House, heating of, 11%-117 Moore Bouse Laboratory, 118 Morgan, J . P . , relations with* 233 Muaie, 35-36, 128-130 Hiepoth, C , relations with, 178-179, 3w38*Xd9» 2*2 BRA, 66 Faclfiaa, 67, 232 Pearson, Qrew, controversy with, 66 Peraoaality, 61-63, 122-127, 170, 282-88¾ 228-23© P-%7 ongiae ammt design, interest in, 176*179 Publieity, 1% Race, views oa, 6V65, 68, 232-233 Radio teats,^terest In, 112
Roosevelt, Franklin D., views on, 66, 233 Routine, 228-229 ME, attitude toward, 90 Service Departaent, 235-236 Sheldrick, L., relations with, 7%, 91 Sedth, C. J . , relations with, 21 Smith, R., relatione with, 118 Sorensea, C. E . , relations vith, 236-238 Soybean experiments* U8-119
-2%f-
of Mr* B a i l toerlaia
Ford, Spring suspension, interest i s , 92-91* Starters, interest la, 1X3 Stsan engines, Interest ia, 25-26» 28, 37-39, Styling, 63, 132 Sugar crystal, theories shout, 137-13¾ 1¾© Ssay bar development, 102-1I& Teaser, 225-226 fast track, 85-88, 93-9¼ anions, attitude toward, 227 Vacations, 60-61 Vocabulary, 218 Voltage regulatcrs, 109 Well Street, 6¾, 233
», ^oba, relations with, 1, 60-61
Welch, Louie, relations with, 127 wlaamlll generator, Interest in, 113, U7 ¥iad Tunnel, 7%~77 Zoarlaia, Ralph, relationa with, 231
Ford, Henry I I , Idt-l&o, 190-191, 195» 199-200 Ford Motor Gcnvany, 1 -15
Avlatioa Accidents, 1 5-1½ Altitude Chaaber, Willow Bun, 151-161, 172 Pftgfnf> aacellea, tri-aoter, 20 PHtref engine, 22-23 Flivver Plane, 20*2% Ford Flivver, 1*5 Helicopter, design of, 11*0-1*7 Eadio beacon devslopaeat, 45-U7
Acoustics, 68-72 Altitude etaaner; World War 11, 151-161, 172-173 Brakes, 90 Sarburetora, 220-222 Cooling aysteas, 78-S0 Distributor, 67, 1*7-150
5-eyllaler engine, 132-183, 185 V-8, 183-185, 190 l^aaoaetera, *8-52, 191-191* Electrical laboratory, k^JS, 130-1*0, 1*7
223
6-eyliader, 98-IOI 60 H.P. V-8, 94.97
Foro 5 cylinder* 93» I8O-I8I Bear drive, 93 Truck, 1940, 100-101 V-8, l ^ s r i M t a l * 32-33, 36-42, 43-45, 48 V-8, 1937, 79
Fuel injection, 175-176 generator design, 305-108 Beater development, 54-59 Beaters, 58-59, So, 127-128 Borne, 59-60 Ignition, Ford 5 cylinder, 180-182
general ttaatrla* Morld Har I I , 169-172 P & w R-2800, 161-169, 173-174 V-8, 32, 39-40, 42-46
Metallurgy, 223-224 P-47, engine aamat design, World War I I , 176* 189, 202-204 Pratt & Wsttney, engine test, 150-151 Badio, 121-112, 189-191 Besearah J&partaaat* 206-207 Spring suspension, 92-94 Starter design, U2-U3 Styling, 81-84
Lincoln Caoriolet, 83-84 Lincoln Continental, 131 Lincoln Eepnyr, 83
8aiy«>ear developnsnt, 101-10¾ fasting, 69 fast Track, 85-91» 99-100* 101-305 fool Design
Dies, 17 Toisps converters* 206-207 Wind Tunnel, 74-85
Voltage-Begislator devslepaemt* 105*111» 150
Bank Holiday, 1933» 44
-251-
Ford Motor Company Industrial Belatloas
Beplcynent practice, 16-40 Sarrice Dapartoent, 227, 23%«236 Union Organisation, 226*227
Manufacturing Stool Operations
Casting, %1 Foundry Tool BOOK, 16-17
Organisation and Aaedoistratioa, 58-60, 128 Engineering, %2-%3, %5-%6, %8-50, 56-58» 67, 7%-76, 83, 8%, 91-9%
102-104, 108-109, 131-232 i ynsatQewnssr Dapaxtaiant, «Juo Engine Fabrication, 207-210 Experimental» %2-%3, %5-5©, 210 Beat Treat Shop, 210 Plating Shop, 210 BeorgeMiatiott, 19%5, 186-191, I9%-202, 20%-212
Officers and Directors, 211, 235-239 Bauson, 8., 192-19%
Beorgaaimtlon, 19%5, 166-191, 19%-202, 20%-212 Plant Engineering
Dearborn Engineering Laboratory, 16-19 Dynaaojseter Building, 205-206 Xysaooaetor lustallatiou, 191-194 fast frock, 85-89 Wind Tunnel Installation, 77-78
Production, World War II distributor Caps, Allison engine, 167 Distributor Caps, P & W R-2800, I60-I67 Pratt * Whitney contract, 150-151 Pratt a Ubitosy engine, 161-167 Willow Bun
Altitude chamber, 151-l6l, 172 Public Belations
Exhibitions "Thirty Years of Progress,w B . Y . , 1933, 5°*»
Purchasing Carbureter purchase, 221-222 Beater Purchase, 55-59 Heaters, 58-59, 128 Organisation and administration, 55-59, 238-239
SeorganizatioG, 19%5# 195
«252-
Ford Motor Coapany Furchaeiag
Radio purchases, 111-112 Starter "buttons, 112-111
Sales Cuetoner ecagslalat, 183 Government contracts, World War II, 1%9 Parte sad Accessories
Heaters, 58 Foster, Paul, 215 Fourteen Points, 5 Freeaan, Lloyd, 203 Qalaah, Joe, k2, 83, 132 Qalato, Tony, 103-10% ieiger, D r . , 68-¾ Hensral H e c t i c , 133-13%, 152, 1&, 169-172 General Motors, 97, 220 General Motors Bendix patenta, 91 Geiaaa Aray* %
mmm, 1-7, 30-31 t i H e e p i e , John, 23% Oredue, Richard, , ,AndyM, %5, %7 Gregory, Robert, 83, 128, 13Q-JL32, 135, 151 Grows, Mr. (Chandler-Groves), 22© Bsgoaaa, D r . , 133-13% Baallton, M r . , 1%6 Hanson, Barry, 77, 87 Bains, M r . , 29, 31 Eaaalng, Paul, 159, 167 Bsary Ford Hospital , 137-1%©, 216 B i - L i a e , 239 Hicks, BaroM, 22, 218 Hiaao engines, 1%6 H i t l e r , Adolph. 30, 65, 231-232 Hoffaan, M r . , %%, 86, 163 Holley earbnretor, 220-221 Rela, C h a r l i e , 59 luff, E d , %5-%6, 58, 67 Jaaaa, ViUftaM, 89, mi, 205-206 Johnson, Oejieral Atgh, 66 Johnson, l a r o M , 199 Kaasler, 1. C , 239«*2%© Ksrcher, Harry, 7%, 1%1
of Mr. Baa Soerlein %mde%
Koppcn, Otto, 20*21 finnntr, Fred, 11, 13-15 Kroll, Bieherd, 26, 191, 215 Kucher, A. A., 13* Laird, Bay, 32, 3*-35, *2 League of latloaa, 5 Liebold, Mr. E. 0. , 63-6*, 213, 236 Lincoln Zephyr, 83 Lindbergh, Charles, 1*3-1**, 157-156, 1®, 173, 175, 232 Long Island MacMne and Pattern Shop, 9-15 Low, Leslie, 18 lynch, Jiaay, 1*1 Maeehi, Charlie, 205 Majestic, {radio), 111-112 Malollo, Tony, 56, 58-59, 1ST Malea, Eddy, * i Mars, 152 Martin, P. £ . , 33, *8-*9, 92, 9*, MO, 302-103, 107-108, 150, 175, 211, 21*, 221, 236, 2*1
Morton, Mr. (aan from England), 121 MeCsrroll, R. B., 13*-1$, 183, IS5-187, 190, 19*-195, 197-201, 223 MeCloud, J . L . , 156 MeClure, Sr. B. 8 . , 136-139 MeCuteheoa, Don, 13*-136 MeGowaa, A. P., 165 Mefhersoa, C , 208 Messsrsehaldt, 198 Michigan Central Depot, 15 Miller, Bill, 25 Mills engine, 120
tenleni Conpany, I6V165 Ward. 55, 58, 179
Moore Bouse, H* Morgan, J . P., 233 Muriny, 14eitt®»aat Arthur, 202 H A , 66 lador, Baery, *2, 93 Matioii&l Socialistic lanaeratie Party, 8 lew Baal, 66 Bew fork Hove, 12 Blepoth, CTT178-179, 188, 2*2 Borth deraan Lloyd, 31 Of flight and Life, 169
45*-
Tm lantfaiaaaaees of Mr. JmtX foerleitt
Oldhea* J . , 16-18 Oxlay, W., 205-206 Packard, 16 farsoas* Mr., 135 Patoa, Clyde R., 194, 196» 210 Patterson, C. S., 206 Pearson, Brev, 66 Petersen, Bete* 4 l Philco Badio Corporation, 112* I89-190 Pioch, William, 17 Pratt & Vhitoey* aircraft engine, 150, 161 PO%HC, JO»B,.1O0 R. B. & M* Ccayaay* .105-106* » 8 * 110 BCA, 133-135 Ssaseh, Ray, 56-58» 60, 87, 127, 179, 191-19%, 199-800, 211, 237, 239 tariolo* V. G. , 205 Reiahold, Btramn, 22, 26, 4 l Republic Aircraft, 167, 178 Riley, Peter, 22 Robertson, John, 93 Sobey, Colonel, I61-162, 165-166, 171 Rockefeller, John £>., 233 Boeder, Bale. 42, 74, 195, 199 Roger, (cook), 215 ROBIUIUS Airport, 203 Roosevelt, Franklin D.» 66, 233 Rosenthal, Mr, (on ''Shenandoah"), 23 Ruddiaan, Br. idsel* 118-119 Russell* Barry* 141 SAE, 90 Belle* Mr., (aleetrteiaa), 4 l Salle* Eomra, 40 Senger, Mr,, 121 Schubert* Bhaw* 42 Sehultx* Carl, 32, 42-43 Scin t i l la , l 6 l , 169-170, 172 Sears and Roebuck, 55 Second World War, 232 Sheldrick, Larry, 41-42, 46, 43, 67, 74, 91-92, 98-99, 102-103, 105,
108, 148, 199, 225 "Shenandoah," 23 Baltb, Robert, 118 Ssdth, C. J . , 21, 41, 142, 180, 182, 193-194
-255-
Tbe Bestimiacencee of Mr. Sail goeriein
Index
Gadtii, Rs*coo, 23Y Social Jsiiaocrats, 7 Srensen, Charles, 32-33* %3-%9, 63, 91-92, 9%, 103, 112, 1%8, 151-152
166, 175-177, 211, 21k, 221-223, 230, 236-238 Screnaon, Jthn, 63, 121, 227 k-xirton, (radio), 112 Stone, saliii, %5, ^7 Cuhiaarine warfare, <vorld War I, £ Swift, C*eoy§e„ 206-207 Tallber^, y. Y., 195, 199-200, 20%-205, 207-210 Te&gue, IX rwla, -% !'-Thirty tears of rrogreas, f 50 ftasas, Cliarlle, V;, 4?, 132, 197, 331, 215 Toelle, Mr. (Rouge), 105, 108 severalty of rtichiean, 6C-69, 71, 133, 135 United States
*r*?r, 150 Aviation Jtosearcu, Warld War II, 202-204, 151-17%, IfS liar/, ikC
Unruh, C a r l , 195 Vellier, /.. . , . , 2 0 7 Volkswagen, 93 Vocrbesa, Charles, 121-1^2, 227 l.'anueraoe, Jc-2m, 2%2 wayne County Airport, 203 «veb8ter, Mr. (Mr ford inspector), 203 i/elcii, Luuio, 127-1¾1! Wenzel, Carl, 1 ½ '••'eatera Auto Supply, 179 v.liarasi, Jack, lStf-190, 1¾), 197, 199 Wibel, A. v.., ^9, 211, Wilson, Bufue, 103 v'orM ;/ar I, 1-5 V< :rtliiiagton Cuiapany, bright Field, l6lP 166, 163-16¾ 171-17%, 176-173, 1 ¾ 2 0 2 , 20% Vrigbt governor, 38-39 tWtteBbcrg, city of, 3 York Ice t1acMw Coapany, ?(> 152-15% iouogren, II. i ' . , 207 teller, Carl, ife .letdtii type windnill generators, 113 Soerletn, I?alph, 231
